# Cyprexx Florida



## LaCaSa (Apr 13, 2014)

Who here works for Cyprexx. I know that they do not rank high, but they are our client. What type of pricing/ bidding should I see from them. I was told for FL they pay us $15 a cbyd?!? Int Maid $100?!? Initial Secure up to 6 locks $90?!? Is anyone else here in Florida dealing with the same pricing? Or Should we put our foot down and demand more? we have been with them for just 3 weeks now. I know they have their bundle packages too, which seem only to be great if the home had one door to secure, clean as a whistle, no debris, and a small lot to mow under a foot. Just curious.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Cyprexx was one of the first preservation clients I dropped. But that was maybe 10 years ago and things do change. Their pricing however may not have. 
If you have only been with them for 3 weeks, you don't have a foot to put down yet. Plenty of posts/threads here about them.


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

LaCaSa said:


> Who here works for Cyprexx. I know that they do not rank high, but they are our client. What type of pricing/ bidding should I see from them. I was told for FL they pay us $15 a cbyd?!? Int Maid $100?!? Initial Secure up to 6 locks $90?!? Is anyone else here in Florida dealing with the same pricing? Or Should we put our foot down and demand more? we have been with them for just 3 weeks now. I know they have their bundle packages too, which seem only to be great if the home had one door to secure, clean as a whistle, no debris, and a small lot to mow under a foot. Just curious.


Gypsos used to work for them at one time. Not sure how long ago. He's currently getting out of the biz and heading to the oilfields so I'm not sure if he still hangs or will continue to hang around PT.

Their pay sucks. In Wisconsin they have the FNMA account (which they pay  too). The FNMA broker whom I work with told them to contact me, and they have a few times looking for a sucker. I sent them my pricelist and payment terms. I was told " that's not the way it works". My response was "My company, my terms. By the way, you contacted me, I didn't call you". Needless to say, I don't and won't work for their crap rates.

Good luck putting your foot down. You will lose the work you got 3 weeks ago. The reason you got the work is the last guy put his foot down (or went broke) and then it was your turn. Next


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

GTX63 said:


> Cyprexx was one of the first preservation clients I dropped. But that was maybe 10 years ago and things do change. Their pricing however may not have.


 If you dropped them 10 years back, you know things have changed, and its not for the better.....:yes:


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Yeah, thought I'd be impartial for a second.

You know when you go into a nightclub and they frisk you for guns, that's a bad sign. Don't want to bash them 10 years later but eh....


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## LaCaSa (Apr 13, 2014)

Were finding that we may not be sticking around with them much longer. In the mean time, We are pushing hard to get directly with the banks, listing agencies and property investors here locally.


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## LaCaSa (Apr 13, 2014)

And oh by the way. We broke the tie with the family company! Man what a load off the shoulders and end of headache!


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## STARBABY (Apr 12, 2012)

I fired them the first of the year and haven`t looked back. really have nothing good to say about them.


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

STARBABY said:


> I fired them the first of the year and haven`t looked back. really have nothing good to say about them.


Come on now Starbaby, firing them the first of the year IS something good to say about them.......:lol::lol::lol:


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## allure9121 (Jan 26, 2014)

If u don't know that 15 bucks a cu yd is very bad then you are in trouble


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## Wpb REO (Oct 23, 2013)

LaCaSa said:


> Who here works for Cyprexx. I know that they do not rank high, but they are our client. What type of pricing/ bidding should I see from them. I was told for FL they pay us $15 a cbyd?!? Int Maid $100?!? Initial Secure up to 6 locks $90?!? Is anyone else here in Florida dealing with the same pricing? Or Should we put our foot down and demand more? we have been with them for just 3 weeks now. I know they have their bundle packages too, which seem only to be great if the home had one door to secure, clean as a whistle, no debris, and a small lot to mow under a foot. Just curious.



I use to work for them here in Florida...they are brutal...they complain about everything and they hold pay...pricing as crappy as ever...


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## REOmadness (Jun 8, 2013)

we fire them early this year too. Pay $380 for all initials up to 30 cyd. Ongoing mtc pays $32 for cut and $25 for sales clean. They love chargebacks and sending you back for everything. They are terrible to work for now, we was with them for 4yrs with over 120 maintenance properties bringing in over $20k per mo during the summer but that was the good ole days.


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## ham (Aug 2, 2014)

I dumped them cypricks here in florida


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## LaCaSa (Apr 13, 2014)

They offered us $380 up to 20 cbyds, initial grass under 12", caps on all things open, light shrub trim, smokes and cos,and initial clean. Bid everything else we see. This can be good if ya got a clean house, small yard, and no debris....


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## Gypsos (Apr 30, 2012)

I quit with them last week and head out in the morning for North Dakota. Up until about a year ago I could make it work. We were the go to guys for all the jobs no one else would touch. We got paid good for it too. My subs were making $35 per hour on average.

We were averaging about 35 trash outs a month and we cut about 80 lawns per week. Then they changed everything. No more make the place look good. Just cut, clean, trim and haul the bare minimum. At the same time we got Satan's ex-wife as our new preservation coordinator. She was evil incarnate. No matter how much I bid she would only approve 25 CY. I literally took pictures of the debris with measurements and mathematically proved that one job had 95 CY of debris on it. She said she could only see 25 CY and did not care about math.

She told me that I would have to work for the price she offered or else. I took or else. My complaints with management fell on deaf ears. We went 68 days without a job. Then we got 7 of them. Then we went another 38 days without a job. Then FNMA QC'ed the properties in our area and she was fired the next week. 

The new coordinator was cool but we simply did not give two ****s about Cyprexx anymore and I had already decided it was time to implement my exit strategy for P&P work and started letting people go. 

During the changes the pay hit rock bottom so Cyprexx got out shovels and started to dig and they managed to make the work pay even less. 

When we started 5 years ago a lawn cut paid $35 and it only took about 15 pictures to document a cut. And you did not have to go into the house. My son and I could knock out 20 properties in about 7 hours. I could do 12 by myself in 8 hours every day. 

Now it takes between 30 and 40 pictures with half of them being inside the house sometimes and only pays $32 per cut. One a good day I can average 1 house per hour because my phone never stops ringing with requests for me to drop everything and take care of some emergency. 

So basically I was working twice as hard for half as much money. 

They will work you like a free slave and you will go back to every initial service at least one time for failed inspections because of the new bonus system they have. The way it works is that if you do not fail any inspections for the first 90 days you are assigned a property then you get a $50 bonus for that property. I figured that since we have only failed three inspections in three years we were going to make a few extra bucks. Not. The first month with the new “bonus system” in place we failed every inspection. So let me see if I got this. We went from a less than .001% failure rate for inspections to a 100% failure rate over night. Right and monkeys might fly out my ass too. 

So if you decide to stay with Cyprexx I wish you the best. The simple truth is I see no future for growth of business in this industry. If you are a Mom and Pop and self perform all your work you can earn a paycheck. You will never be able to take a vacation, you will never be able to afford nice clothes or vehicles and your equipment will end up being held together with duct tape and prayers. You will not be able to hire employees and will only be able to afford subs with a pay if paid business model. 

If you really want to be able to see your future start thinking in terms of how many lawns you have to cut to pay for things. So if you figure you can make $20 profit per yard then an oil change for your mower costs one lawn cut, a set of mower blades costs 2 ½ lawn cuts, the dinner you took your wife out to last night costs 3 lawn cuts, your mortgage costs 40 lawn cuts, groceries for a month costs between 30 and 60 lawn cuts depending whether or not you have kids, a set of used tires for your truck is 8 lawn cuts, want new tires for the truck then it is 60 lawn cuts and a new roof on your house costs 500 lawn cuts. 

It does not take long to realize the is not enough daylight for you to be able to cut enough lawns at this rate to be able to have the life you want. 

And this is why I bought a good used truck and am leaving tomorrow for the frozen tundra to earn a living.


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## STARBABY (Apr 12, 2012)

I ran in to the same problems with them. They were paying us $45 for re cuts changed is $35 a few years back. Had the same problem with bids, I always over bid to give room to give, but that all changed a year ago! if I had a property that have a lot of debris, they want me to the extra charge things for the flat rate! I do not see anyone running a business can now make a profit with them. I was the go to person in my area too, is like over night they didn`t care if you did a good job or not! They were surprised when I started turning down work! I told them I have to make a profit or I`m doing it, period!


Gypsos said:


> I quit with them last week and head out in the morning for North Dakota. Up until about a year ago I could make it work. We were the go to guys for all the jobs no one else would touch. We got paid good for it too. My subs were making $35 per hour on average.
> 
> We were averaging about 35 trash outs a month and we cut about 80 lawns per week. Then they changed everything. No more make the place look good. Just cut, clean, trim and haul the bare minimum. At the same time we got Satan's ex-wife as our new preservation coordinator. She was evil incarnate. No matter how much I bid she would only approve 25 CY. I literally took pictures of the debris with measurements and mathematically proved that one job had 95 CY of debris on it. She said she could only see 25 CY and did not care about math.
> 
> ...


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## Mr301 (Jan 31, 2015)

I used to work for cyprexx stopped about a year ago they weren't too bad but the last 2 months I just did wint so not many headaches. Thinking about getting back into it if cyprexx is so bad then who are good companies lol


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## newreo (May 30, 2014)

Mr301 said:


> I used to work for cyprexx stopped about a year ago they weren't too bad but the last 2 months I just did wint so not many headaches. Thinking about getting back into it if cyprexx is so bad then who are good companies lol


None, This is why lawsuits are probably coming their way (meaning all of the companies). Just a feeling, if you ask me, as things like that can't go on for the long periods of time


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

BRADSConst said:


> Gypsos used to work for them at one time. Not sure how long ago. He's currently getting out of the biz and heading to the oilfields so I'm not sure if he still hangs or will continue to hang around PT.
> 
> Their pay sucks. In Wisconsin they have the FNMA account (which they pay  too). The FNMA broker whom I work with told them to contact me, and they have a few times looking for a sucker. I sent them my pricelist and payment terms. I was told " that's not the way it works". My response was "My company, my terms. By the way, you contacted me, I didn't call you". Needless to say, I don't and won't work for their crap rates.
> 
> Good luck putting your foot down. You will lose the work you got 3 weeks ago. The reason you got the work is the last guy put his foot down (or went broke) and then it was your turn. Next




That is how it works in 99.9% of the contracting world. 

They know it but are counting on finding plenty of laid off workers that are unable to do the math for themselves on the costs of operating a business.
Same as all the other nationals.

There is absolutely no reason for P&P to be special and go against all the flow of the contracting world.


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## newreo (May 30, 2014)

BPWY said:


> That is how it works in 99.9% of the contracting world.
> 
> They know it but are counting on finding plenty of laid off workers that are unable to do the math for themselves on the costs of operating a business.
> Same as all the other nationals.
> ...


They said economy was improving......:whistling2::whistling2::whistling2::whistling2:


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## MKT (May 7, 2014)

BPWY said:


> That is how it works in 99.9% of the contracting world.
> 
> They know it but are counting on finding plenty of laid off workers that are unable to do the math for themselves on the costs of operating a business.
> Same as all the other nationals.
> ...



The P&P industry really took off when the markets crashed, so it has to be looked at as a positive for every construction company that would have went under if not converting work over to this field. 

Now you have to look at new home building coming back so the companys are able to move back in that direction. Investors / banks are in business just like every other company performing work, they have a bottom line of profit not to enjoy the new bathroom you installed.

In P&P we really can't expect a investor to pay us what a private homeowner would.


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## oteroproperties (Aug 10, 2012)

MKT said:


> The P&P industry really took off when the markets crashed, so it has to be looked at as a positive for every construction company that would have went under if not converting work over to this field.
> 
> Now you have to look at new home building coming back so the companys are able to move back in that direction. Investors / banks are in business just like every other company performing work, they have a bottom line of profit not to enjoy the new bathroom you installed.
> 
> In P&P we really can't expect a investor to pay us what a private homeowner would.


That may be true, but then they can't expect the product either.


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## MKT (May 7, 2014)

oteroproperties said:


> That may be true, but then they can't expect the product either.



The theory could be tested. If you bid it the answers will come.


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

MKT said:


> In P&P we really can't expect a investor to pay us what a private homeowner would.


 For discussion sake, I'd ask why not? I might even go a step further and say they should pay more. 

If I install a roof for a private customer, my labor, materials, overhead and profit are the same as for an investor. I'd expect that cutting grass, changing locks, etc. would be no different.

What is different is the payment terms and risk. I always get a down payment on private customers and take regular draws to keep the money close to work performed. When a National, Regional, bank, investor, etc. asks for a 30 or 45 or 60 day payment terms, why shouldn't they pay the contractor more for financing their job? 

While both P&P and private customers have payment risk, the P&P world is much higher. On private work, a contract with draws that coincide with work performed lowers the risk substantially. In the P&P world, you can't unmow the yard when the nopay or chargeback occurs months or years down the road. That financial risk is greater. I'd lobby that the pay rates for that risk should be higher. Not any different from insurance, or banking when lower FICO score applicants pay higher rates. They are identified as riskier clients.

I do have clients that ask for financing. I do offer financing and I do charge them more. I'm a contractor, not a bank.........


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

Spot On Brad!!!!

higher risk higher rewards. Business 101


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## MKT (May 7, 2014)

BRADSConst said:


> For discussion sake, I'd ask why not? I might even go a step further and say they should pay more.
> 
> If I install a roof for a private customer, my labor, materials, overhead and profit are the same as for an investor. I'd expect that cutting grass, changing locks, etc. would be no different.
> 
> ...



Agreed costs are the same, main difference is volume of work available. 

30 - 60 days is not unreasonable. How many times have you been paid in full before a job is completed. If you lien a private homeowner what happens if the homeowner goes into foreclosure, reverse mortgage, does not pay property taxes, files bankruptcy. 

While you cannot unmow a yard at least you are not substantially involved financially with a grass cut. Worst case scenario you write it off as income not received, and look at the positive of doing a positive for that neighborhood. 

If you look at it every job you complete you are financing, when have you been paid in full before a job was completed? It takes time, patience, and strategy to become the bank.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Even with investors I expect payment upon completion.
60 days may not seem unreasonable to some, however I'd question why it takes that long to begin with. They have the money or they do not. String the contractor out on closing invoices means you risk losing lien rights, which by the way follow the property, not the owner. That is also a tactic that is used quite a bit by some of these regionals.


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## MKT (May 7, 2014)

GTX63 said:


> Even with investors I expect payment upon completion.
> 60 days may not seem unreasonable to some, however I'd question why it takes that long to begin with. They have the money or they do not. String the contractor out on closing invoices means you risk losing lien rights, which by the way follow the property, not the owner. That is also a tactic that is used quite a bit by some of these regionals.



:yawn:


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

MKT said:


> Agreed costs are the same, main difference is volume of work available.
> 
> 30 - 60 days is not unreasonable. How many times have you been paid in full before a job is completed. If you lien a private homeowner what happens if the homeowner goes into foreclosure, reverse mortgage, does not pay property taxes, files bankruptcy.
> 
> ...




Unlike you I'm not giving away my labor for my health

That's your business but do not expect everyone else to be ok with it


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

MKT said:


> Agreed costs are the same, main difference is volume of work available.
> 
> 30 - 60 days is not unreasonable. How many times have you been paid in full before a job is completed. If you lien a private homeowner what happens if the homeowner goes into foreclosure, reverse mortgage, does not pay property taxes, files bankruptcy.
> 
> ...


 I'd like to go back the discussion part of the thread.

Volume is a farce. It is a hook used by those have the work to convince those that do not, to accept rates they most likely shouldn't. I'd be willing to go out on a limb and say most of the members of this forum aren't equipped to be able to handle the amount of volume required to complete services at many of the posted prices and make a go of it. 

Years ago, I learned a different perspective on volume. I was an engineer at John Deere. Many a supplier wanted the business and volume that we were offering our component suppliers. I'll never forget sitting in the sourcing/purchasing meetings with suppliers willing to cut there own throats if we'd just single source with them and give them all the volume. A significantly senior engineer Barry, would always stop them in their tracks with the following question: "What volume do I need purchase such that your price is free?" He would follow up with "Just tell me the number and I'll cut you purchase order right now". Many a supplier was taken back by that comment. Because volume in and of itself doesn't mean its profitable or worth while. But that's just my $0.02 worth.

"30-60 days isn't unreasonable." I can agree to this with following caveat: When I am able to dictate the price, I can agree to the financing terms. Again, I finance jobs frequently. But at my price.

While a single grass cut may not be a significant financial investment, if you couple that with huge volume, it can be. Ask anyone who was into Buzek, MRS, Lamco, Etc. Many small mom and pop shops have come here and discussed their financial hardships due to unpaid work orders, chargebacks, no pays, etc.

While I don't typically get paid before a job is completed (although I have), I routinely get paid upon completion. It is stated in the contract that the homeowners sign and I review it with them so they understand what they are agreeing to. I have no shame in asking for payment the day I finish the work on their house. I have the invoice and lien waiver in the folder in the truck.

You are totally correct that it takes time, patience and strategy to become the bank. Year over year my accounts receivables increase. The amount of jobs I finance increases. The size of the jobs I finance increase as well. I don't do this in the P&P realm though. The risk is just too high for the measly reward.......


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## MKT (May 7, 2014)

BPWY said:


> Unlike you I'm not giving away my labor for my health
> 
> That's your business but do not expect everyone else to be ok with it



Thanks again glad you were able to  (Censor the thread) to your satisfaction! :boxing:


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

MKT said:


> Thanks again glad you were able to  (Censor the thread) to your satisfaction! :boxing:





Drop it, those bickering posts were deleted in an attempt to stop the bickering. 
Nobody censored any thing. 

If that hint isn't strong enough try this one, the thread will be closed if it can't get back on topic.


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

Mkt has a point about patience and strategy to become the bank. The P&P business was a godsend for many contractors during the housing bust but the foreword thinking contractors all knew it was only going to be a shortterm fix and kept our hands in our prior lives till the economic cycles shifted. Is it getting better? I don't think so. Not because there isn't building going on BUT the pay rates are much lower than pre-housing bust rates. 

As many know we do a lot of Restoration work, thus a lot of insurance work. Rebuilding houses that burned or the house damaged from water or mold. Pre-housing bust we would rebuild a $200,000 house, get 50% down and upon Certificates of Completions signed the Insurance Company would issue the balance within 2 weeks. NOT Now!! 30% down, enough to cover most materials, 30% when you are halfway done (total of 60%) and the remainder 3-6 months AFTER you are completed. THE CONTRACTOR IS THE BANK for several months. Insurance repair work has evolved and is a carbon copy of P&P EXCEPT you need a larger bank roll. 

I hear the same complaints from Carpet Companies, HVAC contractors, electricians etc etc. 

"the housing crunch has hurt in more ways than what is obvious and has had long lasting consequences" 

People will say the rewards are higher. THEY ARE but the risks are infinitely higher. The BIG LIE about P&P is about being an Independent Contractor. I know NO contractor that does not estimate their own jobs. You either bid to high and don't get the job or you bid to low and you hopefully break even BUT it is still the contractors bid for services. Largely, all P&P work is done at a Service Companies schedule of pay thus no opportunity for reward versus the assumed risk. 

I couldn't fathom banking any company that is reaping the majority of the rewards.


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