# Who are the faceless HUD "Cutters"



## JFMURFY (Sep 16, 2012)

Got chopped by HUD again... When I asked my client how I can get in touch with them to request a valid reason for the cut..I was informed I wasn't "allowed" to talk to the people who just too food from my table. 
To that end I gotta say... if they work for the guv'ment... its Public info...
I may be incorrect on that as they are faceless and I don't know if they're a private contrcator for HUD whacking bids with Mashall Swift Cost estimator or what. 

All I know the phrase "HUD has reduced your bid" any of ya'll get that song an dance?


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## STARBABY (Apr 12, 2012)

JFMURFY said:


> Got chopped by HUD again... When I asked my client how I can get in touch with them to request a valid reason for the cut..I was informed I wasn't "allowed" to talk to the people who just too food from my table.
> To that end I gotta say... if they work for the guv'ment... its Public info...
> I may be incorrect on that as they are faceless and I don't know if they're a private contrcator for HUD whacking bids with Mashall Swift Cost estimator or what.
> 
> All I know the phrase "HUD has reduced your bid" any of ya'll get that song an dance?


 
Been getting from 5 Brothers and NFR for awhile! I think it`s BS, but do not see how to get around it!


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

STARBABY said:


> Been getting from 5 Brothers and NFR for awhile! I think it`s BS, but do not see how to get around it!


That is pure BS. HUD doesn't cut bids they either accept them or decline them. If you can get proof the "client" is HUD, you got them by the short and curlies.....


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## JFMURFY (Sep 16, 2012)

STARBABY said:


> Been getting from 5 Brothers and NFR for awhile! I think it`s BS, but do not see how to get around it!


I think Matt out in Montana... has some knowledge on this... he previously mentioned something about HUD's Office of the Inspector General...
What I need to be made clear to me is .. is it legal to alter a bid. I spoke at length with Joe B... and he seemed pretty sincere that they're hands are tied...
They make more $$$ if we invoice more... but I wouldn't know if they're burning the candle at both ends... Like I say faceless Hud Cutters... sitting at terminals whacking up bids across the board...


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## JFMURFY (Sep 16, 2012)

BRADSConst said:


> That is pure BS. HUD doesn't cut bids they either accept them or decline them. If you can get proof the "client" is HUD, you got them by the short and curlies.....


Paper work says FHA....


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

JFMURFY said:


> Got chopped by HUD again... When I asked my client how I can get in touch with them to request a valid reason for the cut..I was informed I wasn't "allowed" to talk to the people who just too food from my table.
> To that end I gotta say... if they work for the guv'ment... its Public info...
> I may be incorrect on that as they are faceless and I don't know if they're a private contrcator for HUD whacking bids with Mashall Swift Cost estimator or what.
> 
> All I know the phrase "HUD has reduced your bid" any of ya'll get that song an dance?


BS, HUD doesn't reduce bids they either accept them or decline them. If the work order states it, you can report them. 

By the way, to my knowledge, HUD rates are still the same per ML 2010-18. Anyone mowing already is supposed to be following last years rates. The new grass rates will come out on or before March 31, 2013 for this upcoming season.

Also, I was told HUD dropped Marshall and Swift and is now with Blue Book using Repairbase.


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

JFMURFY said:


> Paper work says FHA....


I'm not sure about FHA, FNMA, Freddie or VA. I just know know HUD doesn't cut bids.

I'm a conspiracy theorist type person. I firmly believe that the National crooks mark up our bids when they know they can get more. When the can't, they turn in the bids as is, and then when it gets approved, they tell us on the WO that "the client reduced the amount". Why is it such a secret? If the work off a 20-25% discount, just show us the numbers and remove the doubt.......


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

I have called their bluff before. HUD does not cut bids. Your bid cannot be altered by anyone without your permission. Cut your plumber's bid to install your new toilet and see what he does. HUD is not Walmart; they do not need your bid to be xxx, they only go by best and lowest. While the government may be many things, they do not tell you what your debris or mold bid may be and that you must do it for that price.


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

Call the Regional HUD office and file a complaint. It falls on deaf ears but perhaps if enough did this perhaps it would put the Service Co on notice...


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Hey Paul Williams of Foreclosurepedia has filed a criminal complaint about this...and they are using Istar to record and make lists of this activity so they can show the courts "pattern"...you should send him an email and he can get you the information you need....


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## Diallo185 (Dec 15, 2012)

In CA only the contractor can change the bid. Bid is the price that the contractor can do the work for.


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## ontimepres (Jan 4, 2013)

Everyone is right to say that's BS but IMHO you're better off learning to work with the system. HUD's approved cost estimator is RepairBase, so if you get a "HUD approved price" or "HUD reduced your bid" it's probably because when they entered your bid into RepairBase it came out lower. 
If you get in contact with RepairBase and complete a sales/training webinar they'll give you some free credits and you can try out their website. The presentation is not very long and I thought it was interesting, they break down how they came up with pricing, what affects it, etc. Even if you don't continue to use it, you'll still be able to get pricing for the items you typically bid. 
Another thing I'd point out is if you give the cost estimator a reason it will increae the price. For example, grass over a certain height, special order glass required, must use commercial lawn equipment, needs a 2 story ladder, etc. Make sure your bids include the scope of work, give them a reason to pay your bid price. 
PS-I'm also told this is the cost estimator Safeguard is using when you call in to their "bid desk"


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## hammerhead (Apr 26, 2012)

ontimepres said:


> Everyone is right to say that's BS but IMHO you're better off learning to work with the system. HUD's approved cost estimator is RepairBase, so if you get a "HUD approved price" or "HUD reduced your bid" it's probably because when they entered your bid into RepairBase it came out lower.
> If you get in contact with RepairBase and complete a sales/training webinar they'll give you some free credits and you can try out their website. The presentation is not very long and I thought it was interesting, they break down how they came up with pricing, what affects it, etc. Even if you don't continue to use it, you'll still be able to get pricing for the items you typically bid.
> Another thing I'd point out is if you give the cost estimator a reason it will increae the price. For example, grass over a certain height, special order glass required, must use commercial lawn equipment, needs a 2 story ladder, etc. Make sure your bids include the scope of work, give them a reason to pay your bid price.
> PS-I'm also told this is the cost estimator Safeguard is using when you call in to their "bid desk"


The problem with the estimator is you look up a price. Let's say replace 40 gal hot water heater cost $849 per repairbase so that is what you bid. then the national looks up the same thing at $849. Your expecting the bid approved for $849 but the national see's $849 minus discount. so the bid gets cut accordingly. If the national did it the right way and add their discount to the $849 then everyone would be happy. But we all know that will never happen


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

Hammerhead is 100% correct. 

Also, it doesn't matter what estimator "they" use but what "YOU" use. An independent contractor can charge what "they deem to be a profitable estimate" and the person receiving that estimate can decide to use it or reject it. 

Simple.

We use Xactimate. That same hot water heater is $871.00 + $174.20 (O&P) + $146.34 (base service charge) + $34.55 (gas line connector for supply line) + $123.73 (truckload to landfill). Total for hot water heater replacement==== $1,349.82.

Learn to Estimate Correctly and there is $$ to be made....


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## hammerhead (Apr 26, 2012)

Wannabe said:


> Hammerhead is 100% correct.
> 
> Also, it doesn't matter what estimator "they" use but what "YOU" use. An independent contractor can charge what "they deem to be a profitable estimate" and the person receiving that estimate can decide to use it or reject it.
> 
> ...


I just threw out that as an example. I didnt add in all the other normal stuff.
P.S. SQ will look at the pic of the hot water heater and want measurements so they can say it is 1/4 of a yrd of debris. LOL


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## brm1109 (Sep 17, 2012)

I don't use estimating software. I base the bids off of what the items cost and my profit and o/h. I always give the standard answer, "sorry but the item in question can not be performed based on allowable".
Sorry but if they don't like it have someone else bid. I am in business so that I can make money not lose money while someone else make money from their cut.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

You can use Xacimate, or Repairbase, or GetRDun software, or your calculator and a #2 pencil. It doesn't matter. The OP is getting the "HUD adjusted your bid" and wants to know if it is legit. No, it is not.


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## arunbaheti (Mar 8, 2013)

BRADSConst said:


> Also, I was told HUD dropped Marshall and Swift and is now with Blue Book using Repairbase.


Correct.

HUD just renewed with Bluebook's RepairBASE. They dropped Marshall & Swift in 2011. 

The new RepairBASE contract is for five years.

See: http://www.webwire.com/ViewPressRel.asp?aId=171022


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

From what I've been able to gather HUD does not cut bids. They either accept or deny.

Any one of these nationals saying other wide is lying. Something they are good at.


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## nurumkin (Sep 28, 2012)

*re*

we bid a job in the bid it stated the cost of materials as $460, when we got the approval it was for $425?!?!?!


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

If you are operating on a 20% margin, well, you can figure that one out. Negotiating an estimate is one thing; accepting a job after you bid has been altered by an outside party is another.


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