# New to Property Preservation and loosing money.



## Guest (Jan 4, 2012)

A friend of mine talked me into starting into this business with him about 6 months ago, we were fed all kinds of stories about how much money we were going to make not just from the head of the company but from all the other contractors working for him and I don't see how its possible. We get work from SG (25%) and LPS(%15) and then the parent company above us takes another %50 after sg and lps get their cut. At the end of the day nothing seems so pay anything worth the work accept maybe tarping roofs. How much percentage is everyone else giving up. I am about 1000 in the hole after all my pay comes back from sg and lps still, they owe me about 5k right now, I am seriously considering walking away from this before I get any deeper, Is there any companies working S.E. Michigan, like detroit area I should look into or is this industry a bust?


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

The machine got another FNG.




Read thru the forum and you'll see how many former full timers are hanging it up.
Your very last comment says it all.


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## thanohano44 (Aug 5, 2012)

bpwy said:


> the machine got another fng.
> 
> Read thru the forum and you'll see how many former full timers are hanging it up.
> Your very last comment says it all.


lol


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## Guest (Jan 4, 2012)

Thanks for the replies, That is what I thought. I wish I had found this forum before.


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## david (Apr 11, 2012)

plain and simple too many people jumping onboard when ship is already sinking,its not a business for everyone if you dont have right connections.


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## Guest (Jan 4, 2012)

Yeah I get that, I actually liked doing this too but not for less than minimum wage that we seem to take home after everyone gets their cut out of my money, then waiting the 8 weeks inst helping either. I might apply to a couple companies direct because being this far down the ladder doesn't leave much money left for us.


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## david (Apr 11, 2012)

it might be a wise decision because nothing in this business is guaranteed and it gets harder everyday but hope you the best


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

For the low low price of $39.99 you too can order your very own copy of the *All-in One Property Preservation How-to Manual.*

http://www.mfssupply.com/All-in-One-Property-Preservation-How-to-Manual


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## thanohano44 (Aug 5, 2012)

BPWY said:


> For the low low price of $39.99 you too can order your very own copy of the All-in One Property Preservation How-to Manual.
> 
> http://www.mfssupply.com/All-in-One-Property-Preservation-How-to-Manual


I just got that email too. This validates HollandPpo's comments from yesterday. What's funny is that no book can teach you or list all the BS we go through. If it did, it wouldn't be offered by MFS whose owner is the younger brother of Safeguards owner.


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## david (Apr 11, 2012)

only ppl making money on those books is ones selling them maybe i should start tonight becoming a writer,maybe i could make some money,i'll take 29.99:clap:


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

thanohano44 said:


> I just got that email too. This validates HollandPpo's comments from yesterday. What's funny is that no book can teach you or list all the BS we go through. If it did, it wouldn't be offered by MFS whose owner is the younger brother of Safeguards owner.





Very interesting. No wonder they are the SG exclusive vendor.


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## thanohano44 (Aug 5, 2012)

d+jhomeservices said:


> only ppl making money on those books is ones selling them maybe i should start tonight becoming a writer,maybe i could make some money,i'll take 29.99:clap:


There you go. Driving another industry down. Lol. Jk.


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

If I didn't have the emails to show my wife she would think I was crazy and just telling tall tales.


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## Guest (Jan 4, 2012)

detroitpandp said:


> A friend of mine talked me into starting into this business with him about 6 months ago, we were fed all kinds of stories about how much money we were going to make not just from the head of the company but from all the other contractors working for him and I don't see how its possible. We get work from SG (25%) and LPS(%15) and then the parent company above us takes another %50 after sg and lps get their cut. At the end of the day nothing seems so pay anything worth the work accept maybe tarping roofs. How much percentage is everyone else giving up. I am about 1000 in the hole after all my pay comes back from sg and lps still, they owe me about 5k right now, I am seriously considering walking away from this before I get any deeper, Is there any companies working S.E. Michigan, like detroit area I should look into or is this industry a bust?





You should look into some other companies because if you are doing work, you should be getting profit. The pocket killer is the 30 to 45 day turn around for pay. Some times even longer than that.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

wipeout said:


> You should look into some other companies because if you are doing work, you should be getting profit. The pocket killer is the 30 to 45 day turn around for pay. Some times even longer than that.


The key word above is "should". Promised and guaranteed don't dance together in this ballroom.


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## david (Apr 11, 2012)

I saw a local ad today,here is pricing

lockchange 18.00
wints 55.00
jant 35.00

will pay 350.00 per house up to 35 cu yds i wrote ask them how many responses they got,so far no reply and notice ad is now gone,wonder why,lmao


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## Guest (Jan 5, 2012)

One of most esteemed members of the P&P Forums had a saying about another industry that applies to the P&P Industry also.....

Know how to earn a Small Fortune in the Property Preservation Business?
,
,
,
,
,
,
,
,
,
,
Start with a LARGE FORTUNE.


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## Guest (Jan 5, 2012)

This is just my 2 cents.

I know that there is days and jobs I will lose money on,but the trick is to try and limit those days and jobs at best possible.


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## Guest (Jan 5, 2012)

d+jhomeservices said:


> I saw a local ad today,here is pricing
> 
> lockchange 18.00
> wints 55.00
> ...


wonder they are finding any suckers to work for those prices!


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## thanohano44 (Aug 5, 2012)

FremontREO said:


> One of most esteemed members of the P&P Forums had a saying about another industry that applies to the P&P Industry also.....
> 
> Know how to earn a Small Fortune in the Property Preservation Business?
> ,
> ...


Agreed


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## Cooper2001 (Sep 21, 2012)

I read this on their website and the thing that really made laugh was "work order location" I would love to know what idiot wrote this...and what kind of idiot would spend $40 for this? If it was on $10 I might spend the $$$ just for a good laugh


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

*Reply To Original Question: DetroitPandP*

To DetroitPandP: 

While it is always easier to blame stuff on the property preservation industry instead of holding yourself accountable, it is in your best interest to practice "accurate thinking". Your misfortune is not related to the industry as a whole. It is directly linked to the fact that you are a subcontractor for another subcontractor who is only paying you 50% of the total proceeds. Not to mention that you then have to wait until "the guy above you" gets paid so that he can then pay you. The person who is sending you the work will not be in business very long with that business model. You should discuss the terms with the person giving you work and tell him that you refuse to "work for free" any longer. Don't be afraid to simply walk away from the guy who is currently giving you work. This conversation needs to be handled in private...just you and the person who pays you. Leave your "friend" out of it. His input has gotten you into this mess. He will most likely hinder your ability to think accurately. 

FYI, I operate my business by utilizing subcontractors to complete 100% of the work I receive from my national clients. I send the jobs to my subs for 80%-90% of the total amount I am receiving and I pay all of them within 3 days of when they complete each job. Even though I wait 30-60 days to get paid, my subs get paid right away. And all my subs have families, mortgages, bills to pay... I do not work with the "twenty-somethings" who still live in their mother's basement. And 7 of the 8 subcontractors I work with have been with me for at least 3 years. I thought it might be helpful for you to see a business model that works. 

The best thing you can do right now is use this as a learning experience. Get used to making mistakes if you plan to be self employed, and make it a habit to learn a lesson from each and every mistake you make. Do not allow yourself to twist the facts just because it's easier than facing the real reason you have found yourself in this predicament. You put yourself into a no win situation by choosing to work according to terms that pretty much were guaranteed to fail. Hopefully, you have also learned that doing business with your friends is a "no no". 

The GOOD NEWS (if you've read this far) is this: You showed perseverance by being able to keep your business together while working for this knucklehead. It may help if you think of it as being your alternative to a college education. Anyone who is self employed and even moderately successful knows that the road to stability is ugly and littered with learning lessons that are disguised as mistakes. 

P.S. You should now realize that your buddy is not very wise as a businessman. In fact if I were you, I would smack your buddy for talking you into such a pathetic business arrangement. And then I would smack myself for pretending the situation was caused by something other than your own actions and also for asking for advice on a forum. Once that is out of the way, then you can start signing up to work directly with national property preservation companies. Make sure to educate yourself about current property preservation pricing. Both above links are free resources I have created to help people who are smart enough to know they need help.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

The "Parent Company" is what is killing you.... 

When dealing with the alphabet club, you know your losing your 15-25% so you bid high and negotiate a good $$ for flat rate work, but losing 50% of what's left is working for less then .35 cents on the dollar... 

Your hanging yourself :hang:


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

Ez2BLazy

You are no better than the nationals. Your post says that you don't even do the national work you get. So the national already takes a huge cut and you do such a favor by paying 80 - 90 percent to your subs. I swear no one does their own work. People like you are a joke.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

Holland,

I know your frustration in this business is HUGE...well at least it was for me. When we had subs throughout the Midwest we also took 12% and paid ever Friday even though we didn't get reimbursement for 30-60 days. Our money usage came with a small fee, we also covered the E&O for our Subs (we still required them to have all the other insurance though). 10% is a little low but 20% is high IMO but everyones business model is different. 

We also told every one of our subs that if they EVER wanted to go direct with any of our clients We would do everything in our power to help them with the process. In 15 years we had 2 who left and then came back within 6 months due to the overwhelming amount of work we processed for the subs. Thus our time had a cost also. 

Now we have ZERO (0) subs with any Nationals...we only work with Realtors direct. Much cultivation and time proven methods has freed us from the Nationals/Regionals. 

IMO if you work for a Regional then you should be paid weekly or bi-weekly just the same as if you work with a Homeowner or don't work for them.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

*Holland Resorts To Name-Calling...Again*

Reply To Previous Quote From Holland:

Your comment really shows how pathetic people act when they are safely under the anonymity on the internet. Out of my entire post you somehow picked out 1 sentence and determined that because of my method of conducting business that I am "a joke". That's not very nice of you to disrespect me for attempting to help another human being. 

I normally don't waste my time on fools like you because your attitude will cause you more pain than I ever could. I really feel sorry for your wife for having to deal with such ignorance and senseless negativity. Since attitude is directly linked to income, I kind of feel sorry for you, too. "Forgive them for they know not what they do" is something I have to keep telling myself when dealing with intellectual midgets like you. In reality, I haven't read anything from you that was helpful or that had any real content or that wasn't littered with negativity and name-calling. 

I am challenging you to prove that your business model of "the miserable, negative business owner does all the work out in the field and also in the office" is better than my model of "hiring specialists to complete the work while the business owner focuses on pleasing his clients". I would love to see your logical evidence that your method is better for the property preservation business owner, the client or even the industry as a whole. You feel strongly enough about it to call me names so maybe you could let me know your reasoning.

Lastly, I would like to compare your tax returns to the tax returns of my subcontractors. You would most likely be surprised once you learned that all of my subcontractors earn enough money from the business I give them to pay all their bills, take vacations, put their kids in school and whatever it is that people do. And if we compared your tax returns to mine...you'd realize how ignorant your comment really was.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

HollandPPC said:


> Ez2BLazy
> 
> You are no better than the nationals. Your post says that you don't even do the national work you get. So the national already takes a huge cut and you do such a favor by paying 80 - 90 percent to your subs. I swear no one does their own work. People like you are a joke.


I forgive you for your ignorance, Holland.


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

MakeItEz2GetPd said:


> To DetroitPandP:
> 
> While it is always easier to blame stuff on the property preservation industry instead of holding yourself accountable, it is in your best interest to practice "accurate thinking". Your misfortune is not related to the industry as a whole. It is directly linked to the fact that you are a subcontractor for another subcontractor who is only paying you 50% of the total proceeds. Not to mention that you then have to wait until "the guy above you" gets paid so that he can then pay you. The person who is sending you the work will not be in business very long with that business model. You should discuss the terms with the person giving you work and tell him that you refuse to "work for free" any longer. Don't be afraid to simply walk away from the guy who is currently giving you work. This conversation needs to be handled in private...just you and the person who pays you. Leave your "friend" out of it. His input has gotten you into this mess. He will most likely hinder your ability to think accurately.
> 
> ...


I must have struck a cord since you typed a novel.


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

MakeItEz2GetPd said:


> Reply To Previous Quote From Holland:
> 
> Your comment really shows how pathetic people act when they are safely under the anonymity on the internet. Out of my entire post you somehow picked out 1 sentence and determined that because of my method of conducting business that I am "a joke". That's not very nice of you to disrespect me for attempting to help another human being.
> 
> ...


I must have struck a cord to have you type such a novel.


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

When I get some time away from my office/fieldwork I will type my novel response.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

HollandPPC said:


> When I get some time away from my office/fieldwork I will type my novel response.


Intentional pun?


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## HollandPPC (Sep 22, 2012)

72opp said:


> Intentional pun?


You give me too much credit. Lol.


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## Guest (Jan 11, 2012)

*Im new to property preservation, and i have questions:*

1.When you first take on a company to receive work orders from (Not subcontracting, but rather straight from the major companies) How big of a service area do they expect you to service? 100 miles more or less? The entire state you live in? 

2.My understanding is that checks are 3 months out, is this correct? 

3.Would it be smart to start off, just receiving work orders from 1 company? Would it be alot of work orders or a little? 

If just a little amount of work, would it then be smart to take on more then 1 company to start out?

4. Im trying to start with just myself, no subcontractors. Is it a must to start off with sub-cons, or is it realistic to start off with 1 companies amount of work orders and only me taking care of them?

I appreciate all of you guys on contractor talk. All your information is extremely helpful to me and I appreciate your answers to these questions.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2012)

HollandPPC said:


> Ez2BLazy
> 
> You are no better than the nationals. Your post says that you don't even do the national work you get. So the national already takes a huge cut and you do such a favor by paying 80 - 90 percent to your subs. I swear no one does their own work. People like you are a joke.


Also want to chime in here. Holland, your a joke, not me.

My metro area subs average 70k per year, after expenses. They work very hard and I mean nothing negative about them.

However, they are what they are. They dont have what it takes to do what I do which is run a real company. I have office staff, a network, sales, QC program, safety program. We do what they dont want to or can't do. Of course, one sub probably could do it but he doesnt have the bankroll to do this. My cashflow is crazy but I have the bankroll to suffer through the low spots.

I used to be in your shoes. It lasted about 2 weeks. I hired my first processor and now she is my GM. She did what I didnt want to do, wasnt very good at and mostly, she filters my expletive filled answers to our clients into a sugary answer that doesnt get us fired.

Grow up, open your eyes and ears and stop thinking you know anything at all that is helpful to people that want to get in this industry.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2012)

D+J I saw that add today locally too....crazy huh? My first thought was OMG really!


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