# what are Subs?



## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

Hello all, I'm kind of new at this and I see you guys talking about companies that are subs of larger companies. It also seems that working for the larger companies is more profitable. Who are some of the larger or good companies to work for? I'm struggling to turn a profit in this business so either I'm doing something wrong or working for the wrong people. I would appreciate any guidance.


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## PropPresPro (Apr 12, 2012)

"What are Subs?"

Tasty little hand held lunchables.:chef: :thumbup:


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## NewEnglandProp (May 23, 2012)

ok now they had their fun, subs are whom you would use to do the work instead of you doing it yourself. Years ago when I started things were great, but there are so many sandwiches in the way now if you do not have direct contact with a bank or realtor your pretty much, ummm cant print that here.


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## NewEnglandProp (May 23, 2012)

PropPresPro said:


> "What are Subs?"
> 
> Tasty little hand held lunchables.:chef: :thumbup:


 
you get +10 for creativity:whistling2:


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## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

Thanks for the chuckle, could go for a good sammich right about now. 

I understand the concept of a sub contractor vs. the general contractor. What I'm hoping to find out is who are the big players so I can go after work directly from them. It seems there are a lot of smaller companies, but I just can see how to make money working for them. I'm in a rural area and I can't drive 50 miles between jobs and only get paid $20.00. For me lawn mowings or driveway plowings are a nightmare. In a 12 hour day we will spend 6 hours driving. The pay rates favor lots of work in a small area. We don't have that. Hoping that if I can work for the larger companies I can make a little more and make it work.


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## Zoly (Feb 2, 2013)

No one is going to tell you that. Don't make the mistake of thinking this is an easy to get into business. Even if you do get in it's not easy work.


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## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

I've been doing this for 4 years, I know it isn't easy. 

I don't understand why someone won't tell me. Unless you are in my area you have nothing to loose. And I don't think there very many people doing this in my area. I guess I just feel different about things. If I could help another small business person I would do it unless it would hurt my business.:yes:


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## dryBgerG (Feb 1, 2013)

American property pres said:


> I've been doing this for 4 years, I know it isn't easy.
> 
> I don't understand why someone won't tell me. Unless you are in my area you have nothing to loose. And I don't think there very many people doing this in my area. I guess I just feel different about things. If I could help another small business person I would do it unless it would hurt my business.:yes:


What is your area?


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

dryBgerG said:


> What is your area?






I really wish people would put their state in their profiles. 


Its not like we're asking for your full address or coordinates. 
It just helps to understand where folks are and the circumstances they relate to.


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## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

I am in Northeastern Vt. I would prefer to cover the northern half of the state. If needed I could cover more, but not for the money I've been offered. I know this isn't a get rich business, but a make enough to get by business would be nice. The properties are pretty spread out, and that makes it hard. But we are honest and try to work hard and do the best we can for our client to properly maintain the properties. From what I've seen doing a good job or doing things the right way doesn't matter, that disappointing.


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## dryBgerG (Feb 1, 2013)

BPWY said:


> I really wish people would put their state in their profiles.
> 
> 
> Its not like we're asking for your full address or coordinates.
> It just helps to understand where folks are and the circumstances they relate to.


I agree. I see a lot of the contributors to the forum don't have their locations on their profiles.


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## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

Agreed BPWY, I changed my profile to include location. thanks


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

American property pres said:


> But we are honest and try to work hard and do the best we can for our client to properly maintain the properties. From what I've seen doing a good job or doing things the right way doesn't matter, that disappointing.




You are right that few people care and it will burn you out sooner or later.
Good luck.

I'm not sure if Mid American out of NE has work in VT, but if you hear of them....... run!!


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## Gypsos (Apr 30, 2012)

Some, not many but some, people do care about quality and you have to include drive time as part of the price negotiating. 

I am doing a bid tomorrow on a five acre lawn with tree and plant trimming to get it ready to rent with an option to bid on weekly re-cuts. 

It will require two trucks and two 16' trailers (one for equipment and one for debris) to do the job and is a little over one hour each way. 

I will include drive time for four men and two trucks for two hours in my bid. I know there is a vendor closer than me, but they want me to do the work. If my price does not work for them that is okay. 

I cannot work for free. Especially since we are slammed right now.


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## STARBABY (Apr 12, 2012)

Gypsos said:


> Some, not many but some, people do care about quality and you have to include drive time as part of the price negotiating.
> 
> I am doing a bid tomorrow on a five acre lawn with tree and plant trimming to get it ready to rent with an option to bid on weekly re-cuts.
> 
> ...


 
agree I get this alot too! they want me to do! most the time I get bids! it`s not a hobbie!


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

You have gotten into a over saturated industry with 300+ subbers to each national...and for each subbing there is another 100-150 subbing their work...Whoever came up with the theory that the only way to make money in the PPI is to sub the work forgot one very important issue...eventually someone has to front the money to complete the work...and that is why the industry is a mess...
Not to be rude but if you haven't figured out who the king of the hill is the first in this industry you should probably find another enterprise to play with...Many of the companies that have been around a while have 50+ thousand in equipment to operate their business and everyday we hear people like you wanting to know how to be profitable.
Have you thought of this...take a business class...
Do you know how to perform a break even analysis on your services to know just how much they cost you to complete?
Do you understand the difference between break even point and break even analysis?
Do you understand how a cash flow statement works?
Have you written a business plan?
Do you have the proper licensing for the services you are performing?
Or have you just contacted your local county treasure's office and bought yourself a business license and expect to go from rags to riches because companies like Dreamstreet Investment fill your head with grandeur of making millions in the rapidly expanding foreclosure field service industry???
Everyday the same questions are asked by newbies that have a rake and a lawn mower and have been told they are a property preservation contractor....and while many of us do not have an issue helping others you need to help yourself before anyone can help you...
This industry has become so convoluted that even those with direct contracts with the nationals are having cashflow issues.....
You have chosen a very difficult industry to start a business in....you would be better buying a greenhouse and being a farmer as people are scared to death right now about GMO and want clean food for their families to eat...


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Cant add much more except this-the level of profit and the number of companies that can make a profit have decreased to the point that you are either willing to tear up your equipment for minimum wage or you have one foot out the door. This is a finite industry as it currently exists.
Best five words of advice- Don't quit your day job.


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## BPWY (Apr 12, 2012)

Cleanup and GTX, is doesn't get much better than that.

And yet.......... few will listen.


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## Valley (Mar 12, 2013)

dryBgerG said:


> I agree. I see a lot of the contributors to the forum don't have their locations on their profiles.



Thanks, i had to make sure mine was in there,lol


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## Coos-NH (Oct 17, 2012)

"I don't understand why someone won't tell me. Unless you are in my area you have nothing to loose. And I don't think there very many people doing this in my area."

There are more than you think. I know of at least 8 "Joe Pickup" companies in the NEK. I spent a lot of time this past winter following them around and fixing their shoddy work. Now that it's getting warmer the "Beer Money" guys will be back. The local CL for Vt. and NH is full of ads from subs of a sub of a sub, looking for new meat to skewer. My best advice, since we share a common area, is to only use this field as a filler. I have properties less than 20 minutes from my office that I won't work on for the offered pricing. There is no formula on rural work except to just say no if you can't turn a decent profit.


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## BRADSConst (Oct 2, 2012)

"I don't understand why someone won't tell me. Unless you are in my area you have nothing to loose. And I don't think there very many people doing this in my area."




Coos-NH said:


> There are more than you think. I know of at least 8 "Joe Pickup" companies in the NEK.


Think about this for a minute. There are over 1430 members here. How many of them post frequently? What are the intentions of those that don't? I don't owe any "lurkers" anything. Why should the question "Tell me who is great to work for be answered"?

When an individual INVESTS the time reading here, that question WILL be answered.......


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

At one time we contracted to at least a dozen National/Regionals. Now, maybe one. We deal with Well Fargo and similar companies directly. We are now on the outside looking in, and the air is much better here. I cannot suggest specific clients because they were only as good to me as the rep I dealt with. I will tell you however, the ones that are crooks.


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## PropPresPro (Apr 12, 2012)

BRADSConst said:


> "I don't understand why someone won't tell me. Unless you are in my area you have nothing to loose. And I don't think there very many people doing this in my area."
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yep, There is more information to be had here than I was armed with when I started in this industry. 

And to the OP:

As for company names, Google "property preservation". Any of the 'big' companies will show up that way. Plus, every one of the National's has been talked about here, in depth, at one time or another.
As for 'good' ones to work for, that is a matter of opinion. I may have had nothing but good experiences with a particular company that the next guy has nothing but bad things to say about. Or, that company may have been OK to work with in the past but now they are not.

As for companies not paying enough to warrant driving to the rural location of the properties, require travel & time reimbursement, or, simply do not accept the WO. 

You alone are in charge of your business, and in the end, you are the only one to blame whether it makes money or completely implodes. Make business decisions, not emotional decisions.


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## American property pres (Apr 14, 2013)

I appreciate all the suggestions and advice. Just a little more about my business. I have been in business for 25 years so I'm not that new at it. I do have a lot more equipment than a mower and a rake.(although I am week in lawn equipment because that isn't what I do) My main business is cleaning, water and mold removal, and commercial cleaning. I also sell and service a few lines of cleaning equipment. Why I was looking at this business was to help keep my staff busy during slow times. I understand your frustration with people starting out because they do that in my business as well, they buy a new mop and say they are in business.
What I have seen for pricing makes no sense to me, that is why I asked the question of who I should be working for. I sense some of you are making a living at this and was just hoping to learn. I have learned a lot by just listening or reading. I have also said no to jobs because of pay and they some how found more to pay me. I agree I am the only one that can make my business successful, I work every day to make it better and I always will. Honestly I don't enjoy this type of work because when you do a good job nobody cares, and they are always trying to steal money back from us.

thanks for your help
Dennis


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## Dnmceo17 (Oct 7, 2012)

*No Luv 4 Subs!!*

:thumbup: I changed my profile to state my states :thumbsup: Wha HOO I Did it! but as far as Subs Go Im from PHILLY and we call them" Haogies" GO Phillies...& EAGLES..
oh I digress becasue the subs have come in our insurance goes up, becasue when they mess up yor the one that takes the fall and every 1 suffers at some point !! dont get me wrong if you use sub's do yo thing but I dont Luv the subs!!!:furious:

Dnmceo!!!


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