# This will be a One Time Chance....We have a Senator's ear



## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

If you have an issue that is documented...
Contact me with it as Senator for Tennessee has launched an investagation into the industry...
Michigan is ready to file suit against SGP....

Time to stand up and start documenting things...


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

What is in the lawsuits?

How is this going to effect vendors?

I can see sgp just passing the lawsuits on to the vendors and we vendors are the only ones going to get screwed.

Why are we pissing on a bees nest? The conctractors are the only ones that are going to get screwed.

You have a copy of this lawsuit? As a sgp vendor I really want to hear some solid evidence and I really hope your not just stoking the pot.


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## SRT-Diesel (Aug 1, 2013)

It's not safeguards problem. It's these dumbass contractors that don't know what they are doing. If I see power on, yard maintained, a car in the driveway, or anything, I report as occupied regardless if they like it or not and let the realtor deal with figuring it out. And if there is personals the home owners don't get locked out, only the back lock is to be changed which is again the contractors fault if they are changing all of it. 
The contractors that caused this with the Illinois AG is SCVMS.


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## Craigslist Hack (Jun 14, 2012)

Great news as long as they attack the problem. These nationals all need put out of business. Legislators have a tendency to add legislation and leave the problem in place.


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

The state of Illinois has already taken up a 50 count indictment against Safeguard. In addition there are 100's of lawsuits against them...Google Safeguard Properties/lawsuit....

The is also another 50+ count case against SGP for RICO violations...this is nothing of "stirring the pot"

As a vendor of SGP I would want to know everything going on with this company right now as it will effect your business. As I said in the OP a Senator has commenced an investigation against them....
Scuttlebutt is that SGP is already in damage control mode and attempting to rectify things by throwing sums of cash at the issues in some inane thought process that the all mighty dollar is going to fix the mess they have made over the past 7 years with their greed.

How things will effect the SGP Contractors I have no clue but myself...I would definitely be getting the ducks in a row....

http://www.cleveland.com/business/index.ssf/2013/09/safeguard_properties_of_valley.html
http://www.mortgageorb.com/e107_plugins/content/content.php?content.14321
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/local-news/safeguard-properties-faces-lawsuits-in-five-states
http://www.rfcexpress.com/lawsuits/...operties-inc-and-john-bradley-duvall/summary/

Not to be rude but, with all the madness going on with this company I find it difficult to believe that ANY Contractor for SGP is not aware of the legal issues this company has going on right now...
This is not me or Foreclosurepedia trying to rally the troops and work them up into a frenzy...this company has some serious issues, and lets not forget the IRS and IC/employee issue.....

BTW...we are not just looking for issues with SGP...we are asking for ANY documented issue in the PP with any company. If you think the action was wrong then let's talk and start getting the information into the hands of those that have the ability to enact change...and if you feel that change is going to hurt you...you're an employee and not a business owner...


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

How do we fix the industry?????

I don't see it possible unless we nationals.

I think SGP has lots of issues but I blame 90% of it on the greedy contractors. I have been a SGP vendor for I think about 6/7 years, over my time and I would say roughly 15000 work orders we have completed we have had maybe 2 issues with securing an occupied property and both of those happened in early 2009 at the peak of the boom. They both where 2nd homes for the owner and in the middle of winter and the only visited the property once a month.

In my area we have one contractor that kicks in every single door, or breaks a windows, steals stuff out of properties, and completes half assed work like you read about and hes the #1 vendor in the area. He repairs roof with drywall mud and spray paint. He is the problem in my book, when I go behind his work me and my guys would call about 30% of the houses he secures as occupied.

SGP should be on the hook for his work after all its SGP client not the local contractors. I would just hate to see SGP lose all the work. I personnel like and enjoy working for SGP I have never had an issue really with being cheated or scammed.

I must also note that I havn't completed a P&P, or REO order for SGP in about 1 year. We now only completed hazard claims/ insurance and repairs work for them.


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

wmhlc said:


> How do we fix the industry?????
> 
> I don't see it possible unless we nationals.
> 
> ...


That is why you have no issues....
Our company has never been willing to get into bed with them due to their reputation...
I don't imagine that every Contractor out there has issues with SGP...
However, you know of a problem child and yet you still work along side of them cleaning their messes up...so how is that not contributing to the problem???
Sorry but SGP is scandalous...you just happen to be one of their few employees that actually knows how to deal with them. IMHO....
I can understand your concern for the company as it appears to be your graveytrain. However, I wouldn't put my head in the sand and ignore what is going on around them. 
I would even be so bold as to suggest that one should consider life after SGP...they created a mess that can not be cleaned up without serious consequences....


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## Irnhrse5 (Apr 18, 2013)

*So what will happen in the aftermath?*

So, has anyone considered what would happen IF Safeguard was put out of business, along with every other national out there? How would the void be filled? By the banks contracting directly to the mom and pop contractors doing the work? I don't think so. If Safeguard fails, MCS fails, FAS fails, you WILL throw this industry into complete collapse. But, none of the nationals will fail. Safeguard performs all needed preservation work for EVERY SINGLE ONE of the top five banks in the industry. Safeguard submits all work not only to their clients, but to HUD, Fannie, Freddie, USDA, and VA as well. Safeguard is the middle man because the banks don't have to worry about spending BILLIONS on a contractor network. I don't think anyone here, the NPPG, or anyone with an ax to grind has thought about this. BILLIONS are at stake here, and I guarantee you, Safeguard will come out ahead of this. Will there be more regulation? Yes. But they will still come out ahead. 

Safeguard isn't the problem, per se. They don't kick down the doors them selves. Its the lazy order mills they sub to that are the problem. It's horrible contractors on the ground working for these lazy people. Its subbing to the craigslist crackhead that is the problem. Period. We have worked for Safeguard for 10 years, and not once have we been penalized for calling a property occupied. Have we been charged back? Yes. Is it enough for us to be concerned about? No. Do we get reopens? Yes. Does it concern us? No. We get jobs done. Pure and simple. And we do it in volume, and make more than enough to not worry about a $45 chargeback.

Before all of you pull out the stakes and pitchforks, you need to think about the consequences of your actions. The only way to beat Safeguard is to offer a solution that is better than what they have. Do any of you have a better solution to meet all of Safeguards' clients needs? That is the real question.


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## SRT-Diesel (Aug 1, 2013)

Irnhrse5 said:


> So, has anyone considered what would happen IF Safeguard was put out of business, along with every other national out there? How would the void be filled? By the banks contracting directly to the mom and pop contractors doing the work? I don't think so. If Safeguard fails, MCS fails, FAS fails, you WILL throw this industry into complete collapse. But, none of the nationals will fail. Safeguard performs all needed preservation work for EVERY SINGLE ONE of the top five banks in the industry. Safeguard submits all work not only to their clients, but to HUD, Fannie, Freddie, USDA, and VA as well. Safeguard is the middle man because the banks don't have to worry about spending BILLIONS on a contractor network. I don't think anyone here, the NPPG, or anyone with an ax to grind has thought about this. BILLIONS are at stake here, and I guarantee you, Safeguard will come out ahead of this. Will there be more regulation? Yes. But they will still come out ahead.
> 
> Safeguard isn't the problem, per se. They don't kick down the doors them selves. Its the lazy order mills they sub to that are the problem. It's horrible contractors on the ground working for these lazy people. Its subbing to the craigslist crackhead that is the problem. Period. We have worked for Safeguard for 10 years, and not once have we been penalized for calling a property occupied. Have we been charged back? Yes. Is it enough for us to be concerned about? No. Do we get reopens? Yes. Does it concern us? No. We get jobs done. Pure and simple. And we do it in volume, and make more than enough to not worry about a $45 chargeback.
> 
> Before all of you pull out the stakes and pitchforks, you need to think about the consequences of your actions. The only way to beat Safeguard is to offer a solution that is better than what they have. Do any of you have a better solution to meet all of Safeguards' clients needs? That is the real question.


Once reporting a property occupied comes the hell of "broker communication"...


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## Irnhrse5 (Apr 18, 2013)

SRT-Diesel said:


> Once reporting a property occupied comes the hell of "broker communication"...


Those REO guys have to worry about that. The only time I talk to realtors is on presale properties, and that usually mean we won't perform a lock change anyway.


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

I 100 agree with you


I'm all for change, but until somebody comes up with a more efficient way to run the industry using nationals I don't see any change coming.

I agree everybody should stop working for regionals that 90 of the problem


QUOTE=Irnhrse5;50851]So, has anyone considered what would happen IF Safeguard was put out of business, along with every other national out there? How would the void be filled? By the banks contracting directly to the mom and pop contractors doing the work? I don't think so. If Safeguard fails, MCS fails, FAS fails, you WILL throw this industry into complete collapse. But, none of the nationals will fail. Safeguard performs all needed preservation work for EVERY SINGLE ONE of the top five banks in the industry. Safeguard submits all work not only to their clients, but to HUD, Fannie, Freddie, USDA, and VA as well. Safeguard is the middle man because the banks don't have to worry about spending BILLIONS on a contractor network. I don't think anyone here, the NPPG, or anyone with an ax to grind has thought about this. BILLIONS are at stake here, and I guarantee you, Safeguard will come out ahead of this. Will there be more regulation? Yes. But they will still come out ahead. 

Safeguard isn't the problem, per se. They don't kick down the doors them selves. Its the lazy order mills they sub to that are the problem. It's horrible contractors on the ground working for these lazy people. Its subbing to the craigslist crackhead that is the problem. Period. We have worked for Safeguard for 10 years, and not once have we been penalized for calling a property occupied. Have we been charged back? Yes. Is it enough for us to be concerned about? No. Do we get reopens? Yes. Does it concern us? No. We get jobs done. Pure and simple. And we do it in volume, and make more than enough to not worry about a $45 chargeback.

Before all of you pull out the stakes and pitchforks, you need to think about the consequences of your actions. The only way to beat Safeguard is to offer a solution that is better than what they have. Do any of you have a better solution to meet all of Safeguards' clients needs? That is the real question.[/QUOTE]


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

SG can rot in hell.


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

wmhlc said:


> I 100 agree with you
> 
> 
> I'm all for change, but until somebody comes up with a more efficient way to run the industry using nationals I don't see any change coming.
> ...


[/QUOTE]

Sorry but SGP is a pile...they hire felons that have a record and arrests in the past two years for STEALING FROM THE MOM AND POP CONTRACTORS...that is right the company you're so vehemently defending has put into play felons that steal from contractors like me and you yet they want our company to provide a BC on ALL of our employees and the subs we use????
You do not see what is wrong with that picture???
Sorry but you need to deal with the reality SGP has rode the poor horse to death and now they must pay the piper....
http://foreclosurepedia.org/safeguard-properties-15-minutes-shame/
http://foreclosurepedia.org/senator-bob-corker-enters-safeguard-properties-fray/

Just for the record....
The banks would do the same thing they did 25 years ago before there was SGP, MCS, FAS, Cyprexx, 5 Bro...you get the picture.....none of those companies are institutions in the business world just some part of the corporate world that is traded on the NYSE....the industry got along just fine without them and will be just fine without them now....


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## BamaPPC (May 7, 2012)

we all know SG's reputation, and they deserve most of that reputation, but some of the crap that is thrown their way is not warranted. It's because of contractors not doing the job correctly that gets SG's name drug through the mud.

Now, the other side of this is, SG does things that pushes contractors to do the stupid crap they do. Low pay for jobs that require skilled labor (mold treatment, roof repair). Piss-Poor instructions on work orders. Changing the rules every few months to suit themselves. Treating contractors like employees. Reducing bids (and blaming it on HUD), Taking too much of the HUD allowables instead of paying contractors that money, and the list could go on for a while. We all know the things they do.

But, SG isn't the Devil, maybe Satan's brother-in-law... anyways, I've worked for them since 2008. I've had my troubles. But it was usually my own fault. I didn't follow the rules. I hate the rules, but they are what they are. You can follow the rules, or go play some other game. When the Ref calls holding in football, the offensive tackle can't just quit. He's got to take the penalty, suck it up, and play the next play. I think the charge-back, and the newest- QC follow-up department - are examples of SG being Satan's brother-in-law but that's just me.

I guess my point is, SG sucks balls, but what would we (the PP industry) do if they closed up shop this weekend and weren't there Monday? Is there anyone better standing in the wings that could take their place?

I'm all for positive change. Cutting off your nose to spite your face is never a good idea.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Safeguard isn't my nose.

Make a list of the things contractors have done that have caused the condition the industry is now in. Oh and make one for the Nationals too.

If the Nationals were to go away (they won't), the lenders would survive. After all, they would still have all the money the Federal Government is paying them for their upside down loans and their rotting vacant properties.

Change can be a good thing. I like change.


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

You are comparing to different points in time. Before pre crisis mom and pops could make it work. Now the volume is to high for mom and pops, a 2nd layer must be added.

The whole felon thing should be dealt with, did the felons trick and fake paperwork
to get hired?

Why do you not want bc checks? This would solve lot of the issues with felons working on the homes. I have worked in construction most my life andI bet 45% of sites have felons working on them. Construction needs labor and the clean record person does t want to do manual labor.

I would love to see all the nationals go but until somebody figures out a way to handle the volume the way the national do and protect the clients assets in the timelines the clients demand I personally don't see any change in our future.

I'm all for starting up a roundtable or a discussion about returning the work to the books on the ground. Lets figure out a way for it to work and cut out the nationals.

But until we find a way I don't slap the hand that's feeds me.


OTE=Cleanupman;50859][/QUOTE]

Sorry but SGP is a pile...they hire felons that have a record and arrests in the past two years for STEALING FROM THE MOM AND POP CONTRACTORS...that is right the company you're so vehemently defending has put into play felons that steal from contractors like me and you yet they want our company to provide a BC on ALL of our employees and the subs we use????
You do not see what is wrong with that picture???
Sorry but you need to deal with the reality SGP has rode the poor horse to death and now they must pay the piper....
http://foreclosurepedia.org/safeguard-properties-15-minutes-shame/
http://foreclosurepedia.org/senator-bob-corker-enters-safeguard-properties-fray/

Just for the record....
The banks would do the same thing they did 25 years ago before there was SGP, MCS, FAS, Cyprexx, 5 Bro...you get the picture.....none of those companies are institutions in the business world just some part of the corporate world that is traded on the NYSE....the industry got along just fine without them and will be just fine without them now....[/QUOTE]


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

wmhlc said:


> Why do you not want bc checks? This would solve lot of the issues with felons working on the homes. I have worked in construction most my life andI bet 45% of sites have felons working on them. Construction needs labor and the clean record person does t want to do manual labor.


Not sure what you are saying here. You want bc checks to prevent felons from working in preservation but you also state that non felons don't want the manual labor side of the job?


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## Craigslist Hack (Jun 14, 2012)

We don't need nationals. They should divide states up by regions and let experienced contractors bid the regions. I estimate they would need 1 to 3 contractors per region. They should cap it so that no one contractor has more than one region. Otherwise a national is reborn. It would be much much simpler. 

I work for a couple of banks direct and it's soo much easier. We currently cover portions of 3 states. If we had the volume locally we could manage just as many properties with a more local crew. This would give them better service and make me more profitable.


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

http://aladayllc.com/2013/09/11/wells-fargo-do-they-know/
http://aladayllc.com/2013/09/10/safeguard-lps-5-brothers-legal-woes/
http://aladayllc.com/2013/09/09/safeguard-properties-are-you-guilty-by-association/
http://aladayllc.com/2013/08/26/flirtin-with-disaster/

These are all articles that I have written in the past month 
The one below about Mathis and Lambert...perhaps a little opinionated but factual none the less...
Between the stories that myself and a couple others have written SGP has offered to make good on the bad checks these two wrote to Contractors for the services they completed while these two were subbing SGP work out. So please tell me why all of the BOTG MUST submit to BC's while SGP puts these two into play (MCS also) without a BC?????
They put these two into play less than a year after they were charged with fraud and theft in another state....Two people that are known throughout the industry as swindlers and scammers that open one LLC here burn it out and move to the next territory....

http://aladayllc.com/2013/09/08/ppi-travesty-of-justice-mathis-and-lambert-strike-yet-again/

Sorry but SGP made their bed and now they must lie in it...they have done nothing but make everyone that works FOR them an employee with the luxury of paying them as IC's...they along with NAMFS have drug the entire industry to the pathetic state it is in...

Some upcoming events in the industry, and I encourage everyone to participate...even if you send an email with your ideas in to someone that can place them in a directory for addressing...something to get your voice heard....
I would think the fact that a US Senator has started an investigation on a Congressional level into an organizations activities in an industry would warrant a little attention to start protecting your business...
Blame the crap contractors all you want...No one has done anything to stop the practice so you're right there with them assisting the downfall....
As I stated in one of the articles...It took our company about 30 minutes to make the decision SGP was not a company that we wanted to be associated with...
http://aladayllc.com/2013/09/12/october-one-revolution-update/

I have also been asked to participate in a round table discussion on the current state of the industry that will be sponsored by NAARPI, I will get the dates and information to everyone once I know them...
Change is definitely coming...


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

GTX63 said:


> Not sure what you are saying here. You want bc checks to prevent felons from working in preservation but you also state that non felons don't want the manual labor side of the job?


To get non felons out of the game the pay has to increase or double to get felon free workers. The current system doesn't provide an opportunity for this to happen.


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## LAND (Mar 4, 2013)

BOTG's need to assume responsibility to some degree as well. You know your limitations and what jobs are worth. Stay within your scope and bid accordingly. WE are the ones that killed pricing, doing jobs out of our scope
for less than FAIR CONTRACTOR VALUE,exposing ourselves to the most hazardous conditions know to man, and assuming responsibility{remember your HELD HARMLESS agreement}. Meanwhile the 'sued o powers that be'
set low-ball pricing nationwide. Stop, take a breath and fight for your own pricing the correct pricing. The real pricing in this industry is published (HUD,FNMA and so on..). The won't tell you this in those "start a business" videos. It's okay to work off a percentage of the published rates..i.e 15 to 20%, after all they (whoever) came to you with the job. But why 55 to 78%.. 
Look I've owned and operated my Lawn & Landscaping business for 15+ years. If someone came to me and said cut my grass for $20 my response would be "I'll edge your sidewalk for $20 and that doesn't include clean up." 
Use common sense BOTG's. Protect YOUR bottom line!


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

When I started in this business 16 yrs ago we worked directly for the banks ( BOA, WFHM etc) with absolutely ZERO problems. We handled 4 States (Ia, Mn SC & Ga) with over 10,000 properties serviced with nearly ZERO problems. We took Bank CEO's out in the field to inspect their properties and discussed what needed done in order to maximize their ROI with ZERO problems. We replaced over 800 windows on properties and repainted untold numbers of homes on a simple phone call with ZERO problems. 

THEN came this National trend called: OUTSOURCING.

All went to hell in a few short years. Properties fell into disrepair, contractors were paid minimum amounts or worse yet not paid at all. 

The only thing that can save this industry is to revert back to having the banks actually service their own properties. Nearly everything is computerized so paperpushers are 10% of the number needed 10 yrs ago. 

Dreaming of the old days.


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## LAND (Mar 4, 2013)

That National trend turned contracting into a pyramid scheme.


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## UnitedFieldInspections (Dec 20, 2012)

SG Needs to go.My only solution to help with this industry is to acctually have reps that have contractors experience and to move from nationals to the little guys,regional etc.Hire experienced contractors with the right tools not a mini van and a push lawnmower with no tools.This industry has changed over the last 5-10 years


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## Craigslist Hack (Jun 14, 2012)

UnitedFieldInspections said:


> SG Needs to go.My only solution to help with this industry is to acctually have reps that have contractors experience and to move from nationals to the little guys,regional etc.Hire experienced contractors with the right tools not a mini van and a push lawnmower with no tools.This industry has changed over the last 5-10 years



I was at a property the other day that a local contractor did. He did an amazing job the place looked great. He did the work for 5 bros and it was a repair job with some other stuff thrown in. I will be interested in seeing this guy around. I bet this will be his last job ever in the industry.:whistling2:


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## cutting grass (Jul 14, 2013)

Get rid of the greed 
Have someone or a council of someone's over see prices
So greed cant/doesn't get back in to it 
If the guy doing the job got most of the pay 
You would eliminate a layer or 2 of desk jockies 
If the pay for a recut starts out at $85 and there was something in place that stated ,and was enforced, that the guy actually cutting the grass got $60 of the $85 
Then there wouldn't be any room for greedy cons to say "hey I can fit in there and make money doing nothing and come up with bs reason to back charge and take more of the money from the guy out there sweating to make a buck"


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