# Make a national pay



## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

Hey guys,

So we're done with safeguard and they owe us about 25k at the moment. Coincidentally they've found 30k worth of charge backs against us. Just wondering does anyone here know a good way to fight them on this?

Yes, I know it was a mistake ever dealing with them etc...But now I'd just like the money I earned. I would hate to lawyer up and pay half the money just trying to get it so I'm looking for a way to go or who I can bring a complaint to that will actually help.

Any help is appreciated. Thanks


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

An attorney that costs you half of the 25K vs collecting it on your own?
Since it is Safeguard, they have likely strung out your invoices way past the point you can file a lien. They are masters of keeping all of theirs and a lot of yours; they've had 25 years of practice. 
For the amount of money, I would start the legal process right now. RIGHT NOW.
Hire someone who knows how to write the notifications, get the property searches and has a good relationship with the judges.
I used to be in court almost weekly for civil cases/eviction/property management matters and I got to know the routine pretty well. One thing a good attorney told me that I'll never get however, besides the law degree, was access to the judges and the machine.
I wish you the best but get a move on. Time is not on your side.


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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

Thanks for the reply...Yeah I wouldn't try to defend myself in court lol I know that's a world I know nothing about. I just meant if I'm trying to put pressure on them to pay up myself how to go about doing that. 

But yeah I'm guessing lawyer is the best option. Sucks but oh well. Thanks again 

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## charge back (Dec 3, 2016)

carrion215 said:


> Thanks for the reply...Yeah I wouldn't try to defend myself in court lol I know that's a world I know nothing about. I just meant if I'm trying to put pressure on them to pay up myself how to go about doing that.
> 
> But yeah I'm guessing lawyer is the best option. Sucks but oh well. Thanks again
> 
> Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk


the best pressure would be via liens on properties if you are still within the time frame on any of them


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## JoeInPI (Dec 18, 2014)

There isn't anything you're going to do to "put pressure on them" aside from setting lawyer loose on them. Even then, I hope you're not past the point of no return, i.e. not being able to file liens. Any guesses why they came up with $30,000 worth of chargebacks when they owe you $25,000+ in payment?


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## Wannabe (Oct 1, 2012)

Sickening


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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

Not sure how that number came up. I figured they said just slightly over what they owe me so I wouldn't want to press them on it. I figure it's an easy way to scare someone off

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## Craigslist Hack (Jun 14, 2012)

Regardless of time passing by contact the banks. SG is hated by all.


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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

Funny that you say that. I've been reaching out to the brokers and they love when I'm the vendor in their house but hate safeguard. They always say they'd go direct with me if they were allowed...Unless they're just saying it to make sure I continue doing a good job lol

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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

That's definitely a great idea though I'll start calling them asap most likely safeguard has already gotten paid from them though. 

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## charge back (Dec 3, 2016)

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carrion215 said:


> That's definitely a great idea though I'll start calling them asap most likely safeguard has already gotten paid from them though.
> 
> Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk



that is why you NEED to lien the properties, then call, hey I just filled a lien at property 123 main st because SG has not paid me for XYZ services performed, otherwise you will only get the run around, 

as long as you are calling people, call your state AG and file a complaint against SG and the bank, ask the AG to let you know what they are doing to deal with the fraudulent business operating in your state, follow up with them to see what response they got from SG, be the squeaky wheel so they keep the case moving, don't let your file get lost in a stack of files,


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Just a quick thought- generally as a rule, a contractor cannot withold payment for work completed by their subs that they have invoiced their client and received payment for, especially when claiming the work has failed to meet standards. That is a 5 letter word called "Fraud".
Again, this issue has assuredly been raised during their staff meetings and in interoffice memos so I expect they have measures created for doing so.
Safeguard Dept heads/reps get bonuses for certain monthly/quarterly goals, so pulling in an extra 20k or so is like free money for the dept with a little kickback for the boss.
If you ask them if they billed the client for your chargebacks, their likely response will be "Of course not. We aren't able to do that", but if you ask for verification, you won't get it without calling Saul.


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## USConsulting (Oct 31, 2013)

carrion215 said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> So we're done with safeguard and they owe us about 25k at the moment. Coincidentally they've found 30k worth of charge backs against us. Just wondering does anyone here know a good way to fight them on this?
> 
> ...


30K OF CHARGE BACKS???? I am speechless. Safeguard is notorious for thievery and if you have the proper documentation and find the right lawyer, you have a whopping case of fraud against them. Fight smart and you will come up with more than what they owe you. They are just pulling the 30K out of a hat and it is obvious. You would have received an extremely large amount of correspondence [prior if that was the case.


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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

Hey guys thanks for all the advice and comments here. I don't think it clicked before just how big of an issue this was. 

I spoke to my lawyer and he suggested mechanic liens on each property...That's gonna get the banks attention and they'll go to safeguard asking why they were paid but the mechanic never was. Anyway I called Tim wrath and he's trying to be a spin artist and ditch me so I spoke to his boss told her the situation and that I do not want to place liens on the properties and I am letting them know as a courtesy. Her tone immediately changed into a very helpful one. We got an email with actual chargebacks no where near $30k and she'll be reaching out to accounting to see what the hold up is. I'm sure the conversation is more like "crap, this guys not gonna let it go, cut the check"

Anyway I'm thinking to place my liens anyway just to alert the banks and maybe insert myself as a direct vendor...Good idea? Or shady?

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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Years ago, I was sitting in my attorney's office debating cutting a client some slack over their guarantees to correct a situation if I would only give them another 30 days. My lawyer told me the following story-

So a low level dope dealer, who is suspected of being an informant, is scooped up by the cartel and taken to a abandoned warehouse and tied to a chair over a pool of blood. Their enforcer asks him if he has been supplying information to the police. Despite evidence contradicting his story, the dope dealer replies no, he would never do such a thing and he is with them 100%. He'll even work the streets to find out who is and rat them out.

Response A is the enforcer looks at him for a moment, sighs deeply and replies "Ok then. We'll cut you loose so you can go. Let us know as soon as you find something out. Thanks"

Response B is an assistant pushes a cart out revealing assorted surgical instruments, as well as a few hand tools. He immediately cuts off the dealers little toe. Then he removes a thumb and says "Ok, he's ready."
At that point the enforcer says "Good afternoon. My name is Hector and I work for X. I'm going to ask you a series of questions. Before each question you will lose one fingernail; after each answer that I deem incorrect or incomplete I'm going to have my assistant remove a finger. I'll try to be as efficient with my inquiries as possible so as not to impose upon the rest of your time today. Please show me the same courtesy with your answers."

The point is that you always negotiate collections from a position of strength. You cannot control the outcome without an advantage. Simply agreeing to wait for the mailman or accept 70% of what you justly earned is letting the clock run out on your legal options and rights.


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## charge back (Dec 3, 2016)

nothing shady about filing liens if you haven't been paid, file and dont remove them until the check clears, they claim to be "helpful" now, but it is all part of the delay, they don't want to help you, they want you to go away


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## carrion215 (Dec 6, 2016)

lol gtx, got it I'll hire some goons to take their thumbs. Good story you're absolutely right, got to call them back from a position where I have the leverage. The part that really pisses me off is even with them telling me this my response was, "I got my guys cleaning out 2 different properties at this moment, would you like us to drop everything or finish the job?" I'll let you guys guess which they chose. I've tallied the orders and there are at least 40 orders they owe me on. I'm within the 6 months so they'll be getting notified of a bunch of mechanic liens now. I'm all ears for a lawyer who wont take me to the cleaners...safeguard beat him to it lol.

Thanks for all the replies guys I appreciate the advice.


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