# FAS is Slipping



## Guest

Field Assets IS slipping. They have had a definite change in their operating tactics over the last year. The vendors (contractors) are expendable is the message that is being sent. Case in point 

(1)	Tennant access, a division of FAS SUCKS. We are to go to a property and meet with the tenants and do services. ONLY if the price is what FAS says do these services need to be done. Replacement of a GAS 40 gallon hot water heater $600 what a joke. I can’t buy a gas hot water heater for that price. To install it with a PRO plumber and new supply hoses on top of already going backwards on the water heater and then wait 45 days to get reimbursed if it passes QC, which is a crap shoot at best, then l have to eat the sales tax. When questioned as to where they are getting their prices “it is our business model” is a standard answer. Then they hire a plumber to do the job. Thanks for wasting my time FAS! Not like my family would like to see me for the 3 hours it took to go down and diagnose and return not to get paid for the trip !!

I could go on about the tenant access nightmares and they CONTINUE to call after they have been told I DON’T DO TA. They recently called and have a short in an electrical panel. SERIOUS so I called my electrician and got his price thinking that it was reasonable and set the time for next morning called the representative at TA “OH that’s too much but I will see if I can get it approved”. I did NOT receive a call back and then I get up this morning and the Work order was cancelled. Thanks for the call back to cancel the electrician ON A SATURDAY. The underlying theme is that we the vendors time is worthless and unless we work for peanuts we are replaceable.


I could go on and on but there are too many issues with the business model and their double standard treatment of their vendors for me to waste my time with. 

BE WARNED Captain DALE’s ship has lost its rudder


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## Guest

Yes, we also no longer work with them for the same reasons....
Cyprexx is worse...$365 for a 20 yard trash out????
We bailed out the banks with our taxes and now these companies like FAS, Cyprexx, et al.
have become nothing more than an extension of the banks and they want us to bail them out with our labor.
Everyone in this industry needs to so no...sooner or later...
We have adapted the philosophy, This is OUR coverage area, this is the fee WE NEED for your company to have this service performed by our company....
If they don't want to pay it then as far as I'm concerned let someone else go broke...


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## Guest

everyone just needs to understand your independent contractor. You have your set prices and they have to abide by your bid. If the service company hires a professional contractor to do electrical, plumbing, hvac then technically they are the general contractor. call your local building code officer and see if any permits were pulled. if not, turn them in for unlicensed work. done it many times and you will get a phone call to see if you'll go pull permits for them, then you name your price!


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## david

fremont maybe its just slow time in your area,i went a month with hardly no work and last 2 months all the work i want and more,cant even count the jobs ive refused in just last 2 weeks alone,hopefully it will pick up soon for you and good luck.


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## david

sorry i meant hardly and your right they have changed personel,they do it every 2 months,why is anyones guess but it drives me crazy dealing with new people all the time,just do as others if you cant do a job for price they want,then just dont do it,they always think they have someone in line but trust me they dont,they have actually lost a lot of vendors lately


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## BPWY

FAS was no good back in 09. 
Its no shock that they've gotten worse.


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## Guest

It's just as bad when you have to call in to get a bid approved and they say "go ahead" and I tell them to email me the conformation for that price. It clearly states in my file that every bid needs Written Conformation before work will start then I wait for the email conformation and it never comes. Next thing I know they pull my work order trying to say I refused the job. B.S. you never sent me conformation "let me speak to your supervisor please". Around and around we go again. FAS is just as bad as a Collection Agency as far as there B.S. tactics go. :thumbdown


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## Guest

d+jhomeservices said:


> fremont maybe its just slow time in your area,i went a month with hardly no work and last 2 months all the work i want and more,cant even count the jobs ive refused in just last 2 weeks alone,hopefully it will pick up soon for you and good luck.


With us its not "slow enough". Just surpassed our 29,000th invoice with just 1 company...its called tenure.


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## thanohano44

d+jhomeservices said:


> sorry i meant hardly and your right they have changed personel,they do it every 2 months,why is anyones guess but it drives me crazy dealing with new people all the time,just do as others if you cant do a job for price they want,then just dont do it,they always think they have someone in line but trust me they dont,they have actually lost a lot of vendors lately


The reason is to try to avoid contractors figuring out their reps weakness' and ways to work them in the contractors favor. It also helps the nationals keep the job feeling fresh to their employees. Corporate america mental mind trick mumbo jumbo.


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## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> The reason is to try to avoid contractors figuring out their reps weakness' and ways to work them in the contractors favor. It also helps the nationals keep the job feeling fresh to their employees. Corporate america mental mind trick mumbo jumbo.


Our experience, at least for us, 
CREATES...confusion. We found that most of the time it was a case of the individual not being able to handle the stress of a high volume position. We could always tell by the second conversation if the person was going to last...I actually won two pools we had going on different individuals as to how long they would last...not that that is anything to brag about...they were just easy to figure out...
The figuring out weakness issue is...solid to say the least.
Everyone knows that FAS is traded on the NYSE right??? Thus the corporate thing is in play ALL the time...


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## david

cleanup what name does fas use to trade stocks ive looked it up but could not find them


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## Guest

I would have to look it up. Thay are part of a conglomerate.


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> Our experience, at least for us,
> CREATES...confusion. We found that most of the time it was a case of the individual not being able to handle the stress of a high volume position. We could always tell by the second conversation if the person was going to last...I actually won two pools we had going on different individuals as to how long they would last...not that that is anything to brag about...they were just easy to figure out...
> The figuring out weakness issue is...solid to say the least.
> Everyone knows that FAS is traded on the NYSE right??? Thus the corporate thing is in play ALL the time...


I worked in corporate america for 10 years in management. I can spot this BS a mile a way. I can also decipher most of the bs, lies, blanket statements and figure out what is exactly that they're trying to do. 

They sell their reps on rotating their regions or portfolios to give them the experience the need to move up into management. Give them added responsibility, maybe a new title but same pay. And say whomever delivers the best results SHOULD or WOULD be the prime candidate for consideration for a promotion. 

Then each of these reps have a budget of how much they can work with per month and they have profit margin goals which determine their tiered monthly performance incentives. The less you spend to get the work done, the more they make. Then they factor in on time completions, quality scores etc. 

I attended so many six sigma BS classes and courses that were geared to amp up production, peak employee performance and quality results through spinning the data in your favor so that "we always put our best practices forward in all facets of our growing business model" so that we all succeed. But I have also seen how those same lessons can drag down employee morale. And a lot of you are experiencing it with your interactions with your PM's etc.


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## Guest

The Franchise Company Acquires Field Asset Services, Inc.
November 07, 2007 17:20:00 // Franchise: The Franchise Company // Tags: Mergers & Acquisition News
The Franchise Company (TFC) is proud to announce that it has expanded its property services portfolio with the acquisition of an 80% interest in Field Asset Services, Inc., one of North America's largest residential preservation services companies


You can find the article here;

http://www.franchisenewswatch.com/merger_news/popular/


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## Guest

http://www.dsnews.com/articles/field-asset-services-unveils-new-pre-foreclosure-service-avert-2011-09-16

Another fine example of how they are another exrension of the banks...


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## Guest

Well hearing this now...the pieces are coming together. Heres what I forsee:

) TFC has Paul Davis Restoration franchises. They will handle the restoration work.

)TFC has The Handyman Connection franchises. They will do the handyman type work.

3) TFC has a Cabinet franchise. They will do the kitchen & bath work.

AND NEXT

TFC will be offering the brand new Property Preservation franchise for $XX,***. Get on the bandwagon now boy's and girl's.


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## Guest

bingo


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## GTX63

Once we gave FAS their pink slip we never looked back. We only did work for them as a favor to our local Brokers, as FAS used some of the worst of the worst contractors and absolutley infuriated the Brokers with the poor quality slop they did to homes. FAS called us several times after that, stating they had changed their standards of operations and that we would now find them quite inviting. LOL. They are still bringing in crews from 150 miles out of the area and butchering even basic wints, board ups, mows, etc. We did tens of thousands in business with them each month and the profit margin was nearly non existent.


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## Tom Stuble

sounds like an awesome business you guys are in to:whistling


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## GTX63

Not for the faint of heart


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## Guest

boy now there is an understatement...
We have adopted this philosophy....
.....This is our coverage area. This is what I need to perform that service for you...
If they don't pay it we don't do it...
However, we cover some very remote areas and we can draw this line in the sand and get away with it...someone wher there are 5000 people with a truck willing to do winterizations for 40 bucks...sorry won't work!!!


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## david

gtx if you did tens of thousands in workj and hardly no profit,i'd say you was working way to cheap and didnt do your math,or imreading your post wrong


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## david

cleanup you do know nationals get 150 for each wint i dont do em for less then 100,but yes their is contractors that will do stuff for little of nothing and think their making money


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## BPWY

I've been thinking on the franchise comments from yesterday.


There is no way that under the current method of ops that will work for any length of time.
Franchise owners are not going to put up with HUD depressing the rates below the cost of materials, let alone expenses and profit. ie $12 lockboxes less discount when you can't even buy them for that rate. Then you've got drive time and labor to install one.

Franchise owners also will not put up with charge backs, free trips for bids and a multitude of the other insane BS that currently goes on in the P&P business.

Similar to NOW's attempts to charge $5000 for training, up front, no financing and no guarantees of work........ I don't see this as working out well for any length of time. 
But I could be wrong. Time will tell.


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## GTX63

No you read the post correctly. We do a lot of volume in numerous areas besides REO, but it was for a time, a way to keep part time crews going and keep a paycheck in their pocket. They were declining invoices 60-90 days after the fact and we had to have an additional lady in the office just to chase money. We are willing to work for less when the relationship is good but charity begins at home.


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## david

gtx like you said you have to think of yourself 1st or you'll go under fast,i basically use 1 guy sometimes 2,i cant see a profit in all the expansion of trying to hire 4 or 5 people and no guarantee of work,so i just use 2 part timers that also work other jobs good luck to you


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## Splinterpicker

*Franchise not worth it*

I firmly agree that the franchise is NOT the way to go. When this comes out I am dropping them. 

Now it is horrid enough... They attempt repeat ATTEMPT to get their properties completed in 3 days YHEA RIGHT. I do my part to give valid completion times and they do NOTHING but a smackdown on pricing... 1/2 acre 3 to 5 ft tall grass cut for 125. Accept all the Work Order at their prices or Nothing at all from that WO. Then when it is denied they spend weeks trying to find a contractor to do it. I am not looking to retire off of one job but be compensated adaquetly for a job well done. 

I can only imagine the frusteration once you buy into the franchise and are contractually obligated or forced to do it at their prices or you loose your franchise . 

Instead of the franchising route they should look into a mold remediation frasnchise company. Oh yhea just like the rest of us who look at their policy they wont because of the liability. :laughing:

Their web site crashes , removes workorders on its own and "is about as stable a s my exwife" a quote from The Worlds Fastest Indian a GREAT MOVIE


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## Guest

I know some (most) will disagree but I'm telling you that the franchise will work. The Franchise Company is a very good and very very successful franchise building company. They know what they are doing and from "limited experience" they "make" their franchises successful if you follow their business plan. 

NOW another on the "up side" of the franchise: The SEC, the Federal Trade Commission and the States Workforce Development (different names in different States) would make the rules that the franchise has to go by inside the franchise filings. 

Now a major downside is: How many of us would want to spend $1000's on a franchise plus the franchise royalties? Not many BUT there would be a ton of investors that *would* buy a franchise and sub out to us. Of course "our take" would be less but hell whats new?

Once 1 major National does this and starts raising Millions in Easy Capital from Franchise Sales than I guarantee EVERYONE of them will follow soon. 

JMO


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## Guest

splinterpicker said:


> I firmly agree that the franchise is NOT the way to go. When this comes out I am dropping them.
> 
> Now it is horrid enough... They attempt repeat ATTEMPT to get their properties completed in 3 days YHEA RIGHT. I do my part to give valid completion times and they do NOTHING but a smackdown on pricing... 1/2 acre 3 to 5 ft tall grass cut for 125. Accept all the Work Order at their prices or Nothing at all from that WO. Then when it is denied they spend weeks trying to find a contractor to do it. I am not looking to retire off of one job but be compensated adaquetly for a job well done.
> 
> I can only imagine the frusteration once you buy into the franchise and are contractually obligated or forced to do it at their prices or you loose your franchise .
> 
> Instead of the franchising route they should look into a mold remediation frasnchise company. Oh yhea just like the rest of us who look at their policy they wont because of the liability. :laughing:
> 
> Their web site crashes , removes workorders on its own and "is about as stable a s my exwife" a quote from The Worlds Fastest Indian a GREAT MOVIE


Field Assets' Owner (TFC) already owns a Mold Franchise Company==Paul Davis Restoration.


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## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> I know some (most) will disagree but I'm telling you that the franchise will work. The Franchise Company is a very good and very very successful franchise building company. They know what they are doing and from "limited experience" they "make" their franchises successful if you follow their business plan.
> 
> NOW another on the "up side" of the franchise: The SEC, the Federal Trade Commission and the States Workforce Development (different names in different States) would make the rules that the franchise has to go by inside the franchise filings.
> 
> Now a major downside is: How many of us would want to spend $1000's on a franchise plus the franchise royalties? Not many BUT there would be a ton of investors that would buy a franchise and sub out to us. Of course "our take" would be less but hell whats new?
> 
> Once 1 major National does this and starts raising Millions in Easy Capital from Franchise Sales than I guarantee EVERYONE of them will follow soon.
> 
> JMO


You're a wise sage.


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## Guest

Lol..just seen this crap happen to us before. Its all in the Money Grab. 

Personally I think this business is on the downhill slide and these nationals realize this also so they will grab the fast money.


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I know some (most) will disagree but I'm telling you that the franchise will work. The Franchise Company is a very good and very very successful franchise building company. They know what they are doing and from "limited experience" they "make" their franchises successful if you follow their business plan.
> 
> NOW another on the "up side" of the franchise: The SEC, the Federal Trade Commission and the States Workforce Development (different names in different States) would make the rules that the franchise has to go by inside the franchise filings.
> 
> Now a major downside is: How many of us would want to spend $1000's on a franchise plus the franchise royalties? Not many BUT there would be a ton of investors that *would* buy a franchise and sub out to us. Of course "our take" would be less but hell whats new?
> 
> Once 1 major National does this and starts raising Millions in Easy Capital from Franchise Sales than I guarantee EVERYONE of them will follow soon.
> 
> JMO





thanohano44 said:


> You're a wise sage.





You're right Troy.
And I usually agree with Fremont.


But I'm saying there is no way the franchise will work in the current work environment. There will have to be drastic changes in the standard operating procedures from where things are today.

Am I saying franchise can't work? Nope. Just that it won't/cannot the way things are now days.


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## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> You're right Troy.
> And I usually agree with Fremont.
> 
> But I'm saying there is no way the franchise will work in the current work environment. There will have to be drastic changes in the standard operating procedures from where things are today.
> 
> Am I saying franchise can't work? Nope. Just that it won't/cannot the way things are now days.


Paul,

Those who have the money make the rules. They'll make the necessary changes needed to entice prospective buyers. Then they will find ways around that to keep most of the money. 

Have you ever heard of the Quizno's franchise? It's fairly easy to start up but hard to turn a profit once you're in business. Those shops are sold to another prospective buyer within 9 months because the normal owner can't turn a profit. The royalties are outrageous! 

I had noticed that and asked a former owner about it. And then i asked another former owner. All told me the same thing. I also read that somewhere. I think they put out a product superior to that of subway.


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## Guest

Franchise....
Put it all in perspective. That would bring regulation.
That would mean nationals could no longer tell you that hazards are part of the debris count. Force you to facilitate plumbing repairs on wints when you do not hold a plumbing license. try to pay $75 for vehicle removal when they know it cost $150 to get a tow truck out to a property...Oh and let's not forget all the independant contractor rules they violate....Those regulations would definitely be inforced as the IRS always wants their money...
There would be some serious changes to the industry that would drive fees up to where WE need them to be.
While we do not need to form a "union" sort of speak, everyone needs to stand together and say no...
Look the American tax payers bailed out the banks once now we are being asked to cut our pricing while the our costs have gone up. So the reality is that now we bail them out with our labor????
Personally I think there needs to be A LOT more regulation to force the lenders to pay the fees that are needed and quit screwing the little guy. 
These Nationals have become nothing more nothing more than an extension of the banks with FAS leading the way

http://news.yahoo.com/field-asset-services-unveils-pre-foreclosure-avert-123212245.html

This has just published in the past 2 hours.(currently 6:51 am PST)
Field Asset Services Earns a Spot on 2011 InformationWeek 500 List of Top Technology Innovators across America
http://news.yahoo.com/field-asset-services-earns-spot-2011-informationweek-500-123614576.html
Read these articles....you will have a much better understanding.
Remember this is a company that has MANDITORY vendor conferences for training... at the vendors expense...
So To all out there....
If the money is not right say no. The word is getting out and at least in our area we are starting to see the same people place help wanted postings every 3-4 days. The word WILL get out and then there will be this big push to "clear" inventories...
We just went to add Cyprexx as additionally insured...we were told no...then told by that if we do our premium would go up77%...I told Cyprexx they would have to raise their lousy 365 fee they offered for the initial package...do I need to finish???
We will not be accepting any work from them...Any insite here???(perhaps that is a different thread altogether??)
I still believe that competition is good but at the same time you gotta work together.
It was the greed element of capitalism that created this mess and now the greed side is kicking in from the back end...
Funny how the pecuniary elements of capitalism combined with the manipulative nature of the beast in a democratic society craeate graft and corruption...
Just sayin'...
Have a good day all... gotta go perform for the bean counters!!!!!


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## Guest

d+jhomeservices said:


> cleanup you do know nationals get 150 for each wint i dont do em for less then 100,but yes their is contractors that will do stuff for little of nothing and think their making money


My understanding is that they receive 300 for them...That came from a couple ex-employees at FAS and a couple realtors we work with...

We do them for 150...if you gaurantee 200 for the season we will go 100


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> My understanding is that they receive 300 for them...That came from a couple ex-employees at FAS and a couple realtors we work with...
> 
> We do them for 150...if you gaurantee 200 for the season we will go 100


FAS pays me $150 per unit. $300 if there's 2 units to drain and so forth.


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## Guest

I had to fight with FAS to get 125...I finallygot 150 after a while but it was like pulling teeth...I had to show them another vendors invoice as they insisted they did not pay that high for the service.
But I no longer have them for a headache!!!
Hope alls well in your neck of the woods!!!:clap:


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> I had to fight with FAS to get 125...I finallygot 150 after a while but it was like pulling teeth...I had to show them another vendors invoice as they insisted they did not pay that high for the service.
> But I no longer have them for a headache!!!
> Hope alls well in your neck of the woods!!!:clap:


Like with everyone else, to stay "competitive" they dropped their prices to be more attractive to their prospective clients. What I want to know is......since all of this undercutting and nonsense has gone on, how many more insurance claims have been filed and how has this affected the nationals ability to land large contracts. FAS lost Fannie mae. Safeguard lost Fannie Mae etc.


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## mtmtnman

Cleanupman said:


> Franchise....
> Put it all in perspective. That would bring regulation.
> That would mean nationals could no longer tell you that hazards are part of the debris count. Force you to facilitate plumbing repairs on wints when you do not hold a plumbing license. try to pay $75 for vehicle removal when they know it cost $150 to get a tow truck out to a property...Oh and let's not forget all the independant contractor rules they violate....Those regulations would definitely be inforced as the IRS always wants their money...
> There would be some serious changes to the industry that would drive fees up to where WE need them to be.
> While we do not need to form a "union" sort of speak, everyone needs to stand together and say no...
> Look the American tax payers bailed out the banks once now we are being asked to cut our pricing while the our costs have gone up. So the reality is that now we bail them out with our labor????
> Personally I think there needs to be A LOT more regulation to force the lenders to pay the fees that are needed and quit screwing the little guy.
> These Nationals have become nothing more nothing more than an extension of the banks with FAS leading the way
> 
> http://news.yahoo.com/field-asset-services-unveils-pre-foreclosure-avert-123212245.html
> 
> This has just published in the past 2 hours.(currently 6:51 am PST)
> Field Asset Services Earns a Spot on 2011 InformationWeek 500 List of Top Technology Innovators across America
> http://news.yahoo.com/field-asset-services-earns-spot-2011-informationweek-500-123614576.html
> Read these articles....you will have a much better understanding.
> Remember this is a company that has MANDITORY vendor conferences for training... at the vendors expense...
> So To all out there....
> If the money is not right say no. The word is getting out and at least in our area we are starting to see the same people place help wanted postings every 3-4 days. The word WILL get out and then there will be this big push to "clear" inventories...
> We just went to add Cyprexx as additionally insured...we were told no...then told by that if we do our premium would go up77%...I told Cyprexx they would have to raise their lousy 365 fee they offered for the initial package...do I need to finish???
> We will not be accepting any work from them...Any insite here???(perhaps that is a different thread altogether??)
> I still believe that competition is good but at the same time you gotta work together.
> It was the greed element of capitalism that created this mess and now the greed side is kicking in from the back end...
> Funny how the pecuniary elements of capitalism combined with the manipulative nature of the beast in a democratic society craeate graft and corruption...
> Just sayin'...
> Have a good day all... gotta go perform for the bean counters!!!!!




Your second link is scary too me. I hope other nationals DO NOT require this in the future!! Here's the issue i see. If they have the TIME in the data sent they can use this to cut you even further!!!! I can hear it now, You show up at a very nice and clean house and knock out the janitorial in a few hours. " Mr Contractor, I see your janitorial only took you a few hours. We can't justify paying your normal rate because the place was clean already. You will have a 50% deduct on the cleaning portion of your invoice" .........................


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## Guest

I have contacted FAS to inquire about contracting with them. They were concerned I did not offer to do Janitorial work. I asked them for their pricing.



> FAS standard pricing is as follows:
> 
> Janitorial: $75 under 2000 sq ft
> 
> $150 over 2000 sq ft
> 
> $125 Janitorial Premiere
> 
> Maid: $40 Recurring Service


This just seems too low. Your opinions?


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## mtmtnman

72opp said:


> I have contacted FAS to inquire about contracting with them. They were concerned I did not offer to do Janitorial work. I asked them for their pricing.
> 
> 
> 
> This just seems too low. Your opinions?



Bout the same as everyone else but usually the janitorial is part of a bundle so if there is little trash you make it up there.............


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## Splinterpicker

*thoughts*

Its weird that they profess a 3 day turn in their propaganda to the banks BUT when a property is denied what happens? they spend a day or 2 finding another contractor and then it is on day 3 without anything being done. When they say do it all or nothing who is asked to do the second bid ??? Someone from the handyman franchise 

I just see less light through a piece of screendoor mesh than their logic ( the philosophy has lots of holes in it) or am I the only one seeing this. If as they profess when negoiating on prices for a job... you will make it up on the next job... why dont they live their business model.:laughing:

they are trying to standardize an industry that is not very standard.:blink: 

they want to know every detail on a repair down to the number of nails you are going to use to put up drywall it seems , not quite though it seems so. I had a drywall repair and the rep calls up and tells me that their pricing was X per sq ft. The total repair was under 4 sq ft with a drive time of 75 min ea way The diatance and time at the job combined with materials would have been a HUGE loss . I said this is my bid and I am NOT changing it . I got it but it is not right that you have to beg and pleade to make a decent wage. 

They get people off of craigs list and I bet there is a direct coorelation between that and their insurance rates rising. IF you don't know what you are doing it can jack a house up really fast. Don't get me wrong not all people on CL are bad. In this industry you get what you payfor and even more when you are bottom surfing.

AS for theitr vendor conference these are the biggest JOKE. In the past it was A total waste of my time and $2000 it cost to go to it for me and my employees. I know the attendance for the 11 conference is poor and they are on the line for the rooms they guarenteed. We receive weekly calls and emails pleading us to go. NO not going to happen is what I keep telling them. Tell us what is going to be offered to enhance our relations with your staff tellus how this is going to generate more revenue. They don't. It is a pleading from them because it is a requirement to have ongoing training by their insurance. They are NOT being very head smart. They have the big fish in a small pond mind frame. 

REaltors hate their web site and I could go on and on about them but time will tell. The soap box I am on is starting to weaken . Anyone know a good carpenter for cheap ??


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## GTX63

That is before their discount.


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## BPWY

72opp said:


> I have contacted FAS to inquire about contracting with them. They were concerned I did not offer to do Janitorial work. I asked them for their pricing.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> FAS standard pricing is as follows:
> 
> Janitorial: $75 under 2000 sq ft
> 
> $150 over 2000 sq ft
> 
> $125 Janitorial Premiere
> 
> Maid: $40 Recurring Service
> 
> 
> 
> This just seems too low. Your opinions?
Click to expand...










Its way too low.
There is no way their prices pay for taking the time to do it right.
Even if you pay your help min wage the business owner has nothing left for the business.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Its way too low.


I thought so as well and when I gave them my pricing they told me it was too high.

I also ran into a situation where I did an initial secure 110 miles out. I normally pass on these things. However, I did a google earth search that showed the property to be a good sized property so I took it. I got to the property and preformed the winterization, rekey-ed six locks, and used three padlocks/hasps on garage door/outbuildings. This was all in the good.

I measured the mow-able area (grass is, last I was there about 7 in in height) is a tad over 62,000. I place a call with the company as this is over-allowable. They tell me to cut it and will play $140 for the initial and $110 for recut. I politely refused and countered with $375 for the initial and $300 for recut. They refused and said they would assign grass cut to another company.

Fast forward one week and I receive a call for this property asking if I can do the initial cut for $160 and recut for $120. I counter with $290 for the initial and $250 for recuts. They refused and stated they would have another company cut this property.

I believe I will receive another call in a few days to go out and cut this property for a slightly higher price. I do not believe my prices to be completely wanton but I wonder what you intrepid folks think.

Thanks,


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## GTX63

So you came down $85 on your intial and they came up $10 (before discount). You realize after your fuel, wear and tear on your vehicle and equipment, lunch and drive time you could have made about as much cutting grannie's yard next door for $25?


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## Guest

We were getting 45 for the maids and recuts...
The workload vs the fee....WAAAAAY too low...We no longer perform any type of recurring service for anyone whom is not willing to pay the fee we need, allow us to manage them. If we can not complete them all on one day then we do not do them. Our contracts now have this stipulated in them. 
WE ARE IN CONTROL OF THE RE-OCCURING SERVICES, INSPECTIONS, ETC.
If we can not manage them we will not do them.
All these companies do not lose money and could care less how much we lose...
It is like right now Cyprexx called us and then insulted our intelligence by expecting us to perform the following
Remove 20 CYDS debris
Sales Clean
Initial lawn (1 acre).................$365
$5 for tires and hazards....oh and laytex paint with all the chemicles and oils is not a hazard.
For this our insurance premiums would increase 77% to ad them...
Just can't do it our dump fees are more than that...
Perhaps we should give the president Obama our version of job creation....
Hire the locals and get rid of the banks extensions....just a thought.
As I've previously stated, Companies like Regis Development, Pacific Preservation, Sigma construction, First Preston, Homeland Field Services, BLM/Innotion, Hec-lo, Quest, Qualified West...I have forgotten more than I can remember...
All of these companies THINK they have coverage areas. IF WE do not do the work they have NO COVERAGE areas....
The above mentioned companies all offered $20-$40 for wints, $25 recuts, demanded FREE inspections, $12 debris removal with paints included in the debris removal....
If the money is not right say no...
As for the 62,000 yard...DO NOT BUDGE!!!! If it was me I would go back to my first quoat of $375, That is EXTREMELY reasonable...especially since they have wasted your time...
Juast saying....


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## Guest

Morning,
Yes, I realized that my profit would be smaller but these are not just idle numbers I spouted forth. I know what my cost per hour would be on this cut and; in the spirit of "work for some profit" is better than "no work, no profit", I quoted them a lower price. It is also good to note that the last offer I made is my lowest offer. I will no go lower. I forget where I read it on these boards and to paraphrase "My bid is my bid. Feel free to inquire into other places for a more competitive bids."


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## BPWY

72 I'd have held firm on the first price or maybe came down $1.

Another one of our esteemed members told me hes done that.
After 2 or 3 $1 bid reductions they usually caved and gave him what he asked.


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## GTX63

If you watch Pawn Stars, the customer brings in his whatever to sell, and says they will sell it for $150. The owner, "Rick", looks it over and gives him a price of say $100. Then the customers says, I'll take $140. Then Rick says "$75". I don't know how FAS keeps track of all the crap they have sitting around that doesn't get done because they won't pay a fair wage. Wait, they don't keep track of it.


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## BPWY

GTX63 said:


> If you watch Pawn Stars, the customer brings in his whatever to sell, and says they will sell it for $150. The owner, "Rick", looks it over and gives him a price of say $100. Then the customers says, I'll take $140. Then Rick says "$75". I don't know how FAS keeps track of all the crap they have sitting around that doesn't get done because they won't pay a fair wage. Wait, they don't keep track of it.






In 09 when I worked for them briefly I was mostly their clean up guy.
Stuff that had been sitting for months and months not being done.
You'd have thought that when they finally found a guy that would get the work done they'd take care of that business....... NOPE!!!!
They couldn't even figure out how to cut paychecks.
"Its in the mail" doesn't work for me. Kinda like "no pictures" no pay.
I sent the dang pics in. YOU lost them, now pay me for the work I did.


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## thanohano44

72opp said:


> I thought so as well and when I gave them my pricing they told me it was too high.
> 
> I also ran into a situation where I did an initial secure 110 miles out. I normally pass on these things. However, I did a google earth search that showed the property to be a good sized property so I took it. I got to the property and preformed the winterization, rekey-ed six locks, and used three padlocks/hasps on garage door/outbuildings. This was all in the good.
> 
> I measured the mow-able area (grass is, last I was there about 7 in in height) is a tad over 62,000. I place a call with the company as this is over-allowable. They tell me to cut it and will play $140 for the initial and $110 for recut. I politely refused and countered with $375 for the initial and $300 for recut. They refused and said they would assign grass cut to another company.
> 
> Fast forward one week and I receive a call for this property asking if I can do the initial cut for $160 and recut for $120. I counter with $290 for the initial and $250 for recuts. They refused and stated they would have another company cut this property.
> 
> I believe I will receive another call in a few days to go out and cut this property for a slightly higher price. I do not believe my prices to be completely wanton but I wonder what you intrepid folks think.
> 
> Thanks,


Youre doing the right thing!!


----------



## GTX63

Several years ago they contacted us for an out of area trashout. Seems the previous contractor assigned to it had quit. They promised out of area fee, gas fee, whatever. I said "Sure, why not." They didn't say on the phone but put the order in as a 24 RUSH. I sent the guys up there; 75 cyds later, plus an overgrown yard, busted windows and doors to be secured they are done. But they don't get back in until late that evening. We tried to submit photos and results the next day at 9 a.m. cst and guess what? No work order. They said since we couldn't complete it in the scheduled time they reassigned it again. Really? I called them and told them we had everything they needed to bill the client. Sorry, we'll look into that and get back with you. So, long story short, two months later, the same address is listed in a mass mailing to contractors as needing initial services. We politely respond and state that we can have the job done immediately. Their first reposnse was, "Great! We'll send the order right over!" Twenty minutes later, I got an email thanking me for the interest but they had to decline. Really, again? Sounded like wire fraud and theft to me, but good business for them. See your dealer for details.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> 72 I'd have held firm on the first price or maybe came down $1.
> 
> Another one of our esteemed members told me hes done that.
> After 2 or 3 $1 bid reductions they usually caved and gave him what he asked.


How about going up since time has transpired since the first visit? These companies need you to paint them a picture. Sometimes with crayons and sometimes with feces. When justifying my bids to remove carpet or a bad janitorial, I describe smells. Like the carpet has a strong stench of fermented shrimp, cuban cigars, spoiled cabbage soup, warm vegetable farts and 12 wet dogs. Works most of the time.


----------



## BPWY

GTX63 said:


> Several years ago they contacted us for an out of area trashout. Seems the previous contractor assigned to it had quit. They promised out of area fee, gas fee, whatever. I said "Sure, why not." They didn't say on the phone but put the order in as a 24 RUSH. I sent the guys up there; 75 cyds later, plus an overgrown yard, busted windows and doors to be secured they are done. But they don't get back in until late that evening. We tried to submit photos and results the next day at 9 a.m. cst and guess what? No work order. They said since we couldn't complete it in the scheduled time they reassigned it again. Really? I called them and told them we had everything they needed to bill the client. Sorry, we'll look into that and get back with you. So, long story short, two months later, the same address is listed in a mass mailing to contractors as needing initial services. We politely respond and state that we can have the job done immediately. Their first reposnse was, "Great! We'll send the order right over!" Twenty minutes later, I got an email thanking me for the interest but they had to decline. Really, again? Sounded like wire fraud and theft to me, but good business for them. See your dealer for details.






I hope your state has stronger and better lien laws than mine.

I can't lien for trash outs and lawn mowing.

Landscaping, carpenter work...... yes.


----------



## thanohano44

GTX63 said:


> If you watch Pawn Stars, the customer brings in his whatever to sell, and says they will sell it for $150. The owner, "Rick", looks it over and gives him a price of say $100. Then the customers says, I'll take $140. Then Rick says "$75". I don't know how FAS keeps track of all the crap they have sitting around that doesn't get done because they won't pay a fair wage. Wait, they don't keep track of it.


We have several properties that FAS had "lost" during one of their many system migrations. These properties sat for over a year. Then they received the violations and wanted to back charge us. And get this, here was their reason...

This a property that you have been maintaining for 6 months and you didn't notice that it re occurred in your work list? "I FEEL that you should have recognized this and alerted us immediately". 

My response "James, regardless of how you feel, FAS is the one who assigns US the work. Many other times we don't receive the work order cancelations and it cancels. Other times it does. The next recut didn't generate. These properties sell daily. I'm not in charge of this. I'm sure your client updates you when a new work order is due. Why can't you update us the same? I realize you have upgraded your system and things can get lost in the mix. But don't ever tell me how YOU feel about how this issue should be handled. 

Ps-real men don't FEEL, we think.


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> We have several properties that FAS had "lost" during one of their many system migrations. These properties sat for over a year. Then they received the violations and wanted to back charge us. And get this, here was their reason...
> 
> This a property that you have been maintaining for 6 months and you didn't notice that it re occurred in your work list? "I FEEL that you should have recognized this and alerted us immediately".
> 
> My response "James, regardless of how you feel, FAS is the one who assigns US the work. Many other times we don't receive the work order cancelations and it cancels. Other times it does. The next recut didn't generate. These properties sell daily. I'm not in charge of this. I'm sure your client updates you when a new work order is due. Why can't you update us the same? I realize you have upgraded your system and things can get lost in the mix. But don't ever tell me how YOU feel about how this issue should be handled.
> 
> Ps-real men don't FEEL, we think.


.





Last fall Ocwen had me wint a property.
A month later they sent another wint w/o.


They tried to not pay the 2nd one because I should have declined the w/o because it was already wint a month previous.
I told them that I have no way of knowing if they allowed a buyer's inspection etc that de-winted the property and that it was their job to assign the work and my job to complete it.

They paid the 2nd wint without further ado.


Like I've said over and over and over...... the nationals are allowed to get away with a level of insanity that would get any of the rest of us committed to a padded room if we were that inept and useless at our jobs.


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> How about going up since time has transpired since the first visit? These companies need you to paint them a picture. Sometimes with crayons and sometimes with feces. When justifying my bids to remove carpet or a bad janitorial, I describe smells. Like the carpet has a strong stench of fermented shrimp, cuban cigars, spoiled cabbage soup, warm vegetable farts and 12 wet dogs. Works most of the time.


lMAO. I think me pi$$ed myself a little.


----------



## Guest

Been working with FAS almost 2 years and have 'preferred' status coverage inour area. By preferred status what I mean is they prefer to stick it to uswhenever they see it may be a good time. That being said they can usually keepus pretty busy and I'm pretty curious to see what the Fannie Mae wint seasonhas in store for us next week. I have noticed some odd patterns lately as itseems we might get some good volume then almost nothing the next week and thenback up again and this has gone on about 2 months now.

I ran into someone about six months ago while we were finishing up aninitial lawn service and he told me he was inspecting for Fannie Mae and thathe also did direct work for Fannie Mae and that I needed to find other workbecause FAS was losing everything in my area. Well I found out what company heworks for and they do inspections for Fannie Mae as well as preservation workfor FAS which is about 75% Fannie Mae here. Love that conflict of interest. Iwalked through the house with him for a few minutes as he was telling meeverything that we did wrong that he was writing us up for:

Debris in the drawers- locks and warranty information for new HVAC unit

Dehumidifier not functional- we did not install it, had bid to install newone but he stated we should have removed it although we were advised not to bythe agent...

I left biting my tongue knowing there is a bumpy road ahead.

2 weeks later I got called back for a faulty wint and debris left at aproperty:

no water in lines but rewinterized at my cost just to avoid the hassle

removed a porch swing in perfect condition that was bolted to the ceiling.

Take a wild guess who the agent told me inspected the property....LOVE IT!!!


----------



## mtmtnman

tenec said:


> Been working with FAS almost 2 years and have 'preferred' status coverage inour area. By preferred status what I mean is they prefer to stick it to uswhenever they see it may be a good time. That being said they can usually keepus pretty busy and I'm pretty curious to see what the Fannie Mae wint seasonhas in store for us next week. I have noticed some odd patterns lately as itseems we might get some good volume then almost nothing the next week and thenback up again and this has gone on about 2 months now.
> 
> I ran into someone about six months ago while we were finishing up aninitial lawn service and he told me he was inspecting for Fannie Mae and thathe also did direct work for Fannie Mae and that I needed to find other workbecause FAS was losing everything in my area. Well I found out what company heworks for and they do inspections for Fannie Mae as well as preservation workfor FAS which is about 75% Fannie Mae here. Love that conflict of interest. Iwalked through the house with him for a few minutes as he was telling meeverything that we did wrong that he was writing us up for:
> 
> Debris in the drawers- locks and warranty information for new HVAC unit
> 
> Dehumidifier not functional- we did not install it, had bid to install newone but he stated we should have removed it although we were advised not to bythe agent...
> 
> I left biting my tongue knowing there is a bumpy road ahead.
> 
> 2 weeks later I got called back for a faulty wint and debris left at aproperty:
> 
> no water in lines but rewinterized at my cost just to avoid the hassle
> 
> removed a porch swing in perfect condition that was bolted to the ceiling.
> 
> Take a wild guess who the agent told me inspected the property....LOVE IT!!!



Fannie Agents have final call per FNMA. My brokers would have been livid if a nice porch swing was removed. Brokers here have canceled about 1/2 of my wints which is fine with me. Properties are closing shortly and my brokers leave heat on in ALL FNMA's anyways......


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## Guest

72opp said:


> I thought so as well and when I gave them my pricing they told me it was too high.
> 
> I also ran into a situation where I did an initial secure 110 miles out. I normally pass on these things. However, I did a google earth search that showed the property to be a good sized property so I took it. I got to the property and preformed the winterization, rekey-ed six locks, and used three padlocks/hasps on garage door/outbuildings. This was all in the good.
> 
> I measured the mow-able area (grass is, last I was there about 7 in in height) is a tad over 62,000. I place a call with the company as this is over-allowable. They tell me to cut it and will play $140 for the initial and $110 for recut. I politely refused and countered with $375 for the initial and $300 for recut. They refused and said they would assign grass cut to another company.
> 
> Fast forward one week and I receive a call for this property asking if I can do the initial cut for $160 and recut for $120. I counter with $290 for the initial and $250 for recuts. They refused and stated they would have another company cut this property.
> 
> I believe I will receive another call in a few days to go out and cut this property for a slightly higher price. I do not believe my prices to be completely wanton but I wonder what you intrepid folks think.
> 
> Thanks,


I honestly in a situation such as you described I would have gone the other way. The $375 offer would have went away when I left the property that day. After that, it would have went up. SUBSTANTIALLY... 

And every week it grows, so does the cost for me to do the job.....


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## thanohano44

tenec said:


> Been working with FAS almost 2 years and have 'preferred' status coverage inour area. By preferred status what I mean is they prefer to stick it to uswhenever they see it may be a good time. That being said they can usually keepus pretty busy and I'm pretty curious to see what the Fannie Mae wint seasonhas in store for us next week. I have noticed some odd patterns lately as itseems we might get some good volume then almost nothing the next week and thenback up again and this has gone on about 2 months now.
> 
> I ran into someone about six months ago while we were finishing up aninitial lawn service and he told me he was inspecting for Fannie Mae and thathe also did direct work for Fannie Mae and that I needed to find other workbecause FAS was losing everything in my area. Well I found out what company heworks for and they do inspections for Fannie Mae as well as preservation workfor FAS which is about 75% Fannie Mae here. Love that conflict of interest. Iwalked through the house with him for a few minutes as he was telling meeverything that we did wrong that he was writing us up for:
> 
> Debris in the drawers- locks and warranty information for new HVAC unit
> 
> Dehumidifier not functional- we did not install it, had bid to install newone but he stated we should have removed it although we were advised not to bythe agent...
> 
> I left biting my tongue knowing there is a bumpy road ahead.
> 
> 2 weeks later I got called back for a faulty wint and debris left at aproperty:
> 
> no water in lines but rewinterized at my cost just to avoid the hassle
> 
> removed a porch swing in perfect condition that was bolted to the ceiling.
> 
> Take a wild guess who the agent told me inspected the property....LOVE IT!!!


What you do is find that fool and nail him to the cross. Record his BS yapping. Then you tell him or her if you do any BS like that on your properties again, he won't be able to walk or use his hands to steal money out of anyone's children's mouth again. 

They have no reason to do what they did. Fannie Mae wants us to leave the warranty info. That porch swing can go either way. You need to document that when submitting your work and provide the agents info in the notes. I know I know, it's already there on FAStrack, no matter. M


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## Guest

My company is following what seems to be the trend: not doing work with FAS or Cyprexx. Been with both for almost 3 years and have outstanding ratings, but...I also got my asking price on all bid work (and negotiated flat rates to my what is considered fair industry standards) and as a result, cut into their profit margin. There's a new vendor (sucker) born every minute!


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## Guest

GTX63 said:


> Several years ago they contacted us for an out of area trashout. Seems the previous contractor assigned to it had quit. They promised out of area fee, gas fee, whatever. I said "Sure, why not." They didn't say on the phone but put the order in as a 24 RUSH. I sent the guys up there; 75 cyds later, plus an overgrown yard, busted windows and doors to be secured they are done. But they don't get back in until late that evening. We tried to submit photos and results the next day at 9 a.m. cst and guess what? No work order. They said since we couldn't complete it in the scheduled time they reassigned it again. Really? I called them and told them we had everything they needed to bill the client. Sorry, we'll look into that and get back with you. So, long story short, two months later, the same address is listed in a mass mailing to contractors as needing initial services. We politely respond and state that we can have the job done immediately. Their first reposnse was, "Great! We'll send the order right over!" Twenty minutes later, I got an email thanking me for the interest but they had to decline. Really, again? Sounded like wire fraud and theft to me, but good business for them. See your dealer for details.


If you had documentation of their work order, depending on your state's laws, you could have put a lien on the property. you'd be surprised how much their tone changes when a vendor is aware they posess a silver bullet.


----------



## Guest

Got a few initial services in from FAS yesterday, Fannie Mae. First one was no biggie got it knocked out first thing in the morning, next one had about 30 cyds house was a mess, 2500 sqft, overgrown shrubs and bushes. The idiots, wait maybe not, that have been 'maintaining' it for the last 2 years removed the pool last year... let me rephrase that, according to the neighbor removed all the metal from the pool and stuffed all the platic and the liner into the shed out back, thanks. Talked to the agent and agreed that I would bid on removing the remnants of deck where the pool was, install a handrail where i cut the deck off and padlock deck entrances and run some caution tape around the edges. There is a drained hot tub in its own screened in deck on the ground level next to the main deck. This wasnt talked about so I planned to bid removal of it. Email apparently decided to stop coming to my phone today so when I finally get back to the office to close out the order at 9pm I notice an email from 4:30 from FAS saying the agent requested a bid to remove the hot tub....BUT.... this should be taken care of during initial services and removed as debris.... The first main few issues that come to mind is debris pricing??? debris pricing????? Remove a section of the 10' tall wooden privacy fence to attempt to get the trailer in the back yard after dismantling the screened in porch to pull the 800lb hot tub and motor out....for 5 or 6 cubic yards????? hmmmm I think maybe not.. Maybe I should be like them and post an ad on craigslist and let someone come pay me $300 to come hack apart the deck and fence and take this thing off!!!


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## GTX63

MHR said:


> If you had documentation of their work order, depending on your state's laws, you could have put a lien on the property. you'd be surprised how much their tone changes when a vendor is aware they posess a silver bullet.


At that time we printed our own work orders to simplify the language and remove pricing for our subs. Lesson learned, always have a hard copy.
It's a common practice among some reps to do approvals and negotiations over the phone with the promise of a POC (Per Our Conversation) email to follow. If you proceed and the email never appears, it is driving without a license or insurance. That work order can disappear at anytime before you complete it. We were with them for two different periods totaling about 4 years. Their search engine may or may not work depending on what "Master" says. We have full knowledge that this specific practice happened numerous times to other contractors.


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## thanohano44

tenec said:


> Got a few initial services in from FAS yesterday, Fannie Mae. First one was no biggie got it knocked out first thing in the morning, next one had about 30 cyds house was a mess, 2500 sqft, overgrown shrubs and bushes. The idiots, wait maybe not, that have been 'maintaining' it for the last 2 years removed the pool last year... let me rephrase that, according to the neighbor removed all the metal from the pool and stuffed all the platic and the liner into the shed out back, thanks. Talked to the agent and agreed that I would bid on removing the remnants of deck where the pool was, install a handrail where i cut the deck off and padlock deck entrances and run some caution tape around the edges. There is a drained hot tub in its own screened in deck on the ground level next to the main deck. This wasnt talked about so I planned to bid removal of it. Email apparently decided to stop coming to my phone today so when I finally get back to the office to close out the order at 9pm I notice an email from 4:30 from FAS saying the agent requested a bid to remove the hot tub....BUT.... this should be taken care of during initial services and removed as debris.... The first main few issues that come to mind is debris pricing??? debris pricing????? Remove a section of the 10' tall wooden privacy fence to attempt to get the trailer in the back yard after dismantling the screened in porch to pull the 800lb hot tub and motor out....for 5 or 6 cubic yards????? hmmmm I think maybe not.. Maybe I should be like them and post an ad on craigslist and let someone come pay me $300 to come hack apart the deck and fence and take this thing off!!!


Put it up on craigslist and have someone come get it for free. Or so James Rodriguez at FAS once told me. So if they get hurt on the property and you're not paying them or have them on your insurance. You get sued. I told James to email me those instructions from his FAS email and then send it on a work order. he refused. 

That's what idiots do.


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## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> everyone just needs to understand your independent contractor. You have your set prices and they have to abide by your bid. If the service company hires a professional contractor to do electrical, plumbing, hvac then technically they are the general contractor. call your local building code officer and see if any permits were pulled. if not, turn them in for unlicensed work. done it many times and you will get a phone call to see if you'll go pull permits for them, then you name your price!


guess what I am doing today?


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## Guest

Care to share details? Perhaps in a PM?


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## Guest

I did two jobs for cyprexx a few years back. Itst was a winterizing and controlled thaw/pressure test. I charged them $410 since it was about an hour each way. Second job I did another winterized/pressure test closer to home and much smaller for $180. Then I was doing "free" inspections aka bids 2-3 times a week and getting none of the work, and they got all their inspection pictures free. That's when I told them I'm done


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## david

*hi*

you gotta love how they wanted you to get phones to do pics then lose ams which was biggest part of their work,now stuck in a 2 year contract with phone and no work,but you think fas cares hell no,told me everyone was going to it,funny fas is only 1 i know who uses it...lies,lies,lies,lies keep coming


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## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> guess what I am doing today?


Curious to hear what your doing and if its for F A S ? I havent had a new property with them in 3+ months. Absolutely dead after they lost A M E R!


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## david

*hi*

Ar that was my point its been dead,they did offer a few lil jobs i said no because im not spending more in gas then u make and wait 30 days,i been finding what work i can on the side but its been rough,bank account is going faster then its coming in.


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## Guest

All i get from FAS is maids and snow but of course in NH we have a total of like 10 inches this year a far cry from 70 inhces last year


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## JFMURFY

Haven't had a call for TA at FAS in 6 weeks, was doing roughy $3/k a week... they lose AMER and now its nil. Time to scramble.


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## mtmtnman

FAS has a ton of work here. Nobody will work for their cheap axx rates!!!! It's taking the local agents 3-4 weeks just to get them to rekey a property. By then the pipes are froze and broken...............


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## Guest

They got greedy...cyprexx will be next....
The only conpany's that will hang on are yhe ones that do not have a QC department....


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## Guest

ARpreservation said:


> Curious to hear what your doing and if its for F A S ? I havent had a new property with them in 3+ months. Absolutely dead after they lost A M E R!


still getting fannie mae jobs from them,but I check on property before accepting it(cost plus)


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## Guest

Starbaby....
Are they sending you work on the flat fee rate or are you able to perform services and have line item invoices???


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## Guest

We have still been very busy with FAS, actually even more so since they lost AHMSI but we barely got any of that here in TN although it was nice when we did because we would always get our bids approved.
I'm in the middle of teaming up with a few other crews right now so we can try to keep our own local coverage and the far areas but be able to spread the work out amongst ourselves in order to fight the $4 gal at the pump. The 2 other companies I'm talking to and working with right now have both been in biz about 10 yrs each and neither work with FAS just MCS, The bros, agents and a few others.
There has been alot of people to quit working with FAS lately due to the flat fee, BUT i have somewhat of a different outlook on it here lately as I have explained to my new 'friends.' I have worked with Altisource, AMS, done all kinds of inspections, signage blah blah blah but FAS has IMO simplified the processing of work orders and photos so much that the flat fee is not terrible ( I didn't say great but I turn down alot worse everyday) We still get paid decent for hazards (paint, appliances, tires) that are at almost every job that we never get just a flat fee. Ive had more Fannie plumbing bid approvals in the last 3 months than I have had in the last 2 years together.
Don't get me wrong I would much rather just work for my agents with no pictures but around here I couldn't keep any employees that way as its just not enough work that way and we have been slammed with FAS so at the moment were ok with them, but hell who knows that could change by the time I'm done typing.


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## Guest

Tenec, 
Are you a licensed plumber? Here Fannie is now sending out "affidavits of plumbers" that any plumbing work that was completed by a "non-plumber" is being fined and chargedback. Realtors and Service Companies are running scared. I've been asked to sign a couple of the forms and NO WAY. Thats what a plumber is for!


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## JFMURFY

FremontREO said:


> Tenec,
> Are you a licensed plumber? Here Fannie is now sending out "affidavits of plumbers" that any plumbing work that was completed by a "non-plumber" is being fined and chargedback. Realtors and Service Companies are running scared. I've been asked to sign a couple of the forms and NO WAY. Thats what a plumber is for!


This is idiotic... they don't want licensed plumber prices, but they want plumber certs... Like I always say... if you want Chinese prices...go to China...


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Tenec,
> Are you a licensed plumber? Here Fannie is now sending out "affidavits of plumbers" that any plumbing work that was completed by a "non-plumber" is being fined and chargedback. Realtors and Service Companies are running scared. I've been asked to sign a couple of the forms and NO WAY. Thats what a plumber is for!


But yet they demand that you perform $300 worth of repairs on the spot....
We always sub plumbing ro a plumber...even inspections.
We try to never cross trade lines. We have working relationships with contractors from every trade...
Works well for us and the contractors...they are all willing to wait till we get paid so it's a win-win for everyone...:clap:


----------



## Guest

tenec said:


> We have still been very busy with FAS, actually even more so since they lost AHMSI but we barely got any of that here in TN although it was nice when we did because we would always get our bids approved.
> I'm in the middle of teaming up with a few other crews right now so we can try to keep our own local coverage and the far areas but be able to spread the work out amongst ourselves in order to fight the $4 gal at the pump. The 2 other companies I'm talking to and working with right now have both been in biz about 10 yrs each and neither work with FAS just MCS, The bros, agents and a few others.
> There has been alot of people to quit working with FAS lately due to the flat fee, BUT i have somewhat of a different outlook on it here lately as I have explained to my new 'friends.' I have worked with Altisource, AMS, done all kinds of inspections, signage blah blah blah but FAS has IMO simplified the processing of work orders and photos so much that the flat fee is not terrible ( I didn't say great but I turn down alot worse everyday) We still get paid decent for hazards (paint, appliances, tires) that are at almost every job that we never get just a flat fee. Ive had more Fannie plumbing bid approvals in the last 3 months than I have had in the last 2 years together.
> Don't get me wrong I would much rather just work for my agents with no pictures but around here I couldn't keep any employees that way as its just not enough work that way and we have been slammed with FAS so at the moment were ok with them, but hell who knows that could change by the time I'm done typing.


They dont have Fannie in MI so its completely dead :/


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## reoguys

Ditto


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## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> Starbaby....
> Are they sending you work on the flat fee rate or are you able to perform services and have line item invoices???


flat rate ,I check my e-mail on my phone and swing by property. If there is 30 to 40 cubs I`ll decline. 40 cubs QC will try to move down to 30.if less I accept! may think I`m being AA A** hole but Im working around there BS


----------



## Guest

JFMURFY said:


> This is idiotic... they don't want licensed plumber prices, but they want plumber certs... Like I always say... if you want Chinese prices...go to China...


You can say that again. I had FAS bid dept. contact me about a plumming bid I turned in. It was a property were all the copper supply lines had been removed. I had bid $1400 to replace with cpvc all supply lines and pressure check. The guy said my bid was pretty high! He wanting me to do it for $700.I told him sorry I can set a t home and not( or loss)money. I said if you think I`m high getting bid from a lic. plumber.


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## mtmtnman

STARBABY said:


> You can say that again. I had FAS bid dept. contact me about a plumming bid I turned in. It was a property were all the copper supply lines had been removed. I had bid $1400 to replace with cpvc all supply lines and pressure check. The guy said my bid was pretty high! He wanting me to do it for $700.I told him sorry I can set a t home and not( or loss)money. I said if you think I`m high getting bid from a lic. plumber.


Your asking for trouble with CPVC. It's trash. I wouldn't put my name on it and don't know of ANY professional plumber that would use it. I get approvals *every week* to have my plumber replumb a whole house with PEX (3 bed 2 bath) full of freeze breaks for $2500-$3500 I'll tell you with the utmost certainty that they are turning in bids for AT LEAST $3500 to the client and pocketing the rest. Things like this is why FAS cannot get contractors here. We figured out their game in short order........


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## Guest

STARBABY said:


> flat rate ,I check my e-mail on my phone and swing by property. If there is 30 to 40 cubs I`ll decline. 40 cubs QC will try to move down to 30.if less I accept! may think I`m being AA A** hole but Im working around there BS


That is how you have to run your business.
When we started turning jobs down because we could show a profit we were labeled..."cherry-picker"
Then they attempted to force jobs on us...big headache.


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## Guest

oooooppppppssssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss

could NOT show a profit....:blink::blink::blink:
:thumbup:


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> That is how you have to run your business.
> When we started turning jobs down because we could show a profit we were labeled..."cherry-picker"
> Then they attempted to force jobs on us...big headache.


They said the same thing to us. I asked them to check how many jobs we turned down. They looked it up. 8. 8 jobs that were 6 hours out of my coverage area!! I asked how are we cherry pickers? The only time I turn down work is of we can't get to it, it's not profitable or we cannot complete it within state guidelines. (moving personal property to an off site storage location). 

We also complete everything per their guidelines. And they were telling me some lawns weren't over the allowable. LOL. We would usually fwd them their "memos" to prove our point. They hate when you do that.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Tenec,
> Are you a licensed plumber? Here Fannie is now sending out "affidavits of plumbers" that any plumbing work that was completed by a "non-plumber" is being fined and chargedback. Realtors and Service Companies are running scared. I've been asked to sign a couple of the forms and NO WAY. Thats what a plumber is for!


Fremont --
Haven't heard this before. Do you have/know of link with this? Does this include winterizations? Technically a wint, in my opinion, is plumbing. I couldn't get my plumber to do wints for the allowable! And I'm not allowed to bid them -- have to do them for HUD allowable. Now there's a catch-22.

You always seem to have such good info!


----------



## Guest

MidwestP&P said:


> Fremont --
> Haven't heard this before. Do you have/know of link with this? Does this include winterizations? Technically a wint, in my opinion, is plumbing. I couldn't get my plumber to do wints for the allowable! And I'm not allowed to bid them -- have to do them for HUD allowable. Now there's a catch-22.
> 
> You always seem to have such good info!


Hey we are Certified HUD contractors...we get $125.00 per wint. I know the number is $75 but we have to travel at least 25 miles to every property in the area we cover so they have given us a bump...We do all their wints in this area...
And yes you are correct...a wint is plumbing....
I have said this begore and I will say it again....
Until everyone(vendors) start telling these nationals NO I CAN NOT MAKE THAT FEE WORK... Then they will continue to press you into doing services that you may not be qualified to do or you lose $$$ doing them.
Our fixed costs on a wint for a standard 2 bath home is $57 I will not do them for anything less than $125...PERIOD!!!!! I haven't even got to the variable costs of the wint...which are going up every day as the fuel costs go up....


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## Guest

A side note on the wint fee....
If the client can not gaurantee us 200 wints per season...
$150.00 per wint....
This is a $300.00 service, the banks allow for $350.00, this direct from several realtors that we work with....


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## GTX63

FAS and Safeguard work this angle with a wink and a nod. I know from direct in person experience. Safeguard brought in local Chicago area plumbers once for a winterization training session. First question from a contractor to them, was "Doesn't Illinois require a licensed plumber anytime plumbing is disturbed?" That's where the wink and a nod came in. They advised everyone to get a licensed plumbing buddy to oversee the work (for free I suppose).


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## Guest

Technically winterize IS plumbing but according to the States we service you have No problem with the black water/sewage lines/drains but you cannot touch the meter or the drinking water lines. Draw your own conclusions on this... 



MidwestP&P said:


> Fremont --
> Haven't heard this before. Do you have/know of link with this? Does this include winterizations? Technically a wint, in my opinion, is plumbing. I couldn't get my plumber to do wints for the allowable! And I'm not allowed to bid them -- have to do them for HUD allowable. Now there's a catch-22.
> 
> You always seem to have such good info!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Technically winterize IS plumbing but according to the States we service you have No problem with the black water/sewage lines/drains but you cannot touch the meter or the drinking water lines. Draw your own conclusions on this...


And are want us to disconnect the water meters,hasn`t in over ten yrs. always have to put in comment (didn`t disconnect water meter,not allowed by water company)


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## mtmtnman

We'll folks it's no wonder FAS is so hated by realtors here. I bid this place in Oct. last fall at 140 Cu. Yds. It was finally trashed out 2 weeks ago!! Broker is livid that it took so long. We would have been in and out with the property trashed, Weeds at least knocked down and sales cleaned and max 4 days. Broker asked me to stop by today and take a look at some wet carpeting. Turns out when they winterized it (6 weeks ago, 2 1/2 months after property was assigned to the broker) they never told the Realtor the floor was wet. Their was broken plumbing and now BOA is looking at a $4-$5,000 mold/water loss in one room. Here are the pics of the "SUPPOSED" trashout. Yeah, 2 weeks ago SOME items may have been frozen down but nothing the proper equipment wouldn't handle.


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> We'll folks it's no wonder FAS is so hated by realtors here. I bid this place in Oct. last fall at 140 Cu. Yds. It was finally trashed out 2 weeks ago!! Broker is livid that it took so long. We would have been in and out with the property trashed, Weeds at least knocked down and sales cleaned and max 4 days. Broker asked me to stop by today and take a look at some wet carpeting. Turns out when they winterized it (6 weeks ago, 2 1/2 months after property was assigned to the broker) they never told the Realtor the floor was wet. Their was broken plumbing and now BOA is looking at a $4-$5,000 mold/water loss in one room. Here are the pics of the "SUPPOSED" trashout. Yeah, 2 weeks ago SOME items may have been frozen down but nothing the proper equipment wouldn't handle.


Looks like someone bit off more than they could chew.


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## mtmtnman

mbobbish734 said:


> Looks like someone bit off more than they could chew.



This particular contractor has worked for FAS for 5 years. Lost his own house last year. I had it as an REO and there where HUNDREDS of work orders scattered throughout. The pricing i saw was pitiful to say the least.....


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> This particular contractor has worked for FAS for 5 years. Lost his own house last year. I had it as an REO and there where HUNDREDS of work orders scattered throughout. The pricing i saw was pitiful to say the least.....


Well there goes one low baller. 60,000 to go.


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## Guest

mbobbish734 said:


> Well there goes one low baller. 60,000 to go.


Low Baller.....
Ot would they be in the .....You get what you pay for.....catagory???
Properties like this happe here also....
You should see the FAS prop next to one of our clients....
Night and Friggin' day...But then we're compensated for the service we provide...boy does it make a difference!!!!!:clap::clap:


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## mtmtnman

Cleanupman said:


> Low Baller.....
> Ot would they be in the .....You get what you pay for.....catagory???
> Properties like this happe here also....
> You should see the FAS prop next to one of our clients....
> Night and Friggin' day...But then we're compensated for the service we provide...boy does it make a difference!!!!!:clap::clap:


Had to laugh at one a while back. I had a 60,000 bid on mold remediation on a property of one of my brokers. This was when the changeover happened. The FAS crew went in the house and "SALES CLEANED IT!" Mold is still on the walls, ceilings falling down but damn the counters, toilets, tubs and floors are clean!!!!:thumbup:


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## Guest

I see the same with Cyprexx and of course, Safeguard/corelogic...
Wonder what they are going to do with all the technology they've developed so they can make money when they have no grunts left to use the technology.....


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## BPWY

Speaking of shoddy work, this is the specialty of the local SG full time vendor. 
I've mentioned before that I'll go do remote w/os for them with extra trip funds because no one else will. 
Last winter I did a few REOs. NONE of the REOs I did for them were winterized properly by the full time vendor. Lines full of water, water heaters full of water, breaks and freeze damage every where. Another house was missing outlet covers, and still had 30 yrds of debris after they had "completed" initial services. 

Today I find this gem on one of their houses thats been "secured".
NONE of the garage door roller wheels are in the track. This padlock is doing ABSOLUTELY no good.


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## GTX63

I have seen more poorly done trashouts in the last year than in our entire time in this business. Uncompleted, sloppy, debris hidden from the after photos. It isn't just local, it is across the country. AMS, FAS, Safeguard, Five Brothers, etc made their bed.


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## Guest

GTX63 said:


> I have seen more poorly done trashouts in the last year than in our entire time in this business. Uncompleted, sloppy, debris hidden from the after photos. It isn't just local, it is across the country. AMS, FAS, Safeguard, Five Brothers, etc made their bed.


It's the system these yeahoo's created. As long as we get our price and do quality work, we operate out of there system. And I would rather be out than in.


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## Guest

I've been hearing from vendors that no longer work with FAS that,
FAS has been calling them to come back...quality service...is the theme and subject matter of all calls...
So far everyone has said no as they can no longer make the pricing work...
I agree with them...
I don't need to pollute the air and waste my gas to go broke for them, I can do that staying at hme watching the View!!!!!!!


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## Guest

On Friday i go to a 3 unit building for Fas.They say if you can complete each unit for $300.00 which includes knob locks,debris and janitorial.I get to each unit no debris units look great.

I call say can't do the job for $300.00 send them pics and give them a bid for $600.00 per unit.They call say why can't you do it looks easy enough,so make long story short I get the call back hour later and each unit is approved for $600.00.

2 guys 1 hours for $1800.00 I finally feel like I beat them but I am sure they will beat me the next 9 rounds in the fight.


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## JDRM

Won the battle while loosing the war!!!


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## david

*hi*

usually their motto is if you cant do it for a certain price,we have other vendors in area,quality of work dont matter to them its how fat they can keep their pocket.


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## Guest

d+jhomeservices said:


> usually their motto is if you cant do it for a certain price,we have other vendors in area,quality of work dont matter to them its how fat they can keep their pocket.


There's an understatement!!!!!:whistling:whistling:whistling


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## Guest

Hey Cleanupman, My girlfriend and I just started working on Reo Grass Cuts any helpful info would be great regarding companies good/bad and insurance requirement for grass cuts only. I was an Real Estate Appraiser for several years and after the laws changed and the Mangement Companys gained controled of the industry and my wages, I found my self doing Bpos ( poor mans appraisal ) After 3.5 yrs working with First American/ Corelogic there policy changed and could no longer use my Appraisal Lic, I was over qualified to say the least, and they said for me to get my Real Estate Lic ! I see alot of the same issues that I came accross as an Appraiser was getting $350 to $450 per Appraisal to $39 to $50 per Bpo due to Mangement companies taking advantage of people needing to work and pitting competition against each other driving prices of services to bare bottom. I read your blog about insurance issues very interesting and so true, so we are looking into our local SBA/Score, and like I mentioned any helpful ideas and knowledge would be appreciated.


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## thanohano44

Grass Cuts said:


> Hey Cleanupman, My girlfriend and I just started working on Reo Grass Cuts any helpful info would be great regarding companies good/bad and insurance requirement for grass cuts only. I was an Real Estate Appraiser for several years and after the laws changed and the Mangement Companys gained controled of the industry and my wages, I found my self doing Bpos ( poor mans appraisal ) After 3.5 yrs working with First American/ Corelogic there policy changed and could no longer use my Appraisal Lic, I was over qualified to say the least, and they said for me to get my Real Estate Lic ! I see alot of the same issues that I came accross as an Appraiser was getting $350 to $450 per Appraisal to $39 to $50 per Bpo due to Mangement companies taking advantage of people needing to work and pitting competition against each other driving prices of services to bare bottom. I read your blog about insurance issues very interesting and so true, so we are looking into our local SBA/Score, and like I mentioned any helpful ideas and knowledge would be appreciated.


Nationals or direct work from banks will not give you grass cuts anymore. Not enough ways to back charge you.


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## Guest

Grass Cuts said:


> Hey Cleanupman, My girlfriend and I just started working on Reo Grass Cuts any helpful info would be great regarding companies good/bad and insurance requirement for grass cuts only. I was an Real Estate Appraiser for several years and after the laws changed and the Mangement Companys gained controled of the industry and my wages, I found my self doing Bpos ( poor mans appraisal ) After 3.5 yrs working with First American/ Corelogic there policy changed and could no longer use my Appraisal Lic, I was over qualified to say the least, and they said for me to get my Real Estate Lic ! I see alot of the same issues that I came accross as an Appraiser was getting $350 to $450 per Appraisal to $39 to $50 per Bpo due to Mangement companies taking advantage of people needing to work and pitting competition against each other driving prices of services to bare bottom. I read your blog about insurance issues very interesting and so true, so we are looking into our local SBA/Score, and like I mentioned any helpful ideas and knowledge would be appreciated.


My good man lawn cuts and recuts are lower than your BPO's.You still want in


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## david

*hi*

mkm i think safguard will give you just recuts and initial yards,or they did it last year anyway


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## Guest

Introductions are made on the first page..toward the top. It says Introductions. Protocol Mr. Appraiser :thumbsup:




Grass Cuts said:


> Hey Cleanupman, My girlfriend and I just started working on Reo Grass Cuts any helpful info would be great regarding companies good/bad and insurance requirement for grass cuts only. I was an Real Estate Appraiser for several years and after the laws changed and the Mangement Companys gained controled of the industry and my wages, I found my self doing Bpos ( poor mans appraisal ) After 3.5 yrs working with First American/ Corelogic there policy changed and could no longer use my Appraisal Lic, I was over qualified to say the least, and they said for me to get my Real Estate Lic ! I see alot of the same issues that I came accross as an Appraiser was getting $350 to $450 per Appraisal to $39 to $50 per Bpo due to Mangement companies taking advantage of people needing to work and pitting competition against each other driving prices of services to bare bottom. I read your blog about insurance issues very interesting and so true, so we are looking into our local SBA/Score, and like I mentioned any helpful ideas and knowledge would be appreciated.


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## Guest

Unless you have 500 to 1,000 re-occuring services ...well maybe not that many but you need 100's of them to make it wotk.
The fees for recuts and maids are so low that unless you have a large volume you will only break even...
ESPECIALLY with fuel costs going up every day...
Negotiate a good number...


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## Guest

I forgot this guy....:whistling:whistling:whistling:clap::clap:


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## Guest

Got news today that FAS has decided not to renew the contract with Fannie Mae cause Fannie is wanting to lower costs. So FAS doesn't have much left besides boa and nation star and one west.


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## Guest

I'm glad to see a national standing their ground. Hopefully all the others will follow. 
It's sounds like FAS is learning, contractors won't work for peanuts.


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## Guest

SRT-Diesel said:


> Got news today that FAS has decided not to renew the contract with Fannie Mae cause Fannie is wanting to lower costs. So FAS doesn't have much left besides boa and nation star and one west.


Who was doing Fannie Mae before FAS and Cyprexx, anyboby know?I have been doing this a long time and never seen work from Fannie Mae until acouple of years ago.


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## BPWY

SWOH REO said:


> I'm glad to see a national standing their ground. Hopefully all the others will follow.
> It's sounds like FAS is learning, contractors won't work for peanuts.







I highly doubt they are learning any thing of value.


What they are learning is that their cheap rates don't go the distance.
But instead of being less greedy and upping contractor pay they just turn the work down in the first place. 

Thats a hell of a business model.


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## Guest

It's pathetic cause they made us get that fastrack mobile **** and I had to spend money and sign up with a new extra plan cause I use an iPhone, now they pull this and I have to spend $60 a month for 6 more months for nothing...


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## david

*hi*

srt trust me they dont care if you sink or drown,its just fas nowdays


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## Guest

Obviously they are learning somewhat, considering the vendor blast I got stated the prices wouldn't benefit the vendors or them which is why they didn't renew. But FAS was all about American homes and Fannie, now what? They won't be able to afford all 700+ staff, state of the art software like pruvan, and that huge office they accommodate. Something else is going on work wise that I assume no one knows about.


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## Splinterpicker

SRT-Diesel said:


> Obviously they are learning somewhat, considering the vendor blast I got stated the prices wouldn't benefit the vendors or them which is why they didn't renew. But FAS was all about American homes and Fannie, now what? They won't be able to afford all 700+ staff, state of the art software like pruvan, and that huge office they accommodate. Something else is going on work wise that I assume no one knows about.


I have been told that come January things are going to be better. I don't know for whom but this came from a long time friend at FAS. It has been like a ghost town here I have been getting JUST BOA VA properties makes me wonder if FAS has LOST BOA REGULAR loans here. Fannie Mae is on the bubble as far as being fazed out in I believe 5 years. I have learned to be like a squirrel PUT IT AWAY for the BAD times. This year I might show a LOSS on paper.First time in 20 years of being in business. Am I worried NO I pay ahead on my house hold expenses a full year in advance. I can sleep at least for a year. I repeat ELECTION YEAR. FINAL ANSWER

OBAMA HAS TO GO 

ROMNEY may be no better but the definition of insanity " To do the same thing over and over expecting different results IS INSANE " sure summarizes the last 4 years.


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## Guest

All I can say is...
What ges around ...comes around...

Yeah I know a bunch of philosophical crap...
I can't feel bad about FAS they created their own mess.
We bought into the FASmobil crap also...to the tune of 5 systems...
Now I have phones for our field supervisors and not enough work for them to make the phone bill justified...
What gets me is I keep seeing NEW regionals pop up everywhere and try to recruit us and offer below breakeven fees...
We just got an email from A2Z about inspections and we went out to perform them to the specs they detailed in videos and we would lose revemue if we accept them.
$20 for over one hour of time plus fuel costs etc...$15 on another. They also offered us QC inspections for Fannie Mae at $15 per inspections...

I think what agrivates most about all these nationals is the fact that they negotiate a number that benifits them without even consulting ...us...to see if we can make the number work...then the nationals get butt hurt when we tell them we can not perform said service(s) at the number...as if we are obligated to honor THEIR agreement with the client...
'dems da breaks...huh???


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## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> All I can say is...
> What ges around ...comes around...
> 
> Yeah I know a bunch of philosophical crap...
> I can't feel bad about FAS they created their own mess.
> We bought into the FASmobil crap also...to the tune of 5 systems...
> Now I have phones for our field supervisors and not enough work for them to make the phone bill justified...
> What gets me is I keep seeing NEW regionals pop up everywhere and try to recruit us and offer below breakeven fees...
> We just got an email from A2Z about inspections and we went out to perform them to the specs they detailed in videos and we would lose revemue if we accept them.
> $20 for over one hour of time plus fuel costs etc...$15 on another. They also offered us QC inspections for Fannie Mae at $15 per inspections...
> 
> I think what agrivates most about all these nationals is the fact that they negotiate a number that benifits them without even consulting ...us...to see if we can make the number work...then the nationals get butt hurt when we tell them we can not perform said service(s) at the number...as if we are obligated to honor THEIR agreement with the client...
> 'dems da breaks...huh???


I also do inspection for A2Z,but I do not going out of my way to do them If I`m going to already be in the area I will do them, if not I decline. I got an call from one of there cooranators asking why I was declining so may inspection in my area. I told the same, I can`t make $15 even $20 doesn`t work.

I was doing Hud Initial services for them, but stopped. The amount of work they wanted done for the fee was a joke. Was all so doing there bi weekly lawn and maid,but A2Z cut the pay on these as well and already a pain the do.


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## Guest

It still doesn't make sense. FAS needs Fannie Mae to keep operating their 700 employees and huge office. Nation star, one west, and boa don't provide enough unless some other huge client is on board. Boa has contracts with AMS and others also so I doubt they are the main source of income. I think something will change and Fannie will stay with FAS, because AMS can't do the quality needed that FAS can.


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## Guest

SRT-Diesel said:


> It still doesn't make sense. FAS needs Fannie Mae to keep operating their 700 employees and huge office. Nation star, one west, and boa don't provide enough unless some other huge client is on board. Boa has contracts with AMS and others also so I doubt they are the main source of income. I think something will change and Fannie will stay with FAS, because AMS can't do the quality needed that FAS can.


I don't know about that.
AMS has a pretty decent QC department and inspectors all over the place...and they are extremely picky...don't matter if they are there three weeks after initials...they expect the place to be spotless...

We are currently doing BOA, US Bank, FM, and HUD/FHA for AMS.
They also have Freddie Mac, Grn River, so they have made a move in the industry.My understanding, they are revamping their website for inspections and rehab work.
They just made a big push in this area to train vendors for Fannie Mae...


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## Guest

Where at? I'm in Dallas. No one has heard anything yet.


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## Guest

we are in Nevada


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## thanohano44

SRT-Diesel said:


> It still doesn't make sense. FAS needs Fannie Mae to keep operating their 700 employees and huge office. Nation star, one west, and boa don't provide enough unless some other huge client is on board. Boa has contracts with AMS and others also so I doubt they are the main source of income. I think something will change and Fannie will stay with FAS, because AMS can't do the quality needed that FAS can.


Your exp with FAS quality might be due to your area. Back in 08. We were ranked #1 in AZ for quality, completion time and communication. Still losers like Regis, Copperline and All Sure got all the FAS work, they did a great job. They just used illegal immigrants. When we expanded to las Vegas and Utah, ugh...the work was awful. No matter what vendor did the work.


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## Guest

The email everyone got from FAS about dumping Fannie was not completely true, or mostly not true I should say. What is true is that they will no longer have a working contract relationship come August 1st, but Fannie dumped them due to BSO scores and deadlines not vice versa. FAS no longer has 700 employees in the office, that changed when they lost AHMSI and was cut around half, I would probably bet it will be cut in at least half again. 
Safeguard has already picked up the FAS Fannie work in Tennessee and will assume all properties in TN on 8/1. 
Making money through FAS was like being an artist these last 2 yrs, if you could be very creative and still productive all while not letting them run all over you, there was a dollar to be made, but only if you slept with one eye open.
We have a little over 100 properties that we completed initials on and maintain for them and even got a new initial yesterday. I am not certain that I want to jump off one sinking ship and on to another at this point. I have other work to keep me busy but I will have to let go of some good people who did a damn good job all because of some greedy f-in nationals that don't know as well as don't care what it takes to do this work.
I guess the main concern for me at this point is making sure I can keep my mouth shut long enough and keep from blowing up on some idiot at FAS so I can hopefully get at least half of the $25,000 owe me at this point.


----------



## Guest

So will they still be getting Fannie properties? I hear Fannie was going to AMS, if they're going to safeguard, then safeguard will have their hands full since SG doesn't usually do the cleaning part of the work. And I only make 5-6k a month with FAS but still, I won't be able to keep afloat with just AMS making 8-10k a month, unless FAS has other clients to keep me just as busy.


----------



## Guest

And also I thought Fannie cut prices and FAS couldn't operate with the low costs?


----------



## Guest

Just remember contracts are cyclical. The come and they go but the providers remain the same...

Example: Safeguard aquires *** Company, which replaces FAS, BUT Safeguard KNOWS its doesn't have enough contractors to service the additional workload so they sub it right BACK to FAS.

That is the industry model now and in the past. The work orders may have someones letterhead changed but the players are all the same. Sure you might have some new phone numbers and new customer service reps but its all the same Teams. 

What is bad is that the P&P Contractors who depend on the P&P work will have to "hang on" till the changes are enacted. Some won't make it and some will. Those that hang on will come back stronger and bigger due to filling the void of those that failed the wait. We recovered at least 10X over 15 years and each time work increased a minimum of 40-50% of prior workloads. 

Hang on and find something during the void.


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## Guest

I've tried. All I have is FAS and AMS. SG, MCS,5B, are all full up. Hopefully SG will hire more at least with the substantial work load.


----------



## thanohano44

SRT-Diesel said:


> I've tried. All I have is FAS and AMS. SG, MCS,5B, are all full up. Hopefully SG will hire more at least with the substantial work load.


Branch out into other fields. Don't depend solely on the service companies.


----------



## Guest

Please elaborate.


----------



## Guest

We have an Organic Farm specializing in culinary/holistic herbs and chillies...
We also provide maintenance services foe property management realtors here.

You more then likely have equipment that is compatible with another business/industry 

I will say this, while you have a minute reorganize yourself...as someone has stated...if you can find a way to hang on....


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## Gypsos

thanohano44 said:


> Branch out into other fields. Don't depend solely on the service companies.


Specialization is for insects.


----------



## Guest

DONT SAY "INSECT" !!!

Not with an organic farmer on the boards 

Cleanupman I gotta give you koodo's on organic farming. I raise a 1 acre garden and its a full time job weeding. No pesticides. Got a much needed 2" rain yesterday and weeded all afternoon.


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## BPWY

I hate weeding.

I'm lucky that I don't have a lot of weeds, and then by planting the rows far enough apart so 
the tiller will fit between once the weeds are up to 2'' I go thru with the hiller attachment and 
bury them. I have very very few weeds to deal with the rest of the summer this way.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I hate weeding.
> 
> I'm lucky that I don't have a lot of weeds, and then by planting the rows far enough apart so
> the tiller will fit between once the weeds are up to 2'' I go thru with the hiller attachment and
> bury them. I have very very few weeds to deal with the rest of the summer this way.


Yeah but heck all you turn over in WY is rocks...not weeds :laughing:


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## BPWY

Not quite.


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## Guest

OK I know its off subject but here is what we are harvesting right now from garden. Best year ever on Broccoli.


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## Guest

I actually gOT AWAY FROM IT WITH THE PRESERVATION THING GOING ON...NOW THAT IT'S SLOW i HAVE THE TIME TO REORGANIZE IT AND HHAVE BOTH GOING ON YEAR ROUND.
oooppppssss didn't see caps thingy...too late and tired to change....
we have some hoop houses going up this fall so...


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## Guest

Can I ask where your located? 

Bought my first greenhouse this year. Not huge..12x18 with the clear panels. Giving some ideas a shot.

Know a couple organic farmers who make a good living. Dont think I would want to work that hard though


----------



## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> Can I ask where your located?
> 
> Bought my first greenhouse this year. Not huge..12x18 with the clear panels. Giving some ideas a shot.
> 
> Know a couple organic farmers who make a good living. Dont think I would want to work that hard though


Fremont,
Cleanup is located in NV.


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## GTX63

My wife grows a garden from straw bales. No weeds, pesticides, tilling, bent over all day, etc. She also uses tubs. Its a large garden and it is a huge investment unless done over time. She grows enough food to last a winter for the Waltons.


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## Guest

If you get into it for "profit" then it is expensive, a lot of out lay on resources.
We got into everything for about 25k 5 years ago.
Had a bad insurance policy, ( go figure) had a "farm/Ranch policy that did not cover crop l;oss, green houses, out building loss, just a $125 payment a month for zip.
Had a wind storm, (60mph sustained, with 90-110 gusts) rip everything out of the ground...
So it has been slow to get things back on tract.
We are working with a couple of nursery's to be come their supplier of 4" pots so we can go back in for a loan to get restarted.
The straw and raised bed systems are very good eliminates a lot of labor down the road.
We can produce a 4" pot for .$27 and we sell them for .$90-$1.10 depending on volume.
produce about 5,000 right now...
There is some grant money out there for organic farming. If you have the time and someone that knows about grants I can send you the links...
email me at [email protected] put Organic Farming in the subject line...


----------



## SwiftRes

So FAS called to do a flat fee, I've only ever done a minor plumbing repair for them. So they gave me a trip charge as well, and the property is on our route to other properties. Arrived, 40cyd or better. I am refusing to do it for flat fee, and bidding standard cyd pricing. Will see what they say.


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## JDRM

Not that it makes much difference, but im pretty sure their flat fee is based on 30cyds. Although you would still loose money! You are getting what their usual contractors have turned down!


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## SwiftRes

Yeah its based on 30, but as you said, will still be a lose deal. Was hoping for a couple of cyd.


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## JDRM

I feel your pain!


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## Guest

Thge only ones making $$$$$$$$$$$$ on flat fees are the company's paying the flat fees....

For the fees FAS is paying 20 CYDS tops...30 is a losing proposition....


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## SwiftRes

Honestly 20 would even be too high considering they want a grass cut in there too


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## Guest

Even more of a slap in the face is the $12 cyd price they offer if you hit over 75 cyds??? And thats for all debris over 30....they have been testing the waters to see just how low they could go and i think they are realizing or about to that they have finally crossed the line. Fas is not slipping they have fell and i believe its only a matter of time before they hit rock bottom.


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## Guest

$12?????
You can't even break even at that number!!!!
The discount after X-amount is a friggin' joke!!!
It costs more to remove 75 yards than 20...I don't get a discount for dumping. My e,ployees are not going to take less per hur to do the work. Why should anyone be obligated to a discount for volumne????
They are not billing a discounted amount


----------



## Guest

Beyond greed, I'm not really sure how to classify it at $12 without being banned from CT for use of terrible language....


----------



## Guest

tenec said:


> Beyond greed, I'm not really sure how to classify it at $12 without being banned from CT for use of terrible language....


Tenec are you doing trash out for them. I can`t tell you the number I have declined in the last few months. I just dont see any profit in it.

still been doing recuts and maids (for now)!


----------



## Guest

I am too. Got another 3 trash outs today on top of the 6 last week.


----------



## SwiftRes

They want to negotiate above the flat fee tomorrow. I showed them how compared to others I do work for, they are willing to pay around 50-60% of them. Will see what they offer.


----------



## Guest

SwiftRes said:


> They want to negotiate above the flat fee tomorrow. I showed them how compared to others I do work for, they are willing to pay around 50-60% of them. Will see what they offer.


30 CYDS....$750.....and I would not settle for anything less than 600 on a 30 CYD TO.
And that is a good number...
I have been told that FAS is only getting 900 for the TO's now...that is why the numbers have gone down so much in the past couple years...
Source dates a current employees at FAS so info _shouldbe rather reliable...._


----------



## GTX63

There is a point in which it does not matter what your customer is getting paid for the work, if the numbers don't work...then they don't work. Trying to accomodate FAS because they are getting their profit cut is an "FAS" problem not yours.


----------



## SwiftRes

I think $600 is too low for a 30cyd trashout/mow/cleaning. That's 20/cyd and giving them a free cleaning and mow(200 plus value). Can't give free stuff to one of the lowest paying cyds. 

I feel bad for them if they are only getting 900, but they shouldn't have been willing to do it so low. Other nats pay more than fas is getting, that seems odd.


----------



## GTX63

$600 minus your crew's pay, dump fees, materials, hazards if any, insurance, taxes, fuel, bla bla bla, you get the picture. Any profit from that job is a mirage.


----------



## Guest

MY BAD!!!!!

Since we became a HUD contractor we do not get the front end of the work. We come in and clean up the messes left behind on the properties fannie and Freddie have had in inventory for the past 2+ years...
I forgot about the fact that with the front end work EVERY property has a minimum 20+ yards of debris...
So no...600 would not be fair for 30 or even 20 yards.
If you were broom sweeping and not having to spit shine everything then perhaps, in addition they now want one acre, when we got out of the front end it was only 1/4 acre for initials and the rest was negotiated...:sad:


----------



## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> MY BAD!!!!!
> 
> Since we became a HUD contractor we do not get the front end of the work. We come in and clean up the messes left behind on the properties fannie and Freddie have had in inventory for the past 2+ years...
> I forgot about the fact that with the front end work EVERY property has a minimum 20+ yards of debris...
> So no...600 would not be fair for 30 or even 20 yards.
> If you were broom sweeping and not having to spit shine everything then perhaps, in addition they now want one acre, when we got out of the front end it was only 1/4 acre for initials and the rest was negotiated...:sad:


There rulers seem to change day by day. Have gotten to were I do not even read there e-mails with posted changes


----------



## Guest

Hey guys,

Still kind of new here, but wanted to throw in my 2 cents. I think FAS is telling the truth when they say they had to walk away from the FM contract. FM is driving industry changes, prices lower, and it shouldn't surprise anyone. That company is fighting for its existance. The republicans want it gone, and the democrats are probably starting to winder what advantage they really bring. They are still in the double digit billions of red after a bail out. Its a nasty corrupt, pseudo-puplic enterprice propped up by the government under the guise of being a GSE and fullfilling the Bush era dream of "a home for every american". (steps off soapbox).

The nationwides are all getting screwed. BSO scores, turn times, and all that jazz with FAS was fine. FM may say otherwise to save face, but in California, the houses were great, agents were happy, and the scores were through the roof.

FAS has nothing to gain with a loosing contract, just like many of you won't work for a nationwide at their fees. If they promised you alot of work at a loss, it still wouldn't make sense right? 

I unfortunately am a slave to the nationwides. I would love to break the cycle, but in California there are so many of us, everyone is using illegal labor (not us), and they are doing the work for peanuts. Hard to create sense of "need" for us and our level of quality. Any thoughts in this regard?


----------



## GTX63

Yes a couple of thoughts.
Turn around times and BSO scores for FAS are horrible in Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, KY, the midwest. They have been for several years. The Brokers in these areas detest FAS. Knowing what we know from first hand experience with them since 2007, they are a poster child for the problems in this industry. Yes, the corruption is everywhere, public and private sector, however, regardless of my politics, everytime I hear a generic Bush or Obama bash...ever hear of Chris Dodd and Barney Frank?


----------



## BPWY

GTX63 said:


> Yes a couple of thoughts.
> Turn around times and BSO scores for FAS are horrible in Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, KY, the midwest. They have been for several years. The Brokers in these areas detest FAS. Knowing what we know from first hand experience with them since 2007, they are a poster child for the problems in this industry. Yes, the corruption is everywhere, public and private sector, however, regardless of my politics, everytime I hear a generic Bush or Obama bash...ever hear of Chris Dodd and Barney Frank?






You can add WY, NE, CO and MT to that list too.

FAS is as useless as t'ts on a boar. The brokers that are forced to work with them despise them.


----------



## Guest

warranpiece said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> Still kind of new here, but wanted to throw in my 2 cents. I think FAS is telling the truth when they say they had to walk away from the FM contract. FM is driving industry changes, prices lower, and it shouldn't surprise anyone. That company is fighting for its existance. The republicans want it gone, and the democrats are probably starting to winder what advantage they really bring. They are still in the double digit billions of red after a bail out. Its a nasty corrupt, pseudo-puplic enterprice propped up by the government under the guise of being a GSE and fullfilling the Bush era dream of "a home for every american". (steps off soapbox).
> 
> The nationwides are all getting screwed. BSO scores, turn times, and all that jazz with FAS was fine. FM may say otherwise to save face, but in California, the houses were great, agents were happy, and the scores were through the roof.
> 
> FAS has nothing to gain with a loosing contract, just like many of you won't work for a nationwide at their fees. If they promised you alot of work at a loss, it still wouldn't make sense right?
> 
> I unfortunately am a slave to the nationwides. I would love to break the cycle, but in California there are so many of us, everyone is using illegal labor (not us), and they are doing the work for peanuts. Hard to create sense of "need" for us and our level of quality. Any thoughts in this regard?


I've heard that from some else....
However, they are the one who had to have the best technoledgy at our expense...
How many companies right now can justify their phone bills because they do FASMobil?????
I'm in contact with seveal vendors locally and acros the nation on a daily basis.
Right now everyone is saying the same thing...no work till Aug/Sept...
This is the time for everyne to get their ducks in a row...
We were contact directly by HUD to do work without the middleman....
In addition several vendors in the area are starting to communicate with each other and sharing knowledge about the "clients" they have....knowledge becomes negotiating leverage...
we all know what better negotiating can do for your company....
DON"T WE???????????:whistling:thumbup::laughing::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> I've heard that from some else....
> However, they are the one who had to have the best technoledgy at our expense...
> How many companies right now can justify their phone bills because they do FASMobil?????
> I'm in contact with seveal vendors locally and acros the nation on a daily basis.
> Right now everyone is saying the same thing...no work till Aug/Sept...
> This is the time for everyne to get their ducks in a row...
> We were contact directly by HUD to do work without the middleman....
> In addition several vendors in the area are starting to communicate with each other and sharing knowledge about the "clients" they have....knowledge becomes negotiating leverage...
> we all know what better negotiating can do for your company....
> DON"T WE???????????:whistling:thumbup::laughing::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:


sure glade I refused to use FASMoble:whistling


----------



## Guest

something that everyone may want to keep in mind with everything going on in the industry....
Telling/demanding what equipment you have to use
Background checks...whether you pay fee or not for them
Any type of testing

Those all make you an employee...
If you have been with a compnany for a while they owe A LOT of employee taxes on you.....nice hook to have...

Just sayin'

Yes our phone bill is over 500 a month for all of our lines. Prior to the smart phone thing it was a little under 200 a month....
we sent a survey out to gather inormation.
Had our systems less than 2 months when things with FAS started going belly up......


----------



## Guest

All those things do classify a person as an employee and if it were my company or yours on the stand as a defendent with all that as evidence against i believe we would be held liable for unpaid employee tax. That being said how many cases do you know of that have been brought to court against a national or bank with these said circumstances and are actually winning in court? Because if all of this would hold weight in the courtroom i would have to think that several class action lawsuits would have been filed against several nationals by now.


----------



## Guest

tenec said:


> All those things do classify a person as an employee and if it were my company or yours on the stand as a defendent with all that as evidence against i believe we would be held liable for unpaid employee tax. That being said how many cases do you know of that have been brought to court against a national or bank with these said circumstances and are actually winning in court? Because if all of this would hold weight in the courtroom i would have to think that several class action lawsuits would have been filed against several nationals by now.


No.
When you file you taxes at the end of the year YOU do pay YOUR share of your taxes.
What does not get paid are the employee contributions...
The matching Fica amount, The matching Medicade/Medicare, the employers unemployment tax....
Right now I think it is a matter of "biting the hand that feeds you" mentallity that has not produced any resistance on this issue.
you can bet regulation is coming to this industry.


----------



## Guest

GTX63 said:


> Yes a couple of thoughts.
> Turn around times and BSO scores for FAS are horrible in Missouri, Illinois, Indiana, KY, the midwest. They have been for several years. The Brokers in these areas detest FAS. Knowing what we know from first hand experience with them since 2007, they are a poster child for the problems in this industry. Yes, the corruption is everywhere, public and private sector, however, regardless of my politics, everytime I hear a generic Bush or Obama bash...ever hear of Chris Dodd and Barney Frank?


It wasn't meant as a bash. The Dodd Frank bill isn't a problem for me to be honest if thats what you are referring to. Forcing peopel into homes and looking the other way when the avg home was 500K here in Cali was pretty silly. No one person to blame fot that crap.

Alot of the same people work for FAS as the other nationwides. I think the problem is the nationwide model in general more than FAS. Is Safeguard, Cyprexx or AMS quality really better if they are all generally using the same vendors? I don't think so. In addition, in dealing with many of these guys first hand, FAS treated us better than most of the others. Safeguard would just pay you less than agreed, and then say they didn't have to notify you of chargebacks....just look at your contract.

FAS isn't perfect, but I don't think they are the worst out there. I just want to fire the nationwides, but have to continue to keep the office going in the meantime. Not sure how to make it happen. That is why i am here trying to learn from you fine ladies and gentleman.


----------



## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> I've heard that from some else....
> However, they are the one who had to have the best technoledgy at our expense...
> How many companies right now can justify their phone bills because they do FASMobil?????
> I'm in contact with seveal vendors locally and acros the nation on a daily basis.
> Right now everyone is saying the same thing...no work till Aug/Sept...
> This is the time for everyne to get their ducks in a row...
> We were contact directly by HUD to do work without the middleman....
> In addition several vendors in the area are starting to communicate with each other and sharing knowledge about the "clients" they have....knowledge becomes negotiating leverage...
> we all know what better negotiating can do for your company....
> DON"T WE???????????:whistling:thumbup::laughing::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:


Haha. I wish I knew more what negotiating can do. Cleanupman I am sure we probably know each other. I was doing work in Las Vegas until recently. I focus more on California and a swath of AZ now, along with another problem area. Any suggestions on how I can roll up my sleves, keep all of our people busy who perform good and proper work, and not be a slave to the nationwides anymore? I am all ears! I need someone after 6 plus years of doing this to help me here and I'm not afraid to admit it.

:notworthy


----------



## BPWY

warranpiece said:


> FAS isn't perfect, but I don't think they are the worst out there. I just want to fire the nationwides, but have to continue to keep the office going in the meantime. Not sure how to make it happen. That is why i am here trying to learn from you fine ladies and gentleman.





Once you get out and about you'll see that FAS IS pretty much the lowest of the low. As far as nationals.
Plenty of horrible regionals of there.

This was my experience.


----------



## Guest

warranpiece said:


> It wasn't meant as a bash. The Dodd Frank bill isn't a problem for me to be honest if thats what you are referring to. Forcing peopel into homes and looking the other way when the avg home was 500K here in Cali was pretty silly. No one person to blame fot that crap.
> 
> Alot of the same people work for FAS as the other nationwides. I think the problem is the nationwide model in general more than FAS. Is Safeguard, Cyprexx or AMS quality really better if they are all generally using the same vendors? I don't think so. In addition, in dealing with many of these guys first hand, FAS treated us better than most of the others. Safeguard would just pay you less than agreed, and then say they didn't have to notify you of chargebacks....just look at your contract.
> 
> FAS isn't perfect, but I don't think they are the worst out there. I just want to fire the nationwides, but have to continue to keep the office going in the meantime. Not sure how to make it happen. That is why i am here trying to learn from you fine ladies and gentleman.


I definately agree with your last paragraph...
They are all the same when it comes right down to it...

However, I do have to take issue with the quality statement...
We will not work with Safeguard due to their reputation...
I have yet to take a Safeguard property over and not find it a mess. filthy toilets that have been winterized, cabinets & shelves dirty, mold in the fridges. 
Granted there are times when there has been a property and we were "A_F_N_MAZED"...far and few between.
AMS< Cyprexx, FAS...they all have the same procedures....built-in redundancy...
That said, I do not have an issues with that as it is our policy to put our name on anything we do...

The #1 problem with the industry is not how they screw you over the problem is...

Every National negotiates a number that benifits them without asking anyone if they can complete services for X-amount...
Then when we all say we can't do it for that amount we need this amount, said national gets all butt-hurt because we will not help them keep their end of the bargan...

My job is to keep MY company solvent...not help do so for someone else by going broke so they can keep their end of an agreement they made with no regard for my company...
There is not one of the nationals that care if you go belly up tomorrow because you were assisting them with clearing their inventory...

I know many of us are saying this but...eventually the word will get out and the scabs will start saying no also and there will be no more STUPID labor pool to draw from...

The #2 problem is that there are way tooooooooooo many regionals in the middle clogging things up and diluting the revenue pool....
Everyone needs to tell them no...period...

so pull the belt in another notch, get a bowl of beans and hold on till everything shakes out and get ready to go back to work...:thumbup::clap::laughing::blink::whistling:whistling:whistling:whistling


----------



## Guest

warranpiece said:


> Haha. I wish I knew more what negotiating can do. Cleanupman I am sure we probably know each other. I was doing work in Las Vegas until recently. I focus more on California and a swath of AZ now, along with another problem area. Any suggestions on how I can roll up my sleves, keep all of our people busy who perform good and proper work, and not be a slave to the nationwides anymore? I am all ears! I need someone after 6 plus years of doing this to help me here and I'm not afraid to admit it.
> 
> :notworthy


Go to Karrass.com
There you will be able to sign up for emails on negotiating...
You can go the inexpensive route and sign up for "weekly tips"
It helped me...
I used to blow it and LOSE it...I felt I was disprespected etc...
But the sessions helped me a lot with understanding what was going on...
You are not taught to negotiate from one side of the table, rather how and why BOTH sides need to do what they do...
What I found...the statement...if you won't do it we'll find someone else that will...
I call 'em on that now, I have found that it is easier to raise with an ace high hand knowing they only have a king....95% of the time that statement is a bluff....if they HAD someone else they would not be pushing you so hard to complete a service so low...someone is getting the leftover $$$$$ 
I still get emails, have been for a couple of years now.
Also if you're having business related issues you need to figure out. I use our local SCORE office. They are usually tied to the local SBA.
Score is retired executives and the business mentors I have have been a life...well a business...saver!!!!!!
As for keeping busy...We have started going to events like flea markets, Chamber of Commerce activities etc. and promoting our services...we'll split a booth fee for the opertunity to put our shingle up and promote ourselves...
We just picked up two new clients this weekend that have rental units and were hiring three people to do what we do...preservation work...
We spent $20 on booth fees got to girl watch ( come on ladies we're guys and it is summertime, ie; girlwatching season:clap::clap::clapall day and got a couple clients....
Sometimes you gotta get creative...I got a felling it's gonna get tighter next month...


----------



## SwiftRes

Came to an agreement that puts them pretty much on par with the work we do with other companies. Will see how it all goes. Will be completing property tomorrow.



SwiftRes said:


> They want to negotiate above the flat fee tomorrow. I showed them how compared to others I do work for, they are willing to pay around 50-60% of them. Will see what they offer.


----------



## Guest

And what happened....


----------



## SwiftRes

Uploading order now. Will see in a couple weeks when the check comes.  I think i'll be ok on this one, but it was a little bit of a rural property(but that's what we cover a lot of), so other vendors probably wouldn't do it. If there's no major issues with my photos, I'll be fairly happy with the outcome at where we negotiated at.


----------



## SwiftRes

Well only issue I had with pics was not having any of the meters. Got those in, order was approved. So assume it will be smooth sailing from here.


----------



## Guest

Those damn moving meters!!!!!


----------



## SwiftRes

Followup: Received check in full for this work order yesterday, but they have not asked me to do any further orders


----------



## Guest

There is a meet and greet scheduled for 7-28-12.
This is ONLY to introduce and network with other companies in this area.
THIS IS NOT TO FORM A UNION or anything of that nature.
We are only loking to network and assist each other with the increased workload that (should) is comming in the upcomming months.
Share ideas on how too streamline our opperations.

If you would be interested in meeting your fellow business owners follow the link above for further information.
Also If you are a bank agent or realty agent and would be interested we would love to have you attend. We can all help each other. 

There will be finger foods provided. You will be responsible for your own beverages.
Thank you

Posting on CL Reno/Tahoe area....
anyone interested should check the Events section...There are currently 12 participants...great networking opportunity for the companies in the area...


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## Guest

Where is this increased work load coming from? More like significantly decreased work load...


----------



## Guest

Hey hold on....
August has not gotten here yet!!!!!


----------



## Guest

You're right. August will bring even more of a decrease since they no longer will have Fannie.


----------



## Guest

all the properties we have received in the past 10 days have been BOA


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## david

*hi*

cleanup you cant say all areas will pick up though,hopefully yes but never know in this business,i just wonder how many more vendors fas will lose now renewing E+0 ins and not much work,tough decision


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## Guest

All I know is that 5 vendors I know in this area started seeing a bit of an increase this week...Although one ptoperty would be an increase right now...
I will know mor in the next day or two how thing are in other area.
I Talk...well this with other company owners across the country a couple time a week.

We have been approached by seven "subbers" in the past month.

The latest one sent a price sheet...$37.50 Wints...$18 Cyd includes hazards...
Ever hear of Back Block Property Preservation???
Check their "free" website...:whistling


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## david

*hi*

never heard of back block preservation,but been seeing a lot of new ones around here too poppin up,i agree work has been bad this year so anything helps.


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## Guest

The following is a list of companies we have applied with or have attempted to recruit us. They are all Subbers.
Assurant
Precission Property Services….THEIVES
Allied Property Services…Ally…very Shady Also a THEIF
RLS Services
Lamco…Or is it Scamco????
Qualified West
Qualified East
Quest
Pacific Preservation Services
Regis Development
Spectrum
Sentinal
ABC Field Services
Back Block Property Preservation
Big Daddy Property Preservation/Nationwide
Homeland
DSI Services
Assured Assets
Sheild Asset Sserices
Leading Edge
Hec-Lo
Energy REO Solutions
A+ Property Preservation
Impasto Services


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## SwiftRes

Seriously. How could you take "Big Daddy Property Preservation/Nationwide" seriously?



Cleanupman said:


> The following is a list of companies we have applied with or have attempted to recruit us. They are all Subbers.
> Assurant
> Precission Property Services….THEIVES
> Allied Property Services…Ally…very Shady Also a THEIF
> RLS Services
> Lamco…Or is it Scamco????
> Qualified West
> Qualified East
> Quest
> Pacific Preservation Services
> Regis Development
> Spectrum
> Sentinal
> ABC Field Services
> Back Block Property Preservation
> Big Daddy Property Preservation/Nationwide
> Homeland
> DSI Services
> Assured Assets
> Sheild Asset Sserices
> Leading Edge
> Hec-Lo
> Energy REO Solutions
> A+ Property Preservation
> Impasto Services


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## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> All I know is that 5 vendors I know in this area started seeing a bit of an increase this week...Although one ptoperty would be an increase right now...
> I will know mor in the next day or two how thing are in other area.
> I Talk...well this with other company owners across the country a couple time a week.
> 
> We have been approached by seven "subbers" in the past month.
> 
> The latest one sent a price sheet...$37.50 Wints...$18 Cyd includes hazards...
> Ever hear of Back Block Property Preservation???
> *Check their "free" website...:whistling*


Hey Cleanupman,
Speaking of websites. I tried to check your website out by following the link in your profile but there was nothing there. :hang: :detective:
I figured you might want to know. I know I would.


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## Guest

They came to us...
numbers were a joke 
Never said I took 'em seriously...But that was my first reaction...
Same for Back Block Property Preservation!!!!


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> They came to us...
> numbers were a joke
> Never said I took 'em seriously...But that was my first reaction...
> Same for Back Block Property Preservation!!!!


received a call from them this morning to see if I could do a trash out about 2 minutes down the road from me. 60 cyd for $800. the PM tried to sweet talk me into it. I mean, try to speak to me and seduce me over the phone. it was hilarious. I played along with my guys listening on speaker phone LOL. I told them I could get it done for $4000. grass was on a sloped lot with rocks, brush and 3-4 feet tall. this woman had no shame and no quit in her.

is this the level of nonsense this industry is going to? I mean what professional company would resort to this behavior and what idiot would actually DO THE WORK for them??

so I grabbed my ukulele and played her a favorite song of mines:

Put your sweet lips a little closer to the phone
Let's pretend that we're together all alone
I'll tell the man to turn the juke box way down low
And you can tell your friend there with you he'll have to go

Whisper to me tell me do you love me true
Or is he holding you the way I do
Though love is blind make up your mind I've got to know
Should I hang up or will you tell him he'll have to go

You can't say the words I want to hear
While you're with another man
Do you want me answer yes or no
Darlin' I will understand

Put your sweet lips a little closer to the phone
Let's pretend that we're together all alone
I'll tell the man to turn the juke box way down low
And you can tell your friend there with you he'll have to go....

AND THEN I SAID NO!! $4000 NOT A PENNY LESS SWEETHEART. I told her money talks and talking dirty does nothing for me. LOL


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## Guest

Hey Thanks on the website info...we did find another host at 1/100 of the fee we were paying and I forgot to come back here and change the setting...

Big Daddy huh????
That Fernando Aldana is a character.... Yeah 60 yards is a lot...I'm surprised that the offer was 800...


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## BPWY

Geebus Troy,


Are you serious she tried talkin dirty to get you to take the job?

Dang, how low will they go?
Talk about no morals.


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## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Geebus Troy,
> 
> Are you serious she tried talkin dirty to get you to take the job?
> 
> Dang, how low will they go?
> Talk about no morals.


Serious as a heart attack. I couldn't believe it. I know of 2 other companies(regionals) who have resorted to this type of behavior.


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## BPWY

No self respecting person would do this


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> No self respecting person would do this


I have been turning down there trash out too. I went by one to do a bid to remove over growth from aroung the home. Home had been trash out , it full I would 120 CYD.Only way I would do it is by bidding it! there not getting me to do it on there flat rate scam!


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## Guest

STARBABY said:


> I have been turning down there trash out too. I went by one to do a bid to remove over growth from aroung the home. Home had been trash out , it full I would 120 CYD.Only way I would do it is by bidding it! there not getting me to do it on there flat rate scam!


had not been trashed out, was about two week after I decline. I think there really have problems getting people to do trashouts.


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## Gypsos

STARBABY said:


> had not been trashed out, was about two week after I decline. I think there really have problems getting people to do trashouts.


Seeing that here too. The people that are doing them do a horrible job. 

They asked me to do them again and I told them we needed to start with a flat rate double the current price and half the CYs. 

Never heard back on that one.


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## thanohano44

Gypsos said:


> Seeing that here too. The people that are doing them do a horrible job.
> 
> They asked me to do them again and I told them we needed to start with a flat rate double the current price and half the CYs.
> 
> Never heard back on that one.


They need to just hire their own in house employees. Let them deal with all the overhead. They'll change their minds soon after.


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## GTX63

They get pretty smooth with that kind of phone solicitation because they have to do it so much.


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## Guest

Hey.....
I want girls to call me and talk dirty:clap::thumbup::whistling...that is unles thay are seceretly billing 3.99 a minute!!!!!!


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## GTX63

They are...it's called a chargeback.


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## Guest

chargebacks...


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## GTX63

She whispers, "How can something that feels so right be so wrong?":blush:


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## Splinterpicker

GTX63 said:


> She whispers, "How can something that feels so right be so wrong?":blush:



Breasts without nipples are pointless :thumbup:


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## Guest

GTX63 said:


> She whispers, "How can something that feels so right be so wrong?":blush:


I GASSSSPPPED....
not wrong just grooooovy baby:thumbup::whistling:whistling:whistling


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## thanohano44

Cleanupman said:


> I GASSSSPPPED....
> not wrong just grooooovy baby:thumbup::whistling:whistling:whistling


Stop. No. And don't.


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## Splinterpicker

Cleanupman said:


> Hey.....
> I want girls to call me and talk dirty:clap::thumbup::whistling...that is unles thay are seceretly billing 3.99 a minute!!!!!!


that would be ~240 clams an hour :blink: that is more than what we are making at this point in the game !!

Talk about diversifying your services and yes I'd like fries with that


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## Guest

splinterpicker said:


> that would be ~240 clams an hour :blink: that is more than what we are making at this point in the game !!
> 
> Talk about diversifying your services and yes I'd like fries with that


just looked I`m down to six recuts with them. Have been turnung down all there trash out orders. thinking maybe I`ll some winterizations for them if I just don`t give them the boot first!


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## Splinterpicker

STARBABY said:


> just looked I`m down to six recuts with them. Have been turnung down all there trash out orders. thinking maybe I`ll some winterizations for them if I just don`t give them the boot first!


A long pole ( in the water ) and a cold beer is REALLY looking better. Look into getting in with your local municipalities. I got a job that I bid on today and it is going to be great. Mowing a city lot 2 ft tall and haul away... between 825 and 925 needless to say BRING IT on

according to FAS wages I'd be paying them for the same service :laughing: Copy the loosing of yards ... we lost some today also BOA VA :thumbup: FAS I am beginning to think they are just a glorified PIMP 

See ya on the river bank


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## enriquegill012

Another fine example of how they are another extension of the banks... Thanks for sharing the link to the article.


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