# Opinions needed - am I getting paid enough.



## Guest (Jun 28, 2011)

Thanks for the warm welcome to the community 

Took a job as a contractor for a middle man company that contracts for a mobile home lendor. The job is clean outs and cleaning of single and double wides. 

clean out pays 125 for single wide 150 double wide
cleaning pays 175 flat for either

Jobs are within 50 miles and I'm rolling with a 4x8 enclosed trailer. Truck is full with the gear, so I have the trailer for trash.


mpg for my truck is 10-11 when pulling trailer. Jobs are usually around 50miles away and I don't get mileage.

region is South NH and Northern MA. 

My second job with this company

The single wide I went to today was 90 miles round trip and would take 5 loads with my trailer. The nearest landfill is 20mi each way. 40mi round x5 is 200mi. at 10mi to the gallon hmm...

I had to walk away as the math meant a near loss on the clean out. The middle man company is hiring a dumpster and is sending me back, however I am now 50bucks in on mileage costs, plus another 50bucks for the return trip. Meaning on a the clean out I will make 25bucks to work alone on a large furniture and a king bed clean out. 

I have a full cleaning job at this unit as well which will help me recover some costs, but I am feeling like I just don't have the required trailer/truck set up for the job. The middle man keeps talking me into not quitting and I do need the money but I can't stand near losses.

I also didn't realize dumping rules were so serious, most dump sites in MA are for residents only, meaning anything more than one load and I'm driving 30-40 miles for a transfer station that will take my stuff. And NH transfer stations only take trash if the trash is from a home in that town. Plus I am out 100's at a time in dump fees due to lbs and dead TV's (reimbursed in 1-2 weeks). 

I guess I am looking for opinions as I am beginning to feel stressed over a job that should be stress-less. If I can't complete the clean out and cleaning in 1 trip then to much profit is lost and I may as well go get a $10 per hr job somewhere.


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## Guest (Jun 28, 2011)

I wouldnt even get out of the house for less than 100.00 your getting ripped...


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## APlusPPGroup (Apr 14, 2012)

If that's the rate you are working for to remove all debris and hazards then, no. If it were right next door and there were only a couple cubic yards, a few tires, and a couple gallons of paint maybe. But the way you describe the work, you are seriously shorting yourself and need to find new clients.

YOU are the only one who can calculate what you need to cover expenses, including taxes and insurance, so I would make that your first priority.

Just out of curiosity, does that flat rate include janitorial and yard work?

Linda


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Thanks Linda I was hoping you would respond.

Rate for trash outs 125 and 150 sngl wide, double wide are for removing all trash, furniture, beds, etc.. and a quick wipe of the fridge. Inside only.

175 rate is for cleaning ie: janitorial. 

The killer for me is my trailer size, my miles per gallon issue and the distance

What do you pay your vendors and how large is the territory?


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## APlusPPGroup (Apr 14, 2012)

Our rates are HUD minimum allowances but a few of our clients pay more per item, depending on what the order is for.

We bid janitorial and anything that's more work than the HUD rate allows.

We take a discount but we don't take work from anyone who takes a discount first. We find that 2-tiered discounting never works. If the vendors don't make money, we don't want the work. And we tell them that up front.

Having a small trailer is okay until you get to the bigger jobs. Then it's a pain in the butt and costs go through the roof. It's hard to be competitive when you have to bid high to cover the cost of making so many dump runs.

Linda


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

jobu said:


> Thanks for the warm welcome to the community
> 
> Took a job as a contractor for a middle man company that contracts for a mobile home lendor. The job is clean outs and cleaning of single and double wides.
> 
> ...






No way!!! You would be money ahead to get a job at Mcdonalds!!!!


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## APlusPPGroup (Apr 14, 2012)

I forgot to answer your other question. We have vendors in 48 states and have been receiving a lot work in about 30 of them, especially along the East Coast so we're always looking for good vendors.

Linda


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Sounds to me and you that you are doing a business that you are not setup to do...this is what is killing the industry. This is a business ONLY. Treat it as such. You can't open a McDonald's with only a frying pan. I don't mean to be blunt but the contractors that do make a living in this field have invested $1,000's being properly outfitted, licensed and insured. They know the cost of landfills, they know the different regulations and the have learned what it costs to make a profit. You will get a ton of responses on this forum with and without pricing but ONLY you can learn to run a profitable business. Remember not everyone can operate a successful business.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Morgan Tile said:


> I wouldnt even get out of the house for less than 100.00 your getting ripped...


Dude I've seen about half your 11 post & I must say "YOU ARE ARROGANT"
I hope we all can grow up & be as special as you!:laughing::laughing:

Keep in mind some of us are doing really well, & some of us are just trying to keep afloat but everyone in here aspires to see their company grow.
OH and by the way welcome to C/T:thumbsup:


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

It sounds like they are hoping you can't calculate your costs and so figure out how much you are making or losing with this job.

Somebody might have one of these
http://www.edmunds.com/tco.html
for trucks.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

SAW.co said:


> Dude I've seen about half your 11 post & I must say "YOU ARE ARROGANT"
> I hope we all can grow up & be as special as you!:laughing::laughing:
> 
> Keep in mind some of us are doing really well, & some of us are just trying to keep afloat but everyone in here aspires to see their company grow.
> OH and by the way welcome to C/T:thumbsup:


you would i think not.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

thanks for flaming up the thread rofl. I will take all info...

Let me be clear on this. 

I answered a craigslist ad. I don't want to do this past a few months. I have read further on the forums and understand whats happened to the industry. That isn't me. I am not seeking new contracts, I'm not seeking to make this my life. 

That said, it seems that being on the bottom end and working as a vendor for a company that already works as a vendor is not the way to do it. I will stick with it until something else comes. I will keep active sending out resume's. 

Thanks for the responses and reminding me that I am a contractor and don't owe them anything. Wish me luck finding and job that better suits me.


As far as the mathematics of it all I'm good and blessed better than most. I just had no idea about industry standards.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Trust me friend, my company did not come out of the box turn key & go.
I've built it from the basement up! & i'm only on the 2nd floor.
I would & I have, I did not show a profit for the first 2 years. The first thing I learned was how to F myself...


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

SAW now thats the TRUTH of any business.....Those first 2-3 years are a backbreaker:thumbsup:

JOBU don't take it personal. Its only that this business is like no other. Its not a "contracting" type business even though it technically is. quality of work accounts for 10% of your success and the ability to take good pics and shoot good BULL accounts for the other 90% of your success. Sad but true.

As I try to tell everyone in the P&P field...."use this only as a step to get yourself into a good business or career"... as stepping stone so to speak. Yes this can be a career but in todays atmosphere of the way the P&P Guys/Girls are whipped up on I would never ever ever go into this field. JMO.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Yeah, I think you know the answer to your own question.

At a bare minimum do you want to make at least $10/hr. for your time? I sure hope at least that. Is this guy 1099ing you (or cash under the table)? I am pretty sure your expenses to do this don't add up to just gas (dump fees?).

Working flat rate for something that in the best circumstance seems/sounds marginal/underpaid is a loser over the long term, just as you are describing a far less than ideal scenario above.

I am not surprised he is trying to convince you to keep at it. If I had no scruples and a guy who would work for >10 bucks an hour with his own gear I would try to hold onto him as well.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

No.

But so long as your willing to work for below wage...
They will be more than happy to pay...

Or the next guy that thinks he can get rich cleaning houses, trailers, whatever.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

FremontREO said:


> SAW now thats the TRUTH of any business.....Those first 2-3 years are a backbreaker:thumbsup:
> 
> JOBU don't take it personal. Its only that this business is like no other. Its not a "contracting" type business even though it technically is. quality of work accounts for 10% of your success and the ability to take good pics and shoot good BULL accounts for the other 90% of your success. Sad but true.


Talk to me on the PICS thing. I think I am overdoing the cleaning for mobile home work. Wiping every baseboard and door frame etc.. Is a realtor ever going to contact the bank (assuming they could) due to a ****ty cleaning job that looks good in the pictures? If I could chill out on the 5 hour cleaning then I would be able to knock out a trash and clean 1 day no prob.

Also just to reiterate I am only at this job until I can get another.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

jobu said:


> Talk to me on the PICS thing. I think I am overdoing the cleaning for mobile home work. Wiping every baseboard and door frame etc.. Is a realtor ever going to contact the bank (assuming they could) due to a ****ty cleaning job that looks good in the pictures? If I could chill out on the 5 hour cleaning then I would be able to knock out a trash and clean 1 day no prob.
> 
> Also just to reiterate I am only at this job until I can get another.



Pics are the receipe for chargebacks. That is how the banks/service companies netpick your work to see how and why they can chargeback for work "they" don't think is good. I don't want you to think that the work does not matter because it does. What I was trying to express is the "clerical side" of the business is where you will make or break it. That includes the cost of doing business ie....profit.

I have worked for many companies through the years that do expressely Mobile Homes and they normally pay very well. There is several on this forum that work from NVMS and I would recommend them. Currently we don't work with them since the work load is to light for us...more a hassle than what its worth. Ask around and I think that most will say they are good people. When I worked with them they were a 3 person shop and now they are huge. 

10 years ago I would do a 20cyd cleanout and maid service on a mobile home for roughly $1000. Today? No idea but they probably won't pay half that since as we all know "our expenses have reduced by more than half" NOT:no:


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

jobu said:


> Talk to me on the PICS thing. I think I am overdoing the cleaning for mobile home work. Wiping every baseboard and door frame etc.. Is a realtor ever going to contact the bank (assuming they could) due to a ****ty cleaning job that looks good in the pictures? If I could chill out on the 5 hour cleaning then I would be able to knock out a trash and clean 1 day no prob.
> 
> Also just to reiterate I am only at this job until I can get another.


You have to decide when to do a perfect job and when to do good enough. People really get what they pay for. The other side of that is you have to do what you are paid for. Not to say do a shi**y job. Just do the amount of work they are paying for. On cleanouts that we do sometimes I use a damp mop to hit all the baseboards. Does it get it all? Nope. does it look 100% better than whatever was caked on it before? sure does. everyone is happy. You have to find middle ground. They arent paying for a steak. They are paying for a $1 meal at mcdonalds. I'm sure they want steak. But they don't want to pay for it. So give em what they paid for and move on to the next job cause at those prices youre gonna have to do alot of houses in as short a time as possible to make money. Good luck


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

Don't get me started ya'll:furious:


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

griz said:


> No.
> 
> But so long as your willing to work for below wage...
> They will be more than happy to pay...
> ...


Or just thinks that it is the way out of his currently desperate situation, without realising that it is actually just a continuation, that *includes* running your a** off all day..


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

DreamWeaver said:


> Don't get me started ya'll:furious:


Come on I know you want to cut loose!!!!:laughing:

Got one for ya. A maid service that took 2 hours for 2 men (4 hours labor) and dang thing looked a ton better. Failed by realtor

Went back for free and did it all over again for another 4 hours labor.......Failed again by realtor.

Wanted us to go back again...NOPE NO WAY. Tell the Realtor to get a freakin life and yada yada yada..... Gonna get a chargeback for sure but wth. Not going to waste 1 more minute nor anymore fuel for this fool. Can't polish a turd. 

Called Merry Maids and $85/hour for 4 hour minimum and thats what I bid. Pis*ed them all off. To bad So sad.


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## Guest (Jun 29, 2011)

FremontREO said:


> Come on I know you want to cut loose!!!!:laughing:
> 
> Got one for ya. A maid service that took 2 hours for 2 men (4 hours labor) and dang thing looked a ton better. Failed by realtor
> 
> ...


Amazing..........

I had a company ask me to do initial services on a prop. I was willing to do it but it couldn't be done till Wed of the next week, this was requested on a Friday. They told me no way it had to be done sooner. I told that they needed to re-assign it. They said ok. About 3 weeks later they shoot me an email requesting I do the initial services once again. By then my pricing had gone up. I told them sure, for my new price. They asked if I could provided dump receipts to justify the additional cost. I said I could but I won't. That's my cost regardless. They didn't ike my answer and said they would re-assign. I'm waiting to get another request. It's been a couple of weeks. 

I believe that many of these reps suffer fron crainial rectal inversion. They talk out there Arses:blink:

To give the youngin's some pespective. I'm doing a private job now that will pay more than double what a pres. co. would try to get it done for. Oh and here's the even better part, I don't have to FINANCE them for 30 to 60 days, No chance of a charge back, a real opportunity to receive more work, and I don't have to split the pie with anyone....

Talk to you later my friend.


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## thanohano44 (Aug 5, 2012)

DreamWeaver said:


> Amazing..........
> 
> I had a company ask me to do initial services on a prop. I was willing to do it but it couldn't be done till Wed of the next week, this was requested on a Friday. They told me no way it had to be done sooner. I told that they needed to re-assign it. They said ok. About 3 weeks later they shoot me an email requesting I do the initial services once again. By then my pricing had gone up. I told them sure, for my new price. They asked if I could provided dump receipts to justify the additional cost. I said I could but I won't. That's my cost regardless. They didn't ike my answer and said they would re-assign. I'm waiting to get another request. It's been a couple of weeks.
> 
> ...


Good job! I love when I get those jobs.


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