# Safeguard P&amp;P Grass Versus REO Grass cuts?



## Guest

I have been a REO Grass Vendor for about 2 years and just got offered more lawns if I become a vendor for the P&P grass...

Any insight on what kind of differences i can expect with taking the P&P Grass would be great....


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## JenkinsHB

As a grass vendor I don't think there are any differences, they don't let grass vendors do FHA properties. If you are doing them as a PP vendor there will be many. You'll be liable for reporting any damages to the exterior of the property on conventional loans and for FHA loans you'll need to essentially do a complete cc status everytime you are there for a cut .... so interior rebid and condition photos.


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## Prestigious Property

Can i expect more pp lawns than reo lawns?


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## JDRM

YES, there is a huge inventory of pre forclosures. And you will be expected to bid everything on the property while there, everytime you are there.


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## JenkinsHB

Yes, lots of pre foreclosure. If you are a grass vendor you won't need to bid everything, that's only if you do it as a pp vendor.


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## SwiftRes

I have 41 lawns I do on the P&P side, and I cover a low volume zone. Starting the REO side next week, we'll see how that goes.


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## Prestigious Property

I am now set up for the P&P side with 1 job as of now. I was told it could take a few weeks to get work filling up my box.... I have 250 on my REO side so we will see what happens in the next few weeks...Swiftres keep us posted on how things go....


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## BamaPPC

SG actually made a change this year. They have taken all the FHA pre-sales away from the P&P vendors and given them to the grass cut vendors. Not sure how they are handling the inspection part required by FHA on every visit. But, the only GC's we're getting are Post-Sale FHA's.

I've told them I can't do $30 grass cuts. I figure when the GC vendor figures out he's broke (in late June or early July) I'll be getting back all the cuts they've taken away.

Given our geography, mostly rural, the distances between yards is prohibitive to making a profit at $30 per cut. This is the second year that SG has used GC vendors, so I've had plenty of time to do the math...I don't see how anyone can handle the volume (approx 300-400-that's 600-800 cuts a month) in an area that's approx 4000 square miles, with small pockets of population and distances between than can be 15 miles. No one man can possibly do that many cuts (well, do them correctly) in 30 days. That's 20 per day, everyday, on the low end. Impossible in this area. I've got two man crews and the most they're able to get done on a perfect day is 16. That's daylight to dark, and some of the yards are well over 1 acre (biggest is 4 acres, yes that a single lot) And, I do pay them by the yard, not the hour, so wandering around not cutting grass doesn't make them money.


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## BPWY

BamaPPC said:


> SG actually made a change this year. They have taken all the FHA pre-sales away from the P&P vendors and given them to the grass cut vendors. Not sure how they are handling the inspection part required by FHA on every visit. But, the only GC's we're getting are Post-Sale FHA's.
> 
> I've told them I can't do $30 grass cuts. I figure when the GC vendor figures out he's broke (in late June or early July) I'll be getting back all the cuts they've taken away.
> 
> Given our geography, mostly rural, the distances between yards is prohibitive to making a profit at $30 per cut. This is the second year that SG has used GC vendors, so I've had plenty of time to do the math...I don't see how anyone can handle the volume (approx 300-400-that's 600-800 cuts a month) in an area that's approx 4000 square miles, with small pockets of population and distances between than can be 15 miles. No one man can possibly do that many cuts (well, do them correctly) in 30 days. That's 20 per day, everyday, on the low end. Impossible in this area. I've got two man crews and the most they're able to get done on a perfect day is 16. That's daylight to dark, and some of the yards are well over 1 acre (biggest is 4 acres, yes that a single lot) And, I do pay them by the yard, not the hour, so wandering around not cutting grass doesn't make them money.






They've been doing the $30 per grass cut pricing with grass only vendors for longer than 2 yrs.

I was doing them in 09 for that. The way they talked I got the impression they'd been doing grass only vendors for longer than that.

In 11 they asked me if I could cover my county for them.
I told them I'd get all over it for $50 per, with over 2700 square miles in my county..... you do the math.
Kinda like your situation. They said no. I don't know or care who is doing them for $30. 
It aint me and thats all that matters. $30 is an insult to the contractors with the way expenses have gone way up since 09.


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## Guest

*grass cuts*

It's all based on volume. Each of my crews do 25 properties, minimum per day. I also get paid better than the 30.00 fee.


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## Guest

SwiftRes said:


> I have 41 lawns I do on the P&P side, and I cover a low volume zone. Starting the REO side next week, we'll see how that goes.


I would say you are getting the homeward residential lawn side.

Its crazy I was getting a certain number for these lawns from NFR and now safeguard wants me to cut them for a certain number and lets just say safeguards number was alot lower than NFR number.

I bet homeward is still paying the same


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## GTX63

The volume argument is filed next to the 911 conspiracy theory.


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## BamaPPC

ctvalley said:


> It's all based on volume. Each of my crews do 25 properties, minimum per day. I also get paid better than the 30.00 fee.


25 per day? they have got to be less than 10K sqft and all within a 30 mile radius.

And that's great if that's your area. My area is approx 60 x 100 miles.
that's 6000 square miles, with a large body of water in the middle. Only one bridge across it.

We can have as much as 40 minute drive between yards. A couple large cities, many small towns, lots of rural area. from corner to corner it's 120 miles. and I have had to be in both places on the same day. And you don't make any money looking through the windshield.


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## BPWY

A lot of us rural guys in the Western states have a MUCH bigger area to work in. Troy knows what this is like. As does Linda and others.


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## GTX63

Yeah, SG signs up the new guy and his wife in 2011 and gives them 50 grasscuts. Spring 2012 rolls around and they get about 15 properties out of their coverage area. One or two per small town scattered over multiple counties. The rep says, "Hey, help us out on these and we'll keep you covered up in grass cuts in your area too." So they send over 70 mows in their town. Then, each week for two months, they cancel 5 grass cuts with nothing new coming in. By the middle of last month, they had a handful of recuts left in their coverage area, but they were still knocking down 250 miles per day to cut the yards out in the sticks. Too new to the biz to know any better. Gotta love that volume.


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## BamaPPC

Sorry if I sounded like I was seeking pity. I wasn't. I know some of you guys have very large areas to cover. But, I bet one of your crews can't get to 25 yards in a day either. I was just explaining that a good percentage of the country isn't like an area like Boston or Chicago, where all the yards are within walking distance of each other.

So volume, in our areas, is a two edged sword. Great to have 350 yards to do in a month, but how the [email protected]#L to do get to that many when they are scattered over an area thats 6 to 10 thousand square miles? Answer: ya can't. And ya can't hire someone else to help, because all you're getting paid is $30, or less, and there's just not enough pie to go around.


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## GTX63

Working a 12 hour day (7 a.m - 7 p.m.) 25 per day is a little more than 2 per hour with no lunch, breaks, refuel, or drive time. Don't have to be the Grand Yard Master to know they better be 30' row houses on the same street.


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## Guest

BamaPPC said:


> Sorry if I sounded like I was seeking pity. I wasn't. I know some of you guys have very large areas to cover. But, I bet one of your crews can't get to 25 yards in a day either. I was just explaining that a good percentage of the country isn't like an area like Boston or Chicago, where all the yards are within walking distance of each other.
> 
> So volume, in our areas, is a two edged sword. Great to have 350 yards to do in a month, but how the [email protected]#L to do get to that many when they are scattered over an area thats 6 to 10 thousand square miles? Answer: ya can't. And ya can't hire someone else to help, because all you're getting paid is $30, or less, and there's just not enough pie to go around.


I can not get more than 10 lawns a day done in Boston.All lawn are less than 10,000 but the traffic is terrible,can't find place to park.


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## GTX63

what we have done is stop in front of the property. Two guys hop out, drop the trailer gate, unload the equipment, driver leaves and comes back in 25 minutes, reverses action.


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## Guest

My average lawn is 20 K. One guy trimming one on the ztr. If the lawn is big enough, one ztr and one mower. One guy straps up equipment and blows, the other trims. My days start at 6:30 am (arrive at shop) and get done between 4-5:30 pm. I have several hours of driving per day. But, how long does it take to cut a 20K lawn for you guys? I average 2.5 lawns per hour. Generally average 10-20 minutes between lawn if in the country. 

700 per day per crew is easily attained. If you aren't making that, you are taking too many breaks.


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## Guest

ctvalley said:


> My average lawn is 20 K. One guy trimming one on the ztr. If the lawn is big enough, one ztr and one mower. One guy straps up equipment and blows, the other trims. My days start at 6:30 am (arrive at shop) and get done between 4-5:30 pm. I have several hours of driving per day. But, how long does it take to cut a 20K lawn for you guys? I average 2.5 lawns per hour. Generally average 10-20 minutes between lawn if in the country.
> 
> 700 per day per crew is easily attained. If you aren't making that, you are taking too many breaks.


Sounds like a good system but are you even taking pictures?


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## BPWY

Couldn't be cutting 50k an hour including drive time.


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## BamaPPC

ctvalley said:


> My average lawn is 20 K. One guy trimming one on the ztr. If the lawn is big enough, one ztr and one mower. One guy straps up equipment and blows, the other trims. My days start at 6:30 am (arrive at shop) and get done between 4-5:30 pm. I have several hours of driving per day. But, how long does it take to cut a 20K lawn for you guys? I average 2.5 lawns per hour. Generally average 10-20 minutes between lawn if in the country.
> 
> 700 per day per crew is easily attained. If you aren't making that, you are taking too many breaks.


700 what? dollars? at the new FHA rates that's only about 10-12 yards. Yeah that's doable. But at the lowball fees, that would be 22 to 28 yards per day. Not possible in my area.


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## Guest

I enjoy my grass cuts. I've got a system that enables me to bang out 90-110 accounts a week with just me and a worker. My days vary from 6-8 hours a day. My max account day I can squeeze in 40-45 accounts. On average I work 20 days a month, 140-150 hours total. I guess it depends on the size of your zone. Also, making sure you submit on time. I'm always over 90% completed on the score card and it helps me increase my accounts that I service. If they need a favor, I'll do it, it makes a difference.


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