# Tired Of Getting Ripped Off



## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

I've been with this company Initial Secure for going on 3 years now. Everything has been peachy up until about the last year. Just this morning I got an email that my 10 CYD removal completed yesterday was adjusted to 6 CYD because they saw empty spaces on my trailer. Ya think?? My trailer it 7x16 feet long and can hold up to 20 CYD when full. I was only supposed to move 10 CYD. Of course they're gonna see open spaces! Yes I provided measurements. I put in a bid of $400 to rent a brush hog and clear 1.35 acres of land that is 24 to 32 inches high and recut it with an initial cut. They undercut my rental of $150 per day....$100 full day machine rental plus fuel and trailering to $60. $60 is the 3 hour minimum required by the rental company. That puts me at 45 mins to the property, and 45 mins back to the store and an hour and a half left to use the brush hog AND cut 1.35 acres. ON TOP OF IT, they added a whole bunch more work like debris removal, shrub trimming, vine removal, etc to EQUAL to my $400 bid!!!! I turned it down! Tired of this crap!! I completed a debris removal for $25/CYD to move 18 CYD into storage. After 30 days I was told to dispose of the personals in storage for a grand total of $50!!!! That's a total of $2.77 per CYD!!!!! I had to handle this stuff FOUR times. From property to storage, and from storage to disposal. PLUS an extra month storage for March because the month is not prorated by the storage company. I did charge $25/CYD for 18 CY, plus $107 for the additional month, plus $409 for a 20 yard dumpster for a total of $966. They balked at the price and said the work order is only for $50. Their rep argued with my for 30 minutes about the price. He came up with moving the debris onsite, like from exterior to garage, is $7.50 Their price. So I would make $60 and have $10 for disposal costs. WHAT??? I CAN'T EVEN BY A GARBAGE CAN AT MENARDS FOR $10!!!!!! Not to mention 18 CYD by their price of $7.50 is $135!!!!! Where does he come up with $60?????? Still arguing this one out, but I'm so tired of this crap!! I can go on and on and on here. Anyone else dealing with this crap????


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

Meanwhile I've written up properties with CODE VIOLATIONS and not receiving ANYTHING back. I have a property with a tankless water heater hanging from the ceiling by coat hangers, a kitchen sink that dumps straight into the sewer line with NO p trap. Another with 5 feet of water in the basement. I first inspected the property in december and there was 3 inches of water and a bad check valve spraying all over the basement. I reported it as an emergency condition and that it needed to be addressed immediately. They told me to unplug the sump pump to stop the water flow and bid to correct. Which I did. Never heard boo back. They sent me back to the property in february to verify ICC and there's now 5 FEET of water in the basement. I bid for the pump out and correct the check valve and still haven't heard boo. I argued with their rep where are my bids?? I've turned in over $100,000 in bids over the last 6 months and he said it's not my concern, I should only be concerned about the work orders in my queue!!!! So tired of this crap!!!


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Morgan Services said:


> I've been with this company Initial Secure for going on 3 years now. Everything has been peachy up until about the last year. Just this morning I got an email that my 10 CYD removal completed yesterday was adjusted to 6 CYD because they saw empty spaces on my trailer. Ya think?? My trailer it 7x16 feet long and can hold up to 20 CYD when full. I was only supposed to move 10 CYD. Of course they're gonna see open spaces! Yes I provided measurements. I put in a bid of $400 to rent a brush hog and clear 1.35 acres of land that is 24 to 32 inches high and recut it with an initial cut. They undercut my rental of $150 per day....$100 full day machine rental plus fuel and trailering to $60. $60 is the 3 hour minimum required by the rental company. That puts me at 45 mins to the property, and 45 mins back to the store and an hour and a half left to use the brush hog AND cut 1.35 acres. ON TOP OF IT, they added a whole bunch more work like debris removal, shrub trimming, vine removal, etc to EQUAL to my $400 bid!!!! I turned it down! Tired of this crap!! I completed a debris removal for $25/CYD to move 18 CYD into storage. After 30 days I was told to dispose of the personals in storage for a grand total of $50!!!! That's a total of $2.77 per CYD!!!!! I had to handle this stuff FOUR times. From property to storage, and from storage to disposal. PLUS an extra month storage for March because the month is not prorated by the storage company. I did charge $25/CYD for 18 CY, plus $107 for the additional month, plus $409 for a 20 yard dumpster for a total of $966. They balked at the price and said the work order is only for $50. Their rep argued with my for 30 minutes about the price. He came up with moving the debris onsite, like from exterior to garage, is $7.50 Their price. So I would make $60 and have $10 for disposal costs. WHAT??? I CAN'T EVEN BY A GARBAGE CAN AT MENARDS FOR $10!!!!!! Not to mention 18 CYD by their price of $7.50 is $135!!!!! Where does he come up with $60?????? Still arguing this one out, but I'm so tired of this crap!! I can go on and on and on here. Anyone else dealing with this crap????


Yet you continue to enable them by accepting the bullcrap


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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

Morgan Services said:


> I've been with this company Initial Secure for going on 3 years now. Everything has been peachy up until about the last year. Just this morning I got an email that my 10 CYD removal completed yesterday was adjusted to 6 CYD because they saw empty spaces on my trailer. Ya think?? My trailer it 7x16 feet long and can hold up to 20 CYD when full. I was only supposed to move 10 CYD. Of course they're gonna see open spaces! Yes I provided measurements. I put in a bid of $400 to rent a brush hog and clear 1.35 acres of land that is 24 to 32 inches high and recut it with an initial cut. They undercut my rental of $150 per day....$100 full day machine rental plus fuel and trailering to $60. $60 is the 3 hour minimum required by the rental company. That puts me at 45 mins to the property, and 45 mins back to the store and an hour and a half left to use the brush hog AND cut 1.35 acres. ON TOP OF IT, they added a whole bunch more work like debris removal, shrub trimming, vine removal, etc to EQUAL to my $400 bid!!!! I turned it down! Tired of this crap!! I completed a debris removal for $25/CYD to move 18 CYD into storage. After 30 days I was told to dispose of the personals in storage for a grand total of $50!!!! That's a total of $2.77 per CYD!!!!! I had to handle this stuff FOUR times. From property to storage, and from storage to disposal. PLUS an extra month storage for March because the month is not prorated by the storage company. I did charge $25/CYD for 18 CY, plus $107 for the additional month, plus $409 for a 20 yard dumpster for a total of $966. They balked at the price and said the work order is only for $50. Their rep argued with my for 30 minutes about the price. He came up with moving the debris onsite, like from exterior to garage, is $7.50 Their price. So I would make $60 and have $10 for disposal costs. WHAT??? I CAN'T EVEN BY A GARBAGE CAN AT MENARDS FOR $10!!!!!! Not to mention 18 CYD by their price of $7.50 is $135!!!!! Where does he come up with $60?????? Still arguing this one out, but I'm so tired of this crap!! I can go on and on and on here. Anyone else dealing with this crap????


Where you located ? I been with them a yr, for some reason my bids are going to someone else, while they keep sending me to someone else bids that i haveno clue what they bidded for. Plus out area work where im getting little out area fees.. Smh. 

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## FSMsuperhero (Jul 10, 2017)

The work you're receiving/compleleting... is it for HUD or FNMA?


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

Everything that everyone is complaining about is the reasons we stopped. We have went back to doing work just for realtors, landlords and personal home owners at least they pay and understand the cost of work. I can not express enough that everyone would be better off just working for the banks and realtors and completely cut out asset companies. I also know that the one way to get your money is post the name of the bad company and the people on RIPOFF REPORT.COM So every time someone looks up that company or that person they will see that they like to rip people off.


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

Everything that everyone is complaining about is the reasons we stopped. We have went back to doing work just for realtors, landlords and personal home owners at least they pay and understand the cost of work. I can not express enough that everyone would be better off just working for the banks and realtors and completely cut out asset companies. I also know that the one way to get your money is post the name of the bad company and the people on RIPOFF REPORT.COM So every time someone looks up that company or that person they will see that they like to rip people off.


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## sirluckey1 (Apr 20, 2018)

I have been working for them for a year. The prices and distances are crazy. They keep asking for grass cuts despite the snow and rain. Weather is no excuse for being late with a grass cut either I was told yesterday by processing. So if I think it going to be bad weather I decline. They been asking for grass cuts since JANUARY. Where do you live???
I feel your pain!


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## taggert (Feb 24, 2018)

*initial secure is a rip off company!!!!!!!!!!!*

they outsource all office work to india.they want to get rich off of every order.they cut bids and cut payments.they were good for the first month we worked for them.then they cut prices,bids.they believe that 6x8 fence panels should be installed for $45 . i stood firm and eventually after 6 months i cut ties before they did any real damage to my company.Fred williams is a tHIEF .STAY AWAY FROM INITIAL SECURE AT ALL COSTS!!!!!.THIS IS A VERY SERIOUS WARNING.


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

Ripped off yet AGAIN! WO stated to trim 21 LF of "branches" located at the " FRONT RIGHT CORNER" of the house. The only thing remotely close were shrubs. And trees were 40 feet or more away from the house. They sent a follow up order because I failed to trim the branches off a tree.....the pictures they sent me were from the LEFT REAR facing the street. The tree is about 20 feet AWAY from the house! Definately NOT the "FRONT RIGHT CORNER " OF the house! Closed the order as work fulfilled. But who knows if I'll get paid for it! More B.S.


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

Airraid I'm in the Chicagoland and northern IL area. I get that also. I have hundreds of thousands of dollars in bids out there. When I confronted the Rep, he told me to just worry about what is in my queue. Meanwhile I get shrub trims and other garbage that I didn't even bid on. I wrote up code violations at a property where the tankless water heater was hanging by clothes hangers, a wood porch that was caving in, a kitchen sink draining straight into the sewer line with NO p trap, and a hole in the roof. I get approved to trim shrubs!!!!!! WTF!?!??!?! I DIDN'T BID ON TRIMMING ANY SHRUBS!!!


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

sirluckey1 said:


> I have been working for them for a year. The prices and distances are crazy. They keep asking for grass cuts despite the snow and rain. Weather is no excuse for being late with a grass cut either I was told yesterday by processing. So if I think it going to be bad weather I decline. They been asking for grass cuts since JANUARY. Where do you live???
> 
> 
> I feel your pain!


SirLuckey I am in the Chicago/Northern IL area. I had 20 snow removals ending 03/30 with NO snow around so I closed out all the orders to clean up my queue. They put them back in with a new date of 04/30 And told to do them when it snows. Meanwhile, some goofball in the office sends me emails every morning asking when these orders will be fulfilled. Really? It's like they don't even look at what the orders are even for. I got pissed because it shows the level of experience this person has in this field. The only thing it shows me this person is qualified to do is copy and paste my queue and send it back to me


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

mmcontracting2004 said:


> Everything that everyone is complaining about is the reasons we stopped. We have went back to doing work just for realtors, landlords and personal home owners at least they pay and understand the cost of work. I can not express enough that everyone would be better off just working for the banks and realtors and completely cut out asset companies. I also know that the one way to get your money is post the name of the bad company and the people on RIPOFF REPORT.COM So every time someone looks up that company or that person they will see that they like to rip people off.


MM I ABSOLUTELY hear where you're coming from. My approach when I started out was to simply do grass cuts and snow removals. The PP work is nice in the downtime/off season, but I'm so sick of FIXING other people's @#$%. Once the weather breaks, that's the direction I'm taking. I'm moving back into grass cuts and expanding back into a residential field rather than this industry. It's nice to have while you're growing because let's face it, the banks have to pay for lawn care or they'll get fined. But the trouble with all the PP work just isn't worth it anymore. I just want to cut grass and plow snow


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

Post these people on RIPOFF REPORT.com


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## MMPP (Apr 21, 2018)

Hello, I have worked for Initial Secure a little over a year and for the first 10 months they where awesome and I never had issues including Trip Pay for anything over 30 miles from my house.. I actually did all of TN for them when they picked the state up... The last 2 months have become a nightmare with like you said cuts on any debri removal both jobs over the approval, ignoring Notes on PPW then acts like they never got a note, forgetting to add OAF on jobs that they always have, huge nightmare! What states are you in to those working for ISFS ? I hate it cause they where one of the best to work for and in many cases made more than direct with there vendors do to them paying OAF while growing.. I have had my best luck dealing with accounting there to fix issues... If anyone wants to DM me I would love to chat about them and there antics now... It's like they are trying to grow to big! Let's not even talk about Follow ups on missing pics that are there the whole time...


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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

Morgan Services said:


> Airraid I'm in the Chicagoland and northern IL area. I get that also. I have hundreds of thousands of dollars in bids out there. When I confronted the Rep, he told me to just worry about what is in my queue. Meanwhile I get shrub trims and other garbage that I didn't even bid on. I wrote up code violations at a property where the tankless water heater was hanging by clothes hangers, a wood porch that was caving in, a kitchen sink draining straight into the sewer line with NO p trap, and a hole in the roof. I get approved to trim shrubs!!!!!! WTF!?!??!?! I DIDN'T BID ON TRIMMING ANY SHRUBS!!!


Lol! I know excatly what you talking about . im not sure what to think about them now, lost half my work bc i had truck issues , my rep asked me well are you gonna hire ppl to complete your work order once again Wtf.. I dont make enough to hire ppl plus my truck cost me over 700 dollars to get fixed. He resigned all my orders but seem to me he was threaten me cause i had truck issues. Well got it fixed and end up getting the work i lost back.. Just seem fishy compared to last yr.

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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

MMPP said:


> Hello, I have worked for Initial Secure a little over a year and for the first 10 months they where awesome and I never had issues including Trip Pay for anything over 30 miles from my house.. I actually did all of TN for them when they picked the state up... The last 2 months have become a nightmare with like you said cuts on any debri removal both jobs over the approval, ignoring Notes on PPW then acts like they never got a note, forgetting to add OAF on jobs that they always have, huge nightmare! What states are you in to those working for ISFS ? I hate it cause they where one of the best to work for and in many cases made more than direct with there vendors do to them paying OAF while growing.. I have had my best luck dealing with accounting there to fix issues... If anyone wants to DM me I would love to chat about them and there antics now... It's like they are trying to grow to big! Let's not even talk about Follow ups on missing pics that are there the whole time...


Yeah im starting wonder myself about them.

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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

mmcontracting2004 said:


> Post these people on RIPOFF REPORT.com


Not the answer to collect monies owed


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Just for record...
Might want to tune in to Weekend Wrap later


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

ATTN: Morgan Services I understand and that is where we have been for a few years now. We left the asset companies a couple years ago and have been working for credit unions, banks, landlords and realtors. This has been working very well for us because we get paid within 15 days after invoice and we also get pp work but only what we bid or are asked to bid. Yes the pay is not always as high but it is on time. We also enjoy it because there is no 3rd party and long story short at this point we go to property and inspect, mow, trim and place bids to fix up to the point of selling or putting on market. So debris removal which is around $18 a cyd and initial lock changes, and then start repairs such as painting, and replacing fixtures such as toilets, sinks and so on. We if get paid $1 a light bulb change and the list goes on and they also work with us when we need extra time. I hope this information is helpfully for you and your future because brighter.


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

mmcontracting2004 said:


> ATTN: Morgan Services I understand and that is where we have been for a few years now. We left the asset companies a couple years ago and have been working for credit unions, banks, landlords and realtors. This has been working very well for us because we get paid within 15 days after invoice and we also get pp work but only what we bid or are asked to bid. Yes the pay is not always as high but it is on time. We also enjoy it because there is no 3rd party and long story short at this point we go to property and inspect, mow, trim and place bids to fix up to the point of selling or putting on market. So debris removal which is around $18 a cyd and initial lock changes, and then start repairs such as painting, and replacing fixtures such as toilets, sinks and so on. We if get paid $1 a light bulb change and the list goes on and they also work with us when we need extra time. I hope this information is helpfully for you and your future because brighter.


MM I hear ya. I had ads placed on other sites and have realtors contact me directly because they're sick of the crap work being done by other vendors. I was charging $25 Per CYD and was awarded work because they thought my prices were too LOW. I upped it to $30 and still getting the work. But I'm still in competition with Safeguard and the rest. Since the mortgage companies already have contracts with the big assets, they're not listening to the realtors and awarding it to their own contractors. I get very few orders this way. But still brings in money when the realtors go to bat for me. I had to do a de-wint and there was a busted pipe behind a wall in the utility room. The realtor and the new buyer were right there with me. I called my rep at ZVN and told her I'd fix it for $175 to cut out a 2ft x 2ft piece of drywall, splice in a new pipe, and seal and mud it all back up. Would take me about 30 minutes. She approved it for $175. My rep called their rep who was on the phone with the realtor standing RIGHT NEXT TO ME and said I'd do it for $500!!! They needed to get this done to close on the house next day so they went thru with it and approved it. They made $325 off me for nothing but a PHONE CALL. Goes to show how much they mark this stuff up! I ended up getting full rehab work on a few properties on the side by the realtor. 

Still gonna do like you said tho. Moving out of this into more residential grass cuts and snow removals


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

airraid73 said:


> Morgan Services said:
> 
> 
> > Airraid I'm in the Chicagoland and northern IL area. I get that also. I have hundreds of thousands of dollars in bids out there. When I confronted the Rep, he told me to just worry about what is in my queue. Meanwhile I get shrub trims and other garbage that I didn't even bid on. I wrote up code violations at a property where the tankless water heater was hanging by clothes hangers, a wood porch that was caving in, a kitchen sink draining straight into the sewer line with NO p trap, and a hole in the roof. I get approved to trim shrubs!!!!!! WTF!?!??!?! I DIDN'T BID ON TRIMMING ANY SHRUBS!!!
> ...


Airraid I hear that!! I have had nothing but break downs the past few months. Transmission, blown front wheel bearings, distributor went out, 2 broken trailer wheel bearings went out. My rep at Northsight pulled 30 orders from me when I told them. Not doing that again. Just telling the others I'm running behind. Initial Secure only gives me about 36 hours to complete the work. I can't drop what I'm doing next day to go do it and then process and turn it in on the following day. So that pretty much drops them to the bottom of the list when it's time to get things done. I try to have it within 3 days of when it's assigned. When I give them a date when it will be done, they don't even change the due date. They just let it run late. Then I'm constantly getting interupting calls while I'm trying to work to find out when it will be done!


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## MMPP (Apr 21, 2018)

Hey guys where are you located doing work for ISFS? I could go on and on about them!! I have a couple reps there that are real jerks and others that seem to care. They swear they are located in Mich. but we all know thats a lie.. They use fake names to work under like how many people from India have the last name Wilson and there is like 5 there named Wilson..haha????LMAO!!! Its a joke! Now if you contact Paul or Harold in accounting they will fix about 90% of the legitimate complaints as I had the same issue above with being undercut on debris that I knew where on target but Harold corrected them immediately... Now as for pay I have never been not paid for any work done for them since starting a year ago. I am told they had just started the company about the time I started and last year paid out 510,000 in Out of area fees as well as went from 17 states to 37 since last year.. Its crazy!!!


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## MMPP (Apr 21, 2018)

Im in the same boat doing work directly for Realtors in this area and its been a hit... I invoice $35 a cube and no complaints plus my work is never undercut that way...I strive on excellent work and always do everything correctly and better. I am sick of cleaning up messes from vendors that dont care.. I do kind of git it with the rates some newbies are excepting not understanding the field but still sucks for us hard works that do every thing right!


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

I can say that I never even heard of initial Secure so I would not trust them. When we worked for asset companies and the 3rd party places it was 5 brothers, VRM, Capital City, ZVN, Field asset services, Altisource and a few others and we covered 3 states and the only company that we would ever recommend would be ZVN prices were fair and we did get about 75 % of our bids approved and they always payed extra for out of area trips. I agree with trying to keep prices up but we have learned that since we kept them lower we get more work and have really picked up a lot of local landlords and credit unions. For example if you have a Summit Credit union near you or CCQ or any credit union really seem to be better then a bank. I hope I helped you some how.


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

MMPP said:


> Hey guys where are you located doing work for ISFS? I could go on and on about them!! I have a couple reps there that are real jerks and others that seem to care. They swear they are located in Mich. but we all know thats a lie.. They use fake names to work under like how many people from India have the last name Wilson and there is like 5 there named Wilson..haha????LMAO!!! Its a joke! Now if you contact Paul or Harold in accounting they will fix about 90% of the legitimate complaints as I had the same issue above with being undercut on debris that I knew where on target but Harold corrected them immediately... Now as for pay I have never been not paid for any work done for them since starting a year ago. I am told they had just started the company about the time I started and last year paid out 510,000 in Out of area fees as well as went from 17 states to 37 since last year.. Its crazy!!!



I'm in the Chicagoland area. Got that right about being from India!!!!!!!!!! How many Indian people do you know named Kyle, Jim, Fred, Davis, or Leon?????? And most of my correspondences with them are in the afternoons or I get my orders between 4pm and 8 pm leaving me about 36 hours to complete orders. That tells me they're starting their day somewhere other than the U.S. I'll get along with anyone as long as you're straight with me, so I don't have a problem with race. But don't start [email protected]#$% with me! I've been with them since early 2016. We used to get between 3-5 days to get orders completed. Now it's down to 36 hours....at least for me. I'll get a call from 6 reps asking me for updates while I'm trying to work!! Then I'm asked to update my orders on an excel file from my phone while I'm out in the field soldering copper pipes together!! Or I won't get a single phone call all morning, but then my email blows up with job note notifications saying that so n so tried to call me, but it went to voicemail and please update my job notes with ETD's!! My phone never rang!!! Or the best one I absolutely HATED was someone will call me 3 times IN 60 SECONDS, then leave me a job note saying that "they tried to get a hold of me repeatedly" and if I don't return the call, ALL of my orders will be re-assigned!! Gggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!! THAT pisses me off


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

mmcontracting2004 said:


> I can say that I never even heard of initial Secure so I would not trust them. When we worked for asset companies and the 3rd party places it was 5 brothers, VRM, Capital City, ZVN, Field asset services, Altisource and a few others and we covered 3 states and the only company that we would ever recommend would be ZVN prices were fair and we did get about 75 % of our bids approved and they always payed extra for out of area trips. I agree with trying to keep prices up but we have learned that since we kept them lower we get more work and have really picked up a lot of local landlords and credit unions. For example if you have a Summit Credit union near you or CCQ or any credit union really seem to be better then a bank. I hope I helped you some how.



Most of my work for ZVN was 90 miles or more away. Then they wore down to 1 and 2 orders. It wasn't worth it driving 180 miles round trip for 2 $25 grass cuts. So basically I went bust with them


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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

Morgan Services said:


> I'm in the Chicagoland area. Got that right about being from India!!!!!!!!!! How many Indian people do you know named Kyle, Jim, Fred, Davis, or Leon?????? And most of my correspondences with them are in the afternoons or I get my orders between 4pm and 8 pm leaving me about 36 hours to complete orders. That tells me they're starting their day somewhere other than the U.S. I'll get along with anyone as long as you're straight with me, so I don't have a problem with race. But don't start [email protected]#$% with me! I've been with them since early 2016. We used to get between 3-5 days to get orders completed. Now it's down to 36 hours....at least for me. I'll get a call from 6 reps asking me for updates while I'm trying to work!! Then I'm asked to update my orders on an excel file from my phone while I'm out in the field soldering copper pipes together!! Or I won't get a single phone call all morning, but then my email blows up with job note notifications saying that so n so tried to call me, but it went to voicemail and please update my job notes with ETD's!! My phone never rang!!! Or the best one I absolutely HATED was someone will call me 3 times IN 60 SECONDS, then leave me a job note saying that "they tried to get a hold of me repeatedly" and if I don't return the call, ALL of my orders will be re-assigned!! Gggrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!!! THAT pisses me off


Omg!! This is to funny ill be thinking the same thing. At first when i see the number its has Michigan area code ..lol false.. I just got a email 3 am in the morning from. Sale team tiger..telling me i. Need more picture from a tarp job i did.. bs its been a week since it was completed now you tell me..sometime i cant do but laugh .

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## taggert (Feb 24, 2018)

*initial secure is outsourced to india*

fred williams may be from michigan but his office is overseas.They try to get rich off of every order.another example: the property was 35,000 sf with a grass height of 48" i bid $400( that was really cheap).They "approved for a lower rate" $90.I told them that is a joke and good luck finding anyone to cut this.The property was near me so i noticed it was not cut for 3 more months.Apparently there are desperate contractors that will work for peanuts.every bid approval after my first 6 months was cut more than half.I would fight for every approval until it got old.i would get replies like "We have no room to pay you that amount" and a guilt trip about they wont make any money if they approve for my modest pricing.IF you choose to work for Initial secure you might as well kill yourself.


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## mmcontracting2004 (Apr 20, 2018)

Thank you for the warning about this company and Fred


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## Ear26LSR (Nov 12, 2015)

"As a concerned neighbor " I know your not the neighbor..but say you are and call CODE ENFORCEMENT once they get a violation your approval will be approved because they will charge them up the a** PER DAY!


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

Omg!! This is to funny ill be thinking the same thing. At first when i see the number its has Michigan area code ..lol false.. I just got a email 3 am in the morning from. Sale team tiger..telling me i. Need more picture from a tarp job i did.. bs its been a week since it was completed now you tell me..sometime i cant do but laugh .

Airraid I think they do it just to delay payment. How many pictures of a tarp can you supply??? It's large. It's flat. It covers the roof. 

I removed tree next to a shed. Took pics from the same direction before and after. There was no other direction I could take the pics and it was the ONLY tree within 20 feet of the shed. I took at least 30 before and 30 after pics to make sure my ads was covered. They sent me a "corrective action" to drive 60 miles back to the property to show that the tree was in fact gone! I uploaded my original pics and closed the order as fulfilled. I never heard boo about it again 

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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

taggert said:


> fred williams may be from michigan but his office is overseas.They try to get rich off of every order.another example: the property was 35,000 sf with a grass height of 48" i bid $400( that was really cheap).They "approved for a lower rate" $90.I told them that is a joke and good luck finding anyone to cut this.The property was near me so i noticed it was not cut for 3 more months.Apparently there are desperate contractors that will work for peanuts.every bid approval after my first 6 months was cut more than half.I would fight for every approval until it got old.i would get replies like "We have no room to pay you that amount" and a guilt trip about they wont make any money if they approve for my modest pricing.IF you choose to work for Initial secure you might as well kill yourself.


I can't see how they are NOT making money on our bids unless they are doing it by undercutting. Period. They're getting 30% as most asset management companies are. 30% on top of $400 is a HELL of a lot more than 30% on $90. I went by one of my properties just yesterday that I had over $75,000 worth of bids written up. It's been 6 months since I've been there. From the outside it looks like not a single thing has been done. It actually looks worse. But 30% on $75,000 is a HELL of a lot more than sending me out there for $35 to trim shrubs. If they want to make money, get our bids approved and stop with the nickel and dime crap!


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

AND ANOTHER THING!!!!! LOL

I had 36 hours to complete a grass cut order. I closed it out last night 04/27. I just got the recut order this morning 04/28 due on 05/08. WHY am I getting 10 days to complete the order NOW when I was only given 36 hours THEN???? SMDH


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## MMPP (Apr 21, 2018)

I have gotten where I dont take there BS and most of the time get them to go up to reasonable amounts or tell them where to put it. Does anyone know who owns the company cause all they say is there investors. I have ask before and they said they are not allowed to say but the owner is very nice person (Spoken how they said it). I flat out told them that he must be embarrassed of his company to not want to been known or has scammed contractors in the past leading him to not be upfront as to who he is. I am leaning towards Fred as he has been there since I started as well as Scott but not sure...I personally have not had payment issues and for the most part gotten them up to standards for approvals. I recently did an MCS 30" Grass Cut on 62,000 sft and paid $500 so not to bad for an hour grass cut. I also did deck railings for them on two medium decks and somehow got my approval back on it for $3600. I think this was mistake because they figured it at $16 per deck Pickett instead of what I think was supposed to be $1.60 each (India is good with placing the decimal in the wrong place) given they are only .97 each but they paid me as a Rush the day after completion as they are good at doing if you need the money or have to pay a sub for the work...They have tried to get me to do Tarp jobs for like .25 per sft and we all know that is BS given the $1-1.25 allowable. I know do all tarps for .70 per sft in my pocket and so far they go for it... I also made a killing last year going to another state for them being they where in need being they just where given the state and they paid me $100 OAF for every WO sent to me so needless to say I made damn good money while I stayed there for a week then came home for about 2 days to see the family then back for a week. I did this for about 2 months. since then they have started crying about OAF pay saying how last year they paid out 510,000 in Out Of Area...Back to the Owner?? I have only spoke with one person who speaks 100% american named Paula. I am wondering if she could be the owner. The address is to a Mailbox store in Detroit...I also love how all there Follow-Ups are for stupid stuff like a pic thats there or like mentioned above 30 pics is not enough for a tree there then gone or a tarp job etc....Its a Joke!! I one time had them complain about me using my gauge on the compressor and they sent me a pic and this is no joke of a bike pump tire gauge saying that was what I need to have for my pics....I added a Note to the order and said was something missing cause I didnt know I had to check air in tires as well....Always comes from Team Tiger and Team Jaguar! Cant get any more India than using names like that...


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

MMPP you're right. I've tried searching for a CEO a few times in the past and got nothing. They barely come up on searches. It's not Fred or Paula. When I started, Fred was recruiting and accounting. Paula started off as a field contractor before she worked with them. She was a regional rep and went on to teach training classes. I don't know what her position is now. No one will let me talk to her. And Kim Antle was a regional rep. I got into a 30 minute argument with Davis over the phone while I was out in the field. Pisses me off because I'm trying to work and end up wasting 30 minutes of my time. I was REALLY PISSED. I asked to talk to Fred or Paula and he told me they weren't in. He said Brandon was there. I don't know who that is or what his position is. So I said no I need to talk to Fred. Quite possible this Brandon person is the owner? Or who knows? Gonna look into something.......


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

I was thinking that ISFS might be a spin off of Michigan Realty Solutions since they had big time issues with an audit and not paying their contractors back in 2014. But their owner is Jay. No slight intended. Just trying to debunk the correlation between the two both being out of Michigan. I can't see any other reason why a CEO would hide his identity. I thought their salaries had to be reported. Maybe not since they are an LLC.


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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

Man! Havent spoken to Paula since last summer [email protected] Sevice everything you have spoken is so true..have you met any other vendors that work for them in your state or area, ive met one so far

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## taggert (Feb 24, 2018)

*undercutting at its best*



Morgan Services said:


> I can't see how they are NOT making money on our bids unless they are doing it by undercutting. Period. They're getting 30% as most asset management companies are. 30% on top of $400 is a HELL of a lot more than 30% on $90. I went by one of my properties just yesterday that I had over $75,000 worth of bids written up. It's been 6 months since I've been there. From the outside it looks like not a single thing has been done. It actually looks worse. But 30% on $75,000 is a HELL of a lot more than sending me out there for $35 to trim shrubs. If they want to make money, get our bids approved and stop with the nickel and dime crap!


What they are doing is getting our bids approved and then cutting our bids to initial secure happy pricing .therefore they say "it was approved but for a lower amount that you bid".they get their % from the full bid price then try to pay you nickels on the dollar... who in their right mind would install fence posts in concrete for $20 each/6x8 fence panels installed for $45???


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

Taggert - Exactly! OR they get our bid approved and give it to another contractor at a lower price. Did an inspection 2 weeks ago where the basement was flooded and bid for a pump out. Jade called me back last week and said I was being awarded the bid, but they need to know of the power was on and to go back and take pics flipping the breakers. I told him no I wasn't going back. I provided pictures of lights on showing there was power and #2 the breakers are in the basement. I'm not going wading thru waist deep water to go flip some breakers at a property where it's only me. If something happens I could get killed. Let alone not stupid enough to go flipping breakers in a flooded basement without pumping it out first. He told me he has to call the client back and we'll go from there. Been a week now and ain't heard boo. Guess they want it to turn into a mold infested nightmare


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## airraid73 (Apr 16, 2017)

Morgan Services said:


> Taggert - Exactly! OR they get our bid approved and give it to another contractor at a lower price. Did an inspection 2 weeks ago where the basement was flooded and bid for a pump out. Jade called me back last week and said I was being awarded the bid, but they need to know of the power was on and to go back and take pics flipping the breakers. I told him no I wasn't going back. I provided pictures of lights on showing there was power and #2 the breakers are in the basement. I'm not going wading thru waist deep water to go flip some breakers at a property where it's only me. If something happens I could get killed. Let alone not stupid enough to go flipping breakers in a flooded basement without pumping it out first. He told me he has to call the client back and we'll go from there. Been a week now and ain't heard boo. Guess they want it to turn into a mold infested nightmare


Knowing them , youre be laid up in the hospital and at 3 am you would get a Follow up fron Sale Team Tiger.

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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Morgan Services said:


> Taggert - Exactly! OR they get our bid approved and give it to another contractor at a lower price. Did an inspection 2 weeks ago where the basement was flooded and bid for a pump out. Jade called me back last week and said I was being awarded the bid, but they need to know of the power was on and to go back and take pics flipping the breakers. I told him no I wasn't going back. I provided pictures of lights on showing there was power and #2 the breakers are in the basement. I'm not going wading thru waist deep water to go flip some breakers at a property where it's only me. If something happens I could get killed. Let alone not stupid enough to go flipping breakers in a flooded basement without pumping it out first. He told me he has to call the client back and we'll go from there. Been a week now and ain't heard boo. Guess they want it to turn into a mold infested nightmare



If the bid is changed it is no longer your bid. why would you complete someone else's bid????
If I'm not mistaken what you have discribbed is fraud...and you enable said fraud by completing the work at the numbers they send back to you.
Again employee status is what is being described.


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## PropPresPro (Apr 12, 2012)

Cleanupman said:


> If the bid is changed it is no longer your bid. why would you complete someone else's bid????
> If I'm not mistaken *what you have discribbed is fraud*...and you enable said fraud by completing the work at the numbers they send back to you.
> Again employee status is what is being described.


 What are you talking about Aaron?
Morgan Services simply stated that they submitted a bid and the bid was approved, then refused a request to swim through a flooded basement to turn the power on. _*That's fraud??? *_


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## Morgan Services (Apr 15, 2018)

How is that fraud? I don't get what you're trying to say. I'm committing fraud? No I'm not. My bid was approved for the pump out. Bids are always a "negotiation". So in addition to awarding me the pump out. They added $130 to mop up the basement and another $100 to run fans to dry it. Which I did not include in my original bid. They've never awarded the extras to me before, so I didn't go above and beyond to include a mop up and dry. 

But aside from awarding me my bid, they wanted me to go out to the property and wade thru the water and flip the breakers. Yeah.....no. Unsafe. Award me the pump out first....then I'll flip the breakers once it's dry. 

On another note, I just got a bid request to go back to a property and write up a violation bid. I did this last October and they did nothing about it. Now they got hit again with fines and want me to go write it up again. There are priorities here and they don't follow them. Violations need to be addressed. Not swept under the rug and forgotten about. The 4 things required at EVERY property are grass cuts, snow removals, winterizations, and violations cured. If they don't follow those, they're gonna get fined, or damage will occur. 

I still have the property out there where a tankless water heater is hanging by coat hangers and the sink drops right into the sewer line with no p trap. That ones going on 6 months now and nothing is being done about it. Meanwhile, I'm being awarded shrub trims out the wazzoooo right now


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## safeguard dropout (Apr 21, 2015)

Morgan Services said:


> .....I still have the property out there where a tankless water heater is hanging by coat hangers and the sink drops right into the sewer line with no p trap. That ones going on 6 months now and nothing is being done about it. Meanwhile, I'm being awarded shrub trims out the wazzoooo right now


Ha! Ha! Ha!!! I hear ya!

I have a property that was found with 80 dead cats last fall. There was more manure and urine in that house than I've ever seen in any barn. Yep, right in town too. You can smell the place from the street! The wood floors are rotten from urine. The roof is collapsing with several holes...I tarped it for $650. :smile The plumbing has severe freeze damage, even the sewer pipes. There is water damage top to bottom with mold everywhere. The city code enforcement officer is on my arse to get the place demolished.

What is the client spending money on? Re glazing several boarded windows. :lol: What a joke!!


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