# HUD and REO property preservation



## Guest

Hey guys, I am curious if any of you do work for property preservation companies who work with lenders. I have some questions, but dont want to waste my time if no one does any work for them.

Thanks.


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## Guest

The property preservation guys (winterizing, boarding up), get the advance inside scoop on what's going to be for sale. I have a very close acquaintance who's managed to build quite a portfolio of rentals because he's on the HUD and USDA property preservation contractor list. If you have a desire to aquire property, doing this type of work here and there might not be a bad idea. You might even be able to sell the "lead" to someone who buys rentals or rehabs property.


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## Guest

That is awesome. Thanks. You just answered all of my questions too in allot less time than I could have asked them. Appreciate the help.


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## Guest

hello, i am seriously thinking about getting into the buesiness of Property preservation, i have no experiance, but wanted to know any suggetion i can get from someone who is in the buesiness already, where do i go to teach my self well as far as, winterization, proper board up, pricing, i d greatly appreaciat any help anyone can give me. 

jonathan, thank you, you can emial me at [email protected].


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## APlusPPGroup

infiniti said:


> hello, i am seriously thinking about getting into the buesiness of Property preservation, i have no experiance, but wanted to know any suggetion i can get from someone who is in the buesiness already, where do i go to teach my self well as far as, winterization, proper board up, pricing, i d greatly appreaciat any help anyone can give me.
> 
> jonathan, thank you, you can emial me at [email protected].


Jonathan ~

I own 2 property preservation businesses. There's a lot of up front money involved if you want to do it right. You'll need general liability insurance, decent equipment, fuel, equipment rental, and labor. A website wouldn't hurt either, even a simple one like mine. Plus, you can go weeks without substantial work until everyone knows you're out there.

It was a terrific struggle to get to where we are now but, if you're determined enough, send me an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll see if I can help.

I cover 5 counties in Southern California, the tri-state area of Nevada, Arizona, and California, and will soon have another startup out of Idaho.

I have an awesome crew and the best, most efficient office staff. But it was awhile before I could hire the right labor because the money is slow coming in. Now I offer 30, 60, and 90 day terms and payment plans to lenders and brokers.

I hope all that doesn't scare you off. There's a lot of work out there for the right type of person. If it didn't scare you off, contact me.

Linda


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## Guest

infiniti said:


> hello, i am seriously thinking about getting into the buesiness of Property preservation, i have no experiance, but wanted to know any suggetion i can get from someone who is in the buesiness already, where do i go to teach my self well as far as, winterization, proper board up, pricing, i d greatly appreaciat any help anyone can give me.
> 
> jonathan, thank you, you can emial me at [email protected]


If you have no experience good luck. The first time you screw up inspecting a property. BAM huge lawsuit. Study before you jump in. Let's not make the preservation side of lending like they did with making the loans.


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Jonathan ~
> 
> I own 2 property preservation businesses. There's a lot of up front money involved if you want to do it right. You'll need general liability insurance, decent equipment, fuel, equipment rental, and labor. A website wouldn't hurt either, even a simple one like mine. Plus, you can go weeks without substantial work until everyone knows you're out there.
> 
> It was a terrific struggle to get to where we are now but, if you're determined enough, send me an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll see if I can help.
> 
> I cover 5 counties in Southern California, the tri-state area of Nevada, Arizona, and California, and will soon have another startup out of Idaho.
> 
> I have an awesome crew and the best, most efficient office staff. But it was awhile before I could hire the right labor because the money is slow coming in. Now I offer 30, 60, and 90 day terms and payment plans to lenders and brokers.
> 
> I hope all that doesn't scare you off. There's a lot of work out there for the right type of person. If it didn't scare you off, contact me.
> 
> Linda


Linda,

I couldn't help but notice that you were a female too. I too am interested in getting into this business. I'm a little concerned because I've had several people tell me this isn't a business for women. I have no experience in this industry and I've been online researching as much as possible about property preservation. Do you mind telling me how you got started? I'm a MBA graduated w/ a career as a Financial Analyst studying to be a CPA. This is an entire different industry but was informed that this business is "much needed". Is this a realistic industry for me to enter without any experience? What type of credentials are needed?


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## Guest

XanadooLTD said:


> If you have no experience good luck. The first time you screw up inspecting a property. BAM huge lawsuit. Study before you jump in. Let's not make the preservation side of lending like they did with making the loans.


I too am interested in getting into the property preservation industry. I don't have any experience and lacking knowledge on the industry. I've been doing research online but can't find the negatives of the industry. 

I have a dumb question, but can you tell me what you can do wrong to cause a lender to sue you?


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## Guest

I did a quick google and just scanned the subject and this could get interesting. Seems to be a way more to it than just boarding up a few windows, draing pipes, etc..

Speaking of draing pipes, I have come acroos meters that do not completely shut off. So I would think with the possibility of pipes refilling and rupturing, maybe the meter would be capped off?


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## Guest

Yes it is much bigger than just boarding up windows and changing locks. There are different insurances along with the ones that you all ready carry. It is more inspection than anything else. You have to know a building, you can't just go at it with a screwdriver and some nails. 
As for being sued...THERE ARE MANY! But most likely, you go to a neighborhood and you start putting a board on a window. Next you notice the buidling inspector pulling up behind you. He wants to see your permit. I bet you guys didn't know you need a permit to board windows. 
Then you go to the next house and you perform a winterization. Well you miss one key step and find out 3 weeks later that there are 60000 gallons of water in the home and mold has ruined all drywall, etc. Those are just a few lawsuits...Like i said before there are many more. But let's not turn this business into the Bear Stearns, or Enron, Mortgage crisis with a bunch of people jumping in just to get some money.
Also the companies i have seen doing this do an extensive back ground check and you do need to be in the construction business for a certain number of years. Not just any hack can sign up. good luck to all if this is the field you choose.


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## Guest

> Also the companies i have seen doing this do an extensive back ground check


I would think they would want the same access to previous claims on the property like ins companies have. Can't think of the data base or what the report is called, but it lists any claims a property ower has had with ins co's. Who wants to be liable for pre-existing mold,etc.. Or maybe the mold had been removed but the problem that caused the mold has not been corrected. Good thought provoking thread.


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## APlusPPGroup

ravynd said:


> Linda,
> 
> I couldn't help but notice that you were a female too. I too am interested in getting into this business. I'm a little concerned because I've had several people tell me this isn't a business for women. quote]
> 
> Now, why in the world would your gender stop you from doing something you really want to do? Don't listen to other people, listen to yourself.
> 
> I don't have a degree but still managed to work my way pretty far up the corporate ladder into executive management. My biggest problem is I can't stand office politics and gossipy old men and women who don't have a life of their own so they have to live vicariously through yours. And last, but not least, I really loathe working for other people.
> 
> I was raised to be independent and learned a long time ago that I can take very good care of myself and be as successful as I want if I put my heart and my back into it.
> 
> Just learn everything you can and find someone willing to train you in the industry. Be sure to understand, though, that you'll exchange your time for the experience and education. No one I know of offers paid training to people going into business on their own.
> 
> Also understand that it's very physical work, the hours can be long and hard, and you'll have to know the administrative side of preservation. I work roughly 16 to 20 hours a day, 7 days a week. As in any business, you have to be able to give it everything you've got and commit to what you started in order to get anywhere.
> 
> Thanks, BTW, to all of you who have contacted me through this post. I've managed to receive an overwhelming number of inquiries. I've made some wonderful contacts, hired 2 subs, and have one more who finished his training last weekend to help me with the local work.
> 
> To those who I've not responded to yet, please accept my apologies. We're butt-kicking busy here in Southern California and I find myself spending less and less time online, except to work.
> 
> One thing I know is that, if you're willing to commit yourself, you can do anything. Gender, race, religion, and a multitude of other things should never be an obstacle.
> 
> Linda


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## Guest

I start my first Fannie Mae foreclosure rehab today. Its just some paint, minor repairs, and carpeting. I'll keep you guys posted on things like payment cycle times.

There's not a lot of money in it, but it is great filler to keep the the schedule full.

Mike


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## Guest

If the work was set up through a bank that was servicing the loan, you shouldn't have any real long delay. If it is actually coming from the government it will be some time.


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## Guest

MVH said:


> I start my first Fannie Mae foreclosure rehab today. Its just some paint, minor repairs, and carpeting. I'll keep you guys posted on things like payment cycle times.
> 
> There's not a lot of money in it, but it is great filler to keep the the schedule full.
> 
> Mike


 
who decides the pricing? them or you?

thanks


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## Guest

AtlantaLawn.com said:


> who decides the pricing? them or you?
> 
> thanks


You bid on the job against at least one other licensed contractor.

Mike


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## Guest

Actually VA, FHA, and conventional lenders all have set prices in their allowable category. If you go out to aproperty and can do the work...its all yours. If you can't then you bid. Sometimes the work gets done, but most of the time you waste time bidding. 
Say you go to a house where the roof is leaking in 7 areas. You bid to replace the roof. Figure how long it takes to look at the roof, figure out the price, etc. You submit the bid. You wait a few weeks to see if the bid is accepted. 2 Months go by and you hear nothing. 8 Months later you drive by the house. Now the house is for sale and the roof is worse than it was a year ago. It is hit or miss depending on how much the bank has to spend on keeping the house up. 
If they take a big enough loss on the house, all you are doing is changing the locks.


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## Guest

*Arizona Property Preservation Specialist*

My company has been doing propety preservation work all over Arizona for the last year. Our biggest struggle is finding quality people to perform the work. Most banks want homes secured within 24 hours, which can difficult if they happen to be a 2 hour drive. Like one of the previous posters said, it takes a lot of up front money before you start turning a profit. Banks understand the longer they hold onto the money, the more they make off of it. Banks are you customer, so don't expect payment in a timely manner. Pricing depends on who your customer is, if you are sub-contracted out or work directly for the bank. Feel free to contact me if you have any questions in the trade. You can find more information about the trade at our website.

Kirby
[email protected]
(866) 831-1451
swpreservation.com


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## Guest

*Yes, we are a property preservation company in Texas. We have been the exclusive vendor for Fannie mae for over 10 years. We also work with numerous brokers and lenders.*


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## Guest

*property preservation for REOs*

Hi guys, Im looking for info on how to get into the REO property preservation. My husband and I have a cleaning company in Phoenix and we clean for Property Management companies. I would like to branch off to REOs. I wondered if anyone works with Safe Guard or First American Field Service. I have applied on line for both. It my understanding that they are the middle man between me that the Bank. Im wondering if they are reliable companys to work for, or if there is another way to go about this.
Thanks in advance for any help and suggestions.

Vikki 
[email protected]


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## Guest

I go through local raltors that deal directly with the banks. Some of those they could not pay me enough money to clean out.


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## Guest

*safe guard*



3DVikki said:


> Hi guys, Im looking for info on how to get into the REO property preservation. My husband and I have a cleaning company in Phoenix and we clean for Property Management companies. I would like to branch off to REOs. I wondered if anyone works with Safe Guard or First American Field Service. I have applied on line for both. It my understanding that they are the middle man between me that the Bank. Im wondering if they are reliable companys to work for, or if there is another way to go about this.
> Thanks in advance for any help and suggestions.
> 
> Vikki
> [email protected]


i have been working with safeguard for the past couple of weeks. so far so good, i haven't received my first check yet but i knew that there was a 4-6 week wait due to office politics and making sure u didn't screw up to bad. my friend and mentor said they are good companies to start and learn with. so good luck.


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## Guest

3DVikki said:


> Hi guys, Im looking for info on how to get into the REO property preservation. My husband and I have a cleaning company in Phoenix and we clean for Property Management companies. I would like to branch off to REOs. I wondered if anyone works with Safe Guard or First American Field Service. I have applied on line for both. It my understanding that they are the middle man between me that the Bank. Im wondering if they are reliable companys to work for, or if there is another way to go about this.
> Thanks in advance for any help and suggestions.
> 
> Vikki
> [email protected]



Having worked for SafeGuard before I can tell you they are one of the most tedious and low paying companies to work for. Get familiar with the HUD allowables, and take 30% off of that. Safeguard's "fee" is between 20-30% of the allowable. See if that is worth your time and effort.

Honestly, the only reason it worked for us was because we treated that type of work as a loss leader to get the construction work from them.

Expect long hours of driving giving free bids, 2nd bids, updating lots and lots of pictures and lots and lots of phone calls.

Similar process with First American or any of the other nationals. :thumbsup:


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## APlusPPGroup

CaliJoe ~

I agree with you regarding Safeguard to some degree. You won't work at a total loss with Safeguard but you will be busting your butt for less than you will until you get the bigger jobs.

I terminated my relationship with Safeguard last March due to Chris' line about "office politics". I give an awful lot to the properties we service but I refuse to bend over and walk backwards for anyone, which is the way the relationship ended with Safeguard.

It is, however, an excellent company to start with and, if you can work with Safeguard, you'll find out you can work with anyone after that.

They're a great company to get your feet wet with and you'll find out soon enough whether or not you're cut out to be in the industry.

Just so it's clear to everyone............. I'm not bad-mouthing Safeguard. There are some wonderful people working there but, like any other company, they have their strong points and they have their weak ones.

My post about Safeguard is based on MY experience and has more to do with management changes than anything else. I have no regrets about terminating them and I have far too much work now to be looking backward and wondering if I made a mistake. I didn't and I'm far happier with what I have going on now.

I have subcontractors in several other states and have a hands-on training program set up here in California that many have participated in. It seems to be working so far and no one leaves here without understanding the guidelines and client requirements. The subcontractors who train with me are also included in my marketing program and I send referrals and work their way when agents, brokers, and asset management companies contact me.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> CaliJoe ~
> 
> I agree with you regarding Safeguard to some degree. You won't work at a total loss with Safeguard but you will be busting your butt for less than you will until you get the bigger jobs.
> 
> I terminated my relationship with Safeguard last March due to Chris' line about "office politics". I give an awful lot to the properties we service but I refuse to bend over and walk backwards for anyone, which is the way the relationship ended with Safeguard.
> 
> It is, however, an excellent company to start with and, if you can work with Safeguard, you'll find out you can work with anyone after that.
> 
> They're a great company to get your feet wet with and you'll find out soon enough whether or not you're cut out to be in the industry.
> 
> Just so it's clear to everyone............. I'm not bad-mouthing Safeguard. There are some wonderful people working there but, like any other company, they have their strong points and they have their weak ones.
> 
> My post about Safeguard is based on MY experience and has more to do with management changes than anything else. I have no regrets about terminating them and I have far too much work now to be looking backward and wondering if I made a mistake. I didn't and I'm far happier with what I have going on now.
> 
> I have subcontractors in several other states and have a hands-on training program set up here in California that many have participated in. It seems to be working so far and no one leaves here without understanding the guidelines and client requirements. The subcontractors who train with me are also included in my marketing program and I send referrals and work their way when agents, brokers, and asset management companies contact me.
> 
> Linda


Thanks Linda. I didn't mean at all to make safeguard sound horrible, I too got started with them and worked for many many years, and worked well with Vince and Michael over there. Just making sure that people that are looking to get involved with them know what to expect. 

I had actually left the preservation business completely to start buying and remodeling, but with the economic downturn I am working on rekindling some of those relationships. I am going the Realtor office and small bank route this time around though, trying to minimize the work that I rely on from the big nationals. Any tips that worked for you?:whistling


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## APlusPPGroup

CaliJoe ~

I didn't mean to imply you were saying anything bad. Sorry if there was a misunderstanding.

The only thing I can really tell you is to just get out and make contacts. Pop a business card under the door of each house that appears to be vacant and in need of cleaning up.

I'm very fortunate that there's a lot of work in California. [Unfortunate for the previous homeowners, though, I'm afraid. So I hope no one took that wrong.]

Most agents and brokers don't know who to contact when they get their first REO property. Make yourself known and keep a supply of business cards with you all the time.

When I started my business, I never intended to go nationwide. All I wanted was enough work to stay busy and pay the bills, then have a little left over to set aside for whatever.

Now I'm swamped with contacts and requests from both sides of the industry. Agents & brokers on one side and subcontractors on the other.

I've been putting in 7 days a week, 14 to 18 hours per day for months. I now have 7 employees, just over a dozen subcontractors between all the states I cover, and a new sub flying in for training Sunday night.

I got way more than I ever dreamed of, or bargained for, in this industry. I'm certainly not rich, however, because the money keeps going out for newer and better equipment. And payroll gets paid before the money comes in so there's still something of a deficit in some areas. But, for the most part, it's working. I've been able to put 7 unemployed people to work and my bills are paid so I'm happy.

Now I just need to find a way to get some time off.:w00t:

Linda


[As a side note, my daughter informed me just a moment ago that we can't hire anymore employees because she just used the last 2 folders.:laughing:]


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## APlusPPGroup

Just wanted to give everyone an update here. I've had such an overwhelming response to my posts regarding preservation services that I can't even find time to answer all the e-mails. I apologize to those of you who I haven't contacted.

I'm going on vacation [finally!] the last week of August. I have a great office staff and my field crews can't be beat. But I'll still have a lot to catch up on when I get back so it will be the second week in September when I'll start concentrating on your responses.

In addition to my current preservation company, I just went into a partnership with another well-established subcontractor. Our client base is going to be enormous and we're going ALL nationwide.

If anyone wants to be a part of the subcontractor crew for the partnership, please send me a legible e-mail with your STATE ONLY in the subject line. Nothing else, just the state.

These are the things I'm going to need from anyone who's interested:


Counties you're willing to service, including a list of zip codes with cities;
List of services you can perform;
Photos of 2 projects you've done, including all before & after photos [resized, please, and in a zip file format];
Name, address, company e-mail address, and 2 contact phone numbers for you;
Your availability for 5 days of preservation, photo, and guideline training at your expense in either San Diego or Riverside, California;
Lastly, a website address [if you have one] and how long you've been doing preservation work. [BTW ~ it's okay if you're new]
I can't promise we'll be able to get back with everyone right away because the interview process can take awhile. We'll be interviewing new clients and reviewing their fee schedules at the same time.

There is also no guarantee that there will be work available in your area, no matter how much we market our collective services. We've only come across dry areas a couple of time, though.

Due to the time I have to be away from the office for the training and away from my other crews, we are currently revamping my current training program, and it will no longer be free. It will be offered at a flat rate [including motel, meals, and materials] . Until it's in place, however, the only cost to you will be your own expenses.

So let me know if you're interested and I'll start contacting people the 2nd week of September. You can contact the partnership at [email protected]

Thanks!

Linda


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## Guest

*Thanks for the encouragement!*

Hi Linda,

I recently started a Trash Out Preservation company myself, and yes, for those of you considering starting the business, the out of pocket is important at first while waiting for the banks to process payments. I am still learning, and hoping I will be able to make this business as lucrative as yours. It is growing and I am encouraged to receive inquiries almost daily, after advertising for just over three months now. 

A tip for those starting out.. check out the HUD website, which has some tips on pricing limits and boarding procedures! 

Good luck to you and your companies! Cheers!

Lea


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## Guest

CompleteClean said:


> Hi Linda,
> A tip for those starting out.. check out the HUD website, which has some tips on pricing limits and boarding procedures!
> Lea


I couldn't quite find the information you refer too through the hud.gov website. Can you provide a link or example ?

Thanks
Steve


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## Guest

I wanted to thank Linda for the encouragement on this post and accidentally put it on another post. 

I recently started a Trash-Out Property Preservation company a few months ago. It is hard work as Linda described, and payments do come in slowly. I am working out the kinks, and focusing on the Los Angeles metro and beach vicinities. If you venture out too far, the time and gas adds up and becomes much too costly unless you have a local crew in that area. 

I hope to one day expand the business as Linda has, as I am an engineer and would love to do some future construction design for some of these realtors who would like to see a higher return on their listings. But, many of these REO's are being turned over pretty quickly just to get them off the market, as-is. Hopefully as the real estate market improves, so will the condition in which these homes are sold.. 

I am pleased that there is a niche for the preservation specialist, but I am concerned that there are so many of them, meaning many people are losing their homes. In creating a new business, I'm hoping to also create new opportunities for people who need jobs and eventually want to purchase their own homes. There are so many things I'd like to accomplish with this new venture, that will help others as well.

Thank you Linda!

Lea


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## Guest

*links*



We Fix Houses said:


> I couldn't quite find the information you refer too through the hud.gov website. Can you provide a link or example ?
> 
> Hi Steve,
> 
> I haven't made 15 posts yet to be able provide a link on this forum. Please email me, and I will email you those links.. [email protected]


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## APlusPPGroup

Lea ~

You are SO very welcome for the encouragement.

I wanted to address your comment about there being so many of them. 

While I know you were talking about foreclosures, I'd like to add that the industry is actually becoming saturated with preservation contractors in major metropolitan areas.

If anyone is considering a startup [or already has], you may find a severe shortage of work coming your way due to those who established their presence in the market before you.

Also, one of the things we're ALL coming up against in the field are the inexperienced guys without any type of organized format in which they can legally do business, have no general liability insurance, and hire illegal labor to put more money in their pockets.

Not only do they cut their pricing and take work away from legitimate businesses, they end up [in a lot of cases] doing substandard work with no legal recourse for the banks and brokers when they have to hire another preservation company to do the work.

Eventually, those that are working "under the table" will be caught by the IRS, who routinely audits bank accounts in order to locate people that are doing this.

Banks and brokers ALL require a W-9 and/or a business license, which is helping to stem the flow of work to those who operate "under the table". The SSA gets a copy of their 1099 at the end of the year and, while they may be backed up now, they won't be shortly. From what I understand, they have many more people working on this very problem right now, thanks to this new industry and its rapid growth.

These are just a couple of things to be aware of anyway. We all need to stay informed the best we can so everyone can run a nice, clean operation.

Good luck to all.

Linda


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## Guest

http://www.cubicyard.us/state-guide-1/


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## Guest

*Another question*

Thank you Linda- I'm so glad you addressed the oversaturation. After going through all the avenues I needed to become properly insured (I didn't want to do anything until I knew insurance was in place), and putting in my first few bids, which were quite low to obtain the business, I found that I was still being outbid. Banks are now giving outrageously small limits on the reimbursement amounts. 

For example, a home with dry branches and leaves throughout the backyard needed a thorough yard cleanup.. The bank would only approve $45 for this. What does that cover? Gas, and half an hour of work? They forget there are dumping fees, more than 1/2 hour of labor costs, and materials, such as trash bags, that are used. 

Many times realtors will request a trash out without having inspected the property themselves, so, my question is, as I'd like to be prepared for this since I've been getting requests in areas that may be questionable- what if you arrive at a clean out and find that it was being used for illegal activity, such as drug production and you find parafinalia throughout. How would you handle this in a legal and safe manner? I can't seem to find any information about this.

Thank you!


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## APlusPPGroup

Lea ~

The banks are willing to pay what the vendor is willing to accept. If there's someone who is willing to do it for 1/2 the price, the banks will go with that vendor, regardless of how good the job is.

We take a great deal of pride in our work and make sure that no detail is overlooked. There are areas where we routinely take care of certain items without charging for them. For instance, unless the shrubs are way overgrown, we just include it in the grass cut so that the yard looks like it's being maintained by a professional.

The other guys will just zip in, cut the grass, then leave. If you stick to your pricing and only bend when you feel it's in your best interest in order to do so, then you'll eventually give your reputation as a professional the boost it needs and make the kind of money you should.

I have certain clients that give me a lot of work so I bend and flex as needed. So far, not a single one of them has taken advantage of me and I'm still making a profit. 

Every once in a while I get a loser job but it's usually when the photos from the crew or the subcontractors don't show everything I need to bid. In that case, I stick to my estimate and get the job done, then go on to the next one without giving it another thought. Honoring a contract is a big thing to me.

Moving on to your next issue actually brings up 3 issues, the first one is just advice. 

1. If you receive a request to estimate a trashout [or any other service, including recurring grass cuts] ALWAYS go to the property and take pictures. Never rely on clients' photos to bid the project. They don't see the same things we do and may not get the photos we need.

2. I have several clients that can't get out to the properties fast enough because they receive a lot of listings. They send me a lock change order and know that they can rely on MY photos to show them everything. Again, they need to see what you see. I always send a courtesy estimate for everything I see that needs taken care of and include notes on broken or missing items.

3. If you go to a property and find evidence of drug activity or other illegal goings-on, contact the client immediately and make them aware. In my case, I get as many photos as I can [as quickly as I can], then get out. There's always the possibility that, even though it's not occupied when you get there, people could be on their way back to the house. I think the police have an anonymous hotline you can call to report what you've seen.

Here's something else for everyone to be aware of. There are MANY new asset management companies who will accept you as a vendor, then find ways to refuse or reduce payments for services you've completed. There are others who will go under as fast as they start up. 

And, thanks to the oversaturation, ALL of the asset management companies have plenty of vendors to choose from. So they can hire you, refuse to pay you, then move on to the next "victim" anytime they like. I've already been burned a couple of times and fired one of the asset management companies last March.

So, for those thinking about getting started just be sure you think about what you're getting into very carefully. Not everyone can weather some of the storms that can whip up without warning. 

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Lea ~
> And, thanks to the oversaturation, ALL of the asset management companies have plenty of vendors to choose from. So they can hire you, refuse to pay you, then move on to the next "victim" anytime they like. I've already been burned a couple of times and fired one of the asset management companies last March.
> 
> So, for those thinking about getting started just be sure you think about what you're getting into very carefully. Not everyone can weather some of the storms that can whip up without warning.
> 
> Linda


Be sure you know how to lien the house within the statutory time frame to insure payment. You should be paid prior 90 - 120 days to avoid this.

Steve


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## APlusPPGroup

Excellent advice on knowing how to file prelims in order to protect yourself. The asset management companies, however, will NOT give up the information needed to follow through without a fight. 

One thing to consider regarding liens is that your work could be cut way back due to prelims being filed. No one likes to think about the possibility of liens being filed and legitimate companies don't have the time to keep up with them anymore than you do, if you're really busy.

I've got invoices on the books dating back 6 months from an asset management company right now whose system had a breakdown. I've lost my rights to lien but can still cause the AM to have to come all the way to California to go to small claims court if I feel they're jerking me around.

I'm working on the old unpaid invoices right now and, hopefully, won't have to go that route.

Time will tell.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Looking for some info. please help*

I do property preservation in california. I just got a property that has a old single wide trailor in the back yard that needs to go, any ideas on how to legaly remove this. The only thing I can come up with is bidding the time and scrapping it on the property and dumping it at the dump and recycling whatever I can out of it, but then im stuck with the frame. Any feed back would be appreciated.

Also anyone know the proper way to remove cars. I lost a bid because the bank wanted someone with lein sale/towing capabilities, I'm somewhat new to this and didnt quite understand. I was going to have a scrap company come and tow the car. 
Thanks for your time.


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## APlusPPGroup

Ryan ~

Where in California are you located? Every area and every bank has different ways of doing things. If you want, e-mail me and I'll do my best to help you out.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

BTW ~ I'm currently looking for a reliable preservation company in Placerville, California. Work will include all areas within a 50 mile radius of Placerville as well.

Contact me at [email protected] and put "Placerville, CA" in the subject line so I can get back with you quicker.

Thanks!

Linda


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## Guest

*Linda*

Thanks for the offer but thats to far. I'm in southern California, I operate out of Murrieta.


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## Guest

For anyone considering contacting Linda for potential work, go ahead. Linda is a quality gal! We haven't had the pleasure of meeting face to face yet, but we are working on some estimates together and she is great. 

Thanks Linda for your valuable insight :thumbsup:


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## APlusPPGroup

Ryan ~

The offer of work in Placerville was a general posting.

I just responded to your e-mail. Thanks!

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Angel ~

I'm looking forward to meeting you very soon. Thanks so much for the kind words and I hope the jobs you're estimating for me come through for you!

It's definitely a pleasure working with a professional.:thumbup:

Linda


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## Guest

*reo properties*

if any of you guys need a good sub contractor in the central valley,contact me, i am a licensed b contractor,looking for some work. i would also like to get into the property preservation industry, i have alot of experiance in fire and water restoration,and i think this wouldnt be that much different. if any of you know how to get on venders list,that would be good also. thank you!


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## Guest

First of all, thank you so much Linda for all that information. Those are the exact things I'm learning, and it looks like you've been through it already. So it's very comforting to know that I'm going in the right direction. Patience, integrity, and fairness is a big plus for me. Thank you!

As far as removing that camper.. since it is personal property, it should be removed by someone who is able to place a lien on it by contacting the registered owner. I had a situation with an abandoned boat, and wouldn't touch it, since I don't have an impound location in which to store it, or the means or knowledge to place a lien, yet. I did find a person who will remove the property for free, and takes care of all of that. If you would like that information, please email me. I'm not sure if I should post his info on a blog, but I'll be happy to share it with anyone who is looking for someone who can remove these items legally, here in the southern California area.

[email protected]


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## Guest

Hi all. I'm in the process of getting my business up and running and just took out a general liablity insurance policy. My question is, is it recommended to be bonded as well? If so, how much? Thanks for any feedback.


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## APlusPPGroup

chip4506 said:


> Hi all. I'm in the process of getting my business up and running and just took out a general liablity insurance policy. My question is, is it recommended to be bonded as well? If so, how much? Thanks for any feedback.


Chip ~

Being bonded is not a requirement for the preservation industry. But it DOES look nice on paper and is very inexpensive. Potential clients see it as a guarantee that they have recourse against you should one of your employees steal something from them.

One nice thing about working in foreclosed homes, though, is that there is usally nothing but trash and the properties are unoccupied. Very rarely is there any personal property to steal.

What you'd want is not a construction or license bond but an employee dishonesty bond, the going rate being around $100 to $120 per year. I've been bonded since day 1.

Here's something else you all might want to know. E & O, or Errors & Omissions, is a contractual insurance. It covers potential harm to the client if the contract isn't followed to a "T". I've never seen the point in carrying it because property cleanup does not require a contract. 

Most asset management companies, however, are requiring it these days. But it's expensive and I just turn down the companies that want me to have it. I have enough business without the extra expense of E & O.

Good luck to you, Chip. Sorry I haven't replied to your e-mail yet but my company is shifting its focus away from asset management companies and there's a lot involved in terminating them. I've been so busy with agents and brokers' jobs lately that it's hard for me to respond to everyone who writes.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

I just put a photo album together here at CT of a plexiglass board up we did recently. If anyone wants to see it, click on the Photos link above. 

In looking at the photos, they all uploaded in reverse order. So you might have to view the progress from the bottom up. [And, yes, that's me doing the board up.]

I work in the field with my crew all the time and will try to post a few albums of the different things we do. Hopefully, it will help a lot of you who are interested in property preservation work.

We'll be doing a pool drain today and I'll have photos to post over the next couple of days. BTW ~ in California, pool covers are not legal per HUD guidelines.

Enjoy!

Linda


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## Guest

Thanks so much Linda! Is there a company you can recommend for the "dishonesty" bond?


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## APlusPPGroup

chip4506 said:


> Thanks so much Linda! Is there a company you can recommend for the "dishonesty" bond?


Chip ~

You're in California, right? Contact my agent, Dottie, at Allstate. Her phone number is (408) 465-2392. She's the best agent I've ever worked with and she can get you hooked up with a bonding company.

Linda


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## Guest

*Property Preservation*

My wife is a real estate agent and she is now doing BPOs for the REO companies. I a handyman and would like to start a property preservation company. Do I need to get a contractors license in order to start working and does the insurance company require a contractor's license to issue a general liability insurance policy? What's the best insurance companies would you suggest to use for the insurance policy? Thank you very much and I appreciate your help.


----------



## Guest

nuvision said:


> My wife is a real estate agent and she is now doing BPOs for the REO companies. I a handyman and would like to start a property preservation company. Do I need to get a contractors license in order to start working and does the insurance company require a contractor's license to issue a general liability insurance policy? What's the best insurance companies would you suggest to use for the insurance policy? Thank you very much and I appreciate your help.


Great question! I was wondering the same thing. Someone please help with this.:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

*I have a qustion Linda*

Linda,

I am in the process of starting my own property preservation company. I think I have all of the work methods down except one. I was curious if I could get your advice on the best method for entering a home for the first time. Ive been told to drill the lock out, and other methods of the sorts. How do you tackle this task? 

Thank you




a1propertyclean said:


> Jonathan ~
> 
> I own 2 property preservation businesses. There's a lot of up front money involved if you want to do it right. You'll need general liability insurance, decent equipment, fuel, equipment rental, and labor. A website wouldn't hurt either, even a simple one like mine. Plus, you can go weeks without substantial work until everyone knows you're out there.
> 
> It was a terrific struggle to get to where we are now but, if you're determined enough, send me an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll see if I can help.
> 
> I cover 5 counties in Southern California, the tri-state area of Nevada, Arizona, and California, and will soon have another startup out of Idaho.
> 
> I have an awesome crew and the best, most efficient office staff. But it was awhile before I could hire the right labor because the money is slow coming in. Now I offer 30, 60, and 90 day terms and payment plans to lenders and brokers.
> 
> I hope all that doesn't scare you off. There's a lot of work out there for the right type of person. If it didn't scare you off, contact me.
> 
> Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Carlos ~

There are many methods of gaining access to a house. 

I do about 90% of the lock changes for my company and I really don't like drilling all that much. 

I always look for an open door, window, or doggie door. Yes, doggie door. I fit through most of them. Just crawl through and unlock the front door. And I've gone head first through high bathroom windows, too. [Nearly ended up in a nasty toilet one time.]

One you're familiar with, and have enough of, the standard key codes try your keys in all the locks. Sometimes the previous preservation crew has already re-keyed the house for the previous broker or asset manager. You'd be surprised at how many times this has worked for me.

All in all, I only end up drilling about 1% to 2% of all the properties I change the locks on.:thumbup:

There are a lot of other methods but I won't list them here. Burglars have enough of their own info, they don't need mine.:no:

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Thank You Linda!*

Thank you for your advice. Im starting to see that their are plenty of alternatives to entering a home, other than breaking in. I have another quick question, since you seem very knowledgeable in this industry. I just got accepted as a vendor with Safeguard, and I should be getting work orders by tomorrow, or so. My question is, did I make a bad choice in choosing Safeguard as a start off point for my company, should I have gone with First American. The reason I ask is because Ive been told that First American pays better, and more quickly as well? 


Thanks,
Carlos.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Carlos ~

Safeguard is NOT a bad choice for a starting point. It's a VERY good way to get your feet wet. 

I'm having issues with First Am right now. I'm going back and forth with them because of non-payment and short-payment issues and have been shifting my focus away from asset management companies. I'm concentrating on offering my services to agents, brokers, and banks.

Asset management companies have their upside and their downside. Once you have an issue with even one person at the administrative level, there are residual penalties imposed on you regarding future work, even if the problem is because someone on their end failed to do their job.

In my case, someone in their office didn't do my address change when I moved, which would have taken less than 30 seconds. As a result, I did not receive a check for 4 weeks and had no way to take care of all the work they gave me by the end of that 4 weeks. No money for gas, trucks, trailers, dump fees, or labor. They nearly shut me down and didn't even care.

Then, since the work was behind, they pulled work from me that I'd already completed and gave it to another vendor. As a result, there's a vendor out there who got paid $1,800 and didn't even have to do the work. I've been fighting that one since day 1. 

One of the missing checks went to my ex-partner's residence, thanks to the Post Office. It never has shown up anywhere so I assume he's just holding it out of spite. The other 3 showed up within a day or two of the replacement checks from First Am.

By the time I received my payment, they had lumped everything into a check so large the bank held it for another 10 days. Thank goodness I have a good relationship with my bank and they were able to release $5,000 to me the day of the deposit and another $5,000 2 days before the end of the hold. The other $15,000 was sorely needed by that time to pay my subcontractors who had also been waiting for payment.

This, of course, gave my ex-partner another way to undermine my operation, which he was already trying to destroy because of his jealousy. He's cost me 2 subcontractors and 2 employees, has sabotaged both of my trucks and half of my equipment. I have video of him showing up at 3 am here at my house.

Fortunately, I'm strong and so is my business. Once all the other partnership battles are resolved, he'll be facing libel and slander suits. In the meantime, I have a business to run and don't have time for his nonsense.

Things in this industry are not always easy, to say the least. Remember there's always someone around the corner who can hurt you as easily as help you.

As in every business, there are good people and there are bad people. So, keep in mind that even the simplest of problems can turn into big ones faster than you can form the thought.

Sorry for the book, Carlos. Your question touched a sensitive spot regarding First Am and I felt it necessary to warn people that things happen. You can easily go from being paid "weekly" to being paid "weakly".

Linda


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## Guest

*Getting Started!!*

Hello all. I'm trying to get started in the property preservation business and I want to start off by doing everything right the first time. This board has helped me tremendously! My question is, do I need to get a contractors license in order to start working? My plan is to do some of the work but mainly my focus will be growing the business and handling the administrative side of it. I am also a real estate investor and I have several contractors that are able to do most if not all of the labor. Thanks for any advice that you can give. 

Jay~


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## Guest

*prop preservation!*

if any of you need a good sub contractor in the central valley, calif. e mail me, im fully licensed and insured! also i can do any and all repairs,


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## Guest

*Good Advice!*

Wow that sounds like some ordeal that you got yourself into. Im starting to see that their is potential for this business being very lucrative, unfortunately you have to have some access to money at all times, especially when your dealing with companies who take forever to pay. As far as my company goes, well we are only days into being in business. To tell you the truth so far Safeguard has treated me right. On top of that Im advertising with agents, and banks, etc..so that I may have as many job opportunities as possible. This business is very exciting, especially since its my first start up after college. I knew I was going to have to go into a business in which I could bring my father along. You see he has been a wood framer his whole life. So here I was with a college degree, either I could have gone and worked in the corporate world, or attempted to do something that me and my father could benefit from. Im glad I chose the latter, for my father would have been completely out of work. Their I go now ranting on forever. Anyhow you truly seem like the go to woman in this industry, and I am grateful to have you on the other side of the computer to listen...



Sincerely,


Carlos Rodarte, owner
RODA CONSTRUCTION


a1propertyclean said:


> Carlos ~
> 
> Safeguard is NOT a bad choice for a starting point. It's a VERY good way to get your feet wet.
> 
> I'm having issues with First Am right now. I'm going back and forth with them because of non-payment and short-payment issues and have been shifting my focus away from asset management companies. I'm concentrating on offering my services to agents, brokers, and banks.
> 
> Asset management companies have their upside and their downside. Once you have an issue with even one person at the administrative level, there are residual penalties imposed on you regarding future work, even if the problem is because someone on their end failed to do their job.
> 
> In my case, someone in their office didn't do my address change when I moved, which would have taken less than 30 seconds. As a result, I did not receive a check for 4 weeks and had no way to take care of all the work they gave me by the end of that 4 weeks. No money for gas, trucks, trailers, dump fees, or labor. They nearly shut me down and didn't even care.
> 
> Then, since the work was behind, they pulled work from me that I'd already completed and gave it to another vendor. As a result, there's a vendor out there who got paid $1,800 and didn't even have to do the work. I've been fighting that one since day 1.
> 
> One of the missing checks went to my ex-partner's residence, thanks to the Post Office. It never has shown up anywhere so I assume he's just holding it out of spite. The other 3 showed up within a day or two of the replacement checks from First Am.
> 
> By the time I received my payment, they had lumped everything into a check so large the bank held it for another 10 days. Thank goodness I have a good relationship with my bank and they were able to release $5,000 to me the day of the deposit and another $5,000 2 days before the end of the hold. The other $15,000 was sorely needed by that time to pay my subcontractors who had also been waiting for payment.
> 
> This, of course, gave my ex-partner another way to undermine my operation, which he was already trying to destroy because of his jealousy. He's cost me 2 subcontractors and 2 employees, has sabotaged both of my trucks and half of my equipment. I have video of him showing up at 3 am here at my house.
> 
> Fortunately, I'm strong and so is my business. Once all the other partnership battles are resolved, he'll be facing libel and slander suits. In the meantime, I have a business to run and don't have time for his nonsense.
> 
> Things in this industry are not always easy, to say the least. Remember there's always someone around the corner who can hurt you as easily as help you.
> 
> As in every business, there are good people and there are bad people. So, keep in mind that even the simplest of problems can turn into big ones faster than you can form the thought.
> 
> Sorry for the book, Carlos. Your question touched a sensitive spot regarding First Am and I felt it necessary to warn people that things happen. You can easily go from being paid "weekly" to being paid "weakly".
> 
> Linda


----------



## Guest

Hell Everyone

My name is Steve Licensed Electricial and small knowledgeable General Contractor, most of the General Contracting I limit to establishe Electrical Customers.................Long story short. I want to Funnel my skills and knowledge into starting a Property Management Company. I'm sure there is alot of u guys who have been around and understand my ambitions. All advice would be greatly appreciated...thanks


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## Guest

*software needed for prop. pres. biz*

Does anyone have any suggestions or recommendations for accounting software for property preservation business? purpose of use: invoicing, budgeting, client/account management, etc.


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## APlusPPGroup

Mchelle ~

Quickbooks Pro does an outrageous job of keeping everything organized the way the properties need to be. You can even run a separate profit and loss by customer, by subcontractor, or by property.

Linda


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## Guest

*safeguard and first am*

We've applied to first am and safeguard, but haven't heard from anyone in a few weeks, how long does it typically take to become a vendor, if anyone knows?

Thanks
Branden


----------



## Guest

having trouble uploading multiple photos to contractor web. any ideas


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## Guest

*How to start a property preservation company?*

I bought,rehabbed, and resold foreclosures for 8 years that I bought off the courthouse steps. I did the appraisals,evictions, and rehabbing to get ready to put back on the market as well. I'm starting a property preservation company and am offering all the services including BPO's. I've been filling out all the online vendor applications for many different asset management companies but haven't heard anything from anyone as of yet....is this to be expected? Also, I'm trying to figure out the pricing structure for the different services? I'm located in Atlanta and am trying to service about a 100 mile radius. Thanks in advance for any comments or suggestions


----------



## APlusPPGroup

For all of those who are complaining about not being contacted for work, please review what I said before about the major metropolitan areas being saturated with vendors.

It doesn't mean you won't work, it just means it could be a very long time before you see any. The industry is NOT the cash cow it once was and, for those who are willing to hang in there through thick and thin, it could pan out. For those that can't afford the startup costs while waiting for work, I recommend you find employment to get you through until you can.

Here's something else to consider: At the time I'm writing this, there have been 9,274 views at this particular thread. Only 65 posts have been created.

So, out of the 9,274 views, how many of those who *DO NOT POST* found the information that's been posted here to jump ahead of you in the asset management game?

I'm not trying to be sarcastic or a doom predictor of any sort. I'm being realistic. It's a tough industry to get into anymore and only a few hundred will be successful at it. And only about 50% of those will still be working when the foreclosures are gone. Do you *REALLY* have what it takes or will you just ride the wave and move on to something new when it's over?

To those of you contacting me, hang in there. I've got something in the works for when my company goes nationwide. But it's a slow process for me, too, although I'm already established and working for several large asset management companies.

I've got new clients coming in but *PLEASE* be patient. And if I don't respond right away it's because I'm busy working my fanny off in the field, while still holding down the fort in the office.

Just a quick note regarding e-mails to me: if you don't give me contact information or the items I've previously requested, your e-mail has been automatically going into my "rejection" folder. 

If I don't know where the heck you are or how to contact you outside of an e-mail, why should I bother? One thing I've learned is that, when people don't read or follow the simplest of directions, they are quite often difficult to train and/or get quality work out of. 

So ............ find my list and try to give me what I ask for, okay?

For all I know, you could be my competitors right down the street who keep trying to find out how I run my operation so they can undercut me. And, believe me, it happens all the time and, for that reason, I don't give anyone my pricing anymore. You can get what you need from the guidelines, just like I did.

Everyone has my information so please be considerate enough to give me yours in return.

And to those I'm already working with, *THANK YOU* all very much. You're doing a wonderful job and I'm happy to be associated with you.

Signed........................... exhausted in Riverside.:yawn:

Linda


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## Guest

*Insurance*

Hi.. Can anyone tell me what a good rate for 1 million GL and 500 Error and Omission Insurance is. I am also looking for a company in Florida if you know of any. Hey, while I am at it, if there is any national companies that are looking for a contractor in the tampa / Fort Meyers area in FL, give me a shout .. Thanks.. Have a great day:thumbup:


----------



## Guest

Branden0077 said:


> We've applied to first am and safeguard, but haven't heard from anyone in a few weeks, how long does it typically take to become a vendor, if anyone knows?
> 
> Thanks
> Branden


It depends if there is a need in your area. Safeguard has zones that they assign to contractors and they usually have a waiting list. They also have a high turnover rate because of the low pay and strict requirements. I applied with them in July 08 and was told they did not have a need for my services at that time but then they called in August and asked how quick I can start. They do require you to take a 64 question all essay answer test on HUD, VA, FreddieMac, etc regulations and you have to pay for a background check. They do have considerable insurance requirements also. Nobody will get rich working for Safeguard but its not a bad cash flow supplement if you have got an existing business and want to keep your guys working until things pick up.


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## brm1109

I currently own a licensed and insured trash removal/clean-out company in Northern New Jersey. I am looking to get into cleaning properties for banks and so forth. Anyone know the best way of getting into this?


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Mchelle ~
> 
> Quickbooks Pro does an outrageous job of keeping everything organized the way the properties need to be. You can even run a separate profit and loss by customer, by subcontractor, or by property.
> 
> Linda


 
Linda, thank you so much for the info. My husband and I started our property preservation business about two weeks now. I've read a number of your posts and that of some of the other members! We've completed two jobs thus far. From the agent we're currently workind with to the insurance company we've been told that we do great work and our material is thorough and very professional-looking. Thanks to everyone that have unknowingly helped us avoid many of the problems when starting a business. The learning curve is priceless. Hopefully we will have our website up and running within the week. 

Michelle 
1 Extreme Cleaning LLC


----------



## Guest

Hello to everyone !!

I just wanted to get more info on how to do work directly with the bank or through fannie mae,hud... i have been working with several companies now and generate decent income, but would like to eliminate the middle men  if anyone has some helpful advice please let me know, i am in the state of missouri.

As for all the beginers i could recomend field asset services they are one of the greatest companies i had worked with so far


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## Guest

*Massachusetts*

Hey everybody, This site is awesome, filled with so much great info from so many people. I am licensed General Contractor in Massachusetts. Anybody have any companies they could recommend, I am looking for work in the Ma area. I have done some preservation work and rehab for local credit union and I am familiar with HUD guidelines. Looking for company to start out with be national or local. Any info would be much appreciated. Thanks ahead


----------



## Guest

billybl35 said:


> Hey everybody, This site is awesome, filled with so much great info from so many people. I am licensed General Contractor in Massachusetts. Anybody have any companies they could recommend, I am looking for work in the Ma area. I have done some preservation work and rehab for local credit union and I am familiar with HUD guidelines. Looking for company to start out with be national or local. Any info would be much appreciated. Thanks ahead


You should try field asset services i started out with them, if they sign you up as a vendor you will get alot of work from them, mostly property preservation and some minor repairs, but make sure you sign up for a rehab vendor as well.

Next company I would recomend would be Cyprexx services, though them you will be able to get alot of rehab work, so far i did 6 rehabs for them in a 4 month period. But make sure you are ready to do these rehabs for them. Example... if they approve two of your rehabs at the same time you will have about a month to get them done and you will have to cover all the cost for that property and once you are done you will have to wait about two weeks before you get paid.. so it may be a bit frustrating but its worth it, they pay good.


----------



## Guest

*Thanks*

Hey Edin , 

Thanks for the info. In your experience, how long does Field Asset Services usually take to pay? I am new to this Hud, FHA work but thanks to this site I am learning. With these bigger companies such as Field Asset and the others, how does it work generally, once you are signed on as a vendor do they send you work in which you go look at and submit a bid or do they say this is what has to be done and this is what it pays, you want it or not? Up to now I work on word of mouth, give price and do job but with this economy nobody is spending. I figure with all the forclosures in my area, thereare tons of them, may be time for a change.
I am familiar with the Hud guidelines and cost schedule. What is the normal"discount" you give M&M it appears to be 30% give or take?

Thanks again, and anybody that can offer any info on this venture I really appreciate it.
OH before I forget, anybody use REOTRANS.com? What is your opinion of them? Thanks....Bill


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## Guest

*Five Brothers?*

Anybody work with five brothers for preservation work??? How are they? Pay on time etc... Thanks:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

Hey Billy,

Field Assets pays you a month from the date your invoice is approved and honestly they are the best company i had worked with, they are a bit strict but thats why they are able to get alot of work, they want everything done perfectly.

How it works with them, call them and get the operator to connect you to the vendor manager for your state. Tell them you are interested in becoming a vendor in your state make sure you get a list of all counties and zip codes you will be able to cover. You will also be required to have 1mil general liabilty and E&O insurance, but E&O you can purchase through them for very cheap, plus you dont have to pay for it they can just deduct it from your invoice.

Once they sign you up as a vendor you will be provided with all your login info, everything is done online. It will be or it may be a week or two before you get any work, but when something shows up in your area they will call you, tell you what they have, example; a full trashout.. meaning all the debris in and out, rekey, grass cut, janitorial, winterization, lock box.. they will provide a lock box for you free of charge. If they call you today and give you a trashout they will overnight your lockbox.. sometimes they will forget so just call them let them know and they will ship it. 

When you get to the property you have to figure out about how much cyds. of debris is there and then call the coordinator so he can adjust the price for you. You dont realy have to bid anything, you just have to get to the property and not remove any debris before they adjust your price.

Im not sure if this info is helpful, but when you do start with them you can contact me with all the questions that you may have. They are a great company to work with and i am sure you will generate a steady income with them. Good luck to you


----------



## Guest

Thanks Much Eden. I really appreciate the advice. I am contacting them tommorow to get the ball rolling, Dive in. Hopefully they will have good amount of work here in Massachusetts. I appreciate the offer to cotact you after I start with them, I will take you up on it...Anyway thanks again


----------



## Guest

I have done work with some of the large service companies and have made a little money at it. But if you are not prepared to have days of big loss, and pounding your head against the wall this work is not for you. These properties are after all largely owned by the same banks that cried to the feds for a bailout, and they dont want to have to spend anymore of YOUR money than necessary to keep these properties from falling through (theyre just trying to save up for those executive bonuses). $75 for a full winterization, $32.50 per cubic yard for debris removal, oh yeah were in the money. That cubic yardage fee includes the removal of feces, so say you scrape a five gallon bucket full of dung off the floor... you just made a wopping $2.00!! Sweet!! Good luck and dont let these jokers jerk you around, after all they are playing with money that was taken from taxpayers. :blink:


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## Guest

*Property Preservation Companies*

There are lists available for REO service companies. But a good one that we've contracted with is REO allegiance out of New Jersey. They're on the up & up and have a ton of financial contacts. 
It's easy to register on their site as an available contractor.


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## APlusPPGroup

*A Lesson in Ethics*

Okay, folks. This is going to be a lesson in ethics. Please, please, please don't allow it to happen to you. Going along with something like this can make or break your reputation in the industry, not to mention you could be the target for numerous lawsuits.

The conversation is likely to get even more interesting as new posts are added and you'll get the chance to see responses about an unethical broker by ETHICAL brokers.

*"Broker Interfered w/Trashout ~ Unethical Conduct? Conflict of Interest?"*

http://www.agentsonline.net/forums/...e_Broker_Interfered_w_Trashou.html#Post261799

It's even likely that the unethical broker will be provoked to defend himself, although I haven't mentioned any names. And it will be interesting to see what kind of dirt he'll throw back on me.

If he does, it will almost assuredly be libelous in nature. If you post, be careful what you post. This is a very strong forum.

Enjoy!

Linda


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## Guest

What do you think about marketing service to real estate agents or RE firms for REO repairs or say an agent has a client ready to purchase an REO, but needs repairs? Could there be an opportunity there?


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## APlusPPGroup

*Fox Network in Chicago Needs Local PP Vendor to Interview*

One of the producers at the Fox Network in Chicago has asked me to find a preservation contractor in their local area to interview.

Anyone interested? Just send your information to me via e-mail, along with a brief background of how you got started and where the industry has taken you. This way I can forward it to the producer.

This could be a good opportunity for the right vendor. I look forward to watching [or reading] the interview.









Linda


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## Guest

*Info on hud*

:thumbup: Hi all, i was wondering if anyone could give me the info=
on how to get on with hud for property preservation?=A0 I have been trying=
to figure out how for about 6 months now and i found this site which some =
of the conversation have answered so many questions i had.=A0 My soon to be=
husband has been doing this for about 6 six years and honestly he doesnt k=
now anything i ask him.=A0 I want technicals and he left all that up to his=
mom and she got her answers from her boss which is a broker and well ya kn=
ow it is crazy!=A0 As it has for everyone work has slowed down so we are ju=
st trying to pick up some extras and that info would be greatly appreciated=

Tammy


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## Guest

Hey every body,

Wondering if anyone can help out real quick. Under an initial secure order per hud guidelines are we the contractor authorized to remove personals automatically? I see alot says yes alot sys depending..Anyone know for sure what the protocol is??? Thanks alot for all the help........Bill


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## Guest

Alot of the information on property preservation includes evictions as a service offered/required...What exactly would be required for a pp company to perform this service? Would the pp company be required to notify police etc to physically remove the tenant/homeowner? We are a FL Certified Building Contractor doing remodels and additions, also a InterNachi certied inspector, and see a need for pp in our area due to the large amount of foreclosures. Any advice on getting started in pp would be appreciated. Thanks in advance for any info...Have a great day


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## Guest

Tammylj said:


> :thumbup: Hi all, i was wondering if anyone could give me the info=
> on how to get on with hud for property preservation?
> Tammy


 
Go to HUD site, all the info is there for you. You also need insurance, a truck and lots of tools that real contractors would have


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## Guest

Brickie said:


> Go to HUD site, all the info is there for you. You also need insurance, a truck and lots of tools that real contractors would have


This is like a shark feeding frenzy. I wonder how many people with no contracting experience are trying to get into this now, because of the current economic conditions.


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## Guest

lawndart said:


> This is like a shark feeding frenzy. I wonder how many people with no contracting experience are trying to get into this now, because of the current economic conditions.


From what I've read here and in other forums, quite a bit. Just like the goofs that watch a few episodes of "Flip this House" and then decide that they are now "experts" on contracting, they're all in for a rude awakening.:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Guest

Brickie said:


> From what I've read here and in other forums, quite a bit. Just like the goofs that watch a few episodes of "Flip this House" and then decide that they are now "experts" on contracting, they're all in for a rude awakening.:laughing::laughing::laughing:


I've considered getting into this business Brickie, as you well know I've got all the big boy tools lol. Can you offer me any type of advice? Is this business really worth it? Is there a bunch of paperwork involved? What should I look out for when approaching a company for work?

Thanks in advance :thumbsup:


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## Guest

> I've considered getting into this business Brickie, as you well know I've got all the big boy tools lol. Can you offer me any type of advice? Is this business really worth it?


I wouldn't quit my daytime job if I were you.:laughing:

Here's what it supposedly pays in your neck of the woods:

http://www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/...e_required=Please+identify+a+State.&x=21&y=12


Keep in in mind, the allowables listed above doesn't include any "fees" (usually around 25-30%) that are deducted off the top from the big boys for turning you on to the gigs. 

As someone previously posted, the big boys like to take forever to pay, or they short pay and your admin costs go thru the roof trying to collect from them:furious:

If you decide to to do PP Lawndart, I would recommend doing it to enhance your existing business.


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## Guest

Thanks for the info Brickie :thumbsup:.


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## Guest

Oh my! Feeding Frenzy! Someone quick, where is my local hud agency located.:thumbup:

Bravo to you Linda, sounds like you have a good business out there in CALI.


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## APlusPPGroup

D.A.S.Anthony said:


> Oh my! Feeding Frenzy! Someone quick, where is my local hud agency located.:thumbup:
> 
> Bravo to you Linda, sounds like you have a good business out there in CALI.


 
LOL. Thank you for that. And to Lawndart and Brickie, thanks for the entertainment. :clap:

Okay, just a quick update on the ethics issue. I'm doing the interiew with NBC tomorrow to talk about "conduct unbecoming a broker" and will explain personal property guidelines, among a few other things.

I don't know when the interview will air. I don't know how the media will present the story. I don't know, and am not concerned, how the interview will affect my reputation or business in the future.

Right now, all I'm concerned with is making sure other vendors [yeah, you guys here] just getting into the business don't get put in a position such as the one I just went through.

So off I go to get my beauty rest.:sleep1: I have a feeling they might be a little rough on me during the interview if they want a good story.

Wish me luck tomorrow!

Linda


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## Guest

*Adding another iron to the fire!*

This is quite the popular thread! I found this site by accident, like a lot of others, while searching for info on property preservations. Currently Safeguard has a zone available in my area which I am interested in. I am little hesitant though, and would love to speak with someone who has done business with this company. I have a few questions which I would feel more comfortable hearing answered from another contractor.


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## Guest

morton, what would you like to know? We've been doing P&P with Safeguard for awhile, love it.


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## Guest

Hi have anyone ever worked for Five Brothers Mortgage Services out of Michigan? Do they pay you on time?
let me know, they want to hire me.


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## Guest

*Five Brothers Mortgage Services Out Of Michigan*

Hi have anyone ever worked for this company, if so, do they pay you on time.

They want to hire my service as a field inspector and contractor.

If anyone know anything about this company let me know
thanks:thumbsup:


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## Guest

*Help in PA*



a1propertyclean said:


> LOL. Thank you for that. And to Lawndart and Brickie, thanks for the entertainment. :clap:
> 
> Okay, just a quick update on the ethics issue. I'm doing the interiew with NBC tomorrow to talk about "conduct unbecoming a broker" and will explain personal property guidelines, among a few other things.
> 
> I don't know when the interview will air. I don't know how the media will present the story. I don't know, and am not concerned, how the interview will affect my reputation or business in the future.
> 
> Right now, all I'm concerned with is making sure other vendors [yeah, you guys here] just getting into the business don't get put in a position such as the one I just went through.
> 
> So off I go to get my beauty rest.:sleep1: I have a feeling they might be a little rough on me during the interview if they want a good story.
> 
> Wish me luck tomorrow!
> 
> Linda


 
Good Afternoon Linda,

I too am a woman owned contracting company in PA. I was wondering if we could talk by email sometime on how I can go about adding this type of service to our portfolio. I know we have the insurances and of course all the tools and experience, but I dont quite know where to go from there.

Any help would be awsome.....

Thanks in advance and have a great day!

Angie


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## APlusPPGroup

Hi, Jesse ~

I was going to send an e-mail to you but your address is not listed. Go ahead and contact me at [email protected].

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Hi, Jesse ~
> 
> I was going to send an e-mail to you but your address is not listed. Go ahead and contact me at [email protected].
> 
> Linda


Hi Linda,

I just sent an email to you! 

Hope to talk soon,

Angie


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## Guest

Ive read every word in this thread and am not sure what to think about this business. I originally(a while ago)thought about PP to supplement work in the winter time and such but it almost seems like the money is not worth it. If the guidelines say $1500 max per property is this like 1 days work? Then figure fuel, labor, dump fees and everything else it doesnt seem to add up to much, and how often can you charge that much anyway.


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## Guest

*Link or links to HUD specs on preservation*

I am looking for a link or links to any sites that have specific specs on what HUD requires as far as processes of preservation. I did find some info that was from 2nd parties, but from the source is better to go on. TKS


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## Guest

lynnwood said:


> I am looking for a link or links to any sites that have specific specs on what HUD requires as far as processes of preservation. I did find some info that was from 2nd parties, but from the source is better to go on. TKS


 
Have you tried the HUD site?


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## Guest

*property preservation*

Hi All,

I just started up my property preservation business! I have experience in closely related fields. My question is, how to obtain business..And should I obtain insurance right now..I found two links to vendors but they require insurance. Is there anyway to break into the business starting out with no insurance and if so who do I contact to get going!

Any and all assistance is appreciated!
[email protected]


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## APlusPPGroup

sandiegopmr said:


> I found two links to vendors but they require insurance. Is there anyway to break into the business starting out with no insurance and if so who do I contact to get going!


Absolutely not! 

Everyone requires it, including me. I am added as additional insured on every vendor's policy and if the insurance lapses, I'm notified by the insurance company. I suspend the vendor until I receive a reinstatement. If it happens twice, I terminate them. No ifs, ands, or buts about it.

I'm not going to risk losing a business that I've put my heart & soul into for anyone and I doubt you're going to find anyone else who will.

I wish you luck in your new venture but I definitely advise against doing it without insurance.

Linda


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## Guest

Thanks Linda!!

I'm completing the application for General Liability today and will return it to my agent tomorrow..I was advised he could turn it around and have coverage bound in24 hours.
Any suggestions on how to obtain work?


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## Guest

i've dont it before, but its almost NET 30 or NET45 payments

and they pay fixed rates

$50 for winterizing
$30 for lawn cuts
$50 for 1story ranch junk clean outs, etc


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## Guest

Some thoughts,
National companies are a waste of time and money.
Payment has gone fron 30 days to 3-6 months in the last year, this is across the board.
As linda stated, things are a changing, big time. I lost 2 major accounts to national companies (thats why for the 1st time in 15 years I am fighting for work). also - expect about 10-20% of the invoices to be "lost".

That being said - I love this business.
Yes- you need insurance, yes- you need the business lic. dictated by your state (in MD it ia a MHIC lic), and yes- it would help if you knew what you are doing. You can learn on the job, put it can be costly, trust me, I know.
Good luck and do not give up

Nick


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Hey, Nick ~

Nice to see you here. Also noticed you were able to fix your website. Good deal.:clap:

Just to let everyone know, work is slow everywhere. We haven't done a trashout since early December ourselves ~ lots of winterizations, water heater straps, and a few lock changes but no big jobs.

Not only does a lack of work not generate income for the next month but it affects the scheduling of my training classes, since the first day of training is in the field working on a trashout.

Hang in there. It's going to pick up soon. I've been doing tons of estimates but the banks are slow in approving them right now, too. I think they're being cautious and keeping as much money in their pockets as they possibly can.

Linda


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## Guest

Hey Linda,
One thing in this business that is constant is change.
AM's come and go daily, resurface years later.

This is My 15th year, up untill 6 months ago, I never had to advertise, not even a business card, I was riding on my reputation and contacts I had built up over many years. That all changed when 2 major contacts went to national companes. Now I am scrambling to get new business.

I picked up the software, reg a domain and designed the site in 1 day, I had no experiance with "web design" at all, none. And that is this business in a nutshell, you have to be a quick learner and adpat - FAST.

So now my rekey's and trashouts are nill, but I have gutted 4 basements flooded by "that" national contractor 

I would never discourage anyone from "going for it", but let me be honest,
It is rough, real rough the last 6 months, even for established folks with some cash reserve.

The biggest asset in this business is - Your word, it had better be good.

Nick


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## Guest

Hey how you doing? I am in Denver, been doing remodels for my own company for about three years now with my brother, not easy working with family, but lately I have been chasing checks and giving out free estimates. Does anyone know the right street to take to get to the bank owned properties or lenders. What is the best way to get started with them on repo and foreclosures, clean-outs etc...
Appreciate any feed back


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## Guest

*Need help finding contract and clients*

I am new to this and am ready to go--but how do you get contracts with banks? It seems like all of the agents either have clean up people already or they go through the banks who have their own vendors. HELP!! I am insured and ready to go, with no work--I am in the bay area, ca--alison


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## APlusPPGroup

Unfortunately, Alison, you can't go direct to the banks unless you know someone who knows someone. Even then you need experience....... and plenty of it.

To those who are still contacting me for work, I'm *ONLY* putting experienced property preservation vendors to work. We're already getting busy here and I simply don't have time to walk anyone new through the jobs over the phone or explain the guidelines.

Those who I'm already in touch with, hang in there. The work is coming and I'll do the online training with you the moment I can take a break from getting everyone set up in our system.

Our national venture launched this week and I have a few new clients.

I have coverage in about 1/3 of the states already but still have quite a few areas to fill in each one. You will need *AT LEAST* 1 year of PP experience behind you and must be able to provide good before & after photos of 2 jobs you've done before you can be considered.

In addition to that, you'll need to send me your proof of insurance with a minimum of $1 million in general liability.

*I need a list of counties you cover in your state with your very first e-mail to me.* And be sure to put your *STATE* in the subject line.

You're going to need a good supply of standard key code locks & lockboxes. Also, get ready to install slider locks & window locks in addition to padlocks.

Thanks!

Linda


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## Guest

*Kudos for Linda for help here*

Linda,

I wanted to thank you for the helpful information you have been sharing here. It has helped me tremendously in my pursuit to get started in AZ. I also visited both of your sites as well!

I have also sent you and email to your gmail account from this thread (and I just noticed that I did not copy o the address from your site...).

Yours,
Brian


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## Guest

Hey REO-I was going to PM you but don't see a link to do so...

just a suggestion, you may be able to set up an email for your domain and then forward it to your verizon email. typically this is done in the DNS registar. Benefit may be to track where your 'hits' come from. i.e. if you get in your V.N. box addressed to 'info.yourdomain.com', you'll know it came from the website.


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## APlusPPGroup

Brian, thank you. I got your e-mail but I'm in the middle of trying to get year end payroll taxes, W-2 forms, and 1099 forms done. Everything's due to be postmarked by the 31st.

I may be not able to get back with you until everything's in the mail either tomorrow or Saturday. Just wanted to give you a heads up.

Linda


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## Guest

*Good problem to have*

Good luck on the paperwork.

I am getting my personal tax stuff in order as well. I am working on securing the Quickbooks Pro as well this weekend.

I look forward until the dust clears!

Yours,
Brian


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## Guest

*contacts*



alisonsbiz said:


> I am new to this and am ready to go--but how do you get contracts with banks? It seems like all of the agents either have clean up people already or they go through the banks who have their own vendors. HELP!! I am insured and ready to go, with no work--I am in the bay area, ca--alison


 try doing a google search for property preservation contractors needed.in whatever area you plan to service, also try searching for property preservation companies,many have sites where you can apply online, try cyprexx services llc. safeguard properties, try platinum mortage services
16w oak st, porterville ca 93257, 559-306-1312, i hope this helps you out!


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## APlusPPGroup

Good luck with PMS to anyone who contacts them. Very unprofessional company and bad attitudes from some of the staff. 

I should post the e-mail I got from them when I turned them down. Wow!:laughing:

I won't post it ~ but be sure to search for complaints about any company you decide to contact for work. Put their company name in quotation marks so you don't have to weed through 100 pages of unrelated sites.

Glad to see you got your PP biz off the ground, Chip. Are they keeping you busy down there?

Linda


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## Guest

*how to drain and charge for a pool*

I saw that for Ca you do not cover pools,but I could not access the securing guidlines from HUD. I have my first bid on tuesday and am a little nervous. It is for trash out, cleaning and pool drain. How do I drain and what do I charge. How to I secure it if I do not cover it?--I do not want to lose the job by over bidding and I don't want to under bid--ugh--alison


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## APlusPPGroup

Alison ~

To drain it efficiently, you'll need a gas-powered pool pump, 2" pvc pipe, joints & elbows for the intake, plus 2" reinforced tube for the discharge. The cost will probably run between $400 to $450. I've added a regular shower drain to the end of my intake so that nothing big goes through the pump. 

Most likely you won't be able to charge the client enough to cover the cost of the pump with the first job but it will definitely pay for itself down the road in man hours. A small pump will take you all day, where the gas powered pump will take you just over 3 hours.

Go to http://myspace.com/allreopreservation to see the way I've got mine set up. I've got photo albums there of some of the things we do, including pool drains.

Before you bid to drain, however, check with the city and find out what their policy is. If you're in an area where there are water table issues when it rains, they may not let you drain it unless you clean and refill it right away. 

If the city allows you to drain it, they'll also tell you WHERE to drain it to. As long as there are no chemicals left in the pool, most will allow you to drain it right into the street where it will go into the storm drain.

When you talk to the city, ask if you're allowed to secure it. They should be able to tell you the best way to do it, too. 

If you bid to refill the pool, request that they turn the power be on so you can test the pump. And you'll need the water on, of course.

If you have any other questions, just send an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll get right back with you.

Congrats on your new trashout bid.

Linda


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## Guest

*Linda... Thank You*

I have been (and still am) considering venturing into the Property Preservation business. As is the case with many on this post, I am new to this. There are lots of questions. Thankfully many have been answered here by veterans who have been in this business for a while. Thank you all for your input. 

Linda, a very special "thank you" to you. You have a business to run, yet you have been so generous with the information that you have shared on this thread. In these tough economic times, many are looking for jobs, but some folks are looking for hand outs and some have unfortunately resorted to crime. It is refreshing to see (from reading this thread) many have not given up on trying to get going and to stay afloat. It is not always easy and I cannot tell you how happy I am to have found this thread. There is much to learn and much to share and Linda you have been so kind in teaching and sharing and I just wanted to take a moment to say "thanks". 

That said, I am in Orlando, FL. There are lots of vacant/foreclosed/abandoned properties here. Although I have found the info on this site to be extremely useful, I was just wondering if anyone knows of a property preservation training course anywhere in Central Florida? I saw one offered online for $500, but that is pretty pricey. I understand no training or license is required, but I would like to go in with as much training and knowledge as I can. Anyone know of anything?:whistling


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## APlusPPGroup

srcboogie ~

You are very welcome. I wish I could pop in and post more frequently than I do but life gets very hectic here.

Regarding $500 for training, is it only for 1 day or is it more than that?

I'm working on putting an online training class together that will be much less than that. It won't include the field training, which I feel is the most important aspect of it, but will cover just about everything you can imagine and then some, including tips to save time and expenses.

I'm still in the process of putting downloadable training materials together right now. But, when I'm done, I'll let everyone knows it's being offered and how to connect with me for the training.

You're right about people sometimes needing a hand up and not a hand out. Just be sure to research and understand the realities of the business.

It's not for everyone and it isn't as simple starting up as most people think it is. You need more than a lawnmower and a vacuum but you'd be surprised at how many people think that's all it takes to get going. Anyone under that impression is most certainly in for a wild ride, especially financially.

Linda


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## Guest

*&quot;Regarding $500 for training, is it only for 1 day or is it more than that?&quot;*

Linda, that $500 was for a printable E-Book. The non-printable is $375! I don't know about that..lol. The path I was trying to go down is to contact with a bank or realtor or even Safeguard. Someone in the thread highly recommended Field Asset Services. Are you familiar with them or Cyprexx Services? I am a single mom. My income is all that is coming in and I can't afford huge start up costs. I do have some savings, but of course I don't want to use up all of my savings, you know? So, I figured I would start small and grow. Perhaps offering lock changes, photos and lawn care initially? (I would sub-contract the lawn care out) What do you think? I realize not offering more than that limits me, but I expect to learn as I grow which will hopefully help me to avoid costly mistakes.

I have been to the HUD site. I see their price listing, but I don't recall you speaking about your experience with Fannie Mae or HUD on this thread. Do you recommend that route for a beginner? Any drawbacks? I also want to try to avoid bidding as well. I know some jobs require it, but until I get my feet wet and gain some experience, I want to stay out of the fast lane!


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## APlusPPGroup

Actually, after reading all the complaints about Field Asset Services, I wouldn't touch them with a 100' pole. Go online and type in "Field Asset Services". 

Be sure to use the quotation marks or you'll get too many pages to read. You'll find quite a few complaints from vendors who are having problems getting paid. THAT's what put me off, along with a price list that doesn't even come close to being worth it.

Cyprexx contacted me last week to ask me to be a national vendor. Since I haven't heard any complaints, I'm going to give it a shot. My coverage area keeps growing, though, so getting my list organized and in an e-mail to them has been tough, to say the least. 

It's going to be hard to get work if you don't do all of it and bidding the jobs is a very important part of the process. 

I've got to step out for a couple of hours but send me an e-mail and I'll get back with you when I return. 

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Actually, after reading all the complaints about Field Asset Services, I wouldn't touch them with a 100' pole. Go online and type in "Field Asset Services".
> 
> Be sure to use the quotation marks or you'll get too many pages to read. You'll find quite a few complaints from vendors who are having problems getting paid. THAT's what put me off, along with a price list that doesn't even come close to being worth it.
> 
> Cyprexx contacted me last week to ask me to be a national vendor. Since I haven't heard any complaints, I'm going to give it a shot. My coverage area keeps growing, though, so getting my list organized and in an e-mail to them has been tough, to say the least.
> 
> It's going to be hard to get work if you don't do all of it and bidding the jobs is a very important part of the process.
> 
> I've got to step out for a couple of hours but send me an e-mail and I'll get back with you when I return.
> 
> Linda


Just wondering if that was you on tv tonight taking part in a story on this being a new industry?


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## APlusPPGroup

boman47k said:


> Just wondering if that was you on tv tonight taking part in a story on this being a new industry?


Yep, that was me. If anyone saw the trashout report I did last year, you'll notice that I've got a few more lines on my face these days.:w00t:

Now are you REALLY, REALLY sure you're ready to get into this business? It's tough and it ages you very, very quickly.

I'm getting ready to post both TV reports at my profile at http://myspace.com/allreopreservation if anyone missed it. They're both short but that's probably a good thing.:laughing:

BTW ~ to anyone who's waiting on an e-mail response from me, please give me a couple more days. I'm working on getting things buttoned down with another new client so we can all get to work pretty soon.

SRCboogie ~ I started an e-mail to you a couple days ago and have had nothing but interruptions. Rrrrrrrrrrrr.......

Thanks for being patient. 

Linda


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## Guest

*Moving right along*

Linda,

Thank you for the updates with the news stories... keep up the good PR work!

I have an update: LLC paperwork is going with with AZ today! :thumbup: Once LLC gets registered, then domain name and website work begins in earnest.

I already have a digital camera (on loan, other one busted...) and I am working on a friend's place in barter for equipment left behind by a renter and another reference!

I am also begining what I need to do for AZ contractor liscencing as well... then I want to head to CA for my immersion work!

I know you are busy, but you alos have mail!

Yours,
BAR

PS> Anyone else here working with Linda on possible training soon?


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Yep, that was me. If anyone saw the trashout report I did last year, you'll notice that I've got a few more lines on my face these days.:w00t:
> 
> *Now are you REALLY, REALLY sure you're ready to get into this business?* It's tough and it ages you very, very quickly.
> 
> I'm getting ready to post both TV reports at my profile at http://myspace.com/allreopreservation if anyone missed it. They're both short but that's probably a good thing.:laughing:
> 
> BTW ~ to anyone who's waiting on an e-mail response from me, please give me a couple more days. I'm working on getting things buttoned down with another new client so we can all get to work pretty soon.
> 
> SRCboogie ~ I started an e-mail to you a couple days ago and have had nothing but interruptions. Rrrrrrrrrrrr.......
> 
> Thanks for being patient.
> 
> Linda


I haven't really given it much thought. I don't really think it would feasable in this area yet. Maybe as an add-on.

I read somewhere on here that you did something for a tv report or something. I just happened to catch that piece, and thinking I had seen your pic on here somewhere, I thought it was you.


Clarify something for me. On the HUD site, prices are listed for locks, water heaters, etc.. It also shows a maximum price. Is the maximum all the locks, water heaters, etc. combined? In other words is the maximum all that will be paid regardless of the number of lock change outs and whatever?


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## APlusPPGroup

Typically, unless otherwise stated, the maximum allowed is for all services combined.

Depending on the client, it could be one door or all doors. Everything gets priced separately up to the maximum and any other work is bid.

Linda


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## Guest

*Does anyone have bid sheet they can send me*

I am having a hard time finding a bid sheet and do not know the exact way to do one--Do we price every little thing, or just put it together?--what is the best program, template to use?--alison email: [email protected]


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Alison ~

I use Quickbooks Pro to generate bids. I have items set up with standard descriptions of what's included in each service. My bids typically are laid out in this order [with descriptions]:

Janitorial
Yard Service
Interior Debris
Exterior Debris
Winterization
Water Heater Strap

Those are the main items I address, and in that order. Usually locks have already been changed so I don't bid those. Boardups may already be done. If not, you can add them as another line item on the bid.

Do yourself a favor, tho. If you don't have accounting software, consider Quickbooks Pro. Spreadsheets are good for some things but, when you get busy, you're going to be tearing your hair out trying to keep up with them. 

Hope that helps.

Linda


----------



## Guest

How do any of you manage all the FHA guidelines, rules and pricing you have to follow?

We have problems with on site people keeping track of the rules.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

SoftwareGuys said:


> How do any of you manage all the FHA guidelines, rules and pricing you have to follow?
> 
> We have problems with on site people keeping track of the rules.


Training, training, training. Then termination if they still don't get it.

Linda


----------



## Guest

I just found this thread and thanks to all who have shared information here. 
My wife and I own a 12 year old construction site clean up service. With new home construction as slow here as it is time to expand into other areas....or die for us.
I wish I would have considered this sooner but here I am now researching.
So far from what I have found out this would be an ideal addition to our other services. We already have the right type of insurance, most of the equipment needed I have seen listed here. I even have 6 years of QB experience.
What I don't have is the right contacts. Before I read this thread I put together a flier and I have been canvasing realtor's in my area. I did not know about theses property management outfits until I read about them here so now at least I have a few new leads to go by.
I will need to learn how to do a few things. Winterizing properties and pools would be new territory for me. In addition I am concerned about pricing the jobs. Most of what we do now is by the sq foot or hourly. 
What recommendations and advise might you have for me? Is there a market in this area for just trash out so I could get started and learn what I need to know on the go so to speak? My wife and I pride ourselves on leaving the best looking sites in our market and we have a very good reputation built and I wouldn't want to jeopardize that by taking on anything that I can't handle.
My mane concerns are finding the work, bidding properly and not biting off more than I can chew. 
We have worked on a couple of total tear out remodels before. We striped everything out down too bare floors and drywall. 
Any advise or contact information would be appreciated.


----------



## Guest

alisonsbiz said:


> I am new to this and am ready to go--but how do you get contracts with banks? It seems like all of the agents either have clean up people already or they go through the banks who have their own vendors. HELP!! I am insured and ready to go, with no work--I am in the bay area, ca--alison


Forget the banks and look for brokers. Find brokers who specialize in listing REO homes. Once they get a list of properties from the banks they will call you for work. You give a bid, they send it to the bank for approval and call you back to do the work.
That's how I did it. I have a list of about 400 REO brokers that I harvested off the internet. I send out a bulk email once a month and pick up a new client just about everytime. I have 6-8 brokers I work with on a steady basis.
My problem is not findng the work, it's what to do after I get teh work. I'm drowning with how to make estimating simpler and managing my contractors and make it all more streamlined.
I need a system I can teach to someone else.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

fathersonfab ~ 

Quickbooks Pro makes it easy to keep it all together, if what you're talking about is in regards to keeping track of all the estimates. I've set up my system to track clients & their properties. Everything that relates to each property can be found in one place.

Any expenses [or payouts to subs] you can tie back to the property itself by adding the property to the transaction in "splits".

As long as the transactions are maintained properly, you can run a P & L by client or by property.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> fathersonfab ~
> 
> Quickbooks Pro makes it easy to keep it all together, if what you're talking about is in regards to keeping track of all the estimates. I've set up my system to track clients & their properties. Everything that relates to each property can be found in one place.
> 
> Any expenses [or payouts to subs] you can tie back to the property itself by adding the property to the transaction in "splits".
> 
> As long as the transactions are maintained properly, you can run a P & L by client or by property.
> 
> Linda


Linda,
I use Quickbooks Pro. It's a great tool.
What I'm referring to is physically running all over town and doing bids. Feeling like I need to be in 3 places at once. I need a system I can train someone to be a field estimator.
I would like to be able to take a vacation for a week or two and not feel like the business will shut down.

Brian


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Brian ~

I know the feeling of needing to be in too many places at one time very well.

Why don't you just train someone to take the photos, following a specific protocol, and point out what to look for, then do the estimate from their photos? 

I love the inspection process and it takes me about 45 minutes to an hour to properly photograph everything I need for my estimates. So, to me, it's not a big deal to travel and spend the time taking photos.

But I can see where it would annoy many others because of the time involved. At least having someone doing the photo inspection would free up a considerable amount of time for you. Putting the bids together can take anywhere from 15 to 45 minutes. But the round trip travel can take 3 [or more] hours out of your day. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

*trucks*

So do any of you that are doing this own your own trucks?
I see on Linda's website u-haul trucks.

I have been pricing dump trucks as that is what some companies use around here.


----------



## Guest

my girlfriend and i use a truck and trailer. find it to be easier to have the trailer just for the fact that it is low to the ground and easier to load/unload.


----------



## Guest

*quotes*



leadarrows said:


> I just found this thread and thanks to all who have shared information here.
> My wife and I own a 12 year old construction site clean up service. With new home construction as slow here as it is time to expand into other areas....or die for us.
> I wish I would have considered this sooner but here I am now researching.
> So far from what I have found out this would be an ideal addition to our other services. We already have the right type of insurance, most of the equipment needed I have seen listed here. I even have 6 years of QB experience.
> What I don't have is the right contacts. Before I read this thread I put together a flier and I have been canvasing realtor's in my area. I did not know about theses property management outfits until I read about them here so now at least I have a few new leads to go by.
> I will need to learn how to do a few things. Winterizing properties and pools would be new territory for me. In addition I am concerned about pricing the jobs. Most of what we do now is by the sq foot or hourly.
> What recommendations and advise might you have for me? Is there a market in this area for just trash out so I could get started and learn what I need to know on the go so to speak? My wife and I pride ourselves on leaving the best looking sites in our market and we have a very good reputation built and I wouldn't want to jeopardize that by taking on anything that I can't handle.
> My mane concerns are finding the work, bidding properly and not biting off more than I can chew.
> We have worked on a couple of total tear out remodels before. We striped everything out down too bare floors and drywall.
> Any advise or contact information would be appreciated.


I am in the same boat as far as what do you charge? I am in Ohio, son is working for another PP company but they are poorly managed and we feel we can do better. But how do you know what to charge???


----------



## Guest

ohiogrogans said:


> I am in the same boat as far as what do you charge? I am in Ohio, son is working for another PP company but they are poorly managed and we feel we can do better. But how do you know what to charge???


if you go to the the hud webpage... hud.gov .... put this in the search.

REO Preservation & Protection Cost Schedules for Ohio 

this may help. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

has anyone heard of any scams on craigslis regarding property preservation?
A friend ofmine recently said he contacted a guy who posted an add on craigslist for property presevation work, the guy sent him 3 jobs, which i expect are probably real but the guy is out of state. My hunc is that my friend is gonna do a couple weeks work of work and materials send it to the guy and then never hear from him again. The guy will collect the money from the bank and not have ever had to lift a finger.
Thats just my opinion. What do u think?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Is the advertiser located in either San Diego, California, or Las Vegas, Nevada, by any chance? Or are they based out of Houston, Texas? I know of a few scandalous companies out of all 3 places.

Not everyone who places an ad for help on Craigslist is a scammer but I've got contacts all over the US and can probably help you find out. Why don't you send me an email with a name & some other info and I'll see what I can find out. Send it to [email protected]

When things are as chaotic as they are, all kinds of shady characters come out of the woodwork.

Just make sure you check EVERYONE out who wants to send you work. Get all of their contact information before you even accept the jobs.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Alison ~
> 
> To drain it efficiently, you'll need a gas-powered pool pump, 2" pvc pipe, joints & elbows for the intake, plus 2" reinforced tube for the discharge. The cost will probably run between $400 to $450. I've added a regular shower drain to the end of my intake so that nothing big goes through the pump.
> 
> Most likely you won't be able to charge the client enough to cover the cost of the pump with the first job but it will definitely pay for itself down the road in man hours. A small pump will take you all day, where the gas powered pump will take you just over 3 hours.
> 
> Go to http://myspace.com/allreopreservation to see the way I've got mine set up. I've got photo albums there of some of the things we do, including pool drains.
> 
> Before you bid to drain, however, check with the city and find out what their policy is. If you're in an area where there are water table issues when it rains, they may not let you drain it unless you clean and refill it right away.
> 
> If the city allows you to drain it, they'll also tell you WHERE to drain it to. As long as there are no chemicals left in the pool, most will allow you to drain it right into the street where it will go into the storm drain.
> 
> When you talk to the city, ask if you're allowed to secure it. They should be able to tell you the best way to do it, too.
> 
> If you bid to refill the pool, request that they turn the power be on so you can test the pump. And you'll need the water on, of course.
> 
> If you have any other questions, just send an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll get right back with you.
> 
> Congrats on your new trashout bid.
> 
> Linda


To save you on time you should look into a semi trash water pump with a three inch intake and a 50' disharge hose. Total set up will run you near 1500, but will save you in time. I looked at the photos of your set up, and northern tool sells a fitting that will pump out holes (basements or pools) leaving only an 1/8 of an inch. Runs about 50 bucks. But my pump shoots out 22000 gallons of water an hour. It saves big time. I went with Honda, but many companies offer one.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

XanadooLTD said:


> To save you on time you should look into a semi trash water pump with a three inch intake and a 50' disharge hose. Total set up will run you near 1500, but will save you in time. I looked at the photos of your set up, and northern tool sells a fitting that will pump out holes (basements or pools) leaving only an 1/8 of an inch. Runs about 50 bucks. But my pump shoots out 22000 gallons of water an hour. It saves big time. I went with Honda, but many companies offer one.


Someone else recently mentioned a trash pump to me as well. I didn't know there was anything with a 3" intake. I presume the discharge is also 3". Mine pumps 160 GPM with a 2" in/out.

I put mine together myself. I had never pumped a pool before but after asking several other people in the biz, I knew there was no way I was going to sit around watching a pool drain for 8 to 10 hours. Mine usually takes about 3 to 3-1/2 hours to drain a full pool. 

I just found out recently, however, that it quits when it sits on unlevel ground - like the slope of a swimming pool. Have you ever heard of that? Is there a remedy beside using a wedge?

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Someone else recently mentioned a trash pump to me as well. I didn't know there was anything with a 3" intake. I presume the discharge is also 3". Mine pumps 160 GPM with a 2" in/out.
> 
> I put mine together myself. I had never pumped a pool before but after asking several other people in the biz, I knew there was no way I was going to sit around watching a pool drain for 8 to 10 hours. Mine usually takes about 3 to 3-1/2 hours to drain a full pool.
> 
> I just found out recently, however, that it quits when it sits on unlevel ground - like the slope of a swimming pool. Have you ever heard of that? Is there a remedy beside using a wedge?
> 
> Linda


 Yes both are 3 inch. Intake and discharge. Look at it on NorthernTool.com. They have pumps and all accessories. Good luck.


----------



## Guest

*reply*

[linda is awesome,do your homework,quit being jealous


----------



## Guest

*reply*



osu1962 said:


> No, its just very troubling that you talk bad about so many services on here (firing them)etc...Usually that means your not so confident about your own place in the business or you have alot of trouble associating with people. I am a licensed and certified home inspector and retired realtor, I have an associates degree in civil engineering and I find it difficult for you to answer me back so unprofessionally when I tried to get help from you? Everything posted on here has been positive about you, why can't someone post something not so positive about an experience with you without you getting so upset?


 i have done a little research,i am a licensed contractor in calif,and i believe you do need a contractor license,when the job is for over 500.00 in labor and materials,which many are, even if its a verbal agreement, its still a contract to do the work! so if there is a flat fee of 800.00 its over the allowed limit, board ups and winterizations and lock changes are altering the property , all of the banks and companies i work for require a contractors license! i will have to check with c.l.s.b to make sure! but if im correct ,i would not hesitate to turn anyone in for being a un licensed contractor! i have spent alot of time and money to do this properly,and un licensed contractors,ruin it for everyone doing it the right way, and if you do the work -not being licensed, you really have no recourse,if the bank decides not to pay you, another good site to check out is cubic yard. us


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## APlusPPGroup

Chip ~

Thank you, first of all. I think you're pretty awesome, too.

I just wanted to clarify something regarding your flate rate example. 

If you bid a flat rate of $800 in repairs then, yes, you need a license. If your flate rate bid includes cleaning the house and mowing the grass, along with the repairs then you do not need a contractors license ~ unless the repairs themselves are over $500 and the balance of the package is for janitorial and grass cut.

It's the value of the repairs that will determine whether or not you need a license. In California, any repair work over $500 requires you to be a licensed contractor. Up to that $500 you are considered a handyman.

I saw your un-edited post and agree with you. The $500 is per property, not per trip. Those who break a $2,000 job into 4 trips @ $500 are doing it illegally and are subject to fines and civil penalties. That's also the point where the client can refuse to pay you and it's all within their rights not to.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Indymac Pricing*

Does anyone know how to get pricing for Indymac properties? Do you use the same pricing as HUD? I'm new to the business any help is appreciated..


----------



## Guest

well there is no longer an IndyMac bank it was seized by US govt. I bet Fannie Mae is servicing now if not HUD.


----------



## Guest

*Thanks*

I've been using the HUD pricing...


----------



## Guest

*indymac is still around*



XanadooLTD said:


> well there is no longer an IndyMac bank it was seized by US govt. I bet Fannie Mae is servicing now if not HUD.


Actually IndyMac is still around. They were bought by someone else I still make my payments to INDYMAC and when they call me for refinancing the caller id says INDYMAC.


----------



## Guest

*Fafs*

If there is anyone that is doing work for first american field services, i would really appreciate an opportunity to speak with you, on the phone, i have some questions that can't be 
answer by email. Thank you


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## Guest

stonecreek said:


> , i have some questions that can't be
> answer by email. Thank you


 
Really???? I don't think so:laughing:

People that join CT usually introduce themselves, their location & their company. You have not. That doesn't go over too well with the regulars.:thumbdown:thumbdown


----------



## Guest

Thank you all on CT,

My wife and I were victims of corporate America and decided to go back to the janitorial service that we had in Cailfornia and try to do it in Texas. We heard about Property Preservation from a friend of a friend that's been doing it for about 2 years making decent money. She guaranteed us 2 bank contracts to get started but charges a fee of $2500 to do so. For the last month we have researched, bought books and learned as much as possible on the internet about this indusrty. We recently DBA, LLC'd, insured and bonded our company. We currently have 3 trucks and a crew of 3 per truck with painters and contractor who can fix just about anything. We have all types of lawn equipment just from doing my own home lawn weekly. We have heard Good and Bad things about First american and Safeguard properties. By reading on the internet, the Bad outway the Good with both companys so not going that route would be awesome if we dont have too and paying this lady $2500 is just not in the budget for starting up in this field. We have reviewed the HUD's costsheet but do you charge that on every BID or is it a guideline to use when Bidding? Is there a templet out there for Bidding and what is should look like? Are AM's better that Banks? And last but not least, whats the best way to build a contact list for this business for business out there? Should we just go to REO brokers or just real estate businesses and give out my business cards and flyers? I would like to be a provider for companies in this area but we are having a struggle trying to get with the right people. Linda and Brickie you guys have been great with information with starting up this business and from this thread we have learned a lot but what is the best way to advertise your business? And is there any training classes out there in major cities that teach this business? I fly free so ill go anywhere. Any advice?


Josh


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Hi, Josh ~

No, I wouldn't pay $2,500. No one can guarantee a bank contract because the bank may decide they don't want to use that particular company down the road. If that happens, where will you be? Without a contract, most likely.

Safeguard is not the best but it's good for getting your feet wet and learning the ropes.

Thanks to my experience with them, I can tell you that First Am is the absolute worst. They owe me money, along with nearly everyone I know. They always start off great with the PP vendors, then slowly go downhill in their payments & relationships. 

If you like, you can contact me by e-mail at [email protected] and we can discuss your options for learning the industry.

I'm glad you're doing the research and not just jumping into this. I've seen too many startups fail because their expectations were not met and they didn't know enough about the industry to keep themselves out of harm's way when it came to the nationals and a handful of the smaller companies selling "franchises".

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Need some more info on Property Preservation*

I currently own a landscaping business and I am considering adding property preservation to my business to expand my services. I have general liability insurance right now. By reading some of the threads on this site some people say that this business is not worth it and other associates of mine are saying that contractors with a nice amount of work can make a few thousand a month. Im aware doesn't pay for that 30-60 day time frame. I was thinking about submitting an application with CYPREXX services and MCBREO. Has anyone ever worked with these companies before? And another thing was the actual bidding. Is it true that when submitting bids that you have to take 25% of the maximum allowable prices in order to be competitve with other vendors? How long does the application process normally take?


----------



## Guest

*Property Preservation Q*



Team Lawrence said:


> Hell Everyone
> 
> My name is Steve Licensed Electricial and small knowledgeable General Contractor, most of the General Contracting I limit to establishe Electrical Customers.................Long story short. I want to Funnel my skills and knowledge into starting a Property Management Company. I'm sure there is alot of u guys who have been around and understand my ambitions. All advice would be greatly appreciated...thanks


Hi. My name is Lynnetta- in Holden, Missouri. I am a Lic Realtor, hubby owns Jason's Painting from Florida. We have both found ourselves needing work. Looking to provide top services & make a living doing it. I will read responses to Steve(Lawrence Team) before I ask any questions. But we are trying to get info on doing preservation work. Steve, you in KS? How is business in KS/MO?


----------



## Guest

lynnetta_p said:


> Hi. My name is Lynnetta- in Holden, Missouri. I am a Lic Realtor, hubby owns Jason's Painting from Florida. We have both found ourselves needing work. Looking to provide top services & make a living doing it. I will read responses to Steve(Lawrence Team) before I ask any questions. But we are trying to get info on doing preservation work. Steve, you in KS? How is business in KS/MO?



lol, good luck I am in KC MO.


----------



## Guest

*Interested in Property Preservation partnership*

I've been reading all of the post here and would like to know if there are any of the contractors here that work in the Michigan, Metro Detroit area?? I am available to consult on future business opportunities with-in the Detroit area. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

I work in the Detroit Area. I signed up with Cyprexx Services back in November and I've just recently started recieving bid requests from them. So far it seems like I get about 24-48 hours to inspect or secure the property and submit a bid. Still havent accepted any work because I've been busy finishing up a few jobs, but hopefully soon I'll be able to do accept some work and see how it goes. I know they need contractors that will work inside of Detroit, most wont go into the homes because people move in as soon as someone moves out without actually owning the property, which makes for confrontation from what I've heard


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## APlusPPGroup

Our national venture launched about mid-January and we are still recruiting *experienced* vendors in all states.

We're looking specifically for vendors in all of California to help us handle a new client who is supposed to be releasing over 3,000 work orders to us within the next 2 to 3 weeks.

Another client may be sending us over 1,500 orders just for the Bay areas alone.

Other areas we are focusing on are Northern & Central Utah, Nebraska, Montana, Oregon coastal counties, SE Missouri, Mississippi, and Louisiana, plus all of Texas and the East coast.

What we need in order to facilitate the qualification process is for experienced vendors to send 2 job files of completed trashouts, from start to finish [before & after photos] for us to review.

Photo files *MUST* be resized to 600 x 600 and each be in their own job folders. What *CANNOT* happen is a potential vendor sending 10 files containing a few large photos so, if you don't already have resizing software, install this one: http://bluefive.pair.com/pixresizer.html. Click on the "work with multiple files" tab to resize the whole folder at one time.

We need your contact information in the e-mail, along with the photos, which can be sent to us at [email protected]. If there's no contact info, which should include your location & phone number, along with your name, your e-mail will probably end up in the reject folder because we'll assume you can't follow directions. [Sad to say, but this happens a lot.]

Once we've had a chance to review your job files, and everything looks good, we'll be sending forms for you to fill out. When you return them, send *ONLY* the signature pages, along with your proof of $1 million General Liability insurance coverage and any certifications or licenses you might have.

For anyone requesting startup information, send your requests to [email protected] and be patient. We can't always get to startup requests right away but *WILL* reply when we have the time.

Anyone requesting training formation, e-mail us at [email protected]. At present, we do our field training out of Riverside & San Bernardino Counties in California, and Fort Mohave [Bullhead City], Arizona.

*We have a field training class scheduled in San Bernardino for March 28th & 29th. *If you're interested, contact us right away. All training is prepaid by cashiers check and must be received no later than 3 days prior to the start of the training so that we know the commitment is there. The training cost will be a package deal, including field and online using http://skype.com. You'll have to contact us for the cost of the package.

*NO PHONE CALLS, PLEASE*

We don't have time to answer a lot of questions over the phone. We are already busy in many states and need to remain focused on the jobs we have going on and get through the vendor review process as efficiently as possible.

Any questions? 

Linda


----------



## Guest

hey linda did fox ever do that interview in chicago?


----------



## Guest

*Property Preservation Help*

We are in the middle of getting into the Property Preservation Biz here in Boise and it sounds like we should not get involved with the bigger companies like First American, Safe Guard. How do you find local REO companies? We need some good advise as to how, who, to contact. Any help would be helpful.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

djpp said:


> hey linda did fox ever do that interview in chicago?


No, we didn't. I was never able to find someone who felt comfortable with a camera crew and reporter filming & interviewing during a trashout.

Linda


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## Guest

if they are still looking in a few months, we'd be willing. we are only 45 min from there.:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

wheatie said:


> We are in the middle of getting into the Property Preservation Biz here in Boise and it sounds like we should not get involved with the bigger companies like First American, Safe Guard. How do you find local REO companies? We need some good advise as to how, who, to contact. Any help would be helpful.


just my two cents....... work with the nationals or get subbed for someone who does. it will be excellent experiance and or training. the money is not as good, but it should be the knowledge you gain to be successful. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

djpp said:


> if they are still looking in a few months, we'd be willing. we are only 45 min from there.:thumbsup:


 
Where are you located???


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## Guest

located in racine, wi. pleasure to meet you.


----------



## Guest

Hi, I'm fairly new to the property preservation field and I was just wondering...have any of you worked with REO Allegiance, A2Z or First American Field Services (FAFS)?? Our company just recently started with FAS but I'm seeing lots of negative comments about them. We haven't really done much work with them as of yet, but if they are really that bad maybe we don't want to work for them at all! But, what about the other nationals...I'm having a really hard time finding anything info on them...like are they good to work for?, what kinds of work do they hand out?, do they pay when they say they will?, and the biggest one...are they easy to get in touch with???!!! I know this is a lot of questions but, like I said, I can't find anything good or bad about these companies....any info would be appreciated!!  
-Joy


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## APlusPPGroup

Read all of the posts in this thread. You'll find plenty of info regarding at least 2 of them, maybe 3.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*any one willing to share how to get with reo's and asset*

nobody out here is willing to help, its all cut throat, the way the econ is. were trying to get with companies for prop preservation.  hard to do on own. maybe somebody out there is willing to help since not "competetion" ....were in a smaller town that "blew up" last 2-3 years, then the market slammed . but, there are fore. , repos, reo's , bank owned all over. said that people are loosing there house's but another form of work..


----------



## Guest

its not hard to get into the buisness of PP. pull up hud guidlines and read over them. the only difficult thing is this buisness is having up front capital to have all the supplies and dumping fees , etc. try finding an already established company in your area and work with them for a while to get a feel for it. that is my $0.02. that is how we got into the biz. hopes this helps. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

*Cleanup Contracts*

Hi, is anyone able to share a sample foreclosure cleanup contract? I am starting a foreclosure cleanup biz in the Dallas, TX area. Any help would be appreciated. My email is [email protected]

Thank you...M


----------



## APlusPPGroup

djpp said:


> if they are still looking in a few months, we'd be willing. we are only 45 min from there.:thumbsup:


DJ ~

E-mail me your contact info and I'll put you in touch directly with Fox.

I also want to say to everyone who's been sending me files for review, I've got quite a few of them and it's taking me lots of time. So, to those I haven't replied to yet, I appreciate your patience. 

I'm reviewing everyone who's contacting me and will eventually get to you.

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## Guest

e-mail sent linda:thumbsup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

stabasit said:


> Very informative md


??? Who or what is MD? State abbreviation, member abbreviation?

Linda


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## Guest

Hello all, This is my first post on this website. I came to it prob alot like most of you did, by accident! I'm the owner of done right property clean up in las vegas nv. Good to meet each and everyone of you. I too am in the property preservation market and prob like much of you, hurting! I've been doing this for a few years, but only owned my own company since march of 08. Last year i did great but this year with the new larger companies running the mass percentage of inventory, times have been hard. I usually only worked with smaller banks and listing agents, but have been contimplating getting hooked up with the safeguards, first american reo, va,fha,and agencies of that nature. The big question i have is the insurance requirements they ask for. E/O ins is quite costly and my question is it worth it?? I'm fully insur with GL ins for all my commerical licenses, but to gain the extra insurance would be a big out of pocket expense. I do know that they pay a bit lower and their standards is high and i'm also aware of their pay times are 45-60 days net., none of that bothers me...But is their inventory such where the mass amounts would offset the lower pay rate??? I really need to keep my guys busy or I will llose them and they do amazing work!!!! so any help would be great, or if there are any companys reading this that are in need of a great company in las vegas,NV with great customer service then pm me or email me right away. Enjoy your weekend.


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## Guest

unless you know your going to get the capital back from whatever company is requesting it, i would not get it. it is an expensive insurance that in most cases your GL should cover anyways. IMO, just make sure your reasearching the company that requests it. talk to your insurance agent as well to debate if you actually need that type of insurance as well. it is not necessary for most companies to begin with. GL on your ventures :thumbsup:


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## Guest

djpp,
Yes i checked with my insurance agent and he thinks its acidine to request erros and ommisions insurance on companies like ours. Real estate agents, bpo agents, mortgage brokes all need clerical errors insurance but safeguard and countrywide state its a must to work for them and yes its very expenisve and not too many insurance brokers even write that kind of policy. BUT the guy i talked to that is working for safeguard in my area is stating he's getting 15-25 new properties per week, so it might be a smart investment becuse my new inventory listing are dropping each week. So my new question is does anyone know a loop hole or a way around getting e/o insurance but still do business with those companies just using regular GL insurance???


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## APlusPPGroup

Mike ~

Read your general liability policy and see if E & O is already covered. I don't carry E & O ~ never have and never will. But I've been told that many GL policies already have it covered.

One of these days I'll have to read mine............:whistling

Linda


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## Guest

Linda I'll deff have to read mine, i never knew that, thanks alot. I also sent you an email regarding your training as well as possible coverage service in my area. Be back later, got some bids to do.!!!


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## Guest

*rekey/ lock change training*

Does anyone know of a place in/around las vegas or on the internet that offers lock change/ rekey and lock picking & / or drilling training??


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## Guest

This is a pretty smart lady I think, it is " NOT THE CASH COW" it was even 3 years ago when I started. Having run a drywall/stucco company for 14 years and feeling at times like I built half the houses that I was now doing foreclosures on I have seen it come full circle, When I "got in" it was by necessity and the money was good with low overhead. In other-words if I kept hoping the housing market would recover I was going to be the next foreclosure. Now the overhead is much higher and the money I am getting is much less that I am having look further and further from my base In Naples Fl to get the same amount of money. To start out today on a limited budget I don't know if I would recommend it to anyone. I invested most of my profits right back into equipment. Equipment allows you the ability to do more for less if you don't have what you should have you end up fighting the entire job and getting frustrated with the whole job. Focus on what you are doing, if you say I'll be done in a day then be done in a day. Take your time in doing your bid, look at every aspect factor in fuel to and from, dump fees, hazardous waste fee's etc. All you have to do is underbid a few jobs and your SCREWED (I did that quite a bit in the beginning) But you do learn. Use a good accounting program I personally use Quick books cause it's easy for a computer dummy like me. Buy a 10 mpx camera they are cheap now buy 2 if you can, make a photo check list on what your client wants to see..Get in the habit of taking your pictures the EXACT SAME WAY AT EVERY PROPERTY. There is nothing worse then having to drive 35miles back to a house just to take a picture of 1 smoke detector you missed when you were there(been here done that many times) AND MAKE VERY DETAILED ESTIMATES, spell everything out so there is no mistake about what you are willing to do for the price quoted. NEVER ever trust the client's pics because they never see or show U whats important to you just to them. Never agree to do something without seeing it yourself this is very dangerous ground and although this is my first post on this site I think this site is one of the best for info that I have ever run accross:clap:





a1propertyclean said:


> For all of those who are complaining about not being contacted for work, please review what I said before about the major metropolitan areas being saturated with vendors.
> 
> It doesn't mean you won't work, it just means it could be a very long time before you see any. The industry is NOT the cash cow it once was and, for those who are willing to hang in there through thick and thin, it could pan out. For those that can't afford the startup costs while waiting for work, I recommend you find employment to get you through until you can.
> 
> Here's something else to consider: At the time I'm writing this, there have been 9,274 views at this particular thread. Only 65 posts have been created.
> 
> So, out of the 9,274 views, how many of those who *DO NOT POST* found the information that's been posted here to jump ahead of you in the asset management game?
> 
> I'm not trying to be sarcastic or a doom predictor of any sort. I'm being realistic. It's a tough industry to get into anymore and only a few hundred will be successful at it. And only about 50% of those will still be working when the foreclosures are gone. Do you *REALLY* have what it takes or will you just ride the wave and move on to something new when it's over?
> 
> To those of you contacting me, hang in there. I've got something in the works for when my company goes nationwide. But it's a slow process for me, too, although I'm already established and working for several large asset management companies.
> 
> I've got new clients coming in but *PLEASE* be patient. And if I don't respond right away it's because I'm busy working my fanny off in the field, while still holding down the fort in the office.
> 
> Just a quick note regarding e-mails to me: if you don't give me contact information or the items I've previously requested, your e-mail has been automatically going into my "rejection" folder.
> 
> If I don't know where the heck you are or how to contact you outside of an e-mail, why should I bother? One thing I've learned is that, when people don't read or follow the simplest of directions, they are quite often difficult to train and/or get quality work out of.
> 
> So ............ find my list and try to give me what I ask for, okay?
> 
> For all I know, you could be my competitors right down the street who keep trying to find out how I run my operation so they can undercut me. And, believe me, it happens all the time and, for that reason, I don't give anyone my pricing anymore. You can get what you need from the guidelines, just like I did.
> 
> Everyone has my information so please be considerate enough to give me yours in return.
> 
> And to those I'm already working with, *THANK YOU* all very much. You're doing a wonderful job and I'm happy to be associated with you.
> 
> Signed........................... exhausted in Riverside.:yawn:
> 
> Linda


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## Guest

We just recently became a vendor for Cyprexx. Have done a couple of bids and are waiting to hear back. We got sent on a few jobs to winterize and secure and were told in writing that if we could do it for a flat rate, to send photos from the jobsite and to then proceed. We did, and were then told, after we did the work and submitted the after photos and invoice, that we would not be paid because as a new vendor we should have bid. Now they say that they only do flat rates after they've established your flat bid. Of course, nothing like this was stated on the field report or in any response when we sent in the b4 photos. As a matter of fact, we called the field agent from the job and were told a flat rate. Afterwards he said that this was just an example and din't apply to us as we were new. Does any one out there have experience with Cyprexx? Good or bad. Is this a fluke or are they diff. to work with?


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## APlusPPGroup

D&R ~ I received your e-mail and responded. So anytime you're ready. No pressure, okay?

Golden Gate ~ thank you very much for the compliment. It sounds like you've been able to build something solid from the ground up, which is how I did it. I never considered training but it really would have helped in the beginning. That's why I offer the training now - so no one else has to struggle.

Jacsynbill ~ your only recourse might be to lien the property. Did you get approval in writing before you did the work? If so, that's all the proof you need.

To anyone interested, I have another field training class scheduled for Tuesday & Wednesday, April 14th & 15th. If you need details on what's covered in the training, send an e-mail to me at [email protected].

The property is a 4-plex with small 1 bedroom, 1 bath units, located in San Bernardino, California. All 4 require water heater straps so to anyone who needs to learn how to install them, this is a great opportunity. We will also be pruning trees, cutting back overgrown ivy, hauling debris, and cleaning all the units.

Hope everyone's enjoying a great weekend.

Linda


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## Guest

Yes I have and DO work for Cyprex probably about 15%of my work comes from them. I don't particularly like them they are and can be difficult. We are flat rated also on most jobs but I have learned that some you just have to bid and it is likely they will find someone else with a pickup willing to do it for less. Remember you are not doing this for free, if you can do it for the flat rate and still make what U need then fine but if you are ending up with next to nothing you might as well get a job at 7-11 where you don't have to put your money out to take money in. REMEMBER it cause you are basically given them a free loan to clean up someone else's property, make sure you are getting a reasonable amount in return because they will run you over each and every time given the chance




jacsynbill said:


> We just recently became a vendor for Cyprexx. Have done a couple of bids and are waiting to hear back. We got sent on a few jobs to winterize and secure and were told in writing that if we could do it for a flat rate, to send photos from the jobsite and to then proceed. We did, and were then told, after we did the work and submitted the after photos and invoice, that we would not be paid because as a new vendor we should have bid. Now they say that they only do flat rates after they've established your flat bid. Of course, nothing like this was stated on the field report or in any response when we sent in the b4 photos. As a matter of fact, we called the field agent from the job and were told a flat rate. Afterwards he said that this was just an example and din't apply to us as we were new. Does any one out there have experience with Cyprexx? Good or bad. Is this a fluke or are they diff. to work with?


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## Guest

I am looking into doing clean outs for fill in work and so my guys can stay working. Tell me if I am wrong but doesn't MCB hold all HUD properties? So if you go thru Safeguard or another company you would be sub'ing for a sub?


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## Guest

Has anyone worked for Mortgage Specialist, Inc.? They found my info on SOFI and want me to work for them, inspections that is. 

thanks


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## APlusPPGroup

Okay, I'm going on a short rant here and I really hope everyone understands.:furious:

I'm beginning to receive multiple e-mails from new & startup vendors in every single one of my e-mail boxes from people wanting information and vendors looking for work. I'm becoming very frustrated with receiving 5 of the exact same e-mail because people think that ONE OF THEM will be received faster than the other. 

THAT IS NOT THE CASE AND I ONLY NEED ONE E-MAIL IN ONE BOX. If you haven't figured out [by my posts] where to send your e-mails, try the general box at [email protected] and I'll forward it to the correct one when it's received.

FROM THIS POINT FORWARD, ANYONE SENDING MAIL TO MORE THAN ONE BOX AUTOMATICALLY GOES IN THE REJECTION FOLDER. ANYONE SENDING A FOLLOW-UP 2 DAYS LATER IS GOING INTO THE REJECTION FOLDER, TOO. We are busy constantly and will get to new vendors and startups as soon as we can. BE PATIENT.

My priority is to my clients and the vendors in my network. I will review prospects when I get the time. Startups will have to wait longer. I'm busy processing experienced vendors into my system, along with everything else I have to do.

Also, important. NO PHONE CALLS. I believe I've already asked this but, on the off-chance I haven't, then I am now. If you want me to continue to participate here at the forum, please respect my time. Otherwise, I will simply stop posting due to a serious lack of it.

Yes, I do training and, yes, I'm looking for experienced vendors. Just pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeease be patient, okay? I can only get so much done in a day.

If you're new to this forum, *READ EVERY POST* before you even send me an e-mail. Much of the information you are looking for has already been posted either by me or someone else.

Your understanding is very much appreciated on this end.

Linda


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## Guest

Greetings all...I have been in maintenance and rehab for 25 years. Just threw my hat into the ring for property preservation this year. Looking forward to some informative discussions. Thanks. Tony


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## Guest

*downhill fast......*

I can also speak from several years of exp. with cyprexx. At one time they were great; but I am in the process of eliminating them from my client list. As someone already mentioned; they love the "flat rate". You can bid on a job and just like clockwork they will call asking you to do it for flat rate. If that wont work; they see how low you will go. Then they find someone to do it cheaper. 

Price is the name of the game with them. They have really been turning up the pressure on vendors; but yet that flat rate has remained flat for over 3 years!!!

Before I end my rant :wallbash:

Let me add; over the past year they have been going thru tremendous change. New managers/coordinators/entire state teams being switched! That is probably one of their biggest downfalls.


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## Guest

*Setting up a new business: Structure and workers*

Hi all,

I have just set up a new Property Preservation business and am looking for advive on how to setup and pay for crews.

Right now I am paying hourly. The problem I am finding with that is that when unsupervised the workers tend to sluff off (really, they do!). What have some of you folks that have been doing this awhile found works best? 

Thanks in advance for your help!

Jon


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## Guest

*Hazardous waste disposal*

What do you guys do with your hazardous waste from trashouts? 

I have heard of some folks having a whole crew devoted to disposing of hazmats. i.e pouring the paint out on boards, recycling oil, etc.

I am interested in any things you might be doing to reduce the cost of hazmat disposal while still making sure it is disposed of properly.

Thanks in advance!

Jon


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## Guest

*Insurance for Property Preservation companies.*

I got my GL and E&O through a company called York Jersey. They have a special program set up for folks like us. The price was reasonable as well.





djpp said:


> unless you know your going to get the capital back from whatever company is requesting it, i would not get it. it is an expensive insurance that in most cases your GL should cover anyways. IMO, just make sure your reasearching the company that requests it. talk to your insurance agent as well to debate if you actually need that type of insurance as well. it is not necessary for most companies to begin with. GL on your ventures :thumbsup:


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## Guest

*companies to work for*

hello i started my company in property preservation last year and was doing great till working with safeguard was like banging my head off a wall they are somthing else so i have dumped them and im in ny and just looking for some one to maybe help me by giving me some assistance on other companys.....

thank you
Robert 

if you dont want to say it in here just e-mail me at [email protected]


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## Guest

*Corporate Asset Management*

Hello to All,

I'm getting started in No. Colorado. Has anybody signed up for this REO Preservatoin Network? Any luck with new business?:jester:


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## APlusPPGroup

BOM ~ 

Here's the link to CAMREO's vendor signup page. Note that there's a signup fee of $299 to become a "preferred vendor". 

https://www.camreo.com/preservation/

The problem with paying to be a preferred vendor is that anyone can be one. All you're paying for are leads - you're not actually guaranteed any work. Plus, you're not actually guaranteed the leads because there may be 50 other "preferred vendors" in your area.

Unless you're out in the boonies where no one else will go, I can't see paying the fee. And then, again, if you're in the boonies there may not be any work. So you kind of have to figure out for yourself if it's worth the cost.

BTW. If *ANYONE* tells you that they can guarante xxx amount of work by signing a contract, franchise or otherwise, carefully consider why they're "selling" it to you in the first place. They may be passing bad clients on to you or contracts that don't mean a thing if their client decides to use another company. It's best to sign the contract directly with the client, not a middle-man. Third party contracts are bad news.

In this industry, there are NO guarantees.

Good luck.

Linda


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## Guest

Hi all,
I am filling out a quiz, I am intrested in doing some REO work. Have a tough time finding some of the answers. I was hoping you guys could help or direct me where I can find the answers at. 
1) during a trash out you notice there is a motorcyle in very good condition in detached garage, what should you do? 
2)describe services performed during a trash-out?
I have most of the info on a trash out just want to see if I missed any of them. 
Thanks in advance


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## Guest

*Starting a Property Preservation Co.*

Hello to All,
So my mother and I have decided to embark on a new family venture and start a Property Pres. Company. We have years of experience in the real estate foreclosure industry and have worked very closely with Freddie mac, Fannie Mae HUD and VA housing so guidelines aren't really a concern for us. My father owns a construction company so we will have the ability to partner with them . However I am doing my best to gather all the information possible before jumping into this and this site has been a great help. Linda your post are an amazing source for both inspiration and guidance and I thank you. I was wondering if anyone knew of any other areas I can search to be well informed of all the aspects of this business. 

Thank you in advance,
Lauren


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## Guest

*Removing Vehicles*

Hi Everyone;

Just wanted to introduce myself and say hello. My husband and I have been doing REO cleanups & preservation work for the last year or so after we saw our commercial cleaning business slow significantly due to the economy. Lots of hard (dirty) work but we've found that it's definitely helped to pay the bills. Thanks also to Linda who has been a great resource on this forum. Anyone just starting out should make sure you go back and read all of her posts.

Dugann, in response to your question about the motorcycle, it's considered a vehicle (as is a boat - see previous posts for Linda's unfortunate experience with the broker) and must be submitted to the DMV for paperwork processing. You are not permitted to claim ownership of an abandoned vehicle (including cars, motorcycles, boats, RVs, etc.) on any property. The vehicle must be submitted to the DMV for all paperwork and processing.

Many states require that in order to remove an abandoned vehicle from private property, you must contact a licensed dealer or repairer operating a tow service and have the vehicle towed by a registered wrecker (check your phone book or online directory) 

We haven't personally used this service but I know of a few Realtors who have: "JunkMyCar DOT com" (sorry, I couldn't post hyperlinks) – they’re nationwide and they’ll remove vehicles for free (I would assume they'll do motorcycles too), take care of the paperwork, etc. etc. (you can even book a removal online). 


You can also try this site (it's _not_ a government site though) to search for local offices in your area: "DMV DOT org".

Hope this helps


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## Guest

Greetings to all,

I was reading this thread & wanted to chime in. I run a regional field services company here in GA. & wanted to offer some insight that I have experienced in this industry. Since i expanded my base in 04, I have dealt with many new companies that wanted to get started in PP. During that time I have noted a cycle that usually happens with some new companies. It goes like this..

The cycle starts like this- they contact me wanting work, then I give them some work, then they want MORE work to make lots of money, then when I comply and give them more work due to the good job that they are doing- they start to get "overworked" despite their initial requests for "more work" Then comes declined work, then requests to be paid more, then the feeling that I NEED them creeps in & then they start making demands & telling me what they are & are not going to do & how they want to do things.. Does anyone see something wrong with this? I don't like having to remind people that I am their client, not vise-versa. If I resorted to the same cycle that they did, Id be out of business which Is not my goal. In business you work hard to retain & grow your client list & if you cannot give %100 percent to each then you might be in the wrong business or you might want to scale back your expectations. 

I hope this helps the new entries in to this and other types of business


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## Guest

*Am I crazy?*

Hello Everyone,
Greetings from Southeastern Michigan! I'm happy to have found you all I have plenty of questions. After reading many of these threads I'm having mixed feelings about the pp biz. I'm glad to have knowledgeable people who are willing to share but it is also a bit discouraging.(reality check I suppose)Let me first say that I have quite a few "eggs" in this basket right now and I would appreciate any and as much feed back as possible. My unemployment will run out this Sept. and also I have night classes that will resume around the same time. I'm hoping to have this business functional and bringing in some money by then. I have invested quite a bit of time and energy and some money & I'm wondering, if I should cut my losses and focus on college full time or see this thing through. I've been researching online for months, I bought the book by JT Stewart and I feel like my previous work experience has prepared me pretty well to handle just about whatever comes my way; I ran my own drywall co. for 12 yrs, I'm a journeyman carpenter, I did flooring for a few years, I owned a lawn landscaping and snow plow business for 2 yrs, I've had 4 rental homes at once, I have run crews as big as 10 guys, I've been in charge of some big projects and I am not scared of hard work. I also spent the past 6 mos in the field services industry and I am familiar w/taking photos and downloading them and the many forms necessary to be filled out online. I currently have a newer 3/4 ton truck, 14' trailer, 54"walk-behind mower and other necessary lawn equipment, hand tools, generator, air compressor etc. In addition to my sept. time frame I have about $4000 to pay my insurances, dump fees, fuel and help till I can get money flowing in. I do have my LLC & fedI.D.# I'm waiting for quotes on GL and E&O(should I even bother w/E&O?) I feel like this is realistic for me but I'm a little gun shy due to my timing and the economic climate during some of my past ventures. Any input, advice or encouragement would be greatly appreciated. I'm also wondering what kind of licensing these other companies are claiming to have and how necessary it is to get started. Is it just a business license? Also, are there good companies out there to work for or are they all just trying to get over? Am I crazy for tryin? :w00t:


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## APlusPPGroup

LesTyler ~ You're welcome for the info & experiences. I wish I could get in here and post more but we're super busy right now and life is totally crazy.

I'm looking for a preservation contractor in Helena, Montana, or surrounding areas right now. I've got ONE property that requires an inspection and securing. But, after this one, there may be several more and I don't have coverage at the moment.

Also, I'm planning on holding field training classes soon in Las Vegas, Nevada, and Phoenix, Arizona.

I have properties available for training but I need to know if there are people who need to train close to home in order to save on the travel expenses.

I'm actually going to each state to train my trainers, who have already trained here in California that have proven to be exceptional people. This will most likely be the only time that I'll be there personally to conduct the training. After this, my trainers will be able to train new startups.

So, if anyone's interested in Phoenix or Las Vegas hands-on training, contact me at [email protected]. Each class will take up to 12 people. As soon as each class is full, I'll set the schedule and let everyone know.

To all of the experienced vendors who are sending files for me to review or new business owners requesting startup information, I apologize for not getting back with you. I'm literally swamped with work right now and back to working 18-hour days.

To all, have an awesome week, and I'll come back and post when I can. There are a lot of new things going on in the industry and field service management is changing a lot.

Linda


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## brm1109

I am thinking of signing up with a national company. They mentioned that I would have to buy an initial setup of locks to have on hand. Is there a certain kind of locks to purchase that are universal used this way I can try to shop around?
Thanks


----------



## Guest

*get rolling*

Hi im just getting started with property preservation on my own, i have been trained by a good friend who also just started his preservation business and does not have enough work to subcontract my business. i know how to inspect,maidservice,trashout,lawn maintenance etc; i am currently soliciting safe guard and banks. i have not been picked up and desperate for work, does anyone have ideas or any one willng to pick me up in fresno, ca wanting to take over the cental valley.:clap:


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## Guest

brm1109 said:


> I am thinking of signing up with a national company. They mentioned that I would have to buy an initial setup of locks to have on hand. Is there a certain kind of locks to purchase that are universal used this way I can try to shop around?
> Thanks


You will need to buy the locks they specify, you can start with about 5 each and should be under $200. We buy from MFS Supply (.com) and they ship them pretty fast. Make sure you are on board first with actual work orders. We are 'signed up' with many national vendors but not all of the m give us work.


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## Guest

*Preservation books...*

I came across a preservation book on the internet a few months back and now I can't find it. It was called somthing like 'how to get in without breaking anything" or ' breaking in without breaking anything'. If anyone knows the title or has read it let me know. I'd like to buy it for my crew.


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## Guest

Hi Vikki,

Currently my company works exclusively for Safeguard. It took 2 months for them to contact me initially after I applied. After I passed their tests and requirements it moved very fast.

So far they have been ok to work for. They pay me once a week (after the first 30 days) so that is nice. My big complaint is that they do not spend much time helping you learn their system and what you can and cannot bill for.

After you figure out that it is fairly smooth. The other grip I have is that they take 25% of your invoice but I guess that is the price you pay for steady work.

Good luck!

Jon
Pennington Properties
612-360-0815





3DVikki said:


> Hi guys, Im looking for info on how to get into the REO property preservation. My husband and I have a cleaning company in Phoenix and we clean for Property Management companies. I would like to branch off to REOs. I wondered if anyone works with Safe Guard or First American Field Service. I have applied on line for both. It my understanding that they are the middle man between me that the Bank. Im wondering if they are reliable companys to work for, or if there is another way to go about this.
> Thanks in advance for any help and suggestions.
> 
> Vikki
> [email protected]


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## Guest

*Thermopane Windows*

I have been getting a lot of broken thermopane widows lately. As most of the windows are custom what is the best way to bid them out? Also who do you have create the new inserts? 

Thanks in advance!

Jon
PennProp


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## Guest

Hi Linda
I have a P P in Las Vegas NV Looking to extend a bit
Have experience 4 years. If you have anything going in this area please let us know
Thx
Steve


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## Guest

*REo and Property Preservation*

Frot the most part the only pay what HUD allows, and of course you have to discount it. They require documentation out the yang and are very particular about how it is submitted, or you don't get paid. And, they are not real good about notifying you if you have dotted a T and crossed an I and they are holding your check. 

There can be good money in it and there is going to be much more of the work available. You have to pick and choose, just like anything else. If you have an established client base you can probably make more elsewhere.


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## Guest

*PP+RE Broker + Home Inspector*

Hi All -

Very interesting thread here on PP. My friend and I are starting a PP business. He also wants to do Home Inspections. He already does a lot of general maintenance/repair work. 

On the other hand, I have years of experience in business, project managment, and am a professional software developer. I am also getting my Real Estate Agent and Broker Licenses. So the view is I would handle the front end of the business, the website, billing, marketing, etc, while he would handle the actual work of PP, Home Inspections, Maintenance/repair work, and give quotes, etc.

Here are my questions:
1. I have heard that in CA (where we are located) Home inspectors aren't allowed to do any work on a property for a year after they inspected the home. (Presumably to avoid conflict of interst.) Is there any similar regulation regarding PP and home repair?

2. When I bought my house in CA last month, my agent said she could not take referral fees from contractors she recommended for repairs, due to appearance of Kickbacks. Does that mean that if I was a listing agent on a house, we could not have our PP business do the trashout, etc?

Thanks and best,

PPagent


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## Guest

Hey everyone, i know i've been away for a while but business has really picked up. Hello linda how are things in cali??? I've seen alot of posting regarding national companies and i just wanted to throw in my two cents....I've just disconnected from my last national company and i have to say good ridence. I guess they are good for companies or people just starting out, but they are more pain and problem then good and profit. They want everthing discounted, and then take their "admin fee" of usually 25%...they are very quick to not pay you or fine you for wrong doings or mistakes but they never reward you for their mistakes...i used to be with safeguard, nfs, srms to name a few and i have to say local realtors are the way to go. they are easier to work with and for, more personable, and better rates, the only down side is they only get a certain number of properties and until they sell them they dont get more so you really have to hit the pavement and find alot of them but in the long run its well worth it in your pocket book.


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## Guest

*Wow what a wealth of info*



Kevin B/ said:


> Hello Everyone,
> Greetings from Southeastern Michigan! I'm happy to have found you all I have plenty of questions. After reading many of these threads I'm having mixed feelings about the pp biz. I'm glad to have knowledgeable people who are willing to share but it is also a bit discouraging.(reality check I suppose)Let me first say that I have quite a few "eggs" in this basket right now and I would appreciate any and as much feed back as possible. My unemployment will run out this Sept. and also I have night classes that will resume around the same time. I'm hoping to have this business functional and bringing in some money by then. I have invested quite a bit of time and energy and some money & I'm wondering, if I should cut my losses and focus on college full time or see this thing through. I've been researching online for months, I bought the book by JT Stewart and I feel like my previous work experience has prepared me pretty well to handle just about whatever comes my way; I ran my own drywall co. for 12 yrs, I'm a journeyman carpenter, I did flooring for a few years, I owned a lawn landscaping and snow plow business for 2 yrs, I've had 4 rental homes at once, I have run crews as big as 10 guys, I've been in charge of some big projects and I am not scared of hard work. I also spent the past 6 mos in the field services industry and I am familiar w/taking photos and downloading them and the many forms necessary to be filled out online. I currently have a newer 3/4 ton truck, 14' trailer, 54"walk-behind mower and other necessary lawn equipment, hand tools, generator, air compressor etc. In addition to my sept. time frame I have about $4000 to pay my insurances, dump fees, fuel and help till I can get money flowing in. I do have my LLC & fedI.D.# I'm waiting for quotes on GL and E&O(should I even bother w/E&O?) I feel like this is realistic for me but I'm a little gun shy due to my timing and the economic climate during some of my past ventures. Any input, advice or encouragement would be greatly appreciated. I'm also wondering what kind of licensing these other companies are claiming to have and how necessary it is to get started. Is it just a business license? Also, are there good companies out there to work for or are they all just trying to get over? Am I crazy for tryin? :w00t:


 
I totally agree Kevin, this is a bit discouraging. I have spent some time now reading this whole thread. And I am glad I did, I almost went to bed and was going to get up tomorrow and call Lindas company for advice. Now that I have read through the whole thing including her rant...LOL I am glada that I did not go that route
I worked for a home property mgmt company in West Palm Bch years ago, actually I worked for the guy who worked for them. I have done alot of construction and home improvement work in the past and am absolutley sick of working in a factory and for someone else. My wife was a realtor until the birth of our twins 2 years ago and now her license is in escrow. We have always talked about some of our aspirations someday being realty investing for her and for me a property mgmt company. Actually my wife has always been more of the entrepreneurial spirited one, I was always too scared to be a risk taker. Well now I have really been dreaming about owning a PP company of my own and living in Michigan, albeit on the west coast of MI, there is plenty of work, or at least I think there is?
I dont have near the experience some of you have, like Kevin, but I have enough from southern Florida to know all about the basics of construction adn I have done the trash outs myself of vacant foreclosed homes. I know all about cleaning up human waste, used condoms, crack pipes, and fearing for your safety....you name it!
Now after reading through this whole thread, I fear that I, as usual, am a day late and a dollar short:sad:
I really wanted to do this, but seems like alot of negatives in here and the business has changed and not so good anymore.......dont laugh, but I really had a dream of being the next Maxim Enterprises and maybe someday expanding to a onestop realty/property investing and property mgmt company with my wife. I have been doing quite a bit of research on this business, but never found as much info as I have until finding this thread. I have googled business names (dont want to have any trademark violations), licensing, insurance and bonding (thats a lil confusing to me) I have researched a few sites that sell training books and videos, one for around 80-100$ w w w dot foreclosure-cleaning-business dot com and one for $200 wwwdot cleanoutforeclosuresdot com . I thought that maybe I could start this part time and schedule on the weekends or in the mornings (I am a 2nd shifter at my job) My wife has contacts from being a realtor....although I know thats no guarantee for me getting business. I just wanted ot speak up and air my thoughts, especially after seeing a guy get chastised for doing whatever it was he did without introducing himself first.
Linda you seem awesome, wish I could afford to come and train under you, financially thats not an option though. I cant believe its 6 am and light out...I have been reading this and other sites about this all night for 2 nights in a row now....LoL. Would you guys believe there are homes that are'nt '_that bad'_ here in Muskegon, MI for 5,900.00$...foreclosures everywhere. Anyway I guess I will try emailing you Linda, although it seems as though you are an awful busy woman and somewhat frustrated lately about people contacting you.....if I am reading your posts correctly? Dont want to be a bother to you or anyone, it's just this site has so many people that know what I want and need to know and this really is a big desire of mine. Did I mention how much I want to work for myself, own my own business and hate working for someone else and in a factory

Brandon James


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## Guest

*Another thing*

Where can I find study materials to study necessary knowledge to passy any exams I might have to take for the state of Michigan??

Thanks alot for any help:thumbsup:


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## Guest

First of all you guys are crazy. P&P is not the next get rich quick scheme. The only people that you would make rich is this linda for giving training courses on her business. If you get involved with a good middle man company you will have to follow there rules. Also there are toooo many hacks that got involved in the business ruined homes and skipped town. That is why this is all messed up. If any of you are serious about doing this get involved with a good company or direct with banks. They will tell you what needs to be done. You don't need to listen to someone else who will charge you, tell you this is how i do it...blah blah blah. In this fiedl you are your own boss you do things your way. No one can tell you how to reglze windows pump basements, etc. If you don't have business sense then don't do it. period. If you cant act like the boss dont be the boss. Its that easy. Stop looking on here for work and get out and look. The internet will show you tons of ideas. DO NOT BUY P&Pbooks, training classes or whatever. There is no licensing for P&P. Dont spend money before you make money.


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## Guest

*WOW who pissed in your wheaties?*

you are one negative guy. I never said this was a get rich quick scheme, did I? I said I really wanted to do this and hopefully find succes and expand into other areas with my wife...I have worked hard al my life and I know nothing is going to come easy. There are several reasons I want to do this, 1. Make money being my own boss and owning a company 2. To see if I can do it? be a business owner and be successful...the American dream 3. The opportunities to possibly donate things of need to Needy families and my church. 4. Create a door to other possibilities with my wife for businesses. 5. To take pride in cleaning up neighborhoods and get the houses back in shape for a new owner and for the neighbors. And yes, to hopefull eventually find some financial freedom and freedom with our time.


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## Guest

Izaana said:


> you are one negative guy. I never said this was a get rich quick scheme, did I? I said I really wanted to do this and hopefully find succes and expand into other areas with my wife...I have worked hard al my life and I know nothing is going to come easy. There are several reasons I want to do this, 1. Make money being my own boss and owning a company 2. To see if I can do it? be a business owner and be successful...the American dream 3. The opportunities to possibly donate things of need to Needy families and my church. 4. Create a door to other possibilities with my wife for businesses. 5. To take pride in cleaning up neighborhoods and get the houses back in shape for a new owner and for the neighbors. And yes, to hopefull eventually find some financial freedom and freedom with our time.


HAHAHA, No im sorry it came out wrong. I read your post and it sounded like you were turning away discouraged. I was ticked about that. If you want to do it. GO FOR IT. Look around for something online. Seems like everyone is looking for help now and go for it. Im with you in this. I wish you good luck. My fault for sounding bad. I was worked up because it seems like this is turning out to be a get rich scheme for a lot of people. Hosting training classes? With what credentials? Its crazy. But to you...GOOD LUCK AND GO FOR IT!!!


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## Guest

Thanks for explaining, and sorry if I jumped the gun a little quick. Remember that everyone has a story and every persons story is different from anyone elses. And also, quick to one person, might not be quick to another at all. And on the money subject, the same principal applies. I would consider myself kind of rich if I made 150K (profit) a year, someone else might look at that and laugh?? I am desperate to find something I enjoy and can make a good or even decent living at that gives me some freedoms and satisfaction. I am finding harder and harder to walk into work each and every day now, dreaming about driving up to a job in a truck with MY company name on it and checking on one of my crews. I am a supervisor in a office furniture manufacturing setting and sick and tired of the BS in factories. I dont see the sky from 2pm when I get to work until the next day. I babysit a bunch of ungrateful spoiled adult babies that make over 20$ an hour and get more vacation time than us salary people do. I just want out, I want ot run my own show, I wanna shot at it. 
I have come up with a list of items I feel I need before starting this venture and am wondering if my list is overkill?? Also I must add that my wife and I are not going to do this unless we get a green light from God first.....any efforts without His approval would be futile, like building a house on sand. Here is my list, let me know if I am way off???
Well I will have to do this tomorrow, The Xcel spread it is in that I emailed myself from work tonight is in a brand new Office, I have the older office version here at home and it won't open it. But I can tell you that with a dump truck and all the supplies I could think of and the $180 for license, I came up with almost 16K. I cannot for the life of me find anywhere a rough estimate of what insurance and getting bonded would cost, with out filling a bunch of crap out on line for insurance quotes....right now I just want a rough estimate.


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## Guest

Izaana said:


> Thanks for explaining, and sorry if I jumped the gun a little quick. Remember that everyone has a story and every persons story is different from anyone elses. And also, quick to one person, might not be quick to another at all. And on the money subject, the same principal applies. I would consider myself kind of rich if I made 150K (profit) a year, someone else might look at that and laugh?? I am desperate to find something I enjoy and can make a good or even decent living at that gives me some freedoms and satisfaction. I am finding harder and harder to walk into work each and every day now, dreaming about driving up to a job in a truck with MY company name on it and checking on one of my crews. I am a supervisor in a office furniture manufacturing setting and sick and tired of the BS in factories. I dont see the sky from 2pm when I get to work until the next day. I babysit a bunch of ungrateful spoiled adult babies that make over 20$ an hour and get more vacation time than us salary people do. I just want out, I want ot run my own show, I wanna shot at it.
> I have come up with a list of items I feel I need before starting this venture and am wondering if my list is overkill?? Also I must add that my wife and I are not going to do this unless we get a green light from God first.....any efforts without His approval would be futile, like building a house on sand. Here is my list, let me know if I am way off???
> Well I will have to do this tomorrow, The Xcel spread it is in that I emailed myself from work tonight is in a brand new Office, I have the older office version here at home and it won't open it. But I can tell you that with a dump truck and all the supplies I could think of and the $180 for license, I came up with almost 16K. I cannot for the life of me find anywhere a rough estimate of what insurance and getting bonded would cost, with out filling a bunch of crap out on line for insurance quotes....right now I just want a rough estimate.


0. to start. sub it out. get someone with the truck, sub a grass crew, etc. You will need bout 3500 a year for the insurances. some cites require bonding, but it is small. Contact the company you are thinking of working with and they will get you a sheet of what they need. You can start out small. locks, etc you will need but that is no more than 300 bucks to start and that will get you a lot. Most of these companies use there own billing software anyhow, you dont need a nasa computer.


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## Guest

Forgive me for sounding so ignorant....but if all I am doing is having others do the work by subbing it out, and these co.'s like Safeguard arent good to work with and dont pay very well at all, as many have said in here...then how do I make any money?


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## Guest

No one said it was easy!


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## Guest

I must be missing something here, I remember learning in the first basic business class in college 'Business 101' the one reason people go into business is to make a profit and the business of business is business....period. So something isn't adding up to me or I just have'nt been getting enough sleep. I know my patience level is not what it needs to be for a place like this. And since your not allowed to email miss Linda with any questions...I guess I am out to seek answers and instruction elsewhere.

Thats funny to me that you would say "no one said it was easy" the way I look at it is, the easy (lazy) way is to sub everything out and do nothing and make very little $$

LMBO


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## Guest

Hello!

I wanted to find out if anyone has ever worked with RFS? I have recieved their contract and before i sign it i want to make sure i get some feedback on if they pay ontime and how they are to work for.

What about FAS?

Anyone who has or is working with either company and can give me feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks! 

Sarah


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## Guest

Izaana said:


> I must be missing something here, I remember learning in the first basic business class in college 'Business 101' the one reason people go into business is to make a profit and the business of business is business....period. So something isn't adding up to me or I just have'nt been getting enough sleep. I know my patience level is not what it needs to be for a place like this. And since your not allowed to email miss Linda with any questions...I guess I am out to seek answers and instruction elsewhere.
> 
> Thats funny to me that you would say "no one said it was easy" the way I look at it is, the easy (lazy) way is to sub everything out and do nothing and make very little $$
> 
> LMBO


:thumbsup: That is why over 97% of all businesses fail within their first year of being in business. Sorry to report that we have been going strong for 26 years.


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## Guest

My husband and I are trying to start the same kind of business in Ga.. But wondering where we got to get good insurance rates for E&O, general liability, and workers compensation... We've talked to a few,i.e. State Farm and another but they don't seem familiar with this type of coverage. Any help here would be great. Thanks!


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## Guest

audie17 said:


> My husband and I are trying to start the same kind of business in Ga.. But wondering where we got to get good insurance rates for E&O, general liability, and workers compensation... We've talked to a few,i.e. State Farm and another but they don't seem familiar with this type of coverage. Any help here would be great. Thanks!


You dont need E&O, unless you are a real estate broker doing BPO's
For general liability you need to talk to a commercial insurance company. If you are a licensed contractor you can contact a contractors insurance broker.

This is my insurance broker... http://www.williamscontractorinsurance.com/aboutus.html

Call her and she may point you in the right direction.

Brian


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## Guest

Thanks! I will shoot them an email.


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## Guest

Izaana said:


> I must be missing something here, I remember learning in the first basic business class in college 'Business 101' the one reason people go into business is to make a profit and the business of business is business....period. So something isn't adding up to me or I just have'nt been getting enough sleep. I know my patience level is not what it needs to be for a place like this. And since your not allowed to email miss Linda with any questions...I guess I am out to seek answers and instruction elsewhere.
> 
> Thats funny to me that you would say "no one said it was easy" the way I look at it is, the easy (lazy) way is to sub everything out and do nothing and make very little $$
> 
> LMBO


Dont listen to him. And don;t waist your time trying to work with a national asset company, they are cheap bastards.
Start looking for and talking to realtors and brokers who specialize in listing REO properties.
Once th national preservation company does their initial lock changes and minimal repairs (if any) they turn the property over to the brokers. Then it is HIS responsibility to clean up the property, i.e. cleaning, repairs, electrical, plumbing, etc. Whatever it needs, from a new roof, to new carpet or paint. It's the brokers responsibility, and the banks will keep them on task.

The brokers call me, I give them a bid, they submit the bid to the banks, the bank approves the bid, the broker calls me back, then I do the work. The procces might take a couple days, or a couple weeks. 
Sometimes the broker pays me directly and gets reimbursed by the bank. SOmetimes the bank pays me direct. It all depends. Sometimes they pay fast, some times they pay slow...

BTW, the only thing the other guy was right about.. SUB IT ALL OUT.
I'm too busy doing bids. I haven't touch a tool in months. 

good luck.


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## Guest

OK how in the heck do you private message in this darn thing?


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## Guest

Hello to all, this is my 1st post. After reading everything I felt as if I should reply. To the guy that works in the factory and is tired of it, I know where you are coming from. I used to work in a chemical factory, 12 hr shifts for 3 years. I hated it! My neighbors house was foreclosed on and I went over and talked to the guys performing the PP work. We hit it off really well and have kept in touch every week for over 3 years. He told me to google search Property Preservation, so I did. I was hooked. I submitted my info to every national company, or anyone I could find. BAM, I got a bite! I went out on a limb, quit the plant, and have been going wide open for 2 years. I hired my mom the 1st of the year, she does inspections and is a part-time secratery. Just last week, I brought my wife in. She is a LPN, but now she is my full time secretary. I do quite a bit of the work myself, but I do also have a sub who does alot of the work as well. So, don't give up, if you set your mind to it you can do it. But you definitly have to be the Boss type. There are alot of decisions you will have to make (hard ones) hiring the right people & firing the wrong ones who do not fit your business. I am 32, and I am very proud of what has come out of this venture, however, I always keep my eyes and ears open for the next one. I don't know how long this will last but I believe in being adaptable. By the way, I'm not boasting, I just wanted to give people some encouragement. And remember, not everything is meant for everyone. Guess that's why I'm a contractor and not doctor making millions per hour.:thumbup:


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## Guest

*Bids too low...*

yes, i'm just starting out in the reo clean out and preservation biz after having been in real estate, construction, and mortgage industries my whole life (thanks to my parents:thumbup, and i now have my first few jobs after only a few months of pounding the pavement. 

Like brian says in the sticky note on this forum about pricing, i've done that. however i'm begining to think that i'm getting all these bids because i'm bidding too LOW

yes, pricing is a very tricky thing. once you account for your overhead and other various expenses, then it becomes about what you feel you, your services are worth. 

but i don't want to price myself out of the game. i really don't know what to do. yeah, i'm making 'enough', but have a gut feeling that i should be charging more. 

i haven't done any HUD's/FHA's yet, but am TOTALLY aware of their guidelines, and my pricing usually follows theirs unless i get a property that's just a complete mess(6 tons of garbage!-yep that happened, my dump fees were through the roof)

well, any input is supremely welcomed and appreciated! 

angela
(san francisco bay area)


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## APlusPPGroup

XanadooLTD said:


> I was worked up because it seems like this is turning out to be a get rich scheme for a lot of people. Hosting training classes? With what credentials? Its crazy. But to you...GOOD LUCK AND GO FOR IT!!!


You are correct about one thing, Xanadoo. This is not a "get rich quick" industry. Many startups, in fact, go broke trying to make a living from it and even those with a little cash up front have a difficult time waiting for the 45 to 60 day payments to come in. By the time payments start coming in their cash is gone and the money just barely covers the bills.

Field training is also not a get rich quick scheme. It takes quite a bit of time and effort to coordinate a class and by the end of the training, everyone's beat. But at least they know a lot more about doing the work and HUD guidelines than they did going in. And it's a darn sight more than they are ever going to learn from someone who discourages them by feeding them "realities" such as yours.

I've had many who cannot afford the training class and I've trained several for free, based on their proximity to the training and their circumstances. But they all have one thing in common. Motivation, drive, and a willingness to work hard. For me, that can be worth way more than all the money in the world.

For obvious reasons, "giving" the class away for free not always an option, because the clients get the properties cleaned up for free or next to nothing in exchange for being able to use the property to do the training. Many times the money I make on the training is what I would have made if I'd just done the job myself.

In other instances, I've recommended that people find a mentor if they can't find training. In others whose circumstances put them just at the edge financially, I've recommended they find a job instead of trying to get into something that will put them further behind before they start to get ahead.

So before you go spouting off at how rich "this linda" is getting, find out first what she does and the way she does it. Then, if your small mind can figure out the WHY, then maybe there's hope for you. I'll give you a couple of hints. 

1.) I don't add vendors to my system who can't provide proof of their experience. This is not a job you can just come into with no experience. Anyone can say they can do this but, when I hold training classes, I get to take a good look at the trainees up close and, by the end of every class, I know who I can work with and who I cannot. 

2.) The quality of the work needs to be there so that the industry shines as a whole. I've heard enough crap about the PP industry and know that's its reputation is in the spotlight right now and not looking good. My hope is to put more qualified people on the jobs and start turning things around. We're not going to do it if someone's not making the effort to make a difference. There are several other major companies I'm working with who are doing the exact same thing and for the exact same reasons. So far, we're succeeding.

I have several really good vendors working with my company that came to us through the training classes. Many are busier than any of us thought they would be. But because they know what they're doing and are willing to take the time to learn more, they give our clients what they want in order to keep them coming back for more. The only time I can't put a trainee to work is when they're in an area where there simply isn't any.

Training benefits both parties. They feel more confident starting off and I feel confident that they've got a good amount of the basic skills they're going to need to do the job properly. Everyone that trains with us knows they can come back to any session anytime to learn something new at NO ADDITIONAL CHARGE. [Get rich quick, you say? Hardly.]

And, just to clarify something to everyone here regarding people contacting me. I offered help to a person early into this discussion. From there, it escalated out of control where my time was concerned. It doesn't mean I'm not willing to help at all. I love people and I love finding time to come back here and post. Lately, that's been impossible with my work load.

I have met a lot of people through this site and work with several of them already. But, early on, I had more time to spend with people needing information. With the moratoriums ending and work flowing in again, there simply aren't enough hours in a day to get my work done AND answer all the e-mails I receive.

Myself and many others have posted quite a bit of information here but very few people have read beyond the first page where my offer of help is. What I've been trying to tell everyone with my so-called "rants" is that much of the information you're looking for is right here and I'm not the only one providing solid insights into the industry. Many of us are trying to give you the bad, along with the good, so that you understand the necessity of keeping your eyes and ears open for trends with the AMs.

Sending e-mails before you read all the way through this discussion can also indicate there is a possibility you may not read work orders all the way through either. And, trust me, that comment is in NO WAY intended to offend anyone. But skipping around and not really reading these posts can hurt you more than help you.

BTW, Xanadoo. I don't make my living off the backs of others, as you seem to be implying. I have 2 preservation companies and I work in the field myself and, when I sub a job out, I'm actually losing money. My rates, however, are far better than any you're going to find working with Safeguard, FAS, MCS, FAFS, or any of the others so my subs make good money.

The percentage I get from what my vendors do is a lot less than the more popular nationals and I'm already back to working 14 to 18 hours a day, 7 days a week to make sure all the work gets out to the vendors the minute it comes in and the results get to the client BEFORE their deadline. In other words, I earn every penny I make.

I congratulate you on your 26 years in business. Maybe it's been too long for you and you've forgotten how the marketing game is played and how long it can take to actually build a successful clientele that leads to a successful business. One of the things we you and I both do is put people to work. Are you still marketing to provide more work? I am constantly marketing and add 2 to 3 new clients a week. Some have a lot of work and some just have a little. But we're grateful for every job that comes our way. I hope you can say that.

Linda


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## Guest

Linda,
I appologize, the "rant" statement came out wrong and wasn't intended to be a negative connotation towards or about you. Is there a way to contact you....I for the life of me cant find the PM function here??
I had an appointment with the organization SCORE this morning and they made a mistake and told me today was the appt. when in actuality it is next Monday. 

I know I dont have to have a builders license....but I am trying to find out how to go about getting it here in Michigan anyway....it is somewthing I have always wanted to learn, know and have. Now I am finding that in Michigan, you have to take a 60 hour class at the cost of $750 and then take the test. Anyway.....I would love to have your training, but as I stated before....its a long way from Muskegon, MI to where you are


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## APlusPPGroup

No need to apologize. I wasn't offended in the least and I was going to PM you this morning but your profile is not set up to send or receive messages for some reason. 

Go ahead and send me an e-mail. I'd like to talk.

Thanks!

Linda


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## Guest

I'd turn it on if I could find it...LOL The PM thingy that is


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## Guest

*Lawsuit: All REO Preservation Services*

Please be advised that All REO Preservation Services, Linda Hall, and others have been named in a lawsuit in California, Riverside County Superior Court Case Number RIC529387


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## Guest

*Lawsuit: All REO Preservation Services*

Hey? Are there any other victims of shaddy property preservation groups? You know the type...who steal your property, break into your home, fail to give you notice beforehand. 

Especially those who falsely claim to be federal agents, or employed by The Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (The F.D.I.C.) all in an effort to commit crimes.

If so, blog me


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## APlusPPGroup

Since terrorizing me isn't working, I can see you've decided to see if you can ruffle my feathers in public.

After reading your post, Mr. Daire, I was torn between reporting it or responding to it. 

I've decided to leave it here for everyone to see. I'll post post more about this when all is said and done and the fight has been wrapped up in the courts.

In the meantime, be sure to come back and finish what you started. I'm sure you can do better than what you've written here. You have my blessing.

Linda


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## Guest

2633hudson said:


> Please be advised that All REO Preservation Services, Linda Hall, and others have been named in a lawsuit in California, Riverside County Superior Court Case Number RIC529387


 
In this sue happy country people are named every day all over the place in lawsuits....whats your point? You seem to be trying to paint a bad light of Linda, her company and maybe others....all coming from a realtor....LMBO
Why dont you leave your personal and legal stuff somewhere else

:bangin:


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## ARPPP

Hi Linda,

I am a new company and new poster. I felt compelled to write because of the negativity I see beginning. Stay the higher ground and keep giving out the fantastic information and insight that you have been giving. I am a startup with no business yet. I know it will come. I will come back to this site day after day and see what is going on.

Thanks for all you do.
Annette


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## APlusPPGroup

Thank you, Brandon & Annette. Your defense of me is very much appreciated.

I have a good reputation as a fair & honest person in the industry. I'm not worried about what he says and he can post as much as he pleases. 

I've refused to stoop to his level of name-calling, won't give him a response to his e-mailed, texted, and voicemailed threats & allegations, or file a response to his summons so he's resorting to calling me out in public. 

The case goes to court in December. When it's over, I'll post about it. In the meantime, however, we all need to be patient.

Linda


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## Guest

fathersonfab said:


> Dont listen to him. And don;t waist your time trying to work with a national asset company, they are cheap bastards.
> Start looking for and talking to realtors and brokers who specialize in listing REO properties.
> Once th national preservation company does their initial lock changes and minimal repairs (if any) they turn the property over to the brokers. Then it is HIS responsibility to clean up the property, i.e. cleaning, repairs, electrical, plumbing, etc. Whatever it needs, from a new roof, to new carpet or paint. It's the brokers responsibility, and the banks will keep them on task.
> 
> The brokers call me, I give them a bid, they submit the bid to the banks, the bank approves the bid, the broker calls me back, then I do the work. The procces might take a couple days, or a couple weeks.
> Sometimes the broker pays me directly and gets reimbursed by the bank. SOmetimes the bank pays me direct. It all depends. Sometimes they pay fast, some times they pay slow...
> 
> BTW, the only thing the other guy was right about.. SUB IT ALL OUT.
> I'm too busy doing bids. I haven't touch a tool in months.
> 
> good luck.


This is true in some areas, but not all areas. Most areas the national company provides this for the lenders.


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## Guest

*being licensed*

i believe alot of the so called property preservation companies out there are operating illegally! in calif check section 7151.2-business and professions code division 3 chapter 9,contractors article 10,home improvement contract form 7159!
if the project exceeds 500.00, per property, for work upon a residential building or structure,or upon land adjacent thereto,where the contract price exceeds 500.00, for labor ,services and materials,for proposed repairing.remodeling,altering,converting,modernizing. 

i believe that if you are changing locks.doing board ups.winterizing,even trash outs could technically be altering the property, you are operating illegally,without being properly licensed, you are altering the property by doing lock changes,board ups,. alot of people dont know that you really need a building permit to board up windows,there is a thing called egress,people have to be able to escape out a window in a fire,anyways if your not a licensed contractor you shouldnt be on contractor talk in the first place, you shouldnt be subbing out jobs for over 500.00 unless you are the owner of the property, if the state would crack down on un licensed contractors, that would help the preservation business


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## Guest

chip69 said:


> i believe alot of the so called property preservation companies out there are operating illegally! in calif check section 7151.2-business and professions code division 3 chapter 9,contractors article 10,home improvement contract form 7159!
> if the project exceeds 500.00, per property, for work upon a residential building or structure,or upon land adjacent thereto,where the contract price exceeds 500.00, for labor ,services and materials,for proposed repairing.remodeling,altering,converting,modernizing.
> 
> i believe that if you are changing locks.doing board ups.winterizing,even trash outs could technically be altering the property, you are operating illegally,without being properly licensed, you are altering the property by doing lock changes,board ups,. alot of people dont know that you really need a building permit to board up windows,there is a thing called egress,people have to be able to escape out a window in a fire,anyways if your not a licensed contractor you shouldnt be on contractor talk in the first place, you shouldnt be subbing out jobs for over 500.00 unless you are the owner of the property, if the state would crack down on un licensed contractors, that would help the preservation business


You are right about this. A realtor of ours has us do work in several locations that require permits. Even boarding a window costs 35 dollars for the permit.


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## Guest

Well right now I am having a very hard time finding the residential builders prelicensure course here in Michigan that is friendly to 2nd shift working adults, so I don't have my bubilders license yet........So do I have to leave contractortalk.com??


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## Guest

Not every state has regulations on licensing gc's. Check your local state laws on this. Some cities make you register, which they ask for time in business, etc. Depends on where you live or want to service.


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## Guest

*board ups*

in order to get the permit to board up windows in calif, you need to be either a contractor or the homeowner, in calif landscapers need to be licensed -c27 , technically could be needed for yard care?
locksmiths need to be licensed in calif,technically could be needed to do lock changes,re keys? if the total aggregate comes to 500.00 or more for labor ,materials and services--you should be licensed in calif! i have heard that some counties in calif,require a permit to drain a pool,if this is true? you would also need a license to get the needed permit,

a friend of mine that used to work for the c,l,s.b thinks i am correct that doing this work in calif,you need to be a licensed contractor!


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## Guest

What license's are needed to start contacting reo or realtors to clean out bank owned properties? NV and NC states.... thanks for your help!


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## Guest

For the person with the inquiry of a leaking meter. Usually anything more than 5' from the structure is considered the property of the county. Therefore by capping off or trying to terminate the meter may rub the wrong way with county officials and noone wants to do that.


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## Guest

*Liens, Lawsuit, Scum Realtor HELP*

We did a few jobs for a Realtor three months ago and he keeps giving me the run around saying he will pay and he hasn't received reimbursements etc. What he did when he gave us the jobs is he pitched us a price and said if we can do it for that or under we have the job, we have never met a Realtor who has done this before. The standard process is usually they request multiple bids for a job and the seller accepts the best bid. Especially since we found out who one of the asset mgmt companies were, due to signage on the property. Turns out he has been billing the jobs, at least I know this as a fact on one property to this asset company and they show that another company did the job for $200 more than the price he said I could do it for, and get this, he billed it out for reimbursement a month prior to when we did the job. 

I was going to wait until he paid us but he owes us a substantial amount of money and I found out on Friday, according to the asset company he already has been reimbursed. Contacted him Friday asking when I'd get paid, told me I was first in line and he'd let me know Monday, it's now Tuesday have not heard from him. 

Two of the 4 houses have already closed, I wanted to put a lien on one before closing, but he threatened me by saying I will never work for these companies again if I put liens on the properties when in actuality HE will never work for these companies again and CAN have his RE License pulled by the state because he is in breach of his fiduciary LCDORA w/ his client, the seller. 

On one property he told me he sent the check partial payment, this was a few months ago, I asked him where it was as I did not see it the mail, he said he'd check on it, Weeks went by. I contacted him again, he said it bounced back, he said he must have MISREAD my PO BOX and that it shows it not cleared. 

I E-mailed him said I was going to put a lien on a propertyif he did not get it to me now and he lied again, I told hiim we would pick it up at his office and not to mail it, went over to the office a day or so later and got the partial payment check, it was written the day I TOLD HIM we'd go pick it up, so he lied again about mailing the check and it bouncing back, how can one misread a PO BOX? I contacted the selling agent of the property and they were NOT going to give me that name of the Title company and he said I WOULD GET PAID so I waited this has been a few weeks now, still nothing but one partial payment on one job out of 4. 



So. What do I do? Contact the commerce dept? I did, I need to E-mail them my correspondence with him. Contact Board of Realtors? 2. Lawsuit? 3. Liens on these properties even after close, I did not have a pre-lien notice, a lawyer told me I NEEDED one. ? ? What would you/have you done in this situation? 



Thank you!


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## brm1109

I had a similar problem with a contractor who was not paying me. After trying to be nice I had to resort to doing something that I didn't want to. I just went to their showroom everyday when I saw customer's cars and I went in and in a loud voice demanded my money. Two customers even asked me why I was upset and said that they didn't pay their contractors. After the second time, I got my check. 
The funny part is about 3 weeks later they actually called me to do more work, after I told them it was COD they said never mind.
Also tell them that you will be going to the media with it.


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## Guest

sounds like the same company i am having the same problem with,you can e mail me at aaarestoration.com i am really curious ton see if its the same company?


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## Guest

*Interseting thread......*

I stumbled onto this site by Google " Property Preservation services". Great web site plus great info. 

I'm very interested in doing Property Preservation services here in Northern California. I've read this thread and very encouraged by the responds. The pro and cons (haters :sad. By the end of this week I will be legal and running. 

Linda, if you need a sub contractor here in the Sacramento area. Hit me up. I can give up a more detailed info of my business, services provided. I'm ready to "rock and roll". Also I might interested in some "training".

Q in Sac.
Ivey EnviroTech Services.


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## Guest

Hi I just got my first job from spectrum field services..anyone ever heard of them and what their rep is?? I'm a bit trepiditious as they offered 525 to completely clean the house of debris, including flies and maggots in the basement which don't exist unless there are dead carcasses around, mow the lawn and board all the windows. If I did that I would lose money on the job, is that normal compensation for this type of work?? thanx mike


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## APlusPPGroup

It sounds low [from what you describe] but everyone has their own way of pricing services, based on what they see in the inspection photos, and it will all depend on how much actual work is involved in the authorization they sent. 

Q - why don't you go ahead and e-mail me? I tried to PM you a couple days ago but your mailbox here at CT isn't set up.

Linda


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## Guest

thanx for the input. I'm actually fairly busy in my own field of contracting, but figuring on branching out into property preservation, which I did in ct for HUD homes. let me share the property preservation parameters they wanted me to do.

*******IMPORTANT NOTE!!!: Please call from site if work will exceed allowable of $525. If there is an excessive amount of debris present, you will be asked to just submit bids for all initial services. Please ensure bids include removal of all interior/exterior debris and hazards, initial sales clean (with sq ft of property), carpet cleaning (with sq ft of carpet), yard care (with lot size and grass height), number of smoke detectors and light bulbs to be installed (if needed), treatment of health hazards in basement (please be advised, the basement is infested with maggots and flies).
Oh yeah, sounds like a dream come true for 525. Have you heard of spectrum they came as a recommendation from Keystone Mgt. they just called me again for another property project which I will call today on. ​


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## Guest

I wanted to say that the information that I have gleaned from this thread has been immeasureably helpful. I also have to say to those that want to "break" into the business with no experience nor tools are really putting themselves at risk. I have been a contractor for over 40 years and I still run into situations where I need someone else's expertise to get over a difficult problem and I have all the tools, trailers that one can have. the best fit I can see for this business is either a landscape contractor, they have all the tools necessary, the speed and efficacy to get in and get out (my landscape girl takes 30 minutes to mow weed and prune my over 3 acres of lawn) or a regular contractor, though they would need lawn equipment to complete their necessary inventory to do the job. If you are not one of these, good luck. without the accordant knowledge of licensing, insurance (my liability costs 698 a year btw don't forget workmans comp, you have a worker get injured or sick, you are up the proverbial creek and then they come after your home) and local bldg codes you could be in for a rude shock. and frankly unless you are 100% prepared, the money is not especially good, in light of what a good contractor can make. someone had mentioned they'd be happy to make 150K a year in this biz...who wouldn't, but unless you are extremely well organized and are willing to literally kill yourself working, it ain't goin to happen. saying that you can probably make a good living at it if you apply yourself, but again if you are not an already established landscape, renovation or general contractor, stay away, you'll only hurt yourself or others who have the experience to get the job done..
:notworthy


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## APlusPPGroup

drasylum said:


> *******IMPORTANT NOTE!!!: Please call from site if work will exceed allowable of $525. If there is an excessive amount of debris present, you will be asked to just submit bids for all initial services. Please ensure bids include removal of all interior/exterior debris and hazards, initial sales clean (with sq ft of property), carpet cleaning (with sq ft of carpet), yard care (with lot size and grass height), number of smoke detectors and light bulbs to be installed (if needed), treatment of health hazards in basement (please be advised, the basement is infested with maggots and flies).


Michael ~

This is what's called an allowable and a lot of companies have a pre-authorized limit they are willing to spend on each property without going through the bid process. 

What you do is go to the property and, if the work can be done for the maximum allowed, then you are pre-authorized to get it done. If not, you submit a bid instead.

Clients who use a pre-determined allowance are able to cut back on the time it takes to get the job done and doesn't result in wasted trips by the vendors. This way you don't have to go to a property, take the photos, and submit bids on every job.

Allowables are typically for work "up to" the amount they've allowed. Unless it's a flat rate job, you only bill for the services performed, not the whole $525.

Some companies give a flat rate for what they call REO packages where you go in, change the locks, board any windows, remove 1 vehicles, remove up to 50 cubic yards of debris, cut the grass, and clean the house. When you close the flat rate orders, you bill the whole thing every time, even if it was $350 worth of work and your flat rate is $900.

Just be sure to read each work order carefully and understand the parameters for billing. If anything about it is unclear, make a phone call or send an e-mail so you have it in writing. Some companies will say one thing on the phone, then another when you ask why your payment is short.

Not every job will be profitable but there will be some that you will make quite a bit of money on to make up for the others. When your losers start to outweigh the winners, it's time to re-evaluate your relationship with the company you're getting the work from.

BTW. The PP industry has changed dramatically from last year to this year and it's even harder to make a living at it unless you're already established. 

During the moratoriums, many vendors cut their rates so they could keep working. But, by doing this, they caused rate cuts across the nation and now many clients expect all of us to work for next to nothing. 

Those of you who kept their rates where they were supposed to be and survived the down time, good for you. :thumbup: We didn't budge either and I'm glad.

For those who are thinking about getting into it, research as much as possible and weigh your initial expenses against the wait time for payments. Although some companies pay in 7 to 14 days, many pay in 45 to 60 days. Some will extend payments out to 90 and collections are a big headache.

Keep us posted, Michael. I'm sure many of us would like to see where this goes with your new client.

Linda


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## Guest

*be carefull*

be carefull,with the hazards, whatever is causing the maggots,weather its a dead carcass or human feces-there are several diseases that could be caught, sounds like you need to go inspect the property,take photos and submit a bid, just my opinion! be carefull allways,with dealing with bio hazards, let a professional clean it up!


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## Guest

Is there a difference between being bonded and having errors & omission insurance?


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## Guest

Sorry, posted this reply in the wrong section.


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## Guest

*spectrum field services??*

just an update on my new client spectrum field services. I have submitted two bids for two different jobs, one in vt one in ct. the larger job has approx. 4 20 yd. dumpsters of garbage throughout the house, including a full dumpster already on the property, I'm sure the charges are racheting up on that. the flies and maggots are due to old food and moisture and none of the windows have been opened, millions of flies. all in all the property is a mess. I put a bid in for 5000K, the dumpster fees will be 2/3 of that at 800-900 per dumpster. I 'm sure they will blanch at that. the other job in vt is fairly straightforward, do the initial outside cleanup (150), no interior cleanup, and dc the above ground pool and cart it away (I bid 398 to get it out of there). we'll see what happens.

if you ain't living on the edge, you're taking up too much room


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## Guest

Hello everyone, I just want to start by saying this is the first time I have posted something on here, but I have been reading them for days. I own Alpine Restoration in Bozeman, MT. Yeah I know, most of you probably dont think there is anything in montana. I do water and fire damage restoration and have just rcently added property preservation about a month and a half ago. I response to some of those who had the idea to get in this business but are having second thoughts or to those who are struggling, this thread might help. Since that month and a half ago I have 75 very good contacts with realtors, I am a vendor for 23 national management companies, and every bank in montana that i could find has a list of my services and coverage areas. See, all to often some flashy new idea comes along and everybody thinks they are going to get rich from it. We start thinking about how many jobs we could do in a month and how many each one pays and it looks so much better than what we are doing for work at that present time. So we are so excited for a month and try to get some work and it doesnt come like we thought it would. so we get discouraged and fall off and move on to the next idea. Does this sound kinda like some of you? It sounds like most people because they dont know how to get the jobs. when your having your golden moment and you have this great idea to start one of these pp companies the market looks like a pristine ocean but then you get started and everything in your mind about getting work turns into a muddy puddle. We start seeing the industry may not need me cause there is so many people in this muddy murky mess and who am i going to market to that doesnt already have someone. Well, I may not be the smartest guy in business but i consider myself a marketing giant for one reason, Persistence in marketing and building relationships. when I started the property preservation I was going to be the best and everybody was going to know my name. Sounds corny but thats how determined i was. I started by calling everybody i knew that was in the banking or realty business then i got the trusty old phone book out and called all 197 realtors, Guess what, not every realtor does forclosures but i made sure I talked to every realtor regardless. But, some of them need sales cleans for non forclosures. then i called every national mortgage company i could think of and then contacted every bank in Montana and emailed all of my info to them. Then I searched on the web to find national management companies for 2 solid weeks and filled out applications, and sent insurance docs, and everything else they want constantly. After one month of this and one full week of making sure that my office was organized for it. I now have so much business I'm going crazy, but I love it. This business is so much fun, and I encourage anybody who has the "Brass" to start a business like this to use these methods. As for paysites for leads, forget about them, you dont need them if you do this. I hope this will help all of those who are discouraged. Thank you very much, now I have to get back to work. 

Alpine Restoration
Blake Baggett
alpinecontracting at y a h o o dot com


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## ARPPP

*Thanks for the post Blake!*

Kudo's on your success :thumbup:. I am trying to get started in this business and it is going very slooowwww . I appreciate the encouragement. I hope I don't run out of money before I get my first job and get paid for it. I am also a bit nervous about losing my guys, I keep telling them to hang in there it is coming soon. I have spent the money to be a legitimate business, put up the website, called the realtors, filled out numerous apps for the nationals and nothing yet. I did get called to do my first bid, but no response on that. I am going to keep plugging away. I know there is a place in this business for me...


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## Guest

hang in there arppp!!!! alot of banks already are starting to come out from under the fed government's shadow and release inventory. 

To blake, GREAT share!!!! that answers most of peoples questions on here and I agree it works because i've done the same thing. I started my company by myself working out of a honda civic just two years ago. (yes i said honda civic, so laugh b/c i do) but now i have 8 employees and a good amont of work. AND ALWAYS LOOKING FOR MORE, so if anyone has inventory in las vegas and needs to off load it let me know. Ok enough advertising for now. When i started i got with alot of national companies and it's a great place to start, but once u've started move on! those national companies pay like 20-40 for a lock out / rekey or soemthing close to that, I do lock out/ rekeys with my local banks and realtors for 200.00-350.00 per house. So my thoughts are why do 10 houses with the national companies for the same price banks are paying for one.

i wish you all good luck and anyone can contact me at any time if you have questions, God knows contractors and other business owners have helpled me out in the past.

also want to say hello to linda of course!! hope cali is keeping you busy and also to everyone else DONE RIGHT PROPERTY CLEANUP IS NOW GOING TO BE DONE RIGHT PROPERTY SOLUTIONS LLC...new website coming soon and it'll point out the 3 new sub companies within. For now all contact info will remain the same until we move units. Thank you to all that's supported us and made us what we are today. Thank u


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## APlusPPGroup

LOL, Mike. Yes, Cali's keeping us very busy right now. We haven't had anything new in Vegas for awhile and now that you've posted, I know why. YOU have it all. :laughing:

I think I shared my beginnings here in a previous post but just a quickie for newbies. I started out with basically nothing, doing all the work with a partner, then working until late at night uploading photos and generating work orders, then getting back up at 3 am to start all over again. 

The startup process is very tedious and it takes awhile before you can hire your first helper, then awhile longer for the second. And so on and so forth.

I parted company with my partner because he was totally scandalous and cost us a great deal of money, not to mention I lost my car because of him always taking and not contributing to the house bills. 

When we parted, I started All REO Preservation Services. But because I had met so many wonderful people through networking at forums like CT and others, I had lots of connections and was able to get on my feet pretty quick. A great many of those relationships are still intact and quite a few extended into good, solid friendships.

Everyone has their own method of working, their own ways of doing business, their own methods of advertising, and their own ways of pitching their services to prospective clients. 

Regardless of the differences, the ones who make it in this business have one thing in common: persistence and a drive to succeed. Those who are unwilling to get their hands dirty will find other avenues in the same industry and create new resources for others.

All in all, everyone who contributes, whether it be in the forums or the field, helps someone --- whether they realize it or not. 

It's nice to see so many people posting here and wish I had more time for it myself. Right now I'm not even finding time to open my mail. I'm getting ready to hire 2 more office people so maybe that will change.

Great job, Mike. Go get 'em, Tiger.:clap:

Linda


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## Guest

just an update on my progress. I have done quite a few inspections in the past few weeks and new job orders every day or so. I have put in bids on jobs that needed more work than the "flat" fee and have yet to hear from spectrum about those, but right now I'm doing my first trash out and clean up on a house in stowe vermont that had over 2 feet of water in the basement...for over 6 months. you can see on a sign up sheet where various people have been there with, if you can believe it, sump pumps. we rented a 3 inch pump and had the basement emptied in two hours..however you can imagine the condition of all the furniture and get all that was in the basement. However the company has approved every bid I gave them and we will be done tomorrow, dirty and tired, but hopefully well recompensed. we will see, luckily my other contracting business is starting to boom and will give me more than enough cash flow to support my intitial endeavors..mike


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## Guest

drasylum said:


> just an update on my progress. I have done quite a few inspections in the past few weeks and new job orders every day or so. I have put in bids on jobs that needed more work than the "flat" fee and have yet to hear from spectrum about those, but right now I'm doing my first trash out and clean up on a house in stowe vermont that had over 2 feet of water in the basement...for over 6 months. you can see on a sign up sheet where various people have been there with, if you can believe it, sump pumps. we rented a 3 inch pump and had the basement emptied in two hours..however you can imagine the condition of all the furniture and get all that was in the basement. However the company has approved every bid I gave them and we will be done tomorrow, dirty and tired, but hopefully well recompensed. we will see, luckily my other contracting business is starting to boom and will give me more than enough cash flow to support my intitial endeavors..mike


You better know what you are getting paid before you do the work. I would hate to see you do all of that work and then get less than what you expected. Was a bid approved for you?


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## ARPPP

*I finally got a job!*

Got my first job today! Job came from one of the realtor contacts I made. I think I got it because I underbid myself . The work is being separated out and I assumed that it would be a package. You live and learn. Happy to be jumping in to the arena. Thanks to all of you for the wonderful posts and for sharing your insight, tips and ideas. I believe I am on my way... :clap:


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## Guest

congrats !!


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## ARPPP

Wow, my first day on my first job... Still learning. Lesson 1: I will always add in a factor for unknowns in my bid. Much more hidden stuff that was uncovered as we cleaned. Lesson 2: Never assume, always find out first.

Any advice on how to handle the second part of this job if I get it. It appears as if the kitchen floor is caving into the basement. There is so much trash in this house it is hard to tell. I am afraid to have my workers go in for fear they will fall through the floor. How do I say thanks, but no thanks?


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## Guest

to answer your question, I did get approval before I went ahead on the job. $750.00 to pump out the water, $600.00 for extra debris (cost me $100.00) and $300.00 to install a dehumidifier plus the flat fee for cleanout. I also specified bids to replace the flooring, eradicate the mold (i'm a certified mold guy) and put on a new roof, paint the house etc. I have been a contractor for over 40 years, so I always keep my eye on the prices I charge and get proper approval.....now we'll just see if I get paid.

to the guy who got his first job, don't hesitate to call your provider for approval for more money. if you underestimated the amount of trash, in my case there was another container of trash, wet trash, under the water we pumped out of the basement, call. my company did not hesitate. If you fear structural damage, go in the basement and check out the joists supporting the floor, if they are broken, or in another way damaged, call the company and let them know that you need approval to shore up the floor or it will collapse in. remember these companies have no idea of the shape of these houses and don't underbid. I have lost some jobs because I bid too high, you know what, its better to lose, than to eat a few thousand dollars.


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## Guest

*Invaluable*

After spending far too much time reading through this entire thread, I just wanted to thank all of you who have shared your experiences, frustrations and successes.

Because of this thread and other similar forums, I feel that we are better equipped to enter the field of property preservation. Due to his years of experience and our extensive local contacts, my husband felt strongly that we should jump in full-time. With the realization that so many in the business are being underbid by national companies and hurting for work, we have decided, instead, to test the waters with some weekend jobs and see where it leads.

In particular, I want to thank Linda for her extremely professional posts and liberal usage of paragraphs. They are so much easier to read than some! 

Jenni


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## ARPPP

Wow, I tried the suggestion of going back for more money, because of the many unknowns found after filling 3 30 yard containers with trash from the outside and garage only. Boy, was I reamed out. I will probably not get another job from them. I was accused of bidding low in order to get the job. I sent in photos showing the massive amount of trash and all the things hidden by it. I completed the job, but lost money big time on this. I am a bit gun shy at this point and broke. I am going to still perservere, however. I am not down for the count. 

I have posted some photos of the before and will upload afterwards as well of this job.


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## Guest

sorry to hear about your experience. you might want to consider getting a trailer to haul off the trash, it will save money in the long and short run, its why I have one, I was tired of paying dumpster fees which are usually two to three times the cost of doing it yourself. a dump trailer is an even better idea if you can swing it. they are going cheap in florida due to the downturn in the economy. sounds like you have a bummer company to work for, there are numerous other companies you can subcontract for. try these and see how it works out: 

all of these are subcontractors for Keystone Asset Management (just google them and their websites will come up)

Integrated Mortgage Solutions
Field Asset Services 
Spectrum Field Services: 
REO Allegiance Inc.:


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## APlusPPGroup

ARPPP said:


> Boy, was I reamed out. I will probably not get another job from them. I was accused of bidding low.


ARPPP ~

A couple of things to think about. 

1. You're fortunate to have found out about the personality of whoever reamed you out on your first job, rather than your 10th, 20th, or 50th. Typically, managers with personality defects also try to work you over regarding payment.

2. You're worried about not getting another job from them. Not all companies will assign more than one manager to you. If you're stuck with this one, you'll may be miserable. Your attitude of moving on and persevering is a good one. Go with that.

3. Nationals know full well that there will be hidden "surprises". The good managers will simply approve additonal money as long as your photos provide enough proof that you earned it. ALWAYS get good photos of the trucks, trailers, bins, roll-offs, etc. AFTER they're loaded and ready for the dump. 

You can calculate what you're hauling based on the width x length of the container x the height of the debris [average height of all debris, not the height of the tallest item]. The following link will show you how to convert that into a cubic yard:

http://www.co.mendocino.ca.us/dot/pdf/Microsoft%20Word%20-%20How%20to%20Calculate%20Your%20Volume.pdf

Doing this will give you a fairly accurate idea of how many cubic yards you can justify in your invoicing. What the manager has approved you for is an additional allowance. You can only bill UP TO that amount, not over.

If you really believe in yourself, nothing will stop you from moving forward. So keep up the good work.:thumbup:

Linda


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## Guest

I would just like to start by saying thank you to everybody that writes on here. It is important for us to have a team atmosphere in this business. This is going to sound crazy, but I think everybody who is a vendor for national management companies should go on strike for a week or two. I know it sounds crazy, but hear me out. If you go directly to the bank you get paid an honest wage if you work for a national you get ripped off to the point of paying to do jobs for them and then they want a 25% discount on top of their crap prices. if 80% of vendors decided they were sickof management company prices and decided to go on vacation for a 2 weeks. think about what would happen to their relationship with those banks. If you are sick of what is going on with this industry email me [email protected] I dont depend solely on nationals for work but im sick of the power they have. I hope everybody is doing well

We can get this industry back where it belongs!


Alpine Restoration


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## ARPPP

Hi Linda,

Thanks for the food for thought. You are right it is better I find out about this personality trait sooner than later. I now know how to handle her. I actually received a new order from her. Best believe I will not miss anything this time. I am optimistic.

BTW I am a girl too. I laughed at the posts from the guys assuming I am a guy!

Annette Rogers
AR Professional Property Preservation
[email protected]


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## ARPPP

Alpine Restore,
Sounds like you need to organize a union...

ARPPP


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## Guest

*Property Preservation In Florida*

Ok guys and Gals I need some help here. I am new to the site and new to the business. I have talked to a bank and they reffered me to res.net , I have talked to a realtor and he wants me to be HIS handyman for maybe $500 a week , I have signed on to Safeguard and left a message with Field Services. I also have had a realtor tell me that she no longer will mow the lawn because she is not getting reimbursed from the banks. I have been to 2 town code compliance departments and they say well we do not have the money to take care of the property. So anyway in a nutshell Florida is #2 in the nation in Forecloseures , HOW THE HECK DO I GET ANY WORK IN THIS TRADE? I am Lisensed and Insured. How does Nick Hazel stay so busy? HELP !


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## Guest

Thats a great idea, to aquire rentals. When you do work with HUD is is Davis-Beacon wages?


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## APlusPPGroup

carpentreneur said:


> When you do work with HUD is is Davis-Beacon wages?


In this industry, there is no such thing as prevailing wage. 

HUD has a standard cost allowance for specific services. Pricing on all other items is typically set by the vendors themselves and negotiated with each of their clients or bid on a job by job basis.

Annette ~ you go, girl. There are a lot more women in this industry than you would ever imagine.

Alpine ~ the thought has crossed my mind as well regarding the nationals. They've taken too much for too long from a lot of good, honest, hard-working vendors. 

I think, though, you'd have a tough time organizing a "strike" because people who make just enough to survive can't afford to stop working. Most will just go to another national.

Earlier this year, I heard that most of the larger banks were taking their business away from the nationals, which was good news. I haven't seen it happen so far and contracts I didn't think the nationals stood a chance of getting are being signed.

The more the nationals take from the vendors, the stronger they become because they can afford the manpower to be the one-stop-shop all the clients are looking for. If they were honest and fair, they wouldn't be able to afford the payroll that it takes to run an operation that can offer everything.

It will be interesting to see where the nationals end up when this "flood" of REOs dwindle to next to nothing in a couple of years.

Linda


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## Guest

*remove the middle man*

To Linda and all other vendors of national management companies,

In reference to the strike, I know it will be hard for some people to do this but I personally promise it will work if everybody gets involved in some way or another. for one or two weeks or if everybody calls in on every work order for bid approval. Hike up your prices to where they should be for that two week period. 
I got a work order today from safeguard that was in my zone, but it was 1 1/2 hours away for a recut that was going to be 40.00. First of all, it costs me about 20.00 to 25.00 just in gas to pull a trailor w/ mower and enough room for any debris that might need to be remove not including the cost of the man hour while driving there. So for this we will just say it cost 30.00 and hour to drive anywhere for us. It is a total of three hours of drive time. then another hour to do the cut. and dont forget your expenses for weed eater string, gas for the mower and every other expense. Thats a grand total of 110.00 ( thats under estimating). Then you are going to be charged 25 % off that. So, that brings our total to 120.00 in expenses. To do a job that is going to pay a grand total of 30.00 after discount. hmmm.... . So I called Safeguard to tell them I cant pay to get jobs done and this is what they told me (direct quote) " some times you might have to pay to get a job complete but some others will be profitable". Does anybody see a problem with this? They go get the client and promise them these low prices and then want us to follow through on there promise to their client and then want us to pay to complete a job just so they can uphold their promise and dont forget, they still get their 25%. So if you think you are helping yourself by not losing those weeks, good luck in the future.

Just a little food for thought,

We bailed out most of these companies on our "super Bailout plan". And now they think they our going to take more money from us. NOT ME!!.

Thank you to all of you who have read this. and to Linda I respect you alot for giving alot of these people answers and for leading them in the right path. It is up to people like us that dont depend solely on these nationals, to get people motivated to help those who are having trouble making it in this industy because of these nationals. 

Remove the middle man

Oh I almost forgot. I love this industry, and even though I dont know any of you personally I care about all of you

ALPINE
Blake 

[email protected]
email me if you have any questions (or to complain about me)lol


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## brm1109

I agree with you, they want us to do a lot of stuff for little money.
As far as Safeguard, the reason I wouldn't work for them was when I was going to sign up, they wanted me to cover almost half the state. I told them that most of the further areas wouldn't cover my expenses and they basically told me the same thing about the pay.


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## Guest

I ran into the same problem re: recuts but with an even more bizarre spin. I had given a bid to spectrum of 750 to basically cleanup and cut a 2 acre field around a house seized by the US Marshals, probably a million dollar home. anyway i had put in 85 dollars to do a subsequent perimeter cut at a later date. this woman somehow extrapolated that i had bid 85 dollars to do the initial cleanup and cut, soooo after a few rude emails, she says its my fault she "misread" the bid and is going to take the difference out of my paycheck (I have yet to receive any monies from spectrum after one major cleanup, about 6 property inspections, photos and two merchant site inspections) I told her that a six hour roundtrip drive for 85 wasn't in the cards and that in no way would that cover the costs of doing the cleanup/cut. ironically their client, the marshals service seized over 88 grand in cash and now owns free and clear a million dollar mansion, amazing how cheap these people are. they act as if it is a priviledge to drive hours to take a picture and pay you 30 bucks!! On another note, on the nasty cleanup I did in stowe, where three feet of water sat for 8 months, it was a property formally serviced by safeguard, their answer to the water issue was to throw a sump pump in the basement and watch it die after an hour of operation, I pumped it empty in a few hours, however no one seems to listen to me about the black mold issue or the unsaleability of the house due to that and the fact that we had to tear up half the floor that had bucked due to the moisture, not to mention the failing roof and peeling paint, I guess the clients don't want to pay??? or so spectrum tells me..


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## Guest

Business is still booming - if you are offering securing services, here's a little trick to keep more $$$ in your pocket, away from the nationals. Try bump keys, no need to drill out a lock anymore, no need for the locksmith. I got a set from probumpkeys.com and they work great, I should mention that I also learned how to pick and rekey locks - so that helps. Good luck everyone - this market is tough.


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## ARPPP

*Re: Bumpkeys*

Hi DormanREO,

I got an email from the bumpkey company yesterday. They are fairly inexpensive. Which set do you advise and are they as simple to use as the site indicates?

Thanks
Annette


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## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hi DormanREO,
> 
> I got an email from the bumpkey company yesterday. They are fairly inexpensive. Which set do you advise and are they as simple to use as the site indicates?
> 
> Thanks
> Annette


Good stuff - otherwise I wouldn't have bothered mentioning. They do have a slight learning curve, but they just take getting some used to. I purchased there biggest set - after I bought a couple keys to try. Once in awhile I find a lock that I just can't get with the bump key, but otherwise they're great. Good luck!


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## Guest

*Work*

My name is Paul I have had my own Property Preservation company now for almost 2 years in Dallas, Texas. The question I have for some of you more experienced people is. What is the best way to get more clients. I have called and viewed every bank website. Put out flyers with all the real estate agencies in my area. I have had only 1 call back. All the work I have been getting is through 1 real estate company and there clients that I do all the services to are going away because the real estate company I work for doesn't take there jobs seriously. I only know this because a good friend of mine works for the real estate company. Also in recent months we have been getting a lot of fannie mae and we do nothing except for rekeys. I would also like to find out how to get on with fannie mae and acquire doing their services also. Last summer I had 2 crews working 80 hours a week this summer I have barely enough work for my self. I have worked with several banks but it was all through a contractor I was just the sub. He is relying on the real estate company also, because the owner throws him a bone every once in awhile.
I have been a vendor for one other company and that turned out disasterous. They either paid late or partial payments on everything. So if you all have any advice I would greatly appreicate and hope I could return the favor.


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## Guest

*can't get enough!*

i've seen plenty of posts like mine too, but i can't help it!

i just want to say thank you :clap: to everyone here who provides such great info here in this thread and on this site. after being a realtor and mortgage broker for 8 years here in the oakland/east bay area (san francisco), being the daughter of the real estate broker and growing up around my contractor uncles (spend summers and after school laying tile/carpet/, painting, demo-ing, installing toilets, etc..), i started my own reo business about a year ago. AND YES, I'M A *GIRL.

*i work only with realtors and management companies right now, doing about 2-4 houses per month - interior/exterior trashouts, rekeying, pressure washing, small landscaping and painting jobs, handy'girl'/handyman stuff. i have a very basic website and have acquired enough equipment to be able to get the job done right. no, i don't have everything i need, but i'm very resourceful and can get the job done. 

i have alot to learn and have been lurking around, leaving 'thanks' here and there for posts that have really helped me out, but felt moved to post a big thanks and give my respect to you all :notworthy. thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience, because it's really helped me out. so thanks again :thumbsup:


be well everyone


angela
ubs restoration services


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## ARPPP

*Hi UBSREO*

Hi Angela,

You go girl! Did you get your pricing at a point that you feel like you are fair, but competitive? I saw your previous post where you thought you might be low. I have the same worries myself.

Annette
[email protected]


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## Guest

Hello everyone and thanks for the great input. I've learned a lot from this site before starting my PP business last week. I have a question concerning national company. I notice a lot of them require E&O insurance. I've called around here in Tulsa o.k (home state) and have not being able to find any such policies I called allstate,state farm,all local and no one offers it. Does anyone have this insurance and where can i get it? The other question i have is Most companies also want workers comp insurance. Im the only employee, can i get workers comp and do i need it? Is it expensive? Thank you all for all your input.


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## ARPPP

*Insurance question*

Hi Pipo5832,

This is not an endorsement but I did run across this information in my internet searches. I cannot post urls. Email for the url, or go the the organization of real estate professionals website.

They may be able to assist you in getting a quote. Beware of sticker shock E&O is not cheap...

Annette
[email protected]


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## Guest

Thanks ARPPP i will give it a try.


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## Guest

*Arizona Property Preservation &amp; REO company*

Hello,
This is my first time on Contractor Talk and I am very excited to find this site. My company is CREO Development and we have been in business in Arizona since 2000. We have been doing property preservation and REO services for three national companies for just over a year. We have been very busy and have grown termendously over the last 8 months. We presently are in the Maricopa area, but within the next few months we will be taking over the entire state. 
We are in need of experienced property preservation and REO contractors in Arizona. If anyone is interested please apply on our website under contractor application.

Respectfully,
Jenni


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## Guest

D&R Services said:


> hang in there arppp!!!! alot of banks already are starting to come out from under the fed government's shadow and release inventory.
> 
> To blake, GREAT share!!!! that answers most of peoples questions on here and I agree it works because i've done the same thing. I started my company by myself working out of a honda civic just two years ago. (yes i said honda civic, so laugh b/c i do) but now i have 8 employees and a good amont of work. AND ALWAYS LOOKING FOR MORE, so if anyone has inventory in las vegas and needs to off load it let me know. Ok enough advertising for now. When i started i got with alot of national companies and it's a great place to start, but once u've started move on! those national companies pay like 20-40 for a lock out / rekey or soemthing close to that, I do lock out/ rekeys with my local banks and realtors for 200.00-350.00 per house. So my thoughts are why do 10 houses with the national companies for the same price banks are paying for one.
> 
> i wish you all good luck and anyone can contact me at any time if you have questions, God knows contractors and other business owners have helpled me out in the past.
> 
> also want to say hello to linda of course!! hope cali is keeping you busy and also to everyone else DONE RIGHT PROPERTY CLEANUP IS NOW GOING TO BE DONE RIGHT PROPERTY SOLUTIONS LLC...new website coming soon and it'll point out the 3 new sub companies within. For now all contact info will remain the same until we move units. Thank you to all that's supported us and made us what we are today. Thank u


how do i contact the local banks and who do i ask to speak or get in contact with?


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## Guest

*dealing directly with the banks*

i'm here in metro detroit and i want to knoe how to contact the banks directly to get pp contracts?........where do i start? who do i ask for? where do i go?


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## Guest

carpentreneur said:


> Thats a great idea, to aquire rentals. When you do work with HUD is is Davis-Beacon wages?


 
HAHAHAHA, in most cases it is below minimum wage. That would be pretty nifty if it did pay those rates though.


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## APlusPPGroup

klsgloballlc said:


> i'm here in metro detroit and i want to knoe how to contact the banks directly to get pp contracts?........where do i start? who do i ask for? where do i go?


If you're new to the industry, the best way to get a foot in the door is to work with one or more of the nationals first.

If you go directly to a bank without experience, they won't even talk to you. After you have the experience, expand your business. You have to be fairly large to work directly with them directly. Unless, of course, you have a good contact or two with small local banks.

Not trying to be a party-pooper but asking for contacts and client lists is not going to get you a good response from most PP vendors. Everyone is very protective of who they work with and there are very good reasons why.

Good luck, though. There's no reason to think you WON'T get contracts with the lenders.:thumbup:

Linda


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## ARPPP

*Winterizations coming soon*

Hi All

I know that winterizations will need to be done in areas affected starting October 1st. Wondering if this will mean in increase in business and something to look forward to? Could certainly use the business. I have not bought my compressor or generator yet. I am waiiting until I actually have a job that I need one for. Any suggestions on what to buy?

I appreciate all of you!

Annette
[email protected]


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## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hi All
> 
> I know that winterizations will need to be done in areas affected starting October 1st. Wondering if this will mean in increase in business and something to look forward to? Could certainly use the business. I have not bought my compressor or generator yet. I am waiiting until I actually have a job that I need one for. Any suggestions on what to buy?
> 
> I appreciate all of you!
> 
> Annette
> [email protected]


I would check the tools section on Craigs List. There are plenty of deals there:

http://chicago.craigslist.org/tls/


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## Guest

SWPreservation , Im glad you pointed out they banks and waiting on pay......I have been down that road.

The best i have done is DUE on receipt and charging them interest after 30 days but it still sucks if your used to being paid when a job is done or on a set date.


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## Guest

I have been doing preservation work for the last 6 months. Does anyone know of anymore preservation companies that do work nationaly. Any help would be great.
Thanks

Randy


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## Guest

*Property Preservation for REO*

About a month ago I was looking to add a company or two to my present Preservation Company. I came accross a site on the net that had a list of National Companies that give out preservation work. Hey for $39 bucks I thought...what can I loose? It was the best thing I did. With all the contact infomation of these companies on the list, I started emailing right away and the very next day I had 12 companies needing my company info and zip codes so they could give me work. I was able to pick some great companies out and have been with them ever sense. The site was mylistbiz dot com I hope this helps....it did for me.


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## ARPPP

*Hmmm I smell something fishy...*

Is anyone else thinking what I am thinking?


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## Guest

as the rotten species in denmark. jeez, will these guys ever give up their sleazy attempts at advertising their bunk web sites..


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## mtmtnman

Edin said:


> Hey Billy,
> 
> Field Assets pays you a month from the date your invoice is approved and honestly they are the best company i had worked with, they are a bit strict but thats why they are able to get alot of work, they want everything done perfectly.
> 
> How it works with them, call them and get the operator to connect you to the vendor manager for your state. Tell them you are interested in becoming a vendor in your state make sure you get a list of all counties and zip codes you will be able to cover. You will also be required to have 1mil general liabilty and E&O insurance, but E&O you can purchase through them for very cheap, plus you dont have to pay for it they can just deduct it from your invoice.
> 
> Once they sign you up as a vendor you will be provided with all your login info, everything is done online. It will be or it may be a week or two before you get any work, but when something shows up in your area they will call you, tell you what they have, example; a full trashout.. meaning all the debris in and out, rekey, grass cut, janitorial, winterization, lock box.. they will provide a lock box for you free of charge. If they call you today and give you a trashout they will overnight your lockbox.. sometimes they will forget so just call them let them know and they will ship it.
> 
> When you get to the property you have to figure out about how much cyds. of debris is there and then call the coordinator so he can adjust the price for you. You dont realy have to bid anything, you just have to get to the property and not remove any debris before they adjust your price.
> 
> Im not sure if this info is helpful, but when you do start with them you can contact me with all the questions that you may have. They are a great company to work with and i am sure you will generate a steady income with them. Good luck to you




You have had a far better experience than i have. These guys pay poverty wages!! $30 for grass cut UP TO 1/4 ACRE!!!, $100 for full janitorial INCLUDING WINDOWS! up to 2000 sq ft, $40 for re-curing maid service, Ect. in Montana we do not have cheap foreign labor. The cheapest i can get someone to clean is about $15 an hour. A 2000 sq ft home to clean properly including washing windows will take someone all day! The same job for a Realtor pays 2-3 times more! The last straw for me was a 4 plex they wanted me to secure, clean & mow. The mow was ok @ $75. They wanted me to clean 4, 3 bed one bath condo units for $175!!!!!! NOT EACH BUT ALL FOR $175!!! Figure $3 a unit for air fresheners and $10 a unit for supplies and you just cleaned 4 units for a little over $30 a unit! I do work for the realtor on this property and she tells me no-one has done the property yet 6 weeks after i quit them. They will not get anyone at that rate!! They are also VERY slow on payment. 8-10 weeks is our experience. My advise is Run Forest Run!!!!!!!!!


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## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hi DormanREO,
> 
> I got an email from the bumpkey company yesterday. They are fairly inexpensive. Which set do you advise and are they as simple to use as the site indicates?
> 
> Thanks
> Annette[/q
> 
> The bumpkey idea is a good one, but i wasted money on these things. The video shows some guy smacking the key and magically the door know opens. BS.. Also the info on the bump keys states that sometimes using the bump key will damage the lock pins. Then you are really screwed and still need to drill. Very good idea if it really worked though.


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## Guest

just thought I would share my experience with spectrum field services. I started with them a month ago and at this point I have made over 4000.00 with two cleanouts, a lawn cleanup and various inspections, they pay promptly in 30 days and don't take out 30%. very pleased with the results and it looks like I will have a long lasting relationship with them..mike


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## ARPPP

*Thanks for sharing Mike!*

I love to hear about success' I wish you many more of these in the future

Annette


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> You have had a far better experience than i have. These guys pay poverty wages!! $30 for grass cut UP TO 1/4 ACRE!!!, $100 for full janitorial INCLUDING WINDOWS! up to 2000 sq ft, $40 for re-curing maid service, Ect. in Montana we do not have cheap foreign labor. The cheapest i can get someone to clean is about $15 an hour. A 2000 sq ft home to clean properly including washing windows will take someone all day! The same job for a Realtor pays 2-3 times more! The last straw for me was a 4 plex they wanted me to secure, clean & mow. The mow was ok @ $75. They wanted me to clean 4, 3 bed one bath condo units for $175!!!!!! NOT EACH BUT ALL FOR $175!!! Figure $3 a unit for air fresheners and $10 a unit for supplies and you just cleaned 4 units for a little over $30 a unit! I do work for the realtor on this property and she tells me no-one has done the property yet 6 weeks after i quit them. They will not get anyone at that rate!! They are also VERY slow on payment. 8-10 weeks is our experience. My advise is Run Forest Run!!!!!!!!!



Same here. Not good.

Still waiting on money from July.

They will use any excuse in the book they can to cut and deny your invoices. You can bet that they'll be invoicing the bank for the work you did but won't pay you.

I had one with them that was 3 hrs from my office. Mow a full acre, and three hrs back home.
Paid .......... drum roll................. $30. When I laughed into the phone and told them that was never happening they acted hurt and asked why not. I told the not so bright person that they were asking me to work a 12 hr day for $30, it was not going to happen! They spoke to their manager and "we've got good news". We can do $75 for this job, when do you want to schedule it? I told him not this week that he was still too cheap. 
I never went and did it, that was very close to the beginning of the end for me. When I found out that they were two months out and no payment in sight I immediately quit. 
They've since used every excuse possible to cut and/or deny my invoices to the point I'll probably never see any of the money I worked for ($5000). 

If I were to add up ALL the work I did for them and all the "pay" and average it out over 2.5 months I would never even break even. Let alone make a profit for my wages or pay for my equipment.


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## brm1109

*I can't figure it out sometimes*

I go to do a bid on a complete trash-out and figure it is a 2 day trash-out (total disaster) with myself and at least 3 guys. Not only a ton of trash but the conditions of getting in and out of the property. 
So I give my bid (with overhead included) get a call from the preservation company "we need the estimate to be at least 1/2 or we can't give you the job".
Using their figures, I would , if lucky clear $200.00. Has anyone else just turned down jobs if you are not making anything on it?


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## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I go to do a bid on a complete trash-out and figure it is a 2 day trash-out (total disaster) with myself and at least 3 guys. Not only a ton of trash but the conditions of getting in and out of the property.
> So I give my bid (with overhead included) get a call from the preservation company "we need the estimate to be at least 1/2 or we can't give you the job".
> Using their figures, I would , if lucky clear $200.00. Has anyone else just turned down jobs if you are not making anything on it?





Absolutely.


Tell them that "this is the price" take it or leave it.

I learned a long time ago that when some one says "well I can get so and so company over here to do it for so and so price" that my response was "you better get to calling them then".

Here are a couple favorite sayings of mine, "this is a business, not a charity"

And "your cents aint making business sense".

Feel free to use and abuse them as needed.

They cannot expect you to work for min wage.


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## brm1109

Hi all,
I was hoping somebody could help me with 2 questions concerning winterizations.
1. If you have a standard 1 family house, what size air compressor would you need. Also house much anti-freeze would you need to do the winterizations and how much would you put in each fixture?

Thank you


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## Guest

*E&amp;o*



pipo5832 said:


> Hello everyone and thanks for the great input. I've learned a lot from this site before starting my PP business last week. I have a question concerning national company. I notice a lot of them require E&O insurance. I've called around here in Tulsa o.k (home state) and have not being able to find any such policies I called allstate,state farm,all local and no one offers it. Does anyone have this insurance and where can i get it? The other question i have is Most companies also want workers comp insurance. Im the only employee, can i get workers comp and do i need it? Is it expensive? Thank you all for all your input.


you won't find any of the "regular" insurance companies that offer E&O insurance since E&O is a surplus lines insurance policy. Normally you need to go to York Jersey Underwriters and there is another Association out of The State of Washington (name escapes me now) that offers E&O. Not cheap so make sure you are going to get some work in order to afford the premiums. Work Comp--each State is different but "I think" that Okie allows you to elect out of work comp by going to the the State Labor Dept website and filling out a "Elect to not have work comp" form but you will need to verify this with a local State Insurance Agent or councel. BUT remember that a lot of Nationals are now making this a mandatory requirement (and a good thing), especially if you have sub-contractors since you as the General Contractor are responsible for the subs having work comp...


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## Guest

*Lalo's LawnCare-Dallas*

Hi Linda, my name is Sandra and I own Lalo's LawnCare in Carrollton, Tx. I'm new to this site and I have truly enjoyed reading all the postings...very helpful information and most of all everyone is soo kind to one another and soo eager to help. That's awesome!!

My question is: My partner and I have been on the contractor end. We are good solid reliable contractors and have had a hard time finding good companies to get signed on with. Recently we did a huge sum of homes for Bank of America...through the middle guy ofcourse but those homes were recently auctioned off. I'd like to know HOW to cut the middle man and get directly with the bank. I know you said earlier in another post there's a lot of upfront $$$ to be had and patience....patience we have and we have some money to get started. I guess what I'm trying to say is I'd like someone to take me under their wing....it doesn't have to be in Texas so that there is no insecuries on their part or anything...believe me we're not a threat or a competition for anyone! but I'd like someone to take me under their wing and show me the do's and don'ts of what to know of the inside of this business. Our small business handles all aspects of contruction in this business....we only thing we never did was pool cleanouts and winterization....everything else we did.

Can you give me some tips or mind if I came out for a while while you "trained" me? I'd be willing to pay a consult fee/training fee. I'd appreciate any information you or anyone reading this can give me or offer to me. Thank you!! EVERYONE....HAVE A NICE DAY!!!! 


a1propertyclean said:


> Jonathan ~
> 
> I own 2 property preservation businesses. There's a lot of up front money involved if you want to do it right. You'll need general liability insurance, decent equipment, fuel, equipment rental, and labor. A website wouldn't hurt either, even a simple one like mine. Plus, you can go weeks without substantial work until everyone knows you're out there.
> 
> It was a terrific struggle to get to where we are now but, if you're determined enough, send me an e-mail to [email protected] and I'll see if I can help.
> 
> I cover 5 counties in Southern California, the tri-state area of Nevada, Arizona, and California, and will soon have another startup out of Idaho.
> 
> I have an awesome crew and the best, most efficient office staff. But it was awhile before I could hire the right labor because the money is slow coming in. Now I offer 30, 60, and 90 day terms and payment plans to lenders and brokers.
> 
> I hope all that doesn't scare you off. There's a lot of work out there for the right type of person. If it didn't scare you off, contact me.
> 
> Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

ARPPP said:


> Is anyone else thinking what I am thinking?


Absolutely. Watch out for people who join to SELL YOU a list of viable companies.

All I can say is.............. what a load of crap.

Linda


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## Guest

*Coverage area*

Linda,
I have been reading all these posts and it seems you cover a few areas. I have a family member that is moving to Cheyenne, WY and this is an area that we don't have coverage and I'm trying to find a Servicer that handles Cheyenne? Any ideas? We currently only have crews in 6 Midwest States for 13 years but never in Wyoming. The family member is very very knowledgable growing up in this business and will be looking for work "out there" LOL


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## APlusPPGroup

Hi, Sandra ~

You are most welcome to come out. I have a fee-based training program that takes approximately 2 to 3 days to complete and I think you'd enjoy it immensely. It's very informal since we train on an actual trashout and, while you might be sore at the end of the first couple days, you'll walk away knowing so much more than you did coming in. Practical knowledge [to me, anyway] is so much better than what you can learn online or in books.

BUT you'd have to come to Fort Mohave, Arizona. I'm in the process of moving from California to Arizona right now so I couldn't be ready any sooner than the 18th of October. 

I've got my office staff in charge here in California and I would have them train you except for the fact that there is no work right now, thanks to our current governor extending the moratorium.......... again!

All that aside, I want to address a few things regarding e-mails I receive and experienced vendors.

To everyone who has been sending e-mail:

I have not been able to answer startup questions for months now. My apologies for that but, up until recently, we were slammed with work and there has been absolutely no time to respond. It's important to note, however, that most of the questions I've seen come through my mailbox have already been answered here at CT in this topic. It's one of the reasons I participate here.

Also, I am not doing any hiring right now so vendor reviews are on the back burner until we get the contracts we're negotiating finalized and work starts coming in. 

So, to the vendors who are following instructions and sending photos & contact information, please be patient and don't give up. I still get requests from areas I don't already cover and can search my mail for the your information.

To those who are sending nothing except a question [like "do you have any work?"] with no photos or contact information to my vendor review box, your mail is going in the trash. Sorry to sound so harsh but I need you to give me something to go on. I get a lot of mail with no name, city, or state so searching for a vendor in an area I need coverage in is not going to bring your e-mail into the line-up. If you don't give me anything, I'm totally not interested and won't waste my time.

AND.....this is important. If you tell me you have experience and send someone else's photos, then get accepted into our network and we find out you fudged your way in, we'll know it within the first two jobs and you'll be history. This is not an easy industry to work in and hiring people who are dishonest can cost us clients. We QC everything so don't even try it in the first place, okay? Save all of us the time and trouble.

We don't hire primadonnas either. If you're above getting your hands dirty and expect more than the job is worth, you won't last long. If you can't take the smaller, less profitable jobs, along with the money-makers, you won't last long. Our pricing is more than fair and our fees are very reasonable for all the job photos we have to wade through at the end of each day in order to close out work orders and invoice clients.

The reality of this business is that it's a tough one to be successful at. 

The industry is different this year than the last and there have been many, many up- and down-swings in the work flow. I have hired and fired more vendors since the first of this year than I have ever done in all my accumulated years in other businesses. Terminating vendors is the least appealing part of my job but it has become a critical part of our overall performance with the clients.

On the flip side, we have found an excellent bunch of reliable vendors to work with and our clients are very happy with their response time.:thumbup: Roughly 98% of our vendors are jumping on the work orders right away and get the completed results to us within 24 hours to 72 hours, depending on the job type.

To those just starting out, there are a few simple rules to follow. Be honest, work hard, maintain your composure in difficult situations, and DO NOT put all your eggs in one basket. 

Some of my vendors rely strictly on us to provide them with work but, unfortunately, we don't guarantee there will be work for everyone every day. So be sure to work with several companies. When the work flow picks up to the overwhelming stage, decide which clients you want to keep and which ones to cut loose. It will be in your company's best interest to cut the losers loose quickly. 

That said, I need to say goodnight. Packing and loading up for the move have completely worn me out and I'm hitting the sack.

Goodnight, everyone.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> Linda,
> I have been reading all these posts and it seems you cover a few areas. I have a family member that is moving to Cheyenne, WY and this is an area that we don't have coverage and I'm trying to find a Servicer that handles Cheyenne? Any ideas? We currently only have crews in 6 Midwest States for 13 years but never in Wyoming. The family member is very very knowledgable growing up in this business and will be looking for work "out there" LOL


Fremont ~

I don't have coverage in Wyoming yet and could use a good, experienced vendor there. I have a list of states we service on the first page of my website. If a client is searching for coverage in Wyoming and they see it listed, we might start getting nibbles.

As crazy as the industry has been, it's hard to tell where the work will be. Right now, Washington is keeping us busy and California has slowed way down. My son, who owns another preservation business, is going crazy trying to keep up in Arizona. Eventually, when the load mod phase is past, a lot of new clients will be contacting us.

If you have him write to me, be sure he puts WYOMING in the subject line. Right now I can only respond to referrals. Eventually, I will get back to my vendor reviews but at the moment it's on a case by case basis.

Thanks for letting me know. It's actually one of the states on my list that I had planned to find vendors for.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Wyoming*



a1propertyclean said:


> Fremont ~
> 
> I don't have coverage in Wyoming yet and could use a good, experienced vendor there. I have a list of states we service on the first page of my website. If a client is searching for coverage in Wyoming and they see it listed, we might start getting nibbles.
> 
> As crazy as the industry has been, it's hard to tell where the work will be. Right now, Washington is keeping us busy and California has slowed way down. My son, who owns another preservation business, is going crazy trying to keep up in Arizona. Eventually, when the load mod phase is past, a lot of new clients will be contacting us.
> 
> If you have him write to me, be sure he puts WYOMING in the subject line. Right now I can only respond to referrals. Eventually, I will get back to my vendor reviews but at the moment it's on a case by case basis.
> 
> Thanks for letting me know. It's actually one of the states on my list that I had planned to find vendors for.
> 
> Linda


 
Linda,
I'll do that. I'll be in Cheyenne Friday morning trying to find them a place to live...Job transfer and I'm going to hate to see the daughter and her husband move since he is a crew chief for us. I just don't have the time to pick up more work at the moment since we are doing a lot of hazmat work and our uploaders couldn't handle anymore.


----------



## Guest

Hi Linda, thank you soo much for your response. I can certainly appreciate the way you think about droping the looser companies and agree there is no better way to train and learn other than getting right in it and getting dirty.

My partner and I are more than interested about coming out to train under you in Arizona. What is your fee for your program? Is there a direct contact number to schedule a time available for you? We look forward to meeting with you. Thank You and good luck with your move.
~sandra @LALO'S LAWNCARE 214-724-0389



a1propertyclean said:


> Hi, Sandra ~
> 
> You are most welcome to come out. I have a fee-based training program that takes approximately 2 to 3 days to complete and I think you'd enjoy it immensely. It's very informal since we train on an actual trashout and, while you might be sore at the end of the first couple days, you'll walk away knowing so much more than you did coming in. Practical knowledge [to me, anyway] is so much better than what you can learn online or in books.
> 
> BUT you'd have to come to Fort Mohave, Arizona. I'm in the process of moving from California to Arizona right now so I couldn't be ready any sooner than the 18th of October.
> 
> I've got my office staff in charge here in California and I would have them train you except for the fact that there is no work right now, thanks to our current governor extending the moratorium.......... again!
> 
> All that aside, I want to address a few things regarding e-mails I receive and experienced vendors.
> 
> To everyone who has been sending e-mail:
> 
> I have not been able to answer startup questions for months now. My apologies for that but, up until recently, we were slammed with work and there has been absolutely no time to respond. It's important to note, however, that most of the questions I've seen come through my mailbox have already been answered here at CT in this topic. It's one of the reasons I participate here.
> 
> Also, I am not doing any hiring right now so vendor reviews are on the back burner until we get the contracts we're negotiating finalized and work starts coming in.
> 
> So, to the vendors who are following instructions and sending photos & contact information, please be patient and don't give up. I still get requests from areas I don't already cover and can search my mail for the your information.
> 
> To those who are sending nothing except a question [like "do you have any work?"] with no photos or contact information to my vendor review box, your mail is going in the trash. Sorry to sound so harsh but I need you to give me something to go on. I get a lot of mail with no name, city, or state so searching for a vendor in an area I need coverage in is not going to bring your e-mail into the line-up. If you don't give me anything, I'm totally not interested and won't waste my time.
> 
> AND.....this is important. If you tell me you have experience and send someone else's photos, then get accepted into our network and we find out you fudged your way in, we'll know it within the first two jobs and you'll be history. This is not an easy industry to work in and hiring people who are dishonest can cost us clients. We QC everything so don't even try it in the first place, okay? Save all of us the time and trouble.
> 
> We don't hire primadonnas either. If you're above getting your hands dirty and expect more than the job is worth, you won't last long. If you can't take the smaller, less profitable jobs, along with the money-makers, you won't last long. Our pricing is more than fair and our fees are very reasonable for all the job photos we have to wade through at the end of each day in order to close out work orders and invoice clients.
> 
> The reality of this business is that it's a tough one to be successful at.
> 
> The industry is different this year than the last and there have been many, many up- and down-swings in the work flow. I have hired and fired more vendors since the first of this year than I have ever done in all my accumulated years in other businesses. Terminating vendors is the least appealing part of my job but it has become a critical part of our overall performance with the clients.
> 
> On the flip side, we have found an excellent bunch of reliable vendors to work with and our clients are very happy with their response time.:thumbup: Roughly 98% of our vendors are jumping on the work orders right away and get the completed results to us within 24 hours to 72 hours, depending on the job type.
> 
> To those just starting out, there are a few simple rules to follow. Be honest, work hard, maintain your composure in difficult situations, and DO NOT put all your eggs in one basket.
> 
> Some of my vendors rely strictly on us to provide them with work but, unfortunately, we don't guarantee there will be work for everyone every day. So be sure to work with several companies. When the work flow picks up to the overwhelming stage, decide which clients you want to keep and which ones to cut loose. It will be in your company's best interest to cut the losers loose quickly.
> 
> That said, I need to say goodnight. Packing and loading up for the move have completely worn me out and I'm hitting the sack.
> 
> Goodnight, everyone.
> 
> Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

You're very welcome, Sandra. I was going to e-mail you but your profile is not 100% complete yet. If you like, you can send an e-mail to me at [email protected] so I can send you all the information.

The next class will be held in Fort Mohave, Arizona, on the 24th and 25th. If we need one more day, we'll extend the training to the 26th @ no additional cost. I'm going to be scheduling a class in California but it won't be until later this month. 

Fremont ~ I'll be looking for an e-mail next week then. Go ahead and get them settled in first so you're not distracted. I should be more available around Wednesday or Thursday of next week than I am right now, too.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*A Little Help?*

Hi all,
My name is Bob Boland. I apologize up front if this post resembles spam in anyway. I assure you, these are legitimate questions that I have, and I’m not trying to sell to you. In fact, anyone willing to help me with this will be given the product if you want it.

First a little history. My son-in law (Russ) started sub contracting for a vendor out of Portland, Oregon a few months ago. He is very capable of doing the field work, but has had almost no experience with computers. He was losing money on jobs because the computer work was taking him way too long. I helped him out for a few nights and figured there had to be a better way, so I developed a piece of software that creates and names the folders in less than one second. It then opens the folders to add pictures and reports, then zips it all up automatically. Russ shared the software with a few of his co-workers, and they all loved it. 

I have read all of the posts in this thread and found them helpful, but I still have some questions. First of all, is this a product that there would be a market for? Who would I market this to, vendors or contractors? How would I acquire a list to market to? Should I offer vendors a commission to sell it to their contractors? How much should I charge? Russ suggested 
that I charge the same amount that he paid for his GPS, which was $125. That sounds a little steep to me, what do you think? It does save a lot of time, and I’ve done some of the field and computer work, so I know anything to save time is a plus in your business.
(It’s online now for $98.95, but that isn’t written in stone)

I know this part will sound like spam, no matter how carefully I word it, so I would like to mention again that I will give you a license key free of charge if you can give me any useful information.
The license keys cost me money, so I must stress ‘USEFUL” information.
The web site is at : evbolutionsoftware dot com/EZ-PCR 
(it is case sensitive)
The screenshot page gives a quick walkthrough of the product, as does the demonstration video. There is also a fully working download with a free 25 time trial.

For all of you about to help, I would like to thank you in advance. 
For all of you about to flame me, I’m sorry that I bothered you.

Bob Boland
Evbolution Software


----------



## Guest

*Houston Tx Contractor wants into the REO Preservation Market*

I have my own construction co. SCRAPMETALJOE
I cover most all aspects of construction from demo to new construction/remodel/repair. 
I also remove trees and do trimming. Along with debris/trash/scrapmetal removal and cleanup. 
I have been busy enough for the last year but things have slowed down a bit.
I have been wanting to get into the REO cleanup/Preservation market because I know there is substantial amount of work and money to be made there. 
I have gotten most of my work from word of mouth.
I have all the tools, GL insurance, website, digital camera, internet and trucks and trailers to do the job.
I have already been doing this kind of work just not through this market.
I have been reading through the threads and it will take some time to soak up all the info out there.
If someone can point me in the right direction on where to get started or put me to work I can start immediately. I have good professional references and I do quality work. As you can view my website first hand of our work.
Thank you from Houston Tx.
ScrapMetalJoe


----------



## Guest

*scraper Joe*

I think I remember seeing some adds for help in Houston on http://www.cubicyard.us/. You might look around. Also, I get emails constantly from Five Brothers Company looking for Houston area work. Be prepared that working in the City will all be "taken" since everyone wants work in their "backyard" and not have to drive so be ready to drive 40-50 miles out of town for the first few years till "people move on" since currently there is no $$ in the Property Preservation business due to everyone underbidding each other in the pursuit of being awarded bids....We call it the "race to the bottom" effect and if you are trying to get into the business then work for no profit for a year or two then you can slowly raise your rates after everyone else is broke... Sad but that is the business right now. Good luck and have fun! :wallbash:


----------



## Guest

*REO Preservation*



MVH said:


> I start my first Fannie Mae foreclosure rehab today. Its just some paint, minor repairs, and carpeting. I'll keep you guys posted on things like payment cycle times.
> 
> There's not a lot of money in it, but it is great filler to keep the the schedule full.
> 
> Mike


How did you get with Fannie Mae?


----------



## Guest

Bob_Boland said:


> Hi all,
> My name is Bob Boland. I apologize up front if this post resembles spam in anyway. I assure you, these are legitimate questions that I have, and I’m not trying to sell to you. In fact, anyone willing to help me with this will be given the product if you want it.
> 
> First a little history. My son-in law (Russ) started sub contracting for a vendor out of Portland, Oregon a few months ago. He is very capable of doing the field work, but has had almost no experience with computers. He was losing money on jobs because the computer work was taking him way too long. I helped him out for a few nights and figured there had to be a better way, so I developed a piece of software that creates and names the folders in less than one second. It then opens the folders to add pictures and reports, then zips it all up automatically. Russ shared the software with a few of his co-workers, and they all loved it.
> 
> I have read all of the posts in this thread and found them helpful, but I still have some questions. First of all, is this a product that there would be a market for? Who would I market this to, vendors or contractors? How would I acquire a list to market to? Should I offer vendors a commission to sell it to their contractors? How much should I charge? Russ suggested
> that I charge the same amount that he paid for his GPS, which was $125. That sounds a little steep to me, what do you think? It does save a lot of time, and I’ve done some of the field and computer work, so I know anything to save time is a plus in your business.
> (It’s online now for $98.95, but that isn’t written in stone)
> 
> I know this part will sound like spam, no matter how carefully I word it, so I would like to mention again that I will give you a license key free of charge if you can give me any useful information.
> The license keys cost me money, so I must stress ‘USEFUL” information.
> The web site is at : evbolutionsoftware dot com/EZ-PCR
> (it is case sensitive)
> The screenshot page gives a quick walkthrough of the product, as does the demonstration video. There is also a fully working download with a free 25 time trial.
> 
> For all of you about to help, I would like to thank you in advance.
> For all of you about to flame me, I’m sorry that I bothered you.
> 
> Bob Boland
> Evbolution Software


oh boy. FYI this software wouldn't work as most companies have their own programs and if you go directly through banks and or realtors you go straight to them. I don't really see a need for this program


----------



## Guest

XanadooLTD said:


> oh boy. FYI this software wouldn't work as most companies have their own programs and if you go directly through banks and or realtors you go straight to them. I don't really see a need for this program


If you get your work directly from the banks and or realtors, don't you still have to send them pictures and reports? Thats what the program does, it makes packaging your pictures and reports less time consuming. So far, everybody who has actually tried the program loves it.


----------



## Guest

reports are genreated using the lenders programs (national companies) along with photos. Irfan view is used to compress files and sent directly. Irfanview is free. Good luck with it. Just seems that it may only target a small audience of these contractors.


----------



## brm1109

*Computer systems*

Well here we go, I was all set to sign up with one of the nationals and then found out that my computer system is not compatable with theirs'. I have all Mac computers and their systems only works with pcs.
If this has happened to anyone else, do you think it is worth buying a new computer and hoping for enough work to cover it or do I just say thanks but no thanks?
As always thanks for the advice.


----------



## Guest

yep if you are hooked up with the company you better change your system. it will pay off.


----------



## Guest

*Winterization*

I attempted to winterize a property today and ran into some difficulties. I was required to air pressure test the house plumbing and couldn't get it to hold any pressure. Of course, the system could simply have leaks but my gut tells me that is not the problem. All faucets were turned off and the water supply was turned off. I have done this once before with no problems. If anyone has any suggestions for this confused dude, please let me know. Thanks!


----------



## Guest

*get help*

If this is confusing call a professional...ie licensed plumber. 
There is a ton of reasons why a system will not hold pressure and couldn't list them all. If you have no plumbing experience then I would strongly suggest getting a professional. You might have to pay the costs unless you bid the winterization to the client. It would be an inexpensive lesson?
Anyhow, better than you being held liable for any damages that may happen eh?:confused1:


----------



## Guest

*Re: Winterization*

Thank you, FremontREO...sounds like a plan.:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

I just want to cite positive experience, I have been working with Spectrum fsi out of utah and they are great. I am doing trashouts and sales cleans in the VT and NH areas. It seems that this company is taking over some of Safeguard's territory, it is a 30 day wait period for pay, but they never take a percentage and always pay. all of my on site bids have been approved. I have to say that my move to work in this field has paid off. it helps that as a general contractor, I already had the equipment, i.e., trailers, dump truck, crew, generators and compressors, but I am averaging about 3000 in extra income a month. anyway I just wanted to share this positive experience..mike


----------



## Guest

Is anyone here going to be in Washington D.C. for the Prop Preservation Conference? It's 11/4-11/6. I'd love to meet up with a few of you if you're in town :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

*Company in Florida*



SunStateHome said:


> Hi.. Can anyone tell me what a good rate for 1 million GL and 500 Error and Omission Insurance is. I am also looking for a company in Florida if you know of any. Hey, while I am at it, if there is any national companies that are looking for a contractor in the tampa / Fort Meyers area in FL, give me a shout .. Thanks.. Have a great day:thumbup:


 Hi:

My name is Crystal and I am new here. You all have a really great blog that is sooooo helpful and extremely interesting. I do know of a company that needs sub-contractors in Florida. It's called CFPM (Central Florida Property Management). The contact name is Bruce...I forget his last name. But he is helping me to get started under him learning step by step how to do this business, and he needs people who have experience. Don't worry if you don't have much experience, just be upfront with him and let him know if you're new or if you need training and he will help you. His email address is [email protected]. I hope this helps you out. I just moved from the tampa/clearwater area because of lack of work so I hope you have more success than I did getting into the market. This company should really be able to put you on though because he said he had a lot of work to be completed. Just tell him you were referred to him by Crystal @ Diamond Field Services. He should be able to help you out.

Crystal
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> I currently own a licensed and insured trash removal/clean-out company in Northern New Jersey. I am looking to get into cleaning properties for banks and so forth. Anyone know the best way of getting into this?


 I would advertise to the real estate companies for this type of work. Trust me, they have the "hook-up" for that. Some of them even ask if you can clean their properties (houses and real estate buildings).

Crystal
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

drasylum said:


> just thought I would share my experience with spectrum field services. I started with them a month ago and at this point I have made over 4000.00 with two cleanouts, a lawn cleanup and various inspections, they pay promptly in 30 days and don't take out 30%. very pleased with the results and it looks like I will have a long lasting relationship with them..mike


 Hi Mike:

I would like to know about working with Spectrum. Do you know if they accept people who are new to the business? They ask for a resume. Do you have to have a lot of experience of companies that you have worked for. I do see that they also hire for inspections. I have some experience with that as well. Have you done any inspections for them? I mainly need to know what type of resume they are looking for. Would it be a resume that advertises your company like you see on National Field Services web site or like a resume where you are looking for employment? I am soooo tired of being rejected by national companies and having to result to working as a sub for locals, so this is why I am asking. 

Crystal
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Same here. Not good.
> 
> Still waiting on money from July.
> 
> They will use any excuse in the book they can to cut and deny your invoices. You can bet that they'll be invoicing the bank for the work you did but won't pay you.
> 
> I had one with them that was 3 hrs from my office. Mow a full acre, and three hrs back home.
> Paid .......... drum roll................. $30. When I laughed into the phone and told them that was never happening they acted hurt and asked why not. I told the not so bright person that they were asking me to work a 12 hr day for $30, it was not going to happen! They spoke to their manager and "we've got good news". We can do $75 for this job, when do you want to schedule it? I told him not this week that he was still too cheap.
> I never went and did it, that was very close to the beginning of the end for me. When I found out that they were two months out and no payment in sight I immediately quit.
> They've since used every excuse possible to cut and/or deny my invoices to the point I'll probably never see any of the money I worked for ($5000).
> 
> If I were to add up ALL the work I did for them and all the "pay" and average it out over 2.5 months I would never even break even. Let alone make a profit for my wages or pay for my equipment.


Hi:

Are you guys speaking of Field Assets or another company? It's looking like the person who originally spoke about Field Assets says it's the best company to work for, yet you guys are saying basically it's the worst. Am I reading this correctly, or did I miss something....cause I really hope I missed something lol


----------



## Guest

pipo5832 said:


> Hello everyone and thanks for the great input. I've learned a lot from this site before starting my PP business last week. I have a question concerning national company. I notice a lot of them require E&O insurance. I've called around here in Tulsa o.k (home state) and have not being able to find any such policies I called allstate,state farm,all local and no one offers it. Does anyone have this insurance and where can i get it? The other question i have is Most companies also want workers comp insurance. Im the only employee, can i get workers comp and do i need it? Is it expensive? Thank you all for all your input.


 Try InsureTek, they offer the whole package at a really good price.


----------



## Guest

Bob_Boland said:


> Hi all,
> My name is Bob Boland. I apologize up front if this post resembles spam in anyway. I assure you, these are legitimate questions that I have, and I’m not trying to sell to you. In fact, anyone willing to help me with this will be given the product if you want it.
> 
> First a little history. My son-in law (Russ) started sub contracting for a vendor out of Portland, Oregon a few months ago. He is very capable of doing the field work, but has had almost no experience with computers. He was losing money on jobs because the computer work was taking him way too long. I helped him out for a few nights and figured there had to be a better way, so I developed a piece of software that creates and names the folders in less than one second. It then opens the folders to add pictures and reports, then zips it all up automatically. Russ shared the software with a few of his co-workers, and they all loved it.
> 
> I have read all of the posts in this thread and found them helpful, but I still have some questions. First of all, is this a product that there would be a market for? Who would I market this to, vendors or contractors? How would I acquire a list to market to? Should I offer vendors a commission to sell it to their contractors? How much should I charge? Russ suggested
> that I charge the same amount that he paid for his GPS, which was $125. That sounds a little steep to me, what do you think? It does save a lot of time, and I’ve done some of the field and computer work, so I know anything to save time is a plus in your business.
> (It’s online now for $98.95, but that isn’t written in stone)
> 
> I know this part will sound like spam, no matter how carefully I word it, so I would like to mention again that I will give you a license key free of charge if you can give me any useful information.
> The license keys cost me money, so I must stress ‘USEFUL” information.
> The web site is at : evbolutionsoftware dot com/EZ-PCR
> (it is case sensitive)
> The screenshot page gives a quick walkthrough of the product, as does the demonstration video. There is also a fully working download with a free 25 time trial.
> 
> For all of you about to help, I would like to thank you in advance.
> For all of you about to flame me, I’m sorry that I bothered you.
> 
> Bob Boland
> Evbolution Software


 
Hi Bob:

Honestly, I think your product could be a life saver for some people like my husband who has no computer skills. But as far as advertising it, maybe you should start with the start up companies (such as mine) that are advertised on certain websites like SOFI or something like that. Or, the best way would probably be on *Terry Platt's websites*. He offers *free* advertising of your company and more than likely, you can contact him and he will allow you to advertise for free at his website so that it will cut alot of your costs right there. 
On another note, if I were to buy the software, I would not pay more than $50-$75 for it. That's just me cause I'm cheap when it comes to something I can do myself. Just kidding...the real reason is because there are so many products out there already, and I am not one to spend alot on something that's so small in my day to day operations. Especially since it is a new product. Try a limited time offer at a really great rate, where nobody has anything to lose. I am not at all trying to tell you how to run your business, but it's just a suggestion.

As far as Terry Platt goes, you should be able to go to his website at terryplatt dot com, or terryplatt at yahoo dot com. Email me at *diamondfieldservices at gmail dot com* and I will give you more information if you need it. I would also like to check out your software to see how good it is. I know alot of people who would love to have something to make the office part of this job especially simple so we can get to bed quicker after a long day of preservation. If it's as good as you say, I can help to give a really good word for your product in the state of Florida. I know some companies that speak of this problem all the time and word of mouth is still one of the best ways to advertise. 

Email me and I will try to help you as much as you need.

Crystal
diamond field services at gmail dot com


----------



## Guest

Bob_Boland said:


> If you get your work directly from the banks and or realtors, don't you still have to send them pictures and reports? Thats what the program does, it makes packaging your pictures and reports less time consuming. So far, everybody who has actually tried the program loves it.


 
I don't mean to be rude, but everyone does not work directly with banks/realtors so some do need the program. Some of us are sub-contractors who may need that program because we may be subbing for a sub who does not have a software program set up for you to send in your work. For example, I worked for a guy who did preservation and inspections. I did all of his inspections while he did the preservation, and I had to organize, zip, name the file, separate each file, and everything all from scratch....which took at least 2 hours before I could send it to him to make sure it was done correctly. I think you should aim your market to those just starting out in this business, or those who are sub-contractors. It makes sense to me. Trust and believe, whenever you invent something, someone somewhere needs it and is looking for it. 
Everyone is not computer literate and everyone can't get the opportunity to work straight from the banks and realtors. Think of it this way....somebody thought the coffee lid had no purpose (lol). Well, just like your son needed that software, imagine how many people are in America right now who are doing these tasks from scratch!!! I surely was and it was nothing but tedious. I don't need it right now, but I surely needed it back then (last year). I would really like to see it in action. Honestly, I think you could do some good with it even if it's not the hottest thing on the market, companies are making money right now just selling software to people so they can learn windows or microsoft excel, or how to sell on ebay. If people need such simple software that is learned in elementary school, why not something like this? Everybody doesn't have the same skills and everybody's not working for the big companies. So I say go with it.

Crystal
diamondfieldservices at gmail dot com


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## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Well here we go, I was all set to sign up with one of the nationals and then found out that my computer system is not compatable with theirs'. I have all Mac computers and their systems only works with pcs.
> If this has happened to anyone else, do you think it is worth buying a new computer and hoping for enough work to cover it or do I just say thanks but no thanks?
> As always thanks for the advice.


It is for this reason that I want a Mac so bad, but refuse to get one. Nobody is ever able to do much with it because it's not compatible with Microsoft's programs and not many people have them that run a business or send out software. Such a shame! Anyhow, yes I think it would be in your best interest to get at least one computer for the business. It can't hurt...actually, it can only help you.

Crystal


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## Guest

*Inspections*

Does anyone have any idea how much to charge for property preservation inspections? We have been doing prop pres for about 2 years now and have recently started looking at expanding into other prop pres areas. Any help would be VERY appreciated!


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## Guest

AlyseInvestment said:


> Does anyone have any idea how much to charge for property preservation inspections? We have been doing prop pres for about 2 years now and have recently started looking at expanding into other prop pres areas. Any help would be VERY appreciated!


Depends on what you mean. If you're speaking of Mortgage Field Inspections where you inspect the properties before, during foreclosure or after foreclosure, then they range from $4 to about $50+. Email me and I will send you something to help with pricing and how to do them (diamondfieldservices at gmail dot com)


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## brm1109

*Altisource Portfolio Solutions*

I was recently contacted by this company regarding property preservation work. Has anyone ever dealt with them and if so, any feedback would be appreciated.
Thank you


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## ARPPP

*Re: Altisource*



brm1109 said:


> I was recently contacted by this company regarding property preservation work. Has anyone ever dealt with them and if so, any feedback would be appreciated.
> Thank you


 
I was contacted by them as well. I did some research and it appears that they are/were a part of Ocwen which is a major player in the REO market. Ocwen services many of the foreclosures in my area. They will charge you a "small fee" for accepting work per the agent I spoke with. He says they are "trying" to get rid of this. 

Anyone have any further insight?

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation


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## BPWY

DiamondFieldSvc said:


> Hi:
> 
> Are you guys speaking of Field Assets or another company? It's looking like the person who originally spoke about Field Assets says it's the best company to work for, yet you guys are saying basically it's the worst. Am I reading this correctly, or did I miss something....cause I really hope I missed something lol






Yup I was speaking of Field Assets. Or more literally I call them another name that states with A.........

They have no clue what is going on in their offices. After we quit working for them because of non payments they continued to call and beg us to accept work for almost 2 months. In spite of repeated (some times daily) telling them that we are not working for them because of non payment.

Run far far far away from them. 

Safeguard isn't very good either. $30 grass cuts are just an insult when you'll have 2 to 3 hrs into an individual job when you include drive time both ways and work time.


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## Guest

to the person who wondered what the fee is for inspections, I get paid 30.00 by Spectrum Field Services. However invariably I end up with the trashout, the sales clean and the winterization, which adds up to about 800 to 850 per property NOT including any ramp ups if there is more debris to deal with. they are a great company to work with, no discounts, prompt 30 day pay and good communication. they seem to be taking over safeguard's work as well, everywhere I go I see safeguard stickers. Lawn cuts are 65 for bimonthlies and much more for the initial cuts. good company. I just made over 3K on a 5 apartment trashout and winterization NOT including the sales clean which is coming up at 250 per apt. yowza. I did have to pull out about 30 yards of trash...but my local recycling center is very reasonable and it cost me about 200 bucks to get rid of it.


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## Guest

I see that the asset companies want a discount rate. How do you figure a dicount rate? Per job, per 10 jobs, per item? How much discount is typical? Thanks in advance for the help.


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## brm1109

*Discount*

A lot of them take 15 - 25% off of your invoice, that is their cut. You are better off if you could get some of the work on your own.


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## BPWY

Yeah, all the nationals want their slice of the pie too.

In my opinion 25% is very excessive, 20% is a little high and 15% to 18% is probably fair.


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## Guest

So they call there cut a Discount?


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## Guest

*HUD Guidelines*

I have looked through every post on here and I was wondering if you all could tell me what HUD is calling a unit?
On their guidelines it has a price for one unit, two units additional units and so on?

Thank you!!!!


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## Guest




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## Guest

KMB540 said:


> I have looked through every post on here and I was wondering if you all could tell me what HUD is calling a unit?
> On their guidelines it has a price for one unit, two units additional units and so on?
> 
> Thank you!!!!


 
You are kidding, right?????


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## Guest

Brickie said:


> You are kidding, right?????


:clap::thumbup:
That may be your competitor! :hang:


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## Guest

A unit is an apartment or a house. i just did five "units" and they were apartments. that's the bomb when you are getting 450.00 plus 250.00 for sales cleaning and $152.00 for weatherization per "unit". took five hours, do the math. However i did do a house that took 4 days so it ain't all the same (though my provider authorized a total of 2250.00 for that one.....and no discount!!!!


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## Guest

Thank you drasylum,
No, I wasn't kidding. I figured it pertained to apartments but not houses. If I have two houses to trash out and they each have 12 cubic yards of debris, then what they are saying is that the maximum they will allow is $825.00 for both (15 cu yd). But if I did one now and one later on they would allow $660.00 each. Thats a big price difference. 
To do 5 apartments (units) at one time I could see where that would be a good thing.
Glad I could entertain you two this morning! I have read all the posts on here and have seen where some people could not even find the HUD guidelines without you all giving them the direct link to do so. So I know that to you it may have been a dumb question but I like to make sure I fully understand the things I am looking at!


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## Guest

KMB540 said:


> Thank you drasylum,
> No, I wasn't kidding. I figured it pertained to apartments but not houses. If I have two houses to trash out and they each have 12 cubic yards of debris, then what they are saying is that the maximum they will allow is $825.00 for both (15 cu yd). But if I did one now and one later on they would allow $660.00 each. Thats a big price difference.
> To do 5 apartments (units) at one time I could see where that would be a good thing.
> Glad I could entertain you two this morning! I have read all the posts on here and have seen where some people could not even find the HUD guidelines without you all giving them the direct link to do so. So I know that to you it may have been a dumb question but I like to make sure I fully understand the things I am looking at!


 :jester:
Sorry not laughing at you but at the industry as a whole. I watch at least 90% of the newbies working for free but they don't know it till 6-9 months later. This business is for the brave few that know what they are doing and we know the risk and the reward. If "someone" does not know the answer to some of the very basic questions then I really do suggest that "that someone" works for a Property Preservation Company (not a service company) for a minimum of 2 years so they can learn the ropes and they will protect "that someone" from the potential liabilities and the potential chargebacks. This business has changed 100% in the last 2 years due to the increased number of homes and contractors and the service companies have realized that the pay is better to them by "finding loopholes" for not paying the contractor. As an example a contractor made a very minimal mistake and as a result we were awarded a $115,000 job and the contractor who made the very simple mistake is paying for our work. Not my choice of how to get the work but in seriousness this business trully is not for amateurs...Just a kind thought! Good luck.:thumbsup:


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## Guest

*Fha/VA/Conv*

Ok I have done preservation work for over a year now. I work for a XXX Field Services. I have had no major problems with them paying(though not always happy about the discounts!!) until recently. I know that everything is based off of HUD price guidelines. Or at least thats what i thought. After submitting a work order on a FHA property, I was told that my price(which was standard HUD price) was too high. They stated that FHA pays a lower amount then what HUD pays. They have only ever giving me a pricing sheet for HUD and are now saying that I should have known it. After searching, I can only find a VA, Fannie Mae and the HUD. Does anyone know where the FHA one is? Does it even exist or are they trying to get me to bill less so that they can make more then their 15% profit? I am about fed up with this company and their bullxxxx ways.

And to anyone getting into this....it is not necessarily a hard business to start but know that its not cheap to get into. You can't buy cheap equipment because you have to count on it being reliable. Expect to pay $1500+ just on a lawnmower!!! Not to mention weed eaters, edgers, blowers, generator, air compressor, locks(cuz you foot the bill for them), cleaning supplies, etc. Plus a truck/trailer to haul it all in and the gas to get you to the job sights. Then everything that you bill gets a discount. So lets say you make $100 on a grass cut. Then its discounted(amount depends on company you work for) 25%. So now you made $75. But you have to figure in your cost of fuel to get there, fuel to do the job, time that the job took, sub-contractor wage and dump fees for the grass clippings(which you dont get reimbursed on). So now you are looking more at an income of $10-$12. But then you have to consider the office time you put in. Roughly for every hour you are in the field doing a job, it requires an hour in front of the computer. I work as many hours on my computer doing invoices as i do mowing lawns or changing locks. Every ounce of work has to be documented with pictures of before and after. And all those pics have to be uploaded and named. I work 7 days a week. I am up at 7am and if I am lucky I am in bed by 1am. 
Everyone thinks that there is sooo much money to be made. I put out $400-$600 in gas in my truck. Per WEEK. I do make a profit and I won't lie about that. But it took over 8 months to finally make that profit. But when I started, my start up costs were over $7,000 not including my truck I bought. I also didnt get paid for the first 45 days so all my expenses were fronted by me. Banks dont pay weekly. They pay every 30-60 days.

It doesnt make a difference if you are a woman or not. I am and I do the job just fine. Its a learning experience and things are constantly changing. 

Sorry this is so long(I tend to ramble!!LOL). I hope I helped a little for anyone thinking about starting out. And I hope someone can answer my question!!! :thumbup:

Thanks
Crystal


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Yup I was speaking of Field Assets. Or more literally I call them another name that states with A.........
> 
> They have no clue what is going on in their offices. After we quit working for them because of non payments they continued to call and beg us to accept work for almost 2 months. In spite of repeated (some times daily) telling them that we are not working for them because of non payment.
> 
> Run far far far away from them.
> 
> Safeguard isn't very good either. $30 grass cuts are just an insult when you'll have 2 to 3 hrs into an individual job when you include drive time both ways and work time.


OMG!!! Thank you so much for that information. And....it coincides with whats 2 quotes above on safeguard. I am so glad I have people to network with on this site so that we can all help each other. U guys are life savers....literally!:thumbup:


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## Guest

drasylum said:


> A unit is an apartment or a house. i just did five "units" and they were apartments. that's the bomb when you are getting 450.00 plus 250.00 for sales cleaning and $152.00 for weatherization per "unit". took five hours, do the math. However i did do a house that took 4 days so it ain't all the same (though my provider authorized a total of 2250.00 for that one.....and no discount!!!!


Do you mind quoting who your provider is? I'm in Florida looking for some. Kinda new to Property Preservation and looking to start by or before next year if I can learn quick enough lol:laughing:


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## Guest

catly21 said:


> Ok I have done preservation work for over a year now. I work for a XXX Field Services. I have had no major problems with them paying(though not always happy about the discounts!!) until recently. I know that everything is based off of HUD price guidelines. Or at least thats what i thought. After submitting a work order on a FHA property, I was told that my price(which was standard HUD price) was too high. They stated that FHA pays a lower amount then what HUD pays. They have only ever giving me a pricing sheet for HUD and are now saying that I should have known it. After searching, I can only find a VA, Fannie Mae and the HUD. Does anyone know where the FHA one is? Does it even exist or are they trying to get me to bill less so that they can make more then their 15% profit? I am about fed up with this company and their bullxxxx ways.
> 
> And to anyone getting into this....it is not necessarily a hard business to start but know that its not cheap to get into. You can't buy cheap equipment because you have to count on it being reliable. Expect to pay $1500+ just on a lawnmower!!! Not to mention weed eaters, edgers, blowers, generator, air compressor, locks(cuz you foot the bill for them), cleaning supplies, etc. Plus a truck/trailer to haul it all in and the gas to get you to the job sights. Then everything that you bill gets a discount. So lets say you make $100 on a grass cut. Then its discounted(amount depends on company you work for) 25%. So now you made $75. But you have to figure in your cost of fuel to get there, fuel to do the job, time that the job took, sub-contractor wage and dump fees for the grass clippings(which you dont get reimbursed on). So now you are looking more at an income of $10-$12. But then you have to consider the office time you put in. Roughly for every hour you are in the field doing a job, it requires an hour in front of the computer. I work as many hours on my computer doing invoices as i do mowing lawns or changing locks. Every ounce of work has to be documented with pictures of before and after. And all those pics have to be uploaded and named. I work 7 days a week. I am up at 7am and if I am lucky I am in bed by 1am.
> Everyone thinks that there is sooo much money to be made. I put out $400-$600 in gas in my truck. Per WEEK. I do make a profit and I won't lie about that. But it took over 8 months to finally make that profit. But when I started, my start up costs were over $7,000 not including my truck I bought. I also didnt get paid for the first 45 days so all my expenses were fronted by me. Banks dont pay weekly. They pay every 30-60 days.
> 
> It doesnt make a difference if you are a woman or not. I am and I do the job just fine. Its a learning experience and things are constantly changing.
> 
> Sorry this is so long(I tend to ramble!!LOL). I hope I helped a little for anyone thinking about starting out. And I hope someone can answer my question!!! :thumbup:
> 
> Thanks
> Crystal


 
Hi Crystal:

My name is Crystal as well, and I would like to know if we could chat about this. I have been wanting to get into this business, but it seems so secretive that you can't get alot of information or some type of course to teach all that you need to know. I think that I would be ok if I could learn things like winterization and such. Is it possible that you could contact me at : diamond field services @ gmail dot com?
I would really appreciate some help.

Crystal


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## ARPPP

DiamondFieldSvc said:


> Hi Crystal:
> 
> My name is Crystal as well, and I would like to know if we could chat about this. I have been wanting to get into this business, but it seems so secretive that you can't get alot of information or some type of course to teach all that you need to know. I think that I would be ok if I could learn things like winterization and such. Is it possible that you could contact me at : diamond field services @ gmail dot com?
> I would really appreciate some help.
> 
> Crystal


Hi Crystal,

Linda Hall offers training with her company. She has many posts on here. Look for her posts on this site. Send her an email on training to [email protected] and make sure your state is in the subject line.

Good luck!
Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation


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## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hi Crystal,
> 
> Linda Hall offers training with her company. She has many posts on here. Look for her posts on this site. Send her an email on training to [email protected] and make sure your state is in the subject line.
> 
> Good luck!
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation


 
Hi Annette:

I've already sent an email for Linda's training a couple of weeks ago. I'm just waiting for a reply. Hopefully, she can respond soon. I know she's a very busy lady so I'm just waiting patiently.:notworthy


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## BPWY

samccard said:


> So they call there cut a Discount?





A lot of folks like myself and some friends run into is the inability to be competitive on the bidding process. 
You have a national company and then a regional company and then you the end guy that does the work. With all of them taking a discount off of the work and the bids you cannot be competitive. For example if you need $500 to do the job you have to bid $890 in order to get the $500 to you. 


Its pretty tough. 

Right now I'm getting the song and dance about work being slow and there isn't any work available. We all know better than that, but knowledge isnt putting any food on my table.


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## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> A lot of folks like myself and some friends run into is the inability to be competitive on the bidding process.
> You have a national company and then a regional company and then you the end guy that does the work. With all of them taking a discount off of the work and the bids you cannot be competitive. For example if you need $500 to do the job you have to bid $890 in order to get the $500 to you.
> 
> 
> Its pretty tough.
> 
> Right now I'm getting the song and dance about work being slow and there isn't any work available. We all know better than that, but knowledge isnt putting any food on my table.


 
Are you soliciting your local REO realtors? I work with them. I have not gotten any work from the nationals. I get emails from the nationals telling me my area is saturated with vendors. I have met many "wannabe's" with no experience a nice business cards and website... Find your local REO agents in databases like REOMAC.

Annette
www.arppp.net


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## BPWY

I am working on a flyer to hand out to local agents and local banks.
Thanks for the tip on where to find the local REO agents.


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## Guest

*preseveration*

i have been a contractor doing preservation work for a year now and it has been rough they dont pay fast and find all kinds of reasons as to not pay you,, everything from the b.s forms that they think of using everyday to your photos arent clear enough, yea clear enough, I do turn a decent dollar but the profitt is small after your expenses some months have been a break even others are not record busters either,i take a small salary , i wonder if i should go back to the private sector,, we work seven long days a week and travel across the state my gass and toll fees are though the roof..!!!!!


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## Guest

*CYPREXX vancouver is a shameful nightmare!!*

:wallbash:We were contacted by Amy D. in the Vancouver office to rekey several apartments and a house. She never mentioned any flat rate as most of you have mentioned, in fact she mentioned nothing at all except that she needed these done ASAP. She was informed that unless she filled out an application she would be a "pay as you go" customer. She even sent us out to rekey places that were "supposed" to be vacant - they weren't. It has now been several months and we have not been paid. Amy D. returned our call once only to say that she had questions about our fees and that she would come by the next day to talk to us. NEVER SHOWED. No one in her company will return our calls and the agent has changed her cell phone number. The worst of it is she, Amy D. talked our learning disabled daughter into cleaning two of these units for her. We helped her with it to give her some experience - she also has never been paid. The places she had to clean were revolting - filled with nasty mildew and animal crap. I can't believe that they can feel good about taking advantage of a disabled young lady. SHAME SHAME! 
RUN AWAY of they call. It's not worth the time it will take you to try to collect.


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## Guest

> We were contacted by Amy D. in the Vancouver office to rekey several apartments and a house. She never mentioned any flat rate as most of you have mentioned, in fact she mentioned nothing at all except that she needed these done ASAP


Something tells me you don't have a contract with anyone.

So why didn't you tell her it's XXXX per service call plus____??????

You're supposedly a locksmith, yet you failed to discuss your fees with a client???? What's up with that????



> She even sent us out to rekey places that were "supposed" to be vacant - they weren't. It has now been several months and we have not been paid.


 
How long do you plan on working for free??????




> she, Amy D. talked our learning disabled daughter into cleaning two of these units for her. We helped her with it to give her some experience - she also has never been paid.


 

So despite being played for big time chumps by the POS Amy, you decide to then help your learning disabled daughter get screwed over by the same Amy?????


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## Guest

*Call Brett*



Preclock said:


> :wallbash:We were contacted by Amy D. in the Vancouver office to rekey several apartments and a house. She never mentioned any flat rate as most of you have mentioned, in fact she mentioned nothing at all except that she needed these done ASAP. She was informed that unless she filled out an application she would be a "pay as you go" customer. She even sent us out to rekey places that were "supposed" to be vacant - they weren't. It has now been several months and we have not been paid. Amy D. returned our call once only to say that she had questions about our fees and that she would come by the next day to talk to us. NEVER SHOWED. No one in her company will return our calls and the agent has changed her cell phone number. The worst of it is she, Amy D. talked our learning disabled daughter into cleaning two of these units for her. We helped her with it to give her some experience - she also has never been paid. The places she had to clean were revolting - filled with nasty mildew and animal crap. I can't believe that they can feel good about taking advantage of a disabled young lady. SHAME SHAME!
> RUN AWAY of they call. It's not worth the time it will take you to try to collect.


Call the owner Brett Ory at 800-516-6348. This is published information on the internet so its not info that is confidential. Make sure when you call-the secretary will ask "who you would like to talk to?" and sound like you talk to him all the time and generally they will pass you to his personal office/phone...At least it worked for me. GL:clap:


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## APlusPPGroup

Preclock ~

Are you sure it was Cyprexx and not someone saying she's a representative of Cyprexx? 

We've done 4 jobs for them but always asked ahead of time what the pay was. No one ever refused to discuss it with us and, if it was too low, we turned it down. We're not taking work from them because of the low pay but they were never unprofessional. Something just doesn't sound right.

Did they have you fill out a W-9 form so that you could get paid? I would do as FremontREO suggests and call someone. I think their main office is in Texas. Can anyone confirm?

If you're new to the industry, be aware. There are many who will take advantage, from those you work for and those who work for you. We've had our share of sleezy clients and we've had to terminate many unethical vendors from our network. 

It's life - you just have to keep your eyes and ears open in order to minimize your risks.

Linda

BTW. Training classes are pretty much over for the year. We had our last one a couple weeks ago. But with holidays coming up and the fact that we're going into the unpredictable weather season, we probably won't have another until around February or March of next year.


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## BPWY

I believe Cyprexx main office is out of FL.


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## Guest

I'm new here, been lurking for quite some time. It wasn't Cyprexx who called you. They are based in FL and have an 813 area code that can be easily googled. I have worked with 6-7 different state coordinators and have never had a problem getting paid and in the correct amount as invoiced. I don't do large volume for them, but they have never set pricing for me. I give them bids, they approve or deny, the work is done at that price. I also do inspections for them and do so at a price that is better than all but one other company I work with, so the low pay and not getting paid seems rather fishy. This is from someone that works with a dozen nationals and a few dozen agents, banks, relos, etc.


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## Guest

*Introduction*

Hello all

I just finished reading all 383 posts. Took me about 8 hours. I read slow. I wanna say thanks to everyone who contributed information here. Linda I wanna have your babies. I decided I should give back a little since I did gain from this forum.

I am new but I have learned a lot about property preservation. I have been studying the business for 4 1/2 months now. I will hopefully start working just after new years. I will keep an eye on this forum and help give some feedback and knowledge.

Thanks again 
James


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## Guest

*E&amp;o*

Hello all

Its been a few days since my last post so I thought Id throw something on here. I have noticed that many questions here revolve around Errors and Omissions (E&O) and General Liability (GL) insurance. 

Ive seen a lot of posts on here saying its not necessary and "I wouldn't take a job that required it". Which is all fine as a matter of opinion. Personally I think if your under insured your asking for trouble. Hopefully if you have it you will never need it. And that is way better then needing it and wishing you had it.

I went through a national provider for mine. I'm not posting the name here because I am not here to advertise or spam. If someone wants it email me. Ummm I don't know if my email works here lol. I better figure that out. Anyway, my premium was $1627.46. I was able to put 30% down, like $540, and pay the rest over 9 months. About $120 per month.

Oh and thats E&O and GL together. I scanned the paperwork and I don't know if its E&O with GL attached (thats what it looks like) Or GL with an E&O rider. I don't care cuz its coverage. It covers what all the National companies have asked for and if the want to be put on as additional insured you can. Up to 8 companies for free. 

So with all that said and looking at the true cost of coverage I think it would not be the wisest thing to dismiss getting coverage in a business where one mistake(yours or employees) can literally put you out of business. I know I can't keep enough in my bank account to cover a flooded basement from a poor winterization....

James


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## Guest

Okay i also would then like to point out thet E&O and general liability for property preservation does not give you gl for private of public work. If you do general contracting outside of preservation you will need another insurance policy. This was explained to me by the insurance company. So look into it. If you think you can do work with your preservation gl you are wrong.


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## Guest

Hey all

XanadooLTD as far as I know is absolutely right. I only do property pres. If a property needs further work as in repairs this is not likely the right insurance for you. I suggested this here because this thread is titled "HUD and REO property preservation". If you do other work your likely not to be covered. I would hope if your doing other work you would already have a higher level of insurance that would likely encompass trash outs and winterizations anyway. 

As always talk with your agent. I know its tedious, but its business so do it right. And besides that 25% commission your agent is gonna earn off you means he or she can answer all your questions no matter how dumb you might think they are.

My solution to repairs that need to be done is to bid them and sub it out. I bid for them. Don't low ball cuz I don't really want them anyway. I just take them on as another service to brokers and reo agents. I then get a fully licensed and insured contractor to do the work. I only make 10%-25% off the job but is enough. This way I'm offering "Full Service" with minimum investment and skill level(trust me ) and I still remain "mostly" free to work on preservation and management.

I welcome all your thoughts and comments

James


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## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> Hey all
> 
> XanadooLTD as far as I know is absolutely right. I only do property pres. If a property needs further work as in repairs this is not likely the right insurance for you. I suggested this here because this thread is titled "HUD and REO property preservation". If you do other work your likely not to be covered. I would hope if your doing other work you would already have a higher level of insurance that would likely encompass trash outs and winterizations anyway.
> 
> As always talk with your agent. I know its tedious, but its business so do it right. And besides that 25% commission your agent is gonna earn off you means he or she can answer all your questions no matter how dumb you might think they are.
> 
> My solution to repairs that need to be done is to bid them and sub it out. I bid for them. Don't low ball cuz I don't really want them anyway. I just take them on as another service to brokers and reo agents. I then get a fully licensed and insured contractor to do the work. I only make 10%-25% off the job but is enough. This way I'm offering "Full Service" with minimum investment and skill level(trust me ) and I still remain "mostly" free to work on preservation and management.
> 
> I welcome all your thoughts and comments
> 
> James


James you need to call that agent of yours again :laughing: When you hire that sub you are the general contractor and thus you have the final liability on the project that is being done so you need to purchase the correct general liability. Also, in the P&P field you will be asked to do repairs on a property and you will need to purchase that seperate GL policy from your agent. That agent is going to make 10% off that policy if they are lucky so its not a "get rich" for the advise you will receive. Also, you should purchase work comp insurance since you ultimately will be responsible if anyone gets hurt on the job or require the sub to have work comp. Most States are getting to the point that if you can't complete IRS form SS-8 without a "yes" than you can be held liable for any work comp issues and we have found out that it is easier to purchase coverage and have no worries and no "extra bucks in the wallet" than to run the risk.
Also, we can't stress enough to have a good agent knowledgable in the P&P field for your E&O policy since the "big one" can hit ya anytime..
2 examples come to mind: 1)couch fell off a trailer and caused a fatality and no coverage since the GL didn't cover the insured once the "debris" left the property....E&O didn't pay since it was only for at the property protection..2) contractor was using a blow torch to thaw a property and burned down 5 townhouses and no insurance since they were not licensed to complete this type of work. 
I know lots more claims on this business but not enough time 
good luck


----------



## BPWY

XanadooLTD said:


> Okay i also would then like to point out thet E&O and general liability for property preservation does not give you gl for private of public work. If you do general contracting outside of preservation you will need another insurance policy. This was explained to me by the insurance company. So look into it. If you think you can do work with your preservation gl you are wrong.





Shop around, you can find ins for both. And it didn't cost me $1600. Took over a month of shopping and looking and talking to different folks and agents.


----------



## Guest

yeah it normally runs minimum premium for a very good policy $2400-$2600 with surplus lines fees and taxes for up to 40,000 of gross receipts than UP from there in price so yes shop around but look for the companies that have the policies that are "trully familiar" with the specialty market. Normally you can find them on National Association of Mortgage Field Services. They have several insurance providers to choose from but still get seperate policies for your repair and private work.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> yeah it normally runs minimum premium for a very good policy $2400-$2600 with surplus lines fees and taxes for up to 40,000 of gross receipts than UP from there in price so yes shop around but look for the companies that have the policies that are "trully familiar" with the specialty market. Normally you can find them on National Association of Mortgage Field Services. They have several insurance providers to choose from but still get seperate policies for your repair and private work.






> yeah it normally runs minimum premium for a very good policy $2400-$2600 with surplus lines fees and taxes




Dang man. I aint paying a third of that. And have the INS that satisfies LPS and Five Brothers, among others. Mines just under $800 a year. And when I say satisfies LPS take a look at their website and see what their minimums are.


----------



## Guest

Got an Email from Asset Management Specialists and I am wondering if they are a good company to work with.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Dang man. I aint paying a third of that. And have the INS that satisfies LPS and Five Brothers, among others. Mines just under $800 a year. And when I say satisfies LPS take a look at their website and see what their minimums are.


ya those 2 companies offer their own little policy that only applies to their work only...at least that is what they used to do. I wouldn't take that either and yes I work with both those companies. Know what you buy? LOL $800 a year won't even hardly pay the minimum surplus lines fee and the taxes. 
Got to admit I don't like it 1 bit but if you are in business and want to keep what ya own you better have the cadillac that protects you for everything you do.


----------



## Guest

leadarrows said:


> Got an Email from Asset Management Specialists and I am wondering if they are a good company to work with.


So far so good. Kinda different on how they want pics in .pdf files instead of .jpg and the pay isn't the best but otherwise they seem ok.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:
 

> ya those 2 companies offer their own little policy that only applies to their work only...at least that is what they used to do. I wouldn't take that either and yes I work with both those companies. Know what you buy? LOL $800 a year won't even hardly pay the minimum surplus lines fee and the taxes.
> Got to admit I don't like it 1 bit but if you are in business and want to keep what ya own you better have the cadillac that protects you for everything you do.






I'm not insured thru them, and recheck their ins requirements. I am not running around with a $500,000 policy. Thanks for the concern.
I'm insured thru a 3rd party 100% unrelated to LPS or any body else in the MFS business.


----------



## Guest

New to this forum, this is my first post. Have been in the property preservation field for 6 years. Does anybody know who has the new Fannie Mae contract in Indiana? Safeguard has lost the contract on REO properties from what I have heard.


----------



## BPWY

justan said:


> New to this forum, this is my first post. Have been in the property preservation field for 6 years. Does anybody know who has the new Fannie Mae contract in Indiana? Safeguard has lost the contract on REO properties from what I have heard.





*I heard that Field Assets lost a lot of territory to **Asset Management Specialists, Inc.

Field assets needs to go out of business. My experience with them is they are all about trying to find folks to work for 1900 wages and then doing every thing in their power to screw you out of that pittance. Safeguard is another bottom feeding company. My experience with their grass cut routine this past summer (09) is they are a pretty poor company to work for.*


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> *I heard that Field Assets lost a lot of territory to **Asset Management Specialists, Inc.
> 
> Field assets needs to go out of business. My experience with them is they are all about trying to find folks to work for 1900 wages and then doing every thing in their power to screw you out of that pittance. Safeguard is another bottom feeding company. My experience with their grass cut routine this past summer (09) is they are a pretty poor company to work for.*


So I what I gather is Asset Management Specialists, Inc is taking over areas of Indiana recently and they are looking for new people here so it's not a scam that I got an email from them. That's what I needed to know. 
Thanks everyone I will send them the info they requested and see how it goes. :thumbsup:


----------



## BPWY

leadarrows said:


> So I what I gather is Asset Management Specialists, Inc is taking over areas of Indiana recently and they are looking for new people here so it's not a scam that I got an email from them. That's what I needed to know.
> Thanks everyone I will send them the info they requested and see how it goes. :thumbsup:





A good friend of mine is signed with them out of MT. The top training/recruiting guy Dan J. has met with him twice. 

They are also hiring subcontractors for their Quality Control. After a property is completed another guy comes in to critique the first guy's work.
I've also heard that the main office will check up on the quality of the maid service.............. with a white glove.



I knew your name sounded familiar....... from another site. Now I've got it. lol


----------



## brm1109

I almost laughed when I opened the pricing list for one of the nationals that I was looking into working for. $35.00 for initial cut up to 1/4 acre. $18.00 for snow removal and $60.00 for janitorial.
I can't believe that they would even have the nerve to offer these prices or that anyone would work for them. 
I e-mailed asking if the prices were negotiable and was told no.
I have no problem working hard but I at least need to make money while doing it.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I almost laughed when I opened the pricing list for one of the nationals that I was looking into working for. $35.00 for initial cut up to 1/4 acre. $18.00 for snow removal and $60.00 for janitorial.
> I can't believe that they would even have the nerve to offer these prices or that anyone would work for them.
> I e-mailed asking if the prices were negotiable and was told no.
> I have no problem working hard but I at least need to make money while doing it.






Let me guess. 

Field Assets or Safeguard????


----------



## Guest

*Chateau Properties, Inc. (“CPS”)*

Hello 

Can anyone please share some information on Chateau Properties, Inc. (“CPS”). I heard of them through a friend. I tried googling them for about an hour trying to find some info on them.

If anyone could get me some contact #'s or any info I would be grateful. Anyone had any experiences with them?

Thanks
James


----------



## BPWY

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source...q=Chateau+Properties+Inc.&fp=cbc2f75bf9d43a8f


----------



## BPWY

You are searching the wrong terms. I found them in about a minute.

Try Chateau Property Services.

The key to google is the proper search terms. Some folks are a lot better
at this than me.


----------



## Guest

Thanks BPWY

That is pretty much wat I came up with. Sometimes I just need a second opinion. Kinda thought there would be more to them.

Thanks again
James


----------



## brm1109

*Insurance*

Hello all and Happy Holidays. I have a question concerning insurance. 
A new company I am signing up with wants me to send them a certificate of my w/c insurance with them listed and my auto. I understand having them listed on my g/l but have not needed to add any company on my w/c or auto.
Has anyone else needed to do this?
Thanks.


----------



## Guest

sounds strange. i wouldn't do it. Hmm i dont even know if you can. Good question.


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## Guest

Brm1109

I have no heard of this. The addition to the auto I mean. What company are you negotiating with? Sounds like its gonna be an added cost.


James


----------



## BPWY

Some of these companies will make up their own little rules that have nothing to do with legal or common sense.


----------



## Guest

Here are some of the companies you should consider working with that we've heard some great things about.

NVMS
Trinity Field service
Sand Castle


[email protected]


Your partner in success,


----------



## Guest

............................


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> A good friend of mine is signed with them out of MT. The top training/recruiting guy Dan J. has met with him twice.
> 
> They are also hiring subcontractors for their Quality Control. After a property is completed another guy comes in to critique the first guy's work.
> I've also heard that the main office will check up on the quality of the maid service.............. with a white glove.
> 
> 
> 
> I knew your name sounded familiar....... from another site. Now I've got it. lol


Man the white glove comment is 100% right on! Netted $67.00 on last job and they wanted us to redo the maid service on a cabin that was empty for nearly 3 years that was terrible...well sorry you can't "polish a turd!" and not going in the "hole" for anyone. :whistling


----------



## BPWY

Any body here work for or currently working for AMS???
Asset Management Service.


There are some worrisome reports about them at ripoff report.


Fremont you have any of those kinds of problems with them?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Any body here work for or currently working for AMS???
> Asset Management Service.
> 
> 
> There are some worrisome reports about them at ripoff report.
> 
> 
> Fremont you have any of those kinds of problems with them?


You know I really haven't till lately! I just got today another ****** failure for landscaping. Yep landscaping with 12" of snow/ice on a cabin that has a goat path to the property for a driveway. I failed because I didn't complete a grass cut on the 48" tall horseweeds that are sticking up all over the yard. Now I won't be paid for the entire job that after expenses netted us $67.00 profit for 7 hours of work.


----------



## Guest

Thats so wrong. We take jobs to get our foot in the door and cuz were new they jerk us around. Again shows we should just work 1 on 1 with realators and brokers

James


----------



## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> Thats so wrong. We take jobs to get our foot in the door and cuz were new they jerk us around. Again shows we should just work 1 on 1 with realators and brokers
> 
> James


LOL you are right...I work for a ton of realtors and private party work. Thats the most profitable.


----------



## mtmtnman

Problem is the Realtor/Brokers are not getting Fannie Mae work anymore here. AMS has it all wrapped up. The brokers i have worked with in the past are happy about this but i am sure not!!!


----------



## mtmtnman

Fremont,

How picky are they on cleaning? I did a house today and it looks really good. The broker is happy with it and this was a 1 yr old house. The problem i see is i'll bet i'll fail as i don't have any photos of wiping down walls even though they are clean Ect. and there is weeds 12" tall sticking through 6" of snow. You ever try to start a mower at 6 degrees?????? I WILL not work for nothing and the first time they try that crap on me they did to you i will dump them and let all the other new contractors for them here know about it. I have already sent the contractors a link to this thread.


----------



## Guest

MtMntman where are you from? Do you or anyone else think that the brokers/agents will pick up work from the banks no that this moratorium stuff is done with?

James


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Problem is the Realtor/Brokers are not getting Fannie Mae work anymore here. AMS has it all wrapped up. The brokers i have worked with in the past are happy about this but i am sure not!!!


Yes and no. We do the rekeys for the realtors and then we get to bid all the damages since Fannie doesn't want AMS handling them due to the quality of work. I don't think Fannie work is going to be that big anylonger anyway after the Deed for Lease program is fully kicked in. Ask the realtors you work with who they are working the Tenant Access program for and they should be able to find out who is the authorized "repair contractor" for your State.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Fremont,
> 
> How picky are they on cleaning? I did a house today and it looks really good. The broker is happy with it and this was a 1 yr old house. The problem i see is i'll bet i'll fail as i don't have any photos of wiping down walls even though they are clean Ect. and there is weeds 12" tall sticking through 6" of snow. You ever try to start a mower at 6 degrees?????? I WILL not work for nothing and the first time they try that crap on me they did to you i will dump them and let all the other new contractors for them here know about it. I have already sent the contractors a link to this thread.


Exactly right. This place I got failed on was a cabin that was empty for 3 years with approx 2 BILLION dead lady bugs everywhere and we spent 3 hours cleaning 4 rooms with 3 guys and you just can't get it any cleaner. I told 'em "you can't polish a turd" and well they didn't see the humor in that :laughing: This house they wanted it to be cleaner but I said there is no way! Live with it. I spoke with the realtor and she about died laughing at my email from this company and couldn't believe that they wanted the landscaping redone? OR that is wasnt' cleaned good enough even though they passed the cleaning albeit barely.


----------



## mtmtnman

DaddyYankee said:


> MtMntman where are you from? Do you or anyone else think that the brokers/agents will pick up work from the banks no that this moratorium stuff is done with?
> 
> James




DaddyYankee, I am in Montana It's a good possibility they will get some work form the banks as a few of the brokers i work with get stuff from local banks and now that they aren't doing government work they may have time to persue some work. The brokers are just out of the Fannie Mae stuff as AMS has the ball now. I took a 25% paycut when this happened and have to do twice the work for AMS. Fremont, Are they requiring date & timestamps for you too?? Never in my life did i ever figure i would have to put a timestamp on a photo.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> DaddyYankee, I am in Montana It's a good possibility they will get some work form the banks as a few of the brokers i work with get stuff from local banks and now that they aren't doing government work they may have time to persue some work. The brokers are just out of the Fannie Mae stuff as AMS has the ball now. I took a 25% paycut when this happened and have to do twice the work for AMS. Fremont, Are they requiring date & timestamps for you too?? Never in my life did i ever figure i would have to put a timestamp on a photo.


yes timestamps so they can try to figure out how much time a crew spends on a jobsite is what I was told. I would have to say so they can come back at a later time and say that "this crew is only averaging 2 hours on a job and they need their contract reviewed for the amount of pay" even though the desk jockeys don't understand that you have $5,000 in tools, a $6000 dump trailer, a $30,000 truck, insurances and licenses and their desk cost $500 at most!
I'll give any company a "fair shake". At this moment I don't like what I'm seeing or my gut feeling.:whistling


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> yes timestamps so they can try to figure out how much time a crew spends on a jobsite is what I was told. I would have to say so they can come back at a later time and say that "this crew is only averaging 2 hours on a job and they need their contract reviewed for the amount of pay" even though the desk jockeys don't understand that you have $5,000 in tools, a $6000 dump trailer, a $30,000 truck, insurances and licenses and their desk cost $500 at most!
> I'll give any company a "fair shake". At this moment I don't like what I'm seeing or my gut feeling.:whistling




Good luck tracking my timestamps. I had my daughter taking photos while the wife and i did the work so she was bouncing from room to room taking photos. I couldn't find a decent pocket size camera that does a timestamp so i use my re-size program to pull data from the file and add a timestamp.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Good luck tracking my timestamps. I had my daughter taking photos while the wife and i did the work so she was bouncing from room to room taking photos. I couldn't find a decent pocket size camera that does a timestamp so i use my re-size program to pull data from the file and add a timestamp.


LOL I used to do that myself. I didn't realize that if you run your cursor over the photo then they can see the real time and date of the photo. I have a friend (actually he and I started together 13 years ago) who never ever dated his photos and he had a program that put batch dates on the picture and he got a ton of chargebacks since the service company found out that a lot of his pics were a different date than what was on the picture... Maybe you have a different program that hides the date or the camera hides the "tag" on the picture?


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> LOL I used to do that myself. I didn't realize that if you run your cursor over the photo then they can see the real time and date of the photo. I have a friend (actually he and I started together 13 years ago) who never ever dated his photos and he had a program that put batch dates on the picture and he got a ton of chargebacks since the service company found out that a lot of his pics were a different date than what was on the picture... Maybe you have a different program that hides the date or the camera hides the "tag" on the picture?




I am not cheating with time and date, just using a program to pull the info off of the file and stamp the photo accordingly.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I am not cheating with time and date, just using a program to pull the info off of the file and stamp the photo accordingly.


Didn't imply that 
Can I ask what photo dater you use? I use Batch Photo and like it but there are some quirks that you have to perform to make things appear right.


----------



## BPWY

I applied to AMS to be on their list for when they get to my area.

Now I hope that I have so much work that I don't have time to work for them. Or maybe I'll just tell them
that I don't have time. I won't be able to put up with their nonsense.

MountainMan *DO NOT* under any circumstances tell them you have a minor child on the job!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Didn't imply that
> Can I ask what photo dater you use? I use Batch Photo and like it but there are some quirks that you have to perform to make things appear right.





SnapTouch will do it, and I understand that Faststone will too.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Didn't imply that
> Can I ask what photo dater you use? I use Batch Photo and like it but there are some quirks that you have to perform to make things appear right.






Fastone is what i use......


----------



## Guest

Ok guys here is where I am coming from with this time stamp thing. First my brother who lives with me (so I have access to him 24/7) is a computer genius. He is so good he hasnt had a girlfriend in about 10 years lol. He can get my pics to do or say anything. I semi consider that dishonest. But it doesnt matter. And shouldnt matter. I live in an area with a high minority population. I can get labor for 8 to 10 dollars and hour. 

So if I pull up to a property with 10, say Hispanics, and do a job site in just under 2 hours that doesnt mean I should be paid less because my time stamps read 8am to 955am. So im there for only two hours. They see that as hardly anytime put in. But there is over 20 man hours done on that job site. Something that would take me TWO and a HALF DAYs on my own. And yes then expenses.

And I am happy to share that with them if they ever bring up time stamps. They Should just be glad we are efficent.


James


----------



## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> Ok guys here is where I am coming from with this time stamp thing. First my brother who lives with me (so I have access to him 24/7) is a computer genius. He is so good he hasnt had a girlfriend in about 10 years lol. He can get my pics to do or say anything. I semi consider that dishonest. But it doesnt matter. And shouldnt matter. I live in an area with a high minority population. I can get labor for 8 to 10 dollars and hour.
> 
> So if I pull up to a property with 10, say Hispanics, and do a job site in just under 2 hours that doesnt mean I should be paid less because my time stamps read 8am to 955am. So im there for only two hours. They see that as hardly anytime put in. But there is over 20 man hours done on that job site. Something that would take me TWO and a HALF DAYs on my own. And yes then expenses.
> 
> And I am happy to share that with them if they ever bring up time stamps. They Should just be glad we are efficent.
> 
> 
> James


OH OUCH.....just remember that the pay rate won't allow you to have that many men on a job site.


----------



## Guest

I would just really like it if they stopped looking so hard to work contractors out of there paychecks. Stuff like the weeds arent cut down in the winter.... Really, thats just dumb. And as far as getting the houses ready to go on the market, yes a huge part of that is are job. But is you tell a prospective buyer that the house was abandoned or foreclosed on they are not gonna expect a show house. If they are smart enough to look for a good deal in a foreclosure then they are smart enough to know the building might have weeds under that foot of snow....

Just a thought
James


----------



## mtmtnman

DaddyYankee said:


> I would just really like it if they stopped looking so hard to work contractors out of there paychecks. Stuff like the weeds arent cut down in the winter.... Really, thats just dumb. And as far as getting the houses ready to go on the market, yes a huge part of that is are job. But is you tell a prospective buyer that the house was abandoned or foreclosed on they are not gonna expect a show house. If they are smart enough to look for a good deal in a foreclosure then they are smart enough to know the building might have weeds under that foot of snow....
> 
> Just a thought
> James



I agree 100% What if don't get is how they could cut the cleaning workoder as the grass cut/yard maintenance order is a different number. Also how in the hell do you push a mower through 6" of snow?? I think i'll take the weed burner and the lp bottle over to my job and burn the tops off this morning. At least i'll stay warm LOL!!!!


----------



## BPWY

Fremont so you are saying that AMS $0 invoiced your entire job because you didn't do lawn maintenance in the snow????

If this is the case then I won't be working for them when they do decide to pickup this area.

I had my fill of such actions with just over 2 months of working for Field Assets. I am certain that while they are $0 invoicing your work they are still collecting full rate from Fannie or who ever their customer. I'm not working for an outfit like that.


----------



## Guest

I'm in the same boat. I am already struggling to make it. Last thing I need is to lay out some cash to do a job and get stiffed. I had my paper work ready to send in on Monday. Now I am not sure what to do.


----------



## BPWY

leadarrows said:


> I'm in the same boat. I am already struggling to make it. Last thing I need is to lay out some cash to do a job and get stiffed. I had my paper work ready to send in on Monday. Now I am not sure what to do.





I hear ya man.

I've already sent mine in, but they haven't picked up this area yet.


----------



## Guest

All I can say is here is what I was told: "the lawnmaintence/landscaping is a part of the initial services work order and all has to be completed to our specs for the initial services order to be payable". Now with the holiday there wasn't anyone to call and the last person I spoke with was upset about the cleaning not "being up to par" (pic attached) and nobody said anything about the yard since I figured "someone" could see the reasoning in the pics why this wasn't mowed or even weedwacked but apparently not. AMS is new to this area and new to us and I think that everyone may be a little "over gungho" over everything trying to impress their bosses and the inspector is new and never been in this business, which again is not a good position for the contractor to deal with, and they are all doing the normal CYA. 
the pic: those brown things all over? Billions of dead ladybugs and they were everywhere in this home. vacuumed home multiple times and they seemed to pop up from nowhere!


----------



## BPWY

Thanks for the reply. That is just asinine and foolish to not pay because of a grass cut in the snow. 

I'll be keeping an eye on how things go and depending on the outcome I just might decline them when they
come to this area. Thanks for the update.


----------



## BPWY

After looking at the requirements and dis-qualifiers for the deed for lease program on page two of this link... I'm of the opinion that in the big scheme of things this program won't help as many people as the gooberment thinks it will.

Kinda like obama's big program of this past April or when ever it was. You know, the one he went on a tax payer funded trip to promote in CO, AZ and other stops. The one that the media barely reported as hardly helping any body.


----------



## Guest

Hey all

So im still hung up on this cutting grass in winter thing. I belive the HUD guidelines, which I often default too, say you cut grass between April 1st and October 31st. I know its not a HUD house but you would think they would have similar guidelines with some dates. HUD also does not include lawnservice in "initial clean up"

James


----------



## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> Hey all
> 
> So im still hung up on this cutting grass in winter thing. I belive the HUD guidelines, which I often default too, say you cut grass between April 1st and October 31st. I know its not a HUD house but you would think they would have similar guidelines with some dates. HUD also does not include lawnservice in "initial clean up"
> 
> James


Agree! But they also include winterization in their initial services for no additional monies. When I called to ask about the pay (that they screwed up to begin with) I asked that the winterization and landscaping is a seperate pay isn't it? Nope that is included in the initial cleanout work order. Also, something that needs attn: they want you to put an amount on your contrract for snow removal on a monthly basis:: Lets say you put $100.00 for snow removal then: 1 snow removal this month is $100 but 10 snow removals in a month is still only $100.00 (or $10 per snow removal) so Hope for more of this Global Warming!:clap: I know that this isn't nothing new for the snow plowing guys to bid work like this but in this business you are driving a large radius of territory to cover in order to get the work.


----------



## Guest

Yeah that snow thing is messed up too. HUD just does it based on accumulation. When it hits 3 inches you shovel and get paid. Plain and simple. I really thing these guys sit around the table trying to find ways to burn us. Im sure they get paid every time snow accumulates. But only pays you once a month. They got a sweet deal going...

James


----------



## BPWY

DaddyYankee said:


> Yeah that snow thing is messed up too. HUD just does it based on accumulation. When it hits 3 inches you shovel and get paid. Plain and simple. I really thing these guys sit around the table trying to find ways to burn us. Im sure they get paid every time snow accumulates. But only pays you once a month. They got a sweet deal going...
> 
> James






The SHORT time that I worked for Field Assets (I called them another name, a not nice name that also started with the letter A and the two S-es) I got jacked out of a lot of money by their QC department.

I am convinced that they and the rest still invoiced Fannie for 100% even tho they didn't pay us much of any thing or nothing at all.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> The SHORT time that I worked for Field Assets (I called them another name, a not nice name that also started with the letter A and the two S-es) I got jacked out of a lot of money by their QC department.
> 
> I am convinced that they and the rest still invoiced Fannie for 100% even tho they didn't pay us much of any thing or nothing at all.


Did they not pay you because they could still see snow on the driveways? They tried that crud on me once (different company) and I sent them the specs on a snow plow and how they don't plow right down to the concrete thus ruining a blade. SO they said that we needed to spread salt and wait for it to burn through the reshovel...I said I'll bid!
Did I say I never got another snow removal work order?:whistling


----------



## mtmtnman

This shows AMS is getting rich and we are getting banged. You know damn well they are billing full allowable rates!!! Fannie Mae allowables per my broker:


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Did they not pay you because they could still see snow on the driveways? They tried that crud on me once (different company) and I sent them the specs on a snow plow and how they don't plow right down to the concrete thus ruining a blade. SO they said that we needed to spread salt and wait for it to burn through the reshovel...I said I'll bid!
> Did I say I never got another snow removal work order?:whistling




I worked for Field Assets in the summer. They would use every imaginable excuse in the book to cut or down right deny a full invoice.


"not enough" pics, pics from the wrong angle, pics not showing enough action shots (I didn't know we were making pornos), etc etc etc etc etc

Your snow removal comments does sound par for the course.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> This shows AMS is getting rich and we are getting banged. You know damn well they are billing full allowable rates!!! Fannie Mae allowables per my broker:






I talked to a Cyprexx contractor that was getting some thing like $1100 for the same thing that AMS has folks as low as $500 and then taking 20% of that.


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## Guest

I heard Cyprexx was good. But this came from the same person saying Safegaurd was ok and FAS. So yeah.....


James


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## BPWY

Some one told me that way back in the day FAS wasn't too bad to work for.


DaddyYankee your sig line is pretty much in line with what I told FAS on my resignation letter.


"your CENTS don't make business Sense"


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## Guest

I deleted


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## BPWY

FREMONT YOU ARE MY HERO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I'VE BEEN LOOKING FOR THESE!

I don't know of any others that I have you didn't already post.


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## mtmtnman

Got more in the truck but it's in the garage and it's 10* out. I'll get em tomorrow.....


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## BPWY

Well that was frustrating. 

I went and got all my unknown code lock boxes and I couldn't open any of them.


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## BPWY

deleted


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## Guest

Good point Linda. Cannot believe I didnt realize that! My post is erased, not a good idea at all.


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## APlusPPGroup

Just a quick note to let you guys know that posting lockbox codes in a public forum is not a very good idea.

You could end up being sued because someone copied down all those codes started ransacking and strippng the homes. They don't have to be your homes either. You could be liable for any and all of them.

What you guys might want to do is go through and delete your posts with the codes in them right away. I think you only have a certain amount of time you can edit them. If your time's up, talk to a moderator and have them edit or remove the posts.

Be careful sharing them in messages as well. It's not easy to verify that people posting here are actually legitimate PP vendors and you could end up in a lawsuit quicker than you might think possible.

Be careful what you write here anytime you post. The nationals also read the forum posts.

Linda


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## Guest

Hey everyone! 

I'm new to contractor talk, but not the business. I just wanted to say that I appreciate all of the posts. I currently work for a national company and have been very busy.... Everything was going very smoothly until a couple of months ago. I was glad to know that we aren't the only company having these 'battles' over payment and approval....

Anyway, glad to hear what you had to say in recent posts. Excited to be part of future converstations!

CCC


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## Guest

Clayton who is your current Goliath you are doing battle with?

James


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## Guest

Fas


----------



## BPWY

ClaytonConst said:


> Fas





Theres a shock. 


They got another victim. They should go out of business.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Just a quick note to let you guys know that posting lockbox codes in a public forum is not a very good idea.
> 
> You could end up being sued because someone copied down all those codes started ransacking and strippng the homes. They don't have to be your homes either. You could be liable for any and all of them.
> 
> What you guys might want to do is go through and delete your posts with the codes in them right away. I think you only have a certain amount of time you can edit them. If your time's up, talk to a moderator and have them edit or remove the posts.
> 
> Be careful sharing them in messages as well. It's not easy to verify that people posting here are actually legitimate PP vendors and you could end up in a lawsuit quicker than you might think possible.
> 
> Be careful what you write here anytime you post. The nationals also read the forum posts.
> 
> Linda



Linda I'm just stating personal opinion here .... OK?


I understand what you said, and why you said it. Thank you.

On the other hand my OPINION is that a lawyer will be able to get a guy off of the lawsuit. Simply because the nationals won't be able to PROVE that it was YOU and YOU alone that posted the code and that the bad guys got the code off of the internet.
The codes could have been posted on a forum the national didn't see, and the place where the bad guys got the code in the first place.

Second most vandalism is likely to be caused by a pissed off and disgruntled FORMER contractor. Or simple vandals, I feel that the odds of some one using info here to commit crimes is pretty low.

Like I said. Its my opinion. Doesn't make mine any more valid than yours.


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## APlusPPGroup

Not a problem at all, BPWY. I understand where you're coming from.

In your scenario, however, you would need to hire a lawyer and they cost money.

My whole point, of course, is to warn members not to put themselves in a position to need one in the first place. This is an extremely volatile industry we work in and we live in a very litigious society.

I'm glad you see why I posted it, though, and you're welcome. Thank you for the feedback. 

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

ClaytonConst said:


> Fas



I'm sorry. FWIW keep VERY good track of what you do vs what you get paid for. FAS don't tell you when the cut a work order. You find out 2 months later when you get paid for the work...........


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I'm sorry. FWIW keep VERY good track of what you do vs what you get paid for. FAS don't tell you when the cut a work order. You find out 2 months later when you get paid for the work...........


 
Thanks! My spreadsheet and I are VERY close!!! I am still waiting on payment on a job from the end of SEPTEMBER!!!! From the majority of my experience, I haven't had a significant problem with lack of payment or $ witheld, but we cover a large portion of our state and what gets us is when they request "additional photos within 24 hrs" or they decline it! What are the chances.....

I just caught up on the AMS posts today.... I had my stuff ready to send off ... now, not so sure.... I sent info to spectrum today, but i don't think they really need additional contractors at this time in my area....  Still looking for some GREAT companies to supply and appreciate the work we do!


----------



## BPWY

Clayton when you say Spectrum do you mean Spectrum Field Services, or Spectrum Home Services????


If you are working for a Spectrum Home franchise you might be OK depending on the owners.

If you are applying to be a sub for the home office in UT exercise caution.


----------



## mtmtnman

ClaytonConst said:


> Thanks! My spreadsheet and I are VERY close!!! I am still waiting on payment on a job from the end of SEPTEMBER!!!! From the majority of my experience, I haven't had a significant problem with lack of payment or $ witheld, but we cover a large portion of our state and what gets us is when they request "additional photos within 24 hrs" or they decline it! What are the chances.....
> 
> I just caught up on the AMS posts today.... I had my stuff ready to send off ... now, not so sure.... I sent info to spectrum today, but i don't think they really need additional contractors at this time in my area.... Still looking for some GREAT companies to supply and appreciate the work we do!



I have FAS invoices from June & July that i know will never be paid........


----------



## Guest

*Spectrum field services*

I saw that someone had asked about Spectrum Field Services (not home services). I have been doing work for them about 7 months and all I can say is that they are the best out there. I only know that because of this forum and all the complaints that I have heard about the other companies. I guess I lucked out 'cause I applied to about ten of those companies, but only Spectrum responded. They pay right on time, every 30 days. If there is an issue, just go back out, rectify it, and you get paid. They do not take 20%, what you bid is what you get. They are friendly and very cooperative. They just started doing QA and that's a bit dicey, since I'm not sure that those guys have a clue. I was dinged because I they found garbage under a barn that had no access. Nevertheless I went back and got it out. That was a five apartment complex that netted me 3300 for cleanout and winterization. It took my crew and I all day, but a good day nontheless. It seems that they are taking over all of Safeguard's work as I find that latter companies stickers wherever I go. Good luck to all and happy holidays..mike:clap:


----------



## Guest

DRASYLUM~ what area are you in. Maybe you have a better contact to work with than others You mentioned "QA" is that Quality assurance or something like Quality control?

Thanks
James


----------



## Guest

I'm in NH and I service NH and VT. right now there is little or no work, did all the winterizations and cleanouts they required and with winter, I don't really expect anything more than spring. Oddly enough, there has been no requests for snowplowing. I'm pretty busy anyway as a general contractor. I deal with Spectrum over the phone and email in Utah. Have a great New Year...mike


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Just a quick note to let you guys know that posting lockbox codes in a public forum is not a very good idea.
> 
> You could end up being sued because someone copied down all those codes started ransacking and strippng the homes. They don't have to be your homes either. You could be liable for any and all of them.
> 
> What you guys might want to do is go through and delete your posts with the codes in them right away. I think you only have a certain amount of time you can edit them. If your time's up, talk to a moderator and have them edit or remove the posts.
> 
> Be careful sharing them in messages as well. It's not easy to verify that people posting here are actually legitimate PP vendors and you could end up in a lawsuit quicker than you might think possible.
> 
> Be careful what you write here anytime you post. The nationals also read the forum posts.
> 
> Linda


I think that this idea is crazy but not taking any chances since the homeless shelters are posting lockbox codes and even give out keys and the banks can't do a thing. Paranoia strikes again!!!!:no:


----------



## Guest

squatters rights!


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## Guest

around here we have a few no trespassing signs that read "Trespassers will be shot. Survivors will be shot again"


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> I think that this idea is crazy but not taking any chances since the homeless shelters are posting lockbox codes and even give out keys and the banks can't do a thing. Paranoia strikes again!!!!:no:


Fremont ~

What shelters are posting codes? Can you post the article for us or can you let us know how you found that out?

The banks own the properties and they should be able to press trespassing charges against anyone who enters the homes. If the shelters are giving away keys and codes, they should be shot. Can you imagine how much more chaos that's going to create? 

Incredible, just incredible. It's tough to imagine but, unfortunately, not hard to believe. I'd definitely be interested in finding out what you know.

Thanks for posting the info. I appreciate it.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I had heard that Acorn was cutting padlocks etc of some houses. 

I can't imagine a shelter being that stupid. Many shelters are run by local governments. 
That wouldn't work to well for them to be giving out codes etc.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Fremont ~
> 
> What shelters are posting codes? Can you post the article for us or can you let us know how you found that out?
> 
> The banks own the properties and they should be able to press trespassing charges against anyone who enters the homes. If the shelters are giving away keys and codes, they should be shot. Can you imagine how much more chaos that's going to create?
> 
> Incredible, just incredible. It's tough to imagine but, unfortunately, not hard to believe. I'd definitely be interested in finding out what you know.
> 
> Thanks for posting the info. I appreciate it.
> 
> Linda


Yep it is happening all over. Our family volunteers at shelters throughout the year donating time and a few dollars and about fell over when I walked by a bulletin board and there was a list of foreclosed homes and how to get in. I took a pic of the list (public record you know) and gave it to some of the service companies. The keys are considered "public domain" since anyone can purchase a knobset from any of the lock providers so there was nothing that could be done to stop this. NOW if there was a squatter in a home then that is considered trespassing and is against the law but when the weather is -11 like last tonight (before windchill) you won't catch a police officer kicking them out and personally I can't blame them. IMO. When the shelters fill up then they gotta go somewhere. What I think is absolutely terrible is the realtors that "rent" out a house on a nightly basis for cash...:whistling


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## Guest

I had considered renting a house out nightly but I think there would be a lot of liability and oversight on my part. I thought it might actually provide a needed service in winter months. I know many decent homeless people from my last job as a EMT and I often wonder how they are managing. Many times they will call an ambulance complaining of chest pain to be taking to the ER for 8 hours of warm.

James


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## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> I had considered renting a house out nightly but I think there would be a lot of liability and oversight on my part. I thought it might actually provide a needed service in winter months. I know many decent homeless people from my last job as a EMT and I often wonder how they are managing. Many times they will call an ambulance complaining of chest pain to be taking to the ER for 8 hours of warm.
> 
> James


I have to agree with ya. When volunteering I met a lot of just "down and out" families that due to job loss or the primary breadwinner got hurt/sick they lost everything they had. Made me think that there is not anyone that is just a short step away from this same disaster.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Made me think that there is not anyone that is just a short step away from this same disaster.





You got that right. There are a lot of good folks that have bad stuff happen to them.


My work has been so slow since the end of OCT 09 that if things don't pickup soon I'll be doing a borrow interview for cause of delinquency on my own house.
Not a fun place to be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My business name is in the hands of A LOT of companies right now. They all say that after the first of the year things will get very busy. I hope so. 
As many that have my info if they all gave me even 1 yob a week I'd have a fair amount to do.


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Yep it is happening all over. Our family volunteers at shelters throughout the year donating time and a few dollars and about fell over when I walked by a bulletin board and there was a list of foreclosed homes and how to get in. I took a pic of the list (public record you know) and gave it to some of the service companies. The keys are considered "public domain" since anyone can purchase a knobset from any of the lock providers so there was nothing that could be done to stop this. NOW if there was a squatter in a home then that is considered trespassing and is against the law but when the weather is -11 like last tonight (before windchill) you won't catch a police officer kicking them out and personally I can't blame them. IMO. When the shelters fill up then they gotta go somewhere. What I think is absolutely terrible is the realtors that "rent" out a house on a nightly basis for cash...:whistling




I cannot believe that a realtor would stoop that low. Don't they realize that when they get caught they will be in serious trouble and that will in all likelihood lead the ruination of their career?


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## APlusPPGroup

I sympathize with the truly down and out, too. I agree something should be done for them. There are many that lost their homes through no fault of their own.

But it's not the down and outs that vandalize the homes. It's typically the ones with a grudge or transients that roam from town to town and stay in shelters because they don't want to pay for a roof over their head and will rip the places apart and steal everything they can get their hands on to either sell or recycle. 

I've already had an experience with a professional squatter, too. In fact, he joined CT just to bad mouth me and, as far as I know, hasn't been back since. Hopefully it's my last experience with one. They're the worst and most devious of the squatters.

This industry has changed a lot in the last 3 years and the lawyers are making lots of money defending everyone in the real estate industry [including all of us] because of the few self-righteous who have found the loopholes and all the ones that are now taking their cue from them and following suit.

Almost nothing surprises me anymore. I've known about the Acorn thing for awhile now........... but shelters? They're putting themselves in a position to be shut down. Then what? More homeless people with nowhere to go. If they really want to help people, they should focus on limiting their liabilities so they can stay open.

Just my .02. It probably won't be the most popular. But I never was known for being quiet when I feel strongly about something.:no:

Linda


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Made me think that there is not anyone that is just a short step away from this same disaster.



I googled how to live out of your car last night so whats that tell you. Actually some good advice out there. Glad ive gone from a geo prizm to a GMC Suburban.:jester:


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I sympathize with the truly down and out, too. I agree something should be done for them. There are many that lost their homes through no fault of their own.
> 
> But it's not the down and outs that vandalize the homes. It's typically the ones with a grudge or transients that roam from town to town and stay in shelters because they don't want to pay for a roof over their head and will rip the places apart and steal everything they can get their hands on to either sell or recycle.
> 
> I've already had an experience with a professional squatter, too. In fact, he joined CT just to bad mouth me and, as far as I know, hasn't been back since. Hopefully it's my last experience with one. They're the worst and most devious of the squatters.
> 
> This industry has changed a lot in the last 3 years and the lawyers are making lots of money defending everyone in the real estate industry [including all of us] because of the few self-righteous who have found the loopholes and all the ones that are now taking their cue from them and following suit.
> 
> Almost nothing surprises me anymore. I've known about the Acorn thing for awhile now........... but shelters? They're putting themselves in a position to be shut down. Then what? More homeless people with nowhere to go. If they really want to help people, they should focus on limiting their liabilities so they can stay open.
> 
> Just my .02. It probably won't be the most popular. But I never was known for being quiet when I feel strongly about something.:no:
> 
> Linda


This business has drastically changed in the last few years. Some good and some bad. I remember when you could offer $500-$1000 for a CFK and the folks were trully grateful for the help and I actually felt good helping them to be able to move NOW you hear radio ads advertising "we can get you up to $10,000 for a CFK" and they get it for the folks. I suppose good for the ex-homeowner but then the contractor has to beg and borrow to get what they deserve for a trashout. I think that most of this business will go "down the tubes" shortly since the discounts are so high from these service companies that the banks understand they are severely overpaying for services provided.


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## APlusPPGroup

DaddyYankee said:


> I googled how to live out of your car last night so whats that tell you. Actually some good advice out there. Glad ive gone from a geo prizm to a GMC Suburban.:jester:


If there's anyone here who has not spent at least one night sleeping in their car, please raise your hand.:laughing:

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> This business has drastically changed in the last few years. Some good and some bad. I remember when you could offer $500-$1000 for a CFK and the folks were trully grateful for the help and I actually felt good helping them to be able to move NOW you hear radio ads advertising "we can get you up to $10,000 for a CFK" and they get it for the folks. I suppose good for the ex-homeowner but then the contractor has to beg and borrow to get what they deserve for a trashout. I think that most of this business will go "down the tubes" shortly since the discounts are so high from these service companies that the banks understand they are severely overpaying for services provided.


I agree and it gets tougher every year. 

The ones who are truly dedicated to getting back on their feet have gone [or will go] to live with their families to save money but there are many others who learn to work the system and milk it for all it's worth. They know that, if the bank has to evict, it could cost considerably more than the CFK.

Almost everyone now knows someone, who knows someone, who knows someone, and the grapevine moves quickly. 

It's unfortunate that there are those who had to keep up with the Joneses and lived way beyond their means. They figured out a way to "have it all" and now they're dumping their debts back on the banks. 

The banks are finding more and more ways to cut their losses because of all the unresolved debt and, unfortunately, the preservation industry has too many people willing to work cheap. The bank's biggest expense is getting the people out and that won't change. Then, once it's empty, they pit the PP vendors against each other for the cleanup. How much do you want to bet that doesn't change either? I have a feeling it's only going to get worse.

A lot of people who jumped on what they thought was a gravy train are now up a creek because they took every job that came their way, regardless of the fact that they might have paid out more than they made. Many thought that, once they got their foot in the door, they'd get the experience they needed to make better money. Unfortunately, they set precedents for accepting low pay. 

And, yes, it's only going to get worse. We can slam FAS, Safeguard, and all the low-paying nationals out there all we want. But we need to keep in mind who caused it to happen.

Sorry. Went off in another direction, didn't I? Talking about why PP vendors don't get paid what the jobs are worth kinda got me on a roll.

Have a great night, everyone, and enjoy what's left of your holiday weekend.

Linda


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## ARPPP

a1propertyclean said:


> If there's anyone here who has not spent at least one night sleeping in their car, please raise your hand.:laughing:
> 
> Linda


 
I wish I could raise my hand. Didn't know I had so much company!


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## BPWY

I slept in the truck one night not that long ago. 

Out of town P&P job. A little short to buy a room. No I didn't sleep very good.


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## Guest

I went to a property for a initial Rekey and winterization, as I walked around the property I noticed a back window broken, after I gained entry there was a squatter in the house. I asked him to leave and told him if the law caught him he would go to jail. 
The following Monday went back and I noticed somebody was there, I backed out and called the cops. After cops cuffed and stuffed him in their car the squatter said at least he would be getting something to eat.
I feel bad for him but what do you do?


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## BPWY

Not much you can do.


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## Guest

Just had a company offer me $9-$12 dollars a cubic yard. All I can say is WOW! I hope people are not working for this.


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## BPWY

I've had similar. I told them sorry no can do. Some of the dumps around here charge $11 or $12 a yard to dispose. I dont work for free.


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## Guest

BPWY my work has been verly slow since end of October also, was very busy up to that point. Really need work also, im not sure what happened.


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## BPWY

What part of the country are you in?


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## Guest

Indiana, most my work was coming from Safeguard Properties.


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## BPWY

Safeguard and Field Assets lost a lot, maybe all of their Fannie REO work. 
Or thats what I've heard from this site and talking to others. 
There are some states that they lost all of their work.


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## BPWY

FAS was spamming the WY craigslist in a serious way looking for contractors up until the end of the year. Now there is NOTHING, nada, zip, zilch.


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## Guest

Yes I was aware Safeguard lost Fannie Mae work in Indiana. Have not been able to figure out who obtained all the work. Have had some offers from companies, Asset Management Services being one but they want me to work for free basically. Safeguard was actually decent paying.


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## BPWY

I assumed AMS would become the next FAS. I think AMS got the Fannie work.

You know that AMS, FAS etc are making plenty of money while wanting you and I to work for free.

I'm not doing this work for my health.


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## Guest

AMS wanted me to perform trashouts, maid services, winterization and yard work for a flat rate of $500 up to 40 cubic yards of debris. Minus their 20% discount of course, its $400. Could maybe make money on a few properties at that rate but not many.


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## BPWY

justan said:


> AMS wanted me to perform trashouts, maid services, winterization and yard work for a flat rate of $500 up to 40 cubic yards of debris. Minus their 20% discount of course, its $400. Could maybe make money on a few properties at that rate but not many.






And they charge Fannie multiple times that price.


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## brm1109

I hate to do it but I actually had to refuse to do work for some companies. They want to pay the 12-18 per yard. We pay on average $95.00 per ton to dispose of it. With disposal, insurance and taxes that leaves no money.
I don't understand how some people work for so little if they need to pay expenses. I think I just lost a national because I wouldn't drive 35 min. each way plus 1/2 hour there for a $20.00 inspection. Oh well, hope it picks up soon.


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## BPWY

You cannot work for free no matter what they tell you.


Late July 09 I had FAS ask me to drive 3 hrs one way, mow an acre "lawn", and drive 3 hrs home. Ya'll know that I was looking at a minimum of 12 hrs to do all of this. In late July the grass/weeds will be 3 to 5 feet high.

The most I was able to get out of them was.................................. don't hold your breath............. $75.

I explained to the person that I am working ALL day for $75. It aint going to happen. It was as if I said I was going to go do it. His next question was......... so when can we schedule you to go do this.

I told him I would call him back, hung up and never bothered with it again. Couple weeks later some one called, "I thought you said you were going to go do that". I told them, "NO!!!! I didn't say that, and NO!!! I am not going to go do it for that price."


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## Guest

I really dont understand all the complaints about Safeguard. They pay much better than the other nationals I have been contacted by so far.


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## BPWY

justan said:


> I really dont understand all the complaints about Safeguard. They pay much better than the other nationals I have been contacted by so far.





$30/$35 grass cuts no matter the size.


I've heard that Safeguard isn't as bad on their P&P as they are their grass cuts. 
They have two divisions and from what I've been told they will not allow a contractor to do both.


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## Guest

The grass cuts are a bit of a rip off but $32.50 per cubic yard, $150 for maid services and $100 a winterization. And no they have not allowed me to do property preservation work for them also, have tried repeatedly. I do work for another contractor for Safeguard on the P&P side and the pay is pretty good on that side too.


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## BPWY

Those prices aren't too bad paid to you. After another contractor takes 25% its not so good.


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## Guest

Well I only do work through another contractor on the P&P side not the REO side. Surprised you are not busy with FAS, their website says they are seeking additional vendors in WY.


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## BPWY

I worked for FAS during the summer thru another company.

I don't work for free.

I don't work for liars.

Did I mention I don't work for free?

My distaste for them is very intense.


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## brm1109

I wish there was an easier way to work directly for the banks themselves. I have contacted 6 banks and they all have contracts with the nationals.
The funny thing is that if they went with local companies, they would probably be able to get the work done for less and us contractors would be able to make a better living even if we did it for a little less than the nationals since we wouldn't have to lose that extra percentage.


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## BPWY

> I wish there was an easier way to work directly for the banks themselves


ABSOLUTELY, me too.


The gooberment is allowing folks to stay in their houses under the new lease instead of foreclosure program. The gooberment will be doing all the service and maintenance, tax payer funded of course.

One of the nationals is taking 28% off of the top before they send it down the line to the next company in the line.

So out of a $2000 invoice to HUD (tax payers) only $850 gets to the guy that actually does the work.

It only takes a second to imagine the major screwing the taxpayers are getting. First we pay to buy the house from the home owner that couldn't make the payments. Then we pay for premium upkeep. Better than what will done at our own homes. Only licensed contractors can do the specific work in each area. Say a water line busts under the sink.... no reason under the sun that the P&P contractor cant go to Lowes and get the short piece of hose and install it. A licensed plumber must be called. Resulting in what could be a relatively small bill will become hundreds of taxpayer funded dollars.

Its insane.


This is how I understand its going to work. Its possible that I was given wrong info.


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## Guest

justan said:


> The grass cuts are a bit of a rip off but $32.50 per cubic yard, $150 for maid services and $100 a winterization. And no they have not allowed me to do property preservation work for them also, have tried repeatedly. I do work for another contractor for Safeguard on the P&P side and the pay is pretty good on that side too.


I am going to apply to safe guard this week sometime. How do I Just do there P&P work? I am not mowing any yard for less than $50. 

Thanks for the advise in advance
James


----------



## Guest

i think the numbers are wrong. If you take the 28 percent which is high you would still be getting 1440. Not the 850. But if you take into consideration all of the compliance issues i think it is a fair rate to pay. Its like the union. It saves you all of the advertisement etc. Its not a bad deal IMHO.


----------



## Guest

DaddyYankee said:


> I am going to apply to safe guard this week sometime. How do I Just do there P&P work? I am not mowing any yard for less than $50.
> 
> Thanks for the advise in advance
> James


 
HAHAHA you won't last long there then. In fact don't even apply. Not many pay over 50 anyhow. unless your doing hud yards or large lots.


----------



## Guest

I believe you will have to do the yard work on both the REO or the property preservation side with Safeguard. In my opinion it is worth the give and take. Most yard cuts will pay that for the property preservation side with the FHA properties that pay $105.00 for a 15,000 sq ft yard. FHA properties also pay $60 per cyd removed on the property preservation side, CV properties will only pay $30 a cyd.


----------



## BPWY

XanadooLTD said:


> i think the numbers are wrong. If you take the 28 percent which is high you would still be getting 1440. Not the 850. But if you take into consideration all of the compliance issues i think it is a fair rate to pay. Its like the union. It saves you all of the advertisement etc. Its not a bad deal IMHO.






There are multiple layers of discounts in the scenario I gave. 

My math was correct, I missed some details. sorry

For reasons I cannot get into here I am not able to give out names.


----------



## Guest

Anyone here from TN? Actually I'm in GA. I am trying to find out what work is like in North Eastern corner of TN.


----------



## Guest

I have a question that really burns my ass!! We all are businesses just as the nationals. They give us work orders (bids) due in 24 hours that we already submitted over 2 months ago and now they say it has expired. This is bull crap, not our fault they can't keep up. And now they want to send a work order for us to redo the bid. Do they take in consideration that it's a 2 hour drive round trip then time to come up with prices?? I am so frustrated right now due to the fact that we alllll are legal businesses, carry the insurane and employees. When do we get our say as a business just as they ae? Let's face it we are all loaning money to the banks. It takes weeks for us to get paid. Most contractors require payment due when the job is complete. We are doing well here in GA but it's time for us vendors to make some rules just as the nationals!! If they ask for a itemized bid we should say NO!! We should tell them this is our bid $xxxxxx. Upon aproving it by letterhead, then we will itemize it!! This is why they ask for itemized bids so that they can call the next vendor and ask if they will do it cheaper. Now you lost your time driving to & from the house to take photos and call your subs for prices. A total waste of time for $22.50. Point of the story, why can't we/ vendors come together and have our specifics met? If we get a work order due ( bid) due in 24 hrs, and it can set in there que for over 2 months?? Then where is the problem? Why can't the major banks hire us directly to cover areas and save them $$??The nationals are ripping the tax payers which is us the small businesses/vendors!!!!


----------



## Guest

*Prices*



justan said:


> The grass cuts are a bit of a rip off but $32.50 per cubic yard, $150 for maid services and $100 a winterization. And no they have not allowed me to do property preservation work for them also, have tried repeatedly. I do work for another contractor for Safeguard on the P&P side and the pay is pretty good on that side too.


Hello Justan,

We started working for a friend that subs us the work from Safeguard. Are the prices above what the contractor pays you or what Safegaurd pays him? 

Thanks for the advise!


----------



## BPWY

SphinxVA said:


> Hello Justan,
> 
> We started working for a friend that subs us the work from Safeguard. Are the prices above what the contractor pays you or what Safegaurd pays him?
> 
> Thanks for the advise!






Why did I just get a sudden flash of friends no longer being friends????
Matter of fact they won't even be dong business together. 

Maybe your case will be the 1 in a thousand that works out OK. The interwebz forums are full of stories that start pretty much exactly like yours.


----------



## Guest

APFS You also dont have to work for the nationals. I don't. I may just to bring on some extra employees. But if it turns out bad ill drop them. 

Part of the problem is new P&P biz turn over. They are just burning through new companies and replacing new biz after new biz. The internet ads, even on this site, promise thousands in starting one of these businesses. New people are gonna keep coming in to the work and the nationals will continue to burn through their capital until they go under. I don't see it ending. Even if we organize the continued influx of new companies will still meet the nationals needs.

If we all just work for brokers and agents the nationals will loose business, money, and control. I really don't se this happening but its what I do. Its more work but its more money. I employ a virtual assistant to help with things. Its the best $200 a week on my payroll.

Feel free to email me if you have any questions on my tactics

James


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## APlusPPGroup

Definitely don't believe everything you read. Many of the ads are scams and are trying to sell you a "how-to" book. They are part of the problem.

I blame the media, too, for all the new companies starting up, then going under. People don't realize how much time, effort, and money goes into operating a property preservation business with any kind of success.

The media and "how-to" book pushers make it sound as if anyone with a vacuum and lawn mower can just jump right in there and start making money hand-over-fist. It simply doesn't work that way.

Sure, anyone can clean a house or mow a lawn. Anyone can bag trash and haul it to the dump. But you'll have labor, equipment costs, dump fees, fuel, and [eventually] lots of maintenance from all the driving. 

You'll also have payroll taxes, business taxes, liability insurance, workmens comp insurance, vehicle insurance, contractors will have bonds, and those who don't have the time or the ability to do the paperwork will have to outsource it. Then there's the tax preparer at the end of the year and/or someone to handle the 1099s and the W-2s.

On the income side, many companies can't afford to wait up to 90 days for payment. And those who work for nationals are at risk for chargebacks even when they did a perfect job.

It's hard for me to read mail from people who want to start a PP business right away because they think this so-called "gravy train" will help them save their own house from foreclosure. I have to tell them about all the things I mentioned above and advise them to think long and hard about how they're going to survive on nothing when they're already behind in house payments.

The nationals are experienced business people and it's hard to compete against them. They don't worry about losing or terminating vendors because there are 100's more ready to take their place. And most of them are as inexperienced as you were when you became a vendor for them. 

When a national gets behind in their payments to you, EXPECT chargebacks and EXPECT to have to negotiate for what you CAN get. How many can afford to take a loss on a job where they've already paid out the expenses and payroll? Not very many. 

I hate the sound of a slamming door but it's happening everywhere and many new businesses fail faster than than the time it took thinking about operating and researching this industry before jumping into it. Those just starting out, who think they know it all, haven't seen anything yet.

It's a good business for anyone who doesn't mind hard work, long hours, know when to cut their losses after being dinged a couple of times by the nationals, figures out how to survive on peanut butter and jelly sandwiches, and learns ways to do the jobs at minimal expense without damaging the integrity of the job.

Doing a good job is important but documenting the job you did is of the *UTMOST* importance. How many vendors get rejection slips from their clients repeatedly for photos? Quite a few and nearly every one results in a chargeback or a service that won't be paid until the proper photos are taken.

We operate in 41 states right now and I can tell you that, with over 350 vendors in our network, we have our share of problems with photos. After a few e-mails to a vendor going over photo guidelines without good results, we stop asking. We stop giving them jobs and will pay another vendor to go get the photos instead. 

If you want to save yourself time down the road, take VERY comprehensive inspection photos the VERY FIRST time you visit a property. You will win the clients over in a big way and save yourself a lot of headaches in the long run. Good photos will not guarantee you won't get charged back but they will give you the ammo you need to fight them.

Well, I didn't mean to write a book so I'll stop here. I just want to say, though, that I'm impressed with the members at CT who are willing to take the time to post as much information as they have. It helps everyone and brings up some really good points and topics to discuss.:thumbup:

Linda


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## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> We operate in 41 states right now
> 
> Linda





Do you have any openings in WY? 

thank you


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Do you have any openings in WY?
> 
> thank you


Yes, we do, as a matter of fact. But work has been slow there so it may be awhile before you see anything. 

Send me an e-mail with your state & contact information, along with 2 full sets of before, during, and after photos of trashouts you've completed for me to review and I'll see if we can get you into our network and ready for work as soon as it's available.

The correct e-mail address for sending files to is [email protected]. If files are sent to our general mailbox, I may not see them right away. [BPWY - I just received yours and that's what made me realize I hadn't posted the correct mailbox with my instructions.]

We are looking for a few additional vendors in South Carolina, North Carolina, and Washington right now, too. BUT. We are only hiring people with experience. Just follow the same instructions as I've posted for BPWY.

Linda


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## Guest

Bpwy

I'm actually looking for a contractor in WY, for Property Preservation. Which area are you servicing. Email me your informaiton and contact number and email to [email protected].


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## BPWY

CVMS said:


> Bpwy
> 
> I'm actually looking for a contractor in WY, for Property Preservation. Which area are you servicing. Email me your informaiton and contact number and email to [email protected].




Email sent, I look forward to hearing from you.


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## Guest

Linda

You mentioned great pictures or you will get burned. Can you elaborate on that a bit more for everyone. 

Thanks
James


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Why did I just get a sudden flash of friends no longer being friends????
> Matter of fact they won't even be dong business together.
> 
> Maybe your case will be the 1 in a thousand that works out OK. The interwebz forums are full of stories that start pretty much exactly like yours.


 
I know right! Well, if prices are fair then I can't see why it wouldn't be a good working relationship. Just want to know what prices to expect. Thanks, I'll check it out...


----------



## APlusPPGroup

DaddyYankee said:


> Linda
> 
> You mentioned great pictures or you will get burned. Can you elaborate on that a bit more for everyone.
> 
> Thanks
> James


Actually, I said comprehensive, which is a little different from great. But great would be nice, too.

I was going to post an album showing an interior/exterior inspection to show everyone what photos are needed to satisfy the client's requirements but the application here at CT will only let me upload 60 photos. A comprehensive inspection can be upward of 100 photos.

What I've done instead is opened my albums to the public temporarily at http://myspace.com/allreopreservation so you can get an idea of what I mean by comprehensive. Just click on the link and click on "Photos" to get to the albums. 

The albums will go back to being private before the end of the day because I'm reorganizing the profile. I'm developing an online training program and it will become one of the training modules. But, for now, I've opened it for the members who want to take a look.

Hope this helps.

Linda


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## Guest

Sphinx, these are the prices Safeguard pays. Believe it is different from state to state, not sure on that though.


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## oteroproperties

*Nationals*

I have read this forum since it was started and i almost always like what i read. The one thing i can never get past though is why people, more accurately contractors, want to see the nationals go away. You have to remember that these companies are the ones that orginized the preservation trade. I dont know much about FAS and some of the other compaines that have been mentioned on this board, but I have worked for Cyprexx and i am currently working for Safeguard (i should mention before i go on that i have been with Safeguard 2 years myself but was an employee of another contractor for some time. That contractor was with Safeguard 18 years, i took over his business.) I have never in the time i've been with Safeguard been backcharged, shorted pay, or denied invoices. I am aware that the work done for brokers pays better as i do have 1 broker that i work for, but the real work comes from Safeguard. being in florida most of our money comes from grass cuts as we cut year round. I just wanted to get this out of the way before i continue with my point started above. 

If you know anything about this business and i dont mean how to change a knob and cut some grass, i mean the history and trends, you know that Safeguard is the boss when it comes to the preservation business and its policies (not saying that there are not companies currently giving them a run for their money). Safeguard brought in $500,000,000 in 08 and probably wont be much less in 09 and beyond. That being said there is no national bank in the United States that would be interested getting rid of them for anything short of another national no matter how much money they might potnetially save by doing so. Among a host of other reasons that would take me too long to explain i will give you a short example. 

I worked for a National home builder during the construction boom here in Florida. During that time (14 months) i was responsible for the construction of more then 100 homes. After every county slab, block, and frame inspection the company would call in a private engineering firm. these inspections were very expensive to say the least and completely un-needed. I got a chance to eat lunch with the director of construction for our division and asked him why we had to get these inspections. His answer was very simple. *Liability*. If something happens to the structure of that house for any reason the builder becomes liable, but if the engineering firm signs off on it it becomes there responsibility or at least partly. A national bank doesn't hire a National preservation company to save money directly on a house by house basis. They hire them to offset liablity in the event of a law suit. This saves money that no contractor on this board could dream of saving them. Here's another point, it would cost all of the money potentially saved plus some for the banks to gain the needed staff and technology to run a preservation division. Through a meeting setup by Safeguard i met some bank executives at a property for some type of training they were doing and there was 5 people in there whole preservation team that covers the entire state of Florida. They would need much more then that if they were going to handle preservation in house. Remember, preservation is only a very small part of what these companies do for banks through out the default process. Title work, broker assignment, hazard claims etc..... this post could go on forever................

all you can do is the best work you can for the lowest money possible and hope that the fly by nights fall quick and don't do too much damage in the process. If you got into this business less then 2 or 3 years ago you have a long road ahead of you. If you have been in it longer you beat the rush and had a chance at establishment. did you do what you could to prove your worth while you were one of the few? or did you screw them for every penny? either way it will come around. it always does.


----------



## BPWY

On this forum and others, from word of mouth, and personal experience I would have to say you are one of the lucky few.


> I have never in the time i've been with Safeguard been backcharged, shorted pay, or denied invoices.


My experience with their grass cut department is that they are run by a bunch of morons. A requirement for getting a job there is that one must be a complete idiot.
Example..... summer of 09 we get two grass cut work orders. The address, I kid you not says "TBD" To Be Determined. Not once......... twice.
They came uncorked and verbally abused our company on more than one occasion over their failure to get a proper address from their client. 
Their attitude was that once the w/o gets into our que that its 100% our job to find the property with no further help from them.
Their inspectors must really be of low quality too. I probably ran about 25% occupied and/or vacant lot on grass cut W/Os. They won't approve bids. The yard can be 4 to 6 feet tall grass and weeds, not mowed at all in the last two seasons and they won't approve a bid for more money to initial mow it. In fact their bid rejection time is so quick that I'll about bet they don't even submit the bid to their clients. Just reject it, some times in as little as 2 hrs. Other nationals I work for it usually takes a lot longer.

Life is too short to have to deal with insane employees from a national.

But hey if they work for you, thats good. 

As for the rest of the post. I know why there are nationals etc. What happens is that there are often too many layers of discounts taken and by the time the money gets to the guy that does the work there isn't enough to make ends meet. Then they take up to 60 days plus to pay. Mean while all of my suppliers want paid due on receipt. Kinda makes it hard to juggle every thing.


----------



## oteroproperties

*National*

I understand your issues with their grass department. I too have problems with them, but they have about 40,000 cuts during the peak seasons and its hard to please everybody. (though i will agree that they could try harder) the fact of the matter is that the companies rely on the fact that you know your area and have resources to find these properties (i agree it sucks but its our job). I have plenty of times been given things from them and not had the info needed to proceed. As far as their inspectors, as in any business, people that are not qualified to do the job end up there, either in the field or in the office and they sometimes make our job difficult. 

BPWY, i thought for a bit about me being "one of the few lucky few" and judging by my experience and from what i read, i have no choice but to agree. im of the opinion that if one persons view is different then its possible they are just different, but if 10 people agree then i must be different. that being the case i am greatful that i am still successful.


----------



## BPWY

Any of the P&P contractors here use http://www.altisource.com/Home/tabid/38/Default.aspx ???

They want $50 for a yrs registration but claim that its waived. When I got to the registration part where they wanted my banking info for " payment direct deposit" I got cold feet and clicked out of the registration process.


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## BPWY

Here is why I won't work for Safeguard. They make a habit out of this kind of behavior.

http://www.ripoffreport.com/inspectors/safeguard-properties/safeguard-properties-lies-to-i-74fp9.htm

http://www.ripoffreport.com/Search/safeguard-properties.aspx


----------



## Guest

Hey linda how about one more days on the photos. I wasn't here yesterday :thumbsup:

thanks 
James


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Here is why I won't work for Safeguard. They make a habit out of this kind of behavior.
> 
> http://www.ripoffreport.com/inspectors/safeguard-properties/safeguard-properties-lies-to-i-74fp9.htm
> 
> http://www.ripoffreport.com/Search/safeguard-properties.aspx


 

It's interesting to read the safeguard shill always blaming the contractor, NEVER safeguard........:laughing:


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Any of the P&P contractors here use http://www.altisource.com/Home/tabid/38/Default.aspx ???
> 
> They want $50 for a yrs registration but claim that its waived. When I got to the registration part where they wanted my banking info for " payment direct deposit" I got cold feet and clicked out of the registration process.


Hi I just recently signed up with them. Your rep should give you a one day code to use so that you do not have to pay the $50. I did a job for them last month. I have not been paid yet, so I cannot speak to how fast or efficiently they pay. I do know that the pay is done via direct deposit.

Hope this helps.

Annette Rogers
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC
www.arppp.net


----------



## BPWY

Brickie said:


> It's interesting to read the safeguard shill always blaming the contractor, NEVER safeguard........:laughing:



What do you wanna bet that the guy that is all sunshine and roses is actually a safeguard employee that is doing the rebuttal?
Wouldn't be the first time its happened on an internet site where folks were bad mouthing a company.
I'm a moderator on a trucking forum from my trucking days. It happens every once in a while there.





ARPPP said:


> Hi I just recently signed up with them. Your rep should give you a one day code to use so that you do not have to pay the $50. I did a job for them last month. I have not been paid yet, so I cannot speak to how fast or efficiently they pay. I do know that the pay is done via direct deposit.
> 
> Hope this helps.
> 
> Annette Rogers
> AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC
> www.arppp.net



Thanks, 
they are claiming the $50 fee is waived, but they still want your credit card info. It'll be interesting to see how long it takes for you to get paid.
Did they tell you a fee schedule and/or how much their discount rate was off of HUD?


----------



## oteroproperties

*sunshine and roses*

BPWY - I'm assuming I am "sunshine and roses". If not then take this rebuttal in his/her stead.

I am not a Safeguard employee. I am the owner of Otero Properties Inc. this is a registered corporation in Florida, look it up sunbiz dot org - search by name - otero properties inc

my website is oteroproperties dot net

apparently I haven't made enough posts to post urls. can't imagine why I would spend my time posting on this amazingly balanced site? 

If you still think I'm a Safeguard employee then the rest of this post will be like beating a dead horse but here goes. 

There are some people that would say they can deal with Safeguard, but they don't because it’s not worth their time, I can respect that. But there's also the people that don't deal with it because they just aren't good enough, BPWY, I tend to think you are the latter. 

Something you need to realize is that all men are not created equal. There are some people out there that just have more abilities, better resources, and just an all out better position in life then other people. I am that person and I am great full but it didn't come without GREAT sacrifice. The kind of sacrifice a person like you clearly couldn't comprehend and while I know nothing about you, I can draw this conclusion because judging by the post above you are a person talks first and thinks after. I'm quite sure your mouth has bought you things your ass couldn't afford more then a few times. The bottom line is this, I just have the ability to make things work with much less effort and much higher success then other people. That's my niche. Maybe this is why my relationship with Safeguard is all sunshine and roses

For your consideration, (I had some urls here but..........) why dont you search ripoff report for MCS, or Cyprexx, or First American Field Services. it doesnt take long to see that you can find these on any company if you do some research, but you don't do that do you?


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> BPWY - I'm assuming I am "sunshine and roses". If not then take this rebuttal in his/her stead.
> 
> I am not a Safeguard employee. I am the owner of Otero Properties Inc. this is a registered corporation in Florida, look it up sunbiz dot org - search by name - otero properties inc




Actually I was referring to the ripoffreport glowing report from the one poster.

If you are happy with safeguard I'm glad for you. Keep working for them.

There are too many negative reports about them that match my personal experience with their poor actions for me to believe that they are that good of an outfit to work for.
My personal experience with them shows they are a despicable half axx run company.


----------



## ARPPP

Thanks, 
they are claiming the $50 fee is waived, but they still want your credit card info. It'll be interesting to see how long it takes for you to get paid.
Did they tell you a fee schedule and/or how much their discount rate was off of HUD?
[/quote]


I just got a new fee schedule emailed to me yesterday. Send me an email and I will share with you.

Annette Rogers
[email protected]


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> BPWY - I'm assuming I am "sunshine and roses". If not then take this rebuttal in his/her stead.
> 
> I am not a Safeguard employee. I am the owner of Otero Properties Inc. this is a registered corporation in Florida, look it up sunbiz dot org - search by name - otero properties inc
> 
> my website is oteroproperties dot net
> 
> apparently I haven't made enough posts to post urls. can't imagine why I would spend my time posting on this amazingly balanced site?
> 
> If you still think I'm a Safeguard employee then the rest of this post will be like beating a dead horse but here goes.
> 
> There are some people that would say they can deal with Safeguard, but they don't because it’s not worth their time, I can respect that. But there's also the people that don't deal with it because they just aren't good enough, BPWY, I tend to think you are the latter.
> 
> Something you need to realize is that all men are not created equal. There are some people out there that just have more abilities, better resources, and just an all out better position in life then other people. I am that person and I am great full but it didn't come without GREAT sacrifice. The kind of sacrifice a person like you clearly couldn't comprehend and while I know nothing about you, I can draw this conclusion because judging by the post above you are a person talks first and thinks after. I'm quite sure your mouth has bought you things your ass couldn't afford more then a few times. The bottom line is this, I just have the ability to make things work with much less effort and much higher success then other people. That's my niche. Maybe this is why my relationship with Safeguard is all sunshine and roses
> 
> For your consideration, (I had some urls here but..........) why dont you search ripoff report for MCS, or Cyprexx, or First American Field Services. it doesnt take long to see that you can find these on any company if you do some research, but you don't do that do you?






As for the rest of your post. 
I didn't insult you, your mother, your business ability or non ability, your alligator mouth and your work ethic.
Apparently my comment that wasn't directed at you hit a little closer to home than what you claim?????
Ever hear of the term, "he protests too much"??????????


You are correct about one thing and one thing only. You know nothing about me.


You are also 100% wrong about this statement.


> but you don't do that do you?


How the hell do you think I ran across the bad news about Safeguard???????????????????????????????????????????

I was searching multiple companies that I've either signed with or considering signing with.



I am not going to get into a pissing match with you. I don't have the time.
Consider this my last posting to you on this matter.


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## oteroproperties

I appreciate your lack of time and share that problem which is reflected in my number of overall posts here. I am a diplomatic person, probably more then I should be which is why I tend to put the other side on the table even if it has nothing to do with me. I'm sorry if my words gave you the impression that I had some underlying aggression to get out. The only compaint I have right now is that I dont have enough work. However it seems to be par for the course for the entire industry at this point. 

Either way there are 2 sides to every coin. On this forum there just seem to be more people on the tails side. This is what has kept me from posting for so long. Conformity is not my strong suit. Guess ill go back to being a quite observer and leave you to it...........

night all


----------



## Guest

OK guys and girls I feel there needs to be a referee here....:clap:
"whistle blowing" for a timeout:whistling

Safeguard is a selfish company but they all can be. I have friends who absolutely love them and depend on them for the lions share of their business and on the other side of the coin we could not get along with them so had to drop providing services for them. In todays business world I may have tried to hang on with them a little longer? My final straw was an approval to mow a 4 acre lot that was covered with 20foot tall ironweeds (if you don't know what an ironweed is-they are up to 2" thick and hard...kinda like a softer bamboo for the southern crowd) and after climbing on top of the roof of a house to get the entire field pictured and the bid was approved we mowed with a JD tractor with belly mower and the weeds were twice the height of a full sized tractor and after 160+ pictures they denied payment since they "couldn't tell it was mowed". 
That was the final straw (no pun intended) but still things worked out since the house and the field was seperated by an abandoned alley and the mayor lived next door so he told us for $36.00 we could buy that abandoned alley so we went to the next council meeting and purchased that little abandoned alley and fenced it off so the only access to the field from the house was 1 mile away to a gate that stopped abt 50' at a ravine.....The bank was forced to give us an offer to purchase the old abandoned alley and the price went to $10,000 and 2 years later Safeguard had to purchase that little abandoned alley or build a bridge over the ravine... my price was cheaper!:laughing: The happiest day I could remember was telling the Safeguards atty that I just got paid for the chargeback and a lot more.....:notworthy


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I appreciate your lack of time and share that problem which is reflected in my number of overall posts here. I am a diplomatic person, probably more then I should be which is why I tend to put the other side on the table even if it has nothing to do with me. I'm sorry if my words gave you the impression that I had some underlying aggression to get out. The only compaint I have right now is that I dont have enough work. However it seems to be par for the course for the entire industry at this point.
> 
> Either way there are 2 sides to every coin. On this forum there just seem to be more people on the tails side. This is what has kept me from posting for so long. Conformity is not my strong suit. Guess ill go back to being a quite observer and leave you to it...........
> 
> night all



It's nice your willing to add to Safeguards bottow line but us contractors in remote areas out west cannot put up with their CHEAP CHEAP rates and constant BS. We literally DO NOT HAVE TIME. I cover over 1600 miles a week in the summer to mow between 25 & 30 lawns with the occasional secure thrown into the mix. First American pay HUD allowables minus 20% so i make between $1800 & 2200 a week. I cover this route in 4 days. 
If i was doing the same thing for Safeguard i would make between $750 & $900 a week. You see where the numbers do not add up? We do not have access to cheap labor as you do in Florida either. The workforce you can get down there for $7-8 an hour cost's me double here thus the reason i am a one man band. You know DAMN well Safeguard is billing full HUD allowables to the bank (up to 10,000 $80 & 10-15,000 $100) and giving the contractors 30 bucks! You also do not have the lawn size we have here. About 40% 0f the lawns i cut are between 10 & 15,000 sq ft where HUD allowable is $100 so i get $80 and with Safeguard up to 1/4 acre still pays $30!!!! So you go on being happy a you seem to like being screwed for 50% ow what most every other national pays...........................


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> OK guys and girls I feel there needs to be a referee here....:clap:
> "whistle blowing" for a timeout:whistling
> 
> Safeguard is a selfish company but they all can be. I have friends who absolutely love them and depend on them for the lions share of their business and on the other side of the coin we could not get along with them so had to drop providing services for them. In todays business world I may have tried to hang on with them a little longer? My final straw was an approval to mow a 4 acre lot that was covered with 20foot tall ironweeds (if you don't know what an ironweed is-they are up to 2" thick and hard...kinda like a softer bamboo for the southern crowd) and after climbing on top of the roof of a house to get the entire field pictured and the bid was approved we mowed with a JD tractor with belly mower and the weeds were twice the height of a full sized tractor and after 160+ pictures they denied payment since they "couldn't tell it was mowed".
> That was the final straw (no pun intended) but still things worked out since the house and the field was seperated by an abandoned alley and the mayor lived next door so he told us for $36.00 we could buy that abandoned alley so we went to the next council meeting and purchased that little abandoned alley and fenced it off so the only access to the field from the house was 1 mile away to a gate that stopped abt 50' at a ravine.....The bank was forced to give us an offer to purchase the old abandoned alley and the price went to $10,000 and 2 years later Safeguard had to purchase that little abandoned alley or build a bridge over the ravine... my price was cheaper!:laughing: The happiest day I could remember was telling the Safeguards atty that I just got paid for the chargeback and a lot more.....:notworthy





Fremont you da man. 

I love that story. Once the deal was completed and the check cleared I'd probably have been tempted to called up the QC manager and told him that it really would have been cheaper to have just paid for the grass cut.


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## oteroproperties

no more battles, 

Cheap labor? We are 4 brothers and my wifes sister does the updates. I pay as much as I can and still keep the doors open. We all live very good lifes but we are not rich. we have 4 trucks that I bought and fixed, I built the dovetails on them my self, all my equipment came from craigslist broken but now fixed by me. I have a 2000 sf office warehouse that allows us to stock quite a bit of spare equipment and material. I have alot of spare equipment because my equipment is used and you never know. The other day I blew the engine in one of the trucks and didnt even skip a beat. I had another one waiting. The blown engine is half rebuilt as of this moment.

I think none of us are on the same page, I only do P&P. those numbers are a lot different then reo. you guys definitley get screwed. My area is much more densely populated then yours which allows me to put more money in my pocket then in my gas tanks. I really am sorry you all took a beating from these companies but I haven't thus far, whats wrong with the other side of the story?


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Fremont you da man.
> 
> I love that story. Once the deal was completed and the check cleared I'd probably have been tempted to called up the QC manager and told him that it really would have been cheaper to have just paid for the grass cut.


 
I have seen this before. Technically grass cuts with high grass like that needs to be raked and removed. I have seen other just roll over the grass and knock it down, so it kind of covers the guys who do it right. I think it is a good practice.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> no more battles,
> 
> Cheap labor? We are 4 brothers and my wifes sister does the updates. I pay as much as I can and still keep the doors open. We all live very good lifes but we are not rich. we have 4 trucks that I bought and fixed, I built the dovetails on them my self, all my equipment came from craigslist broken but now fixed by me. I have a 2000 sf office warehouse that allows us to stock quite a bit of spare equipment and material. I have alot of spare equipment because my equipment is used and you never know. The other day I blew the engine in one of the trucks and didnt even skip a beat. I had another one waiting. The blown engine is half rebuilt as of this moment.
> 
> I think none of us are on the same page, I only do P&P. those numbers are a lot different then reo. you guys definitley get screwed. My area is much more densely populated then yours which allows me to put more money in my pocket then in my gas tanks. I really am sorry you all took a beating from these companies but I haven't thus far, whats wrong with the other side of the story?



What i am trying to say is your getting the short end too. Run the numbers for your company if Safeguard was paying you full HUD allowables minus a fair discount instead of the pittance they pay you. You would be doing extremely well. If Safeguard was NOT charging the banks full HUD allowables every bank in the country would be flooding them with work and no other companies would have any work as Safeguard works for many of the same banks as the other nationals. My whole point is Safeguard is getting rich on your back breaking labor. They are collecting better than 50% of what they are charging the banks and giving you, the contractor the scraps. Me? I will stay with the companies paying HUD rates. I am running a business not a charity here. Good luck............


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## BPWY

XanadooLTD said:


> I have seen this before. Technically grass cuts with high grass like that needs to be raked and removed. I have seen other just roll over the grass and knock it down, so it kind of covers the guys who do it right. I think it is a good practice.





Speaking of grass cuts...... I cannot believe some of the things I see other "contractors" do and get away with on grass cuts.
Things like not trimming along the fences, trees and house, PILES of clippings all over the place. They don't mulch, bag, or rake them up.

I guess they are good at taking pics to hide what they are really doing.


Oh and what about the $30/35 fee for real honest to God edging the sidewalks and driveways? Not just cutting the grass back with the trimmer.
Around here we get enough wind that dirt blows in and builds up the lawn some times INCHES above the side walks. First of all the edger blade isn't long enough to get down to the concrete to edge. Second of all if it did there would be so much discarded dirt to remove it will take hours to properly do the job. 
I used to do all lawn care with a mix of P&P thrown in. Even then folks around here don't edge their sidewalks. Just trim the grass back with the trimmer. Its rare to see properly edged properties here. And certainly not on a foreclosure.

What do the rest of you guys do?


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## BPWY

Vacuum cleaner recommendations.

I, like most don't care for maid services in these dirty nasty houses. But thats part of the job.
My current standard house hold vac has lived a hard life and is nearing the end of its road. I need some recommendations on a new one. 
A friend of mine said that the orecks are the best. Thats cool, except they don't have an attachment option. We kinda need that for vacuuming out the corners. 
It'd be nice to find a rug vac with the power of a shop vac.


Equipment opinions??????????


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> What i am trying to say is your getting the short end too. Run the numbers for your company if Safeguard was paying you full HUD allowables minus a fair discount instead of the pittance they pay you. You would be doing extremely well. If Safeguard was NOT charging the banks full HUD allowables every bank in the country would be flooding them with work and no other companies would have any work as Safeguard works for many of the same banks as the other nationals. My whole point is Safeguard is getting rich on your back breaking labor. They are collecting better than 50% of what they are charging the banks and giving you, the contractor the scraps. Me? I will stay with the companies paying HUD rates. I am running a business not a charity here. Good luck............




All the nationals are banging the contractors on the REO services. Of this I'm confident. For example a national gives out an initial clean out on $650 allowable without bidding.
From different contractors I've talked to many of the banks are paying $900 for this. So the national takes off $250, gives it to us at $650 minus their standard discount rate, getting paid twice on the same job.

Now I can't prove it, but it sure seems suspicious. 

My goal is to get more and more local business thru agents and local banks. I feel that they'll appreciate the effort that goes into the jobs far more than a cubicle worker stuck in OH some where, or TX, or FL trying to QC our work thru pics.
Seems to be those states where most of the big nationals are located.


In a few years when the high numbers of foreclosures go away and the quick money to be made is dried up only the most dedicated of us will still be in business offering quality services.


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## mtmtnman

An all in one just is not convenient. Think about doing stairs. The all in ones do not have a hose long enough to reach. Better off with the Oreck and the Oreck portable with a shoulder strap. With the extensions you can reach 12' up so ceiling fans Ect are no problem. Try reaching a ceiling fan with an all in one. Also Oreck is the ONLY thing i have seen that will get the crap up off of rough cut hardwood floors.........


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## Guest

XanadooLTD said:


> I have seen this before. Technically grass cuts with high grass like that needs to be raked and removed. I have seen other just roll over the grass and knock it down, so it kind of covers the guys who do it right. I think it is a good practice.


Yeah I know your point--seen it quit a few times myself. This one was a tad different though when the weeds were as high as the edge of the roof of a 2 story barn (with a hay loft)..The pics were absolutely hilarious. (I'm looking for them now but they were a few years ago and filed on a external hd) Ya all will laugh your butts off! :laughing: What was sad was we ran through 3 sets of belly mower blades that got ruined hitting an old car, tons of old barb wire, paints, batteries and metal from whatnot in the field but you couldn't see it.. This was right in heart of a small town and the bank just ignored till the City Atty got to the right person.
BPWY::: My favorite vacuum is the one I get for free out of a trashout that works.. Cheap and don't care if I ruin the thing. Just bought a new Rug Doctor that lasted for 5-6 jobs and ruined the belt on some loose carpet fibers so that $59.00 "sucker" served its life span. I've bought expensive ones and cheap ones and at the end of the day they work about the same since the cheapies are throwaways. JMO:thumbsup:


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## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> no more battles,
> 
> 
> I think none of us are on the same page, I only do P&P. those numbers are a lot different then reo. you guys definitley get screwed. My area is much more densely populated then yours which allows me to put more money in my pocket then in my gas tanks. I really am sorry you all took a beating from these companies but I haven't thus far, whats wrong with the other side of the story?


 
There is nothing wrong in engaging in civil debate. 

It is nice to read once in a blue moon a post from someone that hasn't been screwed over by Safeguard. Yes, it's that rare even given the fact that I'm member of quite a few boards. 

Since we were on the topic of company that suck, here's just a few more: 

FAS

Philbricks

High Class Properties (CA)

MCS

5 Brothers


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## oteroproperties

MTMTNMAN,

Any company you work for is getting rich off your labor. Just because 1 company pays a little more then the other doesn't make them your friend. They are all in business to make money as are you. 

I can't say any better then you what a fair discount rate is for a national companies business model. I'm sure any company would pay different depending on the region. What I can tell you is I don't loose 50% to my national. This would be impossible in our case because when we bid jobs here we send them directly to the banks on our letterhead. We bid using HUD guidelines. Because of this it would be very hard for them to take money on top of the standard rate discount. As I said earlier I don't do REO. Your numbers and proceedures are WAY different from P&P. Our allowables depend on the client not HUD guidlines because our work is all pre-sale. There is only one client that I know of that pays less then HUD rates. I hate doing work for them but I take the good with the bad. 

As for my pittance, I would rather not say what I brought in last year but they got $80,000 of it and while I would have loved to take that bonus at the end of the year I would hardly call my bottom line pittance.

thanks for the post,


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## oteroproperties

Brikie,

welcome to the debate. When my updater went to the Safeguard convention she met with a bunch of people that said FAS was the greatest company to work for, but that was where the praising stopped because i've heard nothing but bad things ever since. That didn't stop me from applying to them though because i heard the same about Safeguard and they were fine with me. Nothing ever came of it but I did talk with them a few times. I also went to MCS corporate office as it's in the same building as my accountant. They said they were saturated with contractors in my region. Nothing ever came from them either. I worked for Cyprexx for a while. pay was great and within 2 weeks, but they didnt have enough work for me to assign a crew so I dropped them (I regret that decision) 

The problem I have with all this critisism is that I don't know how long any of these people have been doing this and what they are comparing to. To give you an example of my time in the industry, I remember when we got paid to take pictures. We would develop them and mail them to company with the keys. I was very young and was an employee, but i remember using the polaroids. Those days we covered the whole state 2 days south, 2 days central 2 days north, home 1 day (if we were lucky). The guy I replaced retired never having used a GPS or a small digital camera. He was using the old insurance adjuster cameras, the ones that use the 3.5 floppys, yeah i said it floppy's!! That thing was HUGE!! 

I have had some horror stories of my own with some other so called nationals, but I cut my losses before it got too bad and later found out they lost our regions m&m sub-contract for non performance. Had I known that they were not actually the client I would have never even signed up with them. The owner called me a couple months later trying to get me to go with the new m&m but their fee schedule just didn't work for us.


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## Guest

Boy I remember the polaroids! I hate to admit this but I remember when the service companies didn't even require photos They had inspectors that actually knew what they were doing and judged your work and if it passed than all was good and if it didn't the inspector would personally call ya and discuss what they needed different and it was fixed. Were those the good days? I don't know but it sure was a lot more effecient in my opinion. Computers, cell phones and the high speed internet has taken our freedom away since you can never "escape" to a job and just work without 20 calls interupting the day.
I think that everyone in the P&P or REO has to remember 1 thing: 1) use this business as a marketing tool. As a contractor the preservation field has opened more doors than I would have ever imagined. Meeting condo association presidents and acquiring their lawnservices or their emergency water extractions/rebuilds or working with different property managers and doing the simple things like carpet cleaning 500 units/homes a year. The possibilities are endless. 
We evolved in the trades from doing nearly 90% of our business 10 years ago in the P&P field to now,10 years later, we are doing 48% of our gross revenues in the preservation field. Our take home is greater and our work force has grown 10 fold.
Don't depend on only preservation work. Use it as a tool. I'm glad to give suggestions and also always taking suggestions. As a contractor we really are a "band of brothers/sisters".


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## BPWY

The first time I did P&P work email was not required only a fax #.

We also overnight mailed in our 35 mm film along with completion paper work.


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## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> I only do P&P. those numbers are a lot different then reo.



What do you consider the difference between PP and REO?


Thanks
James


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## oteroproperties

I don't have alot of time this morning, but for one, here in florida the REO guys get $35 on average to cut the grass and ours is $65. We do not trim shrubs unless we bid them and its gets approved, we only do exterior debris and interior heath hazards and infestation risk. And even though it appears Safeguard has lost the fannie mae contract p&p will still do fnm loans because we work pre-sale and the bank doesnt actually have title yet. the list goes on and on, but i have to get to the office, hope this helps,


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I don't have alot of time this morning, but for one, here in florida the REO guys get $35 on average to cut the grass and ours is $65. We do not trim shrubs unless we bid them and its gets approved, we only do exterior debris and interior heath hazards and infestation risk. And even though it appears Safeguard has lost the fannie mae contract p&p will still do fnm loans because we work pre-sale and the bank doesnt actually have title yet. the list goes on and on, but i have to get to the office, hope this helps,



P&P Pays $30 bucks out here for up to 1/4 acre.................


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## oteroproperties

no wonder everybody is mad. I didnt know that


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> no wonder everybody is mad. I didnt know that


I still say Safeguard is banging the bank full fare because if they were offering a deal every bank in the country would use them and other nationals would be cutting the rates.


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## oteroproperties

what are other nationals paying on jobs in comparison to Safeguard in your experience?


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> what are other nationals paying on jobs in comparison to Safeguard in your experience?



Firstam is $85 initial cut, $80 re-cut minus 20% discount up to 10,000 sq ft. $105 initial cut and $100 re-cut up to 15,000 sq ft. MCS is the same but minus 25% Five Brothers minus 20%

All are $45 a cubic yard for debris.


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## oteroproperties

for us it depends on the client and the loan type. but that 20% is better then the 25 i pay currently. it doesn't seem like they are that far off to me. We get $85 per initial on average and on FNM, and FHA we get $105 up to 10k sf. the recut amounts depend on the client and the loan type. we get 30 per cyd on most conventinal and FNM loans, we only get $45 on FHA loans but we don't get many debris removals. the other nationals do seem to pay a little better though if those numbers apply here in FL. do you work for first american currently? i'd be interested in trying to get signed with them.


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## APlusPPGroup

Otero ~

First Am is cutting their vendor base way back and keeping only a couple of regional vendors in each state. If you want First Am work, you'll have to find out who their work is outsourced to and apply with them.

First Am still owes me several thousand going back 2 years next month. Don't take my word alone, though. Definitely investigate them before you accept any work.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> Firstam is $85 initial cut, $80 re-cut minus 20% discount up to 10,000 sq ft. $105 initial cut and $100 re-cut up to 15,000 sq ft. MCS is the same but minus 25% Five Brothers minus 20%
> 
> All are $45 a cubic yard for debris.


Keep in mind that the $45 per CY is for your state, not all states. HUD rates are different in every state. Check your HUD cost allowances for the initial and recut rates, too. Those and winterization rates will vary also.

Linda


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## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> Otero ~
> 
> First Am is cutting their vendor base way back and keeping only a couple of regional vendors in each state. If you want First Am work, you'll have to find out who their work is outsourced to and apply with them.
> 
> First Am still owes me several thousand going back 2 years next month. Don't take my word alone, though. Definitely investigate them before you accept any work.
> 
> Linda


Linda, 

We were SUPPOSED to be preferred vendor here but come to find out they have 3 others as well. Being i will not drive 200 miles round trip for 2 $10 inspections they have cut my preservation work to near nothing and given it all to others. If you want the P&P you have to take the inspections and with a state that is almost 800 miles across and towns 100 miles apart inspections are a loss every time. Can't get anyone in these little towns to do 1 or 2 inspections either. They also owe me around $2000 some going back 9 months. They were great to work for until the last 2-3 months but i am ready to bail on them as of right now. My brokers have been keeping me plenty busy anyways.........


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## Guest

*SO Confused about rates.*

Is there anywhere on this thread that can explain rates how much we can charge are we only allowed to charge a certain state allowable amount, what types of rates are ok to start at when applying to these companies? Someone help


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## mtmtnman

lawns4kids said:


> Is there anywhere on this thread that can explain rates how much we can charge are we only allowed to charge a certain state allowable amount, what types of rates are ok to start at when applying to these companies? Someone help



cubicyard dot us


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## mtmtnman

*Workmans Comp?????*

I am applying to many companies to try and cut my coverage area down. What i am running in to is some of these companies requiring work comp. I have a work comp exemption from the state of Montana as i am a sole proprietor. These companies WILL NOT accept this exemption. My problem is the lowest amount of coverage in Montana i can get will run me $2412.00 a year through Montana State Fund!! This is for $10,800 of coverage! No cheaper anywhere else because all agents also go through the state fund. They told me they do not even like to write on sole proprietors. I know in Wyoming you absolutely CANNOT get coverage if your a sole proprietor. I'm wondering if it would be cost effective to hire a part timer to go with me on a 1 day job once a week? What are all of you 1 man bands doing???


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I am applying to many companies to try and cut my coverage area down. What i am running in to is some of these companies requiring work comp. I have a work comp exemption from the state of Montana as i am a sole proprietor. These companies WILL NOT accept this exemption. My problem is the lowest amount of coverage in Montana i can get will run me $2412.00 a year through Montana State Fund!! This is for $10,800 of coverage! No cheaper anywhere else because all agents also go through the state fund. They told me they do not even like to write on sole proprietors. I know in Wyoming you absolutely CANNOT get coverage if your a sole proprietor. I'm wondering if it would be cost effective to hire a part timer to go with me on a 1 day job once a week? What are all of you 1 man bands doing???


I think you might just find it a lot easier to pay the w.c. premium than to deal with FICA/W.C./ State/Fed taxes, unemployment taxes and all the other pleasantries you get with an employee? jmo


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> I think you might just find it a lot easier to pay the w.c. premium than to deal with FICA/W.C./ State/Fed taxes, unemployment taxes and all the other pleasantries you get with an employee? jmo



I agree. I may just pass on these particular companies. I already have health insurance and afflac...........


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I agree. I may just pass on these particular companies. I already have health insurance and afflac...........


Health insurance and a duck?
I don't know if this actually works since we carry work comp but I was told by 2 different crews that if you "sign on" with a temp service and ask that you get a copy of the temp w.c. that you can send that in and say you work through a temp service at times and they carry the w.c. for ya.:whistling
I know when we hire temps I get their copy of work comp for each job so we can claim on our work comp audits.


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## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Otero ~
> 
> First Am is cutting their vendor base way back and keeping only a couple of regional vendors in each state. If you want First Am work, you'll have to find out who their work is outsourced to and apply with them.
> 
> First Am still owes me several thousand going back 2 years next month. Don't take my word alone, though. Definitely investigate them before you accept any work.
> 
> Linda





I've heard that about them. They just loose your payment and paper work and then stall you until you give up on trying to collect. Hey its an extra $2000 for them. If they do that to one contractor in each state per yr it adds up to a nice amount of money.


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## Guest

Okay it is now my turn to vent quickly. We have been in business for 37 years. Our major focus is on public contracts. We picked up some reo work as we saw the real estate market crash coming. We got in at a great time. The problem is that i take my job seriously, my guys take their work seriously. We are an actual company. We were not some guys laid off and started this thing with high hopes. Which leads me to my problem. As this type of work gets out to the public i see people starting up shop and bidding against me on different jobs. Hey, not a problem there. I love it. The more the merrier. My problem is that people who have no idea what is involved jumping on board and trying to get involved. I am letting you here know, because i feel that most of you guys in this forum are true company owners. There is a major difference between a copmany owner, and someone looking to score some beer tonight. So a hack company comes in...bids work per hour at their last job...say 10 bucks an hour. Great if you can do it. But then the fun comes. They mangle stuff, they don't include profits, overhead, insur......you know the stuff. They get underwater and then drag us down with having to then complete their work at unreal prices, etc. Also when they are forced to bid properties and they don't know how or what to bid. There is a problem coming your way if you have not all ready seen it. These guys are going in and making up bids. square footage, taking photos of their buddies houses, etc. It wastes our time sending someone to bid as work does not exist at these properties. Then the photos of their buddies house shows we didn't report something and we are told to go and complete as it was not given previously. Look i am in the business to make money. Not to waste time.
So to all of you here. Watch out, because even this business has hacks coming. Be on the lookout!


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## oteroproperties

we have been running into the same problems, however the "other guys" are not really falsely reporting issues, more they are missing relevent issues all together. Nevertheless this causes the same type of problems for us. We just need to weather the storm.


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## BPWY

I'm sure we can all list horror stories we've witnessed or heard about.
Freeze damaged plumbing from improper winterization, bottom feeders bring their own junk, tires, or paint to a foreclosure property in order to 1. get more work, and 2 dispose of their own stuff.
etc etc

What I can't figure out is how these guys are getting into the industry without insurance. NOBODY has given me work before I showed them proof of my insurance.


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## BPWY

Excitement.....


any of you guys and gals have one like this??

I get an initial secure w/o. Says to call real estate agent prior to beginning work. I call the guy, hes nice enough but very adamant that I am not to enter the property because its for sale and the bank has not gone thru 100% of the foreclosure process to become the legal owner. If I enter the property hes going to have the cops come arrest me in an effort to teach the banks a lesson.

I call my MFS company, they say that when a w/o is issued that I am to proceed with the w/o unless the cops tell me not to. 
I call the agent back and he is very adamant that this is not going to happen and hes already called the cops and they are on the way. So I sit in the truck for about 15 mins. Cops no show.
So I call the PD on their non emergency number. VERY nice lady that answers the phone. Shes heard the agents side already, says the guy I need to talk to is on the phone and to please hold.

A moment later the Sarg comes on the line and tells me that as long as I have a w/o there is nothing he can do to me. The matter of who is 100% legal owner at what time is a civil matter and not some thing that he can do any thing about. He isn't sending an officer out and if the agent were to show up and harass me to call him back. Harassing me while performing a legit w/o is a criminal matter and that is something that the cops can do some thing about.

So any body else have an exciting day this week? lol


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## brm1109

*Competing against short cutting companies.*

I am really getting frustrated lately. I see more and more companies that are advertising for business and are not even properly licensed. I do trash removal and you need a special DEP permit that took 1 1/2 yrs. to get and I have all the insurances.
Then you look on places, especially Craigslist and everybody and their brother is advertising and most of them don't have a license number in the ad which you need to have.
Finally this week, I actually called the enforcement unit and complained about these companies. Was told that they are looking into them.
Permits, insurances:furious:, taxes, then you have people charging half because they have none of it to pay.


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## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> I am really getting frustrated lately. I see more and more companies that are advertising for business and are not even properly licensed. I do trash removal and you need a special DEP permit that took 1 1/2 yrs. to get and I have all the insurances.
> Then you look on places, especially Craigslist and everybody and their brother is advertising and most of them don't have a license number in the ad which you need to have.
> Finally this week, I actually called the enforcement unit and complained about these companies. Was told that they are looking into them.
> Permits, insurances:furious:, taxes, then you have people charging half because they have none of it to pay.




DEP permit??????? I woulda expected you to be in California if i didn"t see your profile. We still have green box locations here to get rid of our trash. Just a bunch of dumpsters on the side of the road. No business licenses or such required either. All those things are is a tax on small business IMHO! Liability ins, is all i need here. This is the reason i moved to a business friendly state!! I'll have to agree the cut throats elsewhere are hurting us here too though. They get the rates so low that the nationals think that all can work for the same rate. As many miles between jobs here if the rates are not toward the top of the scale i might as well stay home in the easy chair.


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## BPWY

Recently I was contacted by a company wanting to become a national. We only thought safeguard was screwing every body.


$25 grass recuts up to 5000
up to 10,000 $35
up to 15,000 $45
$55 winterizes

I declined to work for them on the basis of their very low level pricing. This pricing structure is below costs of material, equipment wear and tear and replacement, insurance costs, vehicle costs etc etc etc etc. Their response was that some very large companies are covering entire states for them at this price level. If I wish to reconsider working for them at this level they'd be happy to have my company work for them.
One thing that most folks do not realize is that in the west we have counties that are bigger than some states in the east. So yeah a contractor could cover all of Rhode Island and cover far less sq miles than say just one county in WY, NE, CO, MT, UT, NM, NV etc etc etc.

The county I live in isn't that large compared to some in surrounding areas, and its still more than twice the size of RI.


One is forced to wonder if their clients are really that cheap or if they are just taking that much off of the rate. When I declined to work for this company part of the reply was "this is all paid to you, no discounts". Well aint that nice. 
Their pricing is about 15 or 20 yrs ago. Not in the days of $3 gas and expected to climb.

I told them when they paid me HUD rate less 20% discount I'd be happy to consider working for them.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Recently I was contacted by a company wanting to become a national. We only thought safeguard was screwing every body.
> 
> 
> $25 grass recuts up to 5000
> up to 10,000 $35
> up to 15,000 $45
> $55 winterizes
> 
> I declined to work for them on the basis of their very low level pricing. This pricing structure is below costs of material, equipment wear and tear and replacement, insurance costs, vehicle costs etc etc etc etc. Their response was that some very large companies are covering entire states for them at this price level. If I wish to reconsider working for them at this level they'd be happy to have my company work for them.
> One thing that most folks do not realize is that in the west we have counties that are bigger than some states in the east. So yeah a contractor could cover all of Rhode Island and cover far less sq miles than say just one county in WY, NE, CO, MT, UT, NM, NV etc etc etc.
> 
> The county I live in isn't that large compared to some in surrounding areas, and its still more than twice the size of RI.
> 
> 
> One is forced to wonder if their clients are really that cheap or if they are just taking that much off of the rate. When I declined to work for this company part of the reply was "this is all paid to you, no discounts". Well aint that nice.
> Their pricing is about 15 or 20 yrs ago. Not in the days of $3 gas and expected to climb.
> 
> I told them when they paid me HUD rate less 20% discount I'd be happy to consider working for them.



I just read your e-mail BPWY, You forgot:

Boarding Small Opening $23.00
Boarding Medium Opening $30.00
Boarding Large Opening $34.00
Boarding Sliding Glass or Double Door $58.00
Boarding Single Car Garage Door $90.00
Boarding Double Car Garage Door $135.00

All the prices are ridiculous but the double car price is a friggen joke!! Typical double car is 7X16 right? Here are the materials:

4 sheets 3/4 CDX $18 a sheet
13 2x4x8 $2 each (2' on center plus sill & top plate)
Concrete anchors for sill plate $10
Box of screws $10
Grand total $118!!!! This does not include sales tax which i don't have here but most of you do. So i am going to spend an hour driving to the job, an hour + boarding and an hour driving back to the shop for $17?????????? :no::no: HUD Allowable is $276 at $1 a United Inch so these yahoos are taking a 51% [email protected]#$^&&%#!!#$!!! I wonder who these guys think they are going to get to do the work?????


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I wonder who these guys think they are going to get to do the work?????






According to the email I got I run in a very small crowd of folks that didn't like their pricing. "most contractors are just glad to have work".
Those most contractors are also gonna be the ones going broke sooner or later.

Now its possible I'm making a mistake by turning down the work, but right now it doesn't look like it. I've got enough work to stay busy.


This is a business, not a charity. I'm not in this for my health.


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## Guest

:thumbsup:


BPWY said:


> According to the email I got I run in a very small crowd of folks that didn't like their pricing. "most contractors are just glad to have work".
> Those most contractors are also gonna be the ones going broke sooner or later.
> 
> Now its possible I'm making a mistake by turning down the work, but right now it doesn't look like it. I've got enough work to stay busy.
> 
> 
> This is a business, not a charity. I'm not in this for my health.


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## Guest

We have people contacting us to do grass cut`s here in Central Florida for a whopping 15.00 yes 15.00 per cut.They can give us 250 per cycle so that`s 500 per month.I told them if I could`nt make money on 1 cut I sure could`nt make money on 500.Oh by the way I forgot to mention the outstanding payment arrangements 30- 45 days if all photo`s were up loaded in the right format. ONLY IN AMERICA:notworthy


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## mtmtnman

deckman8887 said:


> We have people contacting us to do grass cut`s here in Central Florida for a whopping 15.00 yes 15.00 per cut.They can give us 250 per cycle so that`s 500 per month.I told them if I could`nt make money on 1 cut I sure could`nt make money on 500.Oh by the way I forgot to mention the outstanding payment arrangements 30- 45 days if all photo`s were up loaded in the right format. ONLY IN AMERICA:notworthy


There are a lot of thieves out there. Sounds like a local guy who got a deal with a national and now wants to hire you and keep 75% of what he gets. $15 bucks to mow, blow, edge, bag or rake and take pics. Sounds like a great deal!!!...................................................FOR THE GUY PUSHING THE PAPER ACROSS THE DESK!!!! Hell i get $10 for a drive by property inspection!!!!


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## Guest

Boy had a good one today! Been on a large trashout and the crew calls me first thing this morning and someone decided to dump 6 old hotwater heaters in the full 40cyd rolloff container. I go to investigate and all 6 hot water heaters have Safeguard winterize stickers BUT they have boxes in the rolloff container from when they purchase their new hot water heaters....Well I contacted the Police Dept and they sent a policeman (actually very surprised!) and we took one of the boxes down to the "big box" lumberyard where they were purchased and the lumberyard scanned in the scanner numbers through and told the policeman (not me though:furious who purchased the new hot water heaters. Now here is where it gets real interesting::: Mr. Policeman said this is a very big problem and HE called Safeguard and they told him, after about 20 minutes, what 4 of the 6 hot water heaters were possibly installed from "X" crew so then Mr. Policeman called the City Code Enforcement Division and asked if a plumbing permit was pulled for 4 address and NO was the answer. Now they are filing illegal dumping and plumbing without a permit tickets!!! I LOVE IT! I guess it helped the Policemans brother and father are both licensed plumbers :clap:


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## APlusPPGroup

Great story, FremontREO. Most complaints are dead ends. I'm glad yours produced results.:thumbup:

Linda


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## Guest

Linda maybe some of these crews will get what they deserve! I just wish I coulda "overhead" who they were talking about but nope.

Ok my next post is for everyone to consider!


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## Guest

*The RRP rules affecting P&amp;P/REO?*

OK does anyone have any feelings on how the RRP rules are going to affect the P&P and REO preservation work? I am a certified lead renovator already but love watching the posts and concerns about getting the certification.
I spoke with a "major" service company and what their intentions are on handling pre 1978 homes and they have absolutely no idea what I was talking about:laughing: Now I consider that an opportunity! Now when I was in school a while back I spoke with one of the environmental instructors and they said that "changing locks" would be ok and "maybe" winterizing but removing debris or anything that disturbs the "dust" inside a home you have to be certified as a Lead Renovator and have the RRP pamphlet signed before doing ANY work inside the home. Now I see a lot of options here--including higher bid rates for containment zones, "making sure" your competition is licensed and a few other ideas. The bank is going to have sign the RRP form since they can't opt out since someone may purchase the house and have children so I think they are in a corner on this law....
So whats everyones idea on this? :whistling


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## BPWY

As I read it trash/debris removal wouldn't be effected.




> In addition, they must follow protective lead-safe work practice standards when renovation, repair or painting activities will disturb more than six square feet of lead-based paint in a room or when 20 square feet of lead-based paint is disturbed on the exterior.


Unless your activities disturb more than 6 sq ft of paint.

http://www.epa.gov/lead/pubs/renovation.htm


What am I missing?


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## BPWY

From realtor.org

http://www.realtor.org/government_affairs/lead_paint_realtors

As I understand it trash outs aren't effect unless you are messing with the painting or replacing the windows.
If you are paint over existing paint without sanding or in any other way disturbing the paint you're exempt.


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## Guest

I think the Banks will try and weasel out of anything they can. :jester:Lead based paint,mold,and asbestos are NOTHING to mess around with.In 

Florida
anything to do with these 3 problems requires a license issued by the State and governed by Dept. of Business & Professional Regulation.SO IT BLOWS MY MIND THAT PEOPLE ARE GIVING ESTIMATES WITH-OUT PROPER KNOWLEDGE AND EDUCATION IN THIS TYPE OF WORK.The banks will go with the cheapest bids and turn a blind eye if they can get away with it.:furious:


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## Guest

Let me clarify a little bit ( not all banks/servicers are the same)Asbestos abatement whether its old VCT on the floor or old siding or roofing materials or mold from a plumbing or roof leak takes more than ripping the stuff up and replacing it. Also houses that are PLASTERED inside NOT DRYWALL have a 99% chance of having Asbestos in the actual plaster itself.The lead paint is another issue in itself.Now with that being said I do not see the banks paying a pretty penny to have a licensed professional company to take care of the problem when there are so called contractors who will do it under the table and at 1/3 the price ,it`s like making chicken salad out of chicken [email protected]#$, it could look good but still tastes [email protected]#$
Just my 2 cents.:gunsmilie::gunsmilie::gunsmilie:


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## Guest

OK I have to agree about the 6sf of paints but it can go a little farther and I'll look up the regs...BUT I know that if YOU send in the RRP form to be signed by the Servicing Company they are going to ask "what the hell is this and are we breaking some law?"...Understand that every service company has that little clause "you are responsible to follow all laws, ordinances, codes etc"....Well if this is the new EPA rule than you send that little form in with your bid Do you actually think they are going to ignore? Maybe send to the legal dept? They know that they are now in the liability string for any lead exposures and I don't think any bank is willing to take this risk without doing it right..I might be wrong but I have been speaking with several P&P companies and they think in April all **** is going to break loose since they will be sending in the RRP form for signature. Now I think if YOU send in this form then YOU look like the professional and you can charge more for different things.....JMHO


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## mtmtnman

Personally i can live with the Asbestos laws as i see danger with the dust especially since i know many people from Libby Montana where they mined Vermiculite for many years and now there is a lot of cancer in that town. The lead paint thing on the other hand is a joke IMHO. I grew up in the house that my father and grandfather grew up in built in 1862 full of lead based paint and lead piping for fresh water plumbing. The crib i was in as a baby, my dad was in as well as my aunt, my brother and both of my daughters. I did a test on it a few years ago and sure enough, lead based paint! Grandpa lived to 86 and died of a stroke. Dad is healthy as a horse @ 66, i don't seem to have any issues @ 39 and my daughters are fine. Of course i fed them well and didn't let them go around chewing on the furniture or walls and the house was kept clean. PAY ATTENTION TO YOUR KIDS!!! I remodeled both the main house built in 1862 and the hired man's house built in 1899 from top to bottom in 94. Did i wear a mask? Hell yeah! I was more worried about the Hantavirus than lead paint since our house was post and beam with no insulation and 18" thick walls the inner walls were a great place for the mice to hide from our barn cats. IMHO the regulations are a way to protect people from being stupid and not paying attention to their kids. Just like the auto kill on a lawnmower so an idiot can't reach into a running mower and cut his hand off. Another tax on society. You can find all this kind of garbage also starts on the Left coast. Just like the trans-fat issue today. Don't eat the crap!! No reason to regulate it!! If everyone would get there nose out of the damn TV and sports teams and pay attention we wouldn't have half the issues we do!! 

Back on the lead. Just 3 years ago i replaced a 1" lead service in Helena Montana that fed 2 homes built in 1902. Both had all plumbing replaced in their homes a few years before and had the water tested. No lead in their water even though they were serviced by a lead pipe from the city main!! In this part of Helena there are still hundreds of lead services and no one knows any better until they rupture usually around this time of year with 6' of frost in the street!


Lead paint law??? FOLLOW THE $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$!!!!!!!! Per one of my brokers, Remediation could run close to $30,000 on a house worth $95,000. Needless to say...crazy price. He did a little research, and with the lead based paint report in hand you can hire a regular painter and have the test re done after the paint is completed, to make sure it was remediated. (the test runs at about $500). All this is not a must though, if you want to rent it...you still can ...but at this point you would disclose there is lead base paint at the house. To sell it...it's the same...you would have to disclose it.


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## oteroproperties

I think the banks are gonna send it to the bean counters which are more then likely gonna tell them to work loan mods a little harder on home pre 1978


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## Guest

Hey I agree its nonsense! But your last paragraph is only part right:

"He did a little research, and with the lead based paint report in hand you can hire a regular painter and have the test re done after the paint is completed, to make sure it was remediated. (the test runs at about $500). All this is not a must though, if you want to rent it...you still can ...but at this point you would disclose there is lead base paint at the house. To sell it...it's the same...you would have to disclose it."

The painter would have to be a certified lead renovator, test and if lead found then containment zones would need built and wipe tests have to be completed. This isn't going to be cheap either...

Yep you can sure rent that home out and/or sell it with the opt out form signed and disclosed BUT now the seller is liable for the future claims..(If any) and after going to continuing education classes from IA/NE and TN there is only 1 agreement between 3 different locations: this is going to be anothers Lawyers Dream!
I just don't see the banks signing off on the "opt out" form and face uncertain risks? I sure wouldn't but then again its "my" assets I'm protecting vs the service companies don't seem to care.:whistling


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## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> I think the banks are gonna send it to the bean counters which are more then likely gonna tell them to work loan mods a little harder on home pre 1978


 
Exactly whats going to happen when everyone starts sending in the RRP and opt out form to the service company...
Thing is: IF you know its pre-1978 and the contractor does not send in the form then IS the contractor going to be held potentially liable for NOT knowing better and the contractor is the "expert" in the field that is suppose to know the laws.....:whistling


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Hey I agree its nonsense! But your last paragraph is only part right:
> 
> "He did a little research, and with the lead based paint report in hand you can hire a regular painter and have the test re done after the paint is completed, to make sure it was remediated. (the test runs at about $500). All this is not a must though, if you want to rent it...you still can ...but at this point you would disclose there is lead base paint at the house. To sell it...it's the same...you would have to disclose it."
> 
> The painter would have to be a certified lead renovator, test and if lead found then containment zones would need built and wipe tests have to be completed. This isn't going to be cheap either...
> 
> Yep you can sure rent that home out and/or sell it with the opt out form signed and disclosed BUT now the seller is liable for the future claims..(If any) and after going to continuing education classes from IA/NE and TN there is only 1 agreement between 3 different locations: this is going to be anothers Lawyers Dream!
> I just don't see the banks signing off on the "opt out" form and face uncertain risks? I sure wouldn't but then again its "my" assets I'm protecting vs the service companies don't seem to care.:whistling




According to what I dug up in researching it a simple paint over project has no worries. Where the lead issue comes up is when 6 sq ft or more is disturbed on the interior and/or 20 sq ft on the exterior and windows replaced then the testing and remediation kicks in. But a simple paint over is not included.

Is your licensing info telling you different than that?
If so then we've got a conflict on who has the right info.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> According to what I dug up in researching it a simple paint over project has no worries. Where the lead issue comes up is when 6 sq ft or more is disturbed on the interior and/or 20 sq ft on the exterior and windows replaced then the testing and remediation kicks in. But a simple paint over is not included.
> 
> Is your licensing info telling you different than that?
> If so then we've got a conflict on who has the right info.


OK its just like all the instructors will say "CYA" and in a pre1978 home there is no "simple paintover" anywhere I can find in the regulations. For P&P contractors it is the definition of "maintanence" that creates the disturbance of dust (pg 2 of Renovating, Repairing or Painting). Our instructors all said that if you are cleaning such as wiping down windowsills for a initial clean on a workorder then you have to do the RRP forms to the owner of the home (ie service company/bank) due to the dust measures that have to be maintained since you are a contractor and not the homeowner. They actually had a ton of issues that we deal with everyday but its been quite a while since I went to this school....
You are right on 6sf for "minor repair and maintenance activities for painting under rule 745.83 (a) (3) but as they say "this rule is open to interpretation" and why take the risk. 
Environmental companies that I work with all are "salivating":w00t: since the day of bleach treating and kilz covering any moldy area on a pre-1978 home will be over (if done correctly) but heck that doesn't work anyway but that is what the banks/service companies tell the contractor to do....:no:
As the rule says its not for just painting:Its for: Renovations, Repairs AND Painting 40 CFR Part 745.


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## Guest

Oh I forgot to add that there probably is another "rule" that changes everything else to something else for maybe doing this and maybe doing that.....
Kinda maybe :clap:


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## mtmtnman

You know what really cracks me up? HUD can convey with mold without any liability if it is disclosed but it seems like lead is a whole nuther ballgame. What is worse?? Mold or lead???


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> OK its just like all the instructors will say "CYA" and in a pre1978 home there is no "simple paintover" anywhere I can find in the regulations. For P&P contractors it is the definition of "maintanence" that creates the disturbance of dust (pg 2 of Renovating, Repairing or Painting). Our instructors all said that if you are cleaning such as wiping down windowsills for a initial clean on a workorder then you have to do the RRP forms to the owner of the home (ie service company/bank) due to the dust measures that have to be maintained since you are a contractor and not the homeowner. They actually had a ton of issues that we deal with everyday but its been quite a while since I went to this school....
> You are right on 6sf for "minor repair and maintenance activities for painting under rule 745.83 (a) (3) but as they say "this rule is open to interpretation" and why take the risk.
> Environmental companies that I work with all are "salivating":w00t: since the day of bleach treating and kilz covering any moldy area on a pre-1978 home will be over (if done correctly) but heck that doesn't work anyway but that is what the banks/service companies tell the contractor to do....:no:
> As the rule says its not for just painting:Its for: Renovations, Repairs AND Painting 40 CFR Part 745.





Sounds like intentional confusion and misdirection on the part of the gooberment. Makes collecting tax money easier.

Kinda like the DOT with truck driving regs. You could line up 10 DOT cops in a room and ask them all an identical question word for word and chances are VERY good you'll 10 different answers.... some of which will be very different.

And to think I thought I left all that confusion behind. lol


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> You know what really cracks me up? HUD can convey with mold without any liability if it is disclosed but it seems like lead is a whole nuther ballgame. What is worse?? Mold or lead???


Wow thats weighted. I would have to say mold but...the body can "process" mold faster than lead so thats a hard one. Lead in children can leave a lifetime effect (learning disablilities and others) but so can mold according to studies (asthma and lung problems).
I have been seeing a lot of reconveyed properties that the service company did not do the mold remediation correctly and now the banks are having to do the job right before conveying and they must pass the indoor air quality tests. Guess who is paying to do the remediation correctly? Yep the first contractor who did it the way the service company told them. I have mixed feelings on the service company telling you "how to do the work" then sending a claim on your insurance policy to have your work done correctly....

Heres the problem in a nutshell: The service companies want the contractor to "do the work" in a certain way even if they KNOW it will damage the house worse BUT down the road if theres a problem because of the work the service company then blames the contractor for not doing it right....Thats called "having your cake and eating it too" :no:
So in my opinion just bid the job to be done correctly and bid it how they want it done and if they don't want to approve it to be done correctly than that is up to them but at least you told them how it should be. I suppose this will open another can of worms since if you go ahead and do it the incorrect way then you would still be liable...


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## Guest

*Newbie here that wants to say thanks.*

I read this thread to research a strange phenomenon I have encountered recently, as well a see if things in REO are as bad as I hear.

First, thank you, thank you, thank you!! By flooding into the PP and REO market, you folks have collectively pumped my margins back up to about 2004 levels. People running around for $20 and $30 dollars has left a hole in the market, and non-ESL, non-smoking handymen can write their own check, just to show up.

Now don't get sanctimonious on me, I actually have a general contractors license, but I started a service/handyman company, and the margins are 5 time what I could generate with competitive new build.

Not meant to be snarky, I just want to say thanks!


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## oteroproperties

We do preservation work here in Tampa, FL and have been for quite some time. there are alot of new guys (mostly out of work contractors) that jumped into it in the passed couple years. most think they can change the game by staging preservation strikes for higher wages. but there are some of us that have been in the business long before most even knew it was a profession and will be here long after the REO/P&P phase dies out. don't get me wrong things are changing and it is bad for most. especially those in the more rural areas, but if this is your chosen business you have to take the good with the bad. 

in my opinion, I think the handyman thing is quite underrated here in florida. I am among other things a licensed electritian and when i was working for a company i did ALOT of side work on new construction purchases (most home owners migrating from the north). it seemed like the people from the northern states all asked me the same question. "do you know of any good handymen around here?" in Florida the majority of the houses in the bigger cities are new or at least newer so the need for handymen is there but not as pronounced. most home owners would troll the construction sites (mostly their own new neighborhoods) and find a capable person for their project. 

I think as long as you do a good lob, show up, on time, and can speak with some respect you will do well as a handyman. As i said i use to do a lot of side work, and i had so many repeat/referal customers that i was able to quit my job, get my masters and start doing service legit. theres still a lack of handymen here though so we find ourselves hanging pictures, installing chair rail, painting walls, rehanging doors, hanging tv's etc. thats actually what got me into rehabbing. Now my brother runs the service company and I am continuing with preservation and property maintenance. 

anyway welcome and good luck. Get that money while you can, this REO thing is not going to last for ever so you might see your old margins sooner then you would like!!


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> You know what really cracks me up? HUD can convey with mold without any liability if it is disclosed but it seems like lead is a whole nuther ballgame. What is worse?? Mold or lead???


Lead per the EPA, HUD, etc... (but yet you can still buy it and use it for flashing )

Only certain types of mold are dangerous & generally rare

The EPA doesn't even have limits on mold growth, approved testing or anything --- http://epa.gov/mold/ from the FAQ section



> *In most cases, if visible mold growth is present, sampling is unnecessary. Since no EPA or other federal limits have been set for mold or mold spores, sampling cannot be used to check a building's compliance with federal mold standards.* Surface sampling may be useful to determine if an area has been adequately cleaned or remediated. Sampling for mold should be conducted by professionals who have specific experience in designing mold sampling protocols, sampling methods, and interpreting results. Sample analysis should follow analytical methods recommended by the American Industrial Hygiene Association (AIHA), the American Conference of Governmental Industrial Hygienists (ACGIH), or other professional organizations.


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## BPWY

Any one here using the Motorola Droid?

I need to know if I can take photos with my digital camera and then transfer them to the droid for emailing.

I'm up for a new air card on the unreliable laptop, I'm up for a phone upgrade with an extra $50 savings if used by the end of this month on the droid. IF the droid will do what I need I'll save $30 a month on the data charges. I just can't risk this much money on an item that won't do what I need to do.

Thanks.


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## mtmtnman

Advice on boarding hot tubs. Attached below is a photo of a board job i did last summer that Wells Cargo had no issue paying me for. I have done a couple others for other banks the same way without issue. Bank of America on the other hand want's padlocks on the cover. Anyone got any pics on how to padlock one down without ruining the hot tub?? Also, screws into 1/2 inch plywood will rip right out with padlock and hasp setup. I feel chaining the lid down is a lot more secure. I run the screws in right where the cover latch would normally attach with large washers to secure the chain.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Any one here using the Motorola Droid?
> 
> I need to know if I can take photos with my digital camera and then transfer them to the droid for emailing.
> 
> I'm up for a new air card on the unreliable laptop, I'm up for a phone upgrade with an extra $50 savings if used by the end of this month on the droid. IF the droid will do what I need I'll save $30 a month on the data charges. I just can't risk this much money on an item that won't do what I need to do.
> 
> Thanks.


Yep I have the Motorola Droid but I have never tried to transfer pics to the phone but I do snap pics and send them on sometimes. I'll try it in "your neck of the woods" on Thursday to see if the droid will work "out there". LOL
I find where I can get online with my laptop and air card I can't always get online with the phone. Don't ask me why?


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Yep I have the Motorola Droid but I have never tried to transfer pics to the phone but I do snap pics and send them on sometimes. I'll try it in "your neck of the woods" on Thursday to see if the droid will work "out there". LOL
> I find where I can get online with my laptop and air card I can't always get online with the phone. Don't ask me why?



Same here. Seems the aircard picks up on AT&T towers where the phone won't..................


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## BPWY

I see that too. Even when I was driving truck.

Full signal on the phone. Nada on the aircard. Occasionally the other way around.


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Same here. Seems the aircard picks up on AT&T towers where the phone won't..................


I think its what provider you have. My aircard from verizon is the old version that is unlimited usage and isn't offered anylonger and I can pickup everything when others can't get service. The phone is spotty and really slow unless by the Cities--still works but extremely slow. 
Also, BTW that hottub secure is the first I've seen done like that. It seems that anymore they tell us only to drain the dang thing and remove...wanna buy a hottub? LOL:clap:


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## BPWY

You got any *good* ones??? If so throw that puppy on with your snow machines.

When you get here we'll dicker on a price. ROFLMAO

I'll be able to get it real cheap that way, it'll be in your way and a major pain to work around.


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## Guest

*&quot;*



BPWY said:


> You got any *good* ones??? If so throw that puppy on with your snow machines.
> 
> When you get here we'll dicker on a price. ROFLMAO
> 
> I'll be able to get it real cheap that way, it'll be in your way and a major pain to work around.


I woulda brought it along for a sled! Dang that would be a blast--an 8 personal four sided sled "with jets!"...
We don't see many tubs here since nobody can afford one! And when we do they are junk.
Man I'll PM you later and tell you a horror story today if your around?


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## BPWY

Yeah go ahead, if I'm not still around I'll read it in a couple hrs.

I'm emailing pics, a completion, and bids for today's work.


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## Guest

*AZ Fannie Mae Prop Preservation*

Anyone know what asset mang. company Fannie Mae is using for AZ properties? Any help is appreciated!


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## Guest

*This Job Is Not For Everyone*

this job is not for everyone thats for sure its hard being a wife not seeing my husband every day its really hard.. but most of the time your running around like you have no head on but at the end of the day its a great job :thumbup: but if your married and your used to seeing your husband/wife everyday its going to be hard but the best thing you can do is just help uploading and getting this done faster so u can spend much need time with your husband/wife:no:


----------



## BPWY

REOWifey said:


> this job is not for everyone thats for sure its hard being a wife not seeing my husband every day its really hard.. but most of the time your running around like you have no head on but at the end of the day its a great job :thumbup: but if your married and your used to seeing your husband/wife everyday its going to be hard but the best thing you can do is just help uploading and getting this done faster so u can spend much need time with your husband/wife:no:






When I was driving truck I could be gone 3 weeks at a time. For me I'm not even gone 3 nights per month now. (on average)
Big difference.

Are you folks working in a very rural area that requires distance travel?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> When I was driving truck I could be gone 3 weeks at a time. For me I'm not even gone 3 nights per month now. (on average)
> Big difference.
> 
> Are you folks working in a very rural area that requires distance travel?


 
No Not Really, the longest place we go to is about 3hours away.. the thing i hate is i come home hes sleeping and i wake up hes gone..but i have found out what i can do to deal with it :clap:but i lREO and Trash outs


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## Guest

*Date &amp; Time Stamp Question*

I am trying to find a easier way to date stamp my photos, I have to stamp one photo at a time with my camera. I downloaded the trial version of SnapTouch to try out and I am able to date stamp the photos but do not see the print option. I have to print to PDF to upload the photos.
I contacted SnapTouch and have not received a reply back, does anyone know if the registered version will have the print option?

Thanks!


----------



## mtmtnman

samccard said:


> I am trying to find a easier way to date stamp my photos, I have to stamp one photo at a time with my camera. I downloaded the trial version of SnapTouch to try out and I am able to date stamp the photos but do not see the print option. I have to print to PDF to upload the photos.
> I contacted SnapTouch and have not received a reply back, does anyone know if the registered version will have the print option?
> 
> Thanks!



Resize and datestamp your photos, save to file, download Cutepdf (google it) once downloaded, go to saved photos, select all, right click, print, cutepdf writer, save to new file as a pdf. DONE.


----------



## Guest

I have the CutePDF and AdobePDF. I tried right clicking to print but the file saved through the trial version of SnapTouch does not give the print option.
I want to make sure that SnapTouch does have the print option before I purchase Snaptouch. Any other date stamp software out there?

Thanks


----------



## mtmtnman

samccard said:


> I have the CutePDF and AdobePDF. I tried right clicking to print but the file saved through the trial version of SnapTouch does not give the print option.
> I want to make sure that SnapTouch does have the print option before I purchase Snaptouch. Any other date stamp software out there?
> 
> Thanks


use this. http://www.faststone.org/FSResizerDownload.htm its freeware. been using it for a year. does resize, date, time and a bunch more.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> use this. http://www.faststone.org/FSResizerDownload.htm its freeware. been using it for a year. does resize, date, time and a bunch more.



Thank you! Works Great!


----------



## mtmtnman

samccard said:


> Thank you! Works Great!



I can time/datestamp, resize & pdf 250 pics in less than 3 minutes. Great program...............


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## Guest

What a great site...A big thank you to all of you on this site and a special thanks to Linda. Linda you have such positive attitude and I'm amazed how open you are to helping others...Lots of great information on this site, I read through all the posting twice. The second time I wrote down notes. :laughing:


----------



## Guest

capo said:


> What a great site...A big thank you to all of you on this site and a special thanks to Linda. Linda you have such positive attitude and I'm amazed how open you are to helping others...Lots of great information on this site, I read through all the posting twice. The second time I wrote down notes. :laughing:


 
Taking notes is a good thing:thumbsup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Mtmtnman ~

What a cool little program! We've been using PixResizer for years and it works great but this one goes a step further and I like it.

What I really like is the Watermark feature in this software. We've been thinking about adding our logo to all of our photos before sending them off to the clients. Now maybe we can do that. I'll have to play with it some more to get the dimensions just right but it shouldn't be too difficult.

I use Windows 7 so, to anyone wondering whether or not it's compatible, the answer is yes, it is.:clap:

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

reohoustontx said:


> Anyone know what asset mang. company Fannie Mae is using for AZ properties? Any help is appreciated!


Cyprexx got a lot of their business. But they're not going to give you the increase in allowables that FannieMae provides. They'll give you the same rates they always do and pocket the difference.

We just did a couple of jobs for Cyprexx in Kansas and the VM was so full of attitude and difficult to work with that we terminated our relationship with them altogether.

Between their low rates and personality disorders, they were able to remind me why we don't work for the nationals anymore. 

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> Mtmtnman ~
> 
> What a cool little program! We've been using PixResizer for years and it works great but this one goes a step further and I like it.
> 
> What I really like is the Watermark feature in this software. We've been thinking about adding our logo to all of our photos before sending them off to the clients. Now maybe we can do that. I'll have to play with it some more to get the dimensions just right but it shouldn't be too difficult.
> 
> I use Windows 7 so, to anyone wondering whether or not it's compatible, the answer is yes, it is.:clap:
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Linda



Glad it worked out for you. It saves a lot of time to resize and datestamp all at once. Also for those companies that want timestamps it pulls the HEX data from the photos and stamps accordingly.......


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> Cyprexx got a lot of their business. But they're not going to give you the increase in allowables that FannieMae provides. They'll give you the same rates they always do and pocket the difference.
> 
> We just did a couple of jobs for Cyprexx in Kansas and the VM was so full of attitude and difficult to work with that we terminated our relationship with them altogether.
> 
> Between their low rates and personality disorders, they were able to remind me why we don't work for the nationals anymore.
> 
> Linda


Damn that's not good! I just started with them and so far they have been decent but they do have a bit of the "_Cubicle Mind"_ disorder.I did get a check on Tuesday for a re=occuring that i did on Jan 29th. Don't know how fas they pay on the preservation end as i had my $1800 invoice turned in for a trashout on the 30th and have not seen a check yet. They say turn in by the 5th of the month and get paid in 2 weeks.............


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> Damn that's not good! I just started with them and so far they have been decent but they do have a bit of the "_Cubicle Mind"_ disorder.I did get a check on Tuesday for a re=occuring that i did on Jan 29th. Don't know how fas they pay on the preservation end as i had my $1800 invoice turned in for a trashout on the 30th and have not seen a check yet. They say turn in by the 5th of the month and get paid in 2 weeks.............


Our invoices are 1/21, 1/26, and 1/29. No payment yet. My son also owns a preservation business. He's waiting on over $3,000 that was due last month.

When things slow down, the clients hang onto your money so they can still pay their payroll and not close their doors. It happens every time after there's been a moratorium. 

Good luck. Let us know how it goes.

Linda


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## Guest

My husband and i are just starting a pproperty preserv business...we are very excited!!! However im trying to find information on how to become a vendor for lenders and even homebuilders... Could someone please advise... Im located in chesapeake va


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## Guest

HEY LINDA 
DO YOU DO WORK IN MONTGOMERY,AL IF SOME LET ME KNOW
:thumbup:


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## Guest

I just finished reading this entire thread and am very thankful for the information and knowledge shared. I've shown this to my two business partners to give them an idea of what we have to look forward to by getting into the Property Preservation arena. We are a start-up company and looking forward to the future. I have to admit I'm a little apprehensive as to whether or not we're making the right move. It sounds like there is some tumoil to deal with in PP.

I just wanted to give a big thanks to some of the posters on this thread.
Specifically:

Linda Hall
BPWY
mtmtnman
FremontREO
oteroproperties

I really appreciate all of your insights. It's invaluable information.


Bret


----------



## Guest

c.m.j 

wish you luck it a good business to be in at time


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## Guest

C.M.J. said:


> I just finished reading this entire thread and am very thankful for the information and knowledge shared. I've shown this to my two business partners to give them an idea of what we have to look forward to by getting into the Property Preservation arena. We are a start-up company and looking forward to the future. I have to admit I'm a little apprehensive as to whether or not we're making the right move. It sounds like there is some tumoil to deal with in PP.
> 
> I just wanted to give a big thanks to some of the posters on this thread.
> Specifically:
> 
> Linda Hall
> BPWY
> mtmtnman
> FremontREO
> oteroproperties
> 
> I really appreciate all of your insights. It's invaluable information.
> 
> 
> Bret


Half tongue in cheek but I hope 1 partner is a lawyer and the other partner is an insurance agent...
And you the good general contactor.
The other tongue in cheek is: it can be a very rewarding experience if you make sure to dot all "i's" and cross those "t's" and check it twice....
Everyone here is sure to help in your adventure.


----------



## Guest

you right


----------



## Guest

FremontREO- Thanks. The i's and t's were the real eye opener in this thread. This is where the apprehension comes in. Although,the 3 of us come in with a history of getting screwed on a daily by those in charge. After something like that CYA becomes second nature. I just hope we learn what to use for the CYA material.


----------



## BPWY

And then we have this little gem to worry about.

*Government Considers Foreclosure Freeze*



> Analysts tell FOX Business that *the possible changes,* *if adopted, effectively prevent virtually all foreclosure action in the country for an extended period.*


.


How many here will be put out of business thanks to this?


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> And then we have this little gem to worry about.
> 
> *Government Considers Foreclosure Freeze*
> 
> .
> 
> 
> How many here will be put out of business thanks to this?



Do these dumbazzes realize you CANNOT keep meddling with this stuff without dire consequences?????? If this happens the banks will shut down ALL monies available for loans as they will not have any to loan!!! While some people have real reasons they are late on payments about 75% of the pre-foreclosure inspections i am doing are on people that are over-toyed!! Average home but 2 new vehicles, a new camper, a Harley, atv's snowmobiles, boats Ect!! WQhere the hell are these peoples priorities??? I am covering 45,000 sq miles of my state in an 18 yr old pickup with 150,000 miles on it and these people think they need brand new rigs to go 20 miles to work??? In my dads generation these people would be the laughing stock of the community! Of course people had common sense and had there priorities in line then........................


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> And then we have this little gem to worry about.
> 
> *Government Considers Foreclosure Freeze*
> 
> .
> 
> 
> How many here will be put out of business thanks to this?


 
Not me. PP is only part of the services that we offer. Still, this would suck. How would this be legal???? What's next, you can't repo a vehicle because someone can't make the payments???


----------



## mtmtnman

Brickie said:


> Not me. PP is only part of the services that we offer. Still, this would suck. How would this be legal???? What's next, you can't repo a vehicle because someone can't make the payments???



Believe me it would directly effect you as well. People are having a hard enough time getting $$$ for remodels Ect. without the gooberment pushing the banks around more. Not allowing them to unload bad debt will make them rob Peter to pay Paul and tighten up lending even more. The gooberment see's this as saving them $$$$ because Fannie, Freddie, VA Ect. are insured loans and when a house sells short the bank don't loose a dime. Think about it.......


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Believe me it would directly effect you as well. People are having a hard enough time getting $$$ for remodels Ect. without the gooberment pushing the banks around more. Not allowing them to unload bad debt will make them rob Peter to pay Paul and tighten up lending even more. The gooberment see's this as saving them $$$$ because Fannie, Freddie, VA Ect. are insured loans and when a house sells short the bank don't loose a dime. Think about it.......


 
It will have an effect, but it won't put me out of business. It doesn't change the fact it would still suck no matter what.


----------



## mtmtnman

Brickie said:


> It will have an effect, but it won't put me out of business. It doesn't change the fact it would still suck no matter what.



May i ask what else your involved with other than property pres. and remodeling/repairs that you consider safe if this goes down???


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> May i ask what else your involved with other than property pres. and remodeling/repairs that you consider safe if this goes down???


Mtmtnman,

I'm looking at this possible news as just another moritorium. I'm going to do what I always have done during the various moritoriums that we've had.

I'm in the Chicagoland & NW Indiana area which happens to be the third largest market in the country. The results that I am having will be different than in your neck of the woods.


The overwhelming majority of people in this country are not facing foreclosure. These people will always need to have some type of repair work done on their properties. I currently have 12 weeks of work already booked with this group of people. Once the weather breaks, that # will increase. Even though it's still a WIP, if you go to our website it will give you an idea of just some of the services that we provide:

http://www.rammasonry.com/Home_Page.html


With regards to this HUD & REO thread:

I mainly deal with brokers & a few banks. They keep us busy with all the repair work. In addition, many communities around here are going after the banks to make sure their properties are properly maintained. In places like Gary, Indiana (aka "Board Up City") the vandals take their toll on properties. We're constantly being sent there to repair stuff. 

The really good brokers also have their hands in all kinds of stuff like property management for all types of clients. These properties will need work done on them as well. We do get our share of work :thumbup:


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> The gooberment see's this as saving them $$$$ because Fannie, Freddie, VA Ect. are insured loans and when a house sells short the bank don't loose a dime. Think about it.......


All I can say is follow the money.

In the urban areas short sales are perfect for if you want to be a slum landlord. 

You buy the property really cheap & in short order it's turned into Section 8 Housing. Where does the $$$$ for Section 8 Housing come from?????


----------



## Guest

Hello all! Was reading this thread by mistake while looking for work. I have been working in P.P. for a little over 4 years. I want to wish all the new people starting up all the luck in the world. 

I am always submitting bids of my own prices and they never come back at that price. 
I know one thing, I'll be doing a initial on my own house if these bids don't start getting better.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I now am subcontracting for Safeguard and it's horrible.
> 
> I am always submitting bids of my own prices and they never come back at that price.
> I feel that the company I am subbing for is lowballing all these bids for the mere fact to just get the work. I would like to hear some feedback. Is it Safeguard? Or does the company I work for need to step up their bids? I know one thing, I'll be doing a initial on my own house if these bids don't start getting better.




Safeguard gets another one.
The internet is full of stories like this. Once in a great while you'll find a contractor that they keep happy. They have to allow one success story to counter act the negative stories and to be used for their recruiting ads.
I won't work for them. Worked for their grass cut department in 09. I told the company I've been working for that I was not working for safeguard in 2010.

Whats happening with your bids is this. I run into the same thing.
You are subcontracting to another company that is contracting with Safeguard. Every body wants to make money and as the last guy at the end of the chain doing all the work they expect the world from you but do not want to pay you for that. There is very likely another contractor in your area working for safeguard and they are able to bid less than you and get the bids and make money because there isn't that level of discount that you have.


My best advice is to go be your own man. Get your own insurance and your own contacts.
Had I not done this last year when things started to slow down I would have already lost my house.
I started in March 09 and only worked for one company. Like your situation I was the low man on the pole with 2 levels of discount between me and the banks. By NOV it was obvious that they were not giving me the same level of dedication that I was giving them.
I went out and got my own insurance and started applying with every national and regional I could find. I'm slowly getting my name into the hands of the local brokers and agents. One day I'll be able to tell this company I've been working for goodbye. I make a heck of a lot more money when they aren't involved.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Safeguard gets another one.
> There is very likely another contractor in your area working for safeguard and they are able to bid less than you and get the bids and make money because there isn't that level of discount that you have.




I would like to start my own company but it almost looks pointless. Seems like there is a lot more people doing this line of work now than there was 4 years ago. When I first started, I was covering all the N-NW Chicago burbs all the way back to Rockford, IL and there was plenty of work. Now its just the Rockford area and Northwestern IL.

It's frustrating.


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Right. There is another company. I had seen this other company's name all over the sign in sheets when I first started doing the Safeguard work. The company I work for was submitting bids so low that Safeguard was giving us all the work. Now, I hardly ever see this other company's name on the sign in sheets and the bids are still low. I feel the company I work for (family owns it by the way) should now start upping their amounts for work performed. Not drastically but some. It's business, not a friendship.
> 
> I would like to start my own company but it almost looks pointless. Seems like there is a lot more people doing this line of work now than there was 4 years ago. When I first started, I was covering all the N-NW Chicago burbs all the way back to Rockford, IL and there was plenty of work. Now its just the Rockford area and Northwestern IL.
> 
> It's frustrating.



My old stomping grounds. I grew up there but never want to return. I have friends in that area that have attempted to get into P&P but have told me prices are so low it cannot be done to turn a profit. Good luck........


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> It's frustrating.





I understand. And you've got this to worry about too.

I've already got insurance in place and have a lot of my own contacts. Its got me pretty worried.


----------



## Guest

Earlier reading in this thread led me to believe that some contractors don't have the correct GL insurance for P&P. What is the correct insurance coverage? I would like some direction because I've got a meeting set up with my ins. agent on Friday to talk about errors & omitions ins. and to make sure I have the right coverage for GL.


----------



## Guest

For PP, E & O is a waste of $$$$


----------



## Guest

HI LINDA,

I'M LOCATED IN NORFOLK VIRGINIA...I WAS READING THRU SOME OLDER POST ABOUT GETTING STARTED WITH COMPANIES AND THE ADVICE WAS TO START WITH A FIELD ASSET / REHAB VENDOR IS THAT CORRECT? IF IT IS AND IM ON THE RIGHT PATH - HOW DO I FIND THESE COMPANIES IN MY AREA? DO I NEED TO CONTACT HOUSING AND REDEVELOPENT?:confused1:


----------



## Guest

REPLY TO C.M.J- (LINDA HALL):
I AM TOO STARTING A NEW PROPERTY PRESERVATION BUSINESS AND THIS SITE IS VERY HELPFUL.. GOOD LUCK WITH YOUR NEW BUSINESSS :thumbup:


----------



## Guest

EUGENIA said:


> I'M LOCATED IN NORFOLK VIRGINIA...I WAS READING THRU SOME OLDER POST ABOUT GETTING STARTED WITH COMPANIES AND THE ADVICE WAS TO START WITH A FIELD ASSET / REHAB VENDOR IS THAT CORRECT? IF IT IS AND IM ON THE RIGHT PATH - HOW DO I FIND THESE COMPANIES IN MY AREA? DO I NEED TO CONTACT HOUSING AND REDEVELOPENT?:confused1:


 

Eugenia,

If you are looking for work or looking to hire go here:

[email protected]


----------



## Guest

THANK YOU!!!:clap:


----------



## Guest

Brickie - Could you explain the difference between P&P and REO work? Where would the errors & omitions ins. be needed? Thanks.


----------



## Guest

C.M.J. said:


> Brickie - Could you explain the difference between P&P and REO work? Where would the errors & omitions ins. be needed? Thanks.


BUY E&O for everthing in this business. Purchase the best policy money can buy since inevitably you *will* need it. 
Make sure the E&O policy pays for "emotional distress" and any punitive damages other than just "cost of replacement of "missing" items" from a home.
In this business it is a given if you have been in it long enough you will be sued so make double dang sure to not buy the "cheap" policy since either you will let the insurance company pay or YOU will pay.


----------



## oteroproperties

Gotta agree with fremont on this one, I have a very good policy but i've recently been questioning my protection. I have set up a phone confrence to make sure I am covered for ALL work I perform. The E&O is more for the fact that there is no real release from liability for any work done on these properties. They can come back 3 years later and say "you didn't do this right" - pay up!! That's the real reason why the policy is so expensive in comparison to other gen liab policies. What you charge to be responsible indefinitley?


----------



## BPWY

Since many of the start ups in this biz are here today and gone next year (if they're lucky) what are the banks and nationals doing about those that are no longer in biz and the insurance policies have lapsed??


A local real estate agent told me that in the last yr hes talked to 8 DIFFERENT contractors for FAS. Hes never seen the same ones twice. Pretty similar experience to mine with them. This is what I mean by here today, gone next yr or next month.


----------



## oteroproperties

To answer your question about the difference between P&P and REO is that P&P is presale which means you have to be VERY careful who works for and with you. You will be challenged by some type of law enforcement and it helps if your crew members don't have records. REO is after the bank already owns the home, no real liability here.....well not as much anyway. Things are done different, for instance, lock changes are done on the P&P side as well as the REO, but P&P can't really restrict access to the registered owner. With REO all locks must be changed to keep out previous tenants. Grass cuts have to be of better quality on REO then P&P. P&P cuts are to stop code violations and HOA complaints, REO is for both that and curb appeal (they are trying to sell the property so....). You will almost always trim shrubs on an REO job but P&P seldom approves bids for that (this depends on the client of course). The list goes on and on but there are a few examples. The bottom line is REO is after sale meaning the bank owns it and P&P is typically presale.


----------



## Guest

Otero-Is there any way to write into a contract a limited length of time for liability? Such as after completion of certain aspects of the job liability is assumed by the owner (i.e. the bank)? Does this make any sense?


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY, as long as those contractors had insurance (and the client had the AI in possession and signed) at the time the job was completed the claim will be paid. That's the reason the policy is so expensive theres no real statue of limitations on these types of claims. Though im sure arguments can be made on our behalf for reasonable lengths of time passed.


----------



## mtmtnman

C.M.J. said:


> Otero-Is there any way to write into a contract a limited length of time for liability? Such as after completion of certain aspects of the job liability is assumed by the owner (i.e. the bank)? Does this make any sense?



My insurance is written for "ongoing and completed" operations. I have been told this covers my arse WITHOUT E&O. Laws may be different in my state though.


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> BPWY, as long as those contractors had insurance (and the client had the AI in possession and signed) at the time the job was completed the claim will be paid. That's the reason the policy is so expensive theres no real statue of limitations on these types of claims. Though im sure arguments can be made on our behalf for reasonable lengths of time passed.




Insurance companies are all about risk. I would imagine that they will not make payments after a certain amount of time when the contractor cancels his coverage.


----------



## oteroproperties

C.M.J. said:


> Otero-Is there any way to write into a contract a limited length of time for liability? Such as after completion of certain aspects of the job liability is assumed by the owner (i.e. the bank)? Does this make any sense?


I'm sure you could put it in any contract or report, but I doubt it will fly with the nationals. All of this work (maintenance, repairs, and preservation) is about the assumption of responsibility. It's the job of the asset manager to try and remove the liability of the asset from the client. I don't believe any large asset manager is going to work with a company that would put that in a contract. It would be nice though.....

this is just my opinion though not facts on this one..


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> I'm sure you could put it in any contract or report, but I doubt it will fly with the nationals. All of this work (maintenance, repairs, and preservation) is about the assumption of responsibility. It's the job of the asset manager to try and remove the liability of the asset from the client. I don't believe any large asset manager is going to work with a company that would put that in a contract. It would be nice though.....
> 
> this is just my opinion though not facts on this one..





I have a feeling that there isn't a one of the nationals that will accept your contract.


----------



## Guest

Thanks guys! This really helps out. I am probably being naive here, but it sounds like I would be more comfortable with REO work then P&P.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> My insurance is written for "ongoing and completed" operations. I have been told this covers my arse WITHOUT E&O. Laws may be different in my state though.


Buy the E&O......
I recently learned a few of the tricks that are played out on the GL policy to not have to pay for "certan" items thus the E&O has to pay....

Ex: work order sent out to a contractor 4 days before the redemption period is over...GL won't pay but an E&O will. Contractor has no idea of the redemption period. 
EX: GL won't pay for emotional distress
Ex: GL won't pay for cost of defense for the servicing company you work for. (Indemnity Clause) Even if you are in the right.
Ex: GL and most E&O policies won't pay for a countersuit to reclaim the cost of the contractors deductibles.

And on and on I could go but all valueable items that a contractor needs to know in this business...


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> My insurance is written for "ongoing and completed" operations. I have been told this covers my arse WITHOUT E&O. Laws may be different in my state though.


To be honest I don't really think we have any issues with this. After a job is completed and paid it is assumed by all involved that the job was completed correctly. I don't really see an angle that could bite us after that. Unless it's determined that we some how damaged something in the process. I guess arguments can be made from both sides all day long. The important thing is to be WELL covered just in case. 

Just a side note: 
a friend of mine that does this work was hit for a roof replacement for not reporting a small water stain in the bathroom. I couldn't believe that this happened to him and I started to worry about all the houses i've been in.

After some investigation I learned that he took a photo of the issue but didn't document it on the report. There was no plauseable deniability there. 

Same thing happened to me years later and they tried to get me, but I video all my initial orders (especially the celings!!!!!) and that stopped the bulls__t right in its tracks. *CYA* that's all there really is in this business and *GOOD* insurance is a key part of that


----------



## Guest

C.M.J. said:


> Thanks guys! This really helps out. I am probably being naive here, but it sounds like I would be more comfortable with REO work then P&P.


There is nothing naive here. You learn by asking the questions:thumbsup:
The answers may not always be right but an answer none-the-less:laughing:
We always put in our contracts and completion documents a clause thay we cannot be held responsible for any items after an initial secure is completed since the bank cannot safeguard the property and who is entering the home...
p.s. Doesn't work but it makes us feel better kinda


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> To be honest I don't really think we have any issues with this. After a job is completed and paid it is assumed by all involved that the job was completed correctly. I don't really see an angle that could bite us after that. Unless it's determined that we some how damaged something in the process. I guess arguments can be made from both sides all day long. The important thing is to be WELL covered just in case.
> 
> Just a side note:
> a friend of mine that does this work was hit for a roof replacement for not reporting a small water stain in the bathroom. I couldn't believe that this happened to him and I started to worry about all the houses i've been in.
> 
> After some investigation I learned that he took a photo of the issue but didn't document it on the report. There was no plauseable deniability there.
> 
> Same thing happened to me years later and they tried to get me, but I video all my initial orders (especially the celings!!!!!) and that stopped the bulls__t right in its tracks. *CYA* that's all there really is in this business and *GOOD* insurance is a key part of that



With all the BS lately video is sounding better and better. Do you upload vids to the nationals??


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> Insurance companies are all about risk. I would imagine that they will not make payments after a certain amount of time when the contractor cancels his coverage.


I'm sure you're right. I don't see any amount of money that would compel them to pay a claim 5 years old but this is how it was explained to me. I was told that E&O was for people like engineers, in case the structure they design collapses years later and it turns out to be a flaw in the design. My agent never could understand us needing it either other then to cover issues that might arise in the future. but who really knows.....


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> My agent never could understand us needing it either .....




Same here.


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> With all the BS lately video is sounding better and better. Do you upload vids to the nationals??


No I don't but I make sure that there are things that can be identified in the video that will cross reference to the photos. It's not iron clad but it has saved me countless times over the years!!


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> To be honest I don't really think we have any issues with this. After a job is completed and paid it is assumed by all involved that the job was completed correctly. I don't really see an angle that could bite us after that. Unless it's determined that we some how damaged something in the process. I guess arguments can be made from both sides all day long. The important thing is to be WELL covered just in case.
> 
> Just a side note:
> a friend of mine that does this work was hit for a roof replacement for not reporting a small water stain in the bathroom. I couldn't believe that this happened to him and I started to worry about all the houses i've been in.
> 
> After some investigation I learned that he took a photo of the issue but didn't document it on the report. There was no plauseable deniability there.
> 
> Same thing happened to me years later and they tried to get me, but I video all my initial orders (especially the celings!!!!!) and that stopped the bulls__t right in its tracks. *CYA* that's all there really is in this business and *GOOD* insurance is a key part of that


SO True! Good friend of mine did a dewinterize on a home that had sat empty for nearly 2 years. After replacing a few fittings with a licensed plumber the system held pressure and the water was restored to the home. The plumber told him to be double sure to put a exclusion to the bank that the fittings, gaskets and faucet valves may leak from dry rot and etc and this cannot be warrantied nor guaranteed. He did this. House sold. New owners left to take a trip 2 weeks after purchase of home and the fitting from a shower faucet valve broke and flooded main level of home and basement. The new homeowners sued service company and the contractor and won. Now the contractor had to determine if he should sue the plumber but his lawyer said nope since he had a clause for any plumbing issues not being guaranteed. My buddy had the same clause but since the Service Company was listed as an Add Insured they automatically claimed on his policy for all the claim...yep he lost


----------



## Guest

CMJ,

I highly recommend that you sit down with your insurance people & go over everything with them with a fine tooth comb. Make sure to that they are very knowledgeable about Property Preservation, as well as whatever else that you do. Ask them about E & O. My insurance company told me no. Keep in mind, in addition to PP work, I do foundations & all the way to the roof, as well as demolition work. So when you add up the insurance, WC, various surety bonds, it's pricey. I'm sure it will go up shortly because of the EPA RRP Rule taking effect.....


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Buy the E&O......
> I recently learned a few of the tricks that are played out on the GL policy to not have to pay for "certan" items thus the E&O has to pay....
> 
> Ex: work order sent out to a contractor 4 days before the redemption period is over...GL won't pay but an E&O will. Contractor has no idea of the redemption period.
> EX: GL won't pay for emotional distress
> Ex: GL won't pay for cost of defense for the servicing company you work for. (Indemnity Clause) Even if you are in the right.
> Ex: GL and most E&O policies won't pay for a countersuit to reclaim the cost of the contractors deductibles.
> 
> And on and on I could go but all valueable items that a contractor needs to know in this business...


 
Thanks for the interesting info Fremont! I'm going to be meeting with my insurance people shortly to review everything on the heels of the upcoming EPA RRP crap. You've just given me more questions that I need answers for...:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

Thanks Brickie! We have a meeting set for Friday w/ins agent. We have yet to our first job and I/we REALLY want to cover all our bases! We all (me and my 2 partners) are moving from the auto industry (UAW autowokers, parts supplier) to this industry. I want the feeling of "I made/built that!" I know we won't make tons of money, but we've been there/done that and it is not as satisfying. We have A LOT to learn and I'm looking forward to that.


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## Guest

Yesterday was the first time i applied with a company as a vendor. I wasn't aware of the quiz that i had to take alone with it. I knew alot and i alot i didnt- BUT I KNOW NOW Thank god for the internet!!!


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## Guest

EUGENIA said:


> Yesterday was the first time i applied with a company as a vendor. I wasn't aware of the quiz that i had to take alone with it. I knew alot and i alot i didnt- BUT I KNOW NOW Thank god for the internet!!!


Do you have a copy of the HUD guidelines?


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## Guest

*Guidelines*



brickie said:


> do you have a copy of the hud guidelines?


 
i believe i do.. In one of my books that i purchased. Do you know where i can get a list?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Use this link, then find your state. These are the cost allowances:

http://www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/reo/pandpsched/

For guidelines, click on the P & P Mortgagee Letters under the HUD Resources header. Do yourself a favor and go through the old letters, too. Much of the info you find there still applies.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

We are currently looking for *experienced* vendors in these counties in California:

*San Diego*
*Imperial*
*Santa Clara*
*Oxnard *
*Ventura*
*Santa Barbara *
*Los Angeles*
*Shasta *
*Nevada*
*Alameda*
*Contra Costa*
*Solano*
*Santa Cruz*
*San Mateo *
*Marin*
*Sierra*
*Placer*
*Alpine*
*Tulare*
*Lake*
*Colusa*

If anyone here has the *experience* and can produce *good, clear quality photos consistently*, please e-mail me at [email protected] and I'll reply with more detail about what we need to start the review process.

We're looking for qualified, professional, independent contractors, not employees. If you're just starting up a preservation business, we will consider you *ONLY* if you've already been working for another company actually doing the work and taking photos. We will be requesting proof of your quality of work.

You *MUST* be insured. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. General liability @ $2 million and, if you have employees, you'll need to provide proof of workmens comp coverage.

I have work in most of these counties right now and we just took on several new clients who are supposed to be sending us lots of work in California shortly.

Very important ~ so that I can locate what I'm looking for in a mail search, *PLEASE* give me a list of the counties you cover in your first contact, and your name, your company name, and a contact phone number in *EVERY* e-mail you send, not just the first one. 

If you create an e-mail signature with all of your contact information, you won't have to type it every time and I won't have to try to figure out who you are by your first name.

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## Guest

I personally do not think that this is a business for any newbies unless you are looking for failure. I have been doing this bus for 3.5 years. Every year the profits have been dropping. And I will admit, this past year I have gotten so many chargebacks for rediculous stuff. Whether it's the nationals or HUD making up these lame ass excuses to keep my money only says 1 thing. The banks are hurting. They stick the carrot in front of you to take the job, then in 6 months later charge you back for the whole job. Believe me, it happened to me because of a 1 day difference. My photos were dated 5/11 and my completion was dated 5/12. It wasn't even due until 5/14 and I got charged back a little over $682. Personally I think it should be illegal with documented photos proving the job was done with plenty of befores, during & afters. I was so pissed, that was just one of the many times this past year. I am looking to the agents/brokers to eliminate the nationals, but no luck yet as to our STUPID president getting involved and trying to stop all foreclosures. I have never seen it so slow since I've been in bus. You think this would be a time for all of us in this bus to be profitable, but that isn't the case due to dickhead Obama. Sometimes I think that this is the beginning of the end of this work. Just my opinion, hope it changes!!!!!


----------



## Guest

APFS said:


> I personally do not think that this is a business for any newbies unless you are looking for failure. I have been doing this bus for 3.5 years. Every year the profits have been dropping. And I will admit, this past year I have gotten so many chargebacks for rediculous stuff. Whether it's the nationals or HUD making up these lame ass excuses to keep my money only says 1 thing. The banks are hurting. They stick the carrot in front of you to take the job, then in 6 months later charge you back for the whole job. Believe me, it happened to me because of a 1 day difference. My photos were dated 5/11 and my completion was dated 5/12. It wasn't even due until 5/14 and I got charged back a little over $682. Personally I think it should be illegal with documented photos proving the job was done with plenty of befores, during & afters. I was so pissed, that was just one of the many times this past year. I am looking to the agents/brokers to eliminate the nationals, but no luck yet as to our STUPID president getting involved and trying to stop all foreclosures. I have never seen it so slow since I've been in bus. You think this would be a time for all of us in this bus to be profitable, but that isn't the case due to dickhead Obama. Sometimes I think that this is the beginning of the end of this work. Just my opinion, hope it changes!!!!!


OH MAN I saw the 3rd to last word....HOPE
Its called FRAUD in my eyes JMO


----------



## mtmtnman

If y'all think its hard in a metro area try working out here in the Rural West. On many jobs by the time we put gas in the truck we are making less than $5 an hour on a job and wearing out a vehicle. Last summers mowing route for me was 1200 miles a week to cover 20-25 lawns of which 40% were trip charges due to never being able to get bid approvals on very large properties. By the time i paid gas, hotel, food and rack up miles on my truck i would be better off working at Home Depot. I rolled over 80,000 miles last year for around the same in dollars for gross income. I am staying home in my valley this summer. Got work for local realtors that should keep me busy......


----------



## BPWY

Same here, I'm turning down distance travel left and right this yr because the banks/nationals do not want to pay what it costs to cover fuel and vehicle wear and tear.
I'm willing to travel if need be, but its got to pay. 

I'm running a business here, not a charity.


----------



## Guest

Same here. Cut territories we cover by nearly half....We told 2 companies (for grass cuts) that we will do "out of territory" if only there is over 75 gc's per zip code territory. We won't lose money this year since if I want to lose I'll stay home and mow my own yard and make the Mrs happy...


----------



## BPWY

Fremont when I was trucking my favorite saying was if I'm going to go broke hauling other folks freight for free, then I'm going to go broke sitting on MY COUCH drinking my beer.

In so many ways this business reminds me of trucking. Too many fingers in the pie and the guy doing the work getting screwed, too many chiefs with no clue what the heck is going on. etc etc


----------



## mtmtnman

This will fit just about every National out there. 










I had a good one today. Had a cleanup with waste oil jugs in 2 different locations in a carport. Took a semi-close up of the 2 areas with jugs lying on the ground to show the labels. These areas were 10' apart and each phot clearly showed both areas. Hauled all the jugs to the truck, took pic of said jugs in truck, went back to carport and shot 1 pic right into the doorway showing carport was E M P T Y. Had to go back and take 2 separate pics of the locations where the oil was to get paid even though from the overview pic is was damn obvious the oil was gone!!!!

For most of these nationals this is all they know.....


----------



## Guest

Hey Brickie,
How do I get into that yahoo group for PP? Thanks


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> Hey Brickie,
> How do I get into that yahoo group for PP? Thanks


 
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Same here, I'm turning down distance travel left and right this yr because the banks/nationals do not want to pay what it costs to cover fuel and vehicle wear and tear.
> I'm willing to travel if need be, but its got to pay.
> 
> I'm running a business here, not a charity.


 
Speaking of banks.....


Banks at risk of going bust tops 700

http://money.cnn.com/2010/02/23/news/companies/fdic_list/


----------



## BPWY

Brickie said:


> Speaking of banks.....
> 
> 
> Banks at risk of going bust tops 700
> 
> http://money.cnn.com/2010/02/23/news/companies/fdic_list/






The cost that the banks are paying by using nationals is staggering versus the old days of working with local brokers and agents and having them hire the best contractors.
I'd venture to say that they are paying at least half again as much now versus the previous way of doing it.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

a1propertyclean said:


> We are currently looking for *experienced* vendors in these counties in California:
> 
> *San Diego*
> *Imperial*
> *Santa Clara*
> *Oxnard *
> *Ventura*
> *Santa Barbara *
> *Los Angeles*
> *Shasta *
> *Nevada*
> *Alameda*
> *Contra Costa*
> *Solano*
> *Santa Cruz*
> *San Mateo *
> *Marin*
> *Sierra*
> *Placer*
> *Alpine*
> *Tulare*
> *Lake*
> *Colusa*
> 
> If anyone here has the *experience* and can produce *good, clear quality photos consistently*, please e-mail me at [email protected] and I'll reply with more detail about what we need to start the review process.
> 
> We're looking for qualified, professional, independent contractors, not employees. If you're just starting up a preservation business, we will consider you *ONLY* if you've already been working for another company actually doing the work and taking photos. We will be requesting proof of your quality of work.
> 
> You *MUST* be insured. No ifs, ands, or buts about it. General liability @ $2 million and, if you have employees, you'll need to provide proof of workmens comp coverage.
> 
> I have work in most of these counties right now and we just took on several new clients who are supposed to be sending us lots of work in California shortly.
> 
> Very important ~ so that I can locate what I'm looking for in a mail search, *PLEASE* give me a list of the counties you cover in your first contact, and your name, your company name, and a contact phone number in *EVERY* e-mail you send, not just the first one.
> 
> If you create an e-mail signature with all of your contact information, you won't have to type it every time and I won't have to try to figure out who you are by your first name.


Reposting 'cause you guys got busy and buried it! :w00t: :laughing:

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> The cost that the banks are paying by using nationals is staggering versus the old days of working with local brokers and agents and having them hire the best contractors.
> I'd venture to say that they are paying at least half again as much now versus the previous way of doing it.



That is no chit!! No damn reason the nationals need to take 25-30% for sitting on there arses pushing a piece of paper! What expense do they have? I buy the gas, materials, insurance and provide the labor. I do the uploads when i am done with the job. They send the photos to India for someone to pick them apart and cut us a check AFTER they get paid! Just asinine! I do work directly for some brokers here in the valley and am consistently cheaper than the nationals while still making a profit. I can barely make ends meet with the nationals.

Uncle Sugar is getting screwed too but that's nothing new. Here's an example of a repair under the deed for lease program. If you want to be part of this you have to work for the national with the contract. You have to have Plumbers, Electricians on call 24/7. Say a water heater blows at 3am. You get the call. Your plumber needs to be on site within an hour to assess the situation. Example follows:

Electric water heater 50 gallon $400
Emergency install, $300
You taking photos $100 (most plumbers won't deal with the photo BS)
Total price $800

If you work direct for the national who takes 28% off the top your invoice will need to reflect $1111.00 but as with most of this there are 2 layers of discounts to cover as most DO NOT work direct with this particular national but through a regional instead who also takes a discount usually around 25%. If this is the case, the invoice to uncle sugar is roughly double! It will have to be around $1480 - 28% for a national - 25% for a regional!! In the end were out there busting our arses, paying taxes to pay for this insanity!!!

Also don't get me started on Mold. I had a house LAST FEBRUARY that flooded. Bid for $10,000 to remove all the wet drywall from the lower level, add fans and heaters to dry the property. This would have resulted in around $6000 to me for a weeks work, heater rental and disposal fees. There was no mold YET. Guess what? fast forward to January 10. This house has sat a year now with nothing done to it. I mowed and did inspections all year on the property. The national kept wanting me to do internal inspections and after May i told them to piss off i was not entering the property. They seemed to be happy with the external inspections. My friend in the mold business says the home is now a total loss. $378,000 mortgage balance PLUS demo costs of around $30,000 if the bank goes through a national to demo minus the value of the lot at about $75,000 for a net loss to the bank of $333,000 rough numbers. It's no wonder the banks are going tits up.........................


----------



## BPWY

Today I was in 3 different houses for initial services. Lock change and winterize. 

The first one was over a yr vacant by the time I was sent out. 2nd one was nearing two yrs vacant, the third one was I have a feeling that it was near a yr vacant. 
All three have freeze broken plumbing to varying degrees.
Its insane that these banks let the properties sit so long to be vandalized and the plumbing freeze. 
The first one the bank is lucky that the house didn't burn down. When I opened the door the smell of propane was VERY strong. And the water heater was still lit. We had a light breeze this morning and I opened the front and back door to let the breeze blow thru. When I got done with my routine the smell of propane was still in the house.

The second house that was nearing two yrs vacant the water heater was also still lit.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Just a quick note about the counties I posted that we're looking for vendors in...........

To those who responded with an e-mail:

Not a single person has sent me back any of the items I requested of them. I can't work with anyone who's not on the ball. 

The typical turnaround time in this industry is 24 to 72 hours, with very few exceptions. At minimum, an acknowledgement that you received an order is expected, along with a scheduled date or refusal.

Seems as if no one is really interested in working, although many here are saying otherwise.

If you're slow to respond in this industry, you're going to lose out on a lot more opportunities.

The only way to continue getting work is to take care of the clients.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I wish some of that work was in my neck of the woods. I've had way too many days off since OCT!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Me, too, Paul. If you were in California, you'd be working.

I've got orders sitting here and I've got my vendors too busy to take them.

Too many people not taking this industry seriously, I'm afraid. I could tell you some stories!

Just out of curiosity, how many of you turn down vacancy checks or inspection requests because they only pay $15 to $35?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I don't understand where the work is. Like I mentioned in a previous post all 3 initial secures yesterday were properties that have been vacant in excess of 1 yr.
I'm signed with A LOT of companies, some the size of your company, some larger. I get a little work trickling in but not enough to stay busy.

If it wasn't for the need to build on what I've got I'd load up my truck and cruise out to CA and help you for a week or two. If I was to try that tho I'd end up getting one or two W/Os from my contacts and end up pissing off all of them and loosing what business I'm trying to build up.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Too many people not taking this industry seriously, I'm afraid. I could tell you some stories!
> 
> Just out of curiosity, how many of you turn down vacancy checks or inspection requests because they only pay $15 to $35?
> 
> Linda




I've seen some of the sad work other "professional contractors" have done. Its pathetic.


If inspections paid that good I'd do them. When they are $8, $9, $6 I cannot cover expenses in the very rural area I live in. FIS told me that I should be happy they are offering me $6 inspections. I told them thank you for the offer but I can go just as broke sitting in my Lazy Boy drinking beer as I can out paying the banks for the pleasure of doing their inspections.

Another company I work with gives me $25 to $35 for borrow interviews, up to $75 depending on circumstances. Detailed property inspections can pay $50, $75 to $125 depending on turn around time and the type of inspection they are asking for.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Our clients pay $35 per trip charge for occupancy checks and wasted trips [there are rules for what's considered a wasted trip, tho]. Very rarely will we accept anything lower than that.

The point I was actually getting at is that inspections are an opportunity to generate more work.

We've been doing a lot of occupancy checks lately and, when they're occupied, we get contact info. The agents can then offer CFK and, when the people move, we get the trashout work. If the people are evicted, we get the lockouts.

Basically, first vendor to the property will get any work that comes from that property. I have guys right now that all they did in the beginning was run around getting photos and contact info, resulting in a lot of trip fees. They are now doing all the lockouts and trashouts and making good money.

Those who refused to make the trips aren't getting much work. It all depends on whether or not you're willing to put the effort into building up to the bigger jobs. Some do, some don't. The ones who don't show any signs of moving quicker than a snail's pace are terminated and replaced by those who will stay on top.

The toughest states to find GOOD vendors in are California, Oregon, and Washington. I've got several that I rely on heavily and they're always there to pick up the slack. They are preferred vendors in our network. 

But I've been so disappointed in the laziness, lying, and cheating I've seen so far that, at times, it makes me wish I'd never opened my doors.

This industry can be as frustrating as it can be rewarding. Our vendors who don't perform can make or break us as a company and every day brings new insight into the way some people's minds work.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

> But I've been so disappointed in the laziness, lying, and cheating I've seen so far that, at times, it makes me wish I'd never opened my doors.




I can believe it. Just like trying to hire GOOD employees. They are hard to find too.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

You're absolutely right and I've hired my share of guys who were gung-ho, then got lazy or took advantage. 

In the summer, when we have longer hours of daylight, we pay overtime and double-time. After extensive training, we allow the crews to work unsupervised much of the time. Once, we caught a crew stopping off at the bars on the way back to the shop, thus padding their time cards. 

Termination was the best we could do. Can't get back any of the money we paid out when we didn't know.

Every time I think I have people figured out, someone throws me a curve ball.:w00t:

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> Our clients pay $35 per trip charge for occupancy checks and wasted trips [there are rules for what's considered a wasted trip, tho]. Very rarely will we accept anything lower than that.
> 
> The point I was actually getting at is that inspections are an opportunity to generate more work.
> 
> We've been doing a lot of occupancy checks lately and, when they're occupied, we get contact info. The agents can then offer CFK and, when the people move, we get the trashout work. If the people are evicted, we get the lockouts.
> 
> Basically, first vendor to the property will get any work that comes from that property. I have guys right now that all they did in the beginning was run around getting photos and contact info, resulting in a lot of trip fees. They are now doing all the lockouts and trashouts and making good money.
> 
> Those who refused to make the trips aren't getting much work. It all depends on whether or not you're willing to put the effort into building up to the bigger jobs. Some do, some don't. The ones who don't show any signs of moving quicker than a snail's pace are terminated and replaced by those who will stay on top.
> 
> The toughest states to find GOOD vendors in are California, Oregon, and Washington. I've got several that I rely on heavily and they're always there to pick up the slack. They are preferred vendors in our network.
> 
> But I've been so disappointed in the laziness, lying, and cheating I've seen so far that, at times, it makes me wish I'd never opened my doors.
> 
> This industry can be as frustrating as it can be rewarding. Our vendors who don't perform can make or break us as a company and every day brings new insight into the way some people's minds work.
> 
> Linda



Linda, Do you do any work in Montana? I have 2 crews besides myself that cover most of the western 1/3 of the state....


----------



## APlusPPGroup

We only had 1 property that we trashed out and maintained in Montana last year. I don't know if that's due to it being saturated by vendors or if it's because the state doesn't have as many foreclosures. 

It's also possible that the nationals have a monopoly there. We don't work with any of the nationals, only banks, agents, brokers, and FDIC. For that reason, we don't get as much work in some states as others but it means we can invoice at full rate.

You're more than welcome to send me an e-mail and let me know what counties you service. I can find out if my clients have properties in your areas.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Let's talk about dishonesty for a minute.

About a year ago, I happened to be checking search terms that are directing traffic to my website.

Lo and behold, someone had copied and pasted my website into their own. So I got on the ball and went to Copyscape and had it search the internet for similar issues. The free version only brought up 10 results so I paid for the full service and it located 20+ instances of plagiarism.

I wrote an article on plagiarism for CubicYard, who also published it at TheRepReport.

I don't know how many people were deterred from plagiarizing my website but I can tell you that, to date, my website has been plagiarized 50+ *MORE* times.

If peple can't get off their lazy arses and come up with original content, they don't deserve to be in business. Plagiarism is dishonest and carries criminal penalties.

I just had to send the e-mail below to someone who wants to be part of our network. While going through his e-mail 2 weeks ago, I clicked on the link to his website. When I found my website content in his, I asked him to remove it. He said he would do this immediately. Here it is, 7 days later and he has not done a single thing.

*Ray ~*

_*I checked your website, hoping to see that the plagiarism had been taken care of but it has not.*_

_*This issue not only disqualifies you as a vendor for us but I'm filing a complaint today, which may result in a fine or penalty and banishment of your website from the internet.*_

_*Sorry it has to come down to this but we only hire honest people and the integrity of your company is now in question.*_

_*Linda*_

Of all of the people I've asked to remove my content from their website, very few have done so. 

I'm tired of dealing with the "theft" and dishonesty I'm coming across in this industry and this will be the first of many claims I'm going to start filing. I've tried to be nice and simply warn people of the consequences but I don't feel that companies should get a free ride and am going to start being a little more aggressive.

I've attached a PDF of the article in case anyone wants to read it and learn how to find out if anyone's plagiarizing their site.

I'm soooooooooooo tempted to post a list of the offenders. But, with my luck, I'd probably get sued for breaching someone's privacy!:w00t:

Okay, end of rant. This one today just pushed me over the top and I had to vent. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Linda I would say that you have every right to be really pissed. For all the obvious reasons.

Some thing that I've seen on a few websites is that "copy and paste" isn't available. At times when I wanted some one to see some thing from another website I'll copy maybe a paragraph and include it with a link to the site. 
But I've run across sites that do not allow the copy function to work. I've always assumed that was something controlled from the admin of the site?????????????? 
But I don't really know. I'm not that tech savy. Browsing forums and emailing photos is about as advanced as I get.

Currently I don't have a website so I don't have to worry about this sort of thing yet.


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> You're absolutely right and I've hired my share of guys who were gung-ho, then got lazy or took advantage.
> 
> In the summer, when we have longer hours of daylight, we pay overtime and double-time. After extensive training, we allow the crews to work unsupervised much of the time.


 
Unfortunately, that's not that uncommon. As one grows their business, you can't be in three or more places at the same time. Thru trial & error, I have discovered that the solution for me is not have crews unsupervised. Having a good lead, foreman/woman, supervisor or whatever you want to call the position is key. Unsupervised crews will stretch things out & cost you a bunch of money.


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## Guest

On the dishonesty line, I had a crew out today to do a 2nd bid to remove 12 55 gal drums full of an "unknown chemical" When they got there, they were able to figure out what the chemicals were: oxygen, nitrogen, and some good old Salt Lake City Smog. Bone dry all of them, gotta love it.


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## Guest

uintahiker said:


> On the dishonesty line, I had a crew out today to do a 2nd bid to remove 12 55 gal drums full of an "unknown chemical" When they got there, they were able to figure out what the chemicals were: oxygen, nitrogen, and some good old Salt Lake City Smog. Bone dry all of them, gotta love it.


Be careful with that.....In January we had to bid an "empty" 55ga barrell (2 of them) to remove and we thought "ok someone is playing games" so we bid it "reasonable" to remove. We never got the approval till February and someone had removed and then placed them on a different part of the property so we knew something was up.....We called one of the chemical disposal companies (Safetykleen) and lowandbehold it was some empty 55 ga drums that HAD a commercial cleaner/detergent in it and you can't just dispose of them at the landfill since the residuals inside the container (it was dry) and we had to have the chemical disposal company get an EPA number just to pick it up...well the valid 30 day bid period was over and we had to rebid it luckily, the permits for the removal and the EPA number registration cost $760. Man was we happy the bid was no longer valid! 
Never ever assume that you can just throw out an empty 55 ga drum just because theres nothing in it! OR don't get caught!:w00t:


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## Guest

I'll have to check on them. They had contained polyurathane, thanks for the heads up. :thumbup: I am guessing the first contractor just gets stuck with removing them at cost. Bids being good for 30 days would be great. I have had several times when the company sending me work pulls up bids from months ago and has me do the work.


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## brm1109

*30 day bids*

One time I did a bid for a house that had been vacant for over a year with debris in it but there was also mold in the house. When I did the bid, I put in writing that it was good for 7 days and it went up after that because of the condition of the house. Funny every 10 days or so they called me for a new bid. Finally after 4 months they asked why the bid went up so much and what about the original bid. I didn't get the bid but feel sorry for whoever got that bid at the standard rate.
It doesn't matter if it is a large company or private customer, I always put in writing that the quoted price is only good for 7 days.


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Never ever assume that you can just throw out an empty 55 ga drum just because theres nothing in it! OR don't get caught!:w00t:






Just take it home and burn some trash in it. Then dispose of it as a burn barrel. :thumbsup:

lol


This of course is assuming you didn't get caught. :laughing:


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## APlusPPGroup

A couple years ago, a vendor from another company submitted a bid to remove 5-55 gallon drums of oil.

We were asked to submit a 2nd bid. The drums turned out to be rain water and ONLY rain water. The former occupants preferred rain water over tap water for cooking, washing their hair, etc.

Either the other vendor never checked the contents of the barrels out or they outright lied. Rain water can be dumped on the ground and the empty barrels hauled off at a minimal cost. That would have been a pretty good profit had they gotten the order.

Why do people feel they have to cheat? Don't they know they're not the only vendors in the area and that companies will often get 2nd bids and they'll eventually get caught? 

If you don't think the nationals will test you this way, think again. Sending another vendor out for a 2nd bid is a good way to find out whether the first vendor's honest or not. We see it happen all the time.


Linda


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## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> A couple years ago, a vendor from another company submitted a bid to remove 5-55 gallon drums of oil.
> 
> We were asked to submit a 2nd bid. The drums turned out to be rain water and ONLY rain water. The former occupants preferred rain water over tap water for cooking, washing their hair, etc.
> 
> Either the other vendor never checked the contents of the barrels out or they outright lied. Rain water can be dumped on the ground and the empty barrels hauled off at a minimal cost. That would have been a pretty good profit had they gotten the order.
> 
> Why do people feel they have to cheat? Don't they know they're not the only vendors in the area and that companies will often get 2nd bids and they'll eventually get caught?
> 
> If you don't think the nationals will test you this way, think again. Sending another vendor out for a 2nd bid is a good way to find out whether the first vendor's honest or not. We see it happen all the time.
> 
> 
> Linda



Talk about 2nd bid, one particular national has to have all 2nd bids on company letterhead now. No reason given and i have no clue myself......


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## BPWY

I get sent on a LOT of 2nd bids for items that are no longer at the property. Items that its obvious have been gone a while in some cases.

I'm convinced that instead of having a QC person on the payroll the nationals figure its cheaper to pay a 2nd bid trip charge to verify QC of clean up etc.


Speaking of oil drums. In 09 I was doing the grass cut on a property that had a 55 gallon used oil drum on it. It was right under the eve of the garage and when it would rain it would run into the barrel and push oil out onto the ground.
The house was for sale and the agent asked the national to get me to remove it. Because she knew that I would get it done right. The national was real snooty with her and told her they would do what they wanted to do, regardless of what she wanted.

Eventually the oil drum disappears. But in its place is the evidence thats pictured here.
What conclusion would you make???????????? I know the one that I made and the city ended up investigating.


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## BPWY

last one


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Talk about 2nd bid, one particular national has to have all 2nd bids on company letterhead now. No reason given and i have no clue myself......





I thought I read some where that is some thing HUD wants.


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## APlusPPGroup

They probably want to make sure you're legitimate.

Providing bids and estimates on company letterhead or invoices with logos is a good thing anyway. It makes you look a lot more professional to the client.

I still get invoices from my vendors in excel with no company name or logo on them. I might know who they are but my girls wouldn't know. So logos are a good way of identifying yourself and the more clients see your logo, the more you stand out.

You don't have to hire a graphic artist or go to a print shop to create a logo for your business. There are plenty of free online sites where you can create one and save it to your computer to be used over and over again.

I uploaded some I created for my businesses. The sites I used are http://cooltext.com and http://bannerfans.com. Both sites are free to use and it's really easy to create nice looking logos.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Those are impressive photos, Paul. What was the result of the investigation?

Linda


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## BPWY

Thanks. I was never told. I wish I knew.


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## Guest

I gotta another horror story. Bid a trashout on a "junk home" and the hallway was stacked 10' high and about 20' long with medical supplies/fluids and prescriptions..never seen anything like it so I call the landfill to make sure they could take this stuff and they said no way. So we called the listed supplier on the boxes and they said a hazardous removal company would have to come get it. Before I got the bid in the service company calls and said the realtor was going to do the trashout...4 days later I spoke with the realtor and he wanted to know what to do with all these medical things and I told him "I have no clue" and do your homework... 3 days later the City had to shut their water purification plant down and clean all their filtering systems for an "unknown" high contaminates that showed up. Realtor got caught dumping all the stuff down the toilets and sinks when one of his "helpers" made a comment at the local tavern about him dumping all the stuff down the drains....wonder what it cost the realtor?


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> ....wonder what it cost the realtor?


 
Hopefully his license, all the costs of the city clean up + a nice 6 figure fine:thumbsup:


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## Guest

Sucks to be the agent. It is too bad when someone is too smart for their own good. I have an agent who used to send me quite abit of business until I turned in a legit bid for cleanup of hazards on a property and it was about 3 times the one he got from "some guy" he knew. Don't know if anything happened to them but it is good to know sometimes they get theirs... 
I wish their was a way of cleaning out the liars. We did a 2nd bid today to remove mold from the window in a garage, cap the icemaker line, and remove exterior debris. Got there and the garage didn't even have a window, there was no ice maker line and there was about enough litter in the yard to fill a grocery bag.


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## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> Sucks to be the agent. It is too bad when someone is too smart for their own good. I have an agent who used to send me quite abit of business until I turned in a legit bid for cleanup of hazards on a property and it was about 3 times the one he got from "some guy" he knew. Don't know if anything happened to them but it is good to know sometimes they get theirs...
> I wish their was a way of cleaning out the liars. We did a 2nd bid today to remove mold from the window in a garage, cap the icemaker line, and remove exterior debris. Got there and the garage didn't even have a window, there was no ice maker line and there was about enough litter in the yard to fill a grocery bag.



I got 5 second exterior bids today. None of them had any debris. The nationals are using us to QC other vendors.......


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## Guest

We recently signed with altisource and went through all of the paperwork. It seems legit so far. We just got our first two work orders for occupancy checks today. We'll let you know how it goes. 

We're new to this industry... been general contractors for a long time but with the downturn in the economy last year are looking to add another revenue stream. Hope it works out! 

Been reading this whole thread to get a preview and it sounds like it might be worthwhile. 

Anyone know what the regs are for doing a lock change on a vacant property that has no access (all doors locked so you cant get in)?

~Michelle


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## Guest

As long as you have a work order you can do what is needed to get it, that usually means drilling out the lock. Theoretically, you won't have any problems from law enforcement as long as you have your work order.
I had a local law enforcement officer get pretty pushy with one of my guys the other day even after he was shown the work order. He had to call his superior before he finally believed it was legit for us to be destroying the front lock. 
A drill and a lock pick gun work wonders.


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## Guest

Good luck Michelle! As far as gaining access, always look for an unlocked window (it's a lot easier than drilling locks). If you must go at a locked door, find a door with only a knob (no deadbolt) and you can slip a credit card or drivers license in where the striker plate is. Try this on your door at home a few times to get a good feel for it. Keep in mind every door is different and sometimes you will have to drill or destroy the knob.


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## Guest

kileconstructio said:


> We recently signed with altisource and went through all of the paperwork. It seems legit so far. We just got our first two work orders for occupancy checks today. We'll let you know how it goes.
> 
> We're new to this industry... been general contractors for a long time but with the downturn in the economy last year are looking to add another revenue stream. Hope it works out!
> 
> Been reading this whole thread to get a preview and it sounds like it might be worthwhile.
> 
> Anyone know what the regs are for doing a lock change on a vacant property that has no access (all doors locked so you cant get in)?
> 
> ~Michelle


Word of advise since the loan type is not known on our end 

This business is lola land compared to being a general contractor and just remember "nothing is as it seems and trust no one" and you will go far. 

Talk to your lawyer and learn your redemption laws before busting in. YOU can be held responsible for entering a property "to early" (its called trespassing) and its "real easy" for the prior homeowner to claim that "grandmas 10,000 necklace is missing" and you can't prove otherwise. Comment after your post reads "you have a work order that gives permission" and that means you can enter--will from personal experience that work order means nothing to the lawyers/courts and the service company will say "it is YOUR responsibility" per the contract you signed to know your regulations and yada yada yada..

Oh yeah you can win the lawsuit but the price of defense is still carried by you...
My 2cents worth....:thumbsup:


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## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> Good luck Michelle! As far as gaining access, always look for an unlocked window (it's a lot easier than drilling locks). If you must go at a locked door, find a door with only a knob (no deadbolt) and you can slip a credit card or drivers license in where the striker plate is. Try this on your door at home a few times to get a good feel for it. Keep in mind every door is different and sometimes you will have to drill or destroy the knob.


for us "old timers" use a "realtors key" if all else fails! :clap:
p.s. don't ask


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Word of advise since the loan type is not known on our end
> 
> This business is lola land compared to being a general contractor and just remember "nothing is as it seems and trust no one" and you will go far.
> 
> Talk to your lawyer and learn your redemption laws before busting in. YOU can be held responsible for entering a property "to early" (its called trespassing) and its "real easy" for the prior homeowner to claim that "grandmas 10,000 necklace is missing" and you can't prove otherwise. Comment after your post reads "you have a work order that gives permission" and that means you can enter--will from personal experience that work order means nothing to the lawyers/courts and the service company will say "it is YOUR responsibility" per the contract you signed to know your regulations and yada yada yada..
> 
> Oh yeah you can win the lawsuit but the price of defense is still carried by you...
> My 2cents worth....:thumbsup:





Its insane for the nationals to throw the blame back on the contractor for "entering to early". If they send out a W/O how are we supposed to know that the legal process isn't at the correct place for initial securing and winterizing to take place? How do they suggest we go about finding this info?


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Its insane for the nationals to throw the blame back on the contractor for "entering to early". If they send out a W/O how are we supposed to know that the legal process isn't at the correct place for initial securing and winterizing to take place? How do they suggest we go about finding this info?



Also if you don't do the work the nationals have a hissey fit and pull the rest of your work. Now your without income........


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## oteroproperties

With the law, I think it depends on the way the work order is worded. My orders always say proceed if vacant and clearly abandoned. Lock secondary door when ever possible (this is very seldom). Someone pointed out we are not in posession of the information needed to determine what stage of the legal game they are in. This is what has kept me from getting in trouble the numerous times we have been confronted by police.

I had a run in with the them at a property that suffice it to say was a health hazard in and of it self. This property had overgrown grass 4ft high and there was a 40 ft tree that had fallen into the back of the house and started to grow in. The front gate was padlocked so we cut it (thinking it was clearly vacant for a while) oddly the water and power were on. We picked the lock and tried to open the door but the couch was pushed up against it and **** was piled everywhere. We couldn't get in so we went to a window that was boarded and unscrewed it. We got in and clearly someone had recently been there (current newspapers). I walked out of the property and the owner pulled up. We explained who we were and he called the police. We were there for 2 hrs. 6 cops, 2 of which were detectives asked me and my 2 crew memebers questions seperatley. None of us have any previous records so that was helpful, but it took forever to clear it up. Turns out the lady that owned to house died, the son took over and had been cashing her checks, not paying the mortgage and using here bank account. Code enforcement was mysteriously called out there shortly after and deemed the property unfit for human habitation.

With all the indicators at this property anyone would have said this house was vacant and proceeded with the order. The police saw that and ultimately let us go. 

It doesn't always go that well though, I recently got a call from the sheriffs office stating that a house we secured was missing items. I was not personally at that property but my brothers were so I wasn't worried. The items???? are you ready for this?....... A tv, a printer, and a bird. Who the hell would steal a bird? The detective working the case came to our office and saw that we were not some flyby night company and lightened up a bit. Here's the kicker, as I stated before I video all my initial securing and this one was no exception. I didn't know it at the time but the neighbor was outside at the time my guys arrived. We asked him how long the property had been vacant, he said they were gone for at least 2 months and that he is retired and never leaves (this property was a town home and he was the next door over). Who would know better then him? Well when the police interviewed him he denied ever talking to us. When I showed the officer the video I was as suprised as he was that he would lie like that. I don't know what the plan was there, but it was quickly shut down by good documentation. Police will always be a factor when doing presale work orders because the bank doesn't own the property yet, but I carry around my own mortage that clearly shows that the servicer has a legal right to gain access and secure the property to remedy, or prevent any further damages if the property is in ANY form of default.


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## Guest

I would like to apoligize for the negatism that I tend to convey in my posts. In actuality this business has been a blessing for myself and my family over the last nearly 14 years. It has allowed us to pay off the house, be debt free, take vacations, help put 2 kids through college and put a little money in savings. This business used to be fun and when the idiots in charge in DC and the service companies get their heads out of the sand the fun "may" return. This business as any other comes with a lot of risks but with the risk comes rewards. Unfortunately we all play poker at a table where everyone else but us can see the cards and the deck is stacked against the contractor. I saw a study from NAMFS a few years ago that basically stated that "newbies" have a lifespan of 6.1 months in this business. I see these posts from contractors wanting into this field and how do they actually find out what the risks are? The service companies don't mention all the chargebacks, the lawsuits, the local codes/laws/ordinances and how can a newbie know what to ask? This forum gives a lot of good and bad advise but the idea is to make the newbie "search" for the truth. Know your laws (get an attorney), know the local ordinances, Get your lead RRP Certification since this will affect us contractors if you do any window replacements/reglazing, know your abandoned property laws that extend "beyond" the eviction time frame for up to 6 months, be properly licensed for your State, purchase the best insurance money can buy (not from your local insurance agent who also does not understand this business) and first and foremost hire 1 person to do nothing but document ALL your actions and keep a log of what did and did not happen on each and every case. Osteroproperties has really got me thinking about the video idea--I absolutely hate the thought of having to do this but I can see that this could limit some liabilities to the contractor and thats what these posts should make all of us do ---THINK.


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## Guest

*Thanks to you all...*

View attachment 29382
Well, after today... and our first occupancy check, I have to say I've gained a new respect for this business! As well as all of you!

We found the first property and it had a 3 day eviction notice pasted to the front door dated 2/09/10 with the buyers name on it so we knew we had the right place. It's a very remote and rural area with no house number or mailbox, and it was definitely vacant. 

OH Man.... I never knew people could live in such squaller! I was completely grossed out! They had taken every appliance out of the house, including the wood stove, which was apparently the only source of heat in the house. But on the outside I counted more than 7 dead appliances laying around. Refrigerators, freezers, dishwashers, cooktop, washing machine. Some in the outbuilding were full of food and one was a deep freeze full of rotten meat. UHGGGG! There were tires and wheels, a dead snowmobile, motor cycle, bicycles, and tons, and tons of just plain garbage both inside and out. Including an overflowing garbage can full of empty beer bottles! 

Anyways, what a day, and I don't think anything could have prepared me for this type of thing. We got through it though. I took so many pics my digital camera memory was filled and I still didn't get everything. I attached a few so you can see (if you dare! lol) Next trip out we are going to take the video camera. 

Sure hope the next one is at least 1/2 way decent!

Michelle


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## Guest

*time/datestamp...*



mtmtnman said:


> I can time/datestamp, resize & pdf 250 pics in less than 3 minutes. Great program...............



I downloaded this program, but I don't see where the time/date stamp is... 

I have a time/date on the pics on my camera(you can see them in the pics preview on the camera) but when I downloaded them to the computer its not there. Anyone have a suggestion?

Thanks in advance,
Michelle


----------



## mtmtnman

kileconstructio said:


> I downloaded this program, but I don't see where the time/date stamp is...
> 
> I have a time/date on the pics on my camera(you can see them in the pics preview on the camera) but when I downloaded them to the computer its not there. Anyone have a suggestion?
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> Michelle



Go to advanced option, then text in Fastone. You can type your datestamp in or us *($H1)* and the program will pull the hex data from your pics and add them to the photos.


----------



## BPWY

kileconstructio said:


> Well, after today... and our first occupancy check, I have to say I've gained a new respect for this business! As well as all of you!
> 
> We found the first property and it had a 3 day eviction notice pasted to the front door dated 2/09/10 with the buyers name on it so we knew we had the right place. It's a very remote and rural area with no house number or mailbox, and it was definitely vacant.
> 
> OH Man.... I never knew people could live in such squaller! I was completely grossed out! They had taken every appliance out of the house, including the wood stove, which was apparently the only source of heat in the house. But on the outside I counted more than 7 dead appliances laying around. Refrigerators, freezers, dishwashers, cooktop, washing machine. Some in the outbuilding were full of food and one was a deep freeze full of rotten meat. UHGGGG! There were tires and wheels, a dead snowmobile, motor cycle, bicycles, and tons, and tons of just plain garbage both inside and out. Including an overflowing garbage can full of empty beer bottles!
> 
> Anyways, what a day, and I don't think anything could have prepared me for this type of thing. We got through it though. I took so many pics my digital camera memory was filled and I still didn't get everything. I attached a few so you can see (if you dare! lol) Next trip out we are going to take the video camera.
> 
> Sure hope the next one is at least 1/2 way decent!
> 
> Michelle





Sounds like you found a good one to break the ice. Once you've been in the biz long enough you'll think you've seen it all....... you haven't. You'll find one that just blows your mind again.


----------



## Guest

*Thanks!*



mtmtnman said:


> Go to advanced option, then text in Fastone. You can type your datestamp in or us *($H1)* and the program will pull the hex data from your pics and add them to the photos.


Thank you! It works great. I'm so glad I found this forum. You're all fantastic! :clap:

Michelle


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## Guest

Michelle, just wait until you get your first "cat lady" house. We had one where the "cat lady" passed away. Her family must have come to get the cats but nothing else. One bedroom was dedicated to litter boxes (lined the perimeter of the room) that were all full. And the remaining open area of the room was 6" deep with cat feces. The basement was also a dumping ground after the room was full. There was also a deep freezer in the garage that was 1/2 full of meat products.....of course the power had not been active in a while.

Just helping you get prepared for the worse!:thumbsup:

On a side note I think I may start taking a video walkthrough starting at the time I gain access on my future initial secures. I have been lucky so far but that day is soon to come where someone says something is missing. It has happened back when I was doing work with Countrywide. Someone said I took a statue of a German Sheppard. There never was a statue and Countrywide went through the photos and told the P.O.'s they did not see any statue. Never heard any more about it.


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## Guest

Thats a tame one

Eat on this stove:laughing:


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## Guest

Need some advice on meth. I had a guy go to a house for an initial conveyance inspection. We turned it in with the basic stuff that needed cleaned up. 

In between then and when they sent us back to clean the property I attended a class on identifying meth in houses. When we went to clean the house I had a guy who lived near the house come over to help. He brought his daughter who told us she knew of kids in high school who were buying meth from the prior owner. The house also had all the smoke detectors removed, which is another sign of somebody cooking meth. 

When I called the service company and told them about what I had discovered they told me since there wasn't an active lab when I arrived there was nothing we needed to worry about, especially since we have already turned in our inspection results. I am pretty sure the house is contaminated but they are saying I can't turn it in for actual testing because test results may come back negative and it will have wasted the clients money (since they never waste money on anything else, like service companys). I am pretty sure since meth remediation crews wear hazmat suits to clean the residue it would be a hazard HUD would want to know about. 
Any advice or reccomendations? For now or future properties. 

One guy reccomended taking spray starch into houses. If it is sprayed on the walls and turns purple then there is meth residue there.

On a different note, otero, do you have a dedicated video person on each crew or do you use some sort of "clip on" video camera on each crew member? Or something else?


----------



## Guest

^Very good questions. I would like to know the answers to these myself.


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## BPWY

The gooberment programs are proving to be a disaster and create wide spread confusion.
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...banks-underwater-spurning-loan-program-rules/


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## Guest

uintahiker said:


> Need some advice on meth. I had a guy go to a house for an initial conveyance inspection. We turned it in with the basic stuff that needed cleaned up.
> 
> In between then and when they sent us back to clean the property I attended a class on identifying meth in houses. When we went to clean the house I had a guy who lived near the house come over to help. He brought his daughter who told us she knew of kids in high school who were buying meth from the prior owner. The house also had all the smoke detectors removed, which is another sign of somebody cooking meth.
> 
> When I called the service company and told them about what I had discovered they told me since there wasn't an active lab when I arrived there was nothing we needed to worry about, especially since we have already turned in our inspection results. I am pretty sure the house is contaminated but they are saying I can't turn it in for actual testing because test results may come back negative and it will have wasted the clients money (since they never waste money on anything else, like service companys). I am pretty sure since meth remediation crews wear hazmat suits to clean the residue it would be a hazard HUD would want to know about.
> Any advice or reccomendations? For now or future properties.
> 
> One guy reccomended taking spray starch into houses. If it is sprayed on the walls and turns purple then there is meth residue there.
> 
> On a different note, otero, do you have a dedicated video person on each crew or do you use some sort of "clip on" video camera on each crew member? Or something else?


 
Don't know your location but you can call your State Dept of Natural Resources or the local Sheriffs office and they can direct you to a person in your area that tests for meth...remember its YOUR health. Most States that we do remediation the testing will cost $2500+/- and all porous materials that absorb meth fumes has to be removed (carpets, walls, clothing, furniture etc etc). This does have a lasting health effect so just be very careful. With that being said how many homes do we all go into that we don't know the history and may or may not have been meth homes? What would be a another concern is if you reported to a service company that there was a meth lab you now have a liability if its sold with nothing done so I'd write a letter absolving you that "you duly reported the meth problem and the service company did nothing to remediate the problem". This can be very very expensive to remediate and if I purchased a home and found out there was meth and found out the health effects to my family and the service company was told of the problem I'd be seeing my lawyer asap and I think most of us would..... Each State has different rules but most are very strict on this and rightfully so....
Good luck


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Don't know your location but you can call your State Dept of Natural Resources or the local Sheriffs office and they can direct you to a person in your area that tests for meth...remember its YOUR health. Most States that we do remediation the testing will cost $2500+/- and all porous materials that absorb meth fumes has to be removed (carpets, walls, clothing, furniture etc etc). This does have a lasting health effect so just be very careful. With that being said how many homes do we all go into that we don't know the history and may or may not have been meth homes? What would be a another concern is if you reported to a service company that there was a meth lab you now have a liability if its sold with nothing done so I'd write a letter absolving you that "you duly reported the meth problem and the service company did nothing to remediate the problem". This can be very very expensive to remediate and if I purchased a home and found out there was meth and found out the health effects to my family and the service company was told of the problem I'd be seeing my lawyer asap and I think most of us would..... Each State has different rules but most are very strict on this and rightfully so....
> Good luck




I wouldn't be above sending that letter with the loan # and property address to the bank either. Sending it to the national at this point will only get it ignored at that level. They ignored the phone call, I doubt they'll pay attention to a letter.
I'm so sick of the nationals not doing their jobs right. I know there are a lot of half assed contractors but the nationals are making all the money and doing a half assed job too.


I like this comment.


> and it will have wasted the clients money (since they never waste money on anything else, like service companys)


If the banks only knew how much the nationals were screwing them.


----------



## BPWY

I hate scammers.



> A real-estate scam is causing frustrations for local home sellers and renters.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I hate scammers.


Me, too. 



Linda


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I hate scammers.


 
This must be happening all over...In December we were at a very upscale neighborhood in Iowa City (University of Iowa and the UofI Medical School) doing some general recleaning work when up pulled 2 United Van Lines Semi's and up walked the driver asking if this was the correct address (it was) and they asked us to move our truck so they could back in and start unloading...."we asked unload what?" and if was a complete household for a Doctor from Florida that was going back for a surgery residency and he had rented the home off the internet....We called the bank and they said "he what?" and all he** broke loose:w00t: The Doc pulled up about 15 minutes later in his Mercedes with wife and 3 little kids and boy was he shocked to learn that he wasn't moving in.....:whistling He tried calling the lady who rented him the home and of course the phone had been disconnected. I really felt sorry for him since as with all college towns there isn't a lot of "family" housing around especially for "upscale" housing where he was going to be for a couple/few years.
I don't know what ever happened to him but I sure hope I never need his services since he was in shock and was just starting to get pis***. $7500 deposit with 1st months rent.....


----------



## BPWY

> $7500 deposit with 1st months rent.



Oh man that would hurt.


----------



## BPWY

Well this is a huge work in progress. I didn't have much of any thing to do today, so I spent pretty much the entire day working on it. (this sort of thing is not my strong suit) Good thing I got it "finished" for now. I got 9 initial secures to do today. As is the case with the rural nature where I live they are spread out a lot.








And NO LINDA, I DIDN'T COPY *ANY* of your site. :laughing: Or any body else's.


----------



## Guest

Looks nice but to me its kinda hard to read the business text since it appears dark against a dark background? BUT hey I just looked at 2000+ pics and 6 hours of computer work so I'm kinda blind:whistling Otherwise looked very good.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Looks nice but to me its kinda hard to read the business text since it appears dark against a dark background? BUT hey I just looked at 2000+ pics and 6 hours of computer work so I'm kinda blind:whistling Otherwise looked very good.





On my end the back ground is a light grey. With dark red text.


----------



## Guest

I figured it probably didn't come through on the attachment right. Anyhow it does look nice and patriotic. :clap:


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I figured it probably didn't come through on the attachment right. Anyhow it does look nice and patriotic. :clap:




Click on the banner, that'll take you to what took me all day. The banner was easy, couple minute job tops.


I have another banner with white text. I see what you mean about the black text on the banner.


----------



## Guest

IMO the white banner looks very good. But these old eyes don't see as well anymore...


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> And NO LINDA, I DIDN'T COPY *ANY* of your site. :laughing: Or any body else's.


 :laughing:

The banner looks good but you might want to lighten the text more so that it stands out from the red stripe at the bottom of the flag. :thumbup:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> :laughing:
> 
> The banner looks good but you might want to lighten the text more so that it stands out from the red stripe at the bottom of the flag. :thumbup:
> 
> Linda





Did you click on the banner? Thats what I was referring to. 

I have the banner saved in white.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> :laughing:
> 
> The banner looks good but you might want to lighten the text more so that it stands out from the red stripe at the bottom of the flag. :thumbup:
> 
> Linda


thank you!!!
But...are you talking about my twitter page? Im sorry i'm working on so many adveristments i'm not sure which one youre talking about


----------



## Guest

EUGENIA said:


> thank you!!!
> But...are you talking about my twitter page? Im sorry i'm working on so many adveristments i'm not sure which one youre talking about


 
No, they are referring to BPWY's new logo. 

It looks really good. I would like to see white lettering also.


----------



## BPWY

The logo wasn't the main point.


CLICK ON THE BANNER, THERE IS A LINK THERE. 

http://hstrial-brickmanprope.intuitwebsites.com/index.html


----------



## Guest

EUGENIA said:


> thank you!!!
> But...are you talking about my twitter page? Im sorry i'm working on so many adveristments i'm not sure which one youre talking about


No the CL advertisement :w00t::clap:
Sorry couldn't help myself!!!!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> The logo wasn't the main point.
> 
> 
> CLICK ON THE BANNER, THERE IS A LINK THERE.
> 
> http://hstrial-brickmanprope.intuitwebsites.com/index.html


My computer just gets hung up each time I've tried to look at it. I've tried on my personal computer, too with the same result.

Anyone else having the same issue?

Linda


----------



## Guest

BPWY-The site looks very good. Very clean and simple, I like it a lot. I was just going to copy and paste Linda's website, but now I think I'll use yours instead. :whistling I kid. See it does give me some ideas for my website. I promise I won't steal anyone's work.:no: 


Linda-It works fine for me and my 'puter is ssssslow. Try to right click and copy shortcut and paste in the addy bar. I've had to do this lately.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

C.M.J. said:


> BPWY-The site looks very good. Very clean and simple, I like it a lot. I was just going to copy and paste Linda's website, but now I think I'll use yours instead. :whistling I kid. See it does give me some ideas for my website. I promise I won't steal anyone's work.:no:
> 
> 
> Linda-It works fine for me and my 'puter is ssssslow. Try to right click and copy shortcut and paste in the addy bar. I've had to do this lately.


Thanks for the humor, CMJ. Some days I need a smile and today is one of those.

I tried as you suggested with no luck. Unfortunately, Windows 7 is like an overprotective parent. I have feeling I'm being blocked.

Anyone else have designs they want to post? I'd love to see how creative everyone is.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I have a HUd PTC [prepare to convey] order in Richland County [Sidney], Montana, and I don't have a vendor there yet. Anyone in Richland County or in North Dakota that's close enough to handle this one for me? 

I have another order in Glacier County [Cut Bank], Montana, for securing and winterization and also need a vendor in that area.

With experience, of course.

If so, let me know right away. I need to send the orders out tonight for service tomorrow.

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I have a HUd PTC [prepare to convey] order in Richland County [Sidney], Montana, and I don't have a vendor there yet. Anyone in Richland County or in North Dakota that's close enough to handle this one for me?
> 
> I have another order in Glacier County [Cut Bank], Montana, for securing and winterization and also need a vendor in that area.
> 
> With experience, of course.
> 
> If so, let me know right away. I need to send the orders out tonight for service tomorrow.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Linda


wheres MTMTNMAN? :notworthy


----------



## Guest

^+1. He should be all over this like a cheap suit!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> wheres MTMTNMAN? :notworthy


These 2 are out of his area. I have other orders for him.:thumbup:

It's nice to see you guys looking out for each other. Very cool.

BTW. Anyone service South San Diego near the border in Boulevard? I have a lockout on the 8th and my vendor may not be able to make that date due to a conflicting appointment.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Im looking to be a fannie mae contractor*

does any one have any advice on how to get in with fannie mae? they dont respond to emails, there is no phone number and I submitted my info a couple months ago. Can anyone help?!?!?!

Thank you


----------



## Guest

Charlescline said:


> does any one have any advice on how to get in with fannie mae? they dont respond to emails, there is no phone number and I submitted my info a couple months ago. Can anyone help?!?!?!
> 
> Thank you


As a preferred vendor (Sams vendor)? Submit your info and wait 12 months and you may hear from them. Took us 3 years. Good luck since to us it was worth the wait. Of course if you are looking to just do the regular cleanouts and such winterizes then you need to find the servicing company for that and that depends on where you live.


----------



## Guest

Any advice on people to get ahold of? Any insurances that they require other than general liability and workers comp?


----------



## Guest

Charlescline said:


> does any one have any advice on how to get in with fannie mae? they dont respond to emails, there is no phone number and I submitted my info a couple months ago. Can anyone help?!?!?!
> 
> Thank you


 KEEP TRYING 

*REO*
For questions regarding *REO registrations only*, contact:
[email protected]

HOPE THIS HELPS


----------



## Guest

I have tried that email 3 times and got one form letter response that didn't answer any of my questions. Other than that they have never responded to my emails. I wish they had a phone that they would answer. In my county there are only two approved vendors, and from what the realtors I know tell me, they are VERY expensive an non-responsive


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> My computer just gets hung up each time I've tried to look at it. I've tried on my personal computer, too with the same result.
> 
> Anyone else having the same issue?
> 
> Linda




I like this link better. :clap: :clap:

http://www.brickmanpropertyservices.com

Try it and see if it still hangs. Costs extra to have a useable site name instead of the Intuit default one that I had at first.


----------



## Guest

I have been reading these posts, and gathering information as best I can in regard to this industry. Everything I've been able to glean from my endeavors, indicates that it is best I begin sub-contracting for a more experienced entity, than simply attempting to do this on my own. I live in Texas, near Houston, and was curious if anyone knows of any firms who offer ppv services, that recruit sub-contractor teams?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I like this link better. :clap: :clap:
> 
> http://www.brickmanpropertyservices.com
> 
> Try it and see if it still hangs. Costs extra to have a useable site name instead of the Intuit default one that I had at first.


Perfect!!! That link brought it up so fast it made my head spin! :lol:

Good job, Paul. That banner looks way better.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

thank you


Since I didn't copy your website wheres my reward? (work orders)


----------



## BPWY

test


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> thank you
> 
> 
> Since I didn't copy your website wheres my reward? (work orders)


 
Here you go. :drink:

I'm ready for one, too, after the week I've had so I'll join you. In fact, make it a double.:drink::drink:

:laughing:

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> test


Well, you passed. I suppose you want another reward? :tt2:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:



> Here you go. :drink:
> 
> I'm ready for one, too, after the week I've had so I'll join you. In fact, make it a double.:drink::drink:
> 
> :laughing:
> 
> Linda





In the absence of work ............. we drink.

Sounds like a plan to me. :clap:


----------



## BPWY

So Linda I say we have a P&P/Contractor Talk get together in Vegas some time this fall. 

Sound good?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> So Linda I say we have a P&P/Contractor Talk get together in Vegas some time this fall.
> 
> Sound good?


.

Let's do it. Everyone can order locks from US Hardware and pick them up while we're there so the trip can be expensed.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*secrets*

for all of you new contractors looking to get into the field, nationals are a good way to go! stay away from the middlemen and middle women, they tell you they take anywhere from a 5 to 30 percent discount-funny! they actually take anywhere from 50 to 75 percent discount, do a little reasearch,see what h.u.d allowables are, that is about what most of them really get! then they will try to tell you ,that the bank has not paid them ,so they cannot pay you,funny again! you work for them its there job to pay you, and there job to collect there money from the bank, remember-they are making a mint off of you. if a large middleman or woman ,has 250 vendors and they rip off each vendor by 100.00 per month, by saying that the bank did not approve your photos-funny again! then they just pocketed another 25,000.00 per month in there bank account, another good one is realtors, most are not general contractors, so legally they cannot act as a illegal contractor ,by sub contracting out work to you, they need to stick to selling homes, that is what they are licensed for! if us contractors started selling homes, the realtors would not stand for that! so why should we contractors, stand for them, illegally doing our job! i started with a middleman, it was a good way to start, its just that when i got on for the same national, that i learned that most of them are liars, i now make double to triple off of every invoice, how does that equal out to 25 percent? you would still work for them, they should just be honest on what there percentage really is! if they dont pay you ,put a lien on the property, the bank will then straighten them out!anyways, you will most likely have to start off with a con artist ,middleman or woman -job wrangler! because banks will not hire you directly, they use nationals, who then give most of the work to large middlemen and women, do a good job-learn your trade! get your experiance that you need, use the middlemen and women, because they are only using you!then as soon as you can get on directly with the nationals, you will make at least twice as much for the same ammount of work-good luck


----------



## Guest

Very well said! I'm trying to get in somewhere besides Safeguard, FAS, etc. But it seems impossible. If anyone has any leads on some contacts, I'm all ears!! If you don't live in Illinois, don't worry because I wont be taking any work from you.

Here is a classic Safeguard example:
Replace a 1" ball valve for $75 flat fee
- $18.75 for Safeguards 25% "discount"
- $17.00 for ball valve
- $10.00 gas to get there
- vehicle insurance
- wear & tear on vehicle/tools

Look there! you just made less than $29.25 for one job! To me, that's not very good business.


----------



## Guest

*your right*

the sad thing is thats what safegaurd will tell you they get for the valve, if you could only see there real invoice to the bank they work for! it would be double or triple! the banks use nationals because it saves them , alot of management time, and puts another level of liability,between them and property owners, the nationals use middlemen and women, because it saves them management time and another level of liability between them and you, the contractor, i hope to someday, soon . become a middleman-job wrangler! good job! flip photos and send out work orders, take 50 percent of the profit! but at least thats what i would tell ,my vendors, that i really make! you would still have people lining up to work for you!and i would pay them ,for the job done, and worry about collecting from the bank! i have worked for about ten middlemen, and met one honest one! thats the odds, the middlemen dont like the mom and pops, because they are actually on the job , getting it done right! the nationals are just flipping photos and work orders! they say a picture is worth a thousand words, it can also hide a thousand words, i sometimes follow up, behind middlemen and realtors, there jobs are usually not finished! realtors are great for giving out a cash for keys check on a property that is susposed to be broom clean, then you arrive to find 50 cubic yards of debris there! at least i can see that some of the nationals, are phasing out the realtors as contractors, good thing! i believe that they probally got in trouble for having realtors act as illegal contractors! stick to selling homes


----------



## Guest

trashman1 said:


> the sad thing is thats what safegaurd will tell you they get for the valve, if you could only see there real invoice to the bank they work for! it would be double or triple! the banks use nationals because it saves them , alot of management time, and puts another level of liability,between them and property owners, the nationals use middlemen and women, because it saves them management time and another level of liability between them and you, the contractor, i hope to someday, soon . become a middleman-job wrangler! good job! flip photos and send out work orders, take 50 percent of the profit! but at least thats what i would tell ,my vendors, that i really make! you would still have people lining up to work for you!and i would pay them ,for the job done, and worry about collecting from the bank! i have worked for about ten middlemen, and met one honest one! thats the odds, the middlemen dont like the mom and pops, because they are actually on the job , getting it done right! the nationals are just flipping photos and work orders! they say a picture is worth a thousand words, it can also hide a thousand words, i sometimes follow up, behind middlemen and realtors, there jobs are usually not finished! realtors are great for giving out a cash for keys check on a property that is susposed to be broom clean, then you arrive to find 50 cubic yards of debris there! at least i can see that some of the nationals, are phasing out the realtors as contractors, good thing! i believe that they probally got in trouble for having realtors act as illegal contractors! stick to selling homes


----------



## Guest

That was my exact thinking. I started working for Countrywide. Life was good and all the sudden there were a ton of "pay problems". I am still missing enough money from Countrywide to live off of for a year. I'm guessing I'll never see a dime since it was bought out from Bank of America.

So since Countrywide went under, and the laws changed for my state I found myself broke without any insurance. My choices were limited and my wife's family started their own company. I am now covered under their insurance and stuck doing Safeguard (and the occasional 5 Brothers) work orders. The difference between prices from Countrywide to Safeguard are horrible. 

Countrywide - Thaw out a frozen house w/ 3 bathrooms = $1200
Safeguard - Thaw out a frozen house w/ 3 bathrooms = $500

My thoughts on this whole deal was exactly what you just said. Safeguard tells you the they will only pay $500 when they are laughing behind our backs and charging the bank $1200. The sad thing is my inlaws won't tell the clowns at Safeguard "NO". Safeguard says jump and they say "how high"?

I have more field knowledge & experience than 3 out of 4 of my inlaws. I told them after the first week The same thing you just said, that Safeguard is charging the bank way more than what they are paying us for the jobs.


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> That was my exact thinking. I started working for Countrywide. Life was good and all the sudden there were a ton of "pay problems". I am still missing enough money from Countrywide to live off of for a year. I'm guessing I'll never see a dime since it was bought out from Bank of America.
> 
> So since Countrywide went under, and the laws changed for my state I found myself broke without any insurance. My choices were limited and my wife's family started their own company. I am now covered under their insurance and stuck doing Safeguard (and the occasional 5 Brothers) work orders. The difference between prices from Countrywide to Safeguard are horrible.
> 
> Countrywide - Thaw out a frozen house w/ 3 bathrooms = $1200
> Safeguard - Thaw out a frozen house w/ 3 bathrooms = $500
> 
> My thoughts on this whole deal was exactly what you just said. Safeguard tells you the they will only pay $500 when they are laughing behind our backs and charging the bank $1200. The sad thing is my inlaws won't tell the clowns at Safeguard "NO". Safeguard says jump and they say "how high"?
> 
> I have more field knowledge & experience than 3 out of 4 of my inlaws. I told them after the first week The same thing you just said, that Safeguard is charging the bank way more than what they are paying us for the jobs.


Its called "choice". You chose to work for this rate. What is bad is when "YOU" work for these rates than all the other service companies think they can get their services done for the same pay rate. Hey how do you like Safeguards new grass cut rate? NOW I know 3 other service companies that have said to us "well Safeguard is getting their grass cuts done at this rate so will you match their rate for this summers grass cut season?" 
Answer is no.
The problem here is you....sorry but thats my opinion...Its a tough economy and I guess something is better than nothing but still we are expected to flip all these costs and call our job a "hobby"..


----------



## Guest

Sorry didn't mean the problem is "you" personally but all the contractors that are working for these rates....please don't take it that way!


----------



## Guest

I check this post once in a while to see what is going on out there. Man this post went downhill quick with some new people. The regulars say important things, but the new guys. Jeez. Some people would be happy just making 5 bucks. Good lord stop whining and get out there and work.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Sorry didn't mean the problem is "you" personally but all the contractors that are working for these rates....please don't take it that way!


I know. If I was in charge, I'd be telling Safeguard "NO" to a lot of their pricing. But since I'm not the owner I have to do everything at the "allowable" cost or whatever they get told by Safeguard. 
Don't worry, I didn't take your post personal. I agree with you. I just wish my inlaws would grow a pair instead of letting Safeguard run their business into the ground. 

What I'd like to do is start my own company and find a few good nationals to supply me with work and get back to working for a decent price. I'm sick of the charity rates.


----------



## Guest

What are the national companies that are best to work for? I'm in kern county CA


----------



## BPWY

Charlescline said:


> What are the national companies that are best to work for? I'm in kern county CA






As long as you are experienced I think Linda from this forum would like to talk to you.


----------



## Guest

I have been getting work from safeguard for 5 years the deadlines get shorter,the bids get lower,and new contractors,drive down prices but what can you do but keep working i dont know where i can go and make this type of money,wish i could get straight with the morg. co any suggestions


----------



## Guest

BOHICA said:


> I live in Texas, near Houston, and was curious if anyone knows of any firms who offer ppv services, that recruit sub-contractor teams?


 
Yes, as a matter of fact I know of several people that do. Go here & join (it's free):

[email protected]


----------



## Guest

we used to do complete cleanouts,maid service,and yard service for 350 a pop for hud.im greatfull to get anything better than that.safeguard is a pain but it is still way better then that


----------



## Guest

hello i am getting in the business of property preservation.i worked for a sub that worked with field asset management(services)i did initial securing on three houses at my expense and got screwed by the sub.in all i lost about 5000 dollars.i paid for crew,dumpsters,bags, fuel,etc.never saw it coming the guy was slick.he even faked a heart attack.ive got everything to get started but dont know who to approach with no documented experience besides a old work order and my word.any info would be appreciated thank you for your time


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Good morning all.

I'm looking for an exerienced vendor in Alameda County who routinely services Oakland and surrounding areas.

Also, I have a client who has work throughout Kentucky, Virginia, Montana, and Wyoming in areas that I have not already covered. Not knowing what their load is like, I may need more than one experienced vendor in all areas.

I may be posting another list this afternoon with additional areas.

You can e-mail me at [email protected].

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Initial services*

Just wondering what the going rate is for initial services


----------



## BPWY

Depends on which regional or national has you bent over at the moment.

I heard today of a regional paying $60 for one lock change and dry winterize. Talk about every body up stream making the money and the guy doing all the work going backwards in his attempts at making a living.


----------



## Guest

what about reo initial services


----------



## BPWY

I can't help you there. Not my area of work right now. I'm sure that some one will come along soon with that info.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

ACUTABOVESRVCS said:


> Just wondering what the going rate is for initial services


Initial services aren't the same with every company. You'll have to be more specific about what you're asking for.

Start with HUD rates for your area and come up with prices you think are fair for the items not listed in their allowables.

No one is going to post a price list in public, just like no one is going to post their client list. You'll have to do some research that's independent of what you find here. What you get here is some valuable insight into the actual mechanics of the industry from experienced vendors.

Have you started working with one of the nationals yet or are you just starting out and only thinking of getting into the business?

What's your experience so far? Newbies work for the experience at the beginning. Once you know the guidelines and can prove your value, you can leave the nationals behind and truly work for yourself.

Linda


----------



## Guest

We just signed up with Safeguard and have a few things in the works with MCS,work will be coming next week.Pricing isn`t all that bad,mostly just re-cuts,hopefully bid approvals and initials will follow shortly.Anybody from or work in lovely Florida.Just another day in Paradise


----------



## Guest

deckman8887 said:


> We just signed up with Safeguard and have a few things in the works with MCS,work will be coming next week.Pricing isn`t all that bad,mostly just re-cuts,hopefully bid approvals and initials will follow shortly.Anybody from or work in lovely Florida.Just another day in Paradise


Congratulations!!! how can i sign up with Countrywide OR Safeguard ? Im in the state of Virginia? any website links?


----------



## Guest

i found the link to Countrywide & Safeguard .... thanks!


----------



## Guest

Hi. I am new to this business and would like to know if you could send me a sample email that you send. I sent an email to about 50 realtors a few weeks ago and did not hear back from anyone. If you could email me what you send them, that would be ownderfull!!! [email protected]. BTW I am in South Florida. Where are you located? I don't want to step on any toes.


----------



## Guest

Well got my name changed seems theres another mr services in ohio. Question?i got my million to 2 million coverage on my company i got my ein number is there any other insurance i must have, and this sirs certification is it for real?i am starting out on my own here in ohio and i want to be prepared thank you for any help on this


----------



## Guest

Get your E&O Insurance, get work comp, get commercial auto and trailer coverage. If you remove hazards get commercial pollution liability and then you are well on your way to the poor farm! :w00t:

OK Had to share this with everyone: bank wants this sheeted and tarped for $300....ANY TAKERS? I about swallowed my tongue on this and said "nope not this nut" and they said I have to do it at approved HUD rates for this and I said "nope not this nut" "not getting on that roof without another zero behind that number....
Anyone want some work:clap::w00t:


----------



## BPWY

Hell no.

I might need the work, but I don't need the hospital bill.


----------



## Guest

Good call Fremont. By looking at the photo, one step on the roof may be a quick trip to the basement. That's ridiculous that they told you "you have to do it at HUD rates". The picture shows an obvious risk by getting on the roof. I'm glad you told them no. This profession needs more people like you.

Did you bid to demo the house?


----------



## Guest

Nope no demo. They want to rebuild after the insurance company approves the repairs. No 3rd party fire damage firms allowed so they want a P&P crew to rebuild. Cost of rebuild vs cost of demo and new modular is a "no brainer" but.......its a funny business.


----------



## Guest

I had a 100 year old apartment building that had major structural problems and the bank kept insisting on a repair bid. I thought about bidding 500,000 but was afraid it still wouldn't be enough as I have never handled that large of a job before. A year later and it's still sitting, I think the city finally condemned it. 

Also what is average $ for workman's comp? Mine seemed pretty high.


----------



## Guest

sossecureda said:


> I had a 100 year old apartment building that had major structural problems and the bank kept insisting on a repair bid. I thought about bidding 500,000 but was afraid it still wouldn't be enough as I have never handled that large of a job before. A year later and it's still sitting, I think the city finally condemned it.
> 
> Also what is average $ for workman's comp? Mine seemed pretty high.


We do a lot of the rehabs but only "waste" our time when we know the repairs won't exceed the values since obviously they won't fix. 
Work Comp will be different for everyone since it is based off *YOUR* gross volume/receipts and your State of residence. Ours is very high also. Be sure to have your agent use the right job classification in case you have to "use" your policy. :whistling


----------



## Guest

Ya they will want a repair bid, but probably will not happen.


----------



## Guest

good call


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> We do a lot of the rehabs but only "waste" our time when we know the repairs won't exceed the values since obviously they won't fix.
> Work Comp will be different for everyone since it is based off *YOUR* gross volume/receipts and your State of residence. Ours is very high also. Be sure to have your agent use the right job classification in case you have to "use" your policy. :whistling


I didn't want to bid the repairs but the property manager kept insisting on a bid even after I told him it would easily cost more than the building was worth. I was going to bid real high just to give him a bid but was afraid of the slight chance it might get approved. I ended up telling him it was just too large a project for me. I usually repair the newer subdivision houses around here, not the full gut rehabs the old city houses need.
I probably should look for a new agent more familiar with the type of work I do when my policies are due for renewal, she doesn't seem too knowledgeable about the coverage I need. Every time I ask a question I get "uhhhhm I'll call you back". I just about fell out of the chair when I got work comp though, it was 8 times my gen liability.


----------



## Guest

sossecureda said:


> I didn't want to bid the repairs but the property manager kept insisting on a bid even after I told him it would easily cost more than the building was worth. I was going to bid real high just to give him a bid but was afraid of the slight chance it might get approved. I ended up telling him it was just too large a project for me. I usually repair the newer subdivision houses around here, not the full gut rehabs the old city houses need.
> I probably should look for a new agent more familiar with the type of work I do when my policies are due for renewal, she doesn't seem too knowledgeable about the coverage I need. Every time I ask a question I get "uhhhhm I'll call you back". I just about fell out of the chair when I got work comp though, it was 8 times my gen liability.


Work comp only 8x the GL sounds pretty low to me--at least on my end of the checkbook:w00t: On the big jobs we normally get paid to get a 3rd party estimate from the "pros"...plenty of very good guys on this forum that would love that work and pay for them for the estimate in case its a waste of time. Keeps everyone happy that way. I've been researching our insurance package lately (in fact today included) since our renewal is within 60 days and I found another one that I had thought about but didn't realize the impact......Terrorism coverage. Due to the Patriot Act if a "ex homeowner" comes back and destroys a house after a P&P contractor secures it then you can be held partially responsible for the damage for a bad secure job since it is considered an act of terror? When the underwriter and I was talking I said "there is absolutely no house that I couldn't get into even after a lockchange" and they agreed BUT even if you fought it and won you still have to bear the cost of your legal fees yourself...so purchase terrorism coverage (I always had but thought about dropping it)....NOT now.


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## Guest

I feel better about the work comp now, but I was told I didn't need the terrorism coverage. Time for another call to the agent :wallbash:
Thanks for the tip.


----------



## BPWY

sossecureda said:


> I was told I didn't need the terrorism coverage.




Same here.




How long until we pay 100% of our income to protect us in the case of a lawsuit?


----------



## Guest

We're here in Central Florida too


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Same here.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> How long until we pay 100% of our income to protect us in the case of a lawsuit?


 
Exactly! I have owned several businesses over the years but I have never ever ever seen a business such as Prop Preservation evolve to where it has over the past 13 years. :sad:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> Exactly! I have owned several businesses over the years but I have never ever ever seen a business such as Prop Preservation evolve to where it has over the past 13 years. :sad:


The industry has grown out of control and the rules keep changing due to new scams popping up and new classes of people needing protection.

Then, of course, the government has thrown money at a lot of lost causes over the past year or so and unemployment is so bad that people are working for any dollar amount they can get, including PP vendors and contractors.

I owned my bookkeeping business from 1999 to 2008 and the only rules that changed each year were tax rules. The rules in this industry change every time someone gets sued.

We detail every little thing and require that our vendors do, too, in order to minimize our risks. 

We've had our share of issues but none that were too tough to handle. But every day those risks increase. Just CYA the best you can and make sure you've got an insurance carrier that doesn't close up shop when you need them the most.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> The industry has grown out of control and the rules keep changing due to new scams popping up and new classes of people needing protection.
> 
> Then, of course, the government has thrown money at a lot of lost causes over the past year or so and unemployment is so bad that people are working for any dollar amount they can get, including PP vendors and contractors.
> 
> I owned my bookkeeping business from 1999 to 2008 and the only rules that changed each year were tax rules. The rules in this industry change every time someone gets sued.
> 
> We detail every little thing and require that our vendors do, too, in order to minimize our risks.
> 
> We've had our share of issues but none that were too tough to handle. But every day those risks increase. Just CYA the best you can and make sure you've got an insurance carrier that doesn't close up shop when you need them the most.
> 
> Linda


Linda,
So true. But, how do you cya when a company does a rule change in Feb 2010 and start their "recoups" on work you already done and paid out from 2008 because it isn't done/bid per the new rule change? My magicball is busted right now but trying to find someone that can fix the bugger.:whistling Nice when new contracts state "all company recoups (ie the magic word) are non-negotiable". I don't know to many companies contracts that don't read the same language. They need to change their contracts to meet State Laws that are something like this "buyer/signer beware" :w00t:


----------



## Guest

GTK
What part of Central Florida are you in ? Maybe we can hook-up and network together.We cover from Sebring north to Clermont and from St. Cloud west to Plant City.We do approx.400 re-cuts a month and anticipate that number to grow as we reach grass cutting season here in Florida.Check out my profile on linkedin.com just type in Mike Wilson-my company will show up as Wilson Enviromental and Construction Services.Along with this forum its a great place to join groups and network with people


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## BPWY

*Beware of spammers in this biz*

Earlier this week I was contacted by the following company.

*M**ortgage **S**pecialist **I**nternational*
*6616 Davis Blvd, Fort Worth, Texas 76180*
*800-346-2432 817-428-0000 Fax 817-428-1100*
https://www.msionline.com






Asking for all the usual info you've come to expect from a potential new vendor. Before I replied to them with all of my personal info they requested for a background check I ran them by a much more experienced contractor.
FremontREO. To see if he has heard of them.
He advised me to verify the company before sending personal info. 2 days ago I sent them an email asking for info to verify their company as a non spammer before I sent them my info that could be used to steal my ID.
NOT a word back from them.
I'll let him tell you about his friend.

Now I'm not saying they are a spammer, but just throwing the info out there to be careful. If any of our members here are working with them and can vouch for them I'll retract my post.

If its not one thing is another in this biz.


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## BPWY

"Seizing the Wrong Home: Rare, But a PR Nightmare" 




> To address this issue, PHH implemented a control about a year and a half ago that requires its field service contractor to give a homeowner a three-day notice before securing a property. "The notice is really a precaution," Foster said.



This is an impossibility in 99% of the rural areas many of operate.
There is no way I'm driving up to 3 or 4 hrs one way to post a message that a property will be preserved in 3 days. Then drive back home, and then drive back out when the 3 day window closes. If the banks think its costly now to get P&P work done. Just wait until they start this nonsense.


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## Guest

BPWY,
Looks like there is some type of warehouse at that location, a strange place for Mortgage Specialist International to set up that type of business. In addition, I googled all the top peoples names and none showed up. Still that is not to say they are not legit. What I did find strange is all the personal they have listed as working there. Seems a company that large we would have heard or known about. ?


----------



## BPWY

Hammer&Cross said:


> BPWY,......................... What I did find strange is all the personal they have listed as working there. Seems a company that large we would have heard or known about. ?






Similar thoughts to mine.


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## ARPPP

*Somewherein815. I am in 708*



somewherein815 said:


> Very well said! I'm trying to get in somewhere besides Safeguard, FAS, etc. But it seems impossible. If anyone has any leads on some contacts, I'm all ears!! If you don't live in Illinois, don't worry because I wont be taking any work from you.
> 
> 
> I am in south Cook county, where are you located? Perhaps we can help each other out occassionally. I have been getting jobs that are much further out than I prefer to drive. I had 2 near O'Hare this week. Let me know if you want to talk


----------



## Guest

ARPPP, you can contact me at [email protected]


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## Guest

ARPPP said:


> somewherein815 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Very well said! I'm trying to get in somewhere besides Safeguard, FAS, etc. But it seems impossible. If anyone has any leads on some contacts, I'm all ears!! If you don't live in Illinois, don't worry because I wont be taking any work from you.
> 
> 
> I am in south Cook county, where are you located? Perhaps we can help each other out occassionally. I have been getting jobs that are much further out than I prefer to drive. I had 2 near O'Hare this week. Let me know if you want to talk
> 
> 
> 
> try spectrum field services (www.spectrumfsi.com) i do work for them now, they always pay in 30, pay well and seem to be taking over a lot of safeguard's work..mike:clap:
Click to expand...


----------



## Guest

I guess "pay well" is very subjective after seeing their new contracts


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## Guest

In the DFW area HUD pays 350 a house flat fee tree trimming and yard included. thanks but no thanks


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## Guest

Hello 
first of all thanks for all the useful information in this forum. Does anybody know what can be done if the company doesnt pay for the work. I did a job for somebody who posted an ad on craiglist about 1-2 months ago. Ive been trying to get a hold of the person by email and phone for the last couple of weeks and nothing. I spent about six hundred on material out of my pocket and have the receipts. Ive heard that you can put a lien on the property or should sue the company?


----------



## BPWY

dfwcleanouts said:


> In the DFW area HUD pays 350 a house flat fee tree trimming and yard included. thanks but no thanks



Changing all locks, winterizing and initial yard services (depending on the yard conditions) and that money is spent. What do they think you are going to use to pick up the trash and clean the house with?


----------



## Guest

CAMARO BOY said:


> Hello
> first of all thanks for all the useful information in this forum. Does anybody know what can be done if the company doesnt pay for the work. I did a job for somebody who posted an ad on craiglist about 1-2 months ago. Ive been trying to get a hold of the person by email and phone for the last couple of weeks and nothing. I spent about six hundred on material out of my pocket and have the receipts. Ive heard that you can put a lien on the property or should sue the company?


Send a notice of lien letter to your contact. Does this asap since each State is different on the lein laws or contact and attorney asap. Most of the craigslist work I have heard of never gets paid. Friend of mine contacted Dept of Labor and reported that "he was hired as an employee and his back was hurting and wanted to know how to file an work comp claim and the company would not return their calls." :clap: Mysteriously the check was overnighted a week later:laughing:


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## Guest

Back hurting.. workers comp!!! He is a genius. I will be laughing about that for a week.:thumbup::thumbup: Seriously though, there are few groups with sharper teeth.


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## BPWY

Any one here join your local chamber of commerce in an effort to get your business name into the hands of local bankers and real estate agents?


Short of trying to make the appointments to meet many of them personally it seems some thing like this would be a better targeted way to spend your advertising budget.


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## Guest

I went to many a luncheon for the COC but never received much business out of it. Of course that was a small rinky dink town too. I plan on joining Fort Worth COC if the fees aren't too high.


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## Guest

dfwcleanouts said:


> I went to many a luncheon for the COC but never received much business out of it. Of course that was a small rinky dink town too. I plan on joining Fort Worth COC if the fees aren't too high.


 
I see your in Ft Worth....BPWY was contacted by Mortgage Specialist International in Ft Worth and eveyone was kinda trying to see if they were legit....Have you heard of them? Just interested! :thumbsup:


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## BPWY

dfwcleanouts said:


> I went to many a luncheon for the COC but never received much business out of it. Of course that was a small rinky dink town too. I plan on joining Fort Worth COC if the fees aren't too high.





$356 a yr here for a one to five man show. They charge by the size of your company. Pay lump sum, pay 1/2, or pay quarterly.

Along with that comes a couple hundred dollars worth of advertising credits. So you get a large chunk of your money back as advertising credits. I'm planning on going with mine maybe next week and we'll see what happens.


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## Guest

COC never seemed to help directly but indirectly you meet a lot of people (insurance agents, business owners and such) and introduce yourself but just don't say "I remove trash, feces and kick people out of their homes for not paying" :laughing: I have always found out that the P&P contractors are not looked upon "highly"...:whistling
It has helped for other items though.... I got a discount off dinner at a local restaurant for 1 meal and my phone sure did start ringing for contributions for every dang club in town! SO don't put your cell phone number down since they will use up those minutes.


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## BPWY

I've got unlimited minutes so I'm good there. And the cell phone is all I've got. 
I cut the cord on the land line several yrs ago. $55 a month just to have service. 


I've got a question for you on the new lead laws.

Yesterday I tore down an old chicken house. 

After 4/1/10 would that be prohibited activities for non certified lead removal folks?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I've got unlimited minutes so I'm good there. And the cell phone is all I've got.
> I cut the cord on the land line several yrs ago. $55 a month just to have service.
> 
> 
> I've got a question for you on the new lead laws.
> 
> Yesterday I tore down an old chicken house.
> 
> After 4/1/10 would that be prohibited activities for non certified lead removal folks?


Thats a good one!:clap: I could go a long way with that! "I depends if there is going to be any "chicks" under 6 years of age that is going to be living in the new one"
Seriously though: the RRP ruling is for housing. BUT if you think that there could be lead based paint than it wouldn't be a bad idea to put a groundcover down, remove the paints then remove the shed. The only thing is that it may legally would be an abatement job or anyway 99% sure. 
Here is how this is going to effect the P&P contractor: many States require kiddies entering kindergarten to be lead tested (mandatory in many States-mine included) and lets say YOU did a job that disturbed anything in the house that has lead paints and the kiddie tests high for heavy metals....the questioning will start and the State EPA/Fed EPA will start digging to find who did work in the home and source of the lead and if the P&P contactor is not properly licensed and have the correct documentation than let the floodgates open for the fines. I lost my best employee to this same scenario....The Dept of Public Safety, Dept of Human Services and the State EPA kept hounding them for the lead in the place he was living (he rented) and they encapsulated all the paint in the house and the next round of medical tests came back high so the State "experts" came in and started testing. He got hounded, threatened to lose their kids (3) and the only thing in his mind to get them off his azz was that he left the State. They are ruthless.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Earlier this week I was contacted by the following company.
> 
> *M**ortgage **S**pecialist **I**nternational*
> *6616 Davis Blvd, Fort Worth, Texas 76180*
> *800-346-2432 817-428-0000 Fax 817-428-1100*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Asking for all the usual info you've come to expect from a potential new vendor. Before I replied to them with all of my personal info they requested for a background check I ran them by a much more experienced contractor.
> FremontREO. To see if he has heard of them.
> He advised me to verify the company before sending personal info. 2 days ago I sent them an email asking for info to verify their company as a non spammer before I sent them my info that could be used to steal my ID.
> NOT a word back from them.
> I'll let him tell you about his friend.
> 
> Now I'm not saying they are a spammer, but just throwing the info out there to be careful. If any of our members here are working with them and can vouch for them I'll retract my post.
> 
> If its not one thing is another in this biz.


 
I met a few of their reps over at the Washington DC conference last year. They are a newer company trying to break into the national level. Haven't received much work from them since I don't do inspections or general p&p for nationals.

I've got some contact info for people I've personally spoken to over there if you'd like.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Thats a good one!:clap: I could go a long way with that! "I depends if there is going to be any "chicks" under 6 years of age that is going to be living in the new one"
> Seriously though: the RRP ruling is for housing. BUT if you think that there could be lead based paint than it wouldn't be a bad idea to put a groundcover down, remove the paints then remove the shed. The only thing is that it may legally would be an abatement job or anyway 99% sure.
> Here is how this is going to effect the P&P contractor: many States require kiddies entering kindergarten to be lead tested (mandatory in many States-mine included) and lets say YOU did a job that disturbed anything in the house that has lead paints and the kiddie tests high for heavy metals....the questioning will start and the State EPA/Fed EPA will start digging to find who did work in the home and source of the lead and if the P&P contactor is not properly licensed and have the correct documentation than let the floodgates open for the fines. I lost my best employee to this same scenario....The Dept of Public Safety, Dept of Human Services and the State EPA kept hounding them for the lead in the place he was living (he rented) and they encapsulated all the paint in the house and the next round of medical tests came back high so the State "experts" came in and started testing. He got hounded, threatened to lose their kids (3) and the only thing in his mind to get them off his azz was that he left the State. They are ruthless.





Man that is BS!!!! And sucked for you to loose a good man.


So by "disturbing the dust" ........ would that include Fannie Mae maid service work????? Especially for the likes of AMS where they are demanding a white glove clean on each house?


----------



## BPWY

CaliJoe said:


> I met a few of their reps over at the Washington DC conference last year. They are a newer company trying to break into the national level. Haven't received much work from them since I don't do inspections or general p&p for nationals.
> 
> I've got some contact info for people I've personally spoken to over there if you'd like.





Thanks for the offer, but I'm going to pass. 

I asked them for info to verify they are a legit company. Guess what?

I never heard back from them. If they are too busy to respond to a simple request like that then they are probably too busy to process my vendor application once I spent my good time to fill it out.


----------



## mtmtnman

Looks like i'm ok here for now.....

http://www.healthyhomestraining.org/RRP/State.htm

The FEDS have made no reasonable effort to alert the contractors or public about this new ruling. They are leaving people in the dark on purpose. What this purpose is will soon be seen. It's all about control in Washington these days. 

Let me see, you pay a couple of hundred bucks to get into the class, which will automatically put you on a government list. Now all the government needs to do is locate the job you are at and ready the fines. 


I don't want to turn this political but the feds need to keep their nose out of what each state does!!

_*Amendment X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
*_


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Good morning, all. Happy Friday.

I'm looking for experienced vendors to replace one that I can't get a call back or e-mail response from. I have a work order in Lincoln County, South Dakota that needs to be taken care of immediately.

The other counties in his *South Dakota* coverage area are: Clay, Union, and Minnehaha [plus any other counties you cover]

He covers 2 other states.

In *Iowa*, I'll need experienced vendors to cover Cherokee, Lyons, Monona, Plymouth, Sioux, and Woodbury counties.

In *Nebraska*, I'll need experienced vendors to cover Dakota, Dixon, and Thurston.

If anyone covers these areas and wants the work, send an e-mail to me at [email protected] and put your state in the subject line so I can find you easily. I literally get 100's of e-mails every day.

Hope the weather's been good for everyone this week. It's gorgeous here in Arizona and I've already been down to play in the river. Looks like the heat might just stick around through the weekend. :clap:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

While there are a lot of states that haven't adopted their own rules I seriously doubt the feds are going to allow the states to slide by.

There is way too much money involved at $25,000 fines per occurrence per day for the feds to let that slide.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Hope the weather's been good for everyone this week. It's gorgeous here in Arizona and I've already been down to play in the river. Looks like the heat might just stick around through the weekend. :clap:
> 
> Linda






After several days of upper 50s and low 60s we are having snow again today.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> I have a work order in Lincoln County, South Dakota that needs to be taken care of immediately.
> 
> 
> Linda






What kind of trip charge are you willing to pay. :thumbup: :thumbup:


----------



## BPWY

How many folks got an email like this recently?

And what would you tell a company that is trying to hose the contractor over like this??



> Dear Vendor,
> 
> We would like to thank you for all of your hard work and service you provide. Due to the extremely competitive environment within the property preservation industry, our clients have decided to discontinue the practice of paying for service calls (trip charges). Below is a list of services that they will no longer compensate for, effective 3/19/2010. We know this new change can make it difficult to operate, however, it is our hope that we will be able to offset this loss by providing more efficient bidding processes on second bids and focusing on common bid approval items, thus minimizing your time at properties and in return maximizing future bid approvals. We are also working on a variety of other upcoming incentives which will focus on turnaround time, work order accuracy, etc.
> 
> The following are the items that will and will not have trip charges paid.
> 
> · REO occupancy checks when work cannot be performed – Yes
> · Provide access – Yes
> · Second bids – No
> · Limited growth grass cut orders – No
> · Occupied property – No
> · Verify ICC - No
> · Weather conditions – No
> · Bad Address – No
> 
> Thank you,



My first reaction is that unfortunately for this company's clients the realities of life have nothing to do with their wishes. The reality is that none of our prices are going down. The price of diesel fuel is approaching $3 per gallon. The reality is that previously the trip pay barely or did not cover the actual expenses of making a trip to the property. And now they want even more work out of us for free????????

NO! I am running a business here, not a charity.

I feel that this national is probably lying to me. I caught them in a lie the first day I worked for them. They told me that Wells Fargo doesn't pay HUD rate. This I happen to know is a lie. All the other companies I work with for WF pay HUD rate less discount.
I wouldn't be surprised if this national is using this as a way to keep more money for themselves. For example on a $120 or $130 HUD rate wint they pay their contractors $60, and then tell them that is the best they can do. That there is no money to be made on initial secures. Its all made on the bid approvals. Then when they do give you a bid approval and you do the work they only pay about half of what they said the bid approval was for.

I don't do much work for this company, and it looks like I'm going to be doing even far less.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> What kind of trip charge are you willing to pay. :thumbup: :thumbup:


Tell me what kind of beer you drink and I'll ship a case out today.:laughing: Too bad it's so far away from you.

How do you feel about going to Lincoln County, Nebraska? I just got a request while I was responding to your post for an initial secure & winterization in North Platte. 

I just left a message for you. The client needs to know right away.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Thinking of Upgrading*

Hi all -

We have a landscaping and lawn maintenance company and we are thinking of expanding to include property preservation services. In addition to the additional types of insurance that we will need, what other pitfalls should we be on the lookout for. Also, are there any property preservation companies in Georgia looking to contract out the lawn maintenance portion?

Thanks,
Vetlawns
[email protected]


----------



## BPWY

Ya'll wanna hear about a night mare job??

No??

Well I'm gonna tell ya any way. 


Yesterday I've got an initial secure. As I walk around the house I see there is a lot of straw in the back yard with rabbit feces. This by itself doesn't shock me too much, but when I walk into the garage I'm surprised at all the straw and rabbit feces there. 
The shock comes from when I enter the house and find rabbit feces and urine stains EVERY where thru out the house. This place is nasty. I can't imagine getting the clean up bid for it. But I guess we'll see.
The neighbor told me that his estimation is 300 to 400 rabbits were in cages in the garage. Rows and rows of cages 3 to 4 cages high. The feces and urine just ran down thru the cages below.
Inside the house he estimated there was another 300 to 400 running free, along with birds and other animals he didn't know what they were.

Those are urine stains on the door.
The furnace has caked on dust, the filter is so plugged I don't see how air flowed thru it. The washing machine has hair inside it, and you can only imagine what the cabinets of the washer and dryer look like.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Looks like i'm ok here for now.....
> 
> http://www.healthyhomestraining.org/RRP/State.htm
> 
> The FEDS have made no reasonable effort to alert the contractors or public about this new ruling. They are leaving people in the dark on purpose. What this purpose is will soon be seen. It's all about control in Washington these days.
> 
> Let me see, you pay a couple of hundred bucks to get into the class, which will automatically put you on a government list. Now all the government needs to do is locate the job you are at and ready the fines.
> 
> 
> I don't want to turn this political but the feds need to keep their nose out of what each state does!!
> 
> _*Amendment X*_
> _*The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.*_


Matt,
That means that Montana has not adopted any rules worse/harsher then the feds..it doesn't mean that there is no RRP ruling that applies to you:whistling
This will be the doom of this industry if not followed closely and not by the feds or your State..it will be the chargebacks that will follow when a property conveys to HUD and the HUD Lead Inspectors find lead and reconvey the home back to the bank and guess who is going to be found responsible for not reporting this properly...1 guess and its not Santa Claus:clap:jmo.....


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Ya'll wanna hear about a night mare job??
> 
> No??
> 
> Well I'm gonna tell ya any way.
> 
> 
> Yesterday I've got an initial secure. As I walk around the house I see there is a lot of straw in the back yard with rabbit feces. This by itself doesn't shock me too much, but when I walk into the garage I'm surprised at all the straw and rabbit feces there.
> The shock comes from when I enter the house and find rabbit feces and urine stains EVERY where thru out the house. This place is nasty. I can't imagine getting the clean up bid for it. But I guess we'll see.
> The neighbor told me that his estimation is 300 to 400 rabbits were in cages in the garage. Rows and rows of cages 3 to 4 cages high. The feces and urine just ran down thru the cages below.
> Inside the house he estimated there was another 300 to 400 running free, along with birds and other animals he didn't know what they were.
> 
> Those are urine stains on the door.
> The furnace has caked on dust, the filter is so plugged I don't see how air flowed thru it. The washing machine has hair inside it, and you can only imagine what the cabinets of the washer and dryer look like.


Gut job! down to the floor joists and the walls to the studs. Throw on your respirator and strip it down and fog the house with an antimicrobial/disinfectant and bid the rebuild...Glory glory :thumbup:


----------



## Guest

vetlawns said:


> Hi all -
> 
> We have a landscaping and lawn maintenance company and we are thinking of expanding to include property preservation services. In addition to the additional types of insurance that we will need, what other pitfalls should we be on the lookout for. Also, are there any property preservation companies in Georgia looking to contract out the lawn maintenance portion?
> 
> Thanks,
> Vetlawns
> [email protected]


Don't know where you are at in Georgia but we used to do the entire State of Georgia and if you are close to Dahlonega (spelling?) I could pass you a name and he may be able to help ya....Just private message me if you want it.


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## Guest

*Dead Animal Removal*

Hey Y'all,

What seems to be the going rate for small dead animal removal? I've got to bid to remove 1 dead squirrel from a fire place and a couple of dead mice.

I've never had to remove any before. So I just want to see waht's reasonable being paid.

Thanks,


----------



## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> Hey Y'all,
> 
> What seems to be the going rate for small dead animal removal? I've got to bid to remove 1 dead squirrel from a fire place and a couple of dead mice.
> 
> I've never had to remove any before. So I just want to see waht's reasonable being paid.
> 
> Thanks,


Tough question! Figure in the cost of the casket, headstone, hearst cost and you the funeral director and I'm figuring say $1000 for the poor squirrel and $600 per mouse:w00t:
Seriously, "whatever you figure its worth" is what you charge. BUT still charge for the funeral directors fee


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Tough question! Figure in the cost of the casket, headstone, hearst cost and you the funeral director and I'm figuring say $1000 for the poor squirrel and $600 per mouse:w00t:
> Seriously, "whatever you figure its worth" is what you charge. BUT still charge for the funeral directors fee


LMAO! I'm using that one on my next dead animal removal. 

On a serious note, if its not too far away I'd say $150. If its farther away figure in your travel time with the bid.


----------



## Guest

Thanks guys, Needed the laugh. Long day on the roof today.

Fremont, What should I do if they request cremation services? Never mind, I found my tourch an map gas.lol

Anywho, the mice are, shall we say, preserved to the levels only known to be used for Pharo's. The squirrel however, is quite putrid:blink:

Gotta roll, Dirty, Tired, and Hungry!

I'll check back in later If'n the little lady will let me.


----------



## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> Thanks guys, Needed the laugh. Long day on the roof today.
> 
> Fremont, What should I do if they request cremation services? Never mind, I found my tourch an map gas.lol
> 
> Anywho, the mice are, shall we say, preserved to the levels only known to be used for Pharo's. The squirrel however, is quite putrid:blink:
> 
> Gotta roll, Dirty, Tired, and Hungry!
> 
> I'll check back in later If'n the little lady will let me.


Don't mention the MAP gas since either 1 of 2 things will happen:

1) the Service Company tech well ask you "why in the world did you need a map when everyone uses GPS?"

2) The Service Company will issue a HUGE chargeback for feeding you on the jobsite with a "value meal"

:w00t::notworthy


----------



## Guest

*Construction clean up*

I just rec'd my first bid for construction clean up :clap: and i dont have a clue to what to charge per sq footage... i need help from the best - thank you job includes
Furnish labor and materials to rough and final clean each production unit. Rough clean consists of: cleaning all drywall mud from windows, doors, and bathtubs; cleaning cabinets, countertops, sinks, and moldings; cleaning paint from windows; and removing all associated debris left behind. Final Clean includes but is not limited to: complete dusting, vacuuming all carpets, cleaning and polishing of sinks, cleaning windows inside and out, cleaning all appliances and fixtures (including mirrors and shower enclosures), mopping/cleaning all hard surface floors, and cleaning all door tracks and door thesholds.


----------



## Guest

EUGENIA said:


> I just rec'd my first bid for construction clean up :clap: and i dont have a clue to what to charge per sq footage... i need help from the best - thank you job includes
> Furnish labor and materials to rough and final clean each production unit. Rough clean consists of: cleaning all drywall mud from windows, doors, and bathtubs; cleaning cabinets, countertops, sinks, and moldings; cleaning paint from windows; and removing all associated debris left behind. Final Clean includes but is not limited to: complete dusting, vacuuming all carpets, cleaning and polishing of sinks, cleaning windows inside and out, cleaning all appliances and fixtures (including mirrors and shower enclosures), mopping/cleaning all hard surface floors, and cleaning all door tracks and door thesholds.


Good luck where you are live. We used to do this a lot several years ago until the "cheaper uninsured unlicensed illegals" started doing each window,door, tubs, sinks for $1.50 each, Complete sales deep clean for $35.00. 
We couldn't pay for the fuel for that not alone with any profit. Also, we found out that if you don't bid this per unit after a visual inspection you will get hosed....carpet guys will leave all the remnants behind, drywallers will leave all their cuttings behind and mud buckets, window guys will leave all the plastic and window trimming behind. You get the idea. Basically you can't just throw a figure out without knowing how much debris you got to remove before you can clean but if you want a figure heres what we got 4 years ago: $600 for deep sales clean for only interior. $475.00 for exterior pickup (shingles, pallets) as long as it was only skidsteer work.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Good luck where you are live. We used to do this a lot several years ago until the "cheaper uninsured unlicensed illegals" started doing each window,door, tubs, sinks for $1.50 each, Complete sales deep clean for $35.00.
> We couldn't pay for the fuel for that not alone with any profit. Also, we found out that if you don't bid this per unit after a visual inspection you will get hosed....carpet guys will leave all the remnants behind, drywallers will leave all their cuttings behind and mud buckets, window guys will leave all the plastic and window trimming behind. You get the idea. Basically you can't just throw a figure out without knowing how much debris you got to remove before you can clean but if you want a figure heres what we got 4 years ago: $600 for deep sales clean for only interior. $475.00 for exterior pickup (shingles, pallets) as long as it was only skidsteer work.


 
Thank you for the information:thumbup: ive search the web high and low and couldnt find anything to go on. im very proud and excited... im in the state of Virginia and i'm hoping a lot will come my way.. Thanks again and ill keep you posted on the outcome:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

*Getting Started*

I am starting a property preservation and cleaning service in Houston. What is the standard labor charges for trash removal and cleaning of the property per unit? Can someone help me out?


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## BPWY

Google "TX HUD rate".

Thats where most banks start and the rates generally go DOWN from there.


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## Guest

reivax said:


> I am starting a property preservation and cleaning service in Houston. What is the standard labor charges for trash removal and cleaning of the property per unit? Can someone help me out?



Stay away from working for a national preservation company like FAS or Cyprexx, unless you like working for minimum wage.

Try to find REO listing agents and work for them. They will collect the bids and forward them to the banks and asset companies. But be prepared to WAIT for your check.... as much as 4 months.:blink:

Better yet... just start a cleaning and trash hauling business and put your ads on craigslist and work for home owners.... its a terrible time to try and break into the foreclosure market...


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## BPWY

You folks in areas that the grass isn't growing yet getting grass cut W/Os??

Last year I never got ANY until into April. 
This year I've got a stack of about 8 that will be submitted this week as 
no growth. I find it odd they are being issued this early. Grass wont' be mowed in this area for another month... minimum.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:



> You folks in areas that the grass isn't growing yet getting grass cut W/Os??
> 
> Last year I never got ANY until into April.
> This year I've got a stack of about 8 that will be submitted this week as
> no growth. I find it odd they are being issued this early. Grass wont' be mowed in this area for another month... minimum.


 
I always pay particular attention to these that are issued (for us in the Midwest) earlier than April 1 since we had like 20 last year that was issued in Late March that we did then got chargedback since "we knew the GC season didn't start till April 1"....they were right but couldn't figure out why they went ahead and issued with a due date before April 1.....Got Me there


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I always pay particular attention to these that are issued (for us in the Midwest) earlier than April 1 since we had like 20 last year that was issued in Late March that we did then got chargedback since "we knew the GC season didn't start till April 1"....they were right but couldn't figure out why they went ahead and issued with a due date before April 1.....Got Me there




I too am leary of charge backs since First Am has started charging back for cuts last summer where they claim there isn't any difference between before and after.

But I've had repeated reassurances from the company that has the most already in my hand that I AM TO DRIVE BY, TAKE PHOTOS AND SUBMIT A TRIP CHARGE. I guess we'll see. 
I'll be mad if I get banged on em.

I'm working as hard as I can to get as much local work as I can. This will insulate me and allow me to drop some of the worst paying nationals.

I remember a past post you made about a family member moving to Cheyenne and possibly starting this type of work. Did they end up doing that then?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I too am leary of charge backs since First Am has started charging back for cuts last summer where they claim there isn't any difference between before and after.
> 
> But I've had repeated reassurances from the company that has the most already in my hand that I AM TO DRIVE BY, TAKE PHOTOS AND SUBMIT A TRIP CHARGE. I guess we'll see.
> I'll be mad if I get banged on em.
> 
> I'm working as hard as I can to get as much local work as I can. This will insulate me and allow me to drop some of the worst paying nationals.
> 
> I remember a past post you made about a family member moving to Cheyenne and possibly starting this type of work. Did they end up doing that then?


Yes and No....The daughter who "grew up" in this business who has been in the field and in the office and I have to admit was one of our best "uploaders" has kinda came back "into the fold" and is doing uploads for us and now for another P&P company from Minnesota. That is the "one nice thing" about the internet and computers...you can do the admin from just about anywhere. The son-in-law who worked with us for 3 years has found out that his "employer" loves those "recalls" anytime and anywhere:w00t:


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## Guest

oh yeah I was going to add we got some chargebacks from First Am that your lot size was off by just a little but didn't make 1 dang difference in the amount that would have been invoiced for. 

1) 80x100 we input since the assessors site was not online for that information since it is a rural area
2) actual size was 75x96.... 

Big freakin deal eh?


----------



## BPWY

That is just nitpicking to boost their bottom line!


Same as last yr in NOV, and DEC they were RTVing EVERYTHING for any excuse just to boost their yearly revenue right at the end of the year. 
Jan 2........... hardly ANY THING was RTVed. Pretty obvious.

These national clowns like to delude themselves into thinking that the contractors are a bunch of brain dead idiots. (I worked for a regional that was the same way, they thought I was a moron, truth be told I had them figured out months and months before I ever called them on it.)


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## Guest

I just hit the "how old are you" button on the General Discussion forum and wow it just hit me that there isn't to many more options left for age groups....thats depressing:sad:


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I just hit the "how old are you" button on the General Discussion forum and wow it just hit me that there isn't to many more options left for age groups....thats depressing:sad:





Like the one guy said..... the age your drivers license says and the one your wife THINKS you are can always be two different things. 
:thumbup: :laughing: :laughing:


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## BPWY

Holy cow, weather forecast for Tues is possible to hit the low 70s. Dang, we haven't seen those temps here since probably Sept 09.

We won't know how to act.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Holy cow, weather forecast for Tues is possible to hit the low 70s. Dang, we haven't seen those temps here since probably Sept 09.
> 
> We won't know how to act.



I'm 800 miles north of you and we've had 50-60 degrees for a month!


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I'm 800 miles north of you and we've had 50-60 degrees for a month!





We've had this discussion before. I can't repeat some of the words here without getting banned.
   

You don't live at 6000' plus elevation in the foot hills of the rockies.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> We've had this discussion before. I can't repeat some of the words here without getting banned.
> 
> 
> You don't live at 6000' plus elevation in the foot hills of the rockies.



LMAO!! Nope! But with less than a half hour drive i can be at 6000 foot elevation!! :laughing::laughing::laughing:I'm nice and comfy at 3,000 feet. Got at least 6 weeks of nicer weather than you!!!! :bangin::bangin::bangin:


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## Guest

*SC/NC border?*

We live in Fort Mill, SC which is south of Charlotte, NC. What do you guys know of this area for REO's? We are custom home builders who have started up another business do to property preservations. Believe it or not business is slowly picking up in the building industry around here but we still want to persue this as well. Any advice or suggestions? I'm trying my best to get this started up or at least get some advice for my husband. So excuse me of my inexperience. I'm just the info girl trying to pass it along to my much experienced guy. 

Thanks,
Carrie


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## Guest

littlephe said:


> We live in Fort Mill, SC which is south of Charlotte, NC. What do you guys know of this area for REO's? We are custom home builders who have started up another business do to property preservations. Believe it or not business is slowly picking up in the building industry around here but we still want to persue this as well. Any advice or suggestions? I'm trying my best to get this started up or at least get some advice for my husband. So excuse me of my inexperience. I'm just the info girl trying to pass it along to my much experienced guy.
> 
> Thanks,
> Carrie


Carrie,
We are a Midwestern Company but we had an office in Lexington for 3 years and absolutely love South Carolina. In my heart it still is my 2nd home. Anyway, we closed shop in SC for a variety of reasons but primarily due to the very low pay due to so many crews were bidding so low that we could not "turn a decent profit". In my opinion the pay scale 
in SC is so low its hard to stay in business anylonger but as my friends in SC say "something is better than nothing".
We still have Service Companies call us to see if we would go back and mow for $15.00 per yard (they are easy cuts unless you hit bamboo and ruin the blades-1or2 times a week) or if you can complete 40cyd trashouts for $250.00....
If you want to PM me I can get you in touch with 1 of our old crews in Tega Cay or one of the inspectors in SC that lives in Sumter and they might be able to set you up with some work. When we left we transferred contracts to our contractors so that they weren't left high and dry. Both are still in the business. "Back then" you could transfer contracts and now the companies won't do that....
Unfortunately, in Ft Mill I can name at least 10 crews that are still operating in Rock Hill to York area so if looking for National Company contracts will be hard to obtain but you might be able to find a few realtors that these other crews don't market to...:thumbsup:


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## Guest

Comments on FAS, Hi we have been doing property preservation work in Idaho and several surrounding states and I have read a lot of bashing on the national companies one in particular FAS. I have only worked with this company since Feb and yes I have had lots of problems with them on the requirements being meet with pic work to get paid for the order. But I will say we do have a chance to get back to the property and get it fixed, and so far a lot of the problems I have had with this company was due on my end not understanding what FAS is looking for to show proof order was complete and not doing a good job reading through the work order. I believe FAS is a company that pays for the work completed and I was hoping there was someone who is currently with FAS that can help give me some pointers on the office side to make our transition working with this company easier.

my email is [email protected] and our current companies name is Sweet Home Property Preservation or please just post here.

After reading much of this message board with all respect I say this, i currently do not care how much FAS gets paid for a job I complete for them, I knew the pay scale they offered me when I signed up. While we are all humbled in the need to pay bills I assure you I also do not work for free and im not looking for a bash on the national session.


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## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> Comments on FAS, Hi we have been doing property preservation work in Idaho and several surrounding states and I have read a lot of bashing on the national companies one in particular FAS. I have only worked with this company since Feb and yes I have had lots of problems with them on the requirements being meet with pic work to get paid for the order. But I will say we do have a chance to get back to the property and get it fixed, and so far a lot of the problems I have had with this company was due on my end not understanding what FAS is looking for to show proof order was complete and not doing a good job reading through the work order. I believe FAS is a company that pays for the work completed and I was hoping there was someone who is currently with FAS that can help give me some pointers on the office side to make our transition working with this company easier.
> 
> my email is [email protected] and our current companies name is Sweet Home Property Preservation or please just post here.
> 
> After reading much of this message board with all respect I say this, i currently do not care how much FAS gets paid for a job I complete for them, I knew the pay scale they offered me when I signed up. While we are all humbled in the need to pay bills I assure you I also do not work for free and im not looking for a bash on the national session.


Idaho that is a good post. I'm glad that you were able to go back and make the "mistakes by you right" and that sounds really good and a responsible thing to do! Now in 12-18 months you will be charged back for the work order since "you did not complete to specs on the first work order and required a return trip". Word of advise: Put 100% of their checks in a savings account and don't spend a dime of it for 18 months minimun than you will actually know what "pay scale they offered me when I signed up" actually was. ... :whistling


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## BPWY

You started working in Feb and already got a check from them?

You must live a very charmed life or else you mean Feb of 09. I tried working with them last year for just shy of 3 months. It took about that long until they started paying. When they did they didn't pay what they said they would. They use every excuse in the book they possibly can to cut or flat out deny your invoice.
They will tell you that if you are not paid they don't get paid. I don't believe them for a second. In the three months I worked with them I was also told a lot lies and blown a lot of sun shine.


----------



## Guest

Thank you FremontREO for your responce, I will be watching this close thank you for that insight. I usually only handle a situation like that once I am in a position to deal with it, but I have been warned so if I ever use this forum to complain about such a thing I would like you to remind me that you told me so.

Just like every business has in the past property preservation has also followed as far as not being as good like in the old days, I was reading a message on this forum page 40 to 44 I think about how trip charges arent going to be paid for certain services. I think we are going to see more of this in the future not just with trip charges but with other services. Its not my doing, just where it is and while I may have certain work I do for others that pay well I cannot keep all my eggs in one to two baskets on the chance that those clients wont come up with a different business model, and as far as chargeback ( not talking about you, I do not know you) but I have seen some skill sets on some property preservation companies where after viewing this I wouldn't let them wash my dog and watching them do an invoice is like watching some unrealistic wish list being put together, so I do understand how chargebacks can happen.

-Charles


----------



## Guest

Thanks FreemontREO. Any info you can share would be greatly appreciated. How do I contact you privately?

Thanks,
Carrie


----------



## Guest

littlephe said:


> Thanks FreemontREO. Any info you can share would be greatly appreciated. How do I contact you privately?
> 
> Thanks,
> Carrie


 
Hit the little "private message" on the upper right corner of screen. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Hit the little "private message" on the upper right corner of screen. :thumbsup:


 
Carrie will need a minimum of 21 posts to turn on private messaging. I should know since mine just got turned on. :clap:


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## Guest

That's good to know. I thought I was losing my mind. I know I didn't see a private message. :blink:


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## Guest

The hard part,for me, is finding threads to comment on w/o looking like a total idiot. I do more reading and learning on CT forum than having anything useful to contribute. Good luck.


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## Guest

I didnt get the construction bid... a little disappointed :sad: - but i know there's more to come


----------



## BPWY

A word of wisdom to those that are looking for work. 

There are 3 different companies in UT that look for contractors. There must be some thing in the water out there because all three are not worth working for.

Today I was given a "bid approval" on a property I initial secured in Jan. As soon as I looked at it I could tell the pricing was no where close to what I had bid. When I questioned it the response was ..... "those are the bid approval pricing list that you agreed to work with when you signed on as a contractor."

Well not so fast there. They forget that I protested the extremely cheap pricing right from the start.

I also know they lie a lot, come to think of it so does one of the other companies. And the third company's price list is extremely cheap as well. Exercise extreme caution when dealing with all three.
This aforementioned company quit paying trip charges "because their clients quit paying them". Well I know thats a lie. I've also been told that their clients don't pay on HUD rate, I also know thats a lie.

None of the large banks give 100% of their business to one national company. They spread it around for the purposes of getting 2nd bids ect. The reason I know of their lies is that these other banks also give out W/Os to some of the other nationals I work with. Guess what? they get paid HUD rate and still pay trip charges.
Is the large bank going to have such a huge difference in business practices from one national to the next????
I HIGHLY DOUBT IT!!!!


----------



## Guest

littlephe said:


> That's good to know. I thought I was losing my mind. I know I didn't see a private message. :blink:


I didn't know that...sorry. 18 more to go:w00t:
I tried sending you a message and it said I couldn't "yet" anyhow. Get posting and all of us can reply back and forth


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> A word of wisdom to those that are looking for work.
> 
> There are 3 different companies in UT that look for contractors. There must be some thing in the water out there because all three are not worth working for.
> 
> Today I was given a "bid approval" on a property I initial secured in Jan. As soon as I looked at it I could tell the pricing was no where close to what I had bid. When I questioned it the response was ..... "those are the bid approval pricing list that you agreed to work with when you signed on as a contractor."
> 
> Well not so fast there. They forget that I protested the extremely cheap pricing right from the start.
> 
> I also know they lie a lot, come to think of it so does one of the other companies. And the third company's price list is extremely cheap as well. Exercise extreme caution when dealing with all three.
> This aforementioned company quit paying trip charges "because their clients quit paying them". Well I know thats a lie. I've also been told that their clients don't pay on HUD rate, I also know thats a lie.
> 
> None of the large banks give 100% of their business to one national company. They spread it around for the purposes of getting 2nd bids ect. The reason I know of their lies is that these other banks also give out W/Os to some of the other nationals I work with. Guess what? they get paid HUD rate and still pay trip charges.
> Is the large bank going to have such a huge difference in business practices from one national to the next????
> I HIGHLY DOUBT IT!!!!


:thumbup:


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## BPWY

Check your email Fremont. You will see some of the back ground info on this.


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## Guest

Just finished up a class today taught by the guy who will be teaching the RRP class. I was so mad by the time he got done with a summary of the RRP I could spit. I can't beleive they are testing for lead with a wet wipe. That is the dumbest thing I have heard for a long time. Leave it to the gooberment. Pay lots of $$$ for the class, more $$$ for the RRP cert and many, many more $$$ for the HEPA vacuum:furious::furious: FYI a vacuum with a HEPA filter is not the same as an approved HEPA vacuum.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> Just finished up a class today taught by the guy who will be teaching the RRP class. I was so mad by the time he got done with a summary of the RRP I could spit. I can't beleive they are testing for lead with a wet wipe. That is the dumbest thing I have heard for a long time. Leave it to the gooberment. Pay lots of $$$ for the class, more $$$ for the RRP cert and many, many more $$$ for the HEPA vacuum:furious::furious: FYI a vacuum with a HEPA filter is not the same as an approved HEPA vacuum.


 Actually you test for lead with a recognized test kit. The wet wipe is for verification of your clean up. The fees are bad but the amount of time required to do all the paper work is the real problem for me, I already do way too much of that. The containment is kind of a joke anyway, having all the documentation is what is going to keep you out of the $32,500 fines. 
I can't wait to try and get an asset manager to sign the receipt of pamphlet form and mail it to me, should be fun.


----------



## Guest

bpwy said:


> a word of wisdom to those that are looking for work.
> 
> There are 3 different companies in ut that look for contractors. There must be some thing in the water out there because all three are not worth working for.
> 
> Today i was given a "bid approval" on a property i initial secured in jan. As soon as i looked at it i could tell the pricing was no where close to what i had bid. When i questioned it the response was ..... "those are the bid approval pricing list that you agreed to work with when you signed on as a contractor."
> 
> well not so fast there. They forget that i protested the extremely cheap pricing right from the start.
> 
> I also know they lie a lot, come to think of it so does one of the other companies. And the third company's price list is extremely cheap as well. Exercise extreme caution when dealing with all three.
> This aforementioned company quit paying trip charges "because their clients quit paying them". Well i know thats a lie. I've also been told that their clients don't pay on hud rate, i also know thats a lie.
> 
> None of the large banks give 100% of their business to one national company. They spread it around for the purposes of getting 2nd bids ect. The reason i know of their lies is that these other banks also give out w/os to some of the other nationals i work with. Guess what? They get paid hud rate and still pay trip charges.
> Is the large bank going to have such a huge difference in business practices from one national to the next????
> I highly doubt it!!!!


if you dont work directly for the bank or the listing agent its not worth getting into the reo business.

Forget the nationals like fas or safeguard... Unless you like working for minimum wage.


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## Guest

sossecureda said:


> Actually you test for lead with a recognized test kit. The wet wipe is for verification of your clean up. The fees are bad but the amount of time required to do all the paper work is the real problem for me, I already do way too much of that. The containment is kind of a joke anyway, having all the documentation is what is going to keep you out of the $32,500 fines.
> I can't wait to try and get an asset manager to sign the receipt of pamphlet form and mail it to me, should be fun.


Thanks for the correction and I wasn't going to post this since I really don't know what to believe anymore but here goes:

In the P&P field you can go ahead and complete your work but you must provide documentation that YOU tried to have the RRP forms signed. This proof is only by sending by Certified Mail the RRP signature forms to the 1) prior homeowner 2) the bank and 3) the Service Company. This serves as proof that you made every attempt to receive signatures but due to the house being empty and the deadlines imposed by the Service Company/Realtor the signature and the "serving" of the papers were made and you attempted. This was explained to me from the EPA at our State level. 
I would love some of the "old timers" to chime in on this subject:notworthy I have been told of a possible scenario that is or can be played out: P&P contractor goes to property and not licensed and performs some work (subjective what that is) that is subject to the RRP Laws and then you tell the Service Company that the property is in "convey status" so the property conveys to HUD....Every HUD home has a LBP (lead based paint) inspection and "what if it comes back positive"? HUD will reconvey back to the Service Company to abate the mold now (not do Lead RRP) but abatement......
Who holds the bag for this cost? I guess only 1 possibility exists and its not good for the P&P contractor
That is just 1 example that was given to me....Chime in on what YOU think. We are a Certified Firm and all our guys/gals are licensed renovators but still we don't want to have to follow these Mickey Mouse Regs but not for us to decide


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## Guest

Here is how it was explained to me: The current sample pre-renovation form must be signed by the person contracting the work unless it is emergency work. After explaining how my work is contracted I was advised to attach a pdf of the lead pamphlet and the pre-renovation form to an email. The asset manager can then print off the form, sign it, and mail it to the p&p contractor. I was advised against using an electronically signed or faxed document, but that is probably a question for a lawyer. I was also advised that all other documentation _should_ be fine to send electronically as long as it is documented. 
With the hud rule being only 2sqft disturbed I'm sure most pre 78 hud repairs with lead will fall under rrp. Now whether the p&p contractor is certified or not the remediation should not fall on the contractor because of rrp. If the lead inspector finds lead dust or loose paint chips in the area that was disturbed by the contractor then I could see it being a big problem for an uncertified firm. The contractor has just opened themselves up to fines and all kinds of liability because they have at the very least contaminated one room and probably any hall way leading to that room if the dwelling isn't forced air hvac. Will the inspector bother to check out/report firms if there isn't any dust or chips? Hard to say.


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## Guest

sossecureda said:


> Here is how it was explained to me: The current sample pre-renovation form must be signed by the person contracting the work unless it is emergency work. After explaining how my work is contracted I was advised to attach a pdf of the lead pamphlet and the pre-renovation form to an email. The asset manager can then print off the form, sign it, and mail it to the p&p contractor. I was advised against using an electronically signed or faxed document, but that is probably a question for a lawyer. I was also advised that all other documentation _should_ be fine to send electronically as long as it is documented.
> With the hud rule being only 2sqft disturbed I'm sure most pre 78 hud repairs with lead will fall under rrp. Now whether the p&p contractor is certified or not the remediation should not fall on the contractor because of rrp. If the lead inspector finds lead dust or loose paint chips in the area that was disturbed by the contractor then I could see it being a big problem for an uncertified firm. The contractor has just opened themselves up to fines and all kinds of liability because they have at the very least contaminated one room and probably any hall way leading to that room if the dwelling isn't forced air hvac. Will the inspector bother to check out/report firms if there isn't any dust or chips? Hard to say.


I agree with the .pdf email but when I spoke with some of the service companies and the realtors they stated "in no way are we signing this". They don't want to be the liable party to a house that may lose a ton of value if lead is found. Sounds reasonable to us? SO thats what generated the call to the State EPA/Dept of Health who informed us to send by certified mail so there is a record of notifying. Ultimately the person/company hiring for the work would be the bank and good luck finding anyone to sign this form:whistling On the otherhand can you see the expressions on their face when they start receiving certified mail by the bucket loads from contractors :thumbup: 
I gotta disagree on the contractor not being the responsible party since the **it runs downhill and they always expect the contractor to eat those charges and personally I think that is who's lap its going to fall in until there is someone sues and gets a court ruling... JMHO


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## Guest

*All set and ready to go...*

Our company has everything set up, Insurance, nationals applications filled out and also many contacts to listing agents and banks. How long does it generally take to get a call or a work order. I have been following up without trying to make them all crazy....

We are in North Florida. Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks.

Tami
K.C.E., Inc.


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## BPWY

TamiL531 said:


> Our company has everything set up, Insurance, nationals applications filled out and also many contacts to listing agents and banks. How long does it generally take to get a call or a work order. I have been following up without trying to make them all crazy....
> 
> We are in North Florida. Any advice is appreciated.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Tami
> K.C.E., Inc.





If those folks had work in your area you might have already heard from them.
If there are a lot of vendors in your area you might be waiting a while until some one either quits, or screws up and gets fired.

It can take a while for the nationals to process your application. Just because you've applied with them is no reason to think you'll ever hear from. I've applied with several dozen over the last 6 months. I've only gotten about a 5% return on my applications.


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## Guest

We were approved with FannieMae also, but have not heard anything back from them either.


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## Guest

*I'm concentrating on offering my services to agents, brokers, and banks.*

Linda

I have been reading alot of what you have been saying and really enjoy your passion and knowledge about the business. In this one I noted that you spoke on "I'm concentrating on offering my services to agents, brokers, and banks". It was my same concern that mad me do a search to see if I could find something on the net that would lead me in the same direction as I felt people wouldnt share this kind of know how with me. I have been in the business for over 5 years working with the asset management companies and I can agee to everything you have said. However I feel that I want a change and be more in control of my profits as some of them have reduced the prices like grass cuts and have a 25% to 30% discount. That makes it hard for subs and me to make a real good profit to pay insurance and other related expences. If there something that you can share with me on how I can offer my services to my local agents, broker and banks? I have three broker I work with know but I never thought I could work with the banks direct as I thought they only work with the asset management companies.

Tat


a1propertyclean said:


> Carlos ~
> 
> Safeguard is NOT a bad choice for a starting point. It's a VERY good way to get your feet wet.
> 
> I'm having issues with First Am right now. I'm going back and forth with them because of non-payment and short-payment issues and have been shifting my focus away from asset management companies. I'm concentrating on offering my services to agents, brokers, and banks.
> 
> Asset management companies have their upside and their downside. Once you have an issue with even one person at the administrative level, there are residual penalties imposed on you regarding future work, even if the problem is because someone on their end failed to do their job.
> 
> In my case, someone in their office didn't do my address change when I moved, which would have taken less than 30 seconds. As a result, I did not receive a check for 4 weeks and had no way to take care of all the work they gave me by the end of that 4 weeks. No money for gas, trucks, trailers, dump fees, or labor. They nearly shut me down and didn't even care.
> 
> Then, since the work was behind, they pulled work from me that I'd already completed and gave it to another vendor. As a result, there's a vendor out there who got paid $1,800 and didn't even have to do the work. I've been fighting that one since day 1.
> 
> One of the missing checks went to my ex-partner's residence, thanks to the Post Office. It never has shown up anywhere so I assume he's just holding it out of spite. The other 3 showed up within a day or two of the replacement checks from First Am.
> 
> By the time I received my payment, they had lumped everything into a check so large the bank held it for another 10 days. Thank goodness I have a good relationship with my bank and they were able to release $5,000 to me the day of the deposit and another $5,000 2 days before the end of the hold. The other $15,000 was sorely needed by that time to pay my subcontractors who had also been waiting for payment.
> 
> This, of course, gave my ex-partner another way to undermine my operation, which he was already trying to destroy because of his jealousy. He's cost me 2 subcontractors and 2 employees, has sabotaged both of my trucks and half of my equipment. I have video of him showing up at 3 am here at my house.
> 
> Fortunately, I'm strong and so is my business. Once all the other partnership battles are resolved, he'll be facing libel and slander suits. In the meantime, I have a business to run and don't have time for his nonsense.
> 
> Things in this industry are not always easy, to say the least. Remember there's always someone around the corner who can hurt you as easily as help you.
> 
> As in every business, there are good people and there are bad people. So, keep in mind that even the simplest of problems can turn into big ones faster than you can form the thought.
> 
> Sorry for the book, Carlos. Your question touched a sensitive spot regarding First Am and I felt it necessary to warn people that things happen. You can easily go from being paid "weekly" to being paid "weakly".
> 
> Linda


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## Guest

Well here goes last years work done, getting chargebacks on evictions completed in 2009. Today was the 1st, I'm sure more will follow. We got charged back today on an eviction done in Oct of 09. I took 3 men, total of 4. Drove 1 hour to the property, set out at least 15cuyds of personals/post eviction debris and removed it per the sheriff the day off. Then leave the property, come back to the home town landfill, keep in mind 3 men still in the truck. Disposed of the post eviction debris, then back to my office. Turned the completion in for 4 men for 4 hours totaling 16 hours @ $20 per man hour to set out and remove eviction debris. Well today's chargeback says: per photos eviction should not have took 4 hours with 4 men so we are reducing it to 4 men for 1 hour. Who in the h_ll do they think they are. They don't have a clue what goes on out here also a dump fee was in volved. So now they want to pay a total of 4 hours @ $20 per man hour = $80. I had more than that in labor paying $10 an hour, fuel, dump fee??? I'm so lost for words and what this business is heading to. In 2008 we were told to remove post eviction debris by the cuyd. Well we did, in 2009 we got charged back for all of them and were told the reason was HUD says to remove eviction debris for man hours. Well let me say only the Wells Fargo ones. So I guess now here in 2010, we will get charged back on the evictions done in 2009 for charging for too many man hours. Who are these people to judge my drive time, fuel, labor, insurance, ect and expect perfect work. I'm 4 years deep invested (time) in this business and every sunrise it gets so discouraging with new rules made before every sunset with no memos to let us know until they can find another reason for a, guess what CHARGEBACK. I know what you are thinking, stop working for them, well we cover pretty much rural areas 15 counties. You ask a broker around here about working directly with them and they say, "I'm not familiar with what you do.". They let the asset management companies handle everything. Here the brokers just want to know when you are finished so the can take off your lock box, (that I paid for) and stick there's on the door with a sign in the yard. Sorry this is so long but I have nowhere else to vent. My advice to newbies, good luck. You better have deeep pockets! Because everyone will be trying to reach their hands in them too. This business used to be good when you were 1 of 2 vendors covering large areas. It equaled large volumes. Now the nationals have hired so many newbies it is saturated with vendors. When I was 1 of 2 for 15 counties, now I am 1 of 6 for the same area. Way less volume. Oh and grass cutting season started today, although we cover 15 counties for P&P we are only getting grass cuts for only four of the counties, totaling about 50 twice a month. So no, we don't hire subs, I do it all myself with a helper. It's the only way to make it happen, but still small profits but I do enjoy the freedom and not being tied down in an indoor job. You have to pay to play!!!


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## Guest

APFS said:


> Well here goes last years work done, getting chargebacks on evictions completed in 2009. Today was the 1st, I'm sure more will follow. We got charged back today on an eviction done in Oct of 09. I took 3 men, total of 4. Drove 1 hour to the property, set out at least 15cuyds of personals/post eviction debris and removed it per the sheriff the day off. Then leave the property, come back to the home town landfill, keep in mind 3 men still in the truck. Disposed of the post eviction debris, then back to my office. Turned the completion in for 4 men for 4 hours totaling 16 hours @ $20 per man hour to set out and remove eviction debris. Well today's chargeback says: per photos eviction should not have took 4 hours with 4 men so we are reducing it to 4 men for 1 hour. Who in the h_ll do they think they are. They don't have a clue what goes on out here also a dump fee was in volved. So now they want to pay a total of 4 hours @ $20 per man hour = $80. I had more than that in labor paying $10 an hour, fuel, dump fee??? I'm so lost for words and what this business is heading to. In 2008 we were told to remove post eviction debris by the cuyd. Well we did, in 2009 we got charged back for all of them and were told the reason was HUD says to remove eviction debris for man hours. Well let me say only the Wells Fargo ones. So I guess now here in 2010, we will get charged back on the evictions done in 2009 for charging for too many man hours. Who are these people to judge my drive time, fuel, labor, insurance, ect and expect perfect work. I'm 4 years deep invested (time) in this business and every sunrise it gets so discouraging with new rules made before every sunset with no memos to let us know until they can find another reason for a, guess what CHARGEBACK. I know what you are thinking, stop working for them, well we cover pretty much rural areas 15 counties. You ask a broker around here about working directly with them and they say, "I'm not familiar with what you do.". They let the asset management companies handle everything. Here the brokers just want to know when you are finished so the can take off your lock box, (that I paid for) and stick there's on the door with a sign in the yard. Sorry this is so long but I have nowhere else to vent. My advice to newbies, good luck. You better have deeep pockets! Because everyone will be trying to reach their hands in them too. This business used to be good when you were 1 of 2 vendors covering large areas. It equaled large volumes. Now the nationals have hired so many newbies it is saturated with vendors. When I was 1 of 2 for 15 counties, now I am 1 of 6 for the same area. Way less volume. Oh and grass cutting season started today, although we cover 15 counties for P&P we are only getting grass cuts for only four of the counties, totaling about 50 twice a month. So no, we don't hire subs, I do it all myself with a helper. It's the only way to make it happen, but still small profits but I do enjoy the freedom and not being tied down in an indoor job. You have to pay to play!!!


Been there done that. We no longer do any evictions since we got chargedback for everyone (yes everyone) in some way shape or form. Whats nice is when they change the rules in 2009 on how to invoice and then chargeback for the work in 2008 since you didn't follow the 2009 rules......Gotta tell ya my crystal ball is in the shop right now but I think I better get it fast!
We find out that turning in those unlicensed contractors seem to put a real fast stop to the competition Went to a house with the plumbers today to do a bunch of plumbing repairs and lowandbehold another crew was repairing the house (plumbing/electrical/flooring/walls) and they asked "what would we charge for this service?" only answer we had was "wheres the permits?" Answer: uuuhhhhhh you need permits? The plumbing company was on the phone with the City Inspector reporting them while we were there. Imagine rats jumping off a burning ship:w00t:
Stop all work is now posted and reported to the Bank...Do I feel sorry for the hacks? Nope. Are they going to get chargedback for all there completed work? yes...Do I feel bad for the hacks? Nope again. If you want in the game then play by the rules!


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## APlusPPGroup

TAT44995 ~

Going to agents and brokers direct can be tough but it can be done. There's no right or wrong way but the first step is to establish some sort of communication, whether it's in person or by e-mail.

It can be a long process and you'll need lots of patience since the nationals have a strong presence and a lot of agents and brokers have no choice but to use them.

Just be sure not to overwhelm them with e-mails and flyers. There are preservation companies out there that literally bombard me with their flyers and, if I were interested, I'd already have them in my network.

Good luck to you.

Linda


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## BPWY

Hi Linda, hows business?
Haven't seen you around much so I assumed you must be pretty busy.


Things are so so for me. I have no doubt that about a month from now I'll be buried to my eye balls.
I'm signing up as much lawn care as I can find outside of the P&P business. If the new HUD rates are as low as it sounds like they could be there will be no way possible I'll be able to operate with the expenses of running a biz and then giving up the discount rates that some folks expect to get. Earlier this week I dropped my business relationship with a company that was taking any where from 55% to 65% off of HUD rate and then telling me that I couldn't up the amount of yrds to cover my expenses and that this was all their clients was paying. 
I knew that to be a lie among others because some of their customers are also banks of other customers of mine that do pay HUD rate and pays much better to me. One national that I work with pays HUD less 20% meaning that I get $64 for a grass cut. This other company was offering $25 FOR THE SAME THING. 
So if the new HUD rate drops by nearly 50% and then the nationals want to take another 45% to 65% off that to pay their subs I don't see that very many subs will stay in biz for very long!!!


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## APlusPPGroup

Things have been slowing down considerably over the past 3 weeks for us, Paul.

I have no doubt banks are gearing up for the next wave, though, so the down-time has been a good time for catching up with other things that needed to be done.

We're more than ready, as are our vendors. So bring it on...........!!!

Hope everyone has a great holiday weekend. Be safe out there.

Linda


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## BPWY

Some not so lite reading that should impress upon every one to be certain the property you go to doesn't appear occupied.
If some one tells you it is it would be wise to stop all work and notify the bank and let them sort it out.

http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?...merica_Alleging_Erroneous_Foreclosure_Attempt

http://abcnews.go.com/Business/bank-america-sued-foreclosing-wrong-homes/story?id=9637897&page=1

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704655004575113872190094934.html?


If the place *looks* occupied I leave immediately. When in doubt it'll be better to just pull out and let the banks double check their records.


This sort of thing happening should not come as a shock to any one. The banks have exhibited poor behavior for years on end. Its partly their fault that there are so many foreclosures, its all their fault that a paid for house gets secured and utilities shut off.
The many insane things that we all see going on would get normal folks put into a padded room. And yet the banks are given a pass.....


This easily could have happened to me. Multiple times thru out 09 I was given a w/o on an address to initial secure. I would drive out, take photos and report it as occupied and leave. Probably 4 or 5 times.
Finally about the 5th time some one was home and I spoke to him. The name on the w/o was several miles down the road and he said that he often got that guys mail. Had I not been diligent in reporting that property as occupied I could have so easily gotten into trouble.


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## Guest

We had a lady here try to jump on this "bandwagon" claiming she still lived at a house I secured. Funny she still lived there with no running water, 2 toilets full of feces, no furniture, no tv, no refrigerator, and no stove. The only food present was in garbage bags in the middle of the kitchen floor. The house was unsecured upon arrival (garage overhead door and front door both unlocked). I even asked the next door neighbor and they told me the owners have been gone for 8 months. 

The next day the P.O. claimed she was going to sue the bank for having to stay at a hotel. Some people...I tell ya!


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Things have been slowing down considerably over the past 3 weeks for us, Paul.
> 
> I have no doubt banks are gearing up for the next wave, though, so the down-time has been a good time for catching up with other things that needed to be done.
> 
> We're more than ready, as are our vendors. So bring it on...........!!!
> 
> Hope everyone has a great holiday weekend. Be safe out there.
> 
> Linda


I wouldn't count on a "next wave" coming in soon.
I have been told that their is an unofficial "freeze" put on foreclosures by the White House, asking banks to delay anymore foreclosures until after the November elections.
One very large bank has outsources all it internal assent management and is building an new in house short sale program.


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## BPWY

Every thing that the white house does to try and get banks to lend more money is stymied on the other hand by all their efforts to stop banks from unloading their bad assets so that they can lend money to those that qualify.

The more the gooberment meddles the worse the problems become.


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## Guest

fathersonfab said:


> I wouldn't count on a "next wave" coming in soon.
> I have been told that their is an unofficial "freeze" put on foreclosures by the White House, asking banks to delay anymore foreclosures until after the November elections.
> One very large bank has outsources all it internal assent management and is building an new in house short sale program.


 
This is partly true or that is what we have been told by some very "high up" sources..VP level and higher...
BUT a lot of the "U.S." banks have sold off their loan portfolios to companies domiciled out of the USA borders and they are not "participating" any loan modification programs or the unannounced moritorium. That is why I think this will be brought out of the "closet" and officially announced a National Moratorium so all banks would have to follow suit. IMO its just delaying the inevitable OR they "Gov" will finally realize the only way to stop the foreclosures is for us people that actually are paying our bills to just "give them their house"  Anyway I would not be surprised if this has not already been thought of...:whistling


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## Guest

*I would be happy to cut lawns for $30*

contracting with AMS we have to do everything, inspection including tons of photos, repairs, maintenance, cleaning, lawn, you name it for $35 twice a month. I miss the days when all we had to do was cut the lawns for $30. The extra $5 sure doesn't cover the time, RV antifreeze, lumber and pc time uploading, etc. Then we are still lucky if they pay, they find any reason what so ever not to pay. Unfortunately they are the only ones to contract with on the HUD homes.


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## BPWY

MI Forclosures said:


> contracting with AMS we have to do everything, inspection including tons of photos, repairs, maintenance, cleaning, lawn, you name it for $35 twice a month. I miss the days when all we had to do was cut the lawns for $30. The extra $5 sure doesn't cover the time, RV antifreeze, lumber and pc time uploading, etc. Then we are still lucky if they pay, they find any reason what so ever not to pay. Unfortunately they are the only ones to contract with on the HUD homes.





You can't pay money out of your pocket for the priveledge to work for these companies. I refuse to go broke for these companies. 
I've quit 2 companies already this yr. One simply because they were too cheap. The other because they don't pay in a timely manner and lie a lot to me about that and other issues. 
These nationals are getting rich off of our work and most of the time are making far more money than what they are paying the contractor.


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## Guest

HAS A COMPANY CALL ME TO DO SOME GRASS CUT AND INSPECTION WORK IN ALABAMA .GET THIS FOR A BIG 15.00$ I CAN CUT AND INSPECTION THE PROPERTY THEY SAID WE HAVE A LOT VOLUME IN MY AREA I BET YOU DO @ THAT PRICE :no: I TOLD HIM I WISH HIM LUCK . HAVE ANY ONE DONE ANY WORK FOR OCWEN I SING UP WITH THEM JUST LIKE TO KNOW ARE THEY A GOOD COMPANY TO WORK WITH.:whistling


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## ARPPP

Ocwen, keeps me pretty busy and they are fair. Pricing is decent, not great.


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## Guest

Heres a letter from my vendor, explains a lot of what is going on out there::shutup:


"As we are all aware, with all of the continuing federal intervention and other foreclosure moratoriums, business volumes are not as high as all of us had anticipated for 2010. Spectrum is fortunate in that our reduction in volume is not as bad as most; however, we had purposely over-staffed for a much higher expected volume than what has transpired thus far this year.

Our management group stays in very close contact with the major players in our industry. The general sentiment we are hearing is that there continues to be an enormous quantity of foreclosed or seriously delinquent loans (known as the “shadow inventory”). Very little of that inventory seems to be breaking loose because of the intervention and foreclosure moratoriums mentioned above. Most upper-level thinking at this point is that it may be close to the end of the year (perhaps after the election in November) before we see appreciable increases in volume.

Accordingly, with regret, our management group has made the decision to reduce our staff by 15%, which will occur the beginning of next week. We are advising that this is taking place as some of those that you may communicate with on a regular basis at Spectrum may be part of this reduction in force.

Additionally, if you are unable to reach someone, please dial through to Spectrum’s receptionist who will direct you to the correct Spectrum staff member who will be able to assist you.

If you have any questions, feel free to contact any of Spectrum’s senior team leads or department managers."


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## Guest

As Fathersonfab said "I wouldn't be expecting that next big wave". Its ironic how 6-9 months ago all the companies were calling to "please gear up and hire additional staff" for the large increase in volume that "has not appeared". As the saying goes in this industry "hear 100% of what your told and believe 10% of what you hear". You see the servicing companies place unreasonable requirements on the contractors (secure home in 24 hours, meet the utility companies when your told to, complete 50% of assigned grass cuts within the first 5 days or risk losing territory, etc etc etc) and threaten to stop sending work if not done by "their" timelines while they "run your business".


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> .............. while they "run your business".






Don't forget the ones that send you a "bid approval price sheet".

One that shows them making in excess of 50% of HUD rate while they pass on the bread crumbs to the contractor.

I still haven't figured out yet how you have a "bid approval price sheet" before the bid is even turned in.


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## Guest

Anyone working for Cyprexx Service and if so how are they to work for?
Thank you


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## Guest

capo said:


> Anyone working for Cyprexx Service and if so how are they to work for?
> Thank you


Good Luck.


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## Guest

You know I have found Cyprexx very good to work for but........:whistling
You have to bid every job to your pay standards instead of working for their allowables. YES Cyprexx will allow you to do that but the newbies just follow their rules like sheep to slaughter and go broke. 
They have always took our bid and then "marked up" on top of it instead of a discount. We have very close relationships with a good bunch of realtors that list a lot of Cyprexx homes and it is literally amazing HOW MUCH they mark up your bid. I had one a while back that we bid at $850 and received. When the realtor came over with the paperwork it showed that "I" had bid $1700. Cyprexx doubled my bid and made $850 for doing a little paperwork. Can't complain since I got what I bid and made a little $$. Since that time I bid things a little higher and when they call to ask me if I could lower the bid a little I so "no this is about as low as I can go so just don't mark up on your end as high"
We happy---they happy


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## mtmtnman

capo said:


> Anyone working for Cyprexx Service and if so how are they to work for?
> Thank you




RUN FOREST RUN!!! 2 months with them is all i could stomach. Constant e-mails asking for this and that when they already have what they are looking for!! Cry like babies when i ask for $100 trip charge to drive 150 miles for a $600 initial service job. On & On & On..........


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> RUN FOREST RUN!!! 2 months with them is all i could stomach. Constant e-mails asking for this and that when they already have what they are looking for!! Cry like babies when i ask for $100 trip charge to drive 150 miles for a $600 initial service job. On & On & On..........




Do they have a lot of Walter types working there????

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:


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## Guest

OK for us we just got done with our first cycle of grass cuts. How is everyone finding the B.S. requirements this year with some of these companies? I think its going to be a long long Grass Cut season:sad:


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> OK for us we just got done with our first cycle of grass cuts. How is everyone finding the B.S. requirements this year with some of these companies? I think its going to be a long long Grass Cut season:sad:



The less i have to do with MCS the better. (only had 2 for them this go around) I had 100+ grass cuts and only cut 4 lawns. Got 4" of snow last night.


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## BPWY

I'm on the second round on some of mine.

Only cut one so far, yesterday.

Have another to cut tomorrow. Around here not much gets going before the first of may.


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## Guest

Got our second round, out of 200 we cut about 15. We had a pretty good snow storm here to.


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## Guest

*Any good advice*

Hi my name is Pete me and my brother just started a property preservation company in Cincinnati Ohio. We have been in the construction field for a long time now and can make pretty much any repairs that's needed. Over the past eight months I have been studying the HUD rules and guidelines. trying to take in as much as possible we are just trying to get our foot in the door. If anyone has any good information they would like to share I would be really grateful. Thanks Pete.


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## Guest

Wow this is quite possibly the worse time to consider getti ng into the p&p field. I think at this stage of the game I would wait to see what the new hud mortgage letter, that is suppose to be out anyday, says the new pay rates are... I think hud is going to feel sorry for us and 2x our p:whistlingay ...


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I think hud is going to feel sorry for us and 2x our p:whistlingay ...





:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:



I think that concert damaged your thinking. It'd be nice but aint gonna happen. Besides even IF they did double it the service companies would still continue to take 60% of the gross and leave the bread crumbs to the contractor.


I agree... its a bad time to be getting into the biz. The easy money has long since been made by those that have been in the biz for a few yrs.


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## Guest

Tongue in cheek
Ac/dc was the loudest concert I have ever been to! Ears were ringing till this morning made my brains mush....


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## BPWY

Yeah I knew you were kidding. 


lol


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## Guest

i dont think its a bad time to start a business im in cincinnati too hit the pavement,have the proper insurances,equipment, and when you get your first gig with a asset management company,small hometown bank ,or sink as far down the pay scale as a realtor,give them a faster than fast turn around on their investment and look good while you do it. good luck:thumbsup:


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## mtmtnman

The new HUD mortgage letter will put a lot of the new starts out to pasture. It's hard enough floating this type of business with the slow pay but if the rates drop 40-50% (this is what i have heard from one of my brokers) and your not already established it will be curtains in short order. I see guy get in this thinking i'm making a boatload and they undercut my rates but are gone in short order after they can't cashflow things.......


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> The new HUD mortgage letter will put a lot of the new starts out to pasture. It's hard enough floating this type of business with the slow pay but if the rates drop 40-50% (this is what i have heard from one of my brokers) and your not already established it will be curtains in short order. I see guy get in this thinking i'm making a boatload and they undercut my rates but are gone in short order after they can't cashflow things.......




I'd like to hear opinions from the old hands on what they think will happen if/when prices get cut that much.

What that'll mean is that in some/many cases the new price will become what the service companies are paying the contractors now. There isn't a whole lot more in terms of $$ the contractors can give up. How are they going to get any one to do their work for them?


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## mtmtnman

Got a nasty gram this AM from one particular company. Did a final conveyance inspection on a property that i have uploaded AT LEAST 500 photos in the last 4 months for. It is a 1 bedroom 1 bath on a 10,000 sq ft lot in excellent condition. This is the SECOND time i had a final conveyance on the property in a month. No work was completed and no bids submitted. I submitted 2 photos of every room and 1 of each side of the home. Here is what i got back:

"Please be advised...You MUST label ALL photos properly. Labeling them as Final Conveyance inspection is not acceptable. Please re-label ALL photos and resubmit as this is a mortgage company requirement"

And my response:

"There was no work completed so how should i label them?? Inside and out side? Or do you want living room, bedroom, kitchen, bathroom, North side south side east side west side of house, Toilet, Basement ect?? A final conveyance photo set is blatantly obvious unless there is work done or a bid submitted."

No reply back so i labeled all 40 photos different. Including inside and outside of toilet, inside and outside of refrigerator, Bedroom, Bedroom closet, water heater, furnace, garage, N,S,E,W side of home exterior ect. Its like were dealing with a bunch of 5 year olds on most days!!

The grass cut BS is starting all over again too. Last summer i submitted literally hundreds of photos for grass cut bids for individual properties. 15-20 pics every 2 weeks and had to re-do the bid every 2 weeks. There was at least 2 dozen or more of these properties which were rural and took at least an hour to get to where i bid ALL SUMMER LONG and never saw an approval. Just got a trip charge for the photos and by the end of summer the grass was 3' tall!!

And people wonder why i am grouchy..............


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## BPWY

Walter we all deal with the same BS. You just have to not hold onto it. 
Let it slide off your back.


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## Guest

*Great site on learning to rekey doors (Video)*

Here's a great site on learning to rekey locks, winterization and much more:clap:

Check it out 

mortgagefieldrep ( dot)com


Go to the communities section and take a look at the videos


----------



## Guest

*IRS Audits on Contractors*

Man this is old---> While checking out several sites to see if this new HUD Mortgage Letter has been released yet I found this on one of the HUD sites talking about independent contractors. Must think YOU all make to much money:whistling

"*IRS to Step Up Audits of Independent Contractor Status*The IRS has announced that it will expand its audits of small businesses during 2010. The purpose of the audits is to assess compliance with the payroll tax requirements that fall on employers and employees and also self-employment payroll tax rules that fall on independent contractors. 
The IRS is assessing compliance; it is not targeting any particular industry. These expanded audits provide a useful reminder to broker/owners to assure that they have current documents setting out the required information. Occasionally broker/owners who have been lax in their record keeping with respect to these written agreements have incurred significant penalties."

THEY need to go after the National Service Companies that treat us worse than their employee's but expect us to drop everything we do to get their stuff done on their schedules.


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## Guest

*Reo*

I have been doing this for over six years and it has gotten really crowded there is still alot of money to be made. just be weary of contractors that are trying to get a really large cut off your work. If you are really trying to break in to it this is abou the only way to go. But, like they said be careful there is alot of responsibility and up front cost in this game. I have seen alot of people wanting to get into this but do not realize how costly it is up front. But, don't get discouraged and just buckle down if it gets hard. It could pay off if your good at your job. Just don't expect to sleep in the begining.


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## Guest

*Wow*

This is one amazing and interesting thread! Some of the best (and honest) info I've found outside of HUD. I really appreciate everyone who has posted, you've helped me in ways you will never know. I'm starting a small family owned and operated PP company in east central Alabama to serve our area plus some of GA. The other day we responded to a PP ad on craigslist for a Miken Construction Co. They were really on the ball from day one, and within 2 days we had 2 houses. Unfortuantly the houses were 100+ miles from us and we had to turn them down. The gas to go would have cost more than the whole job. But now that I find this thread I'm caution of Miken Construction. They just sound too good to be true and are so helpful it's scary. In fact they seem like the perfect AM company except their pricing is low (they cut 50-75% off hud!). Plus they didn't care if we were lisenced, or even insured. No sub contract agrement form or anything, just a w9, and proof of car insurance and we were ready to go. I'm afraid we may do a couple of houses for them and get stuck with the bill! We can't find any info on them other than their website. (mikenconstruction DOT com - sorry, can't link yet)

I guess the question is am I crazy or am I right not to trust them? has anyone dealt with them before? And how can I check them out or ensure that I don't get burned? The BBB has nothing on them. And 411 turns up the right number. In their defence I will say that they sent some impressive documents to us that really give you a good legit feeling about them. Namely a 22 page pdf on how to take pictures for them, with tons of pics that appear to be from other subs, and then a 15 page procedural manual on how to submit bids, handle certian situations, etc. But I've seen scammers go to insane legnths to convince people.... what do the pro's here think?? I'll be happy to forward the emails to anyone who can help me make an informed decision here.

This is now officially my family's only source of income as of last week, after my old boss stole from me I was forced to quit (looong story). We gotta get things rolling around here or me and the kids will be eating canned beans for breakfast, lunch, and dinner.  yikes!


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## Guest

Pybus, I'd be sceptical. Do a few jobs at risk and see if you get paid. DONT take all the work you can get with a new firm until you trust their payment consistancy and know their payment terms. Your costs are quite different if they pay in 15 days versus 60, especially if you don't have a whole lot of startup capital. Shoot me an email with details on your company and areas you cover, I often get requests for work outside of our coverage areas, but I'm trying to hire like crazy to keep up. Between trash out volume and maintenance work we are doing, its been a busy year thusfar.


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## Guest

MacoServices said:


> Pybus, I'd be sceptical. Do a few jobs at risk and see if you get paid. DONT take all the work you can get with a new firm until you trust their payment consistancy and know their payment terms. Your costs are quite different if they pay in 15 days versus 60, especially if you don't have a whole lot of startup capital. Shoot me an email with details on your company and areas you cover, I often get requests for work outside of our coverage areas, but I'm trying to hire like crazy to keep up. Between trash out volume and maintenance work we are doing, its been a busy year thusfar.


 
Hey Maco, I'de be glad to email you but I don't see your email address on your public profile, and I havn't posted enough to send private messages (I do believe). Would mind sharing an address where I could reach you. You can email me at [email protected] if you don't want to post your address directly to the forum and we can talk more.

I'm always open to try out new vendor lists (cautiously, as you suggested), so feel free to email me. That goes for everyone else as well. Outside of preservation, we also do janitorial, debris removal, new construction cleanup, and yard maintenance. We're kind of an all around company, and if we can't do it we usually know someone who can. We serve a rough 75+ miles of ZIP 36874 at the moment, but are always looking to expand with enough work. :thumbsup:


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## Guest

Hi there guys. I own a small residential HVAC company and am looking to expand into property preservation. I live in the Northwest Indiana\Chicagoland area. I have respomded to two ads on craigslist and did get a response from one. It makes me worry though reading some of the things people have posted here because_ I do not wanna be scammed. The one that did reply sent me a quiz and questionaire but I am not certain how to answer them or find the answers. Is the HUD manual a good place to start. They want to know things like "What are Hazard materials" "What do you do when you show up to an occupied property" "What items are considered personal property?" and " What would you do if a vendor specified a specific key code and you had none?" If anyone can give me some direction I would greatly appreciate it. Also has anyone heard of Midwest REO Maintenance?_


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## Guest

Not to sound like a jerk or anything...but if you can't answer them questions, how would you be able to work in the P&P business? To be honest, this is not a good time to get into it. Seems like everyone knows someone already doing it.


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## Guest

Find out who the MM (Management and Marketing) contractor for HUD is in your State of Indiana. Start there, if you can survive on what they pay... your off to a good start. You will learn alot about the business, however, you will find them to be high maintenance (rules and regs) and low impact (poor pay). While working for them cultivate the local pool of REO real estate agents and start looking for one or two National Asset companies. Good luck because only the strong survive. I hope you find this helpful.


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## Guest

HVAC guy wanting in P&P work?:no: Sorry man but I would be asking every realtor who they use for the P&P work and find out if you could do the HVAC work for them. My HVAC guys run about $5000-$8000 per week in work and lovin it.....remember YOU have the "BIG" license and the P&P guys/gals are not suppose to be doing any HVAC work without your license since they can't pull permits. USE your skills where it is needed. Get with these realtors or the big P&P companies that are replacing furnaces and if you are boiler qualified or a steamfitter than YOU can "name your price" since it seems that all the crazy contractors that are trying to winterize boilers per HUD specs are paying for all the replacements that YOU HVAC guys are doing right now since there is absolutely no way to get "all" the water out and they did not bid to have the specialists (like you) to complete. 
Go where the $$ is...OH YEAH no chargebacks this way!
Good luck!


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## Guest

Indiana HVAC, not sure of your motovation other than $'s, but, Fremont is correct....stay with what you know and cultivate additional leads with those agents and Nationals for HVAC work. Now is not a good time to be getting in anyway, too many unknown variables soon to happen.


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## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Not to sound like a jerk or anything...but if you can't answer them questions, how would you be able to work in the P&P business? To be honest, this is not a good time to get into it. Seems like everyone knows someone already doing it.





Hammer&Cross said:


> Indiana HVAC, not sure of your motovation other than $'s, but, Fremont is correct....stay with what you know and cultivate additional leads with those agents and Nationals for HVAC work. Now is not a good time to be getting in anyway, too many unknown variables soon to happen.





Most of the nationals I'm running into these days are only hiring experienced contractors. If you can find some one that will train their pay scale is not likely to provide a living wage.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Most of the nationals I'm running into these days are only hiring experienced contractors. If you can find some one that will train their pay scale is not likely to provide a living wage.


 
I can swear to this. Without 1,2 or sometimes 3 years experience in P&P you won't hardly find a nation contractor that will even hire you. I've found one so far, and the pay is less than minimum wage per hour...heck sometimes the job's are on a break even basis. But this seems to be the nature of the beast untill every Joe in town gets out of P&P. Take what you can, cut your teeth, and gain that precious experience. Then move on to the bigger companies or branch out yourself.


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## Guest

*Can anyone help me on this quiz??*

1. If you go to a property and find 17 c yards of exterior debris and/or hazards you should:
a) Remove 12 c yards and bid the rest.
b) Bid only, remove nothing.
c) Remove all 17 c yards and charge allowable per yard amount.

2. What does conveyance condition mean, and what loan types are affected by the term?



3. If you go to a property and it is for sale, what should you do?



4. What 2 bids are required if you go to a property with a moldy refrigerator?



5. What 2 bids are required if you go to a property with a roof leak?



6. What 2 bids are required if you go to a property with a broken window?



7. What items need dimensions added into your bid or added to your invoice?



8. What item in the house determines the difference between a steam system winterization and a radiant winterization?



9. What photos are required to support that a winterization has been completed?


10. Explain step by step how to complete a dry winterization.



11. Explain what steps you go through to determine your bid to place property into conveyance condition.



12. Explain what minimum photos are required EVERYTIME you go to a property.



13. When you go to a property to place it into conveyance condition per client’s request, what items are you looking for that would need a bid?



14. If you have placed a bid to put a property into conveyance condition and you received partial approval, should you send in a bid for the items that are still pending from your previous bid?



15. On a Conventional Loan what items are considered personal items?


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## BPWY

Unfortunately this isn't a training site.

The best advice I can give you is.... "google is your friend."
You'll be able to find the answers.

Also there is a training site out there in the big wide internet.

No one here is going to just give the answers so that your company appears to be an experienced company to this national.


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## Guest

Alright sorry about that.
Do you know the website of this trainging site?


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## BPWY

cubicyard.us I think is the site.


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## Guest

SRT-Diesel said:


> 1. If you go to a property and find 17 c yards of exterior debris and/or hazards you should:
> a) Remove 12 c yards and bid the rest.
> b) Bid only, remove nothing.
> c) Remove all 17 c yards and charge allowable per yard amount.
> 
> *Find a burn pile and burn it all up and say there was only 12*
> 
> 2. What does conveyance condition mean, and what loan types are affected by the term?
> 
> *Its a type of stoplight*
> 
> 
> 
> 3. If you go to a property and it is for sale, what should you do?
> 
> *Grab that sign and burn it with the debris (exterior only)*
> 
> 
> 
> 4. What 2 bids are required if you go to a property with a moldy refrigerator?
> 
> *1) Can I take it home?*
> *2) Is the food any good can you keep it?*
> 
> 
> 
> 5. What 2 bids are required if you go to a property with a roof leak?
> 
> *1) how much can we charge for a shower?*
> *2) dah what roof leak*
> 
> 
> OH man I can't go on...
> Gotta have some fun eh? At least we can all laugh. At one time we were all there too. Learn the business or don't get in the game.
> Gotta go post for help wanted on Contractor talk for fire home!


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## Guest

Thanks Freemont, I spit soda on my LCD screen!


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## Guest

8. What item in the house determines the difference between a steam system winterization and a radiant winterization?

The Weber grill in the living room to heat the house (dont laugh, I have seen it)!


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## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> 8. What item in the house determines the difference between a steam system winterization and a radiant winterization?
> 
> The Weber grill in the living room to heat the house (dont laugh, I have seen it)!



I'm not surprised.

I was talking with a cleaning service one day. We were discussing foreclosed houses and how nasty some can be.

He tells me.... "YOU WOULDN"T BELIEVE THE MESS".

I replied, Oh yes I would. I've seen em. After a couple yrs nothing will surprise you any longer.


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## Guest

*HEPA Vac*

Anybody found a good, affordable HEPA vac? It just kills me to pay nearly a grand for stupid vacuum. :furious:

IMHO RRP is going to drive the price of pre 78 houses down even lower. Which will be really good for making positive cash flowing rental properties. Until the tenants sue for their kids being stupid due to the Lead Paint in the house...


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## Guest

uintahiker said:


> Anybody found a good, affordable HEPA vac? It just kills me to pay nearly a grand for stupid vacuum. :furious:
> 
> IMHO RRP is going to drive the price of pre 78 houses down even lower. Which will be really good for making positive cash flowing rental properties. Until the tenants sue for their kids being stupid due to the Lead Paint in the house...


 
Watch the header bar on top of the page. We ordered a Nikko for $600 w/shipping and the beater bar. Maybe not the best out there but "fairly affordable". They were giving discounts if you mentioned Contractor Talk but they told us when we were ordering our 3rd unit sorry we are so inundated with orders that there is no more discounts....


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## mtmtnman

No common sense anymore. I had an order kicked back because i did not give lot dimensions. Here is what was in my completion report.

_*"Per county GIS records lot size is 10,000 sq ft"*_

They kicked it back because i didn't give them ACTUAL dimensions so i kicked it back to them saying it was 100X100 which it really was not as it was an irregular lot. Guess i could go measure and give them all 4 sides?? Good luck finding the property corners after 30 years huh?


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## Guest

Hi all! I am new to this site and this IS my first post. I have been reading this forum on and off for about 3-4 days and have found everything in here very very helpful, and I thank all of you for each of your insight and knowledge of this field. 

I am doing a lot of investigating into the P&P world as I am very interested in starting one of these businesses in my area (Far North suburbs of Chicago). Through my research I have found that I would have a couple of very nice advantages:

1. There is about a 20-50 mile gap where there are no other Property Preservation companies.

2. I have been given a list of bank/Realtor contacts who are in charge of about 200 properties in my area, which most are not getting regular work completed on them. 

3. The person that gave me the list also has told me that there will be nearly the same amount of foreclosed homes coming in this area over this summer, thus doubling the potential need in this area. 

I realize that I will be spending a lot of time on the phones trying to "get in" with the people that handle these properties, however I believe all it would take is just a couple of them to give us a chance and I know we would be able to do an outstanding job. 

So I am posting today to see if there is anyone that could give me some pointers on how to start, give me an idea of prices, I have downloaded HUD pricing but want to know basic pricing guidelines for work you all already do. How would we go about making our proposals to the banks/Realtor? What is a realistic amount of money that we should prepare to use while marketing, setting this business up, and waiting to get paid for our jobs. I also want to know _really _is it good to sign-up with companies like Safeguard? If it is a good idea, which National is the best one?

Here are my assets:

1. 4 very hard working and capable people (who are currently unemployed anyways) with different backgrounds in carpentry, landscaping, and business.

2. 2 Trucks

3. That list of people to contact

4. just about any tool we could possibly need from carpentry to plumbing to lawn care (if we do not already have it, its finally an excuse to get it ) 

5. A rather large area which there are not already companies here (they may serve the area, but we would most definitely have a faster response time).

What we lack:

1. Financial stability to take a chance and not get paid for 3-6 months

2. Specific industry knowledge and experience

3. Track record with the banks/Realtor

4. Any specific certifications we may need?

5. Anything else we may not already know

So if there is anyone out there that would like to offer us some suggestions, please please do. We are all excited about this opportunity, and even though we are aware that we can make some money in this field, we are also aware that its not as easy as some videos on youtube, and other websites make it appear. 

I thank you in advance for your help and any guidance!

Also if you prefer to contact me via email it is jmbaker23 at hotmail dot com

Thanks again!


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## Guest

Something you should know is this............

Many companies travel many miles to take care of properties 100 miles away. I live in the Rockford area. I used to travel to the Chicago and suburb area every day.

There is a lot of people that have jumped on the bandwagon over the last couple years. That "list" you have is probably in the hands of 100's of other people as well.

If you want to jump in....go for it! Prepare to get underbid by a few other contractors though. Not trying to sound like a jerk, but that's the reality of the business right now.

Pay time very. If its FHA related, prepare to wait a while for pay.

And one more suggestion.....stay FAR FAR away from Safeguard!


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## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> Something you should know is this............
> 
> Many companies travel many miles to take care of properties 100 miles away. I live in the Rockford area. I used to travel to the Chicago and suburb area every day.
> 
> There is a lot of people that have jumped on the bandwagon over the last couple years. That "list" you have is probably in the hands of 100's of other people as well.
> 
> If you want to jump in....go for it! Prepare to get underbid by a few other contractors though. Not trying to sound like a jerk, but that's the reality of the business right now.
> 
> Pay time very. If its FHA related, prepare to wait a while for pay.
> 
> And one more suggestion.....stay FAR FAR away from Safeguard!



Thanks for the reply! I would assume that people would travel fairly far to complete a job, but wouldn't those companies typically add in that extra time traveling into their estimates/bids? I would assume so, which I think would give me a small advantage? Yes, no? Really let me know, as this is a huge leap and the cards stack up even further against me if I don't have all the information. 

As far as the list, I am sure that others have this, and its not really a list per say, its something that a person in a rather large town compiled as she works for the building and codes department for the town. She sues that "list" of names to contact the people that handle the properties. I assume that others have this information, however it was probably compiled over time as they were attempting to get business, I think my advantage would be in already having those names, instead of either purchasing them or compiling them over months to years on the job. 

I think it is funny on how many already in make it sound like it is easy to jump into the business, and I think that is what intrigues me to enter this line of work. I know that it isn't easy to find the work, and its even harder to do the work, but is it really just as easy as saying I am a P&P company and you're in? 

What costs would I assume to have to start? I know there are insurance matters, but since somewherein815 is in Illinois, what else would we need to start this up? I have looked all throughout here and it seems as if it depends on where you are, and I have seen that we would need no investment (highly unlikely) to a fairly decent amount of money to start. 

So any help, and somewhere, your input was helpful, but any help would be great as I am pretty sold on the fact that I could make a decent amount of money doing this.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Here's a company who jumped on the bandwagon and made out like a bandit............. literally.

Just posting this so everyone's aware. Keep your eyes and ears open.

http://cbs4denver.com/investigates/nomad.contractors.foreclosure.2.1686537.html

Have a great week, everyone!

Linda


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## Guest

RLJMB23 we also have worked in the Chicago area. Not for 1 minute think that there is not another P&P contractor in a 25 mile area. Odds are there is 100 P&P contractors in just 1 25mile radius of Chicago or the suburbs. 300 P&P contractors in a 50 mile radius. The worst thing you could possibly do (IMO) is start calling these brokers right now since there are lists that are sold on ebay/craigslist that list names of brokers and/or phone numbers that sell foreclosed homes. I had a realtor told me she receives 10 calls a week and she was forced to have all her calls go to the office instead of her personal number. This has made brokers madder than hornets so good luck with that route. 

Working with Nationals? Risky but at least you know you will get paid as long as the work is done correctly, pictures are dated right, completions are not late or if they don't get a hair up the backsides and decide to charge-you-back for some insane reason. 

Being new and not knowledgable, the way most of us that have been in the business for many years, started by working for HUD or the HUD M&M contractor and learning "the ropes" and the HUD regulations from working "inside with HUD". The problem right now is the M&M contractor for HUD is not paying on time or not paying at all in the Midwest. We have friends that are still in the hole nearly $100,000 so don't for 1 minute think that by working for the HUD M&M you have any protection of being paid. HUD will not stand behing the M&M Contractor for payments to YOU. Go the www.hud.gov site and find the M&M for Illinois since it is different for each area. 

If not working for the HUD M&M than you might consider running an ad to see if any "big" contractors are looking for apprentices and will take you under their "wing" for a couple of years and give you time to learn the business without risking everything you own......

Sorry its not a good business anymore.


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## ARPPP

I handle the Chicagoland area in Will and Cook county. The entire area surrounding Chicago is dense with preservation companies. A lot of wannabee's out there with a lawnmower and drill ready to take on preservation work. Before you invest a dime into this, get a a feel for the list of contacts you have and see if there is any actual work for you. Chicago is a very competitive market and someone is always waiting in the wings to under cut you.

Good luck
Annette
AR Professional Preservation, LLC


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## BPWY

Lets talk software.


I work for a handful of companies. None of which by themselves would keep me busy full time.
I need a good software to track my work history via W/O number and address.
Any suggestions?
Does such a convenience even exist?

Thanks in advance.


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## ARPPP

*Lets talk software/Response*

Quickbooks has this functionality. I use the memo field to store information as it is searchable to.

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC
www.arppp.net


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## mtmtnman

Quickbooks. I use the work order # for invoice # and in the memo i put the address. It's nice to be able to sort by address if you forget what you have done on a property in the past.


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## Guest

*E&amp;O Insurance*

Hi everyone I am in Ga. and would like to know if anyone can recommend a good company for E&O insurance?

Thanks


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## Guest

GOOD E&O? 

Only 1 I found that had broad form coverages is York-Jersey Underwriters. Goggle it and you can get their name. I know there is a couple others that have programs for Property Preservation Contractors but nothing that offers comparable coverages IMO....Maybe the others have changed? Not cheap. Before you buy make sure you will have enough revenue to justify the costs.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> GOOD E&O?
> 
> Only 1 I found that had broad form coverages is York-Jersey Underwriters. Goggle it and you can get their name. I know there is a couple others that have programs for Property Preservation Contractors but nothing that offers comparable coverages IMO....Maybe the others have changed? Not cheap. Before you buy make sure you will have enough revenue to justify the costs.


Thank you for the info. I am trying to get set up with more companies to do Property Preservation and most want E&O Insurance up front. Not sure how to get around that.


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## Guest

Thanks for your input Freemont and ARPPP, this helps a lot.

How would I find out if there are more people in the area that have P&P businesses? I have looked through Dex, Yahoo Yellow Pages, did google searches and everything comes up with this rather large hole in my area all the way to South Milwaukee. 

Like I said I am very interested in "jumping-in" but I do need all the information first. A risk is a risk and it could have a nice reward, but an uninformed risk is, well, just stupidity. 

ARPPP, in the Chicago area do you need any other special licensing or certifications before you can start, or is it really Biz License, insurance and you are good to go?


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## BPWY

Any body here hear of or work for http://www.feillc.com/fei/default.aspx??

They want me to fill out their many pages of paper work and go thru their back ground check before giving me their price list.
They are too dense to understand that I'm not going to waste their time or mine if they are paying too cheap. Like $15 grass cuts, etc. I simply am not going to work for that cheap. I can go back to driving a truck before I work for free.
I asked them politely 3 times and their response was...


> We do not give out price list until we do a background check on potential vendors and they have been signed up as vendors.


I'm thinking that if a company is that ashamed of their pricing they are probably way too cheap.


----------



## BPWY

rljmb23 said:


> Thanks for your input Freemont and ARPPP, this helps a lot.
> 
> How would I find out if there are more people in the area that have P&P businesses? I have looked through Dex, Yahoo Yellow Pages, did google searches and everything comes up with this rather large hole in my area all the way to South Milwaukee.
> 
> Like I said I am very interested in "jumping-in" but I do need all the information first. A risk is a risk and it could have a nice reward, but an uninformed risk is, well, just stupidity.
> 
> ARPPP, in the Chicago area do you need any other special licensing or certifications before you can start, or is it really Biz License, insurance and you are good to go?





I'd venture to say that there is 90% of P&P contractors that don't have a web presence or yellow page ad.


----------



## BPWY

rljmb23 said:


> 1. There is about a 20-50 mile gap where there are no other Property Preservation companies.





They are there. Look on Craigslist. 


This isn't to say that you can't find a company that might train you.


----------



## ARPPP

rljmb23 said:


> Thanks for your input Freemont and ARPPP, this helps a lot.
> 
> ARPPP, in the Chicago area do you need any other special licensing or certifications before you can start, or is it really Biz License, insurance and you are good to go?


While I have a website presence it is a very simple one. I am not listed in any of the directories either. Way too expensive for me at this point. I have plenty of work at this point and if I decide to stay in and expand I will consider a directory listing. 

Yep, you are correct in your thinking. There are no certification requirements for what we do in Illinois. If you do repair work, more than preservation activities such as building a porch, installing a water heater etcetera a lot of the villages may require a licensed professional, so you may need to sub in that instance.


----------



## BPWY

Here is a scammer. 

No matter if this guy is replying to a craigslist ad or to my website it plainly states where I'm located and working out of.
This is the entire email.



> I need a good cleaner,capable in the area to help in cleaning the household.
> 
> Where are you located? kindly get back to me ASAP.


----------



## BPWY

I got another spammer this afternoon.
I'm gonna play along with them and see how far this one goes. lol
No way I'll give em a bank account number or any thing like that.



> Hello,
> I am Engr.Celestine Henry, I work as an engineer, i need a cleaner in my House, am presently in England for some contracts which i will be rounding up not quite long. I will be coming back home. I have been away for couple of months now. All I need is a professional cleaner that will clean my house for me before i arrive back to state, I know definately that the place will be messy now.I will need you to do the general cleaning of my House including the Cutting of the Grass, the pool side, I wouldnt mind if you can help me get someone that will do that for me if you can't. Please just make everything perfect before i arrive, i will arrive in 1-2weeks time, but i will like everything to be ready before my arrival.Money is not my problem, i will make every provisions for you, but i want a perfect job as i said earlier.Looking forward to read back from you.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Engr.Celestine Henry


----------



## BPWY

Whats up guys?

Every one in so much shock over the new HUD letter they can't post? lol


----------



## Guest

Okay boys & girls here's some interesting reading material:


http://www.hud.gov/offices/adm/hudclips/letters/mortgagee/files/10-18ml.pdf


----------



## Guest

Its a pay raise for us except on grass cuts.:thumbup:

We are bidding at the 2010 rates effective 5-13-10


----------



## BPWY

I took a $20 to $30 hit on winterizing in two states I work in.
I got a $25 raise in another state.


It'll be interesting to see what happens with the grass cut prices from the likes of MCS etc that have 
been used to making more on the job than what the contractors were making.
One thing for sure when the offered price drops below market price I'm telling the nationals to find some body else.


----------



## Guest

Re-glaze window for $30 maximum allowance per window? I guess I'll start re-glazing with plastic wrap!

Winterizations were $75 here before, so $100 is nice.

Locks up $20 from before.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Re-glaze window for $30 maximum allowance per window? I guess I'll start re-glazing with plastic wrap!
> 
> Winterizations were $75 here before, so $100 is nice.
> 
> Locks up $20 from before.





Along with the lead law requirements for windows???? Yeah right.

I like the boarding pay scale. Instead of united inch, their flat rate reflects more what materials cost.
With UI pay after discounts were taken most of the time boarding was breaking even on materials with nothing for labor.


----------



## BPWY

Boy do I ever have a deal for you.
All the newbies listen up. This is for you. Finally a training program.
For the low low price of $5000.





> *Attn Vendor: *
> 
> 
> After completing recent quality control audits, due to increased work order volume, and lack of quality work product submitted by a number of vendors, it is necessary for us to educate our vendors and graduate them through our internal training program. Effective June 1, 2010, our company will continue doing business *ONLY* with *approved vendors* that qualify and graduate through our Approved Vendor Program (“AVP”). We are providing the following information as a courtesy update, and we look forward to doing business with your company, upon your graduation from our *Approved Vendor Program! *
> 
> 
> Qualified vendors that participate in our *Approved Vendor Program* will receive the following:
> 
> 
> *APPROVED VENDOR PROGRAM*
> 
> 
> Training booklet (Preservation “*Do’s, Don’ts, and How To’s*”)
> 5 Hours of intensive Preservation Field Training (phone/internet) 1 hour per day for 5 days.
> Vendor will receive a certificate of completion upon passing a training exam with a 90% or better score (those that do not pass with 90% or better will be required to retake the exam until completion of 90% or better, prior to receiving work orders).
> Vendors in field are granted access to utilize the *“Help Desk Line”* which is a Field Assistance Hotline available Monday-Friday 8 AM-6PM EST.
> Participation in NOW Vendor Conference Calls scheduled by .......... (i.e. updates on changes from ......... clients, updates on “best practice” procedures, etc.)
> 
> 
> The  *Approved Vendor Program* consists of an annual non-refundable fee of $5,000.00 due at the time of signing the initial/or revised Corporate Vendor Agreement, and paid annually thereafter on the anniversary of Vendor’s initial or revised Agreement with .......
> Participating Vendors will be granted a discounted renewal rate of $2,500.00. Vendor agrees that a portion of the VAP fee will be allotted towards a criminal background check performed by NOW prior to receiving work orders. In consideration of the VAP fee, NOW will provide the items and assistance listed above.
> 
> 
> We will be contacting you to begin processing your application for participating vendors on Monday. Again, effective June 1, 2010, we will only be assigning work orders to vendors participating in our Approved Vendor Program. If you choose to participate, the AVP fee will be accepted via credit card, cash, or check made payable to ............ Property Preservation....... We regret that we will not be accepting installment plans or partial payments. For vendors who choose not to participate in the offered program, we wish you the best in your future endeavors. *WE LOOK FORWARD TO OUR CONTINUED BUSINESS PARTNERSHIP!*




I was contacted by this P&P company and asked to fill out their paper work some time ago. I never got work from them, and this is the first communication since the initial contact.

There is no way I'm paying them $5000, I would not pay them $500. I might consider a $50 fee.
This is not doctored in any way other than the company name is removed, its a 99.9% direct quote from the email memo I just got today.
Thing is their price structure does not allow for them to charge this and for the contractor to make any money.

What this is is a way for them to be guaranteed their income with the new HUD rates. Only thing is I'm sure they reserve the right to fire you any time they wish, keeping the non refundable fee.
This is not a winning business strategy for either the company or the contractor.



I drove truck for 7 years prior to getting back into this biz. This biz reminds me in many many many ways of how trucking is done. In how truck owners get their work.
This scheme reminds me of how CDL (truck driving license) training is done.
The price is very similar too.


----------



## Guest

I am starting a new school called Fremont P&P School for hardknock contractors at a low 1 time fee of $2500. :laughing:

What a crock. Is this really for real?


----------



## BPWY

Unless some one hijacked their email address it came from the company.
I found it odd that it came from them on a saturday. 
MOST nationals do not work on the weekend.


----------



## Guest

I am needing advice on the best way to find companies that are needing contractors on Ga. I am with one company now but need more work to make it. Not quite sure how to go about it. Any advice will be appreciated.


----------



## BPWY

samccard said:


> I am needing advice on the best way to find companies that are needing contractors on Ga. I am with one company now but need more work to make it. Not quite sure how to go about it. Any advice will be appreciated.




Craigslist and google searches.


----------



## Guest

That $2500 school of hard knocks is a deal compared to the one I just went through. The $5000 is still a deal.

Just got a charge back for a leaking roof we missed about a year ago on our first inspection. Turned it in 2 weeks later when we were back at the property and have turned it in 10 times since then.

If you are thinking about getting into this biz, think really hard, damn hard, and pray for a good contact in the bail out dept 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. Everybody singing the praises for their training systems to teach you to be a P&P contractor forgets to mention this little gem: Charge-backs.

Here it comes...

Still can't quite bring myself to type it...

Wife hasn't stopped crying several days later...

Kids are gonna get used to mac and cheese...


and the damage is


$17,000


----------



## BPWY

Damn man, that hurts!!!

I hope you have good insurance!

Whats their reasoning behind nailing you?


Oh and mac and cheese isn't so bad, I survived for 7 yrs as a single man on that stuff. lol


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> That $2500 school of hard knocks is a deal compared to the one I just went through. The $5000 is still a deal.
> 
> Just got a charge back for a leaking roof we missed about a year ago on our first inspection. Turned it in 2 weeks later when we were back at the property and have turned it in 10 times since then.
> 
> If you are thinking about getting into this biz, think really hard, damn hard, and pray for a good contact in the bail out dept 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. Everybody singing the praises for their training systems to teach you to be a P&P contractor forgets to mention this little gem: Charge-backs.
> 
> Here it comes...
> 
> Still can't quite bring myself to type it...
> 
> Wife hasn't stopped crying several days later...
> 
> Kids are gonna get used to mac and cheese...
> 
> 
> and the damage is
> 
> 
> $17,000


OUCH! Remember don't let them push you around on the roof leak. It has to be an *ACTIVE* roof leak in order for them to charge you back. Example: roof had better have water dripping through onto the ceiling and it better be noticeable in the pics of water dripping. SO if it is a dry sunshine day you cannot prove if it was active or not--well unless its wet or whatnot. Understand we have got chargebacks for tarping a roof that the ceilings were wet and there is a very noticeable area of roof with shingles missing but since there was no dripping water pics to actually prove it was *ACTIVE* than it didn't need tarped ie....chargeback.

Heres the Sh*** of it....it might not have been an active leak when you were there and another contractor might have been there 2-3 days later while its raining and there was water dripping so they tarped and now you are the victim of a chargeback because another contractor (unintentional in this scenario) was trying to make a living. 

I've scene other contractors dumping hazards, dumping debris, breaking windows, punching holes in ROOFS, kicking outlet covers to break them, using 2 cameras to take to photo shoots of grass cuts, breaking toilets so they clean feces....YOU name it and if they do this crap just to make a few $$$ how do YOU or US protect ourselves since the bank never pays for this but charges it back to the last contractor that was there who failed to report it!?

My rant for the day...gotta go to work

We all feel for ya...its only going to get worse.


----------



## Guest

I am a contractor in the New Orleans area and have a lot of experience doing Property Preservation in the private sector. What i was wondering is about inspections. I read earliar that the Nationals were paying 3-5 dollars an inspection. Are these simply driveby inspections, where you go house to house, snap 1 or 2 pictures, and move on to the next one? Sort of like due diligence? If its 3-5 dollars per house, this seems like a very fair price, that is if you are located in an urban area, such as New Orleans. Can anyone clarify this? Linda, you seem to be quite knowledgeable on all subjects, what is your .02 cents?


----------



## BPWY

In my opinion $3 to $5 is no where close to enough. Sure there could be days when you would make money.
They'll be a whole lot more where you won't make money.
The service companies are ripping you the contractor off at those rates. Its possible they are making as much if not more than 3 times what they are paying you.


Keep in mind all the office time and office supplies you'll spend both before and after the actual inspection.
You've got time spent in printing out the inspection forms. Along with the ink and paper. Then at the end of the day you've got a lot of time to spend uploading the photos and filling out the inspection paper work.


----------



## Guest

CCClearing said:


> I am a contractor in the New Orleans area and have a lot of experience doing Property Preservation in the private sector. What i was wondering is about inspections. I read earliar that the Nationals were paying 3-5 dollars an inspection. Are these simply driveby inspections, where you go house to house, snap 1 or 2 pictures, and move on to the next one? Sort of like due diligence? If its 3-5 dollars per house, this seems like a very fair price, that is if you are located in an urban area, such as New Orleans. Can anyone clarify this? Linda, you seem to be quite knowledgeable on all subjects, what is your .02 cents?


CCClearing you are being taken advantage of.:whistling Check with your local Real Estate Board or the governing body for Licensing to do Home Inspections since P&P Inspections fall under those licensing requirements..its just that the Service Companies don't want you to do that "due deligence" since when it comes to you "missing something" (see above post about that roof that was "missed" on the initial inspection) then the company can come back to YOU and state that if YOU had done your due deligence then YOU should have been walking through the home looking for damages EVEN if you are only being paid for a drive by inspection. Seen it many times!


----------



## Guest

Well obviouly i would never do walk through inspections for 3-5 dollars a house, but at one time i had contracts for 2500 properties located within a 15 mile radius. Best and quickest money i believe can be made when you factor in using high end GPS programs for laptops, Microsoft Access Databases, etc to knock out 150-200 a day. The work was directly for an asset manager for a mid sized asset management company that just wanted pictures as proof that the houses in their portfolio actually existed, what type of general condition they were in, and if they could act on foreclosures. Is there any type of this work provided by the national or regional companies? My connection dried out when the company i worked for sold out to Bank of America.:furious:


----------



## Guest

musta worked with Countrywide...
The problem that inspectors tell me all the time is they will do say 350 inspections every 2 weeks but they divvy them out 10 today, 30 tomorrow, 30 the next day and so on....
Impossible to make any type of route and make a profit since you are always backtracking.
We used to do 700 inspections in Georgia several years ago and yep you could route the entire route 2 weeks in advance at $40 per inspection...ahh those were the good good days...


----------



## Guest

:thumbsup:Nope, worked for a tax asset group out of Virginia. They were on the other side of the business, tax lien purchasers. They bought bulk at the tax sales and really never had an idea of what was contained in their portfolio until the pictures were taken. There was no need to do an in home inspection on their portfolio as most of their properties would be redeemed before they would actually take possession.
I am new to the idea of working for a national company, seems more like a run around and high cash reserves, which necessarily isn't the problem, but there doesn't seem to be any guarantee when you will be paid, if at all. Was looking at LPS and American Field Services in the Louisiana area, has anyone had any experience with these companies?


----------



## Guest

From personal experience LPS I would stay away from. AFS not really sure on so I'll beg off to someone else on them.
Good luck with your decision..remember this business is changing so fast there is no guarantee of anything tomorrow. Check out the HUD page posted by BPWY and they will have the inspection pay to the service company so that can help you with bargaining for the most you can get. Without pulling out the papers I believe its $30 for initial and $20 for subsequent inspections.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Without pulling out the papers I believe its $30 for initial and $20 for subsequent inspections.




Yup.


Like I said earlier, the service companies are getting filthy rich off of the backs of the contractor. While giving the contractor just barely enough to skate by................. maybe.


----------



## Guest

Hello everyone. I'm thinking about working for MSI and MCS could you guys give me some feedback on the both of them. Thanks in advance...


----------



## Guest

capo said:


> Hello everyone. I'm thinking about working for MSI and MCS could you guys give me some feedback on the both of them. Thanks in advance...


 
UHG...:shutup:


----------



## Guest

Has anyone been using Feild Com? 

I have been using their single user/mobile version and love it. A sales guy has tried to get me to upgrade to an office version because it will allow me access to the list of all regional/nationals who are using them. It will also let my brokers place orders into the system from my website But is is many more bucks a month. Is it worth the upgrade?

Muchas gracias, salamat, and thank you


----------



## Guest

OK we were notified by a service company that the 2010 HUD Mortgage Letter has been rescinded...anyone else hear of this? OR is this just another ploy to "tag" the contractor?


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> OK we were notified by a service company that the 2010 HUD Mortgage Letter has been rescinded...anyone else hear of this? OR is this just another ploy to "tag" the contractor?





I hadn't heard that, but I do know that the handful of companies I work for are not talking about the price change. I've gotten W/Os as recent as today with the old pricing.


----------



## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> Has anyone been using Feild Com?
> 
> I have been using their single user/mobile version and love it. A sales guy has tried to get me to upgrade to an office version because it will allow me access to the list of all regional/nationals who are using them. It will also let my brokers place orders into the system from my website But is is many more bucks a month. Is it worth the upgrade?
> 
> Muchas gracias, salamat, and thank you





What kind of money are we talking??
I can't get any one to tell me.


----------



## Guest

The single user version that I have now is $50 per month but I can only recieve work orders and upload results. from one national. The next version up is $250 per month. check out www eastpointsystems .com They are the people who make Feild-Comm.
I have been very happy with the single user version. It makes keeping track of work orders a cinch.


----------



## BPWY

Good lord. $250 is a really steep.


I work for a couple companies that use Field comm and they'd like for me to have it. 
Not for $250 a month. I do not get any where close to enough work to justify that expense.

A $250 one time fee would be reasonable.


----------



## Guest

Got a work order last January to change a lock and winterize a house. In March Mr. Homeowner called to let me know he would be sueing me for winterizing his house. He called again in April to let me know I would be hearing from his attorney soon. Today his real estate agent called and told me if I didn't have the water turned back on in the house by Wednesday he would stop trying to hold back his client and let him proceed with the lawsuit. I explained the clients Trust deed gave the bank permission to winterize and change locks and the bank had issued me a work order to do just that. He told me my work order was not valid and the his client would never have signed a trust deed with that sort of language. After he tried to put the fear of God into me for a few minutes using some very big words I asked what exactly I would be sued for:
Trespassing... I was afraid he might have an actual civil matter that a judge would consider. I really hope the real estate agent is going to act as Mr. Homeowner's legal counsel. When I called my attorney to let him know what might be coming down the pipeline he did laugh and reminded me to have the service sent to him. It might not be so funny if they get an actual attorney but for now we both got a little entertainment.


----------



## Guest

*New to the Thread*

I just wanted to say hello to everyone. If anyone is looking for work in Texas just send me a message. 

I look forward to talking you all


----------



## brm1109

*Lawyer*

Not for nothing but I think as long as you have the work order then it would be the bank that would be held responsible (if anyone). You had a valid work order and that is it.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> Got a work order last January to change a lock and winterize a house. In March Mr. Homeowner called to let me know he would be sueing me for winterizing his house. He called again in April to let me know I would be hearing from his attorney soon. Today his real estate agent called and told me if I didn't have the water turned back on in the house by Wednesday he would stop trying to hold back his client and let him proceed with the lawsuit. I explained the clients Trust deed gave the bank permission to winterize and change locks and the bank had issued me a work order to do just that. He told me my work order was not valid and the his client would never have signed a trust deed with that sort of language. After he tried to put the fear of God into me for a few minutes using some very big words I asked what exactly I would be sued for:
> Trespassing... I was afraid he might have an actual civil matter that a judge would consider. I really hope the real estate agent is going to act as Mr. Homeowner's legal counsel. When I called my attorney to let him know what might be coming down the pipeline he did laugh and reminded me to have the service sent to him. It might not be so funny if they get an actual attorney but for now we both got a little entertainment.


Bullsh**. Nothing to laugh about ask our atty. Yes trespassing charges can be filed against you and the servicing company. Yes you get to pay for everyones atty fees-read your contract most are all the same. Yes the work order you have is not worth the paper its wrote on. Yes I wish you good luck and try to be apologetic to the fella and maybe he will feel sorry for you for "just doing your job". 
Good luck and hope you don't hear another thing from these people. We paid out a ton lately for trespassing since the bank sent us the work order 4 days premature of the redemption period...OH yeah they can't tell YOU/Contractor when the redemption perior started or stopped since its privacy information. Yep you and all of us are in "the dark".


----------



## Guest

*Landfill ?*

I am wondering how everyone deposes of the property debris. 
Do you have one specific landfill you go to or do you try to locate landfills in each county, if so how do you go about finding all of the land fills? I have found that some landfills only take inert materials which is a problem.
There is not a land fill close by me.


----------



## BPWY

I try to get rid of the debris as quickly as I can.

That being said there are some areas where the landfill costs are way too expensive. Especially when you have companies that try to get you to do debris removal at $15 a yard and pocket the remaining difference in the HUD rate. 
I've been known to haul to another county. Some times a job will finish up long after the landfill closes. 
Or you do a job on the weekend when they aren't open.
I'm not getting a motel and waiting in that county over night just to use that county's landfill when I can go home and dump in my county the following morning.

Most all the landfills close to me do not take hazard waste. Paint, tires, etc.


----------



## Guest

*A-Sons*

Has anyone ever worked for A-Sons? I am in VA and they are out of Michigan. I am wondering if anyone has had an issues with them?


----------



## Guest

One thing I noticed about landfills in my area. The farther away from the bigger city, the cheaper they are. Out of 3 I have used, they go by the first ton at a flat rate. Close to Chicago=$100/ton. Rockford area=$56/ton. Freeport area=$36/ton. 

I took 600 lbs. to the Chicago area one once and was in quite a pickle since the job was a debris removal AND a lawn cut. I had to dispose of the debris in order to get my mowers back home. So I didnt have much choice but to pay the $100 for the 600lbs. I had. The funny thing is, they truck Chicago trash out to the Rockford area landfill. I'll let you do the math on that one. Someones making some mint on trash in Chicago! *cough-MBI-cough*!


----------



## ARPPP

Out of 3 I have used, they go by the first ton at a flat rate. Close to Chicago=$100/ton. Rockford area=$56/ton. Freeport area=$36/ton. 

RSI in Chicago has similar prices to your Rockford pricing and they are open 24 hours a day.


----------



## Guest

What kind of license do I need for property preservation business in Cali?
Couldn't find an answer. May be I'm getting blind


----------



## mtmtnman

ARPPP said:


> Out of 3 I have used, they go by the first ton at a flat rate. Close to Chicago=$100/ton. Rockford area=$56/ton. Freeport area=$36/ton.
> 
> RSI in Chicago has similar prices to your Rockford pricing and they are open 24 hours a day.



Holy Sheepdip!!! I pay $19 a yard WHEN they charge me for most anything. Took a 10' trailer and pickup in today and didn't pay a dime. We don't have pickup at the house so i am at the dump once a week or more with my own trash so i am on a 1st name basis with the ladies at the scale.........


----------



## Guest

shablon said:


> What kind of license do I need for property preservation business in Cali?
> Couldn't find an answer. May be I'm getting blind


Each State is different but in our areas we have to be licensed General Contractors. Insured and bonded as such. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

Do you charge extra for tire disposal ?


----------



## BPWY

samccard said:


> Do you charge extra for tire disposal ?





HUD rate is $15 each.


----------



## mtmtnman

I've been getting $25 a tire from "SOME" companies........


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I've been getting $25 a tire from "SOME" companies........





Your mommy always said you were special.












:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:


----------



## Guest

shablon said:


> What kind of license do I need for property preservation business in Cali?
> Couldn't find an answer. May be I'm getting blind


Are your responding to those ads and requests recently posted on here. If so, good luck. I was wondering who in the world they were looking for. 

The fact that you are asking for a "preservation" license tells me that you really have no experience in this business at all. Are you any kind of trade ? Cus if you were, you wouldn't be asking that question. 

Most likely, a "B" General Contracting license would get you by in California. 

Out of curiosity, I sent my company info in to these "preservation" folks, because we are a LICENSED contractor, and we do inspections, estimates and troubleshooting work ---- Guess what --- absolutely no response. Makes me think they are looking for unlicensed "handyman" types who work cheap.


----------



## BPWY

cwatbay said:


> .........................Makes me think they are looking for unlicensed "handyman" types who work cheap.






You are 100% correct about one thing.




> types who work cheap


----------



## Guest

I may be rich I had about 15 tires to dispose of. Now I have to try and get paid for them.


----------



## Guest

samccard said:


> I may be rich I had about 15 tires to dispose of. Now I have to try and get paid for them.


LOL never seen anyone get rich disposing of tires. 

Funny story that happened to us in Georgia once. We were doing a REAL BIG trashout with 12 guys that took 5 days in Riverdale and there is a HUGE landfill that looked like a mountain (in fact I think it was called Stone Mountain :laughing and there was a semi-trailer full of tires and the back gate fell open and there was probably a 100 tires all over the place and they were rolling everywhere. An hour later they were still picking them things up. :no:


----------



## BPWY

I heard of one out of Kersey CO.

A P&P contractor went down the drain and lost his house. When his bank went in to clean up the place they found hundreds of tires and hundreds of gallons of paint. Along with a mountain of debris, AC units, fridges etc. All the stuff that we haul off in this line of work.
The guy was making out fake dump receipts and dumping the stuff in the back of his multi acre property. When word of this filtered back up to the nationals and the banks he was working for they were not happy they had paid for "disposal" and then his bank got to pay for it again.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> ....they had paid for "disposal" and then his bank got to pay for it again.


Are you sure they paid for it the first time? :shifty: :laughing:

Good morning all.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Are you sure they paid for it the first time? :shifty: :laughing:
> 
> Good morning all.
> 
> Linda






The story is yes they did. But you know how stories go.
It may be the guy misappropriated his funds.


How are you Linda? Haven't seen you around in some time.
Staying busy?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

April and May were extremely slow. We got busy last week and it looks like things might be picking up again in a few spots.

We are still trying to find good vendors in Kentucky, if you know of anyone who actually wants to work. We've been getting requests throughout the entire state but everyone I talk to is "specialized". They either do inspections or they do trashouts. Nobody wants to start with inspections and take whatever work follows.

How are you doing? Staying busy? Is grass cut season kicking your fanny yet?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> How are you doing? Staying busy? Is grass cut season kicking your fanny yet?
> 
> Linda





I'm doing. Its been too slow for too long. Very little initial secure work going on. A couple of minor bid approvals and some grass cuts. There is one bank out there that wont approve grass cut bids. Every two weeks you go out and take new pics that the grass is getting higher and up your bid price. And they continue to ignore it. The level of incompetence is almost mind boggling.

My month of Jan and March were the best of the year. I'm not sure whats happened to all the work since then.


I know folks in KY, thats where I grew up. How ever I highly doubt that any of them are interested in P&P.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Where in Kentucky did you live? I lived in Hopkinsville back in the late 70's. 

I know how rural and spread out some areas can be. I think drive time is a big deterrent to finding good vendors.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Eastern KY.... Crockett.
Morgan county.



I've been near Hopkinsville many times on I-24.


Drive time is an issue where I live too.

Even tho I cover a lot of huge counties the population is low in those areas.


----------



## BPWY

Speaking of drive time.


I was asked to cover a reasigned w/o for $51 less discount. 
It wasn't any where enough to cover my time and distance but I was going part of the way on other work so I took it. It was for missing outlet covers. Having done a 2nd bid at the place I knew how many were there and it wasn't what the other contractor was saying. Any way now I only get paid $4 for the job because there were not the amount that he was claiming and they won't pay me the rest.
I spent 4+ hours of my day and drove 193 miles for $4. And they won't back down. 
The only way the other contractor was going to find the number of missing covers he was claiming was if he took the covers off, took his pics and then reinstalled.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> The only way the other contractor was going to find the number of missing covers he was claiming was if he took the covers off, took his pics and then reinstalled.


Imagine that! Ran into those shenanigans a few times.

Linda, if you ever pick up Northern Illinois/Southern Wisconsin, let me know.


----------



## Guest

I found out I am getting paid $8.00 a tire. -20% guess I am not rich after all.
I did find a dump close to home that charges $30.00 a ton. Makes dumping easier.


----------



## Guest

samccard said:


> I found out I am getting paid $8.00 a tire. -20% guess I am not rich after all.
> I did find a dump close to home that charges $30.00 a ton. Makes dumping easier.


But does the dump take tires?:sad:


----------



## BPWY

Here local tire shops will take them, but you have to pay their disposal rate.

Some times the transfer station will take them for $1 a piece.


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> But does the dump take tires?:sad:



Yea, but they charge according to size. $2.00 and up. The is one dump that does not charge but it is not close by.


----------



## Guest

I just had to laugh at this one. Want in on P&P work? Here is your big breakthrough!!!

http://rockford.craigslist.org/lab/1772627706.html


----------



## Guest

*just a question*

Just curious if anyone else has had a slow down in P&P work in the last several months? I have been in business for over 10yrs and so far this has been the slowest I have ever seen it. 

Thanks,
Heather


----------



## BPWY

I don't have 10 yrs of history but yes its been real slow for me as well.

I got 3 initial secures this week, one is still occupied. First time I've seen that much work in some time.


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> I just had to laugh at this one. Want in on P&P work? Here is your big breakthrough!!!
> 
> http://rockford.craigslist.org/lab/1772627706.html


I saw a similar ad here, they made sure that you knew that you were a subcontractor getting a 1099 as well. :no:


----------



## BPWY

I took that ad to mean they were looking for an experienced laborer. Paid at $10 an hr.
Not the contractor and claiming they were going to pay the contractor $10 an hr.


----------



## Guest

In that ad, they said they wouldn't be paying drive time. 

I am curious how many of you are paying your crews drive time? I have been paying my guys for drive time and some reimbursement for mileage they put on their vehicles.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> In that ad, they said they wouldn't be paying drive time.
> 
> I am curious how many of you are paying your crews drive time? I have been paying my guys for drive time and some reimbursement for mileage they put on their vehicles.


All our bids include $50 per hour for drivetime--no matter if it is to the landfill roundtrip or wherever. This covers the 2 man crew, insurance, gas, wear/tear and the *"opportunity"* for the Service Companies to use us to do the work.
This has been the 2nd busiest year for us in our brief 14 years in this business. NOW I'm NOT saying that this translates into the 2nd most profitable year:no: Without actually getting out old records I would have to say this is probably one of the top 5 worst profitable years so far but its only half over...:sad:


----------



## Guest

Has anyone heard which companies have been awarded the HUD M&M contracts? Nothing found on the Hud.gov site. The local M&M has been receiving 30day extensions since Oct 09. Surely some company has been named by now? It should be public record somewhere. 
Any help is appreciated.
:thumbsup:


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Has anyone heard which companies have been awarded the HUD M&M contracts? Nothing found on the Hud.gov site. The local M&M has been receiving 30day extensions since Oct 09. Surely some company has been named by now? It should be public record somewhere.
> Any help is appreciated.
> :thumbsup:





I heard that your good friends over at AMS got at least some of the contracts.


----------



## Guest

Who is AMS? I've worked with 5Bros and they are slowing down too!

Dave


----------



## Guest

BPWY I have heard that abt AMS but man if this is the case then you might as well write off doing any "profitable" hud work. So far all I can find is rumors but nothing in writing yet. These contracts were to be awarded Oct '09 and there has been delay after delay but surely HUD has awarded the contracts by now? I've looked all over for some time and have had 3 different ex-hud inspectors calling to see if I have heard anything about who is the new companies going to be...Our area M&M company (Best Assets) doesn't pay anyone so they are not having any work done that I can tell and all their yards are 2 feet tall or longer and the rumors of filed lawsuits are running rampant. Hope they get their butts sued off since they deserve it. IMO And thats coming from someone who abhors lawyers and lawsuits....


----------



## BPWY

I know a guy on the western slope of CO that has cut his teeth in the biz working for MCB.
He probably wouldn't cross the street to throw water on them if he saw they were on fire.


AMS = Asset Management Services or some thing like that.

I did an initial secure for 5 Brothers today that the neighbor told me the property had been vacant for 10 months when I showed up.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> BPWY I have heard that abt AMS but man if this is the case then you might as well write off doing any "profitable" hud work.







Kinda what I figured too. See my comment above about MCB.
How ever I don't do any work for HUD now so nothing would really change in my world.


----------



## Guest

5Bros is good, like any other company they too are going through all the changes. Especially with lawn cuts. They are bidding the entire county now. SO the small guys are leaving and it puts lots of pressure on the mid size guy to move up to compete with the large guy. Still you risk being out bid on the next round and still have all the expense staring you in the face. I was doing over half of the county here but lost it to someone who thought they could do it for much less. Not sure how we can get the bank to pay more after the price has already been lowered on the last bid round. I have never seen the Bank increase the rate after the fact. So now it looks like a bid war. The lawns look like garbage because one outfit is going so fast they can't keep up. To bad to ruin it when things were working before.
Just my thoughts.


----------



## Guest

Benzy351 said:


> So now it looks like a bid war.


I think its been a bid war for a while.


----------



## BPWY

5 Brothers sent me the grass cut bid sheet. I bid full HUD rate just like before.

There is no way I'll go broke for any of these guys. I am not paying for the privileged of doing their work.
I'll get another job before I do that!

My uncle's favorite saying....I am not in this for my health, 

And my favorite saying.....this is a business not a charity!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> BPWY I have heard that abt AMS but man if this is the case then you might as well write off doing any "profitable" hud work. So far all I can find is rumors but nothing in writing yet. These contracts were to be awarded Oct '09 and there has been delay after delay but surely HUD has awarded the contracts by now? I've looked all over for some time and have had 3 different ex-hud inspectors calling to see if I have heard anything about who is the new companies going to be...Our area M&M company (Best Assets) doesn't pay anyone so they are not having any work done that I can tell and all their yards are 2 feet tall or longer and the rumors of filed lawsuits are running rampant. Hope they get their butts sued off since they deserve it. IMO And thats coming from someone who abhors lawyers and lawsuits....


AMS did get a bunch. Area 1A--IL, IN, KY, NC, SC, TN and Area 2D-AR,KS,LA,MO,OK,So.TX


----------



## Guest

Thanks for the info...:thumbsup:
Where did you find this? I'm looking for the 5 States that we operate in. We are just hoping that its not AMS or worse yet the existing M&M.


----------



## Guest

*REO Beginner*

I've been in the Site Development business for many years and have been successful...until recently. New commercial construction is in the dumps. No one is financing in Fl right now.

I started a service company last year and have had some success. We do repairs, painting, sidewalk & curbing repair, pressure washing, tenant clean-outs etc...for commercial property managers. We do some HOA work.

I'm very interested in getting into the REO business. I am in the Central Florida area.

I've been reading the posts and they are very helpful, especially Linda's. Someone mentioned using the HUD website for tips on pricing allowables and on procedures such as boarding. I can't find either, so if anyone can send me a link I would really appreciate it. Mention of other resources is greatly appreciated as well. :clap:


----------



## Guest

*REO Beginner*

I've been in the Site Development business for many years and have been successful...until recently. New commercial construction is in the dumps. No one is financing in Fl right now.

I started a service company last year and have had some success. We do repairs, painting, sidewalk & curbing repair, pressure washing, tenant clean-outs etc...for commercial property managers. We do some HOA work.

I'm very interested in getting into the REO business. I am in the Central Florida area.

I've been reading the posts and they are very helpful, especially Linda's. Someone mentioned using the HUD website for tips on pricing allowables and on procedures such as boarding. I can't find either, so if anyone can send me a link I would really appreciate it. Mention of other resources is greatly appreciated as well.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Thanks for the info...:thumbsup:
> Where did you find this? I'm looking for the 5 States that we operate in. We are just hoping that its not AMS or worse yet the existing M&M.


I don't see anything for Iowa yet.
go to fbo . gov and search under department of housing with the key word Management and Marketing services.


----------



## Guest

*contractor license?*

Is it normal for a client to only except contractors how are licensed, I've never heard of this but it appears Cityside does and they have most of the states.


----------



## BPWY

I wonder what license they expect contractors in states that do not license this type of work to have???????

MOST of P&P work is unlicensed in the states I run. Lead work, mold work and some repairs would require a license.


I can re-roof any house I want in the county/non incorporated areas of the county I live in without a license or a permit. As long as there are no structural changes made to the house the building department does not care!


----------



## Guest

Most require the General Contractors license. If there is no licenseing in the State than a "license bond" -- a surety bond normally for $20,000 will do usually.


----------



## Guest

*Car Removal ?*

I have to bid on car removal and I need to know how to legally remove a car in Ga. It is wrecked but not just a junk car. I do not want to make a costly mistake by taking the wrong action. Can someone give me advice on how to leagaly remove this car? Thanks!


----------



## BPWY

Best thing in my opinion is to use a tow yard. They are supposed to know the rules.


----------



## JenkinsHB

Usually car removal issues vary from county to county. Just call the local sheriff. He'll probably even give you the name of the towing company they use.


----------



## agcreno

Does anybody have experience/feedback regarding working for MCB?


----------



## BPWY

An acquaintance that isn't a member on this forum (that I know of) has this to say about them.



> MCB has been keeping me very busy, but with there fees you could go broke working for them! It's like buying yourself a job.


----------



## agcreno

Hmmm...Sounds like what we've already got, you know, 15 work orders a day that don't add up to a hill of beans...New work order for a property that you were just at 2 days ago to add a $20.00 padlock that is 60 miles away... Would be interested to know what the issues with MCB are..with their new contract they are going to be a player. Our current supplier's requirements are just plain old "gettin ridiculous". Kinda lookin around for a change, Used to love workin for em, not so much anymore...You can tell that they are trying to get every red cent they can out of the banks at the expense of the contractor. Sad...


----------



## Guest

agcreno said:


> Hmmm...Sounds like what we've already got, you know, 15 work orders a day that don't add up to a hill of beans...New work order for a property that you were just at 2 days ago to add a $20.00 padlock that is 60 miles away... Would be interested to know what the issues with MCB are..with their new contract they are going to be a player. Our current supplier's requirements are just plain old "gettin ridiculous". Kinda lookin around for a change, Used to love workin for em, not so much anymore...You can tell that they are trying to get every red cent they can out of the banks at the expense of the contractor. Sad...


 
"with their new contract they are going to be a player"...nothing new has happened except changing contract names a little...same "players" same "rules" same "pay".....new year is all. A wolf in sheeps clothing is still a wolf. The Government censored needs to clear all these suckers out and start fresh with new companies that don't screw the contractors and then maybe, just maybe, they will get good service on their homes and contractors that actually care....huh what a thought eh?


----------



## agcreno

We were going to change the world when we started this deal.......Silly Rabbit...What an Education...


----------



## BPWY

agcreno said:


> We were going to change the world when we started this deal.......Silly Rabbit...What an Education...





When it becomes as obvious as the sun in the sky that the banks and nationals don't care in the least bit, its hard to find contractors that give much of a damn either. And you are correct, the guy at the bottom of the food chain isn't going to be able to change things enough to make a difference.


----------



## Guest

Is S.I.R. certificate really helpful, or it's just somebody trying to make some money?


----------



## Guest

shablon said:


> is s.i.r. Certificate really helpful, or it's just somebody trying to make some money?


scam


----------



## Guest

are there any legit certificates?


----------



## Guest

shablon said:


> are there any legit certificates?


Yep there is: EPA Lead Certificate for RRP, WRT, ASD, Licensed General Contractor, AMRT, Electrical, Plumbing, Steamfitter, Boiler qualified plumbing......
Gosh I could go on and on. Every foreclosed home requires specialized and professional contractors so you need to go get your licenses or hire it out. Don't let those Service Companies fool you and say you can do it yourself since they "won't be found" when you have a loss--they will hang you out to the wind. :whistling


----------



## Guest

*Fla Work*

Send me an email, I am setting up my conractors for Fla right now and will contact you when you reply.

Thanks

Peter S. Armstrong
REO Services Group, Construction Manager.

*General Contractors for Carrington Mortgage*

[email protected]




Impact-Outdoors said:


> I've been in the Site Development business for many years and have been successful...until recently. New commercial construction is in the dumps. No one is financing in Fl right now.
> 
> I started a service company last year and have had some success. We do repairs, painting, sidewalk & curbing repair, pressure washing, tenant clean-outs etc...for commercial property managers. We do some HOA work.
> 
> I'm very interested in getting into the REO business. I am in the Central Florida area.
> 
> I've been reading the posts and they are very helpful, especially Linda's. Someone mentioned using the HUD website for tips on pricing allowables and on procedures such as boarding. I can't find either, so if anyone can send me a link I would really appreciate it. Mention of other resources is greatly appreciated as well. :clap:


----------



## Guest

Hi everyone ! so glad i found this
My name is Jim Strick and my company is Alabama Home Renewals, still learning about how things work and any advice on bidding jobs and etc would be so great thanks!! just send an email @ [email protected]


----------



## Guest

jimstrick said:


> Hi everyone ! so glad i found this
> My name is Jim Strick and my company is Alabama Home Renewals, still learning about how things work and any advice on bidding jobs and etc would be so great thanks!! just send an email @ [email protected]


Just bid all your jobs at $1....since someone else will most likely get it anyway


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Just bid all your jobs at $1....since someone else will most likely get it anyway





More than likely some one else will be given the work. 
How ever at that price it'll be tough for them to underbid him.
The work being assigned to some one else is just how its done.


----------



## Guest

Hello all ...I have a question here...Is there a site available, I know this one here, but another site that gives the good and bad info on Nationals..We've been doing P&P for over 10 years for a few different Nationals and haven't been burnt yet, knock on wood, and would like some info on who to look out for...I know the standard ones, like 5 Brothers and AMS, but it's alot of those what seems like new kids on the block is what I'm talkin about...Thanks


----------



## Guest

*Grass Cutting?*

This might be a crazy question, but I am just curious. When cutting grass on an initial landscape work order, do most of you cut the county right away and the grass in the ditch? How do you determine how much yard is enough? I have been cutting some very large overgrown yards that seem to have no boundaries. Just do not want to cut more than I should be.


----------



## JenkinsHB

usually your order has an allowable for lot size. the most common is 15,000 SF and up to 12" in height. anything over that I would bid out. most times I will include a bid for the entire lot and also another one for a 15,000 SF perimeter cut. I know there are others (safeguard) that have an allowable up to 1 acre. When my guys are out on the country lots I just try to have them cut what they think in the previously maintained lawn.


----------



## Guest

JenkinsHB said:


> usually your order has an allowable for lot size. the most common is 15,000 SF and up to 12" in height. anything over that I would bid out. most times I will include a bid for the entire lot and also another one for a 15,000 SF perimeter cut. I know there are others (safeguard) that have an allowable up to 1 acre. When my guys are out on the country lots I just try to have them cut what they think in the previously maintained lawn.


Good answer. Remember that the City Assessors Office official lot size does not include the "curb to the street" and is not included in the lot size BUT yep you get to mow for free. Hey hows BJ? If I'm correct?:clap:


----------



## Guest

*reo specialist*

How is your REO business going? I am considering signing up to franchise in Las Vegas, I just sent the email for info to REO, so I dont even know what the cost are and if it is worth it. What has your experience been?

J Sportsman


----------



## Guest

Parmelee said:


> Hello all ...I have a question here...Is there a site available, I know this one here, but another site that gives the good and bad info on Nationals..We've been doing P&P for over 10 years for a few different Nationals and haven't been burnt yet, knock on wood, and would like some info on who to look out for...


Yes there is:

[email protected]


----------



## Guest

If anyone out there is desperate enough, looks like AMS is looking for contractors on cubic yard . us


----------



## Guest

omg i feel very intimidated,lol
i am a newbie at all this and i feel under :shutup:educated..lol
there is much to learn here and so so glad i found ct
i have lic and insurance i thought i was ready but looks like i have alot of research to do and still learning the bidding process
I am not giving up my hubby has been laid off since april and we have some savings and i have to go with it, any advice /help would be great
I am in Alabama not sure what the demand is for these services
but im in it to win it...prayers from all thanks:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

jimstrick said:


> omg i feel very intimidated,lol
> i am a newbie at all this and i feel under :shutup:educated..lol
> there is much to learn here and so so glad i found ct
> i have lic and insurance i thought i was ready but looks like i have alot of research to do and still learning the bidding process
> I am not giving up my hubby has been laid off since april and we have some savings and i have to go with it, any advice /help would be great
> I am in Alabama not sure what the demand is for these services
> but im in it to win it...prayers from all thanks:thumbsup:


Good luck. Just do your research and study hard. This is a tough game to keep ahead of. 
Example: we secured property in Dec '09 and the next time to property in April '10 there was a busted front window (ruined from vandals) which we reported and bid BUT the inspector was there in Jan '10 (less than 30 days since we initial secured) and now we are being told we have to replace the window free of charge (yes its a pre-1978 home so all the containment zones and lead testing to be completed at our cost per direction of HUD/Bank) and we cannot get anyone to "understand" that shi* happens and vandals are out there and how do we safeguard from vandalism? Its either replace and have all the proper Lead Pics/testing OR they will have someone else do it and I will be charged back for whatever "they" charge.
Welcome to our world. Some companies ARE better than others but the difference between companies are getting smaller and smaller. 
Man I wish it would quit raining so I can get the P&P work done!
But water remediation is gooooood!:thumbup:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Good luck. Just do your research and study hard. This is a tough game to keep ahead of.
> Example: we secured property in Dec '09 and the next time to property in April '10 there was a busted front window (ruined from vandals) which we reported and bid BUT the inspector was there in Jan '10 (less than 30 days since we initial secured) and now we are being told we have to replace the window free of charge (yes its a pre-1978 home so all the containment zones and lead testing to be completed at our cost per direction of HUD/Bank) and we cannot get anyone to "understand" that shi* happens and vandals are out there and how do we safeguard from vandalism? Its either replace and have all the proper Lead Pics/testing OR they will have someone else do it and I will be charged back for whatever "they" charge.
> Welcome to our world. Some companies ARE better than others but the difference between companies are getting smaller and smaller.
> Man I wish it would quit raining so I can get the P&P work done!
> But water remediation is gooooood!:thumbup:


You're going to let them get away with that???


----------



## Guest

*has anyone worked for pacific preservation?*


----------



## Guest

jimstrick said:


>


 You may want to look at their pricing especially for Ocwen acquired homes...


----------



## Guest

Parmelee said:


> You're going to let them get away with that???


I'm all ears for any untried reasoning: )


----------



## BPWY

Do any body have work these days?


I've watched my quickbooks monthly gross drop month after month. To the point I wonder if I should look for a different job.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Do any body have work these days?
> 
> 
> I've watched my quickbooks monthly gross drop month after month. To the point I wonder if I should look for a different job.


Safeguard is keeping me busy with some other jerks lowball bids! I would love to run into this other "contractor" at a property one of these days.....just to see if he is high on meth. Who in their right mind would bid a 18,000 sq. ft. lawn that 30" high for $105?


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Safeguard is keeping me busy with some other jerks lowball bids! I would love to run into this other "contractor" at a property one of these days.....just to see if he is high on meth. Who in their right mind would bid a 18,000 sq. ft. lawn that 30" high for $105?





You didn't bid it, you aint required to perform the work are you?


"Who in their right mind"???????? Obviously no one since that guy is out of business now. You are doing his bids.


----------



## Guest

Well, if it was 100% my own decision I would have told SG to give it to the 2nd bidder. But since I only have 1/4th say in anything my opinion didn't matter.....until I called the head honcho of our company to the property...LOL. She got there and worked about 10 minutes trying to mow after I already hit the entire lawn with a bush hog. Her riding mower was plugging up about every 20 ft.....she then said "this is B.S.!" I told her the day before when I stopped and looked to see how bad the lawn was since I did the initial secure 30 days ago. Told her there is no way that's worth doing for $105! I even took pics to prove the lawn was to my waist. But her "pic judgment" reply was "oh, thats just wheat, it's not that bad". 

I had such a smile on my face when she got a taste of it herself! It's kinda one of those "HA HA, told ya so" smiles. 

Anyone want to come and play on my homemade grass mountain tomorrow? LOL

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y258/badfish667/swrd.jpg


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> "Who in their right mind"???????? Obviously no one since that guy is out of business now. You are doing his bids.


He is one of SG's 2nd bid monkeys. I have no clue how he stays in business. All his signatures to the sign in sheets are 2nd bids. I think I may have been to one property where he actually did an initial.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I had such a smile on my face when she got a taste of it herself! It's kinda one of those "HA HA, told ya so" smiles.
> 
> Anyone want to come and play on my homemade grass mountain tomorrow? LOL
> 
> http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y258/badfish667/swrd.jpg





The forefront of the pic doesn't look so bad. lol

I'm sure it gets thicker farther back tho.

I had to do a recut this morning on about 8000 sq ft. 2 weeks since last cut. 
Knee high. Took me over an hr..... fun fun.
I'm just glad that the rest of the day wasn't as bad as that one!!!!!!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I'm all ears for any untried reasoning: )


 I'm to the point now, with everything going on, I'm not going to be pushed around anymore....I'll give them a great job at a good price but I'm not working for nothing....Sooner or later, mark my words, all this cheap crap they're trying to get away with will come back and bite them where the sun don't sine....


----------



## BPWY

Oh look, its the beverly hillbillies. :clap:
First clean up of any size I've done in a long time.


----------



## ARPPP

*RE: Beverly Hillbilly's*

Oh Man, I can one up you on the trash. I did an eviction this week. Look what they left for me! :clap: And there is more around the back; cars, boat, dogs, furniture etc...

AR Professional Property Preservation
Annette


----------



## BPWY

Thats a mess.


Also looks like some extra treasures you could pad the bottom line if the former home owner doesn't claim them.


But don't make me go back a yr to do "mine is bigger" pics. lol

I had a two day, 8 man, 1 loader, and 7 30 yrd roll off dumpsters clean up.


----------



## Guest

*eviction pics*



ARPPP said:


> Oh Man, I can one up you on the trash. I did an eviction this week. Look what they left for me! :clap: And there is more around the back; cars, boat, dogs, furniture etc...
> 
> AR Professional Property Preservation
> Annette


Whoa.....if that motorcycle isn't spoken for, I may be interested in it for a parts bike!


----------



## ARPPP

ARPPP said:


> Oh Man, I can one up you on the trash. I did an eviction this week. Look what they left for me! :clap: And there is more around the back; cars, boat, dogs, furniture etc...
> 
> AR Professional Property Preservation
> Annette


 
Okay, I showed up with my wreckers to pull the cars, boats, cycles etc. The sheriff told me to trash everything that was not gone in 24 hoiurs. The previous owner ran up to me demanding keys to the house because she has a stay from the judge. I got back in my car called the police and they showed up and told her that the stay meant she has more time to get all of that stuff out of the garage and in the yard. She did not have access to the house. Thankfully they stuck around while I checked all of the locks and windows and made sure they were still all secure. The judge gave her until the 23rd. Somewherein815 I will let you know what is left, there were actually 2 motorcycles.


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## mtmtnman

This property was 12" deep with 3' of dead grass knocked over from last year by winter snows. You can see from my timestamps how long the back yard took. It was a half acre.


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## mtmtnman

another view....


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## mtmtnman

Can't really find a good pic of my mower since my azz is always planted in the seat........


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## mtmtnman

Got some math for you whiz's.

A national co. was having a friend of mine do 700 + - inspections a month here in Montana for $10 an inspection. The day he was composing an e-mail to them telling them he would need $12 per to remain profitable he got an e-mail saying he had to do them for $6.50 a piece or there was another company waiting to do them for that price. I told him don't fret as he was covering the entire state with about 6 subs and in 3-4 months the national will come groveling and he may even get $15 an inspection after the "NEW" company can't get them done for what little they bid. Montana is 760 miles across and 260 miles tall. No 1 man can cover this area in the 10 day window given as the majority of inspections are issued the 15th of the month and what would a company have to pay a sub and still pull a small profit?? $4 per?? Good luck getting someone to do inspections for that. I used to do 200 inspections between Missoula and Kalispell and it took me damn close to the 10 days to get them done as spread out as they where. In the end after filling the gas tank i would be better working at Burger King. I am still LMAO as this new co. really bit off more than they could chew.:whistling:whistling:whistling:whistling


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## BPWY

What was the name of that other company?


I'm thinking it was one I almost went to work for after they cut the rate way down.
To the point THEY were making more than what they were paying the contractors.


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## BPWY

jimstrick said:


> *has anyone worked for pacific preservation? *





Dunno about your area but around these parts FAS has run out of victims and can no longer get their work done.
They've managed to scam Pac Pres into trying to find contractors. 
Only problem is the W/O has FAS's name as the client.

With FAS's problems with paying and their lack of common sense in the office its no wonder they can't find new victims.

A local real estate agent told me that in the previous yr of our conversation he has never seen or talked to the same FAS contractor twice.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> What was the name of that other company?
> 
> 
> I'm thinking it was one I almost went to work for after they cut the rate way down.
> To the point THEY were making more than what they were paying the contractors.



There out of Dallas and there name changed last month.......


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> There out of Dallas and there name changed last month.......





Ah OK. 


I was thinking the other guys out of IN. I forget their name.
Remember they were going to conquer the world, $6 a time for inspections. :furious:


----------



## Guest

*[email protected]#$#^$%^*

I was wondering when there is personal prperty who pays for the storage unit and do u add that to ur bid as well as moving it? then after 60 days? 
also who pays to have a car removed? and should i charge just a flat rate for debris and clean up? say 800 is that about right?


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## Guest

what do you do with all their personal belongings? and if you store them who pays for that?


----------



## BPWY

BPWY said:


> Ah OK.
> 
> 
> I was thinking the other guys out of IN. I forget their name.
> Remember they were going to conquer the world, $6 a time for inspections. :furious:



Now I remember, FSI.



jimstrick said:


> also who pays to have a car removed? and should i charge just a flat rate for debris and clean up? say 800 is that about right?




Usually the bank.

That rate sounds about right to you and me. Only problem is that the nationals will never pay you any where close to that rate!!!! That is a promise you can take to the bank.


----------



## Guest

jimstrick said:


> I was wondering when there is personal prperty who pays for the storage unit and do u add that to ur bid as well as moving it? then after 60 days?
> also who pays to have a car removed? and should i charge just a flat rate for debris and clean up? say 800 is that about right?


Remember to add on the cost of the moving company unless you are licensed and bonded as a mover. Most States require you to be a licensed moving company to remove personal belongings off the site.....Now not saying that everyone does use a moving company but if you get caught by the DOT or if you damage the "goods" you are personally responsible for replacement OR worse yet "the prior owners say there is personals missing" then your bond would have to pay the claim if you acted as a moving company then you are "up the creek without a paddle"...:whistling


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## Guest

*Talilers*

I have three trailers but only one truck this is a problem. I need a trailer that will haul my mower and some debris. I have been unable to find exactly what I need have any of you had trailers built or know of where to by something that works well?


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Remember to add on the cost of the moving company unless you are licensed and bonded as a mover. Most States require you to be a licensed moving company to remove personal belongings off the site.....Now not saying that everyone does use a moving company but if you get caught by the DOT or if you damage the "goods" you are personally responsible for replacement OR worse yet "the prior owners say there is personals missing" then your bond would have to pay the claim if you acted as a moving company then you are "up the creek without a paddle"...:whistling






The debate about personals.... how far do we have to take it? Is a dresser with one missing drawer personal belongings? Or two clothes items?
A pair of sneakers? A lawnmower sitting in the back yard in the weeds?
A kitchen table with no chairs, a bed frame with no mattress?

The state laws need to be updated to reflect on the fact that if folks are abandoning their stuff in a foreclosure market the stuff needs to be considered abandoned.

I don't have a lot to worry about where I'm operating. I *rarely* see any thing of any value. When I go to do a trash out I know that the stuff there is trash.
Some one else I know on the other hand has stories of this or that valuable item they see almost on a regular basis.


----------



## BPWY

samccard said:


> I have three trailers but only one truck this is a problem. I need a trailer that will haul my mower and some debris. I have been unable to find exactly what I need have any of you had trailers built or know of where to by something that works well?




I've got ramps similar to these. They are a lot more closed surface than these for small mower wheels.

I load my 2 walk behind mowers in the pickup. If I have to take the rider I usually take my trailer.













http://www.discountramps.com/atv-loading-ramps.htm

Shop around for the best price, ramps can be bought on ebay too.


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## mtmtnman

samccard said:


> I have three trailers but only one truck this is a problem. I need a trailer that will haul my mower and some debris. I have been unable to find exactly what I need have any of you had trailers built or know of where to by something that works well?


You can finish up your mowing and load the mower in the truck off the trailer with something like this.











Most of the landscapers that bag clippings here use a similar trailer and back right up into their flatbed truck with sideboards to dump clippings. Of course flatbed trucks are commonplace out here and it's easy to turn them into a dump bed.


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## mtmtnman

If your independently wealthy this would work nice.......


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## BPWY

Whats that run? About $20,000?


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## Guest

That would take care of all my needs!!!



mtmtnman said:


> If your independently wealthy this would work nice.......


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## Guest

*Feild Inspections*

Safeguard is wanting me to do Field Inspections. Is anybody making money doing this or is it a waste of time?


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## oteroproperties

*Newbies and the Effects on the Industry*

I know that everyone on this board has voiced an opinion on "newbies". I belong to other boards and forums as im sure you all do. It seems to be getting more hostile for new contractors. Is it really the opinion of all that new guys are to blame for the current pricing problems in the industry?


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I know that everyone on this board has voiced an opinion on "newbies". I belong to other boards and forums as im sure you all do. It seems to be getting more hostile for new contractors. Is it really the opinion of all that new guys are to blame for the current pricing problems in the industry?



The problem with newbies is they see huge $$$$ signs and will work for amounts that us veterans know will not pay the bills in the long run. They do not take into account that there are months to wait in order to get paid, charge backs, bids that are supposedly cut by the bank Etc..........


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## Guest

I think if everyone would turn away the companies wanting contractors to work for a 40% discount . Maybe prices would eventually go up, but I relly do not see that happening.


----------



## mtmtnman

samccard said:


> I think if everyone would turn away the companies wanting contractors to work for a 40% discount . Maybe prices would eventually go up, but I relly do not see that happening.



To many broke people out there that will work for anything to put food on the table. I know a guy in Florida who's son was asked to mow lawns for $10 each and they would be given 75-100 lawns a week. The company that tried to hire him was working for a national and would have been sticking $50 in his own pocket per lawn after paying the kid. My bet is this thief found someone broke enough to do it...................................................


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## oteroproperties

What do you say about the fact that these guys will work them selves into the poor house and bow out? I mean I know that some people make a mess and its up to us to clean it up, but doesnt that just make us look better? If we are as good as we say we are won't we out last these guys?


----------



## oteroproperties

I am here in Florida and I am aware of these types. believe it or not.......

my company is fairly well established here and I have a very nice office and quite a bit of equipment. I was out cutting because my work is slow 
a guy came up to me in his busted truck with a riding mower in the back, told me he has over 500 cuts and wants me to work for him. He pays $15 a cut and says you should be able to to 17 to 20 cuts a day!!!!!!!!

can you believe that s__t?? 20 cuts per day???? $15??????


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> What do you say about the fact that these guys will work them selves into the poor house and bow out? I mean I know that some people make a mess and its up to us to clean it up, but doesnt that just make us look better? If we are as good as we say we are won't we out last these guys?



Personally i am sick and tired of most of the national companies and their utter incompetence. I am pursuing more local banks and broker work and a LOT less national company work. This has actually increased my bottom line. Let the newbies work for the nationals. They will go broke and sooner than later the nationals will run out of victims. Then we'll be a lot better off as professionals. Go back a page or 2 and look for my "inspections" post............


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I am here in Florida and I am aware of these types. believe it or not.......
> 
> my company is fairly well established here and I have a very nice office and quite a bit of equipment. I was out cutting because my work is slow
> a guy came up to me in his busted truck with a riding mower in the back, told me he has over 500 cuts and wants me to work for him. He pays $15 a cut and says you should be able to to 17 to 20 cuts a day!!!!!!!!
> 
> can you believe that s__t?? 20 cuts per day???? $15??????


I can do that in 4-5 cuts without the middle men....................


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> What do you say about the fact that these guys will work them selves into the poor house and bow out? I mean I know that some people make a mess and its up to us to clean it up, but doesnt that just make us look better? If we are as good as we say we are won't we out last these guys?


 
Unfortunately this business is a "race to see who can get to the bottom the fastest". 
We will flat not work for less than $500 gross per day for a 2 man crew. This amount will allow a profit, pay taxes, pay for benefits and maybe, just maybe, put something into savings/rainy day fund.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Unfortunately this business is a "race to see who can get to the bottom the fastest".
> We will flat not work for less than $500 gross per day for a 2 man crew. This amount will allow a profit, pay taxes, pay for benefits and maybe, just maybe, put something into savings/rainy day fund.


You forgot the chargeback fund............................


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> I can do that in 4-5 cuts without the middle men....................


I told him that there is no way I could cut grass for $15 I dont care if I could walk to every one of them. $15 didn't pay for this truck when i bought it, and it damn sure wont pay to keep it running.


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## Guest

I would like to market to the local banks and Realtor s but have not had the time or the plan to contact them yet. Maybe soon!


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> You forgot the chargeback fund............................


I've been fairly lucky with the charge backs, the only thing i've ever got a CB for was cutting grass and updating it too early. Not really my fault and a really long story but suffice it to say i learned my lesson


----------



## oteroproperties

samccard said:


> I would like to market to the local banks and Realtor s but have not had the time or the plan to contact them yet. Maybe soon!


I gotta say nothing beats a good broker!!! they pay well, on time and there is a lot more flexibility with them. If i had 2 more like the one i have now.............


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## BPWY

For some reason I cannot buy a broker's work here.

I've passed out several hundred cards to real estate agents in the last 6 months. A LOT of them nearly had orgasms when they found out what type of work I do.
And yet........... my phone has rung exactly ............. 0.0 times with work from any of them.

Its frustrating.


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> For some reason I cannot buy a broker's work here.
> 
> I've passed out several hundred cards to real estate agents in the last 6 months. A LOT of them nearly had orgasms when they found out what type of work I do.
> And yet........... my phone has rung exactly ............. 0.0 times with work from any of them.
> 
> Its frustrating.


I heard the other day from a realtor that they are getting so many flyers and cards that they are just throwing them out. What worked for me was finding properties that are listed and calling them about the grass of a code violation, unsecured pool etc..... they may not want you to do anything on that property, but they might say, well that house has a pending contract, but i have this other property........... and your in!!


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## Guest

We all complain about the injustices with this business but at the end of the day the bills are still paid (most of the time anyhow), we have our spouses to come home to, our own lawns to mow and maybe a little time to go fishin. 
Sometimes we just gotta be thankful for what we have. 

Kinda getting sentimental---just got a phone call from one of our best subs wife. He had quit unexpectedly about a year ago and we kept in contact and for the last 6 months I hadn't heard from him and his birthday was just last week and the wife (truly my better half) sent a card. His wife just called and said that **** passed away 6 months ago from cancer...he didn't want anyone to know. :sad:

Gotta think.....goodnite all and godbless **** since he was truly one of the good ones!


----------



## Guest

It ain't gonna get any easier. When I use to invest pretty heavily in real estate we ultimately ran into the same type of problem. Those that had know clue what they were doing jumped in, made things much more complicated for those that did know what they were doing, and then ended up loosing their a$$es because what they thought was a good deal WASN'T.....

As I told one of my reps. I'm not looking for a low paying job. I can get them all day long and not have to put up with a 10th of the bull****. I'm in this to make a good living, thankfully this isn't my only source of work. If it doesn't make sense in some form or fashion I AIN"T DOING IT!!!!:w00t:


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## Guest

*Ok got more questions..lol*

ok if you do a house for hud, does the national company turn in for the max amount allowed? i mean because a few i have contacted lately dont even pay half of allowed to the contractor, just doesnt seem right.
how can you make money if you are getting such low pay and have to give a 20-30% discount??? im confused:blink:
i mean the contractos take all the risk and sweat their off they deserve the $$.
I am fairly new at all this hud stuff but how does a small company work for the banks/ realtors cuz i just see making much with the nationals.. any help would be so great thanks


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> I heard the other day from a realtor that they are getting so many flyers and cards that they are just throwing them out. What worked for me was finding properties that are listed and calling them about the grass of a code violation, unsecured pool etc..... they may not want you to do anything on that property, but they might say, well that house has a pending contract, but i have this other property........... and your in!!





I'm not surprised they get a lot of cards/flyers.


I've tried the cold calling with no success. I guess I'll try more. I have to.
There isn't enough work the way it is.


Fremont a call like that sure puts things in perspective.


----------



## Guest

jimstrick said:


> ok if you do a house for hud, does the national company turn in for the max amount allowed? i mean because a few i have contacted lately dont even pay half of allowed to the contractor, just doesnt seem right.
> how can you make money if you are getting such low pay and have to give a 20-30% discount??? im confused:blink:
> i mean the contractos take all the risk and sweat their off they deserve the $$.
> I am fairly new at all this hud stuff but how does a small company work for the banks/ realtors cuz i just see making much with the nationals.. any help would be so great thanks


Funny question!
There have been 1168 post on this topic.
I know it takes some work reading them all(darn work again)
your question has been answered already,but know one can make you read all the info.
I'm not in PP,but by reading between the lines of these posting,I can see where the real money is being made...and it's not from mowing the lawn!:notworthy


----------



## APlusPPGroup

oteroproperties said:


> What do you say about the fact that these guys will work them selves into the poor house and bow out? I mean I know that some people make a mess and its up to us to clean it up, but doesnt that just make us look better? If we are as good as we say we are won't we out last these guys?


Good point but I see a couple of problems. 

One: it depends on how long it takes the industry to correct itself; and 

Two: it may NEVER correct itself because there is another new vendor waiting in line who will also take jobs at low rates.

I think the biggest problem is that people get into property preservation and are willing to take the low rates hoping to "prove themselves" and increase their rates and work load after they've done that.

What they don't realize is that the nationals don't give a crap about the vendors "proving" themselves. All they require is that a job is "acceptable" for the work load to increase...... but the rates rarely do. Once you start at that rate, you can almost guarantee you stay at that rate. 

Once a national finds a "victim" willing to do anything and everything at next to nothing, they work them into the ground. Then, if the national decides to begin charging back, they know the vendor won't have the money or resources to fight them.

It's a dog eat dog industry like none I've ever seen. The field has been saturated for a very long time and the nationals adjust or "fix" their rates based on the laws of supply and demand. As long as there is a huge pool of newbies to draw from, they will keep making more and more of a killing for themselves.

We stick to our pricing and very rarely deviate from it. When we do, it's only because we see potential in the client. This cuts our work load considerably but I'm not going to work my fanny off getting work to vendors when neither of us are going to make money.

Sticking to our guns means we rarely take on a "bad" client, too. We've cut quite a few clients from our list over the years because a small handful of happy clients can generate enough work to sufficiently replace the nationals. Happy clients usually equals quick pay. Not always but we have fewer collections with happy client.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Nicely done Linda, that is a very loaded post full of good point after point.


----------



## oteroproperties

a1propertyclean said:


> Good point but I see a couple of problems.
> 
> One: it depends on how long it takes the industry to correct itself; and
> 
> Two: it may NEVER correct itself because there is another new vendor waiting in line who will also take jobs at low rates.
> 
> I think the biggest problem is that people get into property preservation and are willing to take the low rates hoping to "prove themselves" and increase their rates and work load after they've done that.
> 
> What they don't realize is that the nationals don't give a crap about the vendors "proving" themselves. All they require is that a job is "acceptable" for the work load to increase...... but the rates rarely do. Once you start at that rate, you can almost guarantee you stay at that rate.
> 
> Once a national finds a "victim" willing to do anything and everything at next to nothing, they work them into the ground. Then, if the national decides to begin charging back, they know the vendor won't have the money or resources to fight them.
> 
> It's a dog eat dog industry like none I've ever seen. The field has been saturated for a very long time and the nationals adjust or "fix" their rates based on the laws of supply and demand. As long as there is a huge pool of newbies to draw from, they will keep making more and more of a killing for themselves.
> 
> We stick to our pricing and very rarely deviate from it. When we do, it's only because we see potential in the client. This cuts our work load considerably but I'm not going to work my fanny off getting work to vendors when neither of us are going to make money.
> 
> Sticking to our guns means we rarely take on a "bad" client, too. We've cut quite a few clients from our list over the years because a small handful of happy clients can generate enough work to sufficiently replace the nationals. Happy clients usually equals quick pay. Not always but we have fewer collections with happy client.
> 
> Linda


 
agreed, sadly this is all a sign of the times. use to be when someone saw trucks like mine i.e. white boxtrucks with dovetails they had to talk to the guy driving it to see what it was we did or they just assumed that we were lawn crews. now thanks to all the media outlets we are on the front page everyday. newbies are needed to keep things going, but the particular circumstances surrounding the reasons for the seemingly unlimited supply of contractors is the problem. however that is a double edge sword because its also the reason the industry is so busy right now. No jobs


----------



## Guest

I truly have been thinking real hard about the phone calls I got last fall by a group of P&P contractors that were working with the Laborers Union to have the industry unionized. 
Sometimes I truly think this will be the only protection the knowledgable contractors will have. As one Union Boss told me on the phone "95% of these loans have government money behind them and we (union) can control the work and the Field Service Companies will be shuffled out of the picture".....
These were very serious individuals and the last I heard the Union thing is in the works. I showed some interest hoping to be kept up to speed on what was happening but the only thing I heard was a couple months ago asking if I was still interested. "if the offer and the pay is right heck ya I'm interested"....All I could say. 
Anyone else heard from this group?
I think I'm ready.....maybe.....maybe not. :detective:


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> I truly have been thinking real hard about the phone calls I got last fall by a group of P&P contractors that were working with the Laborers Union to have the industry unionized.
> Sometimes I truly think this will be the only protection the knowledgable contractors will have. As one Union Boss told me on the phone "95% of these loans have government money behind them and we (union) can control the work and the Field Service Companies will be shuffled out of the picture".....
> These were very serious individuals and the last I heard the Union thing is in the works. I showed some interest hoping to be kept up to speed on what was happening but the only thing I heard was a couple months ago asking if I was still interested. "if the offer and the pay is right heck ya I'm interested"....All I could say.
> Anyone else heard from this group?
> I think I'm ready.....maybe.....maybe not. :detective:


Man after all the bad experiences i had with Local 150 operating engineers in Illinois i have NO desire to EVER work with corrupt union organizations ever again................


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I truly have been thinking real hard about the phone calls I got last fall by a group of P&P contractors that were working with the Laborers Union to have the industry unionized.
> Sometimes I truly think this will be the only protection the knowledgable contractors will have. As one Union Boss told me on the phone "95% of these loans have government money behind them and we (union) can control the work and the Field Service Companies will be shuffled out of the picture".....
> These were very serious individuals and the last I heard the Union thing is in the works. I showed some interest hoping to be kept up to speed on what was happening but the only thing I heard was a couple months ago asking if I was still interested. "if the offer and the pay is right heck ya I'm interested"....All I could say.
> Anyone else heard from this group?
> I think I'm ready.....maybe.....maybe not. :detective:


Funny that you brought that up. I am clueless on any inner workings of unions. But two days ago I was asking myself if this could be done to get the pay we deserve. It may or may not be a good idea but as much money as I'm losing I was really giving it some thought. Would be nice to get these crooked nationals out of the picture!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Heads up. Don't forget to read the realated stories.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/NO-CHECKS-NO-BALANCES-92363609.html

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/BYRON-HARRISWFAA-TV-96930104.html

http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/investigates-96773444.html

http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigat...anagement-firm-execs-live-large-88321192.html [This is a company I posted an article about at least once before in this same thread]

Now how many of you are willing to take the risk these people have? One guy is losing his home to the SAME BANK that owes him thousands of dollars for his preservation work. WHAT THE HECK IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE, FOLKS?????? 

Those of us who have been in the industry for awhile try our best to give others the skinny on what's going on out there and yet.............. how many of you ignore us and simply think "it will never happen to me"?

We took on just barely under $20,000 worth of work a few months ago, all of which was completed within a week in 3 different states, from a company in Florida who dragged their feet in paying, kept asking for invoices and photos we had already sent them, then had the NERVE to ask if they could settle with us for 60%. Guess whose contract they had? BANK OF AMERICA.

We ended up telling them that our vendors had worked hard and would settle for NO LESS than 90%. There were many other hoops I personally jumped through besides simply telling them "no less than 90%" but the long and short of it was we won the battle ...... if you can call "settling" winning. We, along with our vendors, took a minor loss compared to the horror stories above. So, in this regard, we feel very fortunate.

Had they stuck to THEIR offer, we might have lost it all. It was a gamble for us since their company was much bigger than ours and had a legal resource we couldn't match. But we fought a good fight and got paid. It took 3 installments over the course of 3 months but it's behind us now.

The reason I'm posting this is to show that it can happen to anyone. US, YOU, YOUR BROTHER, SISTER, COUSIN, MOTHER, FATHER, ETC.

Those of us with experience keep telling newbies how the industry is changing. We relate our horror stories, we talk about chargebacks and unbelievable lawsuits, etc. But yet............ preservation companies KEEP starting up and going under because the media says it's a booming industry. Why do they believe the hype over the truth?????? Sheesh!!!

I'm not one to discourage anyone from doing what they want. But if you're even CONSIDERING getting into this industry, you darned sure better have the gumption and fortitude to stick it out. You might also be prepared to be creative in how you deal with clients.

This post probably seems a little harsh. Okay, maybe a lot harsh. But this industry wasn't supposed to be about the quick buck. It was supposed to be about honest, hard working people trying to find honest work in trade for a decent dollar so that they can pay their bills and get ahead.

The feds and mortgage companies, lenders, and banks created a need for property preservation, otherwise none of us would be here. But many of the PP companies out there have never owned a business of their own before and the banks are taking advantage of this. 

So c'mon, people. Pay attention, educate yourselves, and think really hard before you leap.

Linda


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## BPWY

This is no joking matter. I'm out $107 because of these guys. I've sent the pics 2 times already and they still continue to "loose" them. I am certain its intentional.




> The problems concerned electronic photos. Contractors must upload pictures of their work into a Bank of America computer to prove they've done the tasks assigned to them. Bank of America lost millions of the snapshots and then decided not to pay its contractors as a result.


----------



## BPWY

After reading thru that list of horror stories I'm pretty lucky I never got took by an outfit like these.



> Now how many of you are willing to take the risk these people have? One guy is losing his home to the SAME BANK that owes him thousands of dollars for his preservation work. WHAT THE HECK IS WRONG WITH THIS PICTURE, FOLKS??????


There are a lot of warning signs that show up even when doing your initial research or initial contact with some of these regionals. My experience with some/most of them is that they INTEND to screw the contractor.
For example, only paying $15 per yrd of debris and collecting HUD rate which in some states is 3 times what they are paying out is intentional screwing of your contractors.

A company not mentioned in the list of articles is FAS. They are just as cheap and just as bad about "loosing" paper work and photos. They talk a good game but thats where all the goodness stops!
I could go on and on.


----------



## BPWY

Folks that work for BofA know what I'm talking about.

The requirement of theirs to bid all debris removal EACH AND EVERY trip, other wise the contractor gets the privilege 
of removing it for free for the bank.

I've got my opinions on the WHY they have that policy.
Its easy to forget and its a big pain to have to do each time.


----------



## JenkinsHB

most of our work comes from bank of america. their policies are no different than any of the other nationals that we work for. you need to update your bid on the property everytime you are there ... and you need photos of the things you are bidding out each time you are there. It seems to be in your benefit to document the conditions of the property.


----------



## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> most of our work comes from bank of america. their policies are no different than any of the other nationals .............






Their policies are different than the folks I work for. 
Other wise I wouldn't comment on them.

Several of the ones I work for get real irate if you "update your bids". 

Only first time bids are allowed unless there are new issues at the property is a very common policy.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> This is no joking matter. I'm out $107 because of these guys. I've sent the pics 2 times already and they still continue to "loose" them. I am certain its intentional.


I wish I could say I am only out $107 from BOA. Before it was BOA, Countrywide really screwed me.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I wish I could say I am only out $107 from BOA. Before it was BOA, Countrywide really screwed me.





I'm under no illusion that its not going to get worse.

Right now they are the cheapest and poorest paying outfit that I get work from.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Anyone else get this e-mail from Altisource? More good news...........

_"Altisource Portfolio Solutions would like to thank you for your continued hard work and efforts and is continually striving to improve our working relationship with all of our vendors. With this in mind, please note the following changes. 

Digital Locks (Smart Code Single Cylinder Deadbolt)

Effective July 1, 2010, the lock change process will be revised as follows:

Digital Locks must be installed on the main door (only) of all properties assigned to you. All secondary doors, including all doors on 1st floor and basement must be disabled from the exterior using either Liquid Nails or Loctite (inserted into the key hole). 

The standard price that Altisource will pay is as follows:

Digital Lock cost: $70
Installation charges and deactivation of the other locks : $30

Overall cost = $100

Altisource Standardized Key Codes
The digital lock codes must be set using the first four numbers of the street number. If the street number has less than four characters, add zeros (0) as shown in this example (i.e. address: 12 Audrey Street). The lock code would be: 1200
Note: Altisource will require that the key codes be changed periodically and will notify you when to change the codes & the new format to use.

Key Storage
Keys must be stored in a central area (kitchen cabinet is recommended). If kitchen cabinets are not available then use the bathroom cabinet.

Note: To assist you with this process, we have located a company that is currently offering Digital Locks for sale @ $69.99 each which includes shipping & handling, however, please understand that you are under no obligation to use this company. If you’re able to purchase a similar product from your local hardware stores then please do so.

The company is LOCKS4REO.COM and their contact information is as follows:
__http://www.locks4reo.com/__ 
__[email protected]_
_[email protected]_
_1 888 9REOLOCKS
PHONE 888 973 6562
FAX (949) 388 0725

Thank you,"_

Now we have to buy locks at $69.99 each, plus shipping and taxes in most places? How many vendors can afford to stock up at that price?

So what's next, I wonder? 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I aint got it yet.


If they think I'm buying a lock for $69.99 and going to install it for $70 minus their discount for direct deposit they must be smoking some good stuff. A hell of a lot better than what they are sharing with me.


----------



## JenkinsHB

i saw that this morning. they probably own the company you have to buy the locks from.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

This is my response to Altisource's e-mail:

_"Going to electronic locks is not going to be feasible for most vendors. And WE are not in a position to advance funds to them to stock up their inventory @ $69.99 per lock, plus tax and shipping in most places._

_If this is going to be standard on every new lock change order, we will have to decline them almost every time. The way the industry is these days, not too many vendors are making enough money to go this route."_


Theirs:


_"Thank you Linda. I will bring this to PPI’s management attention."_


I guess we'll see what happens next. What a crazy idea. And a VERY expensive one at that. How many lock replacements will they be able to afford in neighborhoods that are vandalized on a regular basis?

And put the keys inside the house after installing the lock? What's wrong with putting them in the lockbox like we usually do? 

Breaking and entering will be MUCH easier now. People de-code lockboxes all the time. Now all they need to do is figure out the lock code. Are they going to phase out lockboxes now?

So what do you do if the client requires lock changes on ALL doors? Can you imagine the out of pocket cost up front?

Does anyone at all see the benefit to these types of locks? I really want to know if there is one. I'm totally dumbfounded.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BTW. These Power Bolts operate on [4] AA batteries. So there's another expense for the vendor.

Battery goes dead and guess what................? :laughing:

Linda


----------



## brm1109

I actually received the e mail today even though about 4 months ago I told them that I would not do any work for them.
There is no way that I would front that kind of money and then only make $30.00 for it.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I actually received the e mail today even though about 4 months ago I told them that I would not do any work for them.
> There is no way that I would front that kind of money and then only make $30.00 for it.






Doesn't look like they are going to send me the email. 
And I did a occupancy inspection w/o just last night for them.

Oh and it won't be $30. It'll be less than that because of their direct deposit fee.


----------



## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> i saw that this morning. they probably own the company you have to buy the locks from.





Good chance you are onto some thing there!!!!!!

From their website.


















Oh and its a single page site. No home page etc.


----------



## ARPPP

a1propertyclean said:


> This is my response to Altisource's e-mail:
> 
> _"Going to electronic locks is not going to be feasible for most vendors. And WE are not in a position to advance funds to them to stock up their inventory @ $69.99 per lock, plus tax and shipping in most places._
> 
> 
> Linda


I got this email today and immediately sent a response back to Pat. I am going to send it to the escalation team next. There is no way I would drive to a property which usually is 30+ mile trip for me to make nothing! I was so angry when I received this email. On top of that I sent another nasty gram to them regarding properties which they claim I am the primary vendor for and they bid out everything minor or major for the property. I was told that trashouts under $500 we could do without a bid, now somewhere along the line they have changed that, without informing the primary vendor. Others are coming in to the property trashing it out, losing the keys, forgetting to put the lockbox back on the door etc and then I get 5 urgent calls to replace keys and lockbox immediately. (I know I am venting ) 

I am really not feeling the love they promised me these days 

Annette 
AR Professional Property Preservation​


----------



## Guest

ARPPP said:


> I got this email today and immediately sent a response back to Pat. I am going to send it to the escalation team next. There is no way I would drive to a property which usually is 30+ mile trip for me to make nothing! I was so angry when I received this email. On top of that I sent another nasty gram to them regarding properties which they claim I am the primary vendor for and they bid out everything minor or major for the property. I was told that trashouts under $500 we could do without a bid, now somewhere along the line they have changed that, without informing the primary vendor. Others are coming in to the property trashing it out, losing the keys, forgetting to put the lockbox back on the door etc and then I get 5 urgent calls to replace keys and lockbox immediately. (I know I am venting )
> 
> I am really not feeling the love they promised me these days
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation​


 
We don't work with this company but it kinda sounds to me that you will running back to replace the batteries that will die in the heat of summer or the freezing temps of winter....:jester:


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Good chance you are onto some thing there!!!!!!
> 
> From their website.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Oh and its a single page site. No home page etc.


Ok, I just did a search on the domain name registry. The site was just registered on 5/24/2010. :stupid:

Has anyone found them cheaper or about the same price elsewhere. Let us know. I wonder how it would work out if the majority of us ordered from someone other than them :clap::clap:

I'm just saying, There is power in numbers....

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Searched on "Power Bolt". Note that the item has been discontinued. Maybe the company was so overstocked on an item that didn't move, they gave Altisource a "deal" for their vendors?

http://www.smarthomeusa.com/ShopByManufacturer/WeiserLock/Item/ED1460***X/

The lock has been replaced by the same style of lock, only it is now a Kwikset and $20 higher. So..... once the discontinued lock is out of stock, are we going to have to pay $90? If so, will the rate go up for lock changes? I doubt it.

http://www.smarthomeusa.com/ShopByManufacturer/kwikset/Item/907-LO3/

Can we all say boycott? Wow. I'm speechless. Well, kinda. :whistling

In reality, we just front the lock money. Altisource's clients actually pay for it, along with our time. I wonder how many of them have agreed to use this new lock?

Oh, well. I'm not buying any and, unless my vendors indicate they are willing to buy the locks, I'll decline the orders.... so I probably shouldn't stress about it. We'll continue to install the Kwiksets we have until Altisource makes a final decision or comes up with another solution.

Time for me to say goodnight.:sleep1:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

ARPPP said:


> I got this email today and immediately sent a response back to Pat. I am going to send it to the escalation team next. There is no way I would drive to a property which usually is 30+ mile trip for me to make nothing! I was so angry when I received this email. On top of that I sent another nasty gram to them regarding properties which they claim I am the primary vendor for and they bid out everything minor or major for the property. I was told that trashouts under $500 we could do without a bid, now somewhere along the line they have changed that, without informing the primary vendor. Others are coming in to the property trashing it out, losing the keys, forgetting to put the lockbox back on the door etc and then I get 5 urgent calls to replace keys and lockbox immediately. (I know I am venting )
> 
> I am really not feeling the love they promised me these days
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation​






Its easy to tell when a national is lying.
The same way as lawyers...... when their gums are flapping.


----------



## BPWY

I'm fairly new to Altisource, but seem to remember hearing that back in the "good old days" on their website where it says "proposed order costs" you could change the amount you wanted to do the w/o before accepting the w/o.

Am I right on that????


Because you sure can't now! It really gets under my skin they ask us to do inspections etc for free!


----------



## ARPPP

Powerbolt door lock $68.90
http://www.doorhardwareplus.com/decor/search.pl?qs=No%3D36%26N%3D101%2B3000613%2B3000577&mp=3&sp=1&M=&Ns=Price%7C0&gp=&rpp=36

Free shipping!

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


----------



## BPWY

So yesterday I cover a reassigned w/o from another contractor. For what ever excuse he wasn't able to cover it.

Any way, I found out that he is leaving $75 on the table for cleaning a fridge. His bid was only $50.
After I did his w/o then I went and cleaned another fridge that I bid that was no dirtier than his for $125.
Same national co on both.


----------



## mtmtnman

JenkinsHB said:


> most of our work comes from bank of america. their policies are no different than any of the other nationals that we work for. you need to update your bid on the property everytime you are there ... and you need photos of the things you are bidding out each time you are there. It seems to be in your benefit to document the conditions of the property.



B of A has their head so firmly implanted in there rear passage they need xenon lights to see! Some of the garbage i see out of them blows my mind. Today i get a work order to _"Return to property and complete yard maintenance for allowable according to guidelines due to lateness on work order @##$%$%^[email protected]"_

#1., i turned the order in the day it was issued to me.
#2., THE DAMN PLACE IS AN 8 UNIT CONDO AND CONDO ASSOCIATION MAINTAINED!! i HAVE TOLD THEM THIS *OVER AND OVER* AGAIN SINCE 4/1 but they just don't get it!!!!!

Got another order this afternoon for a line x line damage report for vandalism damage ON A PROPERTY _*FOR THE 4TH TIME SINCE FEBRUARY!!!! *_THESE IDIOTS HAVE OVER 1000 PHOTOS ON THIS PROPERTY AS EVERY TIME THEY SEND ME THERE TO DO SOMETHING THEY GET 100 MORE!! HANDRAIL INSTALL?? 100 MORE INTERIOR PHOTOS. SUMP PUMP INSTALL?? 100 MORE INTERIOR PHOTOS. IN SETS OF 100 AND THEY WILL NOW HAVE 100 MORE PHOTOS OF THE SAME SPRAY PAINTED PROFANITY ON THE WALLS ETC. TO MAKE 400+ PHOTOS JUST FROM LINE X LINE VISITS!!

GOT ANOTHER PROPERTY I HAVE BEEN TO AT LEAST A DOZEN TIMES AND I CHIT YOU NOT I HAVE JUST SHY OF 2000 PHOTOS ON THE PROPERTY WITH A NEW BID EVERY VISIT.

This bank wastes so much of my time and $$$ it is hardly worth working for them. I could tell you lots more stories but i just don't have the time.


----------



## Guest

Dang I want more stories but I understand your busy uploading more of the photos....at least you are getting the $1.00 per photo right.....


----------



## Guest

Or start charging B of A $2.00 for every photo they "misplace":thumbup:


----------



## BPWY

lemonque said:


> *HUD Property Preservation Guide*
> 
> With foreclosures on the rise, someone needs to maintain these properties and make sure they stay clean, safe and ready for investors and new buyers. If you are in the business of taking care of these homes you will need to know what the cost allowables are for your services.
> Mortgage Lenders and Brokers have several homes that need to be cleaned, secured and maintained. There are more homes that need preservation than there are homes being sold.
> On the HUD website they have a link to everything an individual will need to know about property preservation. Here is the information posted on their site.
> *REO Preservation & Protection Cost Schedules for California *
> 
> Check for: Information by State
> *HUD Resources *Homeownership Centers Preservation and Protection Mortgagee Letters
> These pages contain the most current HUD Cost Allowable schedules taken from the HUD Mortgagee Letters and are intended for organizations and individuals involved in preserving and protecting HUD properties.
> *HUD General Requirements *of: Maximum Cost, Appeals, Inspections, Lock & Secure, Boarding, Debris Removal, Yard Maintenance, Winterization, Exceed Fees, Exceed Time, and Contractors
> *HUD Regulations State-By-State *include: Alabama, Alaska, Arizona, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Connecticut, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Guam, Hawaii, Idaho, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Minnesota, Mississippi, Missouri, Montana, Nebraska, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Carolina, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Oregon, Pennsylvania, Puerto Rico, Rhode Island, South Carolina, South Dakota, Tennessee, Texas, Utah, Vermont, Virgin Islands, Virginia, Washington, West Virginia, Wisconsin, and Wyoming.








Oh great a spammer.


----------



## Guest

*Boa*

I used to flip properties when the market was strong. You're definitely not dealing with intelligent life within the BOA organization!


----------



## JenkinsHB

mtmtnman said:


> Got another order this afternoon for a line x line damage report for vandalism damage ON A PROPERTY _*FOR THE 4TH TIME SINCE FEBRUARY!!!! *_


line x lines pay $350 a piece. why are you bitching about that? That seems like some easy money to me.


----------



## mtmtnman

JenkinsHB said:


> line x lines pay $350 a piece. why are you bitching about that? That seems like some easy money to me.


Line by line pays a $35-$50 trip charge for anyone i work for. Not much better than insurance loss drafts at $25-$40. 

Line x line instructions:
What is the damage? _*Spray painted body parts and profanity in 4 different rooms.

*What is your bid to repair? *Remover paint from concrete basement floors, $200, Paint over profanity in 2 bedrooms, $300. Literally a 2-3 hour job!! They need to quit wasting my time and approve the bid or quit sending me 130 miles round trip for peanuts!!*
_


----------



## APlusPPGroup

New memo from Altisource regarding the expensive locks:

Dear Vendor,

We have received feedback regarding the communication sent earlier this week on the new Digital Lock procedures, and have taken time to review the questions, comments, and suggestions from our vendors regarding this policy change. We have summarized the primary concerns below, and have also provided our responses to each item:

*Why has Altisource decided to implement this policy?*
We understand this requirement is unique to Altisource, and that most Preservation and Inspection firms do not require this type of Lock. This requirement has been established as a result of our need to resolve recurring access issues which prevent Altisource Preservation Vendors, Altisource Valuation Vendors, and Real Estate Agents from accessing properties. As an Altisource company is the real estate broker in many states, it is our responsibility to provide access to Real Estate Agents attempting to show properties to prospective buyers. 

*What other alternatives were explored prior to implementing this policy?*
We have explored the use of a standard key code; however our challenge is that we must provide access to Real Estate Agents who do not typically carry with them specific keys in order to gain access to properties. If there are no keys in the lockbox (which is a frequent occurrence), designating certain key codes for them to utilize in gaining access is not a solution. Altisource must reduce the number of access issues our team is managing on a daily basis, which impacts our ability to market our properties and for our vendors to perform CMAs. 

*What are the pricing considerations that have been made relative to the cost of the product and the vendor reimbursement?*
As with the previous procedure, Altisource will reimburse vendors for the cost of the Digital Lock, and will also pay vendors a service fee for installation and securing secondary locks. The shipping and tax charges are included in the quoted price of $69.99 that we received from the company (_LOCKS4REO.COM)_.

Please note LOCKS4REO.COM advised us that the shipping time will be 3-5 business days from the initial order placement time.

*Is there any consideration that will be made to the service fee?*
Altisource has decided to increase the fees paid to vendors as follows:
Digital Lock cost: $70
Installation charges and deactivation of the other locks: $40
*Total Fees Allowed = $110*

As with all our policies, Altisource continues to evaluate the effectiveness of its Property Preservation and Inspection requirements. We will make adjustments as necessary to ensure that we are achieving the objective for this initiative: to significantly reduce the occurrence of access issues.

Recognizing that this policy may not be acceptable to all vendors, we ask that you notify us immediately if you are unable or unwilling to accept future orders with these guidelines.

Thank you,

Altisource Portfolio Solutions Management

So I guess they're going to make it stick............ But, hey. For those vendors going along with it, you just got a $10 raise.:laughing:

We'll just take it on a case by case and talk to each vendor before we decline or accept the orders. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> line x lines pay $350 a piece. why are you bitching about that? That seems like some easy money to me.





Sure it does........ to the national/regional that is giving out the bread crumbs at $18 for a trip charge to the contractor.



I've done a P4C for BofA on a property, good grief... I cannot count how many times.


And then we have the issue of them being completely incapable of approving a simple thing such as a grass cut bid. Grass cut cycle after grass cut cycle all we do is go take more pics of the grass getting higher and turn that in.


----------



## BPWY

Isn't this fun. I got the updated memo from Altisource. 

I never got the original.


----------



## mtmtnman

I got the update fromPatricia McTaggart but not the original also. I have a simple solution for Alti-Source you can pass on to them as i don't have the gumption right now. They could go with a zero-bit key code. (blank key) I have one company that does this and it wouldn't take much effort for a realtor to stop by the hardware store and pick up a blank key. Of course then the new issue is actually getting contractors to get a rekey kit and learn how to use it. (my 11 year old rekeys locks for me)


----------



## JenkinsHB

BPWY said:


> Sure it does........ to the national/regional that is giving out the bread crumbs at $18 for a trip charge to the contractor.
> 
> 
> 
> I've done a P4C for BofA on a property, good grief... I cannot count how many times.
> 
> 
> And then we have the issue of them being completely incapable of approving a simple thing such as a grass cut bid. Grass cut cycle after grass cut cycle all we do is go take more pics of the grass getting higher and turn that in.


My experience with BAC is completely different from yours. If you are getting $18 for a line x line you are getting hosed. I net well over $200 for each of them. I do not have any problems getting bid approvals either.


----------



## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> My experience with BAC is completely different from yours. If you are getting $18 for a line x line you are getting hosed. I net well over $200 for each of them. I do not have any problems getting bid approvals either.






You deal directly with BofA???


I don't, and was under the impression that at least in my area they were not taking on any other vendors at this time.


----------



## JenkinsHB

I cover MN and WI for one of their regionals.


----------



## mtmtnman

B of A would not even talk to me unless i wanted to cover the entire state, 750 miles east to west and 200 miles not to south. I tried that for other companies and never could find subs in the 30-40 person Podunk towns in eastern Montana so i declined. I work for a regional...


----------



## BPWY

What do ya'll think????? Craigslist scam or real??

I aint doing it unless they pay 50% down.




> If you have a Large Lawn Tractor or Brush Hog this is a great gig for you.
> 
> We are REO212. We are a Property Preservation company based out of Las Vegas, NV and Denver, CO. We work on Foreclosure Properties.
> 
> We have a need for someone to go mow 35 acres of Flat Land that was actually just a horse pasture and a little mobile home.
> 
> Please provide a bid and day you can complete along with all your contact info. Payment on this is coming from Wells Fargo and generally takes 2-3 weeks after invoice is submitted. You will have to wait that period for payment. You also must have a Digital Camera to take Before, During and After Pictures and email them to us.
> 
> Please call with any questions or email
> 
> There is a lot more work for the right person if things go well.
> 
> Thank you
> 970-691-***x


----------



## APlusPPGroup

35 acres is a LOT of ground to cover. They sound like they're for real. But who knows?

Regarding my response to Altisource, I just sent this note:

_*"We are going to have to accept or decline work orders on a property by property basis. There will be a few vendors willing to put the money out for expensive locks but not very many. 

I see a lot of security issues with these locks. I hope, for Altisource's clients' sake, they work more often than not."

*_Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

I see LOTS of lawsuits in the near future from the new HUD guidelines. Specifically the part bold/underlined.......


*** Interior Broom-Swept Condition ***
The new HUD P&P guidelines will require full interior broom swept
condition for all properties that convey on or after July 13, 2010.
This includes the removal of all interior and exterior debris,
personal property, food, household chemicals. All cabinets, closets,
and rooms must be free of debris, dust and dirt. * If personal property*
* is present, Remove and store for 30 days before disposal. Items are *
* considered personal property if the aggregate garage sale value is *
* equal to $500 or greater. Otherwise, the items are to be included in *
* your interior debris removal.*

This is where the newbies will fall short and end up broke if they are not following the states guidelines they are working in. I'll let y'all look up your own laws and pay your own attorneys for advice. Good luck!!!​


----------



## BPWY

I so seldom see $500 aggregate yard sale value in a house that its of little concern to me.


----------



## Guest

hah your garage sale value to you may be a million dollar treasure to someone else.......its all relative. Now if you moved some stuff out of my house than I'll tell ya that my couch is worth 10,000 (had it happen once where the lady said her flea infested/dog hair covered/stained pos was all wool and she bought for $10,000---bank authorized the removal/disposal and they paid her $6000.. ripoff)


----------



## BPWY

Who knew the nationals worked over the weekend?


I got 5 W/Os assigned to me yesterday and today.... from 3 different companies.


----------



## Guest

Just got word that Safeguard now wants all hazards lumped into 1 bid by c.y. So now I can go remove 40 gallons of paint, 5 propane tanks, 3 gas cans for one, maybe 2 c.y.? What a bargain!


----------



## BPWY

I'll be inflating the yards to cover it. We'll have to. Other wise I won't bid those items.

That might be what they want to happen but reality is different.


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> Just got word that Safeguard now wants all hazards lumped into 1 bid by c.y. So now I can go remove 40 gallons of paint, 5 propane tanks, 3 gas cans for one, maybe 2 c.y.? What a bargain!


 
We have been doing this for several months and it is actually better for you:

40 ga x $14/ga = $560.00. $560/50cyd = 11.20 cyds
5 propane tanks x $45.00 = $225. $225/$50 cyd = $4.5cyd

Total bid is for 15.7cyd for removal of hazards that include paints/propane tanks.


so and so on. IT makes it faster bidding and the companies don't know how much you are bidding per line items..ie the paints, chems, and such


----------



## Guest

Oh forgot to add that it minimizes the dreaded partial bid approvals.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Oh forgot to add that it minimizes the dreaded partial bid approvals.





That would definitely be a plus side.


On another note a property I had bid some time ago for the grass cut and the ext debris removal the bank/national has been stalling and messing around.

Today they had me go remove the int paint. While I was there code enforcement rolls up and posts the property. :thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:

They have 7 days to correct the problem. I wonder who gets the bids..... me or the 2nd bidder.


----------



## Guest

everyone will get to go bid it all over again since it is now code violated.


----------



## Guest

Hi Otero, 
A while ago you posted that your crews video all work. I am curious how you do that? Do you have a designated videographer or video cameras that clip onto your guys? Or something else?
Thanks


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> everyone will get to go bid it all over again since it is now code violated.







Its far enough away I'm not making a special trip just to bid again. My old bid still stands as far as I'm concerned.


----------



## JenkinsHB

Can anyone hit 4 orders in Grant County, IN today or tomorrow???

THIS HAS BEEN TAKEN CARE OF.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

JenkinsHB said:


> Can anyone hit 4 orders in Grant County, IN today or tomorrow???


I have a vendor for Grant County. Message me with your phone number or e-mail address and I'll check with my vendor. We might be able to help you out.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

Ca you really tell if the lock has been changed & deadbolt disabled from these photos??


----------



## BPWY

I can but then again I'm not a habib either sitting in india not really understanding exactly what it is that I'm looking for.


----------



## mtmtnman

Had an old timer locksmith change a lock and take photos of interior for me about 220 miles from me as it really wasn't worth my drive. I knew EVERYTHING but the lock change would have to be bid. The regional is pitching a fit that there is _"no photo of key inserted in lock" _Does anyone know where this rule came from? What does it prove? It's my fault as i forgot to mention this to him but it is also VERY obvious that the lock has been changed. I re-key many of locks on site and had to supply photos in the past of the lock apart setting on top of my rekey kit.


----------



## Guest

> The regional is pitching a fit that there is _"no photo of key inserted in lock" _Does anyone know where this rule came from? What does it prove?


It proves that the key works in the lock without the folks at the bank having to make a trip out there to see for themselves. Where I live, it has been a very common occurrence on REO's for the key to not work. Sometimes keys get mixed up between properties, sometimes a Realtor or some other very interested buyer will change the locks to prevent anyone else from buying it, and the list goes on and on. At least if you have photographic evidence of this, the REO admin is off the hook.


----------



## oteroproperties

uintahiker said:


> Hi Otero,
> A while ago you posted that your crews video all work. I am curious how you do that? Do you have a designated videographer or video cameras that clip onto your guys? Or something else?
> Thanks


Forgive me if this ios a little scattered, its been a long day!!

when we were doing really high volume we had one guy video us gaining entry and talking to a neighbor (to show we had a witness even if they didnt know it). He would then video the entire contents of the property, the ceilings through out the house including closets, and entire ext. We would still take all the needed photos and send them in but keep a video log of all securings. Then we would cut the grass and remove any debris, video it loaded on the truck and us leaving the property. 

Our volume is no where near what it was a year ago so its just me and another guy. We have a dash cam thats always running and a hand held that we use to do int/ext contents. 

As I said before this is not full proof but it helps alot. I have been accused of going to a property before we video and stealing something then completing the securing the next day so...... But, It does show who ever may contest you that you have some things up your sleve and you don't plan on laying down and taking a beating on a baseless lawsuit. There are angles on the video that are not available on still photos and this can get you out of alot of trouble when things are contested by anyone!! It saved my ass more then a few times with missing ac units, water damage, and even lawsuits claiming theft. The dash cam keeps a good log of time in and time out on a property.

The trick is to not let anyone know that you video your work until all the cases are made. That way when they (meaning the one who is disputing you) comes up with their theory, its squashed when they realize you have a video of your work. 

If you have a dash cam you must display notification stating that on your truck.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Had an old timer locksmith change a lock and take photos of interior for me about 220 miles from me as it really wasn't worth my drive. I knew EVERYTHING but the lock change would have to be bid. The regional is pitching a fit that there is _"no photo of key inserted in lock" _Does anyone know where this rule came from? What does it prove? It's my fault as i forgot to mention this to him but it is also VERY obvious that the lock has been changed. I re-key many of locks on site and had to supply photos in the past of the lock apart setting on top of my rekey kit.


I can stick the key to my house in almost any doorknob. There is proof right there that the key in the new lock photo is pointless. You know this is true, but the banks claim its proof.


----------



## oteroproperties

somewherein815 said:


> I can stick the key to my house in almost any doorknob. There is proof right there that the key in the new lock photo is pointless. You know this is true, but the banks claim its proof.


We have always taken a photo of the key in the door turned to show it works. it also shows the key code on the key to further show we did our job right. I went back to a property at no charge to check a lock that an inspector said didnt work only once before i started doing it.

i would show a photo but i dont know how to upload it


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> I can stick the key to my house in almost any doorknob. There is proof right there that the key in the new lock photo is pointless. You know this is true, but the banks claim its proof.


Exactly. Take a photo of any old key in a lock and it proves nothing other than the key slides in the lock. The only way to prove the key works is to send the bank an MPEG of you turning the lock with the key showing it opens the lock. I have had 1 company griping that i rekey instead of changing the lock as they can't tell if the lock was changed because the before and after photos look the same. This is why i have had to take a photo of the lock apart on top of my rekey kit. No need to install a $5 new lok when the old one can be re-pinned......


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> Exactly. Take a photo of any old key in a lock and it proves nothing other than the key slides in the lock. The only way to prove the key works is to send the bank an MPEG of you turning the lock with the key showing it opens the lock. I have had 1 company griping that i rekey instead of changing the lock as they can't tell if the lock was changed because the before and after photos look the same. This is why i have had to take a photo of the lock apart on top of my rekey kit. No need to install a $5 new lok when the old one can be re-pinned......


----------



## oteroproperties

guess that didnt work!!


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> We have always taken a photo of the key in the door turned to show it works. it also shows the key code on the key to further show we did our job right. I went back to a property at no charge to check a lock that an inspector said didnt work only once before i started doing it.
> 
> i would show a photo but i dont know how to upload it



The majority of inspectors tend to be idjits. I had a work order for a line by line for roof damage from wind on a nearly new home today 70 miles away. The work order said the inspector reported damage. Got to the property and took about 50 photos of the roof finding no damage whatsoever. I know what i am looking for as i have built homes and been in the construction trades for 20 years. I really thought of taking 2-300 photos and uploading them but without an SLR camera this would have been a pain. In 30 days i will get the same work order all over again.


Got another one stating a home is unsecure for the 5th time since January. I have never found it unsecure when i arrived. Just wasting good time. For most of y'all it's not so bad because you live close to your work. The 3 counties i cover are over 10,000 sq miles in size and i cover all 3 every week.

I did take 100 more photos of the spray painted words on the wall in the other home in mentioned last weekend. Nothing different than the last 3 times i was issued the same work order. No wonder the banks are going broke. Hire competent people to review the submitals and they could save a ton!!


----------



## mtmtnman

I ran in to a Safeguard house a while back where the contractor took the lock apart, dumped all the pins and put it together again. Coulda opened it with a bobby pin!


----------



## oteroproperties

did it work this time??


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## oteroproperties

oteroproperties said:


> did it work this time??


 
ok, this is what i think they are talking about. shows that the correct key code opens the lock


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> ok, this is what i think they are talking about. shows that the correct key code opens the lock



I very rarely ever show anything but the key in the lock not even turned and no code showing. You would think they would gripe about that but it has NEVER happened until a locksmith forgot to show the key in the lock.


----------



## oteroproperties

i do it so that when they send me a bull**** order to return and check i say sorry my photos clearly show that we did our job right and we are not going back unless they want us to replace the lock. full charge.


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> i do it so that when they send me a bull**** order to return and check i say sorry my photos clearly show that we did our job right and we are not going back unless they want us to replace the lock. full charge.



Are you finding your properties secured by another company a few weeks after you did the secure? Been running into this quite a bit lately......


----------



## oteroproperties

up until 2 days ago i had not gotten a new securing since january so i can't really say. i really dont know what happened to my volume.

here is work from a contractor that has a "faster response time" then me.

and i see why. that pool is with 2x4s!!!!


----------



## oteroproperties

here's another one!!! make sure that front door is secure!!!! unless you have a phillips screw driver. oh and make sure you leave the screws half out and use the wrong size bit so that you strip the screws out and make it harder to fix!!


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## oteroproperties

funny thing is thats a .99 hasp. there was a $3 hasp on the ground that would have made it much easier to padlock


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> here's another one!!! make sure that front door is secure!!!! unless you have a phillips screw driver. oh and make sure you leave the screws half out and use the wrong size bit so that you strip the screws out and make it harder to fix!!




ROTFLMFAO!!!!!! I had a company, A LARGE national kick an order back because they couldn't see how i attached the hasp to the jamb!! When i asked for clarification on how "THEY" wanted it they sent me a photo just like that one!! I had to explain why that don't cut it as the property is only secure if the person trying to get in don't have a Gerber or Leatherman which is standard issue to every man woman and child in Montana!!!!


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> ROTFLMFAO!!!!!! I had a company, A LARGE national kick an order back because they couldn't see how i attached the hasp to the jamb!! When i asked for clarification on how "THEY" wanted it they sent me a photo just like that one!! I had to explain why that don't cut it as the property is only secure if the person trying to get in don't have a Gerber or Leatherman which is standard issue to every man woman and child in Montana!!!!


I really fear for the future of this industry!!!


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I really fear for the future of this industry!!!



Good time to get out IMHO..........................


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> I really fear for the future of this industry!!!


What company did you lose a ton of work from? If you PM me I might have the answer...if its 2 companies that I am familiar with......


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> What company did you lose a ton of work from? If you PM me I might have the answer...if its 2 companies that I am familiar with......





Be loud and proud, we all wanna know.  :laughing:


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I very rarely ever show anything but the key in the lock not even turned and no code showing. You would think they would gripe about that but it has NEVER happened until a locksmith forgot to show the key in the lock.






This is all I've ever done. So far............ no body has complained.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

oteroproperties said:


> here's another one!!! make sure that front door is secure!!!! unless you have a phillips screw driver. oh and make sure you leave the screws half out and use the wrong size bit so that you strip the screws out and make it harder to fix!!


The hasp is on backwards anyway. The latch is supposed to be over the piece you screw into the frame.

I don't know about anyone else, but I think hasps are the easiest to kick in. Not to mention, the buyer will not be happy about the extra holes in the door of his new house.

Some of the nationals are just plain retards. It's not only the inexperienced vendor who screws up. If QC knew what they were looking at, they'd make the vendor go back out and install it the right way.

Sheesh.................!

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> The hasp is on backwards anyway. The latch is supposed to be over the piece you screw into the frame.
> 
> I don't know about anyone else, but I think hasps are the easiest to kick in. Not to mention, the buyer will not be happy about the extra holes in the door of his new house.
> 
> *Some of the nationals are just plain retards*. It's not only the inexperienced vendor who screws up. If QC knew what they were looking at, they'd make the vendor go back out and install it the right way.
> 
> Sheesh.................!
> 
> Linda






Statement of the day, maybe the week.




*Intelligent life is not a requirement* to work P&P on that end.

Here is an idiot for you.
Last yr I was working a large water clean up. Because the home was under contract they wanted a verbal bid to begin immediate water remediation with the paper work uploaded as soon as I got back to the office.

I told the guy "4350". Well he thinks I said $43.50 and turned it in that way.

I cannot imagine what kind of an idiot he is/was.

As you might imagine the fecal matter hit the fan when I turned in the online submission that night and they got to the office in the morning and saw $4350.00. Talk about coming unglued.
I asked him how much remediation did he think would get done on $43.50.
He didn't have a clue.


----------



## oteroproperties

a1propertyclean said:


> The hasp is on backwards anyway. The latch is supposed to be over the piece you screw into the frame.
> 
> I don't know about anyone else, but I think hasps are the easiest to kick in. Not to mention, the buyer will not be happy about the extra holes in the door of his new house.
> 
> Some of the nationals are just plain retards. It's not only the inexperienced vendor who screws up. If QC knew what they were looking at, they'd make the vendor go back out and install it the right way.
> 
> Sheesh.................!
> 
> Linda


that might be the case but this particular company has no excuse because i have sent this to them and their QC guy and explained the problem, they said "I will not discuss other vendor info with you"

I dont know


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## BPWY

*Ocwen's power bolt 6/30 update*

Dear Vendor, 
As was initially communicated to you on June 23, 2010, the Lock Change Process will be effective as of July 1, 2010.

Following up to last week’s communication regarding the use of Digital Locks to secure the primary entrance to properties, this communication is intended to clarify some outstanding questions pertaining to the new policy:
1.) The primary entrance door should be secured utilizing the Digital Lock
2.)  The *secondary door locks* should be disabled, *NOT* the secondary doors. The secondary doors must allow egress from the property. In order to disable the secondary door locks, a key can be inserted and broken in the lock itself. Another disabling method may be the use of superglue or Loctite into the key hole. Other disabling methods may be employed, provided the door may be locked from the inside, and functions properly as an exit.
Again, we recognize that this policy may not be acceptable to all vendors, therefore, we ask that you notify us immediately if you are unable or unwilling to accept future orders with these guidelines.
Thank you,

Altisource Portfolio Solutions Management


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> that might be the case but this particular company has no excuse because i have sent this to them and their QC guy and explained the problem, they said "I will not discuss other vendor info with you"
> 
> I dont know






I don't want to mention the name of this national because my website is there and the internet is a small place. If they saw this post it'll take them two seconds to make the connection and I could be out of badly needed precious work.



When covering other contractor's bid items they can't get to or doing second bids I run across some strange stuff that supposedly passes for a good job. I've turned them in repeatedly. I do not think it does any good at all.
And here I thought that this company was a super "premier" national.
Apparently not.


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## APlusPPGroup

Thanks, Paul. I needed that today.:laughing:

Linda

BTW. Even if the guy turned the hasp around the right way, it still won't fit correctly. It's not the right style for a door with the door stop on the center of the jamb. It would only work on a door that closes flush.


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I run across some strange stuff that supposedly passes for a good job. I've turned them in repeatedly. I do not think it does any good at all.


A lot of this goes back to the QC people not knowing what they're looking at or for.

I worked in construction as a field supervisor and was the one who hired subcontractors and walked the jobs with the inspectors. I've seen a lot of boneheads :w00t: in my day but not nearly as many as there currently are in property preservation.

Granted, some of them are simply inexperienced. But those who don't learn quickly can sure screw it up for the rest of us.

Linda


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## oteroproperties

a1propertyclean said:


> Thanks, Paul. I needed that today.:laughing:
> 
> Linda
> 
> BTW. Even if the guy turned the hasp around the right way, it still won't fit correctly. It's not the right style for a door with the door stop on the center of the jamb. It would only work on a door that closes flush.


I buy my hasps from Bargin Locks instead of MFS because when you buy the "flexible hasps" it comes with the blank and it is designed specifically to padlock a door. only screws needed are in the door jamb, like this,


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## APlusPPGroup

I like the idea of using the hole cover. At least you have something to grab onto on the other side. Plus, there are no extra holes in the door. 

Door jambs can be puttied, sanded down, and painted to look a whole lot better than a door will......... depending on the door type, of course.

Nice job, Otero. Hopefully you re-used the one that was on the ground and saved yourself the money. Even a couple bucks adds up pretty quick when you have to do it a few times.

Linda


----------



## oteroproperties

a1propertyclean said:


> I like the idea of using the hole cover. At least you have something to grab onto on the other side. Plus, there are no extra holes in the door.
> 
> Door jambs can be puttied, sanded down, and painted to look a whole lot better than a door will......... depending on the door type, of course.
> 
> Nice job, Otero. Hopefully you re-used the one that was on the ground and saved yourself the money. Even a couple bucks adds up pretty quick when you have to do it a few times.
> 
> Linda


thanks Linda, we most certainly did pick them hasps up. We don't waste any material at all!!


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## APlusPPGroup

Good for you! We would have, too.

Linda


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## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> thanks Linda, we most certainly did pick them hasps up. We don't waste any material at all!!






Any quickset type of lock that I can rekey goes with me.



Hey, its $5 I didn't have prior to picking it up.


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Dear Vendor,
> As was initially communicated to you on June 23, 2010, the Lock Change Process will be effective as of July 1, 2010.
> 
> 1.) The primary entrance door should be secured utilizing the Digital Lock
> 2.) The *secondary door locks* should be disabled, *NOT* the secondary doors. The secondary doors must allow egress fromthe property. In order to disable the secondary door locks, a key can be inserted and broken in the lock itself. Another disabling method may be the use of superglue or Loctite into the key hole. Other disabling methods may be employed, provided the door may be locked from the inside, and functions properly as an exit.


Does anyone have any idea what we need to do with the locks on sheds and detached garages? I have sent them an email, but received no response to this question.

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


----------



## BPWY

ARPPP said:


> Does anyone have any idea what we need to do with the locks on sheds and detached garages? I have sent them an email, but received no response to this question.
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC







I'm a big time vendor for them. :laughing:

In the last 8 months I've secured all of exactly one property for them.
They did not bother with the gates or the shed.


Some thing else I've recently noticed with them.... they are getting REALLY SLOW about processing your work and payments. Just a few months ago it was nothing to get paid in 7 or 8 days of doing the work.
Now it takes a week just for them to accept your work and another 3 weeks to get paid. (they've got me doing recurring grass cuts on that one property)


----------



## Guest

HELP.... 
I have a company telling us that with the delay from HUD on the new mortgage letter that the rate per cyd, that was at $50/cyd, has been reduced to a flat $40.....
Anyone see or hear of this? I've been looking and can't find anything and obviously the company can't provide this new HUD release. 
Thanks!


----------



## BPWY

Assuming its MCS we can only guess that they are doing with the debris is what they were doing on the grass cuts.
CLAIM their clients only pay $50 for a recut when they really pay $HUD and then take 25% off of the $50.


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## Guest

LOL actually not them....


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## mtmtnman

Hey Brent, Look what Gator Blades do to 2' tall grass!


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## mtmtnman

Here is the "ACTION" shots......


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## mtmtnman

nuther.................


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## mtmtnman

No grass left to speak of........


----------



## Guest

That is impressive. Where can I get some? Will they work in smaller mowers?


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## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> That is impressive. Where can I get some? Will they work in smaller mowers?



I have one on my 21" Ariens as well. They are a great blade.......

http://shop.ebay.com/?_from=R40&_tr...&_nkw=gator+mulcher&_sacat=See-All-Categories


----------



## BPWY

I'll have to post the pics of 2' + that my JD 21" walk behind took down in 2 passes.
Gator blade on it.

Apparently the pics are on my laptop.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I ran in to a Safeguard house a while back where the contractor took the lock apart, dumped all the pins and put it together again. Coulda opened it with a bobby pin!







Didn't you get the memo???


Thats the universal one size fits all key code. :laughing: :laughing:


----------



## Guest

put gator blades on your mower and then add a mulching kit to the discharge on the mower deck and you won't see any grass clippings. They just disintegrate.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> put gator blades on your mower and then add a mulching kit to the discharge on the mower deck and you won't see any grass clippings. They just disintegrate.



That works good if the grass is 6-8" tall but when it is 2 feet tall no mower i know of will handle the amount of clippings and mulch them. It turns to silage under the deck and plugs up.........


----------



## Guest

*gator blades*

the way you guys are talking about gator blades i wish they made they for my simplicity 60"


----------



## mtmtnman

parman properti said:


> the way you guys are talking about gator blades i wish they made they for my simplicity 60"



Have you contacted Gator directly? http://www.gatorblade.com/


----------



## Guest

ya just talked to them they only make it for up to a 54" deck that really sucks


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## mtmtnman

http://www.youtube.com/v/oSizWplbgR...&feature=player_embedded&fs=1"></param><param


----------



## brm1109

*Unbelievable*

I can't believe the prices I was just quoted by a company.
A little background, here in NJ we pay $90.00per ton for trash disposal.
While speaking with this company I asked about their fee schedule. Was told that they have a fee schedule that "allows the contractor to make money and keep them competitive"
Debris removal $20.00 per yd.
Lock change $20.00 per lock.
Are you kidding me.


----------



## BPWY

You know they are keeping $20 for themselves and you have to pay the disposal fees and the cost of a lock.

I'd tell them that you'll accept $20 per yrd PLUS reimburse for disposal costs.


$90 a ton????????????????? holy cow, I thought I was getting jacked at $25. Some places as high as $50 tho.


----------



## brm1109

I only wish it was $25.00 here. Up here they go by what county the trash is from. A couple it is $90 and a couple it is $95-98 a ton.


----------



## Guest

Sounds as bad as this scammer that posted in my area on craigslist. This guy is based out of CA and operates under the company name Montgomery Maintenance. Here's a few of the prices he had listed:

lock change $20
padlock $15
hasp/padlock $18
tarp a roof $95
winterize $30

I emailed this message back to him....(with no reply yet):

No offense, but at those prices I would be losing money in buying supplies, equipment wear/tear, fuel, and insurance funds. I'm not out of work, I was just seeing what you had to offer. Quite honestly I don't see how anyone could make a living/profit at the prices you had listed. I know what banks are getting paid for this stuff and obviously someone between the contractor and the bank is making a LOT more off these jobs for doing nothing but flipping the photos while the guy in the field is doing a lot of work and forking out money for insurance and supplies. The rates you listed were not even close to HUD rates.....which by the way will be going up in July.


----------



## Guest

Does any1 in California provide hands on training?


----------



## Guest

Come out to Illinois. I provide hands-on training for 3 easy installments of $1000
:w00t:


----------



## Guest

Good one


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Come out to Illinois. I provide hands-on training for 3 easy installments of $1000
> :w00t:






Fremont and I had a special running around here some where that we'd do it for even less than that. 

I'm pretty sure it was the bargain price of $2999. 


:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

Gator blades with mulching kit on 26" tall grass. Gotta say the John Deere goes right through it:clap:

This is a 100x150 perimeter cut. If you notice we put a board at all 4 corners of the yard so the bank has no "difficulties" seeing the boundaries. The original pics have the measuring wheel in the pics that shows 100' x 150'.


----------



## BPWY

BPWY said:


> I'll have to post the pics of 2' + that my JD 21" walk behind took down in 2 passes.
> Gator blade on it.
> 
> Apparently the pics are on my laptop.




Here we go.


2' plus high, 2 passes with my JD jx85 21" with a gator blade. I didn't even mulch this one, discharge only.

Where did it all go???? :clap:
Even if you are discharging the gator chops the pieces up finer and they fall into the grass layer.


----------



## BPWY

Here is one that BAC skipped a 2 week cycle on. This is one month of growth. Right during our wet season.

Now if they did that it wouldn't be so bad.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Sounds as bad as this scammer that posted in my area on craigslist. This guy is based out of CA and operates under the company name Montgomery Maintenance. Here's a few of the prices he had listed:
> 
> lock change $20
> padlock $15
> hasp/padlock $18
> tarp a roof $95
> winterize $30
> 
> I emailed this message back to him....(with no reply yet):
> 
> No offense, but at those prices I would be losing money in buying supplies, equipment wear/tear, fuel, and insurance funds. I'm not out of work, I was just seeing what you had to offer. Quite honestly I don't see how anyone could make a living/profit at the prices you had listed. I know what banks are getting paid for this stuff and obviously someone between the contractor and the bank is making a LOT more off these jobs for doing nothing but flipping the photos while the guy in the field is doing a lot of work and forking out money for insurance and supplies. The rates you listed were not even close to HUD rates.....which by the way will be going up in July.






You can't even access their home page without a login.
www.responsivemaintenance.com

Some thing sounds fishy.


They are cheaper than the likes of Spectrum Field Services and Homeland Field Services.

What are they expecting to get out of a $30 wint??
The contractor drive out to the property and close the water valve in the basement/crawlspace and if they are lucky he'll crack a sink spigot on the way back out the door????????????

I would not touch a wint for that!!!!!!!


----------



## Guest

I am not sure spectrum field service is really cheap, I think they pay 75 per wint and I am real happy with that company, I have work with homeland field services also and while we could make money with wints we could not make money with that company in the summer season with all the no pay on grass cuts that needed to be bid and all requirement they had on the grass cuts


----------



## BPWY

Depending on what ID HUD rate is you are probably getting screwed.

In WY ($130) or CO ($120) if they paid $75 they were screwing the contractor.
In NE ($75) not so much.


Some where I ran across a Spectrum price list. I WAS NOT impressed. I still have a Homeland price list
if any body wants to see it. Its really pathetic on how badly they are screwing over the contractor.


----------



## Guest

I think I am going to be hated for saying this, but for me this is true and what I look at. 

I have been doing preservation work as an owner for 2 years, I do not care what any company I work for gets paid, I really do not care only if it is profitable and the volume is there for me to make money. Each one of us that have a property preservation company has different cost and different expectation on what to expect to make in income. Can I make a living doing wints at 30 a pop sure I can if the volume is there but at some point I will struggle with replacement on equipment, tires for truck and so forth. Can I do them at 60 a pop yes all day long never a cash flow issues.

With that said I would rather be a business that has a 15 percent profit for the company on 100,000 dollars in work order volume then a business that has a 10 percent profit on 150,000 dollars in work order volume.

I also do not believe the good with the bad idoliogy when dealing with any company if the company can not help me make money instead of worrying what they get paid I try not to bad mouth them and move on when I can.

The reason some of these companies like homeland has the ability to make so much money off of us or you or johnny down the road is all based on the coverage area we have compared to the coverage area they have? Yes, that is a question. wouldn't it be nice lets say if me and you and 6 others or more property preservation companies could find a way to standardize procedures go to a big client to offer a very nice coverage area and just cut out the middle man. I know they is a lot more to it then just that and good faith with any group of people, I guess I was hoping to open up other dialog

-Charles


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## Guest

Idaho you are correct in most instances. We here follow the "golden rule"....Make $500 gross per day or you go broke in this business. This has been a good avg for us that has taken 14 years of following to get us where we are today. 
You know about 7-8 years ago there was a group of P&P contractors tried to get a "coop" thing going where the banks could skip the servicing companies and take work direct to the contractor and it actually worked very good. Well it worked till the mistakes started showing up and the banks expecting the entire "coop" have to pay for those mistakes and after that everything fell apart. I have always said that the "contractors coop" is a thing that could work if the insurace aspect and the liability aspect could be addressed properly. At the time the internet technology was not as advanced as it is today or will be even more so tomorrow, and the bank would "click" on a map of the property they needed serviced and it would "kick out" the contractor that would receive the work. It was cumbersome system for the contractor to upload any pics albeit we only sent in approx 10-15 pics total in those days. 
If something is not done to satisfy the contractors and the banks then this business is a "race to the bottom" for everyone. That is why my fear of a union thing happening since this business is the "wild west" right now on contractors since there is little (if any) regulations that pertain to the P&P contractor and that is coming from a person that despises regulations/laws. 
I would love to explore another Contractor Registry system for the banks. If rumors are true that is what Service Magic is working on....AND I sincerely don't want to "PAY" for leads. 
Ideas anyone?


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## Guest

New to the Forum... wanted to say hello and wish everyone a great Holiday arty:


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Idaho you are correct in most instances. We here follow the "golden rule"....Make $500 gross per day or you go broke in this business. This has been a good avg for us that has taken 14 years of following to get us where we are today.
> You know about 7-8 years ago there was a group of P&P contractors tried to get a "coop" thing going where the banks could skip the servicing companies and take work direct to the contractor and it actually worked very good. Well it worked till the mistakes started showing up and the banks expecting the entire "coop" have to pay for those mistakes and after that everything fell apart. I have always said that the "contractors coop" is a thing that could work if the insurace aspect and the liability aspect could be addressed properly. At the time the internet technology was not as advanced as it is today or will be even more so tomorrow, and the bank would "click" on a map of the property they needed serviced and it would "kick out" the contractor that would receive the work. It was cumbersome system for the contractor to upload any pics albeit we only sent in approx 10-15 pics total in those days.
> If something is not done to satisfy the contractors and the banks then this business is a "race to the bottom" for everyone. That is why my fear of a union thing happening since this business is the "wild west" right now on contractors since there is little (if any) regulations that pertain to the P&P contractor and that is coming from a person that despises regulations/laws.
> I would love to explore another Contractor Registry system for the banks. If rumors are true that is what Service Magic is working on....AND I sincerely don't want to "PAY" for leads.
> Ideas anyone?


Freemont, I'm kind of close (in terms of state to state). That would be nice to co-op. Im in the zip code of 61063 and our crews cover up to the Mississippi River. It would be nice to see what could be done in a co-op! If any of this sounds interesting, send me a private message.


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## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Freemont, I'm kind of close (in terms of state to state). That would be nice to co-op. Im in the zip code of 61063 and our crews cover up to the Mississippi River. It would be nice to see what could be done in a co-op! If any of this sounds interesting, send me a private message.



Is the Pec fair still as good as it used to be??? Are you going to Kirkland for fireworks tomorrow?? When i lived there i never missed the 4th in Kirkland. Best fireworks in all of Northern Illinois.........


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## Guest

The Pec fair has gone downhill over the past few years. One good thing about it is they now have a MX track inside the 1/2 mile track. They have the "fair race" every year. They have some good payouts for the racers so there is some good racing for the prize.

Never been to Kirkland for their fireworks. We usually go watch Winnebago's display. Not too far of a drive and I have an uncle that live 2 blocks away from the fireworks that usually has a lot of beer for his guests!:clap:


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## Guest

What does CC Issues stand for?


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## Guest

ips said:


> What does CC Issues stand for?


OH NO....thats like asking a plumber what is a trap OR an electrician what a mast is.....

Are you being serious or are you asking for examples?:thumbsup:


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## Guest

Examples of a CC issue?


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## BPWY

IPS you've got a lot of research ahead of you.
Begin with google searches of the term conveyance condition.
You should be able to find the HUD site and their list.


2 examples are paint and tires. Now your home work begins.


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## Guest

Hey this could be like "cc bingo"..... instead of BS Bingo!

Chemicals, ext debris


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## BPWY

BS bingo..................... lmfao


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## JenkinsHB

ips said:


> Examples of a CC issue?


IPS ... I'll assume your filling out a vendor questionaire. Just post all the other questions you don't know the answers to ... I'd love to answer them.


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## Guest

ips said:


> Examples of a CC issue?


CC issue= It's a credit card issue!

This is what you have after you get into P&P work. You will be using all your credit cards to make ends meet! Hence CC issues!

ips....let's keep this on the down-low eh? We don't want all our secrets getting out!


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## mtmtnman

4 cords of firewood stacked neatly in a woodshed is a CC issue according to one bank i do work for..........


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## JenkinsHB

wood can rot and poses an infestation risk. I always bid that as cc.


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## mtmtnman

JenkinsHB said:


> wood can rot and poses an infestation risk. I always bid that as cc.




Rot in an enclosed woodshed with a nearly new metal roof?? This wood was an asset to the property as wood is the only heating source. It had a wood furnace in the basement. I used to heat a 3,000 sq ft house with a wood furnace just like it. Load it 2-3 times a day. It's just backasswards how these banks think. The same property had a dead cottonwood in the front yard with dead branches lying in the crooks and crotches ready to fall in the next windstorm. Every time i mowed i had to pick up sticks. Do you think they would ever take it down??? NOPE! Conveyed with a serious safety hazard but by gosh the wood was out of the woodshed!!!


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## BPWY

There is no rational thought going on at these banks.

You cannot let their stupidity get under your skin. It'll only make you go crazy.
Oh wait, thats a short trip :laughing:


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## mtmtnman

:bangin::bangin::bangin::bangin:


BPWY said:


> There is no rational thought going on at these banks.
> 
> You cannot let their stupidity get under your skin. It'll only make you go crazy.
> Oh wait, thats a short trip :laughing:


:bangin::bangin:


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## BPWY

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Guest

Even through you didnt give this info in your first post how it was cover, why care work is work. I have removed and or replace working stoves, fridges etc... I do not care because it is work. Would your stop at the property been the same amount if you did not remove the cby of firewood ??? if so ok complain they wanted you to work, if not you did sign up to do work. They have companies that provide st8 inspection not alot of lifting involved in that.


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## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> Even through you didnt give this info in your first post how it was cover, why care work is work. I have removed and or replace working stoves, fridges etc... I do not care because it is work. Would your stop at the property been the same amount if you did not remove the cby of firewood ??? if so ok complain they wanted you to work, if not you did sign up to do work. They have companies that provide st8 inspection not alot of lifting involved in that.



I had photos of the firewood EVERY VISIT since October of 09 and all of the sudden on a Friday at 3pm it was an emergency 24 hour rush work order. The property is 120 miles one way for me and i had to scramble to make things work out on a weekend. Thankfully i found someone to take it or i would have had to make 2-3 trips to my dump as it's the only one open on the weekend. The whole point is NONE of these banks use the same set of rules so you never know what to bid and what not to bid. I have conveyed literally dozens of properties with firewood so i quit bidding it long ago. If i really wanted to i could spend 2-3 hours on just about every property i go on bidding stuff. Throw enough crap against the wall and see what sticks. I get bid approvals that other contractors didn't complete and am blown away on what they bid for and get away with. I try to keep a clean slate and bid high if i don't want the work. Bad thing is i have bid jobs recently that i don't have time for hundreds of miles from me at DOUBLE the HUD allowable and have been getting them!!!


Got another good one over the weekend. Had to go to a property and clean up gas cans (empty and reported as such) from a property that has had the doors kicked in and a window busted for 2 months. Still no work order to secure the property and every time i go back there is more beer cans & graffiti inside. The grass is also 3' tall but holy crap there's gas cans on the property line! The reason i bugs me so much is it's my tax $$$$$ hard at work!! My accountant says this next year is going to be total hell for small business owners........

As far as replacing working appliances and doing un-necessary stuff that will turn around and bite you in the arse eventually. I suggest your be very careful with that. Honesty will get you a lot furthur in life. I had one last year where a contractor SUPPOSEDLY cleaned up a property. He was lower bidder than me. I was doing work for another company a block over and HAPPENED to drive by the property he was supposed to clean up. He MOVED 2 55 gallon drums of used oil to the back of the property and stacked most of the debris on the curb! Needless to say i called the company that denied my original bid. I uploaded pics from site and they had me clean it up right away. They back charged the original contractor and fired him. I get all their work now.


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## Guest

I guess I am here to say, have you ever worked at a job where your instructed to do the most stupiest things by management - most of the time it will be because you do not know the big picture and other times it is just stupid. Have you ever been contracted by family lets say to build a deck only to have them change there minds on how its being done each and every morning. Maybe I have not lived a shelter life where I get to decide what needs to be done and try to justify why I am angry over it with reasons without merit when I am ask to do something I do not agree with. 

Should anyone care if you cover a property 120 miles away that this work order happen to be a rush work order? probably not you agreed to take the area at some point you had to understand you would run into these issues.

As far as getting bit in the butt, no reason to suggest my customer didn't know what I replace did or did not work, they always know maybe the bank did not like the color, once again I do not care. But I am glad you felt noble enough to lump me with a bad contractor in your area, I am sure each area has one or more. I would suggest bidding firewood as debris each property we go to is a customer and as a business owner we should try to extract as much business from that customer, I could be wrong but if it is rightfully there and the customer is asking me what is on and belongs to the property I should tell them and whatever happens after that is where I try to make more money.


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## Guest

Just bid the firewood as a fire hazard and its approved darn near everytime. We had 3 rows 42' long x 6' wide. Kinda the same deal......everybody ignored for the first 3 times then 1 of the CSR's called and said "hey that could be considered a fire hazard since doesn't it burn in a fireplace/woodburner?" WELL DUH.....Lightbulb goes off and we bid it as the CSR stated and Shazam! 110cyd of fire hazard went down the road to a guy who sold firewood and well lets just say he bought it all for $1100 and you can guess what we charged.


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## JenkinsHB

double dip ... nice.


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## Guest

JenkinsHB said:


> double dip ... nice.


:whistling

Don't happen enough


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## BPWY

Jenkins lets get real.


The natioanls are not going to allow you to bid a job on what you think you can get out of it. They won't be happy if they don't get their cut.
They will never allow you to under bid or go "free" on removal because you think you can get money out of the items there. I'll be damned if I dispose of items that are of value to some one else. 
And if I get paid for them in the process.......... its not the bank or national's biz.
Example, I dispose of as much of the metal items as I can at the recycle yard. Under 1000 lbs I don't get paid for them, but its STUPID to throw perfectly good items away that can either be recycled or sold.
I'm not making any thing from the metal items, but the recycle yard is. Does that mean they are double dipping?


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## Guest

I'll admit. I have double dipped before. I was the first one into a bag of Ruffles and I got this HUGE chip.......lets just say I had to take one bite then dip it in the french onion dip a second time!

But seriously. I got paid to remove a moldy fridge (it really wasn't moldy, just dirty....and another contractors bid). So I brought it home, cleaned it to a "sale" condition. Threw it on Craigslist for the same price I got paid to remove it. The way I see it, why not right? It saves me a trip to the dump w/ fees and extra travel time. Instead I made a few extra bucks off the deal.


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## APlusPPGroup

I see nothing wrong with donating or selling good, usable items as long as you came by them honestly. 

For example, if you state that an item is broken or damaged beyond salvage so you can get paid to remove it, then sell it because it's in pristine condition, then you're lying. THAT, to me, is double-dipping.

I've terminated plenty of liars and cheats in the 4 years I've been in business. Since it's my company's reputation at stake, I take very good care to terminate vendors who cannot be trusted and/or who cannot be responsive and responsible.

Some vendors put on a very good front and even I can be fooled. But, when I find out what they've done, they're history. 

We take very good care of our vendors and make sure that clients pay the rates they should as much as is humanly possible so, when vendors put me in jeopardy of losing a client, I can show no mercy.

So, basically, if you run a good, honest business and you qualify to work with us, you will get work............ depending on whether our clients have any in your area, of course.

Linda


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## Guest

A-1 that I agree 110%. We had a crew remove old appliances (they were junk) and we got a bid approval to install new ones, which we did. 2 weeks later we were stopping at the property to GC and low-and-behold another crew was removing the newly installed appliances. Yep they had a valid work order but I'm 100% sure that their bid approval was for the oldies that we had removed previously. Called Bank and they said "if they got a work order than let them remove those old appliances" NO amount of explaining could convince those people that they were newly installed. Fully documented and emailed all the "right" people to tell them what happened so I have somekind of defense when the chargeback comes to us for not installing new appliances.....


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## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO ~

Any idea how the other vendor provided proof that they removed the old ones? 

No doubt there were previous photos involved. Did they just take photos of the empty spaces where the appliances used to be? 

This is why we always REQUIRE photos of everything loaded onto trucks or trailers before they go to the dump.

WHAT a ripoff!!!:furious:

Linda


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## Guest

So true...ripoff. I would have to guess they would have taken their "old bid" photos and redate. As far as what is on the trailer is always a matter of "camera angle" but they better not show the brand new yellow stickers on the doors that show the "utility savings". Sometimes the idiots truly are in charge. 
They will figure this out 6-12 months down the road and start laying blame. 
We all have our horror stories of pulling into driveways and other contractors removing furnaces, hot water heaters and so forth BUT what gets me is all the little house Dehumidifiers that tend to develop feet and leave and we get chargebacks 2 years later for "not installing a dehumidifier per approval per the inspectors report of no dehumidifier" albeit the report was a year later.


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## BPWY

Redating photos isn't that hard.

Also I've got 2 maybe 3 of the whole handful of clients I work for that even want dated photos. The rest say "DO NOT" date your photos.


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## Guest

I have a question, its one of those what would you do in this case. I have already agreed to pay the contractor for the job because the circumstances came across where no money came out of the business.

I contracted someone to tarp a roof on a two story house the amount of the job was 1890. Contractor was more then happy to get it done, it was rainy and it took a day longer I understand I am all about safety. Done no issues, within 30 days the tarp job is coming apart I contracted the contractor who refuse to fix the job with out more compensation, he felt that a tarp job will not last as long as it would if it had a roof on it and also there is high winds(which I assume most roof have issues with winds). I will leave it at we disagreed on these points. I had already paid him for the job and held money from other work he did for me which wouldn't cover the whole cost but help absorb some of it if it became a chargeback or cover the cost of me getting it fixed and give him what was left. I was a little confused at this point as if I should just fix it but was instructed by my partner we do not access any property without approval and a work order as once we close out an order we no longer have a right to be on the property, so the contract went in to the contact with the company and everything worked out where I had no more cost and the issues was resolve.

I will never use this contractor again and also will pay him the money I was holding, what would you have done?


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## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> I have a question, its one of those what would you do in this case. I have already agreed to pay the contractor for the job because the circumstances came across where no money came out of the business.
> 
> I contracted someone to tarp a roof on a two story house the amount of the job was 1890. Contractor was more then happy to get it done, it was rainy and it took a day longer I understand I am all about safety. Done no issues, within 30 days the tarp job is coming apart I contracted the contractor who refuse to fix the job with out more compensation, he felt that a tarp job will not last as long as it would if it had a roof on it and also there is high winds(which I assume most roof have issues with winds). I will leave it at we disagreed on these points. I had already paid him for the job and held money from other work he did for me which wouldn't cover the whole cost but help absorb some of it if it became a chargeback or cover the cost of me getting it fixed and give him what was left. I was a little confused at this point as if I should just fix it but was instructed by my partner we do not access any property without approval and a work order as once we close out an order we no longer have a right to be on the property, so the contract went in to the contact with the company and everything worked out where I had no more cost and the issues was resolve.
> 
> I will never use this contractor again and also will pay him the money I was holding, what would you have done?







Your partner is correct. Once the w/o is submitted and with no w/o denials for corrections you are technically trespassing if you return to the property.

When I tarp a roof I put in the w/o notes very loud and proud that this is a temp repair job at best. Tarping is not meant for a long term fix and that I recommend the bank hire a roofer for a permanent repair immediately.
As you might have guessed it.... the bank doesn't care outside of the tarp job.


We all know of jobs where if the bank would have addressed a small issue of water damage at the time it was first discovered they could have remediated the problem for a few thousand dollars. But do to their blithering ignorance and lack of concern about protecting their assets they let the property go to the point now months or even a couple yrs later the property is 100% ruined and is going to cost them 10s if not 100s of thousands of dollars to demolish the house and take the hit on just selling a bare lot versus a lot with a formerly nice house.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Your partner is correct. Once the w/o is submitted and with no w/o denials for corrections you are technically trespassing if you return to the property.
> 
> When I tarp a roof I put in the w/o notes very loud and proud that this is a temp repair job at best. Tarping is not meant for a long term fix and that I recommend the bank hire a roofer for a permanent repair immediately.
> As you might have guessed it.... the bank doesn't care outside of the tarp job.
> 
> 
> We all know of jobs where if the bank would have addressed a small issue of water damage at the time it was first discovered they could have remediated the problem for a few thousand dollars. But do to their blithering ignorance and lack of concern about protecting their assets they let the property go to the point now months or even a couple yrs later the property is 100% ruined and is going to cost them 10s if not 100s of thousands of dollars to demolish the house and take the hit on just selling a bare lot versus a lot with a formerly nice house.



Case in point my mold house in Missoula. 1st visit was March 09. Water was running inside the property. Put a bid in to remove wet drywall and dry home. Never got approved. Mowed the property till October 09 and nothing was ever done to the property. Mold grew all summer and infected the whole house. The last guy i sent by to look at it says it's a total loss. House was in default for 330K. Us guys out here busting our azzes will pay for this banks screw up. Got 100 more stories just like this.


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## Guest

We put a "no guarantee" on the tarps maintaining any integrity. Learned that lesson the hard way.....tarp tore itself up in the winds but took abt 6 months then got charged back cause the tarp developed holes....


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## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> I see nothing wrong with donating or selling good, usable items as long as you came by them honestly.
> 
> For example, if you state that an item is broken or damaged beyond salvage so you can get paid to remove it, then sell it because it's in pristine condition, then you're lying. THAT, to me, is double-dipping.
> 
> I've terminated plenty of liars and cheats in the 4 years I've been in business. Since it's my company's reputation at stake, I take very good care to terminate vendors who cannot be trusted and/or who cannot be responsive and responsible.
> 
> Some vendors put on a very good front and even I can be fooled. But, when I find out what they've done, they're history.
> 
> We take very good care of our vendors and make sure that clients pay the rates they should as much as is humanly possible so, when vendors put me in jeopardy of losing a client, I can show no mercy.
> 
> So, basically, if you run a good, honest business and you qualify to work with us, you will get work............ depending on whether our clients have any in your area, of course.
> 
> Linda



That's exactly how i operate Linda. I have actually turned in work orders stating that a previous contractor exaggerated damages to pad his bottom line. One that comes to mind is a work order that was accidentally put in my cue when it was supposed to go to another contractor. It was for a curb box replacement at the street and the other contractor bid $9500 for the job. I was an excavator for almost 20 years and knew that was outrageous so i called the company. (your big client Fremont) They asked me to bid it and i called a plumber in the area because i am not a licensed plumber. Turns out the plumber i called was the plumber the other company was going to use. He bid $1600 to replace the curb stop ALL IN!! The regional was going to put $7900 in there pocket and never step foot on the job!!!! In the end the National told the Regional they would do the job for $4000 or it would be re-assigned to me for that amount as that is what i was going to bid to drive 1300 miles round trip to the east side of the state to supervise the job and do some fishing on the way back. The regional begrudgingly did the job for $4000 LMFAO! If they where around that price to begin with i would not have said a thing but they where majorly screwing the bank and in turn screwing me on April 15th..........


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## Guest

I understand your story but......remember that that contractor may have just got a $7000 chargeback and that was his way of recouping??? As most contractors we have to pad our bids to overcome the chargebacks that the service companies are sticking us with...Now $7k may be gouging but heck we don't know just how bad he/she just got screwed that day. The Service Companies keep thinking that the contractors "eat" the chargebacks but its like any business those costs just get "passed along".


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> I understand your story but......remember that that contractor may have just got a $7000 chargeback and that was his way of recouping??? As most contractors we have to pad our bids to overcome the chargebacks that the service companies are sticking us with...Now $7k may be gouging but heck we don't know just how bad he/she just got screwed that day. The Service Companies keep thinking that the contractors "eat" the chargebacks but its like any business those costs just get "passed along".



You tell me. It's a company know for screwing there subs and one that a lady friend of yours recently quit for........:whistling:whistling:whistling They would have put $2400 in there pocket if they where honest............


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## BPWY

Kinda like when they paid me $2000 for tearing down this chicken house.
One has to wonder how dang much they bid for that.


The bank paid it and then never bothered with removing ANY of the hazards, paint, chemicals, batteries etc.


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## Guest

I have to agree there is a little pad we have to put into bids, I have a friend who has been to the same property maybe a dozen times for the same bank to do cc pics. Sure enough the first time they got lazy and did not bid all the issues on the property like he had serveral times he had to do it for free. There is a lot of liability we take when we put a property in hud conditions an an example branches touches house while it maybe put into hud complaince with the branches still touching the structure I will bet if you miss that it could come back to haunt you. As far as 7k I do not know how steep that is since my friend got stuck with atleast that in out of pocket money to get his mistake fixed. But once again he got lazy and got a lesson


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## Guest

you know I was told once and we follow this rule on bidding icc items....I know someone is going to say "no way" but here goes: we bid all the items that are icc issues the first time at a property. On each subsequent trip we put into the computer upload that "all items are the same as prior bid and prior bid is still valid". We do not rebid each time. We ONLY bid the additional items that may have become apparent since the last bid such as the voluntary trees are now growing along foundation, broken branches or someone dumped. We do this for 3 different companies for several years without any problem. It makes it so that you don't "accidentally" overlook an item and have what happened to Idahos friend. Dunno it may or may not work for you but all the companies have given us "permission" to bid as such and it is in writing. I know guys/gals that bid 20 items and have to put the same 20 items down again each time they go to the property but this is so time consuming that I would and our uploaders would pull their hair out. Things that we do have to rebid we always substantially raise the rate then they approve our first "main" bid and then we send it back that the original bid is invalid....maybe thats why they don't want this bid over and over? Dunno


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> you know I was told once and we follow this rule on bidding icc items....I know someone is going to say "no way" but here goes: we bid all the items that are icc issues the first time at a property. On each subsequent trip we put into the computer upload that "all items are the same as prior bid and prior bid is still valid". We do not rebid each time. We ONLY bid the additional items that may have become apparent since the last bid such as the voluntary trees are now growing along foundation, broken branches or someone dumped. We do this for 3 different companies for several years without any problem. It makes it so that you don't "accidentally" overlook an item and have what happened to Idahos friend. Dunno it may or may not work for you but all the companies have given us "permission" to bid as such and it is in writing. I know guys/gals that bid 20 items and have to put the same 20 items down again each time they go to the property but this is so time consuming that I would and our uploaders would pull their hair out. Things that we do have to rebid we always substantially raise the rate then they approve our first "main" bid and then we send it back that the original bid is invalid....maybe thats why they don't want this bid over and over? Dunno



Basically the same here. One company i do business with actually has a bid history report on every work order. Grass bids on the other hand are going up 25% on every visit. I have a few i have bid since april 1st and still no approval with grass 3-4' tall. Most are Rural and counties here do not write violations unless you have noxious weeds. I had a violation w/o for a small town given to me yesterday. It was issued on the 25th of June by the city but was not given to me until the 7th of July and had a 10 day window from the city. I drove by but the city has done nothing with it yet...............


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## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> I understand your story but......remember that that contractor may have just got a $7000 chargeback and that was his way of recouping??? As most contractors we have to pad our bids to overcome the chargebacks that the service companies are sticking us with...Now $7k may be gouging but heck we don't know just how bad he/she just got screwed that day. The Service Companies keep thinking that the contractors "eat" the chargebacks but its like any business those costs just get "passed along".


I understand perfectly well what you're saying and the thought process behind padding estimates. Recouping a major loss isn't easy.

But a $7,000 excess doesn't make any of the past wrongs right. But that's just my opinion. 

Linda


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## Guest

Apples to apples??? I think an excess bid is determined by the bank and we really shouldnt make those calls. 

What I mean by that is we all do not deal in apples to apples such as we all have the same equipment and skill sets, if i am the only one that handles a rural area, no other property preservation will go there will and should my bid only be adjusted for the amount of time and milages it would take to get me there ? this situation desnt exist for me but if it did what should I do? what would you do ?

if I am in an area and I am the only one that can handle mold while everyone else is a certified grass cutter what should I do is the would excess even to exist or now are we talking inflated.

If 5 of us walk to a yard that had exact 10 cby of debris all 2 by 4 cut in small pieces put all over the yard do we start to get creative instead of seeing 10 cby do some of us see 20 while others see 9 based on the current work load they have or maybe its close to an area ? what determines when we can state that some one has made an excessive bid ?


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## APlusPPGroup

IdahoProperty said:


> Apples to apples??? I think an excess bid is determined by the bank and we really shouldnt make those calls.


So, in your opinion overbidding your profit by an additional $7,000 is not excessive?

I agree that if you are going a lot further to do the work, then you should bid more than the guy who's just down the street from the property.

But if your bid includes a healthy profit, then why bump it up another $7,000? To me, it seems vengeful. 

What if the excess bid is for work on a property owned by a different client than the one you were charged back by? Do you think that's fair? The nationals represent many clients. 

For example: If you are charged back $7,000 for work you did for "client x" and you put in a bid with an excess of $7,000 for client "client y", then you are only seeking revenge.

If you're getting that kind of money, more power to you. But I won't work with someone who does that.

Just my .02.

Linda


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## Guest

I really was not talking about chargebacks but variables:

Chargebacks are a cost of doing business, like when someone shop lifts from a stores or uses a debit card to purchase gas, that cost of doing business for the owner is then passed on to all customers. Not saying that some chargebacks should or should not be done just that its a cost of doing business.

If i bid a job 2850 and accidently put 1850 how much do i get paid for the job?

When I say variables i state that each of us look at a job in a different way, such as skill set, times we done this type of work, equipment we have to do the job. I think your stuck on 7k for some reason when I am saying what right does anyone have to say its excessive. If the client agrees to whatever the price is then the marriage had been made. If it is excessive that will on;y work so long before work load gets effective.

But really seriously your one of those well I will take my ball and go home kind of people, I mean really who says this in a debate
"If you're getting that kind of money, more power to you. But I won't work with someone who does that."

Instead of 2 cents worth for a nickle would you tell them that there shameless


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## BPWY

Just an example of a frivolous bid.

One company I work with puts the last 120 days bid items on a list on the work orders.
Not the initial secure obviously, but the rest of the W/Os have the list.
So I got to see the other contractors bid items.
One of his bids was to remove a 2 yr old wasp nest above a light. 
The reason this was frivolous is that he claimed it was a hazard and was more than likely charging hazard pay.
..... wasps only use their nests for one season at least in this area. I never see an old nest being reused. 


He had another clearly make work bid on that list. I don't remember now what it was.


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## APlusPPGroup

No, Idaho. I'm a fair and honest person. I was specifically addressing a $7,000 excess and you said the banks should be the one to decide that.

I totally and completely agree that pricing is going to vary by experience, equipment, travel, and a lot of other expenses such as taxes, insurance, personnel and things like that.

It's not a fight I'm picking. I just think that anyone who bids excessively, using the $7,000 as an example, is not someone I want to work with.

Does that help clarify my position?

Linda


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## Guest

Yes it does Linda, I am sorry. After I get done brushing my tooth I hope you will forgive me.


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## APlusPPGroup

IdahoProperty said:


> Yes it does Linda, I am sorry. After I get done brushing my tooth I hope you will forgive me.


lol. I just got done brushing mine, too, as a matter of fact. And you don't need to apologize.

If we all agreed on everything, there would be no point in the forum being a place for good, healthy discussions.

I've got a hot date with my honey tonight so I'm going offline.:clap:

TTY guys later.

Linda


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## Guest

If I see a wasp nest I bid it, I mean how do I determine it is two years old? do I cut it in half and count the rings. I do not do every secure or cc bids work orders but the one thing I try to teach others that are doing it in my name is to be consistant. So plungers, wasp nest, a toliet brush bid em out and there so easy to miss.


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## Guest

Well for everyone who seems to think the $7k is excessive I also agree and I did put it seems that was gouging. LOL how some see only what they want to see. Also I don't think anyone is "holier than thou". For 1 minute if anyone on this forum says they *don't *pad their bids depending on the day/weather/chargebacks that day/being to busy or whatever the reason then you are living in lala land....  JMHO


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## Guest

Wasps nests and padded bids all wrapped up in one:
We always bid the wasps nests regardless of how old they are. Got sent back once to remove some that we hadn't bid on the initial secure. It was the middle of winter in Northern UT. Any wasps tough enough to be out doing their thing at those temps deserve to live in my book. I usually bid them about $5-$10 each depending on... My office manager entered a bid the other day I didn't review. I was doing the invoicing on the completed bid approval. She had bid them $50 each, and the bank approved it. Hadn't intentionally padded the bid but the wife was happy she got to go out to eat that night.


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## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> Wasps nests and padded bids all wrapped up in one:
> We always bid the wasps nests regardless of how old they are. Got sent back once to remove some that we hadn't bid on the initial secure. It was the middle of winter in Northern UT. Any wasps tough enough to be out doing their thing at those temps deserve to live in my book. I usually bid them about $5-$10 each depending on... My office manager entered a bid the other day I didn't review. I was doing the invoicing on the completed bid approval. She had bid them $50 each, and the bank approved it. Hadn't intentionally padded the bid but the wife was happy she got to go out to eat that night.



I bid em if the buggers are living in them. If not i take a pic showing they are vacant. $10 bucks if i can get them from the ground, $20 if i have to get a ladder or a long pole. Out of hundreds of initial secures i have done i do not remember ever getting an approval. I did get yelled at the other day for no action shots of mowing a yard mind you the grass was a foot tall when i started and 3" when i finished. I am about ready to put a dash cam on my zero turn to prove it was in action....................


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## JenkinsHB

uintahiker said:


> Wasps nests and padded bids all wrapped up in one:
> Any wasps tough enough to be out doing their thing at those temps deserve to live in my book. I usually bid them about $5-$10 each depending on... My office manager entered a bid the other day I didn't review. I was doing the invoicing on the completed bid approval. She had bid them $50 each, and the bank approved it.


$5-$10 ??? How do you keep your lights on? We don't get on a ladder for less than $100. We consistently get $100 to remove wasp/bees nests.


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## mtmtnman

JenkinsHB said:


> $5-$10 ??? How do you keep your lights on? We don't get on a ladder for less than $100. We consistently get $100 to remove wasp/bees nests.



I have ran a business of some sort most of my life as a foreman or an owner. Justification for fees is a huge thing in the business world. $100 to remove a wasp nest is ridiculous and not justified. How do you justify $100 for this which may take 5 minutes from the time the ladder comes off the truck to when it goes back on the truck and then turn around and bill $80 to cut a 10,000 sq ft lawn which takes a half hour or more?? Where you in government before this??:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Guest

Linda, boy have you made me think  Thats a good thing that is for a healthy discussion.My long post is this:

Your comment of "I won't work with people like that...just my .02 cents worth"....

My questions is why? Is it because of ethics? Morals? 

Ethically in business one common philosophy is "your responsibility is to maximize profits for the company/shareholder"...don't see anything wrong with that train of thought as long as a contractor is not breaking the law. I haven't said anything about morally right or wrong...yet.

Morals? The most famous based moral is the Golden Rule. As I'm sure you are all aware of the Golden Rule "treat others the same as you want to be treated" will make us all think about how we are treated by the Service Companies... 

Concerning the "price gouging" (my definition) on the water main brings some examples to light such as:

We are known for water remediation/structural drying and in this industry nearly everyone goes by Xactimate Rating System for the insurance industy. Here is a bid that we done on Wed.
company#1 bid $18,200
company#2 bid $11,400
we had bid at $4000.....We can still make a healthy profit even at the $4000 price. Being that there is a $14,200 difference between Company#1 and us...is this unethical? No in my opinion. Remember company #1 and #2 used the Xactimate Rating Software and we did not on this job since we "know" that the home is foreclosed and the bank won't pay the higher rate. Maybe since we knew how the banks will approve these dryings that is unethical? Morally maybe I should have called company 1&2 and told them how to bid these so they have a shot at an approval? 
The only difference between us 3 companies is the type of equipment that was to be used and what the tolerance level for risk is. 

P&P work is no different. Prices/bids are based on: how much tolerance for risk each company has-or how much does each contractor have to lose... (home/cars/savings?). 

The last few years this business has been spiraling ever faster to the bottom. We refer to it as "who can drive to the bottom the fastest". This train of thought is the "end of a profitable business" but contractors have not figured this out yet.....Normally they do after its to late and the credit cards are maxed out and the savings is gone yet the Service Companies know this is true but do they tell the contractors what the risks are? Not that I have seen. 

Hum that brings me back to: is this a moral or a ethical problem? Service Company moral or ethical problem?.....
Think on that for a while everyone before you make your next bid....then look at your checkbook...remember to stay ethical THEN apply your own morals to your decision.

Now that was fun! Have a good day.


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## JenkinsHB

mtmtnman said:


> I have ran a business of some sort most of my life as a foreman or an owner. Justification for fees is a huge thing in the business world. $100 to remove a wasp nest is ridiculous and not justified. How do you justify $100 for this which may take 5 minutes from the time the ladder comes off the truck to when it goes back on the truck and then turn around and bill $80 to cut a 10,000 sq ft lawn which takes a half hour or more?? Where you in government before this??:laughing::laughing::laughing:


my justification:

the hour my crew spent on-site doing the estimate/initial secure.
the hour my office staff spends on processing the initial secure.
the 1/2 hour my office staff spends on processing the bid approval.
the risk I assume for putting my name on the work done at the property.
the risk I assume for having crew on a ladder w/ bees present.
the wages I pay, the drive-time wages I pay, the overtime I pay, the worker's comp I pay, the general liability I pay, the e&o I pay, the gas I pay, not to forget the other 100 things in overhead I pay every month to be able to adequately service these properties. 
Remember you're just not charging for the work you completed, you also have to charge enough for all the losing trip charges you made.


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## Guest

...


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## Guest

Hi everyone. I am new to this as for as posting, but have been reading this post for about a year or so. I have been in this business for 10 years and have finally been thrown a curve ball by one of my contracts. With the new HUD guidelines going into effect on the 13th, I have one company that is changing their bidding process to only three items for debris; interior, exterior or personals. They are saying that the new guidelines do not allow for bidding health hazards or additional line items. I have read the new guidelines so many times that I am going cross-eyed and can not see this new rule clarified. I have printed my local rules for hazardous material disposal, but am being told "sorry, new guidelines do not allow this". Can anyone help with ideas or suggestions, or answers to how other companies are handling this? I also am trying to clarify how to bid to place the property in "broom swept condition".


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## BPWY

There is going to be so much back lash on the hazard pricing HUD might be forced to do some thing with in a month.

Here is the time to dig out your contracts and throw it back into the face of folks that are telling you you can't bid higher for hazard disposal. 
*Remember the lines in the contract about how you are responsible to obey all state and local laws???????????*
Take photos of the signs at the landfill stating what they won't take, get a price list from the hazard disposal facility and send those in.

I refuse to bid paint/tires ect at the all in price. And I'll tell them that either they pay for disposal like has been happening or it will sit. And I'll use their contracts against them. They wouldn't loose the first second of sleep to use the contract against you. Why should you be any different?

The transfer station here just started charging $6.50 per tire for disposal. How many tires will fit in a yrd? Depends a lot on size but I'm guessing more than the $50 less discount it'll cost you for disposal.


Latex paint is my most common hazard by far. I just had the lady at the landfill tell me this week that the WY DEQ told her that the cheapest and fastest way to dry up latex paint for disposal is to mix quickcrete with it. Whats that cost? about $4 a 50 lb bag.


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## Guest

I'm new to the thread but not new to the business. I've been doing property preservation for 9 years, primarly for the HUD prime contractors. It's always scary when the contracts change over, wondering if we will be able to get in with the new primes given how many new companies there are now. :001_unsure: Does anyone know what the official change over date is?

This business sure is a roller coaster ride!


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## Guest

7/13. All our companies have stated that if paints can't be disposed as debris you have to send in the landfill sheet with your local rules and then you can bid those seperately.


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## BPWY

I did my last initial on the old rules this morning. 30 gallons of paint.


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> 7/13. All our companies have stated that if paints can't be disposed as debris you have to send in the landfill sheet with your local rules and then you can bid those seperately.



Do you know of any dump in the country that will take paint if it's not dried up? HUD got there head up there azz as usual.


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## Guest

...


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## Guest

I know of no landfills that will take paint unless you purchase all the materials to dry them out. Thats no big deal but what is the big deal is finding the space to accomplish all this. MY SPACE has value and will always be charged out. I do know of 2 recycling centers but they charge $.80 cents a pound for disposal. Heck I don't know what paint weighs for sure since I refuse to pay that price but water is nearly 8 pds per gallon and paint is heavier. 5ga bucket could cost up to $32.00 to dispose at these rates. Thats why I just drive right on by...


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## mtmtnman

I know of every dump within 300 miles of here and none take paint unless dry. This takes time and space. I dry 15-20 gallons a week when the weather is good. Gave away about 40 gallons of GOOD paint at my yard sale this weekend. Also Habitat will taker unopened cans. For the last year Wells has only been removing oil base and leaving the latex.........


Try this: http://earth911.com/


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## Guest

Thanks for all the imput. I thought I was just getting too blurry eyed or losing my mind. I am only having this issue with one company, and at the time I have tried sending in all documentation and am just being told flat out that it is my problem and no one else is complaining. So I guess that means he will have plenty of other contractors to complete the work for him at these rates cuz I will not. Right now I have a house with 1100 gallons (no joke - - we counted each gallon) and he can have a newbie go get it for cubic yardage and figure out how to dispose of it.


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## mtmtnman

gtkcontracting said:


> Thanks for all the imput. I thought I was just getting too blurry eyed or losing my mind. I am only having this issue with one company, and at the time I have tried sending in all documentation and am just being told flat out that it is my problem and no one else is complaining. So I guess that means he will have plenty of other contractors to complete the work for him at these rates cuz I will not. Right now I have a house with 1100 gallons (no joke - - we counted each gallon) and he can have a newbie go get it for cubic yardage and figure out how to dispose of it.



Sounds like a P&P contractor who got foreclosed on!!


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## Guest

gtkcontracting said:


> Thanks for all the imput. I thought I was just getting too blurry eyed or losing my mind. I am only having this issue with one company, and at the time I have tried sending in all documentation and am just being told flat out that it is my problem and no one else is complaining. So I guess that means he will have plenty of other contractors to complete the work for him at these rates cuz I will not. Right now I have a house with 1100 gallons (no joke - - we counted each gallon) and he can have a newbie go get it for cubic yardage and figure out how to dispose of it.


Holy cow. We have had a few with 300 +/-. 
1100 GA cans I would cut them a deal of $8 / GA.... minus discounts


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Holy cow. We have had a few with 300 +/-.
> 1100 GA cans I would cut them a deal of $8 / GA.... minus discounts






I used to do that sort of thing with your big national, just to try and win bids.

I got a nasty gram...... "THE RATE IS $10"!!!!

:laughing:


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## oteroproperties

JenkinsHB said:


> my justification:
> 
> the hour my crew spent on-site doing the estimate/initial secure.
> the hour my office staff spends on processing the initial secure.
> the 1/2 hour my office staff spends on processing the bid approval.
> the risk I assume for putting my name on the work done at the property.
> the risk I assume for having crew on a ladder w/ bees present.
> the wages I pay, the drive-time wages I pay, the overtime I pay, the worker's comp I pay, the general liability I pay, the e&o I pay, the gas I pay, not to forget the other 100 things in overhead I pay every month to be able to adequately service these properties.
> Remember you're just not charging for the work you completed, you also have to charge enough for all the losing trip charges you made.


I gotta agree with ya on this, i bid $75 per and they get approved almost always. you gotta be carefull here in FL, they will dive bomb you while you're cutting grass. if i think they will be a problem for me or one of the grass guys i bid them, if not then i dont. reason? again, this is FL, i didnt use my 18yrd dump truck for a week and there was 3 nests on it. doesnt take long. 

truth? i learned WAY back that you have to bid each item like its the only one that will be approved, that way if they only approve one item (which use to be predictable) then the trip is worth the LIABILITY of doing the work. it just has to be that way. the other day i did an initial secure, bidded to cap wires among other things, but i bid $100 for 4 sets (no ladder needed). they cut the bid to $8 minus discount. am i doing it??


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## BPWY

On small $$ bid items part of the conditions of accepting the bid is that the small items with either be multiple items or $x trip charge on top of the bid item due to distance from the site.

Either you get paid for the work or they give it to a contractor thats closer.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> On small $$ bid items part of the conditions of accepting the bid is that the small items with either be multiple items or $x trip charge on top of the bid item due to distance from the site.
> 
> Either you get paid for the work or they give it to a contractor thats closer.



Many people on this board have no clue how far apart towns and properties are in the rocky mountain west. One of the guys who works for me also works for a large national who i don't work for. He regularly gets $100 trip charges PLUS the work when he gets there because they cannot find anyone else. Best i get from any of my companies is $50 and that is for a property 80 miles away on a route i run weekly anyways.:shifty::shifty:


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Many people on this board have no clue how far apart towns and properties are in the rocky mountain west. One of the guys who works for me also works for a large national who i don't work for. He regularly gets $100 trip charges PLUS the work when he gets there because they cannot find anyone else. Best i get from any of my companies is $50 and that is for a property 80 miles away on a route i run weekly anyways.:shifty::shifty:






Don't forget that its one that every body hates.
They offer the trip charges many times without even the contractor asking.
I know because I work for them too.


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## BPWY

This was sent to me in an email just like this. I don't have a link.



> The city of Los Angeles last week passed a city ordinance allowing for fines up to $100,000 to lenders and servicers of properties under foreclosure for failing to adequately preserve properties.
> 
> According to coverage in PropertyWire, community activists are joined in wide support of the provision. The article states that by charging huge fees for noncompliance the city is looking to motivate lenders and servicers to upkeep properties in foreclosure, in order to keep communities from widely falling into disrepair.
> 
> RealtyTrac, an online marketplace of foreclosure properties, reports new foreclosure filings in Los Angeles grew by nearly 3,000 properties in May. The state of California is listed as the highest ranked state for foreclosures, on the firm's website.
> 
> However, data compiled by RealtyTrac finds that of the 72,030 properties in default, 15,946 are in real-estate owned status – meaning ownership is now transferred back to the lender. The average sales price for a LA home in foreclosure is $400,000.
> 
> For the California Mortgage Bankers Association, the news is part of a tidal wave of new regulations for mortgage finance firms in the state. Spokesman Dustin Hobbs added that just a few years ago the CMBA tracked two or three bills in the California State Legislature that dealt with the housing industry. Today it's upward of 40 or so pieces of legislation that would seriously impact the mortgage market.
> 
> "The LA ordinance is an example where lenders, servicers now have one more piece of paper to push around in what is becoming a compliance nightmare," Hobbs said. "The city is essentially asking firms to take responsibly for homes that they technically don't own yet."
> 
> The passage of a California state law last year, Senate Bill 1137, slows down the foreclosure process by adding an additional 30 day window to satisfy "due diligence requirements" and "in order to assess the borrower's financial situation and explore options for the borrower to avoid foreclosure." One servicer said Monday that the additional time means the risk of damage to the property will increase as borrowers grow more disenchanted with the status of the property. Hobbs said the Los Angeles ordinance adds more layers of bureaucracy.



Too bad other places don't have a fine. I go to properties around here ALL the time that haven't been attended to in 2 yrs. Other properties the grass isn't being mowed and its 4' high.


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## JenkinsHB

I wonder what their definition of "failing to adequately preserve properties" is. I'm sure my work load would probably quadruple if they made a law like that around here.


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## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> I wonder what their definition of "failing to adequately preserve properties" is. I'm sure my work load would probably quadruple if they made a law like that around here.





I wondered about that too.


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## Guest

A lot of cities already have these ordinances but they are termed as vacancy/inhabited/city foreclosed permits. They do have substantial fines. ...sometimes $1000's in fines. $7k on one of our cities. 
This provides the contractor the opportunity to bid a home back into city compliance standards such as plumbing, roofs, electrical or just overgrown weeds
Check with your cities that you cover and you may be surprised.


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## BPWY

Lockbox fines increased to $1,000 for Detroit brokers



Be careful with your lockbox codes.

Realcomp II, the multiple listing services (MLS) provider for Southeast Michigan including Detroit, raised its lockbox fines earlier in the month. Effective July 5, any broker caught giving out a lockbox code or any other type of access to an unauthorized person will be fined $1,000 instead of the usual $100.

Realcomp advises anyone aware of an MLS subscriber disregarding the policy to report the person.

"Whether a home is vacant, bank-owned or otherwise," they warn, "giving lockbox codes directly to unauthorized persons is fineable."


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## Guest

Can anyone say "revenue stream"?


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Can anyone say "revenue stream"?






As long as its into my account I don't care. :clap:


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## Guest

?? Hud is now requiring the Handle Set to be changed on initial secures. This Handle Set includes knobset and deadbolts. 2 of 3 companies is stating that the $xx lockcharge means to change the Handle Set. I say "no if we change 1 knobset and 1 deadbolt then we need to invoice for 2 locks"...
Anyone else running into this situation yet?


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> ?? Hud is now requiring the Handle Set to be changed on initial secures. This Handle Set includes knobset and deadbolts. 2 of 3 companies is stating that the $xx lockcharge means to change the Handle Set. I say "no if we change 1 knobset and 1 deadbolt then we need to invoice for 2 locks"...
> Anyone else running into this situation yet?






I haven't gotten any new work but as I understand the new rate sheet its $60 per door.

One lock or two, same rate.


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## Guest

If we have to change knob & deadbolt.....I'm going to start a new company called "Super Duper Bargain Deadbolts". My deadbolts will be made of recycled milk jugs and will come with plastic keys. Of course these will have the standard 24 hour warranty once they leave my shop!


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## Guest

OK 1 company just said if there is no deadbolt than you only get $40
...


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## BPWY

While they collect $60.


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## Guest

So what are your opinions on Safeguard's new requirement that you MUST obtain a police report on any new vandalism, etc. I just received a new work order instructing me to obtain a police report for a broken window that I reported three weeks ago. The new language on their work orders demanding police reports started on July 13th...so this is a new thing. So when my guys are cutting 15 to 20 lawns a day are they supposed to sit around for an officer to respond to the call to get a report? Anyone come up with an efficient way of handling this. I was thinking about calling my local police department, explaining the situation and see if they have any suggestions. The problem I have with this is that currently we are only doing grass cuts so it's rush rush rush, if we were doing initials and spending some time on the property then this would make sense but not for the grass cut guys. A bit frustrated right now. any suggestions will be greatly appreciated. This new requirement is in response to the new HUD requirements.


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## Guest

It's not a new thing for them. I was doing the police reports over a year ago. Where I am, they do it over the phone so there isn't much waiting around for an officer to show up. 

If you don't like the police reports, you can always tell Scamguard you won't do them....since I'm sure they probably don't pay very much (if anything).


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## Guest

Thanks for replying. I only started with them in April and the language on the work orders requiring a police report started just this week, so it is new to me. But I can understand the need for a police report. I was thinking about doing just that, calling in to the police department and then maybe picking up the report. I will give the police department a call and see if they will accept that. I really have no complaints about Safeguard yet, but I have seen the horror stories on here. I hope none of that stuff happens to me. I really have no problems getting paid, yet.


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## BPWY

Unless you are getting paid for your time my response would be "what broken window"?


Seriously they cannot expect you to just give them your time while waiting for an officer.
Not at how cheap their grass cut pricing is.


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## Guest

Floridian said:


> I really have no complaints about Safeguard yet, but I have seen the horror stories on here.


YET! Thats the key word. Wait until they start sticking you with this "other contractors bid" that amounts to hardly anything after their discount and your expenses. Another good one is "oh the bank will never approve that price" line.


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## BPWY

Speaking of grass cut prices.


I just got reassigned another contractors grass cut bid....over $200 per acre for recuts.
Good thing, I've got a full day into the job just for drive time and doing the work. (less than 3 acres)
There shouldn't be much grass this time of yr, our rainy season is over.


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## Guest

Here's a question for you all. I was told that anything outside can not be a separate 'itemized' bid. It's all considered exterior debris now. Now say I get to a place and their is a pile of cement chunks (some too big for 2 men to pick up) that's actually 2 c.y. in size. I have to put it in as an actual c.y. bid? 

Seems to me there is more work involved with labor, travel cost, and dump fee's than the price of 2 c.y. would cover.

Another one is.....if I bid a job prior to the rate changes and performed the work after the rate changes, what price would I expect to see?


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## Guest

I cannot imagine that they will be able to get away with this new charging by cyd for everything including hazards for too long. Folks simply won't bid to remove certain hazards or construction materials as they know they will only get paid for cyd. This will create a problem and they will have to change back to paying differently for hazards and construction materials, we can only hope. 

Somewhere in 815, a bid approval is a bid approval, but I bet they will pay you at the new rate.


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## BPWY

My bet is they won 't pay at the new rate.
Your bid is your bid.

Or as long as the price is in their favor thats probably the one they'll go with. 
That is the gooberment way.


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## Guest

here's their memo about pricing after July 13th

07/09/10
To: All P&P Contractors

RE: New Work Order Components ML 2010-18

Effective today, work orders being created will reflect the rules and
policies pertaining to the new HUD guidelines in ML 2010-18. These
rules and policies are in effect for all work completed ON or AFTER
July 13th.

We realize you may complete some of these orders this weekend or on
Monday July 12th. Please follow the old HUD guideline policies and
pricing for all work completed before Tuesday the 13th. Invoices will
be adjusted accordingly.

Vendor Web will be updated with the new guideline policies and pricing
on July 13th. We appreciate your patience and cooperation as we
finalize all of the programming changes in the coming days.

Thank you.


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## Guest

I just stumbled upon this Q & A set. This may come in handy for some of you.

http://www.nls.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/nsc/ml1018qa.pdf


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## BPWY

Is this to say that we continue to get paid on the old grass rate?





> Extension for Grass Cut Cost Schedule:
> 2) We have already negotiated the contractor pricing for grass cuts this season. Would HUD consider using the grass cut schedule from ML 2008-31?
> 
> Answer – HUD recognizes that this Mortgagee Letter was released in the middle of the grass cut season; therefore, HUD has made an exception to allow the use of ML 2008-31, Attachment 6 “Yard Maintenance and Snow Removal Requirements, Page 39 through the end of the 2010 grass cut season. It is anticipated that after this timeframe, HUD will begin utilizing a Cost Estimator product for the grass cut expense. In the event that HUD’s Cost Estimator is not ready for production, HUD will make the determination to possibly extend the use of the ML 2008-31 grass cut cost schedule for an additional period of time.


----------



## Guest

I didn't see an option on where to submit my own question. I would like to ask this...

Boarding is only allowed in high vandal areas. If I am at a property in a non-vandal area and the window is only cracked (not letting outside elements in) would I be required to reglaze at the initial visit?

To me, $30 don't really cover the cost of new glass, running to get the glass, and caulk to install it.


----------



## BPWY

My response on each and every window glazing will be that due to the EPA's lead laws and the liability involved for every one up the food chain that each and every window will be bid and the work performed by a licensed lead contractor.

There is no way they can argue with you. Each and every contract as well as the HUD letter says you MUST follow all applicable laws.

Let the gooberment morons fight each other over their own laws, it isn't my problem!


----------



## BPWY

Or tell your nationals that your insurance company won't allow you to do work where there is a potential claim for lead being disturbed.
I'm sure if you asked your ins company they would say no.


----------



## BPWY

I've got a question on properties that convey and ones that don't.

As I understand how it works the properties that are FHA insured are the ones that convey to HUD, Fannie, Freddie etc.

Any body know what the ratio of FHA insured properties to those that are not?
Reason I ask is well under half of the properties that I've initial secured or done other work at have conveyed in the last yr. A lot of them just keep on being bank maintained.


In the area where a friend works the properties convey many many times faster.

I'm not talking about the right of redemption time frame. I'm talking about properties that go months and months or even years and have not conveyed.


----------



## Guest

dont do it first american approves very little and look up safeguard on rip off report.com should answer your question been doing this work for ten years and iam gettin out before the losses get to big


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## BPWY

You guys have no idea how badly it pains me to say this.


But Safeguard has different divisions. Not ALL the divisions have the same reputation.
*MOST* do, example... the REO grass cut department.... they will bang you like a screen door.
Come to think of it the plain REO department has a reputation too.

Hell must have froze over, I just stuck up for Safeguard.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> My response on each and every window glazing will be that due to the EPA's lead laws and the liability involved for every one up the food chain that each and every window will be bid and the work performed by a licensed lead contractor.
> 
> There is no way they can argue with you. Each and every contract as well as the HUD letter says you MUST follow all applicable laws.
> 
> Let the gooberment morons fight each other over their own laws, it isn't my problem!


 
For what it's worth, and I would like to hear some other's imput. When I went through the RRP class the instructor told us as long as we were just reglazing and not disturbing the frame where is is mounted in the house we don't fall under RRP.


----------



## Guest

9 out of 10 times you will have to clean up the edge where that glass sits in the frame. 10 out of 10 times it has old paint on it. I don't see how it would make any difference if you were disturbing frame paint or the mounting frame paint.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> 9 out of 10 times you will have to clean up the edge where that glass sits in the frame. 10 out of 10 times it has old paint on it. I don't see how it would make any difference if you were disturbing frame paint or the mounting frame paint.





That is kinda what I'm thinking.

Down the road if there's a lead dust test done on the house and they find lead I'm sure the EPA inspector is not going to care if you only glazed a pane or replaced the window.
The fact that there is lead dust is going to be enough to cause trouble.
I don't want any part of it.


----------



## BPWY

How many here signed up for Altisource's $6 regular inspections and $8 rush inspections?


Me?? I think I'm going to pass. 
Their new rate sheet was included with the email. The grass cut price has gone down $23.
I'm not sure I'm interested any longer to be honest with ya'll.


----------



## Guest

It was tempting, but the company who called me today to do inspections for $7 and $4 really won me over.:whistling 
Unless they are all in the same condo complex I don't understand how anyone can do them. $10 each won't even cover the gas to go from place to place and I cover a pretty population dense area.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> How many here signed up for Altisource's $6 regular inspections and $8 rush inspections?
> 
> 
> Me?? I think I'm going to pass.
> Their new rate sheet was included with the email. The grass cut price has gone down $23.
> I'm not sure I'm interested any longer to be honest with ya'll.


We passed on that one. It's not worth it. We're doing less and less with Altisource these days.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Like Fremont and I were discussing... the only way to make money in this biz today is to work harder and harder.
There are only so many hrs in the day and with prices being paid dropping all over and prices for disposal ect going up working harder and harder only leads to one thing.... burn out!!!

$4, $6, $8 inspections, $8 a yrd for debris removal.... etc etc
Many folks don't know what it takes to break even or turn a profit and by contractors accepting these rates and then going out of biz in a month or 3 they get the banks and nationals used to thinking that these bottom feeder prices are the market rate.
Example I spoke to a real estate agent on some bids and she told me the grass cut guy bid (and won) $30 for an initial grass cut. 
Approx 4000 sq ft of turf, grass height 3' and he hauled the clippings.

No possible way for me to compete with that!!!!


The agent agreed with me that this guy is making life miserable for the rest of us. Because WHEN (her words) he goes out of biz everyone will think that his prices were the market rate when they aren't even close.

For comparison pricing I recently got paid $160 less discount for about 5000 sq ft of grass/weeds 3' to 4' high and with effort I mulched every thing. (grass wasn't real thick)


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I'm turning down clients right and left. I can't seem to get the rate sheets from them before I fill out the vendor apps. When I get them, I ask to negotiate. Some will, some won't. Those who won't, we turn down.

We could be really busy if we took on all the clients that want to send us work. But we would be the only ones making money, since we take a percentage of the work. We don't treat our vendors that way. We do our best to get them as much as possible.

We have fewer clients this way but at least my vendors get paid the money they should.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> I'm turning down clients right and left. I can't seem to get the rate sheets from them before I fill out the vendor apps. When I get them, I ask to negotiate. Some will, some won't. Those who won't, we turn down.
> 
> We could be really busy if we took on all the clients that want to send us work. But we would be the only ones making money, since we take a percentage of the work. We don't treat our vendors that way. We do our best to get them as much as possible.
> 
> We have fewer clients this way but at least my vendors get paid the money they should.
> 
> Linda





What are you finding with the nationals that won't share their prices prior to signing up?? way too cheap??

FEI has been posting all over craigslist looking for contractors. But they will not share their rates until ALL paper work is done, insurance exchanged etc etc and they are ready to assign work. THEN they'll share the rate.
They won't even hint at the rates. I've asked them if they use HUD. 
I am completely ignored.

My feeling on that way of doing it is that they are way cheap and ashamed of their prices so much that they think you'll do the work since you've already spent so much time on getting to that point.
I'm not that gullible, and so far haven't done any thing more than exchange a few emails.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I don't bother with the nationals. 

Vendor packets can be time-consuming and we receive a LOT of them. I fill them out, then wait for the price list. If it's not right, I try to negotiate [per stated above]. If they don't, we decline. If they do, and the pricing is acceptable, we move forward.

We don't accept clients who ask us to work for a reduced rate with the promise of better pricing down the road either. We have over 350 vendors in 44 states. We can provide lots of help [a 1-Stop Shop] to those clients who are willing to pay reasonable rates. 

We use HUD pricing [at minimum] ourselves. If a client pays HUD, then takes a discount, we can do that. But ONLY if their discount is small enough for everyone to make money. 

So, basically, we review them the same way they review us. Make sense?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> I don't bother with the nationals.
> 
> Vendor packets can be time-consuming and we receive a LOT of them. I fill them out, then wait for the price list. If it's not right, I try to negotiate [per stated above]. If they don't, we decline. If they do, and the pricing is acceptable, we move forward.
> 
> We don't accept clients who ask us to work for a reduced rate with the promise of better pricing down the road either. We have over 350 vendors in 44 states. We can provide lots of help [a 1-Stop Shop] to those clients who are willing to pay reasonable rates.
> 
> We use HUD pricing [at minimum] ourselves. If a client pays HUD, then takes a discount, we can do that. But ONLY if their discount is small enough for everyone to make money.
> 
> So, basically, we review them the same way they review us. Make sense?
> 
> Linda





Makes sense.

It just chaps me to spend my valuable time filling out their packets only to find out that I wasted all my time.
Like you said it is time consuming.

Kinda like it chaps me to go out and do grass cut bids for folks like BAC over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over.

JUST APPROVE THE DAMN CUT, THE GRASS ISN'T GETTING ANY SHORTER.
So that all of us can get on with our lives.

I had one of my suppliers tell me that BAC is wanting to cut out trip charges for grass cut bids.
I told him that when that happens I will be doing a one trip bid. No going out cycle after cycle after cycle for free.

Here where I live my home county is 2688 sq miles. I can spend A LOT of fuel money and never leave the county. Even zip codes are hundreds of sq miles. The one I live in is some thing like 192 sq miles. This is one of the smaller rural ones. The biggest zip code area is over 1300 sq miles by itself. I AM NOT doing free trip charges.
Like I told the supplier when I pull up to the fuel pump and load up $85 to fill my tank they are not going to give me free fuel just because I was doing free trip charges. It doesn't work that way for me, and it aint gonna work that way for them.
I also told him that he has to be giving blow back to the banks on these matters instead of just taking it and then dishing it out to us.
So far I still get paid for trip charges, but when they go away I'm done working for that bank/supplier.


----------



## Guest

Looking at AAP vendor price list. Are they really expecting somebody to cut 15000 sq. feet for $20, or am I missing something. 
p.s.
New to the whole thing. 



> Landscaping - Lawn
> Yard re-cut (up to 15,000sq') $20.00
> 
> Overallowable shrubs/trees and grass cuts (per man hour to complete) $34.56 per man hour
> 
> Paint front lawn green with biodigradable paint 3500 sq ft lot $113.76
> 
> Paint front lawn green with biodigradable paint 4500 sq ft lot $142.56
> 
> Paint front lawn green with biodigradable paint 5500 sq ft lot $171.36
> 
> Reseed front lawn 3500 sq ft lot $230.40
> 
> Reseed front lawn 4500 sq ft lot $259.20
> 
> Reseed front lawn 5500 sq ft lot $288.00
> 
> Resod - Average size (60-70 feet width) front only $1,008.00
> 
> Resod per sq ft with a $150 minimum $0.86
> 
> Decorative landscaping rock in front yard up to 60-70 feet width $1,008.00
> 
> Sprinkler system - Average size, Front only $518.40
> 
> Initial tumble weed removal per acre $100.80
> 
> General landscape clean up per day $403.20
> 
> Grass cut up to 10,000 sq. ft lot (Preservation Team Only) $28.80
> **Add $6.00for every additional 5,000 sq ft. per lot


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## BPWY

Shablon what state is this for?


And are those prices from 1900??
Because nothing I see about them are based in the reality of 2010 cost of materials.


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## BPWY

Any body else reading this into the new HUD regs? Or is this just one national's policy?



> Effective immediately, the HUD regulations no longer allow deadbolt covers. The requirement is to re-key the deadbolt to match the knoblock, and the allowable for this is $60.00 per LOCKSET. The lockset includes the re-keying deadbolt. There is no separate charge for it.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Shablon what state is this for?
> 
> 
> And are those prices from 1900??
> Because nothing I see about them are based in the reality of 2010 cost of materials.


California. That's prices from AAP. I first thought may be I'm missing something...
Can you advise any good companies for beginner in this (business and geographical) area?


----------



## BPWY

shablon said:


> California. That's prices from AAP. I first thought may be I'm missing something...
> Can you advise any good companies for beginner in this (business and geographical) area?




I've never heard of that company.


My advice is to run Forest, RUUUUUN from this biz.

Many folks that have been in it for a while are exiting or wanting to exit. 
Like I posted earlier the only way to make money in this biz is to work harder and harder and harder.
Only problem is that the prices for work most of the time go down and down. Bid work has gotten so cut throat that most of the time you aren't going to make up enough from them to cover what you loose else where.

I do not know where the work volumes went but any body will tell you that they've gone way way down from last yr this time.

This is a tough biz to crack and has swallowed up a lot of good contractors when they loose their own house and their credit cards are maxed out. 
Some of the nationals/regionals take up to 90 days to pay. And expect you to front the cost of ALL jobs no matter how large until they feel like paying.
Let me ask you.... if you win a roof replacement bid and the company takes 90 days to pay what are you going to tell your roofing supplier and/or contractor? They won't wait for 90 days. Neither will a plumber on a plumbing repair. Most of these types of contractors expect to be paid on receipt.
On large bids I put in the terms that 50% is due upon the rewarding of the bid. To date not a one of them has been accepted because the national won't put their neck on the line in the hopes that the bank will pay. If the multi million $$ national corp won't make a stupid biz decision its probably wise for you and me to not do it either.

I don't know what else to tell you. 
I can say that you should expect a tough go of it, unless you want to work for the prices you just were offered.


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## Guest

Well, I've got a truck, all the tools and credit card for gas and other small supplies. Worth trying. Will b happy if it helps me getting at least $15/hour cutting grass and changing locks. Not much other jobs any way. And yes, I'm ready to work hard. Really hard. No other choice right now.


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## BPWY

$15 an hr???????????


Sit down and work out your expenses for equipment, INSURANCE, equipment repairs/maint, taxes and the list goes on and on. $15 an hr isn't even getting getting started on what you need to be charging.

A little word of advice, take it for what its worth. DO NOT use your CC for P&P work. 
At $15 an hr you won't last a couple months when the bills start coming due.

I'm not trying to discourage your ambitions for being self employed. I'm a strong defender for that.
I'm just trying to protect you from going broke, which is what will happen. 

Good luck man, you are going to need a lot of it.


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## Guest

I'm talking about $15/hour "clean" money. I did my math homework on everything with accountant relative 
Gonna go bankrupt without such income in the next 6 months any way. So... Last resort


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## Guest

Well this is just discouraging. I just spent over $100 on a course on how to do property preservation and looks like I just wasted my money. I wish I would of found this forum first. Because after reading on here what you guys are saying I don't think this is a business that I want to get into.


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## Guest

Looks way easier in a course huh?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Any body else reading this into the new HUD regs? Or is this just one national's policy?


I guess you're talking about the Mortgagee Letter 10-18? Yeah, it's some really jacked up stuff. One thing, out of many, that strikes me as counterintuitive is the fact that HH is phased out. You'd think that either the tree huggers would be all over this or another arm of the fed would strike it down as an eminent danger due to the funneling of HH into the dump; let's not BS, the vast amount of folks in this field aren't gonna pay the fees to dispose of paint, chemicals and such properly.

There are pros and cons in it. I work a lot of clients and BAC Field Services (this is Bank of America who absorbed the Countrywide fiasco) are the pickiest. Labeling, pix, etc. So, I don't have to do individual pix and labels on the HH so it suits me fine. Sure, it's great to get the $50 on 5 gal paint, but when you bid, wait and then have to return in midstroke of another job it's _not_ worth the hassle.

One item worth note is that as ML 08-31 phases out and ML 10-18 is implemented (13JUL10) the days of conveying properties with tarps is out. This means that the roof has to be repaired.

Being a veteran I am _all to familiar_ with bureaucracy; in this I mean that each rule is codified by another. 24 CFR 203.377 controls a vast array of HUD stuff and is only a paragraph long with ambiguities as grey as the Smokey Mountains out here where I live.

One of my goals is to get some of the folks out here on the East Coast involved in some good networking and start to put control of the market back into the small businesses hands; David v. Goliath syndrome. Classic case-in-point: I went to our local senator's office a couple months ago with problems about accessing HUD, it's pricing and POCs (points of contact). I began with this, "I want to start the conversation by saying this: You [to the secretary] and your boss work for me at the end of the day. I pulled my tours in the bush and pay my tax, so I don't want to hear terms like 'I don't know,' 'I'll get back to you,' or 'You can't have this or that.' It actually worked great! You see, most folks have this belief that the suits and ties of the world demand a type of subservience. This is not the case.

Anyway, with all that said, I have greatly enjoyed this thread, hope to contribute to it and would LOVE to speak w/anyone in the East TN area (Knoxville-Nashville, Tri Cities) who would like to put a consortium together out here and others on the East Coast who would be interested in getting involved in some good teleconferencing!


----------



## BPWY

> I guess you're talking about the Mortgagee Letter 10-18? Yeah, it's some really jacked up stuff. One thing, out of many, that strikes me as counterintuitive is the fact that HH is phased out. You'd think that either the tree huggers would be all over this or another arm of the fed would strike it down as an eminent danger due to the funneling of HH into the dump; let's not BS, the vast amount of folks in this field aren't gonna pay the fees to dispose of paint, chemicals and such properly.




Like I've said before. Use HUD's own regs and your contracts with the nationals/regionals against them.
They all say to follow state and local regs.
State and local regs do not permit dumping haz materials as regular debris.


----------



## Guest

stutzd said:


> Well this is just discouraging. I just spent over $100 on a course on how to do property preservation and looks like I just wasted my money. I wish I would of found this forum first. Because after reading on here what you guys are saying I don't think this is a business that I want to get into.


Ahhh, just throw some antifreeze in the crappers, change a few locks, toss some paperwork around, and take some blurry photos.....it isn't all that hard....c'mon!

:w00t:


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## BPWY

How many times a year do the rest of ya'll run across some one that winterized a house with green vehicle antifreeze?????

I see it 2 to 4 times a yr.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> It was tempting, but the company who called me today to do inspections for $7 and $4 really won me over.:whistling
> Unless they are all in the same condo complex I don't understand how anyone can do them. $10 each won't even cover the gas to go from place to place and I cover a pretty population dense area.


WOW! That boggles my mind! No disrespect and let me lay the foundation here. We're outside Knoxville, TN. All family owned business. Two older trucks, couple of John Deere mowers and a trailer. We cover a 2 hour (any direction) AO (Area of Operation). My wife, father-in-law and I do the work and an occassional laborer. So, for a company to tell me we'll pay ya $7 to drive across the street even is ludicrous. BAC (Bank of America) leverages $29 for a bid. Let's go back a step. To understand the industry you need to _first_ understand bureauspeak 101. For example, they used to lob line-by-line inspections as what I believe you are calling inspections. Nah, screw that. I said you're paying what's in essence a trip charge and that won't fly. So, they pay $50 (in this example). Why? Because the fed will compensate. Leverage ladies and gentlemen. Now, bottom feeders are afoot everywhere. So, how do you _leverage_ them out? Quality product, productive timeline. Fundamentals of business. Take 10 jobs and plug them into ur GPS and u can (via zip code) get a ball park idea of a logistical path. Plug them into MS Streets and Trips and you get precision logistics, Just Say No to MS (Microsoft) and use open source platforms and you don't pay the overhead for the S&T program and have zero investment precision logistics.

With that said, one needs to understand the parameters of pricing. I'll address FHA as that is really the only ones that the ML's address (UNIV and CONV loans are bank held). $2,500 is the overall threshhold max (w/o overage submission). Now, here's the example: BAC Field Services (BACFS)sends u out to a house which Bank of America (BA) owns. BA owns BACFS. So, they are gonna run that $2,500 and _more_ up the billing pole. Why? BACFS bills, BA gets reimbursed from the fed AND they get the toxic asset off their back! So, it's all how the game is played.

Now, if $7 works for you great! Heck, we're ******* out here; so rural that there is only _one_ stop light in my county, and yet we score the cosmopolitan contracts. Case-in-point: Most of my lawn cut bids are above $500. These are 125x175, 2'+ on average. I make SURE when I bid the jobs I tell the neighbor to contact their city code officers about the dangers (encephlitis from mosquitos, snakes, etc.). Generally, a violation is issued and my $500 is cheaper than the city's $1,500 and the flack from HUD.

Good luck!


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> How many times a year do the rest of ya'll run across some one that winterized a house with green vehicle antifreeze?????
> 
> I see it 2 to 4 times a yr.


Never seen it out here. We use pink RV. $3.55 @ Wal Mart or $2.90 @ Lowe's with my veteran's %10 discount. We do about 100+ a year. LOVE it when they show a house as we go back and whack $75 each time!


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> How many times a year do the rest of ya'll run across some one that winterized a house with green vehicle antifreeze?????
> 
> I see it 2 to 4 times a yr.


I have seen it a few times when working for Countrywide. But thats been a few years ago. Still funny to see though!:thumbsup:


----------



## BPWY

In this area BAC does not care about getting grass cuts done.

I've bid an easy 100 grass cuts this season for them alone. Between the ones they've sent me to once
and the ones that I've been to over and over and over and over I am sure there about 100 trips of wasted bids.
Not a one they've approved. 
Its not because I'm too expensive, the grass isn't being mowed.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I have seen it a few times when working for Countrywide. But thats been a few years ago. Still funny to see though!:thumbsup:





I'd imagine that in places where the population is much higher and the amount of foreclosures is higher some folks would see it more than me.

FNGs that are getting $30 to $40 for a wint are going to cut every corner they can find.
"Oh look, free anti-freeze in the garage"
Heck they both say "anti-freeze" on the jug, I don't see why I can't use it.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> In this area BAC does not care about getting grass cuts done.
> 
> I've bid an easy 100 grass cuts this season for them alone. Between the ones they've sent me to once
> and the ones that I've been to over and over and over and over I am sure there about 100 trips of wasted bids.
> Not a one they've approved.
> Its not because I'm too cheap, the grass isn't being mowed.


Concur; however, we get about 1 in 7. Now factoring in the trip charge and multiple bids synchronized by precision logistics it pans out to about $800 +/- for 4 days or so of bids.

R u working directly for BAC? Do they or ur FS company pay you for the bids?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I'd imagine that in places where the population is much higher and the amount of foreclosures is higher some folks would see it more than me.
> 
> FNGs that are getting $30 to $40 for a wint are going to cut every corner they can find.
> "Oh look, free anti-freeze in the garage"
> Heck they both say "anti-freeze" on the jug, I don't see why I can't use it.


The legal angle is that auto antifreeze has the nasty polyethylene glycol which will kill you. RV antifreeze is food grade. Why? Potable water systems. You can drink the stuff. Did a video on it for my future ebook. I'll probably link it here when it's done (it'll be free as I am a die hard open source, copy left person).


----------



## Guest

FS pays for OA


----------



## BPWY

Sub Rosa said:


> Concur; however, we get about 1 in 7. Now factoring in the trip charge and multiple bids synchronized by precision logistics it pans out to about $800 +/- for 4 days or so of bids.
> 
> R u working directly for BAC? Do they or ur FS company pay you for the bids?






Not working directly for them.

But I should be. Because they have at least two regionals covering this area they won't even think of looking at me going direct with the.


----------



## Guest

BAC is good and bad. This is a classic case-in-point: (can't add the www stuff yet) wfaa.com/news/investigates/investigates-96773444.html They have crazy labeling requirements, etc. The volume makes up for it _generally. _I sometimes like to keep a company in between me and the end client. That way I can file mechanic's lien --- and I do occassionally.


----------



## BPWY

I have no idea on the labeling requirements since I don't do the upload.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I have no idea on the labeling requirements since I don't do the upload.


Yeah, it's a _real_ time intensive task; it can be minimized by software, though. Sent u a msg.


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## BPWY

Cheaper place to buy the electric lock that OCWEN wants.


http://www.buylockbox.com/electronic-entry-door-locks.html


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## BPWY

This would be a much cheaper solution ($40) than the electronic one.


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## Guest

Great lock "B"...Too bad they won't use it, it's to good of an idea...


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## Guest

How many P&P contractors submit a work authorization form for signature before beginning any jobs? At least on a bid to be signed upon approval. If you say no then why not? The WA protects you and the service company. Also give the contractor rights that the service companies don't want you to excercise (payment protection). 
Just curious. We do but I know of a lot of contractors that do NOT submit for signatures the work authorizaton.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Cheaper place to buy the electric lock that OCWEN wants.
> 
> 
> http://www.buylockbox.com/electronic-entry-door-locks.html


That's a good price........... for now. It's on sale so, those of you who are stocking up should buy them before they go back to regular price.

We are still going to accept on a property by property basis. For the most part, we will be declining lock change orders from Alitsource due to the pricing. If our vendors don't make anything, neither do we.

Linda


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## Guest

We have been asked to remove debris from foreclosed properties. How do you make a living removing debris? We checked prices here in Las Vegas and it is $15.00 a cubic yard to dump the debris at our local landfill. Most preservation companies are paying you $20.00 a cubic yard to remove debris your not going to make out at the end. Do you charge for the dumping fee?:thumbsup:


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## BPWY

Either they pay more per yard, or you are allowed to charge a dumping fee or don't do the work.

Its that simple. The banks and service companies know what costs are across the country.
And they will try to get you as low as they possibly can so that they make more money.

Don't work yourself into bankruptcy doing some thing you know you can't do.


----------



## Guest

ips said:


> We have been asked to remove debris from foreclosed properties. How do you make a living removing debris? We checked prices here in Las Vegas and it is $15.00 a cubic yard to dump the debris at our local landfill. Most preservation companies are paying you $20.00 a cubic yard to remove debris your not going to make out at the end. Do you charge for the dumping fee?:thumbsup:


 
Easy. Bid for a rolloff on each job with the cost of rolloff as the disposal fee. The $20cyd is for you to take to the bank. As BPWY knows and stated: "the bank knows the costs of disposal all to well". They just looking for 1 more sucker


----------



## Guest

I am looking for the regs from HUD that they are using Boeckh (marshall swift) for the cost estimator for completing repair work. I know I saw that somewhere that you can purchase online the new guideline/estimator but can't find the information. Anyone know off hand?

Reason: Service Companies are starting to have us contractors complete Bid Estimate Sheets that list the name of the manufacturer of the product you use, # of man hours (hud pays $20 *gross* per hour labor) and such. They are going to "audit" against the Boeckh Cost Estimator. We get hosed. 

Example: We bid to remove and replace 2'x12' soffit area on Thursday at $300.00 (minus all the discounts and such) so we have an adjusted net of $240.00. Not counting all the drivetime and materials that equates to the true net. 
Service company said the "estimator" is saying that should be completed for $84.00.....
I said reassign. 

That is what this is coming to. I don't have a problem with estimating at residential pricing for the locale where I live but in the P&P business we have to take into acct all the "extras" that are thrown on us such as: E&O, Drive time, discounts, landfill receipts, picture processing, upload administration time, possible chargebacks etc etc.....


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## Guest

I called and told the company if there was a way for them to pay us more than $20.00 a cubic yard and they said no and they also won't allow for a dumpster unless it is more than 60 cubic yards of trash.


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## BPWY

ips said:


> I called and told the company if there was a way for them to pay us more than $20.00 a cubic yard and they said no and they also won't allow for a dumpster unless it is more than 60 cubic yards of trash.





Stand your ground and tell them to get some one else.

Do not go bankrupt to make them money.

We both know they are probably pocketing $30 per yrd for doing all the hard paper work.


I've run across outfits that pay $15 while pocketing $35, the remainder of HUD rate. Even in an area that charges $50 per ton for disposal. And they wouldn't allow me to inflate the yrds. I told them to _whizz off_, just like Gordon Ramsay does on Hells Kitchen.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I am looking for the regs from HUD that they are using Boeckh (marshall swift) for the cost estimator for completing repair work. I know I saw that somewhere that you can purchase online the new guideline/estimator but can't find the information. Anyone know off hand?
> 
> Reason: Service Companies are starting to have us contractors complete Bid Estimate Sheets that list the name of the manufacturer of the product you use, # of man hours (hud pays $20 *gross* per hour labor) and such. They are going to "audit" against the Boeckh Cost Estimator. We get hosed.
> 
> Example: We bid to remove and replace 2'x12' soffit area on Thursday at $300.00 (minus all the discounts and such) so we have an adjusted net of $240.00. Not counting all the drivetime and materials that equates to the true net.
> Service company said the "estimator" is saying that should be completed for $84.00.....
> I said reassign.
> 
> That is what this is coming to. I don't have a problem with estimating at residential pricing for the locale where I live but in the P&P business we have to take into acct all the "extras" that are thrown on us such as: E&O, Drive time, discounts, landfill receipts, picture processing, upload administration time, possible chargebacks etc etc.....





Be sure to include ALL your man hrs in the estimate then, drive time, office time, processing etc.

And yeah, I'd tell them to reassign too. That is ridiculous!


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## Guest

This ship has got to right itself or it's going straight to the bottom. A lot of these Nationals and HUD are at the helm of the Titanic if you know what I mean. Sad...Sad...Sad...


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## mtmtnman

No rhym or reason with these banks. They pizzed and moaned they needed a bid on 5 acres up in the mountains. The last mowing on this property was when we still had buffalo here 120 years ago!! House in the middle of it with NATURAL MOUNTAIN LANDSCAPING!! Anyways the bank approved $1600 to cut this and the same bank has multiple homes in town that are 10-15,000 sq ft where i have bids in for $150 and NEVER get approved. This mountain property worries me as its very dry and if i hit a rock with the bush hog i COULD start a forest fire.......


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I am looking for the regs from HUD that they are using Boeckh (marshall swift) for the cost estimator for completing repair work. I know I saw that somewhere that you can purchase online the new guideline/estimator but can't find the information. Anyone know off hand?
> 
> Reason: Service Companies are starting to have us contractors complete Bid Estimate Sheets that list the name of the manufacturer of the product you use, # of man hours (hud pays $20 *gross* per hour labor) and such. They are going to "audit" against the Boeckh Cost Estimator. We get hosed.
> 
> Example: We bid to remove and replace 2'x12' soffit area on Thursday at $300.00 (minus all the discounts and such) so we have an adjusted net of $240.00. Not counting all the drivetime and materials that equates to the true net.
> Service company said the "estimator" is saying that should be completed for $84.00.....
> I said reassign.
> 
> That is what this is coming to. I don't have a problem with estimating at residential pricing for the locale where I live but in the P&P business we have to take into acct all the "extras" that are thrown on us such as: E&O, Drive time, discounts, landfill receipts, picture processing, upload administration time, possible chargebacks etc etc.....





DreamWeaver said:


> This ship has got to right itself or it's going straight to the bottom. A lot of these Nationals and HUD are at the helm of the Titanic if you know what I mean. Sad...Sad...Sad...





How right you are.

Contemplate the full effect of Fremont's post and it'll scare any body that is doing repair/rehab work for the banks.


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## Guest

Funny how we the TAX PAYERS bailed their arses out of the sound financial decisions they had been making for some time. Yet they have the balls to tell us what we should be charging.

Shoot'em an email and tell'em you'll be needing a bailout if you work for those fees. Then ask them if they're game to stimulate your bank account. Bet the silence is deafening.


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## mtmtnman

The work orders are reading different now. Liquids are not to be considered by the cubic yard........


DEBRIS/HAZARDS - Follow current HUD guidelines and cost schedules for debris removal. If debris cannot be removed for the allowable, you must submit a bid.. - If submitting an estimate to remove debris and/or hazards, you MUST specify, in cubic yards. If bidding to remove chemicals, bid in gallons/number of cans, NOT in cubic yards. You must indicate if the debris/hazards are located in the INTERIOR or EXTERIOR of the property. Debris and hazards located in outbuildings which can be secured are considered interior. It's IMPERATIVE TO IDENTIFY WHAT THE HAZARDS, PERSONALS, or DEBRIS CONSISTS OF.


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## BPWY

Read this article and think about how it relates to the discussion of this page and the previous one.


The politicians don't care if the middle class goes away! Actually this would be a good thing in their eyes because it massively increases the dependence on the gooberment to provide for this economic class of people. There by ensuring that the politician that can bring home the most bacon to his/her voting block will remain in power.
Politicians know that for the most part the voters aren't going to vote against the hand that feeds them. Even if it is bread crumbs.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> The work orders are reading different now. Liquids are not to be considered by the cubic yard........
> 
> 
> DEBRIS/HAZARDS - Follow current HUD guidelines and cost schedules for debris removal. If debris cannot be removed for the allowable, you must submit a bid.. - If submitting an estimate to remove debris and/or hazards, you MUST specify, in cubic yards. If bidding to remove chemicals, bid in gallons/number of cans, NOT in cubic yards. You must indicate if the debris/hazards are located in the INTERIOR or EXTERIOR of the property. Debris and hazards located in outbuildings which can be secured are considered interior. It's IMPERATIVE TO IDENTIFY WHAT THE HAZARDS, PERSONALS, or DEBRIS CONSISTS OF.


 
That might be a specific company but I haven't seen this in any HUD documents.... Yet anyway.....


----------



## Guest

*electronic locks*



BPWY said:


> Cheaper place to buy the electric lock that OCWEN wants.
> 
> 
> 
> My experience is this company is constantly out of stock and now they mention limited availability and I have ordered from both buylockbox and locks4reo. Locks4reo does not charge shipping or tax whereas buylockbox does charge for shipping for smaller quantities. They also include the four batteries needed for the lock. I am on the locks4reo mailing list and they have specials that are not mentioned on their website on a weekly basis. Just my opinion......
> 
> Kathy Wilson
> Preservation Specialists


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> That's a good price........... for now. It's on sale so, those of you who are stocking up should buy them before they go back to regular price.
> 
> We are still going to accept on a property by property basis. For the most part, we will be declining lock change orders from Alitsource due to the pricing. If our vendors don't make anything, neither do we.
> 
> Linda


 
Great thing about buylockbox.com is that their "sales" never end. They get extended every 2 weeks. I have been buying knobs from them for a long time. They are really good about getting orders out in a hurry. I live in Utah and usually recieve the knobs 2 days after ordering them.


----------



## BPWY

The only thing about their knob locks I hate is they aren't rekeyable.

I do like their lock boxes because without that special little tool they aren't as valuable to other contractors that might come behind and wish to re-code and re-use the box. Or at least its not as convenient to re-code.

Yeah I know I'm a jerk, but thats OK, I still sleep at night. :lol:


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## Guest

Hello all...Have any of you been working for ASD America? If so, how are they to work for?


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## BPWY

Never heard of them.

Any body here work for A2Z?


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> The only thing about their knob locks I hate is they aren't rekeyable.
> 
> I do like their lock boxes because without that special little tool they aren't as valuable to other contractors that might come behind and wish to re-code and re-use the box. Or at least its not as convenient to re-code.
> 
> Yeah I know I'm a jerk, but thats OK, I still sleep at night. :lol:


I screwed up a while back and got 2 cases of knoblocks. Now i don't do much work for the Co. that uses the code i bought and i can't rekey them. I would venture to guess tha the majority of P&P contractors don't rekey. if i can find a way into a home i rekey what is in the home if its Kwikset or Wieser......


----------



## Guest

*New to Contractor Talk*

Hey guys thought I would go ahead and sign up here at contractor talk. I have been reading these post for months now and I would like to say thanks for all the info. I own a pp business here in arkansas and like the idea of having a place to talk to others about this business. Thanks


----------



## Guest

*New Here*

Hello all, I am in the process off starting up a PP business in southern Louisiana and really would appreciate any advice on who to contact that could offer me some work. I just need to get my foot in the door, it should all work out after that. Thanks for your help.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Never heard of them.
> 
> Any body here work for A2Z?


We're signed w/them and have dBase access now. They're waiting out the new HUD contract as it shifts from Pyramid (we work for them too) to them. They seem pretty sophisticated; payment plans are on par w/what we require for what we will do for them.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I am looking for the regs from HUD that they are using Boeckh (marshall swift) for the cost estimator for completing repair work. I know I saw that somewhere that you can purchase online the new guideline/estimator but can't find the information. Anyone know off hand?
> 
> Reason: Service Companies are starting to have us contractors complete Bid Estimate Sheets that list the name of the manufacturer of the product you use, # of man hours (hud pays $20 *gross* per hour labor) and such. They are going to "audit" against the Boeckh Cost Estimator. We get hosed.
> 
> Example: We bid to remove and replace 2'x12' soffit area on Thursday at $300.00 (minus all the discounts and such) so we have an adjusted net of $240.00. Not counting all the drivetime and materials that equates to the true net.
> Service company said the "estimator" is saying that should be completed for $84.00.....
> I said reassign.
> 
> That is what this is coming to. I don't have a problem with estimating at residential pricing for the locale where I live but in the P&P business we have to take into acct all the "extras" that are thrown on us such as: E&O, Drive time, discounts, landfill receipts, picture processing, upload administration time, possible chargebacks etc etc.....


Their # is in the response Q&A for ML 10-18. Kinda a waste to buy it, though, as a person ought to be able to know in their mind what their bottom line/profit margin is. If they don't want to meet your specs tell them to resubmit to someone who will.


----------



## BPWY

Sub Rosa said:


> We're signed w/them and have dBase access now. They're waiting out the new HUD contract as it shifts from Pyramid (we work for them too) to them. They seem pretty sophisticated; payment plans are on par w/what we require for what we will do for them.





What is "dBase"?


I've been working for them for closing on a year. I feel their pricing is some what cheap especially for the amount of time involved in the inspections.
I've not gotten any other work other than inspections.
I've NEVER had a bid approval. Even tho bids are required for almost every w/o.

But the thing that is concerning me right now is they've gone from paying promptly to taking 3+ weeks to drop a check in the mail after its been cut.

Its easy to prove this. Check date versus postmark.

There WAS another company out of SLC I WAS working for that lets just say they didn't work out. And this is where it started. Taking weeks to drop the checks in the mail after they were cut. Mean while they were telling all kinds of lies about the situation. Blaming it on the mail carrier loosing every check that they sent out... etc etc etc.
Because of my negative experience with that company when A2Z has started the same thing it begins to make me nervous.

I know for a fact that this other wanna be company was having financial problems, is this what A2Z is up to?


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## Guest

SubRosa, Totally agree but always nice to see were a person van "tweek" bids. Kinda like xactimate painting rate stinks but include all the "add ons" and its not bad.
PS was in your area last week and I claim responsibility for all the rain: )


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> SubRosa, Totally agree but always nice to see were a person van "tweek" bids. Kinda like xactimate painting rate stinks but include all the "add ons" and its not bad.
> PS was in your area last week and I claim responsibility for all the rain: )


Any time you wanna drop by give us a heads up! Yeah, the rain is here, but what's worse is the humidity!


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> What is "dBase"?
> 
> 
> I've been working for them for closing on a year. I feel their pricing is some what cheap especially for the amount of time involved in the inspections.
> I've not gotten any other work other than inspections.
> I've NEVER had a bid approval. Even tho bids are required for almost every w/o.
> 
> But the thing that is concerning me right now is they've gone from paying promptly to taking 3+ weeks to drop a check in the mail after its been cut.
> 
> Its easy to prove this. Check date versus postmark.
> 
> There WAS another company out of SLC I WAS working for that lets just say they didn't work out. And this is where it started. Taking weeks to drop the checks in the mail after they were cut. Mean while they were telling all kinds of lies about the situation. Blaming it on the mail carrier loosing every check that they sent out... etc etc etc.
> Because of my negative experience with that company when A2Z has started the same thing it begins to make me nervous.
> 
> I know for a fact that this other wanna be company was having financial problems, is this what A2Z is up to?


dBase - Database. All my systems are actually fired up on Linux (Ubuntu), but my lady and dad still run windows. Linux runs GREAT, works JUST LIKE Windows, and IS FREE! Yeah, anywayz, we are registered with them and they sent us a pack and we're just waiting to look at some of their work before committing fully.


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## BPWY

Per email today from altisource 8/3 is the drop dead date on the electric deadbolts.




> Per PPI, effective August 3rd, all orders received without the Digital Lock will be placed into pending correction status.
> To avoid this, please ensure that when securing the property you are using the Digital Lock – No substitute please.
> 
> Thank you
> 
> Altisource Portfolio Solutions


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## Guest

Got sent to a property to give a bid to fill in a trampoline hole or build a cover for it. Sent the bid in and all was good. Included in the bid the price to remove 5 pallets of quickcrete bags that had gotten wet and solidified. They called today and wanted a bid to move the cement into the trampoline hole and cover it with dirt. I called the city to run the idea past them. The code officer said they didn't have an ordinance for stupidity but he would gladly write a ticket for illegal dumping if they really wanted him to.


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## BPWY

A lot of the insanity today comes from the banks, but I'm certain that a lot of it also comes from the national's monkey brained ideas.


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## BPWY

Per another email I got recently Altisource bought up Home Eq.




> Altisource Portfolio Solutions expanded its REO disposition services in 18 states with more than 5,700 properties listed with brokers in Q210, an 18% increase from the 4,800 properties listed in the previous quarter.
> 
> The company reported $17.6m in net income in Q210, more than double the $7m earned in the same quarter last year.
> 
> Altisource earned $71.3m in total revenue in Q210, a 43% increase from Q209 as it continued to expand. Robert Stiles, chief financial officer at Altisource, told REO Insider the company started the brokerage operations in the second quarter of last year and in only three states initially.
> 
> "Suffice it to say, we have more than doubled the inventory today with brokers," Stiles said.
> 
> Its property preservation segment managed more than 10,200 properties in Q210, up 36% from the previous quarter. It provided default management services, primarily nonlegal processing for foreclosure attorneys, in 24 states, growing from 13 at the start of the quarter.
> 
> Altisource earned $47m from its mortgage servicing division in Q210, nearly doubling the $24m earned in the same quarter last year. That part of the company, too, has expanded after acquiring MPA, a deal completed in the first quarter of 2010 and added $1.3m to revenues.
> 
> Altisource is expecting to see more revenue from a recent servicing deal in May, when Ocwen Financial Corp. acquired HomEq Servicing from Barclays Capital. The deal added 190,000 loans to the 400,000 serviced by Ocwen. If the transaction closes Sept. 1, Altisource expects to see referrals from the deal, which could bolster revenue in Q410 through 2011.


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Per email today from altisource 8/3 is the drop dead date on the electric deadbolts.


 
Does anyone have a clue how to secure with digital lock if the door is one of those steel security doors that are prominent in the inner city. I could put one on the inside door I guess, but I would still have to secure the security door, otherwise you will have people inside squatting in less than a week


----------



## brm1109

*No common sense*

I get a call from a new national 3 weeks ago for the status of an initial secure. I informed the person that I never received it but they said "oh yes we sent it". Needless to say they call me later and tell me that it was actually given to another contractor. So yesterday they send me an order for the same address. I ask them why since it was already done and they responded that it actually wasn't done.
Get to the property and guess what, the property is secured. Call and tell them and they say oh it is? send a photo and invoice for trip.'One thing I can't take is wasting my time and payroll.


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## BPWY

The way the banks shop around and change nationals on a whim I'd have gone a head and secured it.

I've been down that road before. Secured by First Am, now MCS has it and they want it secured.
Call in and tell them that its already been secured, their question... was it done by us? Nope. Resecure it!!!!!!
Back in the day when I worked for MCS I completely resecured more than one property that I had already done for MCS.

Oh well.


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## BPWY

I may have asked this question before. But I didn't find any thing when searching.

Any body here use Lamco network?? They charge the contractor to sign up on the network claiming that one or two jobs will pay the annual $260 fee. They charge the contractors and agents to sign up but the asset managers are able to search the network for free.


They keep trying to talk me into taking the area I live in because there are no other contractors in this area.
I could certainly use more work but I'm going to get real pissed off if I pay $260 (UP FRONT) and all I get are calls for cheap work.


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## Guest

Lamco is a joke. Never ever heard of anyone getting work from them but they sure do send out a lot of junk emails....abt 10 per week. Try to unsubscribe? Nope twice as many as previously. Some good stories on their site though.

ARPPP seen these in the inner city and 1 service company said to secure the inside door and make a temporary handle from zip ties...yep thats what we do now. I like the nice purple ones myself

BRM1109 isn't that just the berries? That has been done to us so many times we don't even count anymore BUT I will tell you it sure seems that when we get to the house and start taking pics "those knob holes are mysteriously empty" and it needs secured  I Just think the prior securing person stuck a lock in the hole and took pics and took their box with them since that is never in the pics either  I will also say that the old locks we put on the ground "outside" the door and say their appears to be vandalism and someone broke in so that way the previousl securing contractor does not get chargedback....The old saying "what goes around comes around" so we try to make sure that doesn't happen.

Talk about securing: the State of Iowa is suppose to have a law passed by Oct 1 that all persons changing locks for profit will have to be licensed and bonded as a locksmith. We hear several other States already have that law and soon to be at a State near you. We were notified to get licensed today.
Also, was told by a good friend who moved south that in the State of Texas he has to take a class to become a licensed locksmith that was something like 3 days. He is signed up for Tue through Thur next week. Oh how sweet that will be. How to change a doorknob OR lucky for all of us to learn to put on a digital deadbolt


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## BPWY

I had a real estate agent tell me last week that she uses a lock smith that charges her $15 per lock. WTF???

$20 trip charge to get to the property, $20 to pick a lock and $15 per lock changed.


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## Guest

not if they are licensed that couldn't. No way no how. Insurance and bonding is to high price for that unless they are a charity or just released from the Dept of Corrections with their "training manual"


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## mtmtnman

ARPPP said:


> Does anyone have a clue how to secure with digital lock if the door is one of those steel security doors that are prominent in the inner city. I could put one on the inside door I guess, but I would still have to secure the security door, otherwise you will have people inside squatting in less than a week




Damn, If i had to lock my place up with one of those i would move!


----------



## ARPPP

I posted a during pic of the locks. There were actually a knob and deadbolt on this door and 2 deadbolts on the inside door all keyed differently. I pulled all of the locks out and put a chain through the 2 holes in each door and then a lockbox to act as a padlock since we seem to have some folks that do not carry the standard lock key with them. I know I will get a call that keys are missing from the lockbox one day! :whistling


----------



## Guest

Hello all. I'm new here and just wondering if anyone is from the Ohio area. If so, what is the availibilty of property preservation work. From reading these posts, it seems some states are overly busy while others are not. Comments appreciated.


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## mtmtnman

A little good news on the new HUD Letter......


_*" HUD recognizes that this Mortgagee Letter was released in the middle of the grass cut season; therefore, HUD has made an exception to allow the use of ML 08-31, Attachment 6 “Yard Maintenance and Snow Removal Requirements, Page 39 through the end of the 2010 grass cut season. It is anticipated that after this timeframe, HUD will begin utilizing a Cost Estimator product for the grass cut expense. In the event that HUD’s Cost Estimator is not ready for production, HUD will make the determination to possibly extend the use of the ML 08-31 grass cut cost schedule for an additional period of time."


*_This also is of interest. It looks as if there might be different prices by zip code??:_*
"MSB Presentation & Related Preservation Issues: After a general overview from MSB on their product, specific HUD preservation discussion focused on several issues. The primary one surrounded the example of grass cuts; the new Exhibit B prices, future CE prices (down to zip codes) and the interim from 7/13 until at minimum 9/1 when the new contractor would be live with the CE. This resulted in HUD indicating that they may have to go to a full price schedule until the CE is in place and fully operational. This includes re-examining some pricing that in 10-18 is lower than 08-31. HUD arrived at the new prices by “manual” research and calculation.
The CE, when in place, will allow for differentiation, and eventual elimination of, a cost schedule. The ability to extract the CE cost from the tool will allow servicer’s & vendors to pull and print the CE quote and place it in the audit file to support expenses above any line item published cost or a cost in general."


*_


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## mtmtnman

This is good:

*Exterior Debris & Second Bids:* One bid only after 7/13 and will clarify with claims concerning now until 7/13. Clarification will be provided concerning work begun under 08-31 that extends beyond 7/13 and whether two bids will be required if subsequent work (as previously advised) will continue under 08-31.


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## mtmtnman

*So long middle class.........................*

This is depressing........

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/so_long_middle_class_GoGvE3xMnYXzZpS2OMGZsI


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> This is depressing........
> 
> http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/so_long_middle_class_GoGvE3xMnYXzZpS2OMGZsI


What do you have to worry about? YOU are in the top 3% of income earners YOU are a P&P contractor!:laughing:

Hoorah!


----------



## Guest

epiccleaning said:


> Hello all. I'm new here and just wondering if anyone is from the Ohio area. If so, what is the availibilty of property preservation work. From reading these posts, it seems some states are overly busy while others are not. Comments appreciated.


 
From my cohorts in Ohio they don't measure population anylonger......

They measure the number of P&P contractors per square mile. 
Can you say "overpopulated/oversaturated"?


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## Guest

Morning Y'all.....

Any of my fine upstanding colleages have a good HVAC Sub-Contractor agreement they'd be willing to share with me?:notworthy

And Fremont, I see you were burning the midnight oil also my friend.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> What do you have to worry about? YOU are in the top 3% of income earners YOU are a P&P contractor!:laughing:
> 
> Hoorah!



LMFAO!!!! Maybe in gross dollars but whats left in the end??


----------



## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> Morning Y'all.....
> 
> Any of my fine upstanding colleages have a good HVAC Sub-Contractor agreement they'd be willing to share with me?:notworthy
> 
> And Fremont, I see you were burning the midnight oil also my friend.


Yep the oils were burning...just not very bright

Personally never have got any HVAC or Plumber or Electricians to sign a subcontractor agreement (if they were any good) but instead they give us a work authorization form that we sign to guarantee payment and scope of work.


----------



## mtmtnman

Damn i like living here. I hire HVAC, Sparky & Plumbing work on my good name! I let an invoice for plumbing work slip last summer and found it 2 months later in the mess on my desk. I called the plumber apologizing and embarrassed and he said "I wasn't worried, I knew you would pay me" We can still write a check at the KFC and A&W too!!!


----------



## Guest

I got one for ya! How many of us has had to stare down a dog? All us has at one time BUT how many of us has had to stare down a gray wolf that was a freakin 4' tall! 

Scared the dang crap out of me! Dropped the camera and clipboard and honestly was to scared to move! My wife was with me and she rolled up the dang truck window.....COWARD.. :laughing:

Fortunately the home was occupied and the lady came running around the back yard and said "LAY" or something like that while my heart started beating again and the HUGE thing just laid down at my feet. I wanted to faint, cry for joy or just run but my feet were in concrete and wouldn't move. Man I don't remember ever being so scared in my life. Sorry I'm still shaking:whistling

Ended up the lady has 5 registered 100% Wolves on the endangered species list for our State and she was letting the "tame" one run around the yard when I had the pleasure of driving up the lane. 

I will once again start "carrying" again...never ever again!

Pics of the other 4 in the pen attached.


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> I got one for ya! How many of us has had to stare down a dog? All us has at one time BUT how many of us has had to stare down a gray wolf that was a freakin 4' tall!
> 
> Scared the dang crap out of me! Dropped the camera and clipboard and honestly was to scared to move! My wife was with me and she rolled up the dang truck window.....COWARD.. :laughing:
> 
> Fortunately the home was occupied and the lady came running around the back yard and said "LAY" or something like that while my heart started beating again and the HUGE thing just laid down at my feet. I wanted to faint, cry for joy or just run but my feet were in concrete and wouldn't move. Man I don't remember ever being so scared in my life. Sorry I'm still shaking:whistling
> 
> Ended up the lady has 5 registered 100% Wolves on the endangered species list for our State and she was letting the "tame" one run around the yard when I had the pleasure of driving up the lane.
> 
> I will once again start "carrying" again...never ever again!
> 
> Pics of the other 4 in the pen attached.


Did you need a new pair of these???????


----------



## Guest

Just about needed depends!... that picture does not do any justice but the occupant is in the other pics and I won't post a picture of the homeowner. The 2 in that pic are females and they were half the size of the males. 

p.s. the only thing hanging low was my dang gut.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Damn i like living here. I hire HVAC, Sparky & Plumbing work on my good name! I let an invoice for plumbing work slip last summer and found it 2 months later in the mess on my desk. I called the plumber apologizing and embarrassed and he said "I wasn't worried, I knew you would pay me" We can still write a check at the KFC and A&W too!!!






Same here. But I don't need their services very often.

Once for a furnace guy and twice for a water dry out company.
And once for a tree removal service.

All the work was done on a handshake.


----------



## BPWY

Fremont I'm betting your wife wishes she would have had a video cam rollin!!!!
She could put it on pay per view and make money off of it. 

That is hilarious, since it was you and not me. lol

The animals in the pic look like dogs, not wolves.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I got one for ya! How many of us has had to stare down a dog? All us has at one time BUT how many of us has had to stare down a gray wolf that was a freakin 4' tall!
> 
> Scared the dang crap out of me! Dropped the camera and clipboard and honestly was to scared to move! My wife was with me and she rolled up the dang truck window.....COWARD.. :laughing:
> 
> Fortunately the home was occupied and the lady came running around the back yard and said "LAY" or something like that while my heart started beating again and the HUGE thing just laid down at my feet. I wanted to faint, cry for joy or just run but my feet were in concrete and wouldn't move. Man I don't remember ever being so scared in my life. Sorry I'm still shaking:whistling
> 
> Ended up the lady has 5 registered 100% Wolves on the endangered species list for our State and she was letting the "tame" one run around the yard when I had the pleasure of driving up the lane.
> 
> I will once again start "carrying" again...never ever again!
> 
> Pics of the other 4 in the pen attached.


 
LOL....... Now that's funny there, I don't care who you are, that's funny.... As long as it happens to someone else. 

Here's one not quite as threatening or tramatic as Fremonts, but funny none the less.

A helper and myself were walking down an alley to get to the rear of a city rowhouse for maintenance. When doing so we walked pasted a black and white cat that appeared to have been ran over and was dead. Sad, but not uncommon in the city. We went about our bid-ness and about a half hour later we were returning to the truck via the same alley. As we were walking past the cat, it was just a couple of feet from my helper, it jumped up and scared the $$*****TT out of both of us. My helper took of running and when I regained my composer I started laughing my arse off. The helper still wanted nothing to do with it and was not amused at all. That was the roughest living cat that I have ever seen in my life to this day.


----------



## BPWY

Fremont did you have to stop by the clothes store after you left that job?????????????????????







:laughing: :laughing:


----------



## Guest

He said that "Depends". lol


----------



## Guest

Whats up with lockboxs? I do rekeys for a realtor and they only want to pay $18 for a lock box. Is this the going rate for lockbox? The lockbox cost me around $12 to $13 after shipping.


----------



## Guest

kh-pp said:


> Whats up with lockboxs? I do rekeys for a realtor and they only want to pay $18 for a lock box. Is this the going rate for lockbox? The lockbox cost me around $12 to $13 after shipping.


Just like the old drug campaign... Just say NO!

Don't let them price you out of business.

Good Luck.


----------



## Guest

Seems to always be jobs in this field, but in this area, I just can't see it being profitable. Maybe I don't understand it. Some of the adsseem to be asking for people to serve more than one county. I can't imagine serving one county and maybe having to travel 20 miles one way to do a lock change or inspection. Then go another 15/20 miles in aqnother direction to take before and after picture of a lawn that you cut.


----------



## mtmtnman

kh-pp said:


> Whats up with lockboxs? I do rekeys for a realtor and they only want to pay $18 for a lock box. Is this the going rate for lockbox? The lockbox cost me around $12 to $13 after shipping.



I made a deal long ago with my broker and include a lockbox with my rekeys for him. He returns the lockboxes to me when the homes sell. I haven't bought a new one in about 6 months now but have done around 8K in rekeys in that time. I also supply him with all the keys he needs and cut keys for him as needed for free. It cost's me .15 cents a key to do this but in turn i get all of the brokers work. When all this foreclosure crap is over i will have my local brokers to fall back on. Before the SHTF my broker would get 3-5 foreclosures a year. He gets that many most weeks now........


----------



## BPWY

boman47k said:


> Seems to always be jobs in this field, but in this area, I just can't see it being profitable. Maybe I don't understand it. Some of the adsseem to be asking for people to serve more than one county. I can't imagine serving one county and maybe having to travel 20 miles one way to do a lock change or inspection. Then go another 15/20 miles in aqnother direction to take before and after picture of a lawn that you cut.







You'd never make it in many of the western states. I live in a large county, (over 2000 sq miles). Unbelievably enough there are counties in my state and others that are far larger. 20 miles only gets me from my house into town.
CO, UT, MT, and WY all have counties that are bigger than some of the eastern sea board states. I'm sure TX could be added to that list as well.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> You'd never make it in many of the western states. I live in a large county, (over 2000 sq miles). Unbelievably enough there are counties in my state and others that are far larger. 20 miles only gets me from my house into town.
> CO, UT, MT, and WY all have counties that are bigger than some of the eastern sea board states. I'm sure TX could be added to that list as well.



I got you beat. My county is 5,256 sq miles and i cover the county south of me which is 1,654 sq miles as well as the county west of me which is 3,675 sq miles for a total of 10,585 sq miles. In this area there is 120,000 people and 58,000 housing units and a little over 11 people per sq mile. My state ranks fourth in area, but 44th in population, and therefore has the third lowest population density in the United States.


Found this interesting too. "Loma, Montana is the location of the most extreme recorded temperature change in a 24-hour period in the United States. On January 15, 1972, the temperature rose from &#8722 °F (&#8722.8 °C) to 49 °F (9 °C)." Damn i put a lot of worthless effort in this post!


----------



## Guest

I am officially going into the preservation business for the first time. I have a restoration and cleaning company so it should be hard and I am no newbie. 

Hi everyone I have two questions for the experience.

A company sent me the price list below. What do these prices represent, the cost of labor and materials or just materials? If they represent labor and materials needed how far would be the max distance you would travel to complete for example a debri removal and janitorial service for a single family home?

If multiple companies bid on a project what do these prices represent?


Securing 
Digital Lock $110.0 
Padlock $15.0 
Slide Bolt $10.0 
Bracing Wood $10.0 
Bracing Metal $15.0 
Secure Swimming Pool Bid 
Sliding Door Secure/Slider Lock $10.0 
Window Lock $10.0 
Strap Door $10.0 
Patio Door $10.0 
Boarding 
Boarding Small Opening $30.0 
Boarding Medium Opening $40.0 
Boarding Large Opening $45.0 
Boarding Sliding Glass or Double Door $75.0 
Boarding Single Car Garage Door $125.0 
Boarding Double Car Garage Door $175.0 
Boarding (over 112 square feet) Bid 
Security Door with hinges & padlock/hasp $75.0 
Boarding Large Front Door $45.0 
Board Pool Bid 
Winterize 
Dry Winterization $70.0 
Radiant Winterization $110.0 
Steam Winterization $75.0 
Replacing Sump Pump Bid 
Winterization Re‐check $20.0 
Wet Winterization $250.0 
Yard Maintenance 
Initial Grass Cut ‐ Less than 5,000 Square Feet $75.0 
Initial Grass Cut ‐ 5,000&#8208,999 Square Feet $75.0 
Initial Grass Cut ‐ 10,000&#8208,999 Square Feet $85.0 
Initial Grass Cut ‐ Over 15,000 Square Feet Bid 
Re‐Cut ‐ Less than 5,000 Square Feet $63.0 
Re‐Cut ‐ 5,000&#8208,999 Square Feet $65.0 
Re‐Cut ‐ 10,000&#8208,999 Square Feet $63.0 
Re‐Cut ‐ Over 15,000 Square Feet $63.0 
Trim Shrubs Bid 
Snow Removal Bid 
Debris Removal 
Debris Removal/Trash Out ‐ Per Cubic Yard $25.0 
Automobile Removal $110.0 
Initial Janitorial Services $150.0 
Trip Charge (if occupied)


----------



## Guest

Compare those prices against HUD's listed prices. I'll tell you one thing, they are all lower than what HUD has listed. Good luck on your new company.....be prepared to be underbid by the other "mystery" contractor.


----------



## BPWY

Those are Altisource's prices.


----------



## mtmtnman

*The IRS is out collecting.....*

A good friend of mine owns a machine shop out in Somewherein815's hood. A great big ethnic guy and a little geek stopped in to his shop yesterday asking why he hadn't filed a 941 in the last 5 quarters. He told them it was because they don't have any employees anymore and he hasn't paid himself in that long. He is basically making enough to keep the lights on and his wife's job pays the bills. The IRS guy said he still had to file a 941 stating no wages where paid and then slapped him with a $500 fine. Jackazz wouldn't listen to reason! I am afraid it will be a bad few years for this garbage.............


----------



## Guest

They come after me early this year for 08's taxes. Somehow all the 10-99's I issued didnt get listed in my filings.....my mistake.

So they sent me a "you owe $22,*** for blah blah blah" letter. I re-did the taxes for the entire year of 2008 and found out they actually owed me somewhere in the ballpark of $2000. My wife sent them a letter thanking them for finding the mistake and guess what.....they still keep saying they cant find the 10-99's we sent them the last 4 times in 4 months! And they still have not sent a dime of what I am owed.

It's almost like dealing with BOA/Countrywide losing photos!

mtmtnman, curious to know if I know who your buddy is. I know there is only a billion machine shops in that town! Rockford, IL....screw capitol of the world!


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> They come after me early this year for 08's taxes. Somehow all the 10-99's I issued didnt get listed in my filings.....my mistake.
> 
> So they sent me a "you owe $22,*** for blah blah blah" letter. I re-did the taxes for the entire year of 2008 and found out they actually owed me somewhere in the ballpark of $2000. My wife sent them a letter thanking them for finding the mistake and guess what.....they still keep saying they cant find the 10-99's we sent them the last 4 times in 4 months! And they still have not sent a dime of what I am owed.
> 
> It's almost like dealing with BOA/Countrywide losing photos!
> 
> mtmtnman, curious to know if I know who your buddy is. I know there is only a billion machine shops in that town! Rockford, IL....screw capitol of the world!


Somewhere,

I thought the screw capital of the world was Washington D.C.:laughing:


----------



## Guest

its scary, I have no employees I use contract labor and family(yes in my state that is ok to stay exempt) but I know a guy pays everyone hourly but treats them like a contract worker. I do not want to be him when he gets caught. For the reasons I have no employees the goverment had really priced that so high I just can't afford it.


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> They come after me early this year for 08's taxes. Somehow all the 10-99's I issued didnt get listed in my filings.....my mistake.
> 
> So they sent me a "you owe $22,*** for blah blah blah" letter. I re-did the taxes for the entire year of 2008 and found out they actually owed me somewhere in the ballpark of $2000. My wife sent them a letter thanking them for finding the mistake and guess what.....they still keep saying they cant find the 10-99's we sent them the last 4 times in 4 months! And they still have not sent a dime of what I am owed.
> 
> It's almost like dealing with BOA/Countrywide losing photos!
> 
> mtmtnman, curious to know if I know who your buddy is. I know there is only a billion machine shops in that town! Rockford, IL....screw capitol of the world!


He is 28 miles east of you in Marengo.......


----------



## Guest

I'm still shaking my head how these service companies are getting by saying the P&P contractor is an independent contractor? Due dates, You have to do this and do that, Be there at a certain times, This is how much you are going to be paid, Can't take a vacation or close your doors since "they" won't allow it......

The list goes on. I looked at a IRS Form SS-8 and in the past the employer had to fail 3 items (as I understood it) and if they fail 3 requirments than the "independent contractor" is considered an employee and given the rights as an employee....Anyone can request the IRS perform a determination on an "employer" and boy that would be fun for 10,000 P&P contractors to request this at the same general time!!


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> He is 28 miles east of you in Marengo.......


Ahh, gotcha. Then no, I wouldn't know of him.


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Ahh, gotcha. Then no, I wouldn't know of him.



How long you been in Rockford?? 19 years ago i met the woman who is now my better half at a place off of South Alpine called Doyle's Circle K.................


----------



## Guest

Been in the area my whole life. never actually lived in the city of Rockbottom though. Always lived a few miles west of there. I think my uncles band used to play at Doyles circle K


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> I'm still shaking my head how these service companies are getting by saying the P&P contractor is an independent contractor? Due dates, You have to do this and do that, Be there at a certain times, This is how much you are going to be paid, Can't take a vacation or close your doors since "they" won't allow it......


You can specify a due date and expect them to meet it but you can't tell them what day and time to be there. THAT is the difference between an employee and an independent contractor.

The preservation work order is basically a contract, just like an order for the machine shop to manufacture x number of screws. There is a due by date on an order for screws but that doesn't mean the machine shop is an employee, just like the vendor with a due date is not. 

The vendor or machine shop has the right to refuse an order, an employee does not...... another major difference.

Make sense?

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Been in the area my whole life. never actually lived in the city of Rockbottom though. Always lived a few miles west of there. I think my uncles band used to play at Doyles circle K



What is the name of his band? I did a bit of DJ'ing there as well as teaching dance lessons.......................


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> You can specify a due date and expect them to meet it but you can't tell them what day and time to be there. THAT is the difference between an employee and an independent contractor.
> 
> The preservation work order is basically a contract, just like an order for the machine shop to manufacture x number of screws. There is a due by date on an order for screws but that doesn't mean the machine shop is an employee, just like the vendor with a due date is not.
> 
> The vendor or machine shop has the right to refuse an order, an employee does not...... another major difference.
> 
> Make sense?
> 
> Linda





An even bigger problem is the outfits like Homeland that tell you what their "bid approval" prices are. Before you even bid.

THAT IS NOT AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR RELATIONSHIP.

HUD's set pricing could probably be challenged as well. I'd love to see what the IRS thinks of that.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> An even bigger problem is the outfits like Homeland that tell you what their "bid approval" prices are. Before you even bid.
> 
> THAT IS NOT AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR RELATIONSHIP.
> 
> HUD's set pricing could probably be challenged as well. I'd love to see what the IRS thinks of that.



How about the other ones who cross out the approval amount on the work order faxed to you but will tell you what they will pay for the job over the phone. So far everything they have told me on the phone has been paid accordingly but i am waiting for them to screw me.......


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> An even bigger problem is the outfits like Homeland that tell you what their "bid approval" prices are. Before you even bid.
> 
> THAT IS NOT AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR RELATIONSHIP.
> 
> HUD's set pricing could probably be challenged as well. I'd love to see what the IRS thinks of that.


It depends on the type of bid you're talking about. A client can set its own pricing or use the HUD rates, which are basically industry standards for HUD homes. But if you're talking about general contracting bids, the general contractor should bid those.

If your client *IS* a general contractor and they are able to bid from photos and know the rates for your area, there's probably not much you can challenge there.

If the gc bid is not acceptable, decline. People who choose to take jobs at less than what they're worth are their own worst enemy. Once enough people decline jobs, the rates will go back up. IMHO, of course.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> How about the other ones who cross out the approval amount on the work order faxed to you but will tell you what they will pay for the job over the phone. So far everything they have told me on the phone has been paid accordingly but i am waiting for them to screw me.......






The one(s) with no written contract? No vendor application/info packet?

Thats just stupid on their part.

I heard that they cut a check to a PREVIOUS contractor. And then 2 days later stopped payment on it. Causing the contractor's checks to bounce.
Its no wonder that contractor is a PREVIOUS contractor.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> How about the other ones who cross out the approval amount on the work order faxed to you but will tell you what they will pay for the job over the phone. So far everything they have told me on the phone has been paid accordingly but i am waiting for them to screw me.......


If the job is approved at what YOU bid, YOU should be paid according to your agreement with the client. 

eg. if you bid a job at "net to contractor or vendor", there should be no reduction in the amount you receive. Anything less than "net", you should have a talk with the client.

If you have an agreement that your client takes a % off the top and the approval comes over at your bid less their %, there shouldn't be a problem.

It's basically up to each vendor to determine the fairness of the pricing and either accept or decline accordingly. 

It doesn't hurt to challenge the pricing either. You may be surprised at the response from the client. SOME are flexible and you might be approved for more.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> It depends on the type of bid you're talking about. A client can set its own pricing or use the HUD rates, which are basically industry standards for HUD homes. But if you're talking about general contracting bids, the general contractor should bid those.
> 
> If your client *IS* a general contractor and they are able to bid from photos and know the rates for your area, there's probably not much you can challenge there.
> 
> If the gc bid is not acceptable, decline. People who choose to take jobs at less than what they're worth are their own worst enemy. Once enough people decline jobs, the rates will go back up. IMHO, of course.
> 
> Linda






The bottom feeders will continue to burn thru contractors. It seems as if there is no shortage of folks that are their own worst enemies. Especially in today's shortage of jobs. There is always a guy out there that is willing to work for any thing.
As long as this is the case the bottom feeder nationals will continue to be able to find plenty of new VICTIMS.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> The one(s) with no written contract? No vendor application/info packet?


Every work order issued is an agreement and there is an implied contract. Even without a formal vendor packet, you should ALWAYS know what the clients wants in exchange for the work they provide. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> It doesn't hurt to challenge the pricing either. You may be surprised at the response from the client. SOME are flexible and you might be approved for more.
> 
> Linda






The national I mentioned is very adamant that those low 1940 prices are ALL you are going to get. Suck it up and deal with it. Fiddles on them. I don't work for that cheap.

They out right lied to me about the banks pricing. Telling me that Wells Fargo does not pay HUD rate. Well I happen to know better because of some of the other clients I work for they also do Wells work. Guess what?
They ALL pay HUD rate for Wells work. 
I'm not about to work for a bottom feeder like them that only pays $15 to their contractors and pocket (at that time) $20 of the HUD rate. All travel and disposal fees were included in that cheap rate.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Yes, there will always be bottom feeders. As long as there are vendors and contractors willing to do the jobs at any cost, bottom feeders will continue to thrive.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Every work order issued is an agreement and there is an implied contract. Even without a formal vendor packet, you should ALWAYS know what the clients wants in exchange for the work they provide.
> 
> Linda






The problem is that they only send out a w/o with address and work requested.
Even on bid approvals they will not give you the amount paid for the job.
They will tell you on the phone IF you ask them. But they will not volunteer the info without you asking.

Recently they offered me a job for $3000. I wasn't able to cover it.
They offered it to some one else I know for $2700. But nothing will be put into writing. Company policy. 

I need the work, other wise..................


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Paul ~

If you don't know up front what the expectations are, you are creating a problem for yourself and you should look for clients that are on the up and up. Clients that don't disclose information are not honest, as far as I'm concerned and they will use and abuse you until you make them stop.

When I'm not sure about something, I'll send e-mail after e-mail requesting clarification. I don't move forward unless I know for a fact what I'm getting myself and my vendors into.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Like mtman said.... So far........... fingers crossed for the future.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Like mtman said.... So far........... fingers crossed for the future.


I certainly wish you luck!

Linda


----------



## BPWY

In other news MCB plays hardball with HUD.




> DENVER - The sole contractor maintaining and marketing HUD-owned homes in Colorado and several other states claimed the government wasn't paying its bills. So the company shut down all pending and future sales. ..........The company, Michaelson Connor & Boul (MCB), posted a notice on its website Monday saying, "Until such time as HUD is provided with additional appropriated funds for this contract, no further work will be performed."


These realtors that cannot believe HUD is being stupid........... obviously are first day newbs to the foreclosure market madness. There is nothing in this insanity game that I'd fail to believe any more.




> "There are a whole lot of people who are caught in a bind," Roberts said. "I've got to believe it's unprecedented."
> Other Realtors expressed disbelief that HUD would allow time to pass with willing buyers waiting in the wings.
> "It's kind of foolish to turn down money that could be coming into HUD," Rick Erickson, a broker with Erickson Sellers in Arvada, said.





I don't for a second believe that MCB is innocent in this mess either.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> What is the name of his band? I did a bit of DJ'ing there as well as teaching dance lessons.......................


His band was called "The All Stars" but IF they played there it would have been back in the early 80's. They were the last band on side B of the Y95's "Hometown Heros" album from back in the old days.


----------



## brm1109

*Gotta love when they try to get over on you.*

Just recently received a call from a "property preservation company" looking for contractors in my area.
First I hear how busy they are and can give me "a lot of work". Before anything else I asked for the fee paid for trash removal. I almost laughed at the person, $17.00 per yard.
So I politely explain that there is no way that I would work for that little and said the minimum that I would except. They then try to tell me that HUD only allows $25.00 for NJ. I know it is $50.00.
The person told me that there are only a few opening for contractors left. My response " good let them all work for that, when they go broke it will be less competition for me.
Gotta love new "regional and nationals".


----------



## Guest

Dump fees here were by weight the last I heard. How do you know how many yards you have if your trailer, or whatever, is not full? Or do you not not dump partial loads? Seems like sometime you would have to.

I'm talking about when you do not have a rented dumpster but are using your own trailer for instance.


----------



## brm1109

My truck is equal to 20 yards. And yes we also pay by the ton, anywhere from $89 -$102. per ton depending on the location of the cleanout. I look at it this way. 20 x $17.00 = $340.00. - at least $100.00 for a full truck, I pay $12.00 per hour to my folks plus tax = $128.00 for a 8 hr day (1 guy). That leaves about $112.00 not counting gas, insurance and overhead.
So now I would have worked all day, lost money and not even paid myself.
Let others have at it. I will only work if I am making money.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I will only work if I am making money.



:thumbup:


My business is not a charity.


I am not in this for my health.


----------



## BPWY

I do believe we've discussed this before.



> *Bank of America admits it did not pay dozens of contractors *
> 
> by BYRON HARRIS
> WFAA
> Posted on June 21, 2010 at 3:02 AM
> Updated Monday, Jun 21 at 3:53 PM
> *Related:*
> 
> 
> 
> Collateral damage: Innocent victims of the mortgage crisis
> Contractors unpaid while Nomad execs live large
> No checks, no balances for 'property preservation' firms
> Property preservation firm sues Bank of America
> More from News 8 Investigates
> Bank of America Field Services Web site
> 
> 
> 
> *NEWS 8 INVESTIGATES*
> DALLAS - If the nation's largest bank had lost the records of thousands of its customers, federal regulators would take swift action.
> But, that's just what Bank of America directly and indirectly has done with the paychecks of thousands of its contractors and sub-contractors in the property preservation business.
> The failure to pay contractors millions of dollars has created a tide of financial ruin in the backwash of the mortgage crisis. Just one of the places where the suffering has taken hold is the Mt. Moriah Baptist Church in Fort Worth.
> 
> 
> http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/investigates-96773444.html


It makes my blood boil for these guys. Knowing it easily could have been me BofA was willingly shorting. The contractors should start posting liens against the properties. BofA will get far more willing to pay up then.


----------



## ARPPP

*Request for new vendors in my area (LOL)*

Okay, how many of you jumped in on this great offer today! I am sure many of you will be knocking down their doors :clap:

They are kidding? Right?


----------



## BPWY

Thats so cheap as to not even be worth an email telling them thanks but no thanks.

Whats sad is that they probably found some one to work for that cheap, other wise those prices wouldn't be around long.

For a $30 wint all I'd do is open the lowest drain point in the house that I saw in the first 5 seconds of looking, drain the water heater if there is a floor drain. SPLASH not pour anti freeze into the drains and roll.
I wouldn't even bring the air compressor along for that.


----------



## Guest

Maybe everyone should start posting where they find these dumb ads and everyone should start swamping them with questions? ..... Tell them they are ignorant and etc etc etc and maybe they will find that these ads are going to get "slammed"...


----------



## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Okay, how many of you jumped in on this great offer today! I am sure many of you will be knocking down their doors :clap:
> 
> They are kidding? Right?


ARPPP, Whose ridiculous fee sheet is that?


----------



## Guest

Hello All: I have followed this forum for some time now but never registered to make a post. I own a property preservation company in the "Scenic City" of Chattanooga, Tennessee and we cover the Chattanooga Metro Area. Although I have not been an active poster in the past, I would like to become an active poster here. I think this is a great area for us to share best practices and industry information.

1) Does anyone have any feedback on Asset Management Specialist Inc (AMS)? [good or bad]
2) What vehicle set up do you find works best for you and do you have pictures to share? (truck, van, box truck, trailer)

We are a small business with about 10 staff members and growing. As of now, we use F-150's and GMC box trucks for our business, but I wanted to know what others think is the best set-up. We have been communicating with AMS about contracting with them so that is the reason for the question about them.

Thanks,
Victor
TeamOne Property Solutions


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## ARPPP

ARPPP said:


> Okay, how many of you jumped in on this great offer today! I am sure many of you will be knocking down their doors :clap:
> 
> They are kidding? Right?


I received an email with the fee sheet attached from Southeastern Asset. I am glad they attached the fee sheet in the initial correspondence, good way to weed them out quickly :clap:


----------



## Guest

TeamOnePS said:


> Hello All: I have followed this forum for some time now but never registered to make a post. I own a property preservation company in the "Scenic City" of Chattanooga, Tennessee and we cover the Chattanooga Metro Area. Although I have not been an active poster in the past, I would like to become an active poster here. I think this is a great area for us to share best practices and industry information.
> 
> 1) Does anyone have any feedback on Asset Management Specialist Inc (AMS)? [good or bad]
> 2) What vehicle set up do you find works best for you and do you have pictures to share? (truck, van, box truck, trailer)
> 
> We are a small business with about 10 staff members and growing. As of now, we use F-150's and GMC box trucks for our business, but I wanted to know what others think is the best set-up. We have been communicating with AMS about contracting with them so that is the reason for the question about them.
> 
> Thanks,
> Victor
> TeamOne Property Solutions


I wouldn't share too much info. You get the average Joe looking around in here and all the sudden we get 50 new P&P guys spinning drills and tossing antifreeze in toilets that will jump all over those lowballed price sheets like ARPPP posted. Then again, let them fools jump on it. They will be looking for a new job in about 6 months.


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I wouldn't share too much info. You get the average Joe looking around in here and all the sudden we get 50 new P&P guys spinning drills and tossing antifreeze in toilets that will jump all over those lowballed price sheets like ARPPP posted. Then again, let them fools jump on it. They will be looking for a new job in about 6 months.





I was thinking more along the lines of right after they get their first or possibly second check they'll be hangin it up at those rates.


----------



## Guest

Notice the fine print? Think they ran out of space and couldn't use regular print for that little tidbid?


----------



## BPWY

I just ordered 3.

I know of one job coming up that will require 1. The other two will sit in inventory I guess.





> INVENTORY SPECIAL​ ​ _Place an order *online* for *3* or more locks $59.99 each_​ _*INCLUDES BATTERIES AND PRIORITY SHIPPING _​ ​ ​ *OFFER VALID – Tuesday August 10, 2010*​ ​ ***AFTER PLACING ORDER REFUND WILL BE CREDITED $10.00 PER LOCK FOR QUALIFYING ORDERS*​ ****special INCLUDES priority 2-3 day shipping ONLY*​ *(over night orders will NOT have special pricing applied)*​ ​ ​ ​ *www.Locks4reo.com*​ ​ *Please feel free to contact us 24/7 at 1-888-973-6562*​


----------



## Guest

ive been getting them from lowes, they cost about 10 dollars more and don't come with batteries but i don't keep money on shelf and i try to knock out all orders within 24 hours


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## Guest

Got an order that would have required one of those neat digital locks the other day. They wanted me to go negotiate the Cash for Keys. Stopped by the house and the home owner informed me I was the 4th contractor they had sent out. His loan wasn't even with the Ocwen. He was really nice and said he understood it wasn't my fault but he would have his attorney call and confirm everything he had told me. Mr Attorney was pretty nice too. About a week later I recieved notice the work order had been canceled. I am guessing they are onto contractor #5 to go bother this guy. I really hope he doesn't run out of patience and start sueing everybody who has been out to do a cash for keys with him.

Anybody had any luck doing work for cities? We have had several code enforcement people recently contact us about performing abatements for them.


----------



## ARPPP

IdahoProperty said:


> ive been getting them from lowes, they cost about 10 dollars more and don't come with batteries but i don't keep money on shelf and i try to knock out all orders within 24 hours


If you have a Menards in your area all Kwickset locks are on sale. The powerbolt is currently $64.99


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## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> Got an order that would have required one of those neat digital locks the other day. They wanted me to go negotiate the Cash for Keys. Stopped by the house and the home owner informed me I was the 4th contractor they had sent out. His loan wasn't even with the Ocwen. He was really nice and said he understood it wasn't my fault but he would have his attorney call and confirm everything he had told me. Mr Attorney was pretty nice too. About a week later I recieved notice the work order had been canceled. I am guessing they are onto contractor #5 to go bother this guy. I really hope he doesn't run out of patience and start sueing everybody who has been out to do a cash for keys with him.
> 
> Anybody had any luck doing work for cities? We have had several code enforcement people recently contact us about performing abatements for them.





EVERY property inspection w/o I get with them I worry that this is the deal.
I've got one that I need to go do. 

This story does not help my fears in the least little bit. lol


----------



## BPWY

ARPPP said:


> If you have a Menards in your area all Kwickset locks are on sale. The powerbolt is currently $64.99






Not close enough to do me much good.



I do happen to get near one twice a month on the farthest edge of my grass cut route.
Murphy's law says that I'll get a w/o needing one the day after I'm in the area. :laughing:


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## BPWY

Beware of the scammers.


http://chicago.craigslist.org/wcl/lbg/1896387259.html


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## brm1109

*How to handle this?*

Gave a quote for a yard cleanout for a customer to remove brush and downed trees in a backyard. Went last Wed. and got all of the big branches cleared out but when we get to the smaller piles I found out the hard way that there was a bee's nest (stung 3 times). Call and tell the homeowner that they need to have the bees taken care of. 
My office called them on Sat. and they said the bees were being taken care of that day and that we should be able to go back today to finish. So my crew is scheduled and I postpone other jobs but they never called back so I called and left messages.
Finally I reach them this morning to say I am going there and they tell me "oh well the bees might not all be gone so wait to come back". Now the job is half done and I am scheduled with other jobs for the rest of the week and they are mad at me for not being able to go back this week.
I suggested that if they are mad and can't wait then pay me 1/2 of the quote (even though we did remove about 75-80% of the debris and they could get someone else.
How would you handle this?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Thats so cheap as to not even be worth an email telling them thanks but no thanks.
> 
> Whats sad is that they probably found some one to work for that cheap, other wise those prices wouldn't be around long.
> 
> For a $30 wint all I'd do is open the lowest drain point in the house that I saw in the first 5 seconds of looking, drain the water heater if there is a floor drain. SPLASH not pour anti freeze into the drains and roll.
> I wouldn't even bring the air compressor along for that.


 
I see a Wyoming Cowboy saunter into a bathroom in his black duster and Stetson with a double holster on. His steely eyes survey the bathroom then he quick draws his two plastic squirt guns filled with antifreeze and squirts one into the sink while crossing his arms and getting the other one into the tub. Then he spins on the heel of his boot to open up with both barrels on the toilet. After glaring at the survivors he heads to the kitchen to do battle with the combined forces of a sink and dishwasher.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

brm1109 said:


> Gave a quote for a yard cleanout for a customer to remove brush and downed trees in a backyard. Went last Wed. and got all of the big branches cleared out but when we get to the smaller piles I found out the hard way that there was a bee's nest (stung 3 times). Call and tell the homeowner that they need to have the bees taken care of.
> My office called them on Sat. and they said the bees were being taken care of that day and that we should be able to go back today to finish. So my crew is scheduled and I postpone other jobs but they never called back so I called and left messages.
> Finally I reach them this morning to say I am going there and they tell me "oh well the bees might not all be gone so wait to come back". Now the job is half done and I am scheduled with other jobs for the rest of the week and they are mad at me for not being able to go back this week.
> I suggested that if they are mad and can't wait then pay me 1/2 of the quote (even though we did remove about 75-80% of the debris and they could get someone else.
> How would you handle this?


I would most likely try to squeeze them in, even if it meant being a few hours late to another job or, if you're not already working 7 days this week, work the extra day. [If you have a crew that would be on overtime doing it that way, then maybe I wouldn't.]

I might also have had the homeowner ask the exterminator to coordinate with us so we'd know for sure the bees are taken care of. This way I don't have to wait around for a call from the homeowner [who gave me an estimated date] and I can move some of the other work ahead of schedule in case they're not ready for me.

I don't know what your work load looks like so it's really kind of hard to say much more than that. All I know is I try to make the best use of my time, if there is any, to get other stuff done in case the exterminators run behind schedule.

Linda


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## Guest

Hello,

I am new here...... I have been a carpenter all of my life and now I also doing Property Preservation.....I am very disappointed..... I worked for two contractors that are just a scam.... They owe me like 6,000 and now they do not answer my calls or e-mails. In fact one of them is still doing business around some blogs. Anyways, so no payment. All of the homes were from Bank of America and I called them yesterday and they said that there is not much they can do. Does anyone have any suggestions out there. Anything would really help me out. Thanks...


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## BPWY

Liens

and quick. BAC will real quick get concerned about the fact you didn't get paid.


You can try to take the guys to court, but as you've already found out..... making them pay is gonna be tough. Just because you get a judgment against them is no promise of paying.


----------



## mtmtnman

Viking28 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I am new here...... I have been a carpenter all of my life and now I also doing Property Preservation.....I am very disappointed..... I worked for two contractors that are just a scam.... They owe me like 6,000 and now they do not answer my calls or e-mails. In fact one of them is still doing business around some blogs. Anyways, so no payment. All of the homes were from Bank of America and I called them yesterday and they said that there is not much they can do. Does anyone have any suggestions out there. Anything would really help me out. Thanks...



Can you tell us where these companies you where working for are based out of? City & State??


----------



## Guest

*Question*

So I've been reading alot of the posts on hear about how these companies are basically riping off the contractors. My question is are there any good companies to do the property Preservation for? I have noticed on alot of the price sheets I've gotten, that these companies are keeping half of the money or more that hud is paying.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

T&A Maintenance said:


> So I've been reading alot of the posts on hear about how these companies are basically riping off the contractors. My question is are there any good companies to do the property Preservation for? I have noticed on alot of the price sheets I've gotten, that these companies are keeping half of the money or more that hud is paying.


There are only a handful of good ones left to work for. But, as competitive as the industry is these days, other property preservation companies will be reluctant to give up the names of the good ones.

Linda


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## Guest

First of all....I consider your success very motivational....I'm just wondering when was the last time you had to resubmit your company information to ALTISOURCE....for their NEW vendor requirements?


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## APlusPPGroup

exGangster ~

Out of curiosity, why is Altisource having you resubmit your information? 

They don't give us enough work for us to put them in our top 10 and payments can be sketchy. We turn down a lot of their work so I don't know if I would resubmit info or not. But they haven't asked.

Linda


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## BPWY

Recently I was asked for updated insurance info.


Thats it.


----------



## ARPPP

ExGANGSTER said:


> First of all....I consider your success very motivational....I'm just wondering when was the last time you had to resubmit your company information to ALTISOURCE....for their NEW vendor requirements?


 
I received this request from them in regards to CMA and BPO work, not property preservation. I updated my insurance info a couple weeks back for them for property preservation.


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## Guest

*New but not new*

We have been working with a property preservation company for a couple of years now and feel it is time to move ahead on our own. We have been happy with the company we have work for but know that we are ready to do this on our own. We have all our licenses and insurance in place now and are currently seeking good companies to work with. We obviously know of some but would like opinions of others that we could work with. 

Please feel free to send us a pm if that works better for you. I know these questions have been asked before but all opinions and info would be good for the forum. 

Thank you


----------



## Guest

*Property Preservation*

We are also interested in Property Preservation and restoration. Specifically Floor covering removal and concrete floor repair and floor leveling in Southern California.

Working with lenders, insurance companys, etc.


----------



## BPWY

covaltleveling said:


> We are also interested in Property Preservation and restoration. Specifically Floor covering removal and concrete floor repair and floor leveling in Southern California.
> 
> Working with lenders, insurance companys, etc.






I'm not sure that you'll get much of that type of work in the P&P business.
I sure do not see it in my area of operations.

If you can find some investors that are rehabing houses you might.


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## brm1109

*Cheap*

Gotta love these. They are recruiting here in New Jersey. Funny thing is they run this ad every 3 weeks or so.
Probably after the contractor works for a week or two they realized how much money they lost.

need independent contractor to cover entire county. Please respond with what county you van cover in the subject line. Lawns are tp be cut every two weeks with digital photos showing work completed. Pay is $20 for lots up to 100x100 and $25 for up to 100x150. More details upon reply 

Location: BERGEN COUNTY
Compensation: Pay is $20 for lots up to 100x100 and $25 for up to 100x150. More details upon reply
Principals only. Recruiters, please don't contact this job poster.
Please, no phone calls about this job!
Please do not contact job poster about other services, products or commercial interests.


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## Guest

covaltleveling said:


> We are also interested in Property Preservation and restoration. Specifically Floor covering removal and concrete floor repair and floor leveling in Southern California.
> 
> Working with lenders, insurance companys, etc.


We have mudjacked a few homes in the past few years. There is a lot of concrete driveway leveling going on here on foreclosed properties but they are being done through the Realtors ... cheaper than the cost of concrete if its savable. Hint for ya: pull up the listings for all the homes empty in your area and if the driveway needs fixed then tape a sign to the front door
..the buyer's will see and request this completed before closing if not an "as is" sale (even those are negotiable if its a hazard )


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## BPWY

So how'd ya'lls day go?


I got hosed to the tune of $30 for only a level pickup bed of trash. Short bed I might add.

The transfer station I usually go to charges $27 to $54 for my 6' wide x 16' long x4' high trailer.
Depending on the mood that the guy is in on the day I show up to dump.
I'd have gone to them, except they close early and I needed to unload today.

More than likely I'll get held to only 2 yrds so that means I worked ALL DAY for $50 after discounts. Just lovely.


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## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Gotta love these. They are recruiting here in New Jersey. Funny thing is they run this ad every 3 weeks or so.
> Probably after the contractor works for a week or two they realized how much money they lost.
> 
> need independent contractor to cover entire county. Please respond with what county you van cover in the subject line. Lawns are tp be cut every two weeks with digital photos showing work completed. Pay is $20 for lots up to 100x100 and $25 for up to 100x150. More details upon reply
> 
> Location: BERGEN COUNTY
> Compensation: Pay is $20 for lots up to 100x100 and $25 for up to 100x150. More details upon reply
> Principals only. Recruiters, please don't contact this job poster.
> Please, no phone calls about this job!
> Please do not contact job poster about other services, products or commercial interests.


 
There are usually multiple ads like that here. I just can't see it. How some of these people get people with the qualifications some of them require is beyond me.


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## Guest

boman47k said:


> There are usually multiple ads like that here. I just can't see it. How some of these people get people with the qualifications some of them require is beyond me.


They do not get people with the qualifications or requirements needed; they lie and make everyone look bad. Need to weed (LOL) these groups out. We have responded to these ads in our area and as soon as we ask any questions about requirements we hear crickets. Go figure.


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## Guest

ImperialPS said:


> They do not get people with the qualifications or requirements needed; they lie and make everyone look bad. Need to weed (LOL) these groups out. We have responded to these ads in our area and as soon as we ask any questions about requirements we hear crickets. Go figure.


That is what I expect in regard to most of them.


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## Guest

*FAS and their BS*

Question for all doing REO. What has your response been lately with FAS as far as getting the corridnators to get back to you in a timely manner while your on site. Now that most work orders require you to call for approval before you can proceed with work. IE tall grass, excess trash, cars,...

It seems when I call to get a bid approved no one is there to take the call. What makes it so bad is that once out in the field if I don't get an answer I just wasted a trip without any pay. 

How many others have been having this problem?


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## Guest

So you have to get approval by phone and hopever approves the bid


> remembers


 approval? Looks like an approval via email would be more reliable. This would mean internet access in the field though. But, don't most require you to have a laptop and internet access in the field? That may be bs too. From the way it sounds, some may be using people who would not have a laptop and access.


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## Guest

ALWAYS get it in writing. Peoples memories are only as good as they want them to be. I had a rep. tell me to do something when I was at a property doing other work. A month later they decided they didn't want to pay for the service even thought their rep agreed to the fee and instructed me to proceed. I approached the Rep about it and she FLAT OUT LIED..... saying she never said or agreed to any such thing. Thankfully it was only a small job. 

After that, I told them everything would be in writing. They did not like that at all. 

If they don't want to put it in writing prior to you moving forward with the approved work, DON'T do it, period.


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## Guest

I'm not sure how this works with out of town companies as far as getting work orders in writing. They have local reps that you have to make a trip to in order to get written approvls, then have to wait for your money?

Years ago when my son was much younger, he did some grass cutting for some company out of town (I think) . He had to take before and after pics of the yards with a Polaroid. I am not sure if he mailed them before getting paid or how it worked. This was way before the onslaught of property management companies.


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## Guest

boman47k,

Get them to email the approval / authorization to you. If you can receive emails on your phone, that's all the better.

I've actually had some reps change their answer when asked to provide approval in writing or when you ask how to spell their name, what their supervisors name is and would they patch me thru to them.


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## Guest

I don't do pp. I do wonder about it sometimes, but I just don't see how it could work not being in a concentrated area. I mean like having to go to one side of the county for a small job then going to the other side for another small job. Then having to deal with other issues mentioned.

It does sound like the type work I would like to do, but it just seems like the possibilty for headaches is abnormally high.


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## Guest

Is anyone using a software program geared towards property preservation? I have not been able to find anything specific... property management, REO, etc...but nothing specifically for our industry. As the company grows, I am in more in need of staying on top of specific work orders, vendors, photos, issues, bids, etc...
Any suggestions??
Thanks, all!


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## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> ALWAYS get it in writing. Peoples memories are only as good as they want them to be. I had a rep. tell me to do something when I was at a property doing other work. A month later they decided they didn't want to pay for the service even thought their rep agreed to the fee and instructed me to proceed. I approached the Rep about it and she FLAT OUT LIED..... saying she never said or agreed to any such thing. Thankfully it was only a small job.
> 
> After that, I told them everything would be in writing. They did not like that at all.
> 
> If they don't want to put it in writing prior to you moving forward with the approved work, DON'T do it, period.


Been there done that. Now everything that is bid is confirmed via email, verbals aren't worth spit. The Reps will screw you time and time again if they can. Look at it this way, they sell a contract to the banks for "X" dollars and they only have so much to spend so if they don't have to pay you for the extra work they can pocket the savings. Problem is the work needs to be done but they don't want to pay anymore than they have to.



choicefieldserv said:


> Is anyone using a software program geared towards property preservation? I have not been able to find anything specific... property management, REO, etc...but nothing specifically for our industry. As the company grows, I am in more in need of staying on top of specific work orders, vendors, photos, issues, bids, etc...
> Any suggestions??
> Thanks, all!


Yes. FAS uses a system that works via smart phone or laptop. The software is proprietary to the company. The kicker is if you don't step up and use it you get kicked down on the preferred vendor list. That's BS.


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## BPWY

Every thing about FAS is BS.

Didn't take me more than a couple weeks to figure that out. When they couldn't pay any thing in 2.5 months and didn't have any thing more than excuses and BS to offer as to why I cut them off real fast.


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## brm1109

*My difficult customer continued*

If you remember I wrote last week about the job I was only able to finish half of because of the bee nests that caused me to get stung. I offered to accept half payment because they cancelled the return visit.
Well, I called and left messages that I had an opening where we could go and finish the job. I called on Tuesday and said the opening was for Thurs. Never got a return call so booked 2 jobs for Thurs. 
The owner calls me on Thursday morning asking what time I will be there so I explained that they never called me back to confirm and then they get mad at me.
So now I tell her I will schedule it for this MOnday. She tells me that she needs to check with her husband and will call me back. Guess what we are at Sunday morning and I am putting off scheduling a job for tomorrow till I hear from her. I am really getting ticked off.
Normally I wouldn't be like this but I think I am just going to tell them to pay me for 1/2 the job and move on?


----------



## JenkinsHB

choicefieldserv said:


> Is anyone using a software program geared towards property preservation? I have not been able to find anything specific... property management, REO, etc...but nothing specifically for our industry. As the company grows, I am in more in need of staying on top of specific work orders, vendors, photos, issues, bids, etc...
> Any suggestions??
> Thanks, all!


www.eastpointsystems.com

Field-Comm


----------



## Guest

*Industry Specific Software*

Yes. FAS uses a system that works via smart phone or laptop. The software is proprietary to the company. The kicker is if you don't step up and use it you get kicked down on the preferred vendor list. That's BS. 

FAS have a very good computer program but I still don't use a smart phone or report from the job site. I hope that I'm not being pushed down the ladder of job offerings.

*Although I have been in the residential building business for many many, years I am relatively new to property preservation work. During the last 30 years I have developed land, built a bunch of houses, was a managing partner in a 300 space mobile home park, and still own a few rental and owner financed properties. At the end of last year I studied and read as much information as I could find pertaining to HUD requirements and how it all works with the big nationals. I'm not a spring chicken and really haven't been doing much for the last four years but decided to go ahead with doing some pp work. I have lots of equipment and all I really had to do was purchase about $2500. worth of insurance to get started with two of the big boys. I started with both about five months ago here in the Myrtle Beach, SC area and to date, I haven't been given much work. I did only one initial secure about two months ago and I have outstanding bids to remove debris and personals from the interior but they haven't awarded those yet. I did receive the bid to clean up the landscape and I have mowed a few times. I have handled a couple of repairs in tenant occupied properties but no real money makers. A few hours here and there would some it up. Both companies have told me that I'm getting all the work they have in my area. The territory I listed keeps me within a half an hour or so from my home base. It's really not practical to travel much more to mow a lawn. I am financially secure and the long wait to be paid is no big deal but lately I have asked myself. "how much will it cost me to work here". I'm completely competent, trustworthy, reliable and have an outstanding reputation here in my area. About all I've been doing in the last several years has been buying, repairing and reselling a few properties each year and thought by doing pp work, I might add some cash flow and find some good buying leads. Even that hasn't worked out. My only thought now is to prepare an introduction letter and get it to the hundreds of real estate companies in my area and send it to the REO departments of some lenders. Over the last few days I have read most of the seventy something pages in this thread and I'm looking for ideas and suggestions that would help to get me moving. I will thank you in advance for any help you might pass my way and thank those who have already contributed to this thread. *


----------



## BPWY

Mayolives welcome to the site.


As you are already learning its a very strong upstream battle in this biz.

Here are a few rules to keep in mind with the nationals.

1. They lie.... a lot. More than likely they ARE NOT giving you all of their work in the area.
As a new vendor they give you enough to keep you around until hopefully one of their other vendors above you screws up and they'll be able to already have you trained.

2. There is no loyalty among the nationals.... none what so ever.
The health of your business is the least of their concern. If you do or don't make enough money to survive and grow they couldn't possibly care less. If you screw up or if you don't they will use any and all excuses to give charge backs. If you stay with them or go away for lack of work and pay..... they couldn't possibly care less. There are a long list of FNGs waiting in the wings to pick up where you left off.

3. They are incompetent. As time goes on you'll learn what this means. Insanity will achieve a whole new level. Both with the nationals and with the banks. The ability to read and comprehend work order notes IS NOT a requirement for those that work at either place.
You'll get email requests for confirmation or explanation of some thing or another. When if they would have read the work order notes they would not have wasted your time or theirs.

Any questions???????? Please refer to the previous 3 bullet points.



GOOD LUCK.


----------



## Guest

*FAS Response Time*



Hardly Working said:


> Question for all doing REO. What has your response been lately with FAS as far as getting the corridnators to get back to you in a timely manner while your on site. Now that most work orders require you to call for approval before you can proceed with work. IE tall grass, excess trash, cars,...
> 
> It seems when I call to get a bid approved no one is there to take the call. What makes it so bad is that once out in the field if I don't get an answer I just wasted a trip without any pay.
> 
> How many others have been having this problem?


Perhaps they are playing nice with me because I've only been with them about six months. I've had almost instant response when I needed approval on the spot. Keep in mind that most of the work I've completed for them thus far has been on tenant occupied properties. Two of the jobs were labeled "emergency" because they involved repairing the air conditioning system when outside temperatures were in the nineties. One of them was on a Sunday evening and I was told by the supervisor that small children were in the house with the parents and that it really needed to be handled ASAP. Maybe the new FAS supervisors who still care are stuck with working at their desks on Sunday evenings. With the exception of receiving very little work and finding it difficult to talk with someone when I first call and having to leave messages, I have no problems with FAS. Keep in mind that when I needed approval from the job site, I received fast communications from them. At least I know that it can only go down hill from here.


----------



## Guest

*photo fee*

When can i charge this fee? Anytime im not securing or lock change?


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## BPWY

Only a few of the nationals accept this fee.

Five Brothers is the only one that I work with that allows you to charge this on the initial services visit.


----------



## Guest

...


----------



## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> That had to be the most unprofessional post I have seen in a long time. Gives this site more of a teenage chatroom feel, and look it got a recommend. You have a business, as a contract worker your entitled to say no I can not do that. You have the oppurtinity to work for a middleman or shoot to work without the middle man, in no way, any type of shape or size of anykind think that your an employee and the business that gives you orders is a non-profit organization.
> 
> There is no reason for anyone you work for to tell you how to run your business nor should they look for advice from you.





Congrats to you if in your journeys you have not had the misfortune of dealing with the likes of FAS, SHS, and the list goes on.

Had you dealt with these companies you would know that what I posted was 100% true.

You are entitled to your opinion of unprofessionalism. I how ever disagree. 
Other wise I wouldn't have posted it.

As an independent contractor start turning down work and see how much your work load gets cut. 

Your #2 point......... its obvious you've not signed contracts with nationals.
Either that or you didn't read them. Their contracts ARE FULL of all the ways they want the work done. It may depend on your view of such things but in my book that is telling you the independent contractor how to run your business. How many vendor questionnaires ask if you are willing to work on sundays??? Give you due dates for all your work? Even HUD gets in on the telling independent contractors on how they'll do their work.
Cut the grass at 2'', what material and how many bolts to use to board the windows and you can't use OSB board etc etc etc.
This isn't a debate on products for boarding.





I'm not going to claim that I'm sorry if my incredibly brutal truth of the current state of the industry offends you.

Another truth about the whole mess that might offend is that if the American voter knew the half of the insanity the banks perpetuate on a daily basis they'd be even far more pissed off about the bank bail outs than what they are.


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## brm1109

*Lesson Learned*

Was doing grass cuts for a national for the last several months. All of a sudden the recut orders didn't show up. Well after researching I come to find out that they took all of my cuts and reassigned them to someone who underbid me.
I understand that people have lower bids but I didn't think they would do it in the middle of the season. Especially without even telling me. If I didn't make several calls to find out I would just have been left in limbo.


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## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> Was doing grass cuts for a national for the last several months. All of a sudden the recut orders didn't show up. Well after researching I come to find out that they took all of my cuts and reassigned them to someone who underbid me.
> I understand that people have lower bids but I didn't think they would do it in the middle of the season. Especially without even telling me. If I didn't make several calls to find out I would just have been left in limbo.





Hey Idaho, Remember what my #2 point was?????????
Seems like I was right.





> 2. There is no loyalty among the nationals.... none what so ever.
> The health of your business is the least of their concern. If you do or don't make enough money to survive and grow they couldn't possibly care less. If you screw up or if you don't they will use any and all excuses to give charge backs. If you stay with them or go away for lack of work and pay..... they couldn't possibly care less. There are a long list of FNGs waiting in the wings to pick up where you left off.


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## Guest

...


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## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> And yes I still look at your 1...2...3... post and laugh I also think if any post could be posted in crayon text yours would of been.





Opinions are like...... we've all got one.



I'm glad I could make your day.


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## mtmtnman

Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids,Bids, Bids............................ An no approvals from 4 nationals i do business with. Tired of wasting my time! Been trip charging about 40 lawns all summer for on bank. Guess what?? The grass is over 4' tall on these properties and nothing is being done! Cannot get any local restoration co.s to bid jobs anymore as they are not getting any work for all there effort. Have one national that is nice enough to pay a $150 bid fee so this is the only one i am getting outside bids for anymore. This whole business has gone to hell in a handbasket. And FWIW BPWY is 110% correct i nthis statement:

*Here are a few rules to keep in mind with the nationals.

1. They lie.... 

2. There is no loyalty among the nationals.... 

3. They are incompetent."* 

And i will add their only goal is to line there pockets. They have no real interest in these properties. I had one bitch me out a few weeks ago as i trip charged a grass cut as limited growth. It was under 2"!! They said i need to go back and "scalp" it!! I do not treat my equipment this way and told them no!! Funny work has dropped of from this company now.............


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## brm1109

I don't want people to get the wrong idea. I do understand the bidding process and if I was underbid then so be it. What my biggest gripe is, is that this happened after I have already been doing the cuts and that they didn't even have the courtesy to tell me they reassigned them. I had to do all the work to find this out.


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## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> I don't want people to get the wrong idea. I do understand the bidding process and if I was underbid then so be it. What my biggest gripe is, is that this happened after I have already been doing the cuts and that they didn't even have the courtesy to tell me they reassigned them. I had to do all the work to find this out.



That's EXACTLY how the nationals operate. They never give you a chance to match another vendors price. There getting what they pay for though. A while back 1stAm cut inspections out here to $6. Since this time i have tripled my rate of occupied homes on initial secures. A full 75% of the initial secure work orders i now get are occupied............


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## BPWY

Is there an exit ramp around here close by????


Here is another reason to exit P&P.



Screwguard just got me. I have completed a few jobs here and there for them as a one time vendor deal. They never added me as a full time vendor. What I did for them was small potatoes.
Today I get an email of a $950 charge back. Funny thing is the original w/o amount was for $745.
They are claiming that supplied photos don't prove the work was done.

I asked them politely to immediately remove me from their vendor list. BPS doesn't work for free and we don't work for companies that take advantage of their contractors.


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## oteroproperties

you know I really feel much better about my business & the work I do when I'm not reading these posts. Take it how you want, but it seems like there's nothing but negativity in the preservation forums anymore. I know the industry is not what it once was, but jesus!!!! Adapt & overcome people!!!!! If not then gracefully bow out.


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## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> you know I really feel much better about my business & the work I do when I'm not reading these posts. Take it how you want, but it seems like there's nothing but negativity in the preservation forums anymore. I know the industry is not what it once was, but jesus!!!! Adapt & overcome people!!!!! If not then gracefully bow out.





Congrats to you if in your journeys you have not had the misfortune of dealing with some of these companies.


Count your blessings every morning when you get up. 

I can tell you that getting knocked down over and over and over wears a guy out.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> you know I really feel much better about my business & the work I do when I'm not reading these posts. Take it how you want, but it seems like there's nothing but negativity in the preservation forums anymore. I know the industry is not what it once was, but jesus!!!! Adapt & overcome people!!!!! If not then gracefully bow out.


Otero, If people are doing ok they generally do not go looking for forums on the internet. I have been a member of a truck forum for over 10 years and 90% of the posts are negative or having problems and need answers. The rest is just general banter.


About my bidding rant, One guy i ran into said "so what, keep bidding and collect a trip charge" That's all fine and good if you don't think as a taxpayer. The waste of $$$$$ it what makes me extremely sick and more so the closer April 15th rolls around. The trip charge rarely covers gas and wear & tear here anyways as i average 30+ miles one way to properties. Then they pull stupid crap like mowing 5 acres clear up in the mountains around 5000 feet elevation with no neighbors for miles that has NEVER been mowed since the world was created and leave properties on the main drag through town 4 feet tall! Some people overlook this stupidity but i cannot as i write a check every year that pays for this garbage and Uncle Sugar hands the $$$ over to the banks! If you had your house listed for $149,000 and you got a CASH offer for $144,000 with NO CONTINGENCIES would you sell?? Fannie Mae don't. They sell it 2 weeks later at auction for $126,000 instead. This is whats frustrating in this business and like BPWY said, if the average Joe public saw the exorbitant waste of their tax dollars there would sure as heck be a revolt. There is no such thing as Adapt and overcome if you have a conscious. 

I will tell you one thing, It's WHEN you get screwed by these national not IF. I have gotten to the point of taking 4-500 photos of a 40 yard trashout after being back charged numerous times saying my photos, (usually around 150-200) do not justify the cubic yardage removed. Unfortunately i cannot even provide dump receipts as many of our dumps are free. I think they get so sick of looking over my photos that they just approve the job. I have seen a dozen contractors come and go in my area the last year. No newbies last over a few months after they figure out how much $$$ they have layed out or been screwed out of. Some people have great luck but the majority of people in this biz i talk to are having WAAAY for issues than ever before.......


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## Guest

choicefieldserv said:


> Is anyone using a software program geared towards property preservation? I have not been able to find anything specific... property management, REO, etc...but nothing specifically for our industry. As the company grows, I am in more in need of staying on top of specific work orders, vendors, photos, issues, bids, etc...
> Any suggestions??
> Thanks, all!


Try looking up. 

EastPoint Systems

bcconnect.com

ezInspections.com

Let me know if you need some additional companies


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Some people overlook this stupidity but i cannot as i write a check every year that pays for this garbage and Uncle Sugar hands the $$$ over to the banks! If you had your house listed for $149,000 and you got a CASH offer for $144,000 with NO CONTINGENCIES would you sell?? Fannie Mae don't. They sell it 2 weeks later at auction for $126,000 instead. This is whats frustrating in this business and like BPWY said, if the average Joe public saw the exorbitant waste of their tax dollars there would sure as heck be a revolt. There is no such thing as Adapt and overcome if you have a conscious.





Recently a local agent told me about a property that I attended the public auction for 10 months previous the bank had a solid offer for $92,000. Bank was asking $95,000 and wouldn't budge a penny.
Fast forward 10 months at the auction I was at...... they sell it for $11,000 cash to the only bidder.

Its maddening as a tax payer to see this.


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## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> Congrats to you if in your journeys you have not had the misfortune of dealing with some of these companies.
> 
> 
> Count your blessings every morning when you get up.
> 
> I can tell you that getting knocked down over and over and over wears a guy out.


trust me I feel your pain when speaking on getting knocked down. I do on a daily basis deal with nationals. But I've found the bigger they are the easier it is to get paid. At the end of the day that's all I care about. As far as unfair backcharges? I've never got hit with one (going) on 5yrs with national clients) that's not to say it won't happen, but the fact that it has not yet in my opinion speaks to the way I run my business.

I will say this for you guys out there in the rural areas, you probably get screwed the most. Such long trips for such little money has got to wear you down after a while.


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman, I agree to a certain extent your point on why people seek out forums, but that's not why I did.

I guess for me I want to believe that I get paid & not backcharged because of the balance of quality & responsiveness. Albeit, I have fallen victim to new, or lower charging contractors. From june of 09 to june of 10 I was bumped from my primary position in my region by a national. A million excuses were given but the bottom line was that they were responding faster then me. So I decided to start a quality campaign. It was to my advantage that the new vendors grass recuts were getting signed to my grass code. I had an opportunity to veiw their work. I took photos, sent them with tighty files including loan numbers & addresses. Didn't take long to get back where I should have been all along. I decided not to lay down & take it, & I assure you if ever an unfair backcharge or blaten non payment happens to me. The work I completed WILL be reversed no matter what the cost to me. It's happened before & it only took them once to realize that I will do it.


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## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> As far as unfair backcharges? I've never got hit with one (going) on 5yrs with national clients) that's not to say it won't happen, but the fact that it has not yet in my opinion speaks to the way I run my business.





I know we'd all like to think we are superior business people. I doubt that has as much to do with it as your number hasn't been punched yet.
With the debris removal I did that I just got back charged with.... I didn't do any thing different than any of the others I do. I took all the before/after, 4 shots of the heavily loaded trailer and submitted dump receipts.
There was nothing wrong with what I did.

Its just that my number got punched.


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## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> mtmtnman, I agree to a certain extent your point on why people seek out forums, but that's not why I did.
> 
> I guess for me I want to believe that I get paid & not backcharged because of the balance of quality & responsiveness. Albeit, I have fallen victim to new, or lower charging contractors. From june of 09 to june of 10 I was bumped from my primary position in my region by a national. A million excuses were given but the bottom line was that they were responding faster then me. So I decided to start a quality campaign. It was to my advantage that the new vendors grass recuts were getting signed to my grass code. I had an opportunity to veiw their work. I took photos, sent them with tighty files including loan numbers & addresses. Didn't take long to get back where I should have been all along. I decided not to lay down & take it, & I assure you if ever an unfair backcharge or blaten non payment happens to me. The work I completed WILL be reversed no matter what the cost to me. It's happened before & it only took them once to realize that I will do it.







Congrats to you if you were able to get back at the other vendor.

None of the ones I work with do that. I've tried!!


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## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> Congrats to you if you were able to get back at the other vendor.
> 
> None of the ones I work with do that. I've tried!!


Let me be clear, my intention was never to "get back" at anyone. My intention which I accomplished, was to get back were I belonged. That's all. I appreciate what all contractors deal with and would share my work with anyone who needed it. I am very good friends with the veterans in the field where I am and would never intentionally hurt them or take their work. I'm not greedy. 

It's no secret that the majority of the posters on this forum are not fans of nationals. For me I worked for realtors long before nationals and there was NEVER a time where I didn't have to threaten one of them to get my money. On the flip side, since the day I started working for nationals I have never been shorted a dime. I have since booked some good paying realtors, but I still prefer nationals. It's just my personal experience. Don't get me wrong, I've been hit for some dumb things but they can all be laid at my feet so I can't complain. 

As far as my ticket being punched, of course I would like to believe that it will never happen, but rather then worring about it and assuring everybody I come in contact with that its gonna happen, I would rather spend my time being thankfull for the fact that it has not yet. Either way I have a solid plan for *if* (im an optimist what can I say) it happens to me.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> Let me be clear, my intention was never to "get back" at anyone. My intention which I accomplished, was to get back were I belonged. That's all. I appreciate what all contractors deal with and would share my work with anyone who needed it. I am very good friends with the veterans in the field where I am and would never intentionally hurt them or take their work. I'm not greedy.
> 
> It's no secret that the majority of the posters on this forum are not fans of nationals. For me I worked for realtors long before nationals and there was NEVER a time where I didn't have to threaten one of them to get my money. On the flip side, since the day I started working for nationals I have never been shorted a dime. I have since booked some good paying realtors, but I still prefer nationals. It's just my personal experience. Don't get me wrong, I've been hit for some dumb things but they can all be laid at my feet so I can't complain.
> 
> As far as my ticket being punched, of course I would like to believe that it will never happen, but rather then worring about it and assuring everybody I come in contact with that its gonna happen, I would rather spend my time being thankfull for the fact that it has not yet. Either way I have a solid plan for *if* (im an optimist what can I say) it happens to me.


You have had to threaten a Realtor or broker to get paid? That really blows me away. I have brokers asking me for invoices days after i complete the work so they can pay up. Sometimes i am weeks behind in invoicing. My brokers are some of my best customers. Maybe it's because i am in a small community. 50,000 in my valley between 4 towns..............


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## oteroproperties

I know, I get the same reaction every time I tell people this, but it's true. I had about 4 brokers with coldwell, & 2 independent brokers that I really had to fight with to get my money on time. I fought for 7 months for $470 one time. Pissed me off because all my terms are net 30. They should have had more then enough time. Nationals on the other hand I average 3 weeks. Go figure.....


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## BPWY

So far I haven't been able to get much broker work.

But the one job I did, $900 clean out was paid in less than 7 days.

That is odd.


On the other hand about 10 yrs ago with a different business name I had to send an agent's bill to collection service because she wouldn't pay for some thing at the apartments she owned.
So yeah I can see where it could happen with P&P.


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## oteroproperties

yeah, most of my broker woes were about 6 or 7 years ago. The coldwell guys I started doing work for again a year ago & not 4 jobs in they started the same bulls__t so I dropped them again. It was funny too because the "new" office manager was supposed to be superior @ billing & "its not going to be a problem"........i should have known better. Oh well. I got a couple of really good ones now & haven't had a problem since. I would definitely like more, but I guess all the brokers in the area already have their guys. Anyway I'm right where I wanna be volume wise now so I guess it really wouldn't matter. I am a much smaller operation now then I was last year. We were doing about 150 initials, 600 grass cuts, & about 50 bid approvals per month. Now? Maybe 30 initials, 350 cuts, & 15 bid approvals ( this number appears to be rising now) I have 5 less guys now & I leased out the other side of my shop to an appliance guy. the most important thing in this business is the ability to adapt. My wife makes very good money & carries our families health insurance, I pay myself a modest check every week & that check could be covered with 1/3 of the business I currenty do. As work slows I cover larger areas, & adjust my equipment holdings accordingly as I typically buy broken equipment & repair it it always sells for more then I paid for it.......i love craigslist.......well for everything but those awesome P&P companies that have all the work & money in the world!!!!!


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## Guest

*Ocwen digital deadbolts*

quick question since these are so expensive, how often do you guys find you get your deadbolts back?


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## mtmtnman

Hey Otero, Are you windrowing your grass and taking photos of the windrows for Safeguard? An acquaintance ran into a Safeguard contractor the other day and this is what he was doing. He says Safeguard requires this on all lawn cuts now to prove clippings where removed. Since you cut a lot of lawns for them i though you could shine some light on this.


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## mtmtnman

Can anyone work for these rates and pull a profit? This is what this industry is coming to...........


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## mtmtnman

Let's talk about chargebacks........

Charge backs were first implemented as a way for the banks to have a check and balance system with the management companies. The completed work orders were scrutinized by the banks vendor manager and approved for payment or “Charged back” with an additional fee to have the work order corrected. This was done in the first thirty days and the management company would either get paid or be charged back for each work order. This was a good system as the management company had to critique their work orders more carefully before they sent them in and if they found errors they could send the contractor back to the property to correct the work order so he could be paid. This system worked for years. It meant a contractor had the opportunity to ascertain he would get paid correctly for each and every work order he completed. *Then along came the spin off management companies and they began to see this was a golden opportunity. Now, they had a way to make even more money and with each generation of these spin off companies they became more desperate to raise that bottom dollar figure for their company. They began to use this as a way to cheat the contractors six to ten months after they had completed the work orders and had already been paid. Some of these companies used this tactic as a way to punish contractors who dropped them.*
*It got better as time went on, as they started playing the absent picture game. I know everyone knows that game. There is no photo of the new knob lock or the winterization photos are not all there and so on.*
*Then it evolved into a slush fund to make up any deficit for the company. Hence a year later a contractor may be waiting for thousands of dollars owed for recent work orders he completed and not get paid due to “Charge Backs”. (I like to refer to them as kick backs, but that is my own personal sense of humor) Now the contractors never know when that boom is going to be lowered and they pray every month it will not.*
How could they get away with this? Simple, once a contractor got paid he usually deleted all the photos. That is why it is imperative to save every single photo from every single property and put them on a disk and label that disk with the property address, them archive it with the printed out work order. If you get a charge back you have absolute proof of what you did at that property. I have resent photos up to a dozen times, and I got paid when they figured out I kept every single photo of every single property.
*One company even told me I could not keep photos it was against their company policy. I told them “”It is OUR company policy to keep copies of all documentation for seven years because we never know when we may have to go to court”. Boy, does it hurt when they slam that phone in your ear! Irregardless I got paid.

http://cubicyard.us/pnews/featured-stories/lets-talk-about-charge-backs/8094/
*


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## Guest

Sounds like your new to the buisness. Seperating trash is a good idea, but when you have crews and 15-20 trashouts a week, that is virtually impossible>easy for the guy that has a light workload.


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> Hey Otero, Are you windrowing your grass and taking photos of the windrows for Safeguard? An acquaintance ran into a Safeguard contractor the other day and this is what he was doing. He says Safeguard requires this on all lawn cuts now to prove clippings where removed. Since you cut a lot of lawns for them i though you could shine some light on this.


I've never heard of that. It is policy to remove grass clippings, but photos have never been requested from me for it. Maybe it's new for the grass vendors they recently hired.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I've never heard of that. It is policy to remove grass clippings, but photos have never been requested from me for it. Maybe it's new for the grass vendors they recently hired.




I mulch everything into the ground if at all possible. No way in heck i would remove clippings for the price most of these companies want to pay..........


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## brm1109

Got a call yesterday from a company that I sent an e-mail to for pp work. The conversation lasted all of 3 minutes when I said it a more diplomatic way to take a hike.
$20.00 for grass cuts, $35 for full winterizations.
The best was $10.00 per yard for trash removal (but they do pay for the disposal).
Lets see how long they stay in business with the quality work that will be done.


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## brm1109

*ASE Property Preservation*

Hello all,
I was wondering if anyone has any info on this company. They contacted me today about signing up with them.
Thanks.


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## Guest

I do not know this company or have known anyone that works with this company, but what i look for is to work with a company that looks professional. With the counter on the main page of the web site I personally would stay away, thatdoesnt mean that there not a profession company that would pay there bills.

Have you tried doing a web search for reo brokers inyour area? and if you can comeup with a list be creative, i am not suggesting on being cheap. But be creative and how you can get them to work with you......


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## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Was doing grass cuts for a national for the last several months. All of a sudden the recut orders didn't show up. Well after researching I come to find out that they took all of my cuts and reassigned them to someone who underbid me.
> I understand that people have lower bids but I didn't think they would do it in the middle of the season. Especially without even telling me. If I didn't make several calls to find out I would just have been left in limbo.


 
This sounds like something that Safeguard would do!!!!!


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## BPWY

I was talking with a local fannie realtor agent today.

lol 


She didn't have any thing good to say about screwguard.

Its a crying shame that they have the reputation they do. With a little effort they could be much better.
As big as they are and as much work as they have there is no reason to be so greedy and trying to screw over every contractor they can find. They would save more than they are making by taking care of the contractors. 
They'd be able to lay off probably half of the recruiting team if they took care of the contractors.

Classic example of penny wise, 5 tons stupid.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I was talking with a local fannie realtor agent today.
> 
> lol
> 
> 
> She didn't have any thing good to say about screwguard.
> 
> Its a crying shame that they have the reputation they do. With a little effort they could be much better.
> As big as they are and as much work as they have there is no reason to be so greedy and trying to screw over every contractor they can find. They would save more than they are making by taking care of the contractors.
> They'd be able to lay off probably half of the recruiting team if they took care of the contractors.
> 
> Classic example of penny wise, 5 tons stupid.


I have been in business for about 9 months now here in NNJ, I started out with Safeguard and then Altisource, I am currently still running with both of them, I am looking to expand now, I have not been screwed by either one but I want more, Any advice? Feel free to email me privately [email protected]


Claude
Environmental Resources


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## APlusPPGroup

IdahoProperty said:


> With the counter on the main page of the web site I personally would stay away, thatdoesnt mean that there not a profession company that would pay there bills.


Just out of curiousity, how does a counter on the main page of a website make a business look unprofessional? 

I'm really confused by your post.

Linda


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## Guest

...


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## mtmtnman

I can hear the attorneys gearing up for this! Got this from a company i do some business with.

We recently received clarification from HUD that a sale date is NOT needed in order to change all locks on a property. 

Currently your work orders advise to change only a secondary lock on an Initial Secure, and change all remaining locks on the Final. Effective immediately, we will be changing all locks on an Initial Secure. This DOES NOT include properties with special circumstances such as being for sale, etc. 

I sent this letter:

"My attorney is advising against this policy for my protection unless the house and outbuildings are TOTALLY empty of personals... He states it is illegal to lock a homeowner out of a home pre-sale and will open me up to litigation but advises changing 1 lock and leaving the homeowner access through other entries is fine. Can you provide documentation from HUD on this so my attorney can review it???"


Think i'll get a reply or will they just give the work to a contractor that doesn't pay attention or pay an attorney??


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## BPWY

This is what they told me.




> This is how we have been advised to proceed by HUD, this was not a _____________ decision. In addition, as stated in the letter, this does not apply to homes that are for sale and obviously not to occupied homes, but homes that appear to have been abandoned (vacant). The bank needs to protect their interest in the asset. Please let me know if you have any further questions/concerns. Thank you.




I too want to see documentation from HUD.


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## Guest

Would it not be wise to get your own documentation from HUD?


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## BPWY

I've asked for it.

So far nothing.


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## Guest

*help*

Hello, My name is Gary and Im new to this site and to the property preservation field. 
I previously worked with safeguard and no longer use them due to the cost of doing business with them.
My question is how and who do I contact to land more clients. An aquaintence of mine recommended safeguard and they were fine for awhile, but after 6-8 months I decided we could no longer do business. Any help would be greatly appeciated. also does any one know what ppr stands for in the field. Thanks Gary [email protected]


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## mtmtnman

Here's a few pics for y'all thinking about getting in this business. Just when you think you saw it all. I inspected this place for 14 months and it was always occupied. Neighbors said he moved back to Jersey a few months ago. He had 5 dogs and from the looks they where always kept inside.


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## mtmtnman




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## Guest

Call an odor control specialist


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Call an odor control specialist



I think a match and a can of gas would be more efficient. The dog piss smell was so strong it burned my eyes.


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Here's a few pics for y'all thinking about getting in this business. Just when you think you saw it all. I inspected this place for 14 months and it was always occupied. Neighbors said he moved back to Jersey a few months ago. He had 5 dogs and from the looks they where always kept inside.


Try this stuff: http://www.scoe10x.com/Scripts/SCOE10X-Odor-Eliminator.asp


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## Guest

*anyone have the same problem last week with Safeguard?*

Safeguard sends out checks to contractors on a weekly basis. Last week we never received the usual email from accounting outlining the upcoming check. Then came Friday and Saturday and we never received Safeguard's check. I have been emailing Safeguard's accounting department, my regional, vendor management, etc. since Wednesday of last week about this and have yet to get a response from them to my various emails. Did anyone else have a similar problem last week getting paid? I have never had any issues with payment with Safeguard, however, their lack of response is turning me off about them. How can so many emails go unresponded to? This is extremely unprofessional. Again, I've had no problems with them to date, but this issue last week and no response to my emails are not sitting well with me at all. All the while I am still receiving work orders from them so aparently I am still active in their system. If they think I will continue to work for them with no response as to the missed payment they have something coming to them. Please advise if anyone had a similar issue last week. Thanks for your time.


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## APlusPPGroup

Floridian ~

Is it possible Safeguard paid ahead on a few invoices and no check was due yet? That was usually the case when they missed one with us.

Linda


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## BPWY

Go to ripoff report and type in screwguard ....... I'm sorry about the typo, I meant Safeguard.

You'll be amazed at the horrible reputation they have.


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## APlusPPGroup

No one should be amazed at their reputation by now. There are a handful of people I've seen post in the positive and I hope they always can. I Would never wish on another vendor what we went through!

We had a couple of write-offs [one was my partner's fault for not providing enough photos and I can't remember the other one] but no major problems with all other payments and received everything right through to the last invoice being paid in full. 

They tried to pull the bogus chargeback stuff on us but it was after we were paid so there was nothing to take anything from.

My biggest problem with Safeguard was the attitude of the coordinators and the lack of follow-through on their promises. 

Linda


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## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> No one should be amazed at their reputation by now.
> 
> They tried to pull the bogus chargeback stuff on us but it was after we were paid so there was nothing to take anything from.
> Linda




Very true, their reputation precedes them.


Thats actually really funny.
How bad did they fight you on trying to get you to return the money?? 
I kinda need to know.


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Thats actually really funny.
> How bad did they fight you on trying to get you to return the money??
> I kinda need to know.


They didn't fight me at all. I just sent a reply to the the person who sent the e-mail letting them know that we'd been paid in full and no longer accepted work from them. 

Linda


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## Guest

Auditing invoices is a 2 way street but the service companies don't believe that the contractors actually pay attention... :whistling

We discovered on our monthly audits that we did not charge for 3 properties that were multi-unit complexes for "extra unit" maid services....
We sent a "chargeback" to the service company and fell over when we actually got a check for the "shorted amount". In a million years I wouldn't have believed it!
Sometimes it pays to bill the service company if "you" made a mistake.

My thinking is that Winterize season is "just around the corner" if not started already and these Service Companies are short "qualified" help and they don't want to upset anyone........yet.


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## APlusPPGroup

It's not that unusual, Fremont. There are still some good companies out there, thank goodness.:thumbup:

Linda


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## Guest

I finally heard back from Safeguard and was told that no checks went out last week. This week I should receive an email from accounting and the check will follow and to please forward any invoices I have that are over 30 days old....but that is all they said, very short and not very informative at all. This cut and dry approach they have with their contractors is getting on my nerves. The one good thing that Safeguard has is work to give you and they pay you timely. It would be nice, however, if they were not so cut and dry with their contractors.


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## APlusPPGroup

Floridian said:


> I finally heard back from Safeguard and was told that no checks went out last week. This week I should receive an email from accounting and the check will follow and to please forward any invoices I have that are over 30 days old....but that is all they said, very short and not very informative at all. This cut and dry approach they have with their contractors is getting on my nerves. The one good thing that Safeguard has is work to give you and they pay you timely. It would be nice, however, if they were not so cut and dry with their contractors.


They were probably working against the holiday just like everyone else. 

Just because you get a check every week doesn't always mean one is due. Sometimes clients pay ahead, as we do, if and when we can and we know the client well enough to know we'll be reimbursed. Otherwise, our policy is to pay when payments are received and some clients take longer than others.

Linda


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## Guest

Thanks for your comments Linda. You have a great way of looking at this craziness we are up to our eyeballs in.


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## Guest

Linda,

Thank you for responding to my inquiries and posts. However, Safeguard pays invoices once they are 30 days old, and I have invoices that should have been paid last week as well as this week. The email from accounting this week has not yet come in and it is now Thursday. So I am now going on two weeks without a payment from Safeguard. Today, I have emailed the rep that responded to me with all the invoices that are over 30 days due. Whatever happened is not due to invoices not being due for payment nor because of the holiday, because the last holiday weekend that took place I was paid on time as every other week. I am now naturally concerned about what may be going on with accounting. I believe if you agreed to process payroll weekly when you recruited me then you should keep your word or at least let me know that something is changing, but don't leave me in the dark and make me send 5 emails and get a response 1 week later. I am consistent in my work and don't change things around after I promised something. 

We do grass cuts for Safeguard so weekly payments are always due because we do work for them every week since April. There is no justification in their gap in paying me. I am a reasonable person and as understanding as I can be. However, with the new lowered grass cut rates that they threw on us in April (and let's not mention their reputation), I expect absolutely no problems with payroll, or at least good communication. I do not believe it is that difficult for them to have someone send an email to contractors letting them know what is going on. Also, I have work to do for them in just two days so I have to get to the bottom of this and ensure I am not being cheated before I continue to complete work orders for them.

Thank again for your responses, they are always very informative and knowledgeable.


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## Guest

Okay, after sending my email this morning I finally received an email from accounting paying most of the invoices due for 30 days. *I feel a lot better now*. I do know they have been updating their vendor web to be compatible with windows 7, etc. but since they did not communicate anything I was concerned. However, I must be clear, aside from whatever snafu accounting may have had last week, I have never had a problem getting paid by Safeguard. This is of course contrary to what many complain about but I personally have never had a problem with Safeguard paying me. Thanks everyone for being on here and communicating with others in this industry about the things that go on.


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## APlusPPGroup

Floridian ~

Very happy to hear you're finally being responded to.:thumbup: With a company as big as Safeguard, no doubt there will be e-mails they just don't have time to answer. 

Not defending them in any way but they are probably overwhelmed. If they didn't pay *anyone* last week, their mailboxes are probably full and they have to work through them.

We have over 350 vendors in our system. If I were to get a flood of e-mails, it would take me awhile, too.

I'm glad your experience with them has been more positive than negative, tho. Like I said before, there are a handful of companies posting in the positive and I hope they continue to do so.

Linda


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## Guest

Hey guys. I'm new and was wondering how to start my own thread. Can someone help me please? I would really appreciate the help. Thanks.


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## APlusPPGroup

usbestrepairs said:


> Hey guys. I'm new and was wondering how to start my own thread. Can someone help me please? I would really appreciate the help. Thanks.


I'm not sure you can until after so many posts. Anyone else know?

Linda


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## Guest

Thanks for responding Linda. Are a lot of people here looking to recruit contractors and crews, or is it mostly for information? The reason i ask is because the company i work for is currently looking for contractors across the nation for additional coverage. Our biggest client Bank of America has decided to give us all 50 states to do all of their property preservation work for. We previously had 32 states that took a few years to acheive, but apparently they liked our quick response to their demands and gave us all of them. So it is my understanding that we have orders coming in a few weeks, and I'm trying to get the extra coverage before the orders come in that way we have people to assign them to. If anyone is looking for work, we have plenty available.


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## APlusPPGroup

Chris ~

All you have to do is post here. You will have more e-mails in your inbox than you can answer. It may become very overwhelming, as it has for me.

Linda


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## Guest

Thanks. There is a whole crew of us doing recruitment. I've been searching different sites looking for vendors, but i'm running short of new places to search, so i wound up here hoping it would help. Any ideas from anyone on any sites i could search for companies that do property preservation that are regional, not nationwide?


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## APlusPPGroup

http://lawnprocafe.com/
http://www.lawnforums.com/index.php?

These are a couple I know of but there are many out there. It just takes a little more research.

Linda


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## Guest

Thank you Linda. I will check these sites out.


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## Guest

what area do you cover? The company i work for has a contract with Bank of America and we're looking for additional coverage across the nation, so if you're interested shoot me an e-mail.


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## APlusPPGroup

usbestrepairs said:


> what area do you cover? The company i work for has a contract with Bank of America and we're looking for additional coverage across the nation, so if you're interested shoot me an e-mail.


We operate in 44 states at the moment and the coverage areas change as we add [or remove] vendors to [from] our network.

We are considered nationwide. What are you looking for exactly?

Linda

PS. Check your mailbox. We should already be in your system.


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## Guest

Thanks linda, i have tried a site newrep.com . It has been gold. But i dried them all up for the areas we need now, so that's why i'm here. I did get PLENTY from that site however.


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## Guest

Oh, and Linda, sorry about not directly answering your question earlier. We're looking for regional vendors. The reason we're looking for regional vendors is because when we get off the phone with a vendor about a work order, we don't want them to pick that phone right back up and call a sub, who will call a sub. The end result is someone doing the job for such bad pay, they figure halfway through the job it isn't worth it, and don't give 100%. So we're looking for vendors who have an in house crew. We know there are companies out there hungry for work, because i too often run into people on the brink of calling it quits. They have 3 crews at home waiting for a call to do some work, so we hope to help them out( not to sound like i'm from "feed the children" or anything) It's just that hungry workers work better then those who have plenty.


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## APlusPPGroup

Not a problem at all, Chris, and it was nice chatting with you earlier. You are doing it the best way. It's not always feasible to have a middleman involved.

Sorry I couldn't get back to your post right away. I've actually been in a training class for 1/2 a day so my posting time was at a premium.

Linda


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## Guest

Usb brings up a good point with a sub calling a sub, then that sub calling a sub. This one thing that has kept mef rom checking furhter into pp, knowing how to position myself closer to the money.


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## Guest

Well I guess my post about not being paid from a recent recruiting contract service company was "pulled".... To bad that the truth can't come out so its being revised:

If someone is trying to recruit from the threads then "buyer beware" since unfortunately it makes Contractor Talk look like they are promoting a company or allowing them to post for recruiting and stealing from the hard working professionals. 
Yes there is someone posting looking for vendors and yes they don't pay their bills... Heaven forbid nothing new there.
Now if the moderator finds this offensive then pm me and I will word it a different way but when a company is recruiting and not paying the contractors then the "world needs to know" JMO:thumbsup:


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## APlusPPGroup

Fremont ~

I never saw your post so it must have been "pulled" right away. If you named a company name, that company probably reported it and that's why it was removed.

I have recruited through CT also so I would imagine the mods don't pull what might be considered "ads" unless someone reports them with a valid reason. That's when the posts disappear.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Fremont ~
> 
> I never saw your post so it must have been "pulled" right away. If you named a company name, that company probably reported it and that's why it was removed.
> 
> I have recruited through CT also so I would imagine the mods don't pull what might be considered "ads" unless someone reports them with a valid reason. That's when the posts disappear.
> 
> Linda


Yeah I responded to the "poster" which must have been the mistake. I normally don't waste my time (no time to waste) on "slamming" a company but when that company does not pay then they need to be reported but report to whom is the problem. 
Hey the Mods were 100% right and respect them for pulling it:notworthy since I did it with a pile of unpaid invoices from Feb/March and June in my file that they keep "losing". Enough said :shutup:


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## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> Yeah I responded to the "poster" which must have been the mistake. I normally don't waste my time (no time to waste) on "slamming" a company but when that company does not pay then they need to be reported but report to whom is the problem.
> Hey the Mods were 100% right and respect them for pulling it:notworthy since I did it with a pile of unpaid invoices from Feb/March and June in my file that they keep "losing". Enough said :shutup:


The best way is go to BBB or http://ripoffreport.com. Just be careful to be factual and honest so that you aren't sued in return for defamation of character.

I also am working on collections right now. It seems I can only do it when things slow down a wee bit. But, usually, by that time invoices payments are months behind schedule. The clients that are behind, however, are not any that have been mentioned in the forum so I doubt we're working with the same clients.

I wish you the best.

Linda


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## agcreno

So many wolves in sheeps clothing...


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## APlusPPGroup

agcreno said:


> So many wolves in sheeps clothing...


It happens, unfortunately. No matter how conscious you are of what's going on in the industry, people can still sway you with promises. 

The problem is we believe because we want to believe. We all like to think the best of people. It's when our faith is shaken that we begin to stop believing.

Linda


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## BPWY

Several pages back I mentioned a Safeguard charge back.


Guess who kissed and made up today????


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Several pages back I mentioned a Safeguard charge back.
> 
> 
> Guess who kissed and made up today????


Hmmmmmmm. Who?

Linda


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## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Hmmmmmmm. Who?
> 
> Linda






Wasn't me, does that help?  


:w00t:


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Wasn't me, does that help?
> 
> 
> :w00t:


Well, if it wasn't you it's gotta be Cyprexx? FAS? MCS?

:no: No?

Ooh, ooh. I know. Must be Safeguard............... lol

Seriously, though. Glad you got whatever it was all squared away.:thumbup:

Linda


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## REO2Rentals

Thanks!


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## REO2Rentals

usbestrepairs said:


> Oh, and Linda, sorry about not directly answering your question earlier. We're looking for regional vendors. The reason we're looking for regional vendors is because when we get off the phone with a vendor about a work order, we don't want them to pick that phone right back up and call a sub, who will call a sub. The end result is someone doing the job for such bad pay, they figure halfway through the job it isn't worth it, and don't give 100%. So we're looking for vendors who have an in house crew. We know there are companies out there hungry for work, because i too often run into people on the brink of calling it quits. They have 3 crews at home waiting for a call to do some work, so we hope to help them out( not to sound like i'm from "feed the children" or anything) It's just that hungry workers work better then those who have plenty.



Hi Chris,

Do you have any job in SE Michigan, we don't sub work out...... everything done in-house for quality control purpose:thumbup:

Thanks


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## ARPPP

Okay, spoke with that "company" that wants us to do digital locks and recently starting paying for inspections  Wanted to know why payments that I usually get from them several times a week, since I do invoices everyday have not been paid. It has been almost 2 weeks since I received a payment from them and this is quite unusual. Sometimes they are slow, sometimes they are fast, but this is extremely slow for them. The kind gentlemen on the phone did the "needful" and stated that there are issues with their system and hopes that they will be corrected soon. Me too! I have several thousand outstanding right now. I need my money! Had to borrow from personal accounts to cover payroll this week


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## Guest

*Regional vendors*



usbestrepairs said:


> Oh, and Linda, sorry about not directly answering your question earlier. We're looking for regional vendors. The reason we're looking for regional vendors is because when we get off the phone with a vendor about a work order, we don't want them to pick that phone right back up and call a sub, who will call a sub. The end result is someone doing the job for such bad pay, they figure halfway through the job it isn't worth it, and don't give 100%. So we're looking for vendors who have an in house crew. We know there are companies out there hungry for work, because i too often run into people on the brink of calling it quits. They have 3 crews at home waiting for a call to do some work, so we hope to help them out( not to sound like i'm from "feed the children" or anything) It's just that hungry workers work better then those who have plenty.


I MAY BE POSSIBLY INTERESTED! can you send me a price lists and payment terms to [email protected] i currently cover central california, all work is done in house and we are properly licensed and insured-fully experianced! thanks! thomas


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## Guest

Hello All! Hope everyone is out there moving and shaking today! 
I came across this board through google and am looking to start a property preservation business here in the NY/NJ/CT area to begin with hopes of expanding as quickly as the industry and current work load will allow me to... So that is the vision... now the problem...
I have been through what seems like a million websites trying to gain some more information on this business and it seems that everyone is trying to sell me a DVD set or a Book or a program or training class etc. 
Is there anyone here who can point me in the direction or fill me in on what the down and dirty of this business is? 
My current company is an extremely experienced construction firm with over 16 years experience in construction specialties. I have seen a few different sides of the business...
1) As a subcontractor actually doing the work
2) As a Mngmnt Company whom I'm guessing gets the actual contracts from the banks and subs the work out to the above.
3) A sub to a sub which IMO from what I've seen is the way to get screwed... but like I said I don't claim to know anything much about this, just seems to be what the horror stories say.
So if anyone has some helpful info of where to go from here please let me know as I am looking to have this up and running in the next month or so and hopefully be taking work orders by Mid Nov. 
I'm sure this isn't as easy as open a company, get some ins certs, call the banks, make $$$... If it was that easy wouldn't everyone be involved??? That's what my Mom used to say at least... and it always proved to be right! 
I needed to know what Certifications are needed, What Ins is needed, If it makes more sense to be a Mngmnt Co. or a Sub... etc. Looking forward to the responses & some well thought out direction... and like I said I'm a Newbie so don't bash me too bad if my post is out of context for this forum. 
Thanks in advance, 
Doug


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## BPWY

Spend some more time reading this thread and the horror stories and the ups and mostly downs of the industry before deciding to spend a lot of money getting started.


There is an old saying that comes from the trucking industry and it applies here too .

If you want to make a million bucks trucking (doing P&P) start with 5 million.


I can't recommend this biz to any one at this time with a clear conscience. 
Or at least thats been my experience for the area I work in.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Spend some more time reading this thread and the horror stories and the ups and mostly downs of the industry before deciding to spend a lot of money getting started.
> 
> 
> There is an old saying that comes from the trucking industry and it applies here too .
> 
> If you want to make a million bucks trucking (doing P&P) start with 5 million.
> 
> 
> I can't recommend this biz to any one at this time with a clear conscience.
> Or at least thats been my experience for the area I work in.


That's exactly what I have been doing. The stories I have read seem to lead me in the direction of going to a Management type structure only because I am familiar with working with subs heavily and have an impeccable history as far as paying my vendors within the time frame stated (Usually Net 30,60,or 90) even in some cases not taking a salary myself to complete my financial obligations to my crews. 
That in itself seems to be, from what I've read, something that is needed in this industry.
I've been in business through my current company for 18 years and pride myself on never being late on a payroll, never going belly up on any job, and never once taking a loan for anything. 
With that being said I know I would like to work for someone like myself, so why wouldn't others? 
As of right now I am doing my due diligence and am finding no negatives about the business other then the "Nationals not paying their subs". 
However my dilemma is not finding the "blueprint" if you will, on the necessary requirements to break the lock (No pun intended) on this business. 
How long have you been in business and what has your (and everyone else) experience been? 

Doug


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## Guest

*HUD Guidelines Florida*

I was wondering where can I print off the HUD Guidelines for Florida for Property Preservation? I have been looking for something for months now and can never find anything on the acutal site... Any help would be awesome!

-Sarah


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## BPWY

Dturziano said:


> That's exactly what I have been doing. The stories I have read seem to lead me in the direction of going to a Management type structure only because I am familiar with working with subs heavily and have an impeccable history as far as paying my vendors within the time frame stated (Usually Net 30,60,or 90) even in some cases not taking a salary myself to complete my financial obligations to my crews.
> That in itself seems to be, from what I've read, something that is needed in this industry.
> I've been in business through my current company for 18 years and pride myself on never being late on a payroll, never going belly up on any job, and never once taking a loan for anything.
> With that being said I know I would like to work for someone like myself, so why wouldn't others?
> As of right now I am doing my due diligence and am finding no negatives about the business other then the "Nationals not paying their subs".
> However my dilemma is not finding the "blueprint" if you will, on the necessary requirements to break the lock (No pun intended) on this business.
> How long have you been in business and what has your (and everyone else) experience been?
> 
> Doug





I THINK you'll find getting into the management difficult at best. Most of the banks are happy to go with a national presence that takes care of what they might get no matter where in the country its at.


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## Guest

Dturziano said:


> That's exactly what I have been doing. The stories I have read seem to lead me in the direction of going to a Management type structure only because I am familiar with working with subs heavily and have an impeccable history as far as paying my vendors within the time frame stated (Usually Net 30,60,or 90) even in some cases not taking a salary myself to complete my financial obligations to my crews.
> That in itself seems to be, from what I've read, something that is needed in this industry.
> I've been in business through my current company for 18 years and pride myself on never being late on a payroll, never going belly up on any job, and never once taking a loan for anything.
> With that being said I know I would like to work for someone like myself, so why wouldn't others?
> As of right now I am doing my due diligence and am finding no negatives about the business other then the "Nationals not paying their subs".
> However my dilemma is not finding the "blueprint" if you will, on the necessary requirements to break the lock (No pun intended) on this business.
> How long have you been in business and what has your (and everyone else) experience been?
> 
> Doug


My friend,
This business is not for the "unknowing" unless you are willling to provide your services for free.
As others have said this is not a business "right now" that I would recommend anyone venture into unless you are willing to lose money. Don't get me wrong there is money to be made but you have to understand the business and I mean truly understand the business. No general contractor can relate to this field without starting at the bottom and try to work your way up the food chain. 
Yes there are ways to shortcut the food chain but I have not seen 1 (NOT 1) that has not failed and shut the doors from bankruptcy or just run out of money. 
If you do decide to venture into the field of vultures then I would hire a partner or someone who has worked this business both "in the field and administratively" who knows how to navigate the mines.
Good luck with your decision.:thumbsup:


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> My friend,
> This business is not for the "unknowing" unless you are willling to provide your services for free.
> As others have said this is not a business "right now" that I would recommend anyone venture into unless you are willing to lose money. Don't get me wrong there is money to be made but you have to understand the business and I mean truly understand the business. No general contractor can relate to this field without starting at the bottom and try to work your way up the food chain.
> Yes there are ways to shortcut the food chain but I have not seen 1 (NOT 1) that has not failed and shut the doors from bankruptcy or just run out of money.
> If you do decide to venture into the field of vultures then I would hire a partner or someone who has worked this business both "in the field and administratively" who knows how to navigate the mines.
> Good luck with your decision.:thumbsup:


Hmmmmm... ok so I'm getting that there is more to this then meets the eye. I appreciate all the feedback from those that have responded, and invite others who have info to chime in. 
My issue is trying to figure out the actual process of how this all works. I have downloaded all the HUD guidelines, pricing docs, Applications, etc... for that line of the work. I am still unfamiliar with where to go to deal with the Private companies though.
However I am trying to locate, for a lack of better words, a timeline or outline of the foodchain for this business. Or a very straight up definition of what the sectors are.
It seems to me that it is less about contracting and more about how precise you are with your business and book keeping. Is that a fair assumption or am I totally off the mark? 

My current business runs as follows and you all can tell me if it is similar...
1)Find Job
2)Get Bid List and spec of work
3)Bid Job
4)Follow up bid
5)Get Job (Hopefully:rockon
6)Order Materials and requisition for the following month
7)Actually do the job
8)Requisition for work completed
9)Finished product & Full payment net 30-60-90 depending on client

Is this a similar beast or am I in completely unfamiliar territory? I am extremely intrigued by the business and I understand that everyone is advising against it, however I'm not understand why... Positives and Negatives anyone?

Had to edit to add this one in... When you say run out of money, go bankrupt, or as I have read before have a large capital outlay upfront to start. What is a reasonable amount of money to open your doors? Just figured this would be a relevant question. I know it will be a substantial investment... but what is that substantial investment? Round a bout #. 

Doug


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## BPWY

I keep hearing from my neighbor/contractor that he gets A LOT of calls for rehab work. But all the pay terms are 60 to 90 days. He won't touch any of them for that reason. His terms are 50% down and net 30 non negotiable. I do not blame him. There are too many horror stories about 30 days becoming 60 and then 60 becomes 90. 90 becomes never. The contractor is bankrupt and the bank just got free work. I don't know what to tell you is a needed capital number. Its going to depend on how big you want to start out I guess.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I keep hearing from my neighbor/contractor that he gets A LOT of calls for rehab work. But all the pay terms are 60 to 90 days. He won't touch any of them for that reason. His terms are 50% down and net 30 non negotiable. I do not blame him. There are too many horror stories about 30 days becoming 60 and then 60 becomes 90. 90 becomes never. The contractor is bankrupt and the bank just got free work. I don't know what to tell you is a needed capital number. Its going to depend on how big you want to start out I guess.


BPWY,

Is the issue that the subs are running into that the Management companies are not paying their subs or that the Banks are not paying the management Co's? 
Cause if it is the first one, which is what it seems to be, the ethics of the people who are supposed to be paying their subs are S#!^
I figured that as much for the initial capital investment... wasn't sure if there was a "Rule of thumb" number.


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## BPWY

No rule of thumb number that I've heard.


I'd imagine that a lot of the problems stem from the nationals not paying their subs, but the banks are far from innocent!!!
BofA has a bad reputation for stiffing folks out of millions. Its been mentioned in this thread with links to multiple news stories.
Also there is no reason the bank can't pay with in reasonable terms. After all they are the ones with all the money since the gooberment took it from the tax payer and gave it to the banks.


----------



## Guest

I'm finding on my side of the business that right now it's not necessarily about who is cheapest but who is most desperate. 
I have heard of companies taking jobs at a loss just to keep the doors open and payroll moving... this is a sure way to get yourself in a hole you will never get out of, but they just keep bidding and taking work below cost :blink:.
I don't know about the rest of everyone but I refuse to work for free, as should everyone else. 
Is this the same case in the preservation business right now?


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## APlusPPGroup

Dturziano ~

I have only heard of one bank that didn't pay. They're paying now, after a lot of grief, tho.

It's the management companies that fall into the following categories:

1. Don't pay
2. Don't pay enough
3. Take 90 days to pay
4. Chargeback the vendors

It's tough anymore finding the good ones so I wish you the very best in your search. Trying to go direct without the experience to back you up will be extremely difficult and take the longest to achieve, at the very least.

Linda


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## BPWY

Dturziano said:


> I'm finding on my side of the business that right now it's not necessarily about who is cheapest but who is most desperate.
> I have heard of companies taking jobs at a loss just to keep the doors open and payroll moving... this is a sure way to get yourself in a hole you will never get out of, but they just keep bidding and taking work below cost :blink:.
> I don't know about the rest of everyone but I refuse to work for free, as should everyone else.
> Is this the same case in the preservation business right now?





DING DING DING !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Your entire post is right on. This is whyFremont and myself said we wouldn't with good conscience want to recommend this industry to any one at the current state of affairs.


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## Guest

I mean correct me if I'm wrong, but if subs are underbidding each other and taking jobs at a loss to get the jobs wouldn't the management companies be making out like bandits because of the fact that they are allotted a certain budget to do this work within? Or have the banks changed their guidelines as to what they will pay for certain services based on what they have been paying out directly? Cause if thats the case nobodies making anything. 

@ A1PropertyClean

First off let me say that it seems that you have built quite a business for yourself, congrats and continued success on that.
Do you know what the payment terms are from the banks to the M&M companies? 
I'm figuring that there has to be a documented account on all parties and like working with a bond on a job, if the customer (in this case the bank) is not satisfied (Which is usually BS anyway) they will withhold payment till it is done to "Their Standards" or go after the bond to fulfill their job as "They" want it done. 
I don't claim to be ANY sort of an expert in this field, but am just playing devils advocate in the case that maybe that's the reason the Management Companies aren't paying in a timely manner. 
As far as them not paying enough, if what BPWY and I were referring to in the last post is true then the industry is commoditizing itself and leaving the other companies to take what they can get because of those "Desperate" companies. 
As far as charge backs... I am not familiar with this yet... Why would a M&M charge back a sub? Do they claim it is for the same reasons I have stated above that the banks would hold back payment to an M&M? 
Seems to be the Management companies defense mechanism to extend payment terms or charge back when they haven't received their payment from the bank or the other side is that they are just super shady business people. 

Just trying to learn ladies and gents... sorry if I'm being a PIA. I appreciate all your input.


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## APlusPPGroup

Thank you for that, Dturziano, and I wish you the very best in whatever route you take.

I have no clue when the banks actually pay but I know for a fact that, when I received checks directly from the banks for work I did through a broker, the checks arrive sooner, rather than later.

It's always been my thought that the banks pay on time but the management companies hold onto money so they can continue operating. Then, when they get really big payments, they release what was due 60 and 90 days ago.

I could be wrong but that's my opinion. We send payments as we receive them so, when clients pay quickly, the vendors get their money quickly, too. I am fighting to get some old stuff paid right now 'cause we don't get paid until the vendor gets paid and we need the money, too.

Linda


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## BPWY

Dturziano said:


> I mean correct me if I'm wrong, but if subs are underbidding each other and taking jobs at a loss to get the jobs wouldn't the management companies be making out like bandits because of the fact that they are allotted a certain budget to do this work within? Or have the banks changed their guidelines as to what they will pay for certain services based on what they have been paying out directly? Cause if thats the case nobodies making anything.






Some accounts yes!! There is some of the work that is "flat rate".

The cheaper that the service company is able to brow beat contractors into working the more their bottom line is.


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## Guest

*Feeling like throwing in the towel*

Feeling so tired of this Biz..all the headaches and risks involved have me wondering if this is all really worth it. Someone please shed some positive light.


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## BPWY

Positive???


You'll be looking for a while.


Good luck


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## Guest

This business is no longer what it used to be and I am getting quite fed up with doing so much for so little!


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## Guest

Hello all !!
Wow it's been almost a year since i've been here. Wanted to say hello to all, especially mrs Linda, how is Laughlin treating you? Las Vegas has immensely blown up, we're having fun keeping up. I've even taken your lead and am writing my first eBook to help out the new business coming out every day....Stay in touch!! and i'll post more on here soon !!


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## Guest

quick question....I want to get on with Fannie mae but I'm a business owner not a contractor. Any way around that? Any contractors nationally out there that work with Fannie Mae that need a large scale Preservation company in Las Vegas Nv with years of experience and a sounds affiliate and clientele base???


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## Guest

Random question out there, but what major management company/or bank cuts off lawn cuts from November until March? Local contractor was telling me of company that they get a huge list in the spring, then it disappears in the winter. 

Any idea? Our maintenance group slows back, but there is still plenty of work over the winter months, inside and out.


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## Guest

monthlies for me cut back to once a month here in Nevada in the winter time but they never truly go away until the property is sold or is transferred to another agency. Things definitely slow down a bit in the winter time but I just use that slow time to build better rapports with clients and tighten up my advertising strategies


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## BPWY

In all actuality grass cuts only need to be done in many states from May thru the end of Aug.

The mountain states do not start in April, there can still be snow around. When the rains dry up so do the non irrigated lawns. It is possible to see snow in Oct.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> In all actuality grass cuts only need to be done in many states from May thru the end of Aug.
> 
> The mountain states do not start in April, there can still be snow around. When the rains dry up so do the non irrigated lawns. It is possible to see snow in Oct.




Most of my properties i have not broken out the mower since the 1st week of August. Didn't start mowing them till May..........


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## Guest

D&R Services said:


> monthlies for me cut back to once a month here in Nevada in the winter time but they never truly go away until the property is sold or is transferred to another agency. Things definitely slow down a bit in the winter time but I just use that slow time to build better rapports with clients and tighten up my advertising strategies


Trying to respond back to your message Mike. Doesn't seem to be going through. Email me @ [email protected] so I can discuss some things further with you. Thanks and sorry if you get a million messages from me in your mailbox... this damn site seems temperamental of what it wants to send. LOL 

Doug


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## Guest

Dturziano said:


> Trying to respond back to your message Mike. Doesn't seem to be going through. Email me @ [email protected] so I can discuss some things further with you. Thanks and sorry if you get a million messages from me in your mailbox... this damn site seems temperamental of what it wants to send. LOL
> 
> Doug


no problem doug, i responded to your email, sorry about the delay !!


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## APlusPPGroup

I'm looking for vendors in Vermont. Is there anyone here who can do a grass cut bid for us on a property in Pawlet [Rutland county] with just over an acre of land? We don't have photos. This will be our first time at the property.

If anyone in Vermont is interested, please send me a private message or, if you're too new here to receive/send messages, post your e-mail address and I will contact you.

I'm also looking for vendors in Massachusetts, Louisiana, Mississippi and Nebraska. It appears we may be getting work in these states shortly. E-mail us at [email protected] and put your state in the subject line, your counties in the body of the e-mail. This way we can find you faster.

Thanks!

Linda


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## BPWY

Linda you already have my contact info, I do some work in far southwest NE. If this is an area you need help in please let me know.


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## APlusPPGroup

Thanks, Paul. I do have all your info but am looking for coverage throughout the entire state.

The requests I've had are for these particular states and I need coverage throughout all of them.

Keep your fingers crossed the work comes through. We've been promised the moon before...................... you know how it goes.:whistling

Linda


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## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> Thanks, Paul. I do have all your info but am looking for coverage throughout the entire state.
> 
> The requests I've had are for these particular states and I need coverage throughout all of them.
> 
> Keep your fingers crossed the work comes through. We've been promised the moon before...................... you know how it goes.:whistling
> 
> Linda



In other words they want you to give them the moon eh??? Nebrasky is as bad as Eastern Montana to cover unless you can find a tallented antelope or beef cow as there are 5 times as many as those as there is people!!:thumbup:


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## brm1109

*JGM Property Group*

Hello All,
I was wondering if anyone has done any work for a company called JGM Property Group. It appears they get their work from ASONS. Any advise about them, good or not?
Thanks,


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## BPWY

cheap cheap cheap

Working for a sub of a sub of a sub etc means the guy doing the actual work is working for cheap.


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## brm1109

*Inspections*

Another question. If you look at the HUD inspection that JGM wants done one of the items is for the electrical appliances and other electrical to be tested. It says that if there is not power then you need to hook a generator up with a #10 wire drop and pig tail and connect it to a stove or dryer receptacle. But I thought I read somewhere that this is illegal.
Q. Would you do this and how difficult is it or maybe just pass for them?
Thanks for the help.


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## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> Another question. If you look at the HUD inspection that JGM wants done one of the items is for the electrical appliances and other electrical to be tested. It says that if there is not power then you need to hook a generator up with a #10 wire drop and pig tail and connect it to a stove or dryer receptacle. But I thought I read somewhere that this is illegal.
> Q. Would you do this and how difficult is it or maybe just pass for them?
> Thanks for the help.



Good way to backfeed a grid and knock a power company guy on his azz. No way in hell would i do it.............


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## brm1109

thanks


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## Guest

OK All its my "that time of year" recommendations for winterizing. I'm sure theres more so everyone add to it: Newbies really need to understand before they start doing winterizes that could come back and haunt them. 

1) call every City that you winterize and check to see if its legal to touch the meter, touch the domestic potable water supply. You just might find it very very interesting that you could be fined and taken to court. Yes it is happening already and fun watching everyone squirm.

2) HUD says on boiler systems to replace RPZ valves on boilers if there is one needed or something to that effect. Just remember that most states follow the National Plumbing Code and you need to be licensed to do this....ie plumber, steamfitter etc. 

3) Don't ever guarantee your work. Understand (for the newbies) that you can never get "all" the water out of the domestic water lines unless every single pipe runs downhill and personally I've never seen that  Up and down runs on pipes creates traps and if the water doesn't evaporate and it pools it can freeze and bust.

4) If it "doesn't feel right or you don't think you are qualified" than don't do it. Kinda like the golden rule...

Good night all.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> OK All its my "that time of year" recommendations for winterizing. I'm sure theres more so everyone add to it: Newbies really need to understand before they start doing winterizes that could come back and haunt them.
> 
> 1) call every City that you winterize and check to see if its legal to touch the meter, touch the domestic potable water supply. You just might find it very very interesting that you could be fined and taken to court. Yes it is happening already and fun watching everyone squirm.
> 
> 2) HUD says on boiler systems to replace RPZ valves on boilers if there is one needed or something to that effect. Just remember that most states follow the National Plumbing Code and you need to be licensed to do this....ie plumber, steamfitter etc.
> 
> 3) Don't ever guarantee your work. Understand (for the newbies) that you can never get "all" the water out of the domestic water lines unless every single pipe runs downhill and personally I've never seen that  Up and down runs on pipes creates traps and if the water doesn't evaporate and it pools it can freeze and bust.
> 
> 4) If it "doesn't feel right or you don't think you are qualified" than don't do it. Kinda like the golden rule...
> 
> Good night all.



well said fremont!! most rookies think its just turning off valve stops,sucking the water out of the toilets and putting anti freeze in...it's not brain surgery but it's not that simple either...I still can't believe they have me do them in las vegas for that one - two days a year its gets anywhere near 32f ...but oh well a paycheck is a paycheck. and then i get to benefit from the HOA violation curing ...win win


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## brm1109

*Just don't get it*

This is the second time in a week that I went into a house to do a bid on a trashout and janitorial and found that while the house was "winterized" the toilets were full of s%$t.
What ever brain did them put a sign on saying it was winterized but didn't even have the name of the company.


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## Guest

I work for a national that has us wint dirty toilets and then bid to clean and re-wint and of course i work for another that in order to do a wint they have to be clean. I dont know I just blindly follow the work order


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## agcreno

Be careful just blindly doing what a work order tells you to do...Remember, You are ultimately responsible for what you did at that house, regardless of what a national may tell you. What are you going to say when that toilet full of you know what freezes and breaks because the anti freeze wasn't as effective in the pool of you know what. The national is likely to tell their client...Oh Ya we paid so and so to winterize it, knowing full well they told you to winterize a dirty toilet, which, by the way will never be on your work order... then when the you know what hits the fan...Shazam...You are the proud owner of a new toilet chargeback or maybe more plumbing damage. All you guys need to make calls and see if you are even legal to winterize a home...You might be surprized to see what the actual requirements are, as well as the fines and penalties that go along with it for violations. Some counties care and some do not..


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## BPWY

BofA in the news again and they continue to prove just how clueless they are.



> FOX Business Network has learned that even as people started losing their jobs, the bank’s capital markets arm -- the same department targeted for many of the deepest cuts -- is scheduled to throw a lavish party tonight on the swanky rooftop bar in Manhattan, according to people at the firm.


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## Guest

Its on the work order, believe it or not. but i give your post a recommend regardless


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## Guest

With some of the rates I have seen, and what seems the hectic nature of this gig, I have to assume there are a lot of nonqualified people doing the actual work.


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## oteroproperties

brm1109 said:


> Another question. If you look at the HUD inspection that JGM wants done one of the items is for the electrical appliances and other electrical to be tested. It says that if there is not power then you need to hook a generator up with a #10 wire drop and pig tail and connect it to a stove or dryer receptacle. But I thought I read somewhere that this is illegal.
> Q. Would you do this and how difficult is it or maybe just pass for them?
> Thanks for the help.


This is common practice during electrical hot checks. It's not illegal because you are using it to check the power. It can be an issue if you try to run too many components, but for checking it you should be fine. 

If there is no power then there's no way to "backfeed the grid". But to be safe I would kill the main breaker.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> This is common practice during electrical hot checks. It's not illegal because you are using it to check the power. It can be an issue if you try to run too many components, but for checking it you should be fine.
> 
> If there is no power then there's no way to "backfeed the grid". But to be safe I would kill the main breaker.



There was a guy killed a few years ago as it backfed even though the main was off. Ask a sparky how safe it is without a double throw switch installed or the meter out of the socket..........


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> BofA in the news again and they continue to prove just how clueless they are.




They are clueless in SO MANY ways. I have one property for them that has been vacant since April 08. The first time i was sent to the property was Oct 09 for a grass cut. At that time they had me change a lock and i took photos. Found the basement FULL of mold and a water line 4' up the walls but no standing water. This is a really wet subdivision and this house has 2 sump pumps. They had me bid the mold and the local mold guy came in at $42,000 I bid the grass as well. Nothing was done. Fast forward April 10, i was sent for grass cut again and had to bid as grass was still 3-4' tall from previous year. I bid it once a month and finally got an approval in August. Remember the basement?? Nothing was ever done. In April there was 4' of water in the basement and by the time August rolled around it was gone again. Now they send me a work order to activate utilities and test the sump pumps. The electric has been submerged twice now and the basement is full of black mold among other colors. Told em i wasn't going in it as it was hazardous. Now just tonight they send me a work order to wint the property after it has sat 2 years without being winterized!! 

I had 9 wints last week for BOA and was able to do exactly ONE of them. The rest i had visited last year, told them they needed wints and BOA never did them. Now they all have busted plumbing. I am very close to hanging it up with them for utter stupidity.......


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> There was a guy killed a few years ago as it [YOUTUBE][/YOUTUBE]backfed even though the main was off. Ask a sparky how safe it is without a double throw switch installed or the meter out of the socket..........


If thats the case then there was something wrong with the system. 

Look at my signature I am a "sparky" licensed in the state of Florida


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## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> This is common practice during electrical hot checks. It's not illegal because you are using it to check the power. It can be an issue if you try to run too many components, but for checking it you should be fine.
> 
> If there is no power then there's no way to "backfeed the grid". But to be safe I would kill the main breaker.


January '09 we had a doozie of an ice storm. Knocked out power to 10x's of thousands of people for up to 2 weeks. Everyone went running out to purchase the generators and unfortunately some idiots hooked them up to the power the same way that was described in the earlier post and killed 2 lineman (2 seperate cases). It was quickly broadcast that the backfeeding of power is illegal and criminal manslaughter charges followed. Don't know of the outcome but it stopped everyone (rightly so) from backfeeding power. NOW I am 100% sure you as a licensed electrician may know the "proper" way of doing this so that there is little risk of burning down a house or being arrested for doing something illegal (in this State anyway) but 99.9% of the "unknown" in this field of business is clueless. 
2) we have 2 licensed electricians on staff in our company and neither on their worst day would backfeed power. Nope No Way. To much liability risk.
3) There was/is a company that used to do 90% of all the HUD PCR Inspections and required all the inspectors to purchase BIG generators to backfeed power till they got "let say sued" by the State, Feds and the Utility Companies. Yep they stopped real fast.

Once again "buyer beware". I hate electricity since for some reason whenever I fool around doing something my hair gets fuzzy


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> If thats the case then there was something wrong with the system.
> 
> Look at my signature I am a "sparky" licensed in the state of Florida



Better get your books out. Simply shutting off the breaker does not qualify as means of connecting a generator under NEC code. During the aftermath of Hurricane Isabel in 2003 two out-of-state linemen here helping restore power were killed by a hot-plugged portable generator with no transfer switch (and the main breaker was off). All that they could do to that homeowner was fine him a max of $10,000 each for the two deaths, which didn't help the linemen's families, I'm sure.


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## mtmtnman

Just another thought, Draw out a dryer circuit with the three pin receptacle (H/H/G), with a dryer (complete with it's internal N/G bond, and the 120V motor) all plugged in, and then (using an eraser), cause the grounded wire to the dryer receptacle to fail. For bonus points, draw in a pic of yourself with one hand on the dryer and then other on a grounded object, eg the washing machine.


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## oteroproperties

I don't need my books, i am already licensed and continue to practice residential electric remodel and new construction as well as multi unit rehabs as a business. There is NO POSSIBLE WAY to back feed the grid of any system if the main disconnect is off i dont care how you draw it. its that simple. the people who made those mistakes clearly did not consult an electrician. 

Remeber people I live in Florida the lightning capital of the world. Power goes out here when the wind blows and as a result I have personally installed over 50 Generators with and without transfer switches. In the last 10 years I have roughed in, trimmed and hot checked better then 500 homes as well as numerous remodels, and service changes. Arguring with me about this is like the guy at Home Depot telling me how to install a ceiling fan.


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## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> I don't need my books, i am already licensed and continue to practice residential electric remodel and new construction as well as multi unit rehabs as a business. There is NO POSSIBLE WAY to back feed the grid of any system if the main disconnect is off i dont care how you draw it. its that simple. the people who made those mistakes clearly did not consult an electrician.
> 
> Remeber people I live in Florida the lightning capital of the world. Power goes out here when the wind blows and as a result I have personally installed over 50 Generators with and without transfer switches. In the last 10 years I have roughed in, trimmed and hot checked better then 500 homes as well as numerous remodels, and service changes. Arguring with me about this is like the guy at Home Depot telling me how to install a ceiling fan.


And it's against NEC to install a generator without a transfer switch or a lock out. Do what you want but we'll be reading about you in the paper eventually and good luck with your insurance paying up if someone is hurt or killed. Banks are trying to get away from any responsibility . If you want the liability's go for it, I will wait to read all about it. 

I also know a lot about electricity as i worked as an apprentice in early 2000. Per NEC On-site generators MAY NOT be connected to a service that is also connected to a utility without the use of an APPROVED transfer switch, transfer panel or circuit breaker interlock. What your suggesting is effectively called a suicide cord in the industry. You plug it in to the dryer outlet and go about the house testing stuff, the neighbor kid comes over being nosey, trips on the cord and pulls it out of the socket and now you have bare plug blades for them to get tangled in or killed with. 

Many homes here still have split-buss panels. There is no main disconnect, this makes it very difficult to isolate the utility lines from the generator when it back feeds through a 240v Receptacle. 

Yes, it is possible to feed power to the grid with the main breaker open. All it takes is two wires swapped in your cord or the dryer plug wired incorrectly and you're feeding 110V onto the grid through the neutral wire, which is NOT disconnected by the main breaker. This is only if the neutral is not bonded. Out here the ground is so dry they run neutral back to the substation. I remember my dads place in Florida only had 2 wires coming in and had an earth ground/neutral.

Now, theoretically, the neutral should be bonded to ground in the main panel, which is then connected to a ground rod, so it SHOULD trip the breaker on your generator IF the generator is also properly grounded. 

BUT, there's alot of IF'S and AND'S and SHOULD'S in this situation, they are all *ASS*uming a proper installation was done on the original panel install.


Here is something you might want to consider......

http://www.jhuapl.edu/ott/technologies/technology/articles/P01517.asp


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> And it's against NEC to install a generator without a transfer switch or a lock out. Do what you want but we'll be reading about you in the paper eventually and good luck with your insurance paying up if someone is hurt or killed. Banks are trying to get away from any responsibility . If you want the liability's go for it, I will wait to read all about it.
> 
> I also know a lot about electricity as i worked as an apprentice in early 2000. Per NEC On-site generators MAY NOT be connected to a service that is also connected to a utility without the use of an APPROVED transfer switch, transfer panel or circuit breaker interlock. What your suggesting is effectively called a suicide cord in the industry. You plug it in to the dryer outlet and go about the house testing stuff, the neighbor kid comes over being nosey, trips on the cord and pulls it out of the socket and now you have bare plug blades for them to get tangled in or killed with.
> 
> Many homes here still have split-buss panels. There is no main disconnect, this makes it very difficult to isolate the utility lines from the generator when it back feeds through a 240v Receptacle.
> 
> Yes, it is possible to feed power to the grid with the main breaker open. All it takes is two wires swapped in your cord or the dryer plug wired incorrectly and you're feeding 110V onto the grid through the neutral wire, which is NOT disconnected by the main breaker. This is only if the neutral is not bonded. Out here the ground is so dry they run neutral back to the substation. I remember my dads place in Florida only had 2 wires coming in and had an earth ground/neutral.
> 
> Now, theoretically, the neutral should be bonded to ground in the main panel, which is then connected to a ground rod, so it SHOULD trip the breaker on your generator IF the generator is also properly grounded.
> 
> BUT, there's alot of IF'S and AND'S and SHOULD'S in this situation, they are all *ASS*uming a proper installation was done on the original panel install.
> 
> 
> Here is something you might want to consider......
> 
> http://www.jhuapl.edu/ott/technologies/technology/articles/P01517.asp


 
this thread it getting to be more of a "my dicks bigger then yours" thread everyday. 

I appreciate the lesson. 

I know what the NEC says and I know what should and should not be done. That code is intended for permenant installations. I guess I should have said this.... IF the stars align just right and the asshole before you didn't make a mistake and your smart enough and the grid is right and the cord is tight and the ground is wet enough and.................

If your testing the home to make sure the systems work you can safely do so for a short period of time using a generator and backfeeding the home through a 220v outlet. If you don't have the education to test continuity and voltage before hooking up the lead then you shouldn't attempt it.


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> this thread it getting to be more of a "my dicks bigger then yours" thread everyday.
> 
> I appreciate the lesson.
> 
> I know what the NEC says and I know what should and should not be done. That code is intended for permenant installations. I guess I should have said this.... IF the stars align just right and the asshole before you didn't make a mistake and your smart enough and the grid is right and the cord is tight and the ground is wet enough and.................
> 
> If your testing the home to make sure the systems work you can safely do so for a short period of time using a generator and backfeeding the home through a 220v outlet. If you don't have the education to test continuity and voltage before hooking up the lead then you shouldn't attempt it.


 
WOW I don't think you won the "contest" :clap:
Hey just kidding but you are 100% right.....If the contractor can't test for continuity (99.9% don't even know what that means in this business---sad but true) or the voltage than they shouldn't be attempting. 

1 thing that just pis**s me off is the contractors that don't "respect the trades" ie...plumbing, electrical, hvac or whatnot...these people know better but continue hacking and the service companies are more than happy to let them keep going on and on.....


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## mtmtnman

Otero, Your still against code using your suicide cord. Just trying to save you a fine.............

NEC article 406.6(B) states “*Connection of Attachment Plugs. *Attachment plugs shall be installed so that their prongs, blades or pins are not energized unless inserted into an energized receptacle. No receptacle shall be installed so as to require the insertion of an energized attachment plug as its source of supply.”


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## oteroproperties

FremontREO said:


> WOW I don't think you won the "contest" :clap:
> Hey just kidding but you are 100% right.....If the contractor can't test for continuity (99.9% don't even know what that means in this business---sad but true) or the voltage than they shouldn't be attempting.
> 
> 1 thing that just pis**s me off is the contractors that don't "respect the trades" ie...plumbing, electrical, hvac or whatnot...these people know better but continue hacking and the service companies are more than happy to let them keep going on and on.....


The service companies are not always to blame. People should know their own limitations. Just becasue you can read a code book does not mean you know what your doing. At the same time, just because you hold a license doesnt mean you know what your doing. I have a close friend that is also a master elect, he can't hang a light to save his life. The building contractors exam requires 2 weeks of prep and you can take your test. Then your off to stat a business. no experience needed. Master electric? 6000hrs field experience and 2 masters to sign off before you can even take the test. Go figure.....


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> Otero, Your still against code using your suicide cord. Just trying to save you a fine.............
> 
> NEC article 406.6(B) states “*Connection of Attachment Plugs. *Attachment plugs shall be installed so that their prongs, blades or pins are not energized unless inserted into an energized receptacle. No receptacle shall be installed so as to require the insertion of an energized attachment plug as its source of supply.”


thanks again......15 years no fines. But then again i've never asked the inspector or osha for that matter if my cord is UL Listed.


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> thanks again......15 years no fines. But then again i've never asked the inspector or osha for that matter if my cord is UL Listed.




Hey, a good sparky knows how to break the rules correctly!:stuart: I just hope to many rookies don't read this and try it at home or on homes they are maintaining.


----------



## mtmtnman

*ACE Hardware Is Tired Of People Asking For Double Ended Male Adapters*


----------



## brm1109

Thanks for all of the imput.After reading everything and considering it I decided not to do the inspections for that company.
I know that I don't know enough about electric to risk it. I would rather lose the inspection money that kill myself or someone else.


----------



## brm1109

*Getting bids*

Is anybody running into the same problems I am. I have a couple of contractors that I use to get bids for residential properties (they are more than happy to do it for regular customers). But now they are more hesitant to give bids on foreclosures simply because they know that the bank want the bids but almost never approve the work. I am almost at the point of telling companies that I want to charge for time of the contractors.


----------



## Guest

We get $135 for "bid for professional estimate "
So no we don't have that problem. You can't get any contractors to bid on a foreclosure in our area without a bid charge since they don't have the time to waste.


----------



## Guest

We get $135 for "bid for professional estimate "
So no we don't have that problem. You can't get any contractors to bid on a foreclosure in our area without a bid charge since they don't have the time to waste.


----------



## BPWY

Fremont is stuttering :laughing:





brm1109 said:


> Is anybody running into the same problems I am. I have a couple of contractors that I use to get bids for residential properties (they are more than happy to do it for regular customers). But now they are more hesitant to give bids on foreclosures simply because they know that the bank want the bids but almost never approve the work. I am almost at the point of telling companies that I want to charge for time of the contractors.




BRM you are not alone!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

All across this country this is happening. The contractors are tired of wasting their time for the bank to have free estimates. Its really getting crazy.

Some thing else that is happening that the nationals don't want to recognize is that the contractors will NOT wait up to 60 days for them to pay up. They expect 100% of their money upon completion of the job. When you put in your bid terms that they have to pay for this you get told that "YOU CANNOT DO THIS".

I told that national I am not a lending institution for the banks and to reassign the w/o.


----------



## agcreno

*Carpet Layer*

I am in need of a carpet layer to do a couple of jobs(1300 Sq Ft lay) in Pahrump NV, If anybody knows of someone in that area that may be interested in a little side work Please send me an email

Thanks Everybody

Glenn

[email protected]


----------



## agcreno

brm1109 said:


> Is anybody running into the same problems I am. I have a couple of contractors that I use to get bids for residential properties (they are more than happy to do it for regular customers). But now they are more hesitant to give bids on foreclosures simply because they know that the bank want the bids but almost never approve the work. I am almost at the point of telling companies that I want to charge for time of the contractors.


 
It is almost embarassing to have to call a "trade", any trade to give an estimate for anything on a repo house, It's as if the moment they arrive they know it is a waste of time. I can't tell you how many roofers in this city won't even return my phone calls because they have NEVER received an approval to complete work. However, we have found that one company will go the extra mile and get the "trade" set up on acceptable terms which is a win win for all. Thanks Linda...:thumbsup:


----------



## mtmtnman

If i have to get a trade i request a bid fee. If they won't pay it i tell them to find someone else. It has cost me a few companies as they don't give me ANYTHING since i started to do this but Oh Well.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> If i have to get a trade i request a bid fee. If they won't pay it i tell them to find someone else. It has cost me a few companies as they don't give me ANYTHING since i started to do this but Oh Well.







I don't feel a shred of sympathy for them. They've brought it on themselves.


----------



## brm1109

*Florida trash removal permits*

All,
I am researching the requirements for operating a trash removal cleanout business in florida. I currently own a business in NJ but am considering moving.
Anyone know where to obtain this info. I have been searching on line but can't find any specifics.
Thanks a lot.


----------



## BPWY

Where I live no license required.... no license available for "trash outs".
FL .... I don't know.


I cannot imagine a level of gooberment interference in our lives that would require a trash out license.


----------



## brm1109

I know every place is different. In NJ we are licensed by the DEP (what a pain to get it).


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I know every place is different. In NJ we are licensed by the DEP (what a pain to get it).





One can only imagine!


----------



## Guest

*Rick*

I am a lifetime construction person and the last three years as an REO property preservation vendor.and inspector.I understand by so many sourses that this is a booming business.I must tell you where the hell is someone hiring.I have contacted so many companies to expand my client list in the last three years its ridicules.I have performed so many differant tasks to hundreds of houses and still no one has room for someone with experance like this. ....Help


----------



## Guest

Maybe they are going through all the 'beer drinking money' vendors before biting the bullet to hire a pro. Seems there are always ads here on CL for that kind of work, but I wouldn't relocate across town for it much less drag up and move to another state from what I keep hearing about the industry.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

eaklma11 said:


> I am a lifetime construction person and the last three years as an REO property preservation vendor.and inspector.I understand by so many sourses that this is a booming business.I must tell you where the hell is someone hiring.I have contacted so many companies to expand my client list in the last three years its ridicules.I have performed so many differant tasks to hundreds of houses and still no one has room for someone with experance like this. ....Help


You'll have to pose that question to the media, who just LOVES to make the industry out to be much better than it is. It is NOT a cash cow industry and new companies really need to weigh their options before jumping in.

Too many startup asset management companies and WAY TOO MANY vendors saturating the industry have caused rate cuts everywhere. If one vendor's too high, there's another one just down the street willing to underbid and get the work. 

Just to keep working, many are lowering their rates. But some are barely breaking even and it's not going to work for them for long.

It's a shame we don't have any real statistics on how many preservation businesses have actually failed. You can't rely on the SSA since so many started up under the table.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> You'll have to pose that question to the media, who just LOVES to make the industry out to be much better than it is. It is NOT a cash cow industry and new companies really need to weigh their options before jumping in.
> 
> Too many startup asset management companies and WAY TOO MANY vendors saturating the industry have caused rate cuts everywhere. If one vendor's too high, there's another one just down the street willing to underbid and get the work.
> 
> Just to keep working, many are lowering their rates. But some are barely breaking even and it's not going to work for them for long.
> 
> It's a shame we don't have any real statistics on how many preservation businesses have actually failed. You can't rely on the SSA since so many started up under the table.
> 
> Linda






For some reason I cannot shake the feeling that there are major shake ups coming in this industry. I'm not certain how and I'm not certain when or where. But some thing has got to give!!! Long time contractors are looking for an exit ramp because of all the negative changes that have come along in just the last 2 yrs, forget the last 10.
Its getting harder and harder every day to break even and cover expenses, let alone make a profit. The new bidding process where HUD gets to decide what a job will pay........ thats stupid, we are no longer independent contractors. But rather employees with ALL the liability.
Turn in a bid "too high" in their opinion and you'll end up doing the work for a much lower rate or not getting bids at all.
The nationals are balking at allowing the contractors to up the bid enough to cover the discounts.

For example if I'm paying a trade contractor $2000 for a job I had better be able to make some money myself and cover the discount rate or else I'll be taking money out of my pocket to pay the sub. That is NOT going to last very long.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> For some reason I cannot shake the feeling that there are major shake ups coming in this industry. I'm not certain how and I'm not certain when or where. But some thing has got to give!!! Long time contractors are looking for an exit ramp because of all the negative changes that have come along in just the last 2 yrs, forget the last 10.
> Its getting harder and harder every day to break even and cover expenses, let alone make a profit. The new bidding process where HUD gets to decide what a job will pay........ that's stupid, we are no longer independent contractors. But rather employees with ALL the liability.
> Turn in a bid "too high" in their opinion and you'll end up doing the work for a much lower rate or not getting bids at all.
> The nationals are balking at allowing the contractors to up the bid enough to cover the discounts.
> 
> For example if I'm paying a trade contractor $2000 for a job I had better be able to make some money myself and cover the discount rate or else I'll be taking money out of my pocket to pay the sub. That is NOT going to last very long.




I'd definitely have to agree, just a few short years ago, local REO Realtors were able to hire their own vendors/contractors to perform work on their properties. Those were the good time because the listing agent had stock in making sure needed projects were done in a timely manor because they had a large stake in the selling of property. When I first started i had over 20 local realtors that i worked for on a consistent basis, now i just have 3 and one isn't that consistent...

the three that i have occasionally have properties that certain services have to go through a national vendor based on the title holder. And when i'm sent to properties that are co-shared with a national company, 9 out of 10 times the realtor calls me all pissed off b/c the work is not done, not done properly, not done!! First off there are too many hands in the pot to make the company actually doing the work to give a rats azz about the quality of work he/she performs. secondly, there are too many people in the equation that doesn't care about the property. I honestly care about my local realtors because I've met them all, we have built a great business rapport, and some I've even built a friendship and on the flip side they care because it's their commission. With the national companies it's very hard to build a friendly rapport, or even a business rapport because sometimes they are in a different country, or flip around employees often. whatever the case may be I, like everyone else, has seen the change, don't' like the change, and can't wait for it to change back........well that's my rant for the year


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> With the national companies it's very hard to build a friendly rapport, or even a business rapport because sometimes they are in a different country, or flip around employees often.






Exactly, and you can be sure that the nationals and the regionals DO NOT care about the agents. 


To back up your statement ..... a local agent told me earlier this yr that he lists a lot of REO and that a lot of those come from FAS. He told me that in the last yr he had been doing this he NEVER NOT ONCE met the same FAS contractor twice.
Pretty tough to build any rapport with that turn over.


----------



## BPWY

Any of the fine upstanding members of society that hang out here ever hear of 3Point Lender Services??? www.3pointls.com

They contacted me today, I'm trying to get a feel for their pricing and what to expect. I haven't received a price sheet yet.
How are they are as company to work with?




Thanks ya'll.


----------



## Guest

There seem to be expecting a pretty good size work load, as they have invested a lot in the system they used. I have done a few jobs for them all at the same property. As of right now seems to be a lot of confusion there as I have signed up a few times only to be requested the same infomation this week to sign up again, They ask for a lot of infomation. the secure i did was maybe 3 month ago. Then over and over an order to cut the grass 4 acres so it was a bid they werent sure if my bid was approved so after due date it recycled in again and the process started over. I have never seen a check either, my personal feeling is they do business but dont have enough business in my area to be stable with knowing what is going on as it seems when I call I get who ever is available and no one consistant.

Hope it helps


----------



## BPWY

No check............hmmmmmmmmmmmmm



I'm highly allergic to working for free.


thanks


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Wasn't someone complaining about Now Property Preservation? This link came to me in an e-mail earlier this evening so I thought I'd share.

http://www.ripoffreport.com/propert...eserv/now-property-preservation-now-56fd7.htm

We don't work with them [or the vendor] so I can't vouch for the validity of the report but this is not the first time I've heard that Now PP is having problems. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

NOW are the guys that want $5000 UP FRONT with no guarantees of work to go to their PP training school. $5000 up front, no payment plans allowed and yrly renewals were along the lines of $2495. A sweet bargain for their loyal contractors that stayed with them for over a yr.

I told em no thanks. :no::no:


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> NOW are the guys that want $5000 UP FRONT with no guarantees of work to go to their PP training school. $5000 up front, no payment plans allowed and yrly renewals were along the lines of $2495. A sweet bargain for their loyal contractors that stayed with them for over a yr.
> 
> I told em no thanks. :no::no:



that's a new one to me?? there are asset companies that require you to pay them???? did i read your post right???? tell me i didn't please !!!


----------



## BPWY

Your eyes didn't lie to you.


They couldn't understand why I wasn't in a huge hurry to be the first guy signing up for this.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

My son also owns a preservation company. He was talking to me yesterday about how difficult it is to get payments from a few of his clients.

I told him about NOW PP and he told me this is one of the companies he hasn't been able to collect from.

Too bad we didn't know this awhile back. It's good to see people posting here. It keeps us up to date on who to avoid working for.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

BOA TO HALT FORECLOSURES IN 23 STATES.......


A document obtained Friday by the Associated Press showed a Bank of America official acknowledging in a legal proceeding that she signed up to 8,000 foreclosure documents a month and typically didn't read them.

http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...TE=ap_template.html&CTIME=2010-10-01-19-47-05


----------



## mtmtnman

Another assanine W/O from BOA. A year ago i was sent to a property to secure it and found a spring running in the house with a foot of grass growing on the LR floor. Got the water shut down and notified BOA. They sent me back for a damage report and i considered it a total loss. Haven't heard a thing for 12 months and now they send a re-secure order and wint. :stupid::stupid::stupid: Door to home cannot even be opened as it is swelled shut now. What i nthe hell are they thinking?? I have had 21 wint orders from BOA the last 2 weeks. 17 out of the 21 did a lock change and bid the grass a year ago. We had many weeks of below zero weather last winter but now they are worried?????


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> BOA TO HALT FORECLOSURES IN 23 STATES.......
> 
> 
> A document obtained Friday by the Associated Press showed a Bank of America official acknowledging in a legal proceeding that she signed up to 8,000 foreclosure documents a month and typically didn't read them.
> 
> http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...TE=ap_template.html&CTIME=2010-10-01-19-47-05





Chase and GMAC are already doing it in these states......... how many hundreds of contractors are going to go broke and loose their house in the next 2 months from these states???


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> BOA TO HALT FORECLOSURES IN 23 STATES.......
> 
> 
> A document obtained Friday by the Associated Press showed a Bank of America official acknowledging in a legal proceeding that she signed up to 8,000 foreclosure documents a month and typically didn't read them.
> 
> http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/storie...TE=ap_template.html&CTIME=2010-10-01-19-47-05


Wow. They have created a HUGE mess for themselves. Expect work to slow down for a little while from BOA while they audit their foreclosure docs.

_*Those states are:*_

_*Connecticut, Delaware, Florida, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Vermont and Wisconsin.*_

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I've been hearing about Chase and GMAC in little bits and pieces. Nothing like this article about BOA, though.

This article is pretty revealing, isn't it? 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I believe that we've just seen the tip of the ice berg and that the entire industry is a major lawsuit looking for a good place to happen. I just hope that there aren't hapless contractors swept up in this mess. We have no ability to know any thing about the legal process and shouldn't be involved in such lawsuits.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

No, we sure don't. We are a 3rd or 4th party and are not privy to the clients' files.

We just got slammed in California and I just took on 2 new clients today. Your intuition about something happening soon may just be coming true.:thumbup:

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> Another assanine W/O from BOA. A year ago i was sent to a property to secure it and found a spring running in the house with a foot of grass growing on the LR floor. Got the water shut down and notified BOA. They sent me back for a damage report and i considered it a total loss. Haven't heard a thing for 12 months and now they send a re-secure order and wint. :stupid::stupid::stupid: Door to home cannot even be opened as it is swelled shut now.


lol. I remember you telling us about that one, Matt. Sorry to hear they are sending you back out to resecure. Maybe they don't want the grass getting out.....or the critters that might be living in it.:laughing:

LInda


----------



## mtmtnman

For everyones enjoyment.........


----------



## Guest

I am not in one of the 23 effected states but I have a feeling it will be affects for all even outside those 23 states. On bofa secures I call into the hotline untill 2 days ago I have always recieved a confirmation to secure the property, But last two days more then half I have been denied on which caught me by surprised as most of these properties seem kind of obvious to me.

I still feel kind of lucky as another client I have sent me a big bulk of wints which will help me get around the slow down if this continues into november when grass cuts go away.


----------



## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> I am not in one of the 23 effected states but I have a feeling it will be affects for all even outside those 23 states. On bofa secures I call into the hotline untill 2 days ago I have always recieved a confirmation to secure the property, But last two days more then half I have been denied on which caught me by surprised as most of these properties seem kind of obvious to me.
> 
> I still feel kind of lucky as another client I have sent me a big bulk of wints which will help me get around the slow down if this continues into november when grass cuts go away.





What is so odd is the same things that one agent will approve are the same ones that the very next won't approve.

For example.... electric on/off. With digital meters and no visible lights on interior just how in the world are you supposed to tell if the electric is on or off????????????????

And yet uncertainty about the electric status will get you denied to proceed by one agent. The one right before allowed electric on and gas on without a moments hesitation.


----------



## agcreno

mtmtnman said:


> Another assanine W/O from BOA. A year ago i was sent to a property to secure it and found a spring running in the house with a foot of grass growing on the LR floor. Got the water shut down and notified BOA. They sent me back for a damage report and i considered it a total loss. Haven't heard a thing for 12 months and now they send a re-secure order and wint. :stupid::stupid::stupid: Door to home cannot even be opened as it is swelled shut now. What i nthe hell are they thinking?? I have had 21 wint orders from BOA the last 2 weeks. 17 out of the 21 did a lock change and bid the grass a year ago. We had many weeks of below zero weather last winter but now they are worried?????


 

Have a little fun with this one and submit a bid to mow the living room!:laughing:


----------



## Guest

hi everyone, i've been lurking around for a couple weeks.
first, i'd like to thank all who post in this thread.
the information and discussion has been quite helpful, even though i'm not all the way through it yet.

about me...
g-pa & dad were both union carpenters so i've been around construction all my life. i didn't follow them though, i went for concrete and have been a finisher for over 17 years. my wife and i started P&P back in april and cover 11 counties in NE indiana. 
we work for what i think you guys call a regional(they only cover indiana). we get work through them from altisource and have just started getting a few ams jobs as well.

since i know you all like to share stories about work, i thought i'd sign up and share a story also.
i was doing some googling and a page came up that had the post quoted below. 

linda,
about the new locks. 
you say because of security issues you hope for altisource's clients sake they work.
i'm not sure who they are or who's assigning them jobs but there's someone else in my area that is doing altisource work. two weeks ago i went to a house that they re-keyed and couldn't gain entry by typing in the code. when i typed in the code i could hear the mechanism working but the door would still be locked. thinking the slider may be getting stuck i tried again, still locked. took me only a couple minutes to decide to try pushing the "lock" button, sure enough it opened! went to another house last week... same thing! 
i guess it doesn't matter on the second house since it has an alarm:bangin:.






a1propertyclean said:


> 35 acres is a LOT of ground to cover. They sound like they're for real. But who knows?
> 
> Regarding my response to Altisource, I just sent this note:
> 
> _*"We are going to have to accept or decline work orders on a property by property basis. There will be a few vendors willing to put the money out for expensive locks but not very many.
> 
> I see a lot of security issues with these locks. I hope, for Altisource's clients' sake, they work more often than not."
> 
> *_Linda


----------



## BPWY

Altisource is so cheap how do you survive after the regional takes their discount?

$70 dry wint must be what??? $50 after they get their piece of the action? 
Not worth it to me thats for sure.


----------



## Guest

looking into starting with  Mccaffrey Properties,does anybody have any insight on them,there is alot of paper work to start,plus what has me is that they want me to get a photo uploader,even though i can send pics...plus it costs.08 cents per photo....any insight would be helpful... thanks....

Dan


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mullers said:


> looking into starting with Mccaffrey Properties,does anybody have any insight on them,there is alot of paper work to start,plus what has me is that they want me to get a photo uploader,even though i can send pics...plus it costs.08 cents per photo....any insight would be helpful... thanks....
> 
> Dan


Read the last comment at this forum thread in regards to McCaffrey Properties:

http://www.lawnsite.com/showthread.php?t=314320

They didn't elaborate but at least ONE person is not happy with them.

Linda


----------



## Guest

thanks,Linda i am still looking for a good company to start with any feed would be great....i live in eastern,pa...

Dan


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Altisource is so cheap how do you survive after the regional takes their discount?
> 
> $70 dry wint must be what??? $50 after they get their piece of the action?
> *Not worth it to me thats for sure.*


well you know how them new guy low ballers are :notworthy

it was good at first when we were busy as heck - literally 12 or more hours a day 7days/week.
volume made up for the lower price.
thought they(prices) were "alright" till coming here and doing some searching on the net. 
also helps that i have minimal overhead. only fixed cost is insurance and mobile internet for my laptop.
all equipment paid for. personal vehicles, work truck & trailer, commercial grade mowing setup, no mortgage... bla bla bla... am very fortunate.

i'm starting to feel it though since work has slowed. now quite sure but something has been going on with hud, fannie mae, ect are distributing work in indiana through the nationals. anyone have some insight on that?

our regional says they just signed up with ams, a2z, and another i forget the name. we've only seen about 4 re-cleans from ams though.

we looked at the vendor packet for fas. i'm not sure i'm liking a couple things on their price list and vendor contract. 
somebody know of a national that has some volume in north eastern indiana?

funny just after signing up here i see the link above for lawnsite.
i'm a member there too under name of superPRO


----------



## BPWY

anonymous user said:


> well you know how them new guy low ballers are :notworthy
> 
> it was good at first when we were busy as heck - literally 12 or more hours a day 7days/week.
> volume made up for the lower price.
> thought they(prices) were "alright" till coming here and doing some searching on the net.
> also helps that i have minimal overhead. only fixed cost is insurance and mobile internet for my laptop.
> all equipment paid for. personal vehicles, work truck & trailer, commercial grade mowing setup, no mortgage... bla bla bla... am very fortunate.
> 
> i'm starting to feel it though since work has slowed. now quite sure but something has been going on with hud, fannie mae, ect are distributing work in indiana through the nationals. anyone have some insight on that?
> 
> our regional says they just signed up with ams, a2z, and another i forget the name. we've only seen about 4 re-cleans from ams though.
> 
> we looked at the vendor packet for fas. i'm not sure i'm liking a couple things on their price list and vendor contract.
> somebody know of a national that has some volume in north eastern indiana?
> 
> funny just after signing up here i see the link above for lawnsite.
> i'm a member there too under name of superPRO






I'd stay far far far away from FAS. I worked for them thru another company last yr for less than 3 months. Their prices are too cheap to break even when working directly for them, let alone after some one else takes a discount. Same goes for all the other companies you mentioned.
FAS has a bad habit like Safeguard of charge backs. Or simply not paying. 
The reason that the time working for them was less than 3 months was that they couldn't figure out how to pay. Even after stopping work for them and telling them no pay means no work they still couldn't figure out how to cut a check. It was a big cluster and I lost a lot of money with them. Combined all the jobs I did for them I never broke even across the board. That don't work so well.

Keep in mind that while you have a paid for house, a paid for truck and all your equipment is paid for that its wearing out. And one day will need replaced. Paid for equipment doesn't mean that you can work cheap and be able to remain in biz for real long.
Your best bet is to obtain your own insurance and step out on your own.
Nobody that is already working in IN is going to give you the list of companies that have work. That would be cutting their income. You'll have to do your own research and read thru this thread. Over the pages different company names have been mentioned, some are good some not so much.


----------



## mtmtnman

More stupidity. The bank is pitching a fit because i didn't mow this.






































They have never hear the term "Natural Mountain Landscaping"  This is a $500,000 duplex and there is $5,000,000 homes that look the exact same way in this ski resort town..........................


----------



## BPWY

That property does need fire abatement. 

You should bid it as such. Big coins.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> That property does need fire abatement.
> 
> You should bid it as such. Big coins.


Do anything with that creek right there and you'll be answering to the DNRC. All the homes up there are like that. Snow sticks till mid June and falls mid October.


Here are a few pics of other stuff up there for sale.


----------



## mtmtnman




----------



## BPWY

Nice houses but its insane to have that type of fuel load that close and in some of the pix
right against the houses. Say what you will, they still NEED to be abated. Probably won't get
done, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't. The forest service spends a lot of money to 
educate folks on the need for and proper fire abatement. Trimming out branches and the fuel 
load near the houses is not going to get you in trouble with the DNR. Call em tomorrow and 
have them fax you the regs prohibiting. I betcha they can't/wont.


----------



## BPWY

Here is what it should look like, you got to have a defensible area around the house or if there is a fire the FD may just let yours burn because they cannot defend it.


----------



## BPWY

more


----------



## agcreno

MTMTNMAN is absolutely right not to touch the landscape at that house the liability could be HUGE... At best you need a letter from the governing body in that area authorizing you to do whatever as far as trimming natural landscape...It is almost EXACTLY like Lake Tahoe in our area. You need a permit in Lake Tahoe to Fart...They prosecute at will for even trimming a tree that "in their opinion" will alter the natural landscape and the FINES are unbelievable.


----------



## mtmtnman

Removing the underbrush causes erosion in the creek bed. This is a very wet area. Not to likely to burn. Here is an areal map.

http://maps.google.com/maps?client=...03,-114.357226&spn=0.010597,0.033023&t=h&z=16


----------



## BPWY

agcreno said:


> MTMTNMAN is absolutely right not to touch the landscape at that house the liability could be HUGE... At best you need a letter from the governing body in that area authorizing you to do whatever as far as trimming natural landscape...It is almost EXACTLY like Lake Tahoe in our area. You need a permit in Lake Tahoe to Fart...They prosecute at will for even trimming a tree that "in their opinion" will alter the natural landscape and the FINES are unbelievable.





I've heard about that stuff. 

The fact that they won't allow it does not negate the NEED for it. Ask any wildland fire fighter.


----------



## agcreno

The local wildland fire guy will likely agree...Its the (TRPA in our area who governs it) that will tell you to leave it alone... and also will be who gives you the fine for messing with it. You cant even imagine how many properties that need a 30' defensible space don't have it because of TRPA... Wild and beautiful, Right...


----------



## mtmtnman

agcreno said:


> The local wildland fire guy will likely agree...Its the (TRPA in our area who governs it) that will tell you to leave it alone... and also will be who gives you the fine for messing with it. You cant even imagine how many properties that need a 30' defensible space don't have it because of TRPA... Wild and beautiful, Right...



These places are lucky to be 30' apart. Can we tear down the neighbors to make defendable space????:clap::clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Wow. They have created a HUGE mess for themselves. Expect work to slow down for a little while from BOA while they audit their foreclosure docs.
> 
> _*Those states are:*_
> 
> _*Connecticut, Delaware, Florida, Hawaii, Illinois, Indiana, Iowa, Kansas, Kentucky, Louisiana, Maine, Nebraska, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, South Carolina, South Dakota, Vermont and Wisconsin.*_
> 
> Linda



GLAD to see Nevada isn't in that list !!!!!!


----------



## Guest

*e/o insurance*

alright i got a new topic that i need information regarding.....i've postponed for 3 years doing business with any client that require E/O insurance but i think i might consider it....so i called my GL insurance broker and inquired about it...they are telling me they can't write a policy or even offer a rider for E/O insurance for a company like mine because it's not needed and not warranted because i don't work with contracts.....any incite???


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I'm with you, Mike. I'm glad Nevada isn't in that list. But we service 44 states and our workload could be affected eventually.

I also don't deal with clients that require E&O. I needed it when I was a notary but I don't believe in it for this business. I believe that the asset management companies should carry it, since they deal directly with the banks.

I'm not going to consider it unless forced.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Sounds like major shake ups coming, there might be all of us looking for a job.


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704029304575526182962738098.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

I heard today that a nation wide 90 day moratorium is coming.


----------



## Guest

D&R,
E&O Insurance? The nationals require. York Jersey is the only place that offers a policy with "per occurence" and not a "claims made" policy. BIG DIFFERENCE! 
If anyone in the P&P field does not believe you "NEED" it is 100% wrong...Ask me? I just wrote out the $5000 deductible check last week for a claim that had absolutely 100% nothing to do with us but due to the "contracts" that the service companies require you to sign they are held harmless and indemnified for any claim and if YOU are the last person there (or in our case the first and only person there) than YOU pay for all the defense costs...IE E&O Policy. Service company sent us into a house 4 days premature--as if we are supplied that information? NO its called "proprietary information" duh stupid us!

Also when the fallout starts happening from the incorrect (illegally) signed papers and the crap runs downhill to the contractors shoes than you had better have E&O insurance to cover your lawyer bills and the defense costs you will incur from the Service Companies cuz your General Liability Insurance won't UNLESS you have Commercial General Liability that expressly covers Property Preservation (Named in the ISO Forms). Otherwise get ready to be an illegal in Mexico since you can only run 

This is only my opinion but.... I have already been contacted by law firms wanting to recruite our contractors to start hunting down past foreclosed homeowners. Do not believe these moratoriums will only be in "selected" States my friends since many of us knew it was coming several weeks ago. Its just Convenient that its happening 1 month before the mid-term elections huh? 

I have been told it will be a very very slow Holiday season ie... no work. Hunker down-it will get straightened out in a few months if you can hold on 

Oh yeah...---- Its only my opinion.


----------



## mtmtnman

"per occurrence" & "claims made". Totally confused! Maybe i don't have enough coffee in me? The only explanation i can find makes no sense!

http://www.wrslawyers.com/articles/claims-made-insurance.pdf

From what i am reading per occurrence pays from the 1st day you where insured with the policy and claims made pays only if loss is between your renewal dates???????????????????????


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> D&R,
> E&O Insurance? The nationals require. York Jersey is the only place that offers a policy with "per occurence" and not a "claims made" policy. BIG DIFFERENCE!
> If anyone in the P&P field does not believe you "NEED" it is 100% wrong...Ask me? I just wrote out the $5000 deductible check last week for a claim that had absolutely 100% nothing to do with us but due to the "contracts" that the service companies require you to sign they are held harmless and indemnified for any claim and if YOU are the last person there (or in our case the first and only person there) than YOU pay for all the defense costs...IE E&O Policy. Service company sent us into a house 4 days premature--as if we are supplied that information? NO its called "proprietary information" duh stupid us!
> 
> Also when the fallout starts happening from the incorrect (illegally) signed papers and the crap runs downhill to the contractors shoes than you had better have E&O insurance to cover your lawyer bills and the defense costs you will incur from the Service Companies cuz your General Liability Insurance won't UNLESS you have Commercial General Liability that expressly covers Property Preservation (Named in the ISO Forms). Otherwise get ready to be an illegal in Mexico since you can only run
> 
> This is only my opinion but.... I have already been contacted by law firms wanting to recruite our contractors to start hunting down past foreclosed homeowners. Do not believe these moratoriums will only be in "selected" States my friends since many of us knew it was coming several weeks ago. Its just Convenient that its happening 1 month before the mid-term elections huh?
> 
> I have been told it will be a very very slow Holiday season ie... no work. Hunker down-it will get straightened out in a few months if you can hold on
> 
> Oh yeah...---- Its only my opinion.




i'm with BPMY, in the respect that you lost me fremontreo.....E/O insurance is for important information left out of a contract....but i've never written or signed a contact since i begun working....I submit bids, and then invoices once work is completed.....i see the need for brokers, real estate agents, insurance agents etc but why us p&p vendors?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Sounds like major shake ups coming, there might be all of us looking for a job.
> 
> 
> http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704029304575526182962738098.html?mod=googlenews_wsj
> 
> I heard today that a nation wide 90 day moratorium is coming.




another moratorium....the first one didn't work at all, it just made alot of work for us when it ended !!!!! it's good for those that can hold out for 90 days


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Moratoriums are a huge joke, in my opinion. All they do is delay the inevitable, in most cases, and give the banks time to catch up with their loads, which they probably don't do anyway.

At the end of every year, this is the preservation industry's Christmas bonus............ little or no work during the 2 months of holidays and another 2 months afterwards.:laughing: Have you noticed, though, that grass continues to grow in the Western states and fines from code violations are being compounded every month and vacant properties are still being vandalised. 

A good-sized portion of the homeowners facing foreclosure already expect to be evicted and have given up on maintaining their properties..... and a lot of them are causing damage because they're angry.

So, at the end of the moratorium, the banks expect us to do more and offer us less in the way of compensation. Whoo hoo! I'm all in. How about the rest of you? :notworthy

Sorry for the negativity but I'm in a rotten mood today. I actually came in here to rant about something else and found Mike's post instead....... lol

I'll just get through everything today and, if I'm still pissed, will come back later and rant. No, it's not about clients. Actually, we're swamped and the clients are awesome.

Hint: CT Newbies who contact me and don't give enough info for me to work with. I'm going to..... okay, never mind. I'd better :shutup: now before I get started again.:whistling

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Linda don't hold back, tell us how you really feel about the matter :laughing: :laughing:



I'm slammed busy here myself, its a good thing. 
The last 10 months have not been kind to me.




Oh and I can agree with the top half or 2/3rds of your post.


----------



## brm1109

*E&amp;O Insurance*

I had also spoken a while ago to my agent. He also agreed that there is no ned for that since I don't do contracts.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I had also spoken a while ago to my agent. He also agreed that there is no ned for that since I don't do contracts.






A yr ago when I was trying to locate my own insurance that is what I was told all over the place. 
"there is no need for you to have E&O for the type of work your are doing".


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Linda don't hold back, tell us how you really feel about the matter :laughing: :laughing:


Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh and :furious:. Does that help? :laughing:

I'm a little better now that my internet isn't having problems. It's been really bad all day long and putting me behind schedule. It even shut down for a couple hours with no warning and what I thought to be no reason.

Come to find out, it was the guys cutting the tree off the roof. We had a 40 foot tree struck by lightning Saturday and it fell across the yard and onto the roof.

Fortunately, I was in the process of moving in and my HUGE custom trailer deflected it away from our front door, which we had our motorcycles parked just outside of, and through the roof, eaves, and overhang of an empty apartment unit.

I have insurance on the trailer and bikes but, if we'd lost ANY of that, I'd have been upset to have to file a claim for their replacements. Not to mention, of course, that my trailer was filled to the max with stuff I can't move into this place because of its size. The trailer itself is 8' wide by 17' long with 6' high expanded metal sides, with a tongue of 3.5 feet so you can imagine the load in it. 

I easily could have lost quite a bit and I feel extremely relieved that I didn't lose a thing.

Anyway, I digress..............

Apparently, the guys being on the roof were causing interference with the internet radio and I couldn't keep a steady enough signal to get through my workload, then it was out altogether. I don't know if they bumped it or maybe left part of the tree they were cutting down in front of it. So I've been pretty stressed out all day.

THEN, on top of everything, I'm reviewing vendors for work orders I don't have coverage for yet and ALMOST NOBODY is putting their STATE in the subject line, as I've requested probably a million times, nor are they listing the counties they service, which we REALLY, REALLY need in order to search a new vendor when we have work.

Here's a prime example of what I get to deal with:

*Hi, I just started up a new property preservation company and I'd like to know if you have any work for us?*

Huh? Where are you? Who are you? No signature, no way to tell where they are. So I respond like this:

*Hi, where are you located, what counties do you service, and can you give me information about your company?*

*I'm in Texas and my name is Fred.*

_*Okay, Fred. What counties do you service?*_

*I live in Waco.*

For those of you who have never tried to screen vendors, you may not realize how much grief we are caused and time is wasted by e-mails like this one.

I now have an autoresponder up that simply says:

*Vendors:*

_*If you have not already put your STATE in the subject line of your e-mail, please do so and re-send it.*_

_*In the body of the e-mail [or file attachment], please provide a list of the COUNTIES in the STATE or STATES you service.*_

_*DO NOT SEND US A LIST OF CITIES OR ZIP CODES. WE ONLY SEARCH BY COUNTY WHEN WE NEED VENDORS. EVEN IF YOU COVER THE ENTIRE STATE, YOU STILL NEED TO LIST THE COUNTIES.*_

_*We receive a LOT of mail so, the easier you make it on us, the faster we can find you and get you through the review process. If we don't have what we need, you may not hear from us.*_

*Thanks!*

I have tried every trick in the book to get what I need from prospective vendors and am still going through this, even with the autoresponse. I still get this............. Waco............ ONE word, no name, no company, no phone.............. *GOOD-BYE, PROSPECT!!!!!*

If we don't get anything within the first couple of tries, the potential vendor goes into the *REJECTION* folder, which we *KEEP IN THE ARCHIVES* in case they try again. And you'd be surprised at how many of them STILL don't get it, even after it's been a year. Oh, yes, we get lots of duplicate requests. People simply forget who they've e-mailed and e-mail again.:jester:

And then there are those that e-mail to every single e-mail address at our website, including our CLIENT mailbox.

I could go on and on with this but...................... I could be here all night and I just don't have that kind of time right now.

Well, this took longer than I expected and now I have to get back to work. 

Oh. BTW. The tree thingy was on the Channel 13 news on Saturday [Las Vegas]. The came during the day and we left for dinner :laughing:, then they came back at night and filmed it live. We left for Bikefest when they arrived and let the manager do the interview.:thumbsup: I've been on TV enough. No need to be there again. lol

Okay, y'all. I'm done. One more bid to wrap up and 2 more work orders to get out and I'm hitting the sack.

Have a great night.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

Ask your agent if your general liability will pay attorneys costs if your sued when you make a mistake. E&O is really insurance to protect you and your business in the event a client alleges they’ve suffered a financial loss as a result of an error or an omission committed by you in the delivery of your services, whereas General Liability is designed to provide coverage to you for primarily bodily injury, advertising, or property damage liability.


----------



## BPWY

Linda if they are that incapable of following directions you DO NOT want them working for you!

But you already knew that. 

unreal!


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh and :furious:. Does that help? :laughing:
> 
> I'm a little better now that my internet isn't having problems. It's been really bad all day long and putting me behind schedule. It even shut down for a couple hours with no warning and what I thought to be no reason.
> 
> Come to find out, it was the guys cutting the tree off the roof. We had a 40 foot tree struck by lightning Saturday and it fell across the yard and onto the roof.
> 
> Fortunately, I was in the process of moving in and my HUGE custom trailer deflected it away from our front door, which we had our motorcycles parked just outside of, and through the roof, eaves, and overhang of an empty apartment unit.
> 
> I have insurance on the trailer and bikes but, if we'd lost ANY of that, I'd have been upset to have to file a claim for their replacements. Not to mention, of course, that my trailer was filled to the max with stuff I can't move into this place because of its size. The trailer itself is 8' wide by 17' long with 6' high expanded metal sides, with a tongue of 3.5 feet so you can imagine the load in it.
> 
> I easily could have lost quite a bit and I feel extremely relieved that I didn't lose a thing.
> 
> Anyway, I digress..............
> 
> Apparently, the guys being on the roof were causing interference with the internet radio and I couldn't keep a steady enough signal to get through my workload, then it was out altogether. I don't know if they bumped it or maybe left part of the tree they were cutting down in front of it. So I've been pretty stressed out all day.
> 
> THEN, on top of everything, I'm reviewing vendors for work orders I don't have coverage for yet and ALMOST NOBODY is putting their STATE in the subject line, as I've requested probably a million times, nor are they listing the counties they service, which we REALLY, REALLY need in order to search a new vendor when we have work.
> 
> Here's a prime example of what I get to deal with:
> 
> *Hi, I just started up a new property preservation company and I'd like to know if you have any work for us?*
> 
> Huh? Where are you? Who are you? No signature, no way to tell where they are. So I respond like this:
> 
> *Hi, where are you located, what counties do you service, and can you give me information about your company?*
> 
> *I'm in Texas and my name is Fred.*
> 
> _*Okay, Fred. What counties do you service?*_
> 
> *I live in Waco.*
> 
> For those of you who have never tried to screen vendors, you may not realize how much grief we are caused and time is wasted by e-mails like this one.
> 
> I now have an autoresponder up that simply says:
> 
> *Vendors:*
> 
> _*If you have not already put your STATE in the subject line of your e-mail, please do so and re-send it.*_
> 
> _*In the body of the e-mail [or file attachment], please provide a list of the COUNTIES in the STATE or STATES you service.*_
> 
> _*DO NOT SEND US A LIST OF CITIES OR ZIP CODES. WE ONLY SEARCH BY COUNTY WHEN WE NEED VENDORS. EVEN IF YOU COVER THE ENTIRE STATE, YOU STILL NEED TO LIST THE COUNTIES.*_
> 
> _*We receive a LOT of mail so, the easier you make it on us, the faster we can find you and get you through the review process. If we don't have what we need, you may not hear from us.*_
> 
> *Thanks!*
> 
> I have tried every trick in the book to get what I need from prospective vendors and am still going through this, even with the autoresponse. I still get this............. Waco............ ONE word, no name, no company, no phone.............. *GOOD-BYE, PROSPECT!!!!!*
> 
> If we don't get anything within the first couple of tries, the potential vendor goes into the *REJECTION* folder, which we *KEEP IN THE ARCHIVES* in case they try again. And you'd be surprised at how many of them STILL don't get it, even after it's been a year. Oh, yes, we get lots of duplicate requests. People simply forget who they've e-mailed and e-mail again.:jester:
> 
> And then there are those that e-mail to every single e-mail address at our website, including our CLIENT mailbox.
> 
> I could go on and on with this but...................... I could be here all night and I just don't have that kind of time right now.
> 
> Well, this took longer than I expected and now I have to get back to work.
> 
> Oh. BTW. The tree thingy was on the Channel 13 news on Saturday [Las Vegas]. The came during the day and we left for dinner :laughing:, then they came back at night and filmed it live. We left for Bikefest when they arrived and let the manager do the interview.:thumbsup: I've been on TV enough. No need to be there again. lol
> 
> Okay, y'all. I'm done. One more bid to wrap up and 2 more work orders to get out and I'm hitting the sack.
> 
> Have a great night.
> 
> Linda





longest post ever !!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

D&R Services said:


> longest post ever !!


Not.:laughing:

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

^^^^^^

Shortest post ever? :laughing:

Sorry. Couldn't resist. Actually, I think I've made longer posts in the past but you'd have to go back 91 pages to find out.:w00t:

Linda


----------



## Guest

OK I hate to do this but here goes since its a true life experience:

1)Service Company issues a work order to complete lockchange.
2)Lockchange completed
3)6 months later Service Company files a claim on P&P contractors Policy under the Additional Insured Endorsement (P&P contractor has no sayso in this either)
4)Law firm for homeowner sues bank and service company for changing locks 4 days to early. (Didn't sue the contractor)
5)P&P contractors *E&O* insurance had to pay $21k total to settle this claim. $17k was for legal fees (figures huh)

Now for information. 
The Commercial General Liability policy would *NOT* pay for this claim. THATS what the E&O policy is for. This could happen to anyone in the business since unfortunately none of us is provided the information to allow us to make an informed decision if we were to early or not eh? Even the P&P contractor could not get the information after the lawsuit was filed since the P&P contractor has no right to "proprietary information"..huh but the P&P contractors checkbook was fine to rob from though....OH yeah a $5000 deductible for E&O so that hurt.

What nobody seems to understand is this...

Have you ever asked why do the Service Companies recruit *so many* contractors and spread the work so thin?

Answer) By having 1000's of subs and each sub has to add the additional insured endorsement to their $1,000,000 policy then in actuality the Service Company now has BILLIONS of dollars of insurance to draw from for claims. This is used as a selling tool when trying to acquire contracts with the banks. That is also why the banks don't normally use the "little guys" in the business since the little guy does not have enough insurance coverage. 

IMO the big claims are still coming and maybe this legal snafu with the moratorium is going to "run downhill" and hit the contractors insurance policies?... Who knows? Paranoia?
Think of all the 100,000's of homeowners who have purchased a foreclosed home who NOW do not have a clear title? Guess the lawyers will be suing the title insurance companies who then will subrogate to the Service Companies who in turn has an "indemnity clause" in thier contracts that allows them to turn the claims onto all the P&P contractors insurance policies (they all have the indemnification clause-at least the big ones I'm familiar with). Now You and I sit here and yell that "they can't do that" but they most certainly can and we signed our name to the contract that gave them permission...Kinda like selling your soul eh? 

Before long something will have to give since I think that in the very near future you and I won't have enough money to buy an insurance policy for this business..... 
JMHO
OK gotta quite ranting or someone will call me Linda :clap:


----------



## BPWY

Here are only a few of the "foreclosure freeze" articles that I have found, type those two words into your favorite search engine. You too will be sickened at what is about to happen to your method of feeding your family.


http://www.cbs7kosa.com/news/details.asp?ID=21869

http://www.thestreet.com/story/10881554/1/more-states-push-foreclosure-freeze.html

http://www.palmbeachpost.com/money/...-freeze-leaves-buyers-in-the-cold-957604.html


> Norman Lachance is living with a friend after he was told 90 minutes before he was to get the keys for a bank-owned home last week that Fannie Mae was canceling the closing.


----------



## Guest

for the post above 

i'm wondering if an E&O policy could be written that would hold the party that files the claim responsible for the deductible.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> OK I hate to do this but here goes since its a true life experience:
> 
> 1)Service Company issues a work order to complete lockchange.
> 2)Lockchange completed
> 3)6 months later Service Company files a claim on P&P contractors Policy under the Additional Insured Endorsement (P&P contractor has no sayso in this either)
> 4)Law firm for homeowner sues bank and service company for changing locks 4 days to early. (Didn't sue the contractor)
> 5)P&P contractors *E&O* insurance had to pay $21k total to settle this claim. $17k was for legal fees (figures huh)
> 
> Now for information.
> The Commercial General Liability policy would *NOT* pay for this claim. THATS what the E&O policy is for. This could happen to anyone in the business since unfortunately none of us is provided the information to allow us to make an informed decision if we were to early or not eh? Even the P&P contractor could not get the information after the lawsuit was filed since the P&P contractor has no right to "proprietary information"..huh but the P&P contractors checkbook was fine to rob from though....OH yeah a $5000 deductible for E&O so that hurt.
> 
> What nobody seems to understand is this...
> 
> Have you ever asked why do the Service Companies recruit *so many* contractors and spread the work so thin?
> 
> Answer) By having 1000's of subs and each sub has to add the additional insured endorsement to their $1,000,000 policy then in actuality the Service Company now has BILLIONS of dollars of insurance to draw from for claims. This is used as a selling tool when trying to acquire contracts with the banks. That is also why the banks don't normally use the "little guys" in the business since the little guy does not have enough insurance coverage.
> 
> IMO the big claims are still coming and maybe this legal snafu with the moratorium is going to "run downhill" and hit the contractors insurance policies?... Who knows? Paranoia?
> Think of all the 100,000's of homeowners who have purchased a foreclosed home who NOW do not have a clear title? Guess the lawyers will be suing the title insurance companies who then will subrogate to the Service Companies who in turn has an "indemnity clause" in thier contracts that allows them to turn the claims onto all the P&P contractors insurance policies (they all have the indemnification clause-at least the big ones I'm familiar with). Now You and I sit here and yell that "they can't do that" but they most certainly can and we signed our name to the contract that gave them permission...Kinda like selling your soul eh?
> 
> Before long something will have to give since I think that in the very near future you and I won't have enough money to buy an insurance policy for this business.....
> JMHO
> OK gotta quite ranting or someone will call me Linda :clap:



actually in las vegas you can go to a website call www.accessclarkcounty.com and it has the recorder site showing if title has changed hands. I'm not sure if every state/city/county has a similar website but title recording is public records. I will never go to a property unless i can verify that title has taken place and publicly recorded by the county. I scan that along with the work order and keep both in my property file and I've only had to go thru what you went thru once and that stood up in court. I had a work order requesting the job from the service company that was requested from the bank that had title. i had county/state record showing they were legal title holder and had the authority to request the locks to be changed. IF i can't identify that the service company's client is the bank on record then i request one of two things from the service company. Either a letter from them identifying the requester of the service, or the documentation from their client requesting as long as that documentation is exactly the same as the name on record......that's a few steps and it takes me a little extra time but as you all read from his post, a 5k deductible vs a 25.00 lock change is a no brainer !!!!!

Here's another peice of info....be careful of the contracts you sign for these service companies and stay away from one's that REQUIRE e/o insurance because as fremontreo states, it's an open checkbook for them!!!


----------



## Guest

Hi - My partner and I work with two PP companies in the NorCal area and things are good. I come from a real estate background. I’m curious how one get in touch with a bank to get the opportunity to present bids directly. I look for to your response and help. 

Joe


----------



## Guest

*Connecticut Property Preservation*

Hey Linda,

I submitted a request for vendor work in CT. I"m pretty sure I included everything you ask for ( state, counties, pics, name, etc )
We currently work directly with REO agents ( busy, but want to be busier ) Looking for a company that has a lot of work for us.
Been in business for a year now. Initial inspection to complete re-habs
We are EPA lead cert, HUD guidelines cert, etc, etc.

Thanks
Dan
S&S Property Preservation


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> OK gotta quite ranting or someone will call me Linda :clap:


rotflmao........... touche'! :thumbsup:

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> Hey Linda,
> 
> I submitted a request for vendor work in CT. I"m pretty sure I included everything you ask for ( state, counties, pics, name, etc )
> We currently work directly with REO agents ( busy, but want to be busier ) Looking for a company that has a lot of work for us.
> Been in business for a year now. Initial inspection to complete re-habs
> We are EPA lead cert, HUD guidelines cert, etc, etc.
> 
> Thanks
> Dan
> S&S Property Preservation


Dan ~

I'm pretty sure I got yours. Problem is we're really swamped right now and I've only been able to review vendors for the areas we're being hit the hardest.

I just went to my general mailbox and sat there for 2 hours forwarding mail to the review mailbox. People are sending requests to the wrong mailbox and I don't open the general box very often, due to all the spam I get there.

It could take a couple weeks to get to you. Right now I'm focusing on central and northern California and ALL of Massachusetts. I'm literally being bombarded in both states and just picked up a new client in Florida who may keep us busy there.

Be patient, if you can. I will get to you as soon as I can catch my breath.

Thanks!

Linda


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## mtmtnman

Hasty exit out of this business is not soon enough for me.......

Got this from one of my companies today.

We have recently received a massive amount of price adjustments from HUD. We have researched these items using a cost estimator system and we have also been working very closely with HUD to determine how their decision to adjust the price was made. HUD clearly advised that the bids for debris and reglazing have been excessive. 
HUD informed us today that the industry standard price for debris removal is $25.00 per cubic yard. They are paying the $50.00 per cubic yard, however they are paying based on your bid photos and the size of dumpster needed. When reviewing the photos, they justify the adjustments based on items that can be compacted into the dumpster / trailer. Attached is the document HUD uses when approving debris removal. Please be sure when bidding debris that you follow these guidelines as HUD advised they will continue to cut our prices. Please also include the following in your bids for debris removal:

·Number of cubic yards (photos must justify)
·Size of dumpster / trailer that is being used (ex: 20 yard dumpster, or 10 yard trailer)

In regards to reglazing, HUD has informed us that the set price of $30.00 needs to be followed. They will not approve any higher without the support of a cost estimator. We have researched the pricing of reglazing on the cost estimator and the average is as follows:

·$4.51 per square foot for single pane
·$13.25 per square foot for thermopane 


I'm sorry but you can't even buy the glass for what they are offering less a 20% discount!!! I just paid $75 from a local glass company for a 24" X 36" thermopane panel installed in the frame i brought them! Now i have to drive 40 miles and install the panel, take picture and upload photos a WAIT FOR 45 DAYS TO GET PAID TO BOOT while i give the national a 20% discount? How much in the hole am i now??


There will not be many quality people in this business if this garbage keeps up!!


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## mtmtnman

I forgot the best part!!

"We will no longer accept bids without the details that we have requested. If you cannot follow these bidding instructions, we have no choice but to locate another contractor to do so. We will also not allow contractors to pick and choose the work they would like to bid on. As preservation contractors, you are responsible to report and bid all work needed at a property."


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## Guest

Is this FB that sent this letter out?


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## mtmtnman

ImperialPS said:


> Is this FB that sent this letter out?


yes but i got a very similar one from another national......


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## BPWY

As always the gooberment are clueless bumbling IDIOTS.

That letter claimed that the national going rate for debris removal is $25 but out of the kindness of their heart HUD is paying $50.
What a crock. There are many places that it costs near $25 just for disposal. At a landfill near me on a recent trip where I wanted my truck empty and they were going to be the only place that was open it cost me $30 for a level full short bed pickup load. Not heaped up, and not a long bed. At another facility I can dispose of about 22 yrds on my trailer for $47.


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## BPWY

Well they finally admit that the foreclosure freeze is all about politics.

http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2...pe-avoid-their-own-eviction-foreclosure-moves

A statement lifted from the article....


> By leaving defaulted lenders in homes, it saves banks from dealing with upkeep........
> http://politics.blogs.foxnews.com/2...-own-eviction-foreclosure-moves#ixzz11kuTOuEV​



suuuure it does, every body here knows that when we go to do initial services that we find the property is beautifully maintained......not.


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## BPWY

In some markets up to 30% of the bank owned listings have been pulled.

http://www.wtsp.com/news/mostpop/story.aspx?storyid=149848&provider=top


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## Guest

*Connecticut Preservation*

Thanks Linda

Will look forward to the opportunity to work with you. We just did 3 winterizations for Florida's Finest Industries on Wednesday, first time doing work for them. Ever hear of them ? As with most vendors ( i assume ) we're a little concerned about working for someone we've never met in person, and is a thousand miles away and then hope to get paid. I'm a face to face kinda guy, have met all the REO agents we do work for and most of the time they meet us at the property to go over everything that needs to be done so we're all on the same page. Obviously we have to take our chances if we are going to work with out of state companies. BTW, I neglected to add 2 counties in NY ( Putnam, Westchester ) when I submitted my info. We are on the CT / NY border so we cover those Counties in NY

Thanks again, hope to hear from you soon

Dan
S&S property Preservation


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## Guest

*Trash out costs*

I see some of the pricing across the country and can understand making some money on trash outs. In Fairfield County CT things are expensive. Approx $350-$400 for a 20yrd dumpster, $150 to dump a full ( cab height ) pick-up truck. I can't afford to pay helpers on those jobs, going rate for help in this area is $10-$12 an hr. nobody wants to work for less than that. Gotta do it myself to make any money. Tough business sometimes if you want to make a dollar


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## Guest

danny1217 said:


> I see some of the pricing across the country and can understand making some money on trash outs. In Fairfield County CT things are expensive. Approx $350-$400 for a 20yrd dumpster, $150 to dump a full ( cab height ) pick-up truck. I can't afford to pay helpers on those jobs, going rate for help in this area is $10-$12 an hr. nobody wants to work for less than that. Gotta do it myself to make any money. Tough business sometimes if you want to make a dollar





YIKES !!!!![email protected]#[email protected]!!!!! :wallbash:

in vegas i can get a 20yrd roll off for 176.80 and sometimes dump free at the landfill ( depends whos working lol) BE NICE TO LANDFILL EMPLOYEES AND THEY'LL BE NICE TO YOU!! and in case a local employee is reading this i soo never wrote this !!!! 

also not sure of CT but here minimum wage is 8.25 and last time i checked labor work is considered minimun wage....even though i've heard day labors at home depot won't work for under 12/hr lol :laughing: anywhooooo in these times it all about thinking outside the box ! good luck !!!!!


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## Guest

Mike,

I don't hire day laborers, for one I don't want to, and 2 it's a $500 fine if caught picking one up.
The best dumpster deal I've found in my area is $275 for a 20yrd,( 1ton limit ) but that's only when they run an internet special. Just got a ( interior )trash out job today for $300...........20yrds worth of stuff through a National. Did a trash out last week for a local REO agent $650 for the same amount of work. That might give you an idea of what the banks / servicers are willing to pay for the work but by the time it gets to us it's been cut in half and then some!
Here's a good example of working directly with REO agents ( if there was enough work to keep me busy everyday ). They often are forced to use the nationals, but when possible they call me. I'm doing this job early next week
Initial mowing $150( small yard )
Winterize $175
Lock change $125 ( front & back door )
Trash out $450 ( 15 yrds ) 
Needless to say, the money is much better directly through the REO agent but the nationals can offer regular work.


----------



## BPWY

BofA is shutting it down now.





> The move, along with another decision on foreclosures by PNC Financial Services Inc., adds to growing concerns that mortgage lenders have been evicting homeowners using flawed court papers.
> 
> Charlotte, N.C.-based Bank of America Corp., the nation's largest bank, said Friday it would stop sales of foreclosed homes in all 50 states as it reviews documents used to process foreclosures. A week earlier, the company had said it would only stop such sales in the 23 states where foreclosures must be approved by a judge.
> 
> "We will stop foreclosure sales until our assessment has been satisfactorily completed," company spokesman Dan Frahm said in a statement. "Our ongoing assessment shows the basis for our past foreclosure decisions is accurate."
> 
> Bank of America did not disclose how many homeowners would be affected.
> 
> State and federal officials have been ramping up pressure on the mortgage industry over worries about potential legal violations amid growing evidence that mortgage company employees or their lawyers signed documents in foreclosure cases without verifying the information in them. Also Friday, Sen. Christopher Dodd, D-Conn, the chairman of the Senate Banking Committee, said he would hold a hearing on the issue next month.
> 
> "American families should not have to worry about losing their homes to sloppy bureaucratic mismanagement or fraud," Dodd said. "Regulators at the federal, state, and local levels have a responsibility to uphold the law and protect consumers from unfair foreclosure, and lenders have a duty to not cut corners around the law."
> 
> A document obtained last week by the Associated Press showed a Bank of America official acknowledging in a legal proceeding that she signed thousands of foreclosure documents a month and typically didn't read them. The official, Renee Hertzler, said in a February deposition that she signed 7,000 to 8,000 foreclosure documents a month.
> 
> Earlier in the week, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., urged five large mortgage lenders to suspend foreclosures in Nevada until they have set up systems to make sure homeowners aren't "improperly directed into foreclosure proceedings." Nevada is not among the states where banks had suspended foreclosures.
> 
> Also Friday, PNC Financial Services Group Inc. said it is halting most foreclosures and evictions in 23 states for a month so it can review whether documents it submitted to courts complied with state laws. An official at the Pittsburgh-based bank confirmed the decision on Friday, which was reported earlier by the New York Times. The official requested anonymity because the decision hasn't been publicly announced.
> 
> PNC becomes the fourth major U.S. lender to halt some foreclosures amid evidence that mortgage company employees or their lawyers signed documents in foreclosure cases without verifying the information in them.
> 
> In addition to PNC and Bank of America, Ally Financial's GMAC Mortgage unit and JPMorgan Chase & Co. have announced similar moves in the past two weeks.
> 
> In some states, lenders can foreclose quickly on delinquent mortgage borrowers. By contrast, the 23 states use a lengthy court process. They require documents to verify information on the mortgage, including who owns it.
> 
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20101008/ap_on_bi_ge/us_foreclosure_mess


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## Guest

What a fiasco for everyone involved. We did a trash out and some repairs on a house in CT, then the agent listed it. He got 2 cash offers this week but was told by the lender they cannot sell until this is all figured out.
Unfortunate for the agent, but luckily we got paid for the work. I can see former owners moving back in to their re habbed house and staying for free until the cows come home. What a mess!
I only hope there are'nt law suits coming my way for discarding property left in the houses we trashed out over the last few months


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## mtmtnman

danny1217 said:


> I only hope there are'nt law suits coming my way for discarding property left in the houses we trashed out over the last few months


That is VERY likely to happen due to the contracts the nationals have written.......


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## BPWY

In Scottsbluff NE it costs $50 a ton for disposal at the landfill. 

Oh you wanted to rent a 30 yrd roll off???? Thats only $800 give or take a _few_ pennies.


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## mtmtnman

These 2 loads INCLUDING the dump trailer rental for 4 hours cost me $101.28 (Dump trailer was $66..............)


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## BPWY

Your mommy always said you were special. :laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## Guest

How many cy would you say that is ? The reason I ask is I had contracted out an order where he used a trailer that size for about 18 dump runs granted his loads were about 2 ft over the top with wooding sides to extend the sides. He is stating 461 cy I was thinking maybe not so much but not 178cy the bank is stating I am going to bat on this and willing to share the pics via email anyone wanting to give me a second opinion. Thanks toanyonewanting to look because Ibelieve I am really loosing my judgement on this.


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## mtmtnman

18 Cu Yds is what i had figured level full. No questions asked by the bank. Your guy would have to have 10' sides to get the kind of yardage he quoted you. I would guess with 2' sides your guy had 360 cu yds.


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## Guest

Landfills? Ah, the good ole' days. In my area we have "transfer stations". Everything gets weighed and accounted for before it gets sent off to some other state. Forget about trying to discard mattresses ( $20 ea ) tires ( $10 ea ) propane tanks ( $15 ea ) and anything with freon. They wonder why there are piles of junk in any open area behind buildings and along quiet roads. Our costs have steadily increased while the pay scale steadily drops, squeezing out the professionals for the fly by nights, cut corners kinda guys. Starting to lean more towards the re-hab / major repair jobs. GC it , take my 20% and call it a day


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## mtmtnman

danny1217 said:


> Landfills? Ah, the good ole' days. In my area we have "transfer stations". Everything gets weighed and accounted for before it gets sent off to some other state. Forget about trying to discard mattresses ( $20 ea ) tires ( $10 ea ) propane tanks ( $15 ea ) and anything with freon. They wonder why there are piles of junk in any open area behind buildings and along quiet roads. Our costs have steadily increased while the pay scale steadily drops, squeezing out the professionals for the fly by nights, cut corners kinda guys. Starting to lean more towards the re-hab / major repair jobs. GC it , take my 20% and call it a day



Sure makes me glad i live in a very unpopulated state. One of my subcontractors took a whole longbed pickup full of paint to one of our landfills that takes it. Cost him $15 for the load. This landfill has a guy that comes 2X a year to get the paint and recycles it.


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## Guest

Hey guys, I am now trying to expand to provide my services and hire sub-contractors. There are so many orders it's easy to become overwhelmed. 
I have been doing aggressive marketing for my company, I have applied to around 12 companies. All national except one. The one local company is the only one giving me work at the moment. I have also applied for BAC Field Services. 

I do not want to work with nationals to be honest, I would like to work directly for the banks and real estate agents. I have personally contacted numerous agents directly via email. When talking and trying to promote my services I'd like to explain how they can be reimbursed by HUD but I really don't understand it.

My questions laid out (because I get off track)
How can I market my services to avoid the middle man? 
How does HUD factor into this? Does HUD reimburse the REO Companies directly? 
The nationals have strict picture guidelines, working directly for REOC's and lending companies are the guidelines the same?


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## BPWY

Before you count too many $$ signs go to google news and type in "foreclosure freeze". Read thru the results that come up and then factor that into your business plan.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Before you count too many $$ signs go to google news and type in "foreclosure freeze". Read thru the results that come up and then factor that into your business plan.


Yep, I'm definitely aware of that. I am not in too deep to the point I can't settle down. I feel we can hold consistent business enough to pay the bills, that's all I'm looking for currently (that's what everyone says eh?). I offer free website building and online marketing of real estate after an agent has used our services but I'm not completely sure how to contact the right people.


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## BPWY

Cny Clean said:


> Yep, I'm definitely aware of that. I am not in too deep to the point I can't settle down. I feel we can hold consistent business enough to pay the bills,







For my sake I hope you are right.


But after the very slow (in this area) most of the last yr I'm not going to be holding my breath.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> For my sake I hope you are right.
> 
> 
> But after the very slow (in this area) most of the last yr I'm not going to be holding my breath.


We have been getting a TON of grass cuts. Like around 40/wk and I feel I could easily ask for double and they'd give it to me.


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## BPWY

Grass cuts are over the end of Oct. Enjoy the last 2 plus weeks.

I have one more cycle. I'm happy to be done.
BAC shut all of theirs down in this area the end of Sept.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Grass cuts are over the end of Oct. Enjoy the last 2 plus weeks.
> 
> I have one more cycle. I'm happy to be done.
> BAC shut all of theirs down in this area the end of Sept.


Then the snow removals come in, right?


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## BPWY

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:






Do not hold your breath on that!




In this area they (the banks) don't care. About 99% of the time is my experience.


In other areas such as yours you won't get much work either because the allowable is $40 to $50. 
Heres how it works. You go out to a property and determine that the snow is too deep to be able to do it for $50. So you bid it. It will take them 2 or more weeks (most likely) to approve the bid. 
In that time the sun shines and melts the top and it refreezes as ice making the job much more difficult. Then along comes another 8'' of snow on top. And you get bid approval. Now you are forced to do the whole thing for your bid approval price even tho there is much more work than what you bid for thanks the ice and the deeper snow.


From the questions you are asking its easy to tell you are new to the industry.


I'd get out while you still can and invest your hard earned capital some where else.

I'm looking and pursuing a way out as is every one I know personally in the biz. 
The nationals and the banks have teams of folks working on the newest and greatest way of screwing the contractor out of every last penny they can. While coming up with more and more and more regs and job requirements while they try to pay the same or less for more work.


Case in point. BAC's authorization calls. If you don't call in they won't pay you for the entire w/o, and they will not pay any extra for this requirement that takes up 15 to 30 mins of YOUR time on each and every job. Time that you didn't used to have to spend and time that they do not reimburse for.


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## BPWY

I'm curious how you expect to charge 20% less for janitorial and yet provide a superior service?

Some of these outfits are offering $50 janitorial pay for a full maid service. 20% less than that and a top notch white glove service???????


It isn't possible, you won't be in business for very long.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I'm curious how you expect to charge 20% less for janitorial and yet provide a superior service?
> 
> Some of these outfits are offering $50 janitorial pay for a full maid service. 20% less than that and a top notch white glove service???????
> 
> 
> It isn't possible, you won't be in business for very long.


Janitorial is for commercial offices. We do janitorial for business as well. That is a new customer limited price to entice offices and businesses to hire us to clean their business.
Also for trashouts we're willing to lose money in the beginning to acquire more business.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Do not hold your breath on that!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In this area they (the banks) don't care. About 99% of the time is my experience.
> 
> 
> In other areas such as yours you won't get much work either because the allowable is $40 to $50.
> Heres how it works. You go out to a property and determine that the snow is too deep to be able to do it for $50. So you bid it. It will take them 2 or more weeks (most likely) to approve the bid.
> In that time the sun shines and melts the top and it refreezes as ice making the job much more difficult. Then along comes another 8'' of snow on top. And you get bid approval. Now you are forced to do the whole thing for your bid approval price even tho there is much more work than what you bid for thanks the ice and the deeper snow.
> 
> 
> From the questions you are asking its easy to tell you are new to the industry.
> 
> 
> I'd get out while you still can and invest your hard earned capital some where else.
> 
> I'm looking and pursuing a way out as is every one I know personally in the biz.
> The nationals and the banks have teams of folks working on the newest and greatest way of screwing the contractor out of every last penny they can. While coming up with more and more and more regs and job requirements while they try to pay the same or less for more work.
> 
> 
> Case in point. BAC's authorization calls. If you don't call in they won't pay you for the entire w/o, and they will not pay any extra for this requirement that takes up 15 to 30 mins of YOUR time on each and every job. Time that you didn't used to have to spend and time that they do not reimburse for.


Interesting points. I am upset about the extremely strict seemingly unneeded rules as well. Not sure what else I can do right now though.


----------



## BPWY

Cny Clean said:


> Janitorial is for commercial offices. We do janitorial for business as well. That is a new customer limited price to entice offices and businesses to hire us to clean their business.
> *Also for trashouts we're willing to lose money in the beginning to acquire more business.*



I drove truck for 7 yrs and owned one for over half of that. This biz is much like trucking. Each load and each job needs to pull its own weight or you won't be in biz long. 
No matter what industry you are trying to make it in DO NOT PLAN TO LOOSE MONEY GOING INTO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Enough of that happens without intentionally planning for it! This is only setting yourself up for failure.




Cny Clean said:


> Interesting points. I am upset about the extremely strict seemingly unneeded rules as well. *Not sure what else I can do right now though*.





Work hard at expanding your biz into non foreclosure market work places.


----------



## BPWY

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/10/11/foreclosure-freeze-undermine-housing-market-adv/





> What's more, lawyers who have already filed class action lawsuits in Maine and Kentucky are now signing up entire neighborhoods as new clients. They're hiring private eyes to track down former industry employees and holding marathon conference calls to strategize on how to get every speck of dirt on the banks that they can.





All this will do is give the banks a reason to tighten up the screws even more on the contractors and take away more of their hard earned pennies.


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## Guest

This is horrible news in general, this was supposed to be an amazing time for businesses like ours and the banks messed it up.


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## Guest

*Nationals -VS- direct agents*

We have had a lot of success working directly with the REO agents. We have not looked to work for the Nationals because of the pay scale, paperwork, reimbersment time frames, etc. We continue to contact agents through REO network web sites. The majority are forced to use the nationals, although to a person they would rather work with us because of the response time and quality of work we provide. 
Most will tell us the maximum allowable we can charge for each service for whoever their client is before they have to send it out for multiple bids. We usually can do the work for the allowable and get the authorization right away.


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> We have had a lot of success working directly with the REO agents. We have not looked to work for the Nationals because of the pay scale, paperwork, reimbersment time frames, etc. We continue to contact agents through REO network web sites. The majority are forced to use the nationals, although to a person they would rather work with us because of the response time and quality of work we provide.
> Most will tell us the maximum allowable we can charge for each service for whoever their client is before they have to send it out for multiple bids. We usually can do the work for the allowable and get the authorization right away.


Do you have the same strict guidelines such as taking 32 million photos of each job? (not actually too hard) but the calling in and uploading photos is ridiculous. Missing payment because you miss one photo isn't worth it to me all of the time.


----------



## BPWY

Cny Clean said:


> Do you have the same strict guidelines such as taking 32 million photos of each job? (not actually too hard) but the calling in and uploading photos is ridiculous. Missing payment because you miss one photo isn't worth it to me all of the time.







That is the foreclosure industry for you. Lying contractors have brought some of this on.


10 yrs ago I did some part time P&P and we took a lot of photos then too.


----------



## Guest

Most of the time the REO agent meets us at the property, we go over the services together to make sure we're on the same page. They take the before pics then go back for the after pics. If "during pics" are needed then we usually do that if they can't hang around. Normally it's a written proposal, do the work, send an invoice, get paid in a few days or up to 3 weeks depending on the price tag. They will usually pay us out of their pocket then they get reimbursed from the lender / servicer
It's much better working with the REO agents but they are'nt able to give us daily work because of them having to use the nationals through the asset management company the lender is contracted with.


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> Most of the time the REO agent meets us at the property, we go over the services together to make sure we're on the same page. They take the before pics then go back for the after pics. If "during pics" are needed then we usually do that if they can't hang around. Normally it's a written proposal, do the work, send an invoice, get paid in a few days or up to 3 weeks depending on the price tag. They will usually pay us out of their pocket then they get reimbursed from the lender / servicer
> It's much better working with the REO agents but they are'nt able to give us daily work because of them having to use the nationals through the asset management company the lender is contracted with.


Interesting. Have you ever felt like you were bothering the agents with your marketing email/msg? Did you call them to propose your services ever?


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## Guest

Cold calls, e mails, flyers...........anything to let them know your available.
I've gone to agent meetings ( the whole office usually meets at least once a month ) and do presentations. Just a 10 minute discussion to all the agents of the services we provide and allow them to ask questions. If your new to the biz, the trick is getting them to try you at least once, they already have people they've been using and a lot of times they don't want to try somebody new. Then again, they may be frustrated with who they currently use and you might contact them at just the right time.


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> Cold calls, e mails, flyers...........anything to let them know your available.
> I've gone to agent meetings ( the whole office usually meets at least once a month ) and do presentations. Just a 10 minute discussion to all the agents of the services we provide and allow them to ask questions. If your new to the biz, the trick is getting them to try you at least once, they already have people they've been using and a lot of times they don't want to try somebody new. Then again, they may be frustrated with who they currently use and you might contact them at just the right time.


Excellent information. Also for anyone trying to get into the business you will become very overwhelmed. The job is 20% work 80% meeting strict guidelines, uploading photos, calling and doing paperwork.


----------



## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> a lot of times they don't want to try somebody new.






Man aint this the truth.


----------



## BPWY

Cny Clean said:


> Excellent information. Also for anyone trying to get into the business you will become very overwhelmed. The job is 20% work 80% meeting strict guidelines, uploading photos, calling and doing paperwork.





All the while only getting paid for the actual work done.


Drive time paid :laughing::laughing::laughing:
time spent researching insurance and meeting with the agent :laughing::laughing::laughing:
hours upon hours and hours and hours of office work uploading :laughing::laughing::laughing:

repair and maintenance time spent on your equipment paid??? nope you guessed right the first time.......... NOT PAID


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## Guest

Yep, alot of time spent you don't get paid for. I'm really going after the big re hab projects if possible. Just looked at 2 this week. $24k and $18k = $42k... Sub it out, GC it, take my 20% ( $8400 ) without working up a sweat. Sounds great and would be if I could get that work all the time


----------



## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> Yep, alot of time spent you don't get paid for. I'm really going after the big re hab projects if possible. Just looked at 2 this week. $24k and $18k = $42k... Sub it out, GC it, take my 20% ( $8400 ) without working up a sweat. Sounds great and would be if I could get that work all the time






It does sound great but when you consider all the risk you take on making sure that all the proper things were bid, there are no hidden $$$$$$$$$$$ problems and all the over the top rules and regs like EPA's lead laws that really isn't that much money at the end of the day. Not when you are the guy that all the bucks stop with if things go south.


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## Guest

All good points, do everything I can to cover my ass but **** does happen. We are EPA lead cert, have a great crew of subs and so far, have'nt had any problems. I'd be happy with netting $8000 a month without doing the work. There is risk involved being the buck stops here guy, but hey, can't turn down that kind of work.


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## BPWY

My neighbors get offered rehab work ALLLLLL the time.

But they only work with 50% down and remainder due in 30.


Few of the banks will work that way and that is the end of the discussion for them. Like they say, we are small business guys and do not have the resources to finance the bank's rehab work for 45 to 90 plus days until they get around to feeling like paying up.
I don't blame them myself.


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## Guest

We've been getting a good bit of people requesting a list of banks and asset managers to solicit business to. if you're looking for more contacts you can find them on our community site under links. We'll be adding more shortly. You can also find all agency guidelines under our guideline section.


:clap:


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> Yep, alot of time spent you don't get paid for. I'm really going after the big re hab projects if possible. Just looked at 2 this week. $24k and $18k = $42k... Sub it out, GC it, take my 20% ( $8400 ) without working up a sweat. Sounds great and would be if I could get that work all the time


 
This used to be a great side of the business! NOW with the moratorium and the agents having their listings taken away the good days are rapidly going away. 
NOTE: the day of YOU charging and taking a 20% cut and playing General Contractor are pretty much over. You see all the banks are going to the MSB Guidelines and those "extra" amounts are gone. HUD is on the MSB, Fannie is MSB by Dec 1, Freddie is on Dec 1, FHA is on Effective Nov 1. 

Gotta go and get more of my bids in now so that the realtor can call next week and say "sorry they just pulled that listing from me and we can't submit for any repairs--Damn moratorium".... 
Thats the business and who knows if its getting better or worse. ???:whistling


----------



## brm1109

*Tired of stupid companies wasting my time*

To Whom it May Concern,
I visited the property today for the above work order to find that the property was already winterized last year by another contractor. This is the 3rd assignment that I have been sent by your company where work could not be completed due to conditions beyond my control.
Even though I took all of the required photos and also had to pay payroll for a helper I will not be forwarding any of the information.
I refuse to first pay payroll, then take the photos, then have to print and scan the winterization forms and then label all of the photos for a trip charge of $25.00.
Based on the fact that for the last 3 assignments I have actually lost money please be advised that you will have to find another contractor because I will no longer accept any work orders for your company .


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## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> To Whom it May Concern,
> I visited the property today for the above work order to find that the property was already winterized last year by another contractor. This is the 3rd assignment that I have been sent by your company where work could not be completed due to conditions beyond my control.
> Even though I took all of the required photos and also had to pay payroll for a helper I will not be forwarding any of the information.
> I refuse to first pay payroll, then take the photos, then have to print and scan the winterization forms and then label all of the photos for a trip charge of $25.00.
> Based on the fact that for the last 3 assignments I have actually lost money please be advised that you will have to find another contractor because I will no longer accept any work orders for your company .


Sounds like you should be doing a pressure check and wint refresh. If you sign off on the other contractors work and he screwed up YOU are now liable for the property........


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## brm1109

Actually when I called them I told them that someone had broken into the house.
They stole the water meter, ripped out the piping and ripped out the toilets from the wall. There was nothing left to even check.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Actually when I called them I told them that someone had broken into the house.
> They stole the water meter, ripped out the piping and ripped out the toilets from the wall. There was nothing left to even check.


The stupidity of these companies is beyond belief. We all feel your pain and your frustration. 

Personally I really hope a national moratorium takes effect so maybe, just maybe the service companies will have to layoff the employees that have marbles for brains AND I'm ready for a break

The only reason why I hope there isn't a moratorium nationally is that a lot of us may not be able to "hang on" for several months BUT if you are able to then you will be able to come back stronger since I think 90% of the competition will be gone:whistling


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## APlusPPGroup

Cny Clean said:


> Also for trashouts we're willing to lose money in the beginning to acquire more business.


CNY ~ If you do that, you are hurting not only yourself but others in the industry.

Trust me when I say that 99% of the clients you undercharge will only work you as long as you are losing money.

They don't know what your profit is or isn't. All they know is that you've got the best rates in the area. Once you try to increase them, after you realize how much you've lost, you will have a major fight on your hands.

Set your rates to make a profit from the very beginning and you will be much happier. Clients KNOW what the HUD rates are and expect it. Don't lower yourself to the level you're considering.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Cny Clean said:


> This is horrible news in general, this was supposed to be an amazing time for businesses like ours and the banks messed it up.


You are just one of THOUSANDS who believe all the hype about how successful this industry is. It's NOT the money-maker it was before so many inexperienced and fraudulent people jumped into it.

There is such a saturation in the industry now that the banks are playing us all against each other for low bids. Nationals force you to undercharge, then charge you back for something you did or didn't do. They also charge you back for work OTHERS did or didn't do that YOU didn't catch.

A multitude of clients doesn't guarantee your bills will be paid every month. I'd rather have a handful of GOOD clients than 2 handfuls of BAD clients.

Just be careful and take it one step at a time. Don't take too much right off the bat for any one client. You could find yourself in the position of paying out and never being repaid. Been there, done that one!

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> CNY ~ If you do that, you are hurting not only yourself but others in the industry.
> 
> Trust me when I say that 99% of the clients you undercharge will only work you as long as you are losing money.
> 
> They don't know what your profit is or isn't. All they know is that you've got the best rates in the area. Once you try to increase them, after you realize how much you've lost, you will have a major fight on your hands.
> 
> Set your rates to make a profit from the very beginning and you will be much happier. Clients KNOW what the HUD rates are and expect it. Don't lower yourself to the level you're considering.
> 
> Linda



I agree with Linda. CNY save yourself the frustration in the future. Our industry is what we've made it. We can ALL do our part in helping to make this industry as rewarding as it used to be.



Here's a few job leads for someone interested in picking up a few more clients during these trying times

First Preston 

http://www.firstpreston.com/au_vendor_info.asp . 


Southwest Alliance of Asset Managers, LLC 

http://www.southwestalliance.com/sw_au_vendor.asp

Enjoy


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## APlusPPGroup

First Preston's rates are too low for a middleman such as our company so we've turned them down with a note saying, "if your rates ever go up, let us know".

Personally, I think they may even be too low for vendor-direct as well.

I've never checked out Southwest. We typically don't initiate first contact and rarely ever search. We get about 10, sometimes more, contacts a week trying to get us to work with them. We typically turn down anywhere from 8 to all 10 due to pricing.

We want our vendors to stay in business and, for that reason, will simply not go below a certain dollar amount for the work involved. If they don't make money, neither do we. Once in awhile, we take a lower paying job but it's only because the client has given us a lot of other work that will make up for the occasional not-so-good paying ones.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> First Preston's rates are too low for a middleman such as our company so we've turned them down with a note saying, "if your rates ever go up, let us know".
> 
> Personally, I think they may even be too low for vendor-direct as well.
> 
> I've never checked out Southwest. We typically don't initiate first contact and rarely ever search. We get about 10, sometimes more, contacts a week trying to get us to work with them. We typically turn down anywhere from 8 to all 10 due to pricing.
> 
> We want our vendors to stay in business and, for that reason, will simply not go below a certain dollar amount for the work involved. If they don't make money, neither do we. Once in awhile, we take a lower paying job but it's only because the client has given us a lot of other work that will make up for the occasional not-so-good paying ones.
> 
> Linda



southwest has decent rates but they only offer work in tx and new mexico


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## Guest

If your just starting out, don't get wide eyed at the promises of potential work. YOU WILL BE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF ! Set your travel limits, no your bottom line and be upfront with whom ever is offering you work. We have turned down jobs that are not cost effective for us from companies that send us work. They may try to talk you into doing the job for them since they are giving you work. Some can't or won't understand that it's not worth 3 hrs round trip, plus on site time, plus fuel, etc for $75 - $100. We have a great working relationship with those we do jobs for because we do quality work, on-time, with any pics and documentation submitted properly and they understand our limits. They know on occasion they will have to find another vendor to fulfill a work order for them, which may be a hassle but they can rely on us for the other jobs so they have no worries when they know we are out there doing the work. 
We cover 1/2 of Connecticut ( about a 1hr radious from our office )
From what i've heard and seen, there are only 3 of us in CT that offer Preservation work.


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## Guest

danny1217 said:


> If your just starting out, don't get wide eyed at the promises of potential work. YOU WILL BE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF ! Set your travel limits, no your bottom line and be upfront with whom ever is offering you work. We have turned down jobs that are not cost effective for us from companies that send us work. They may try to talk you into doing the job for them since they are giving you work. Some can't or won't understand that it's not worth 3 hrs round trip, plus on site time, plus fuel, etc for $75 - $100. We have a great working relationship with those we do jobs for because we do quality work, on-time, with any pics and documentation submitted properly and they understand our limits. They know on occasion they will have to find another vendor to fulfill a work order for them, which may be a hassle but they can rely on us for the other jobs so they have no worries when they know we are out there doing the work.
> We cover 1/2 of Connecticut ( about a 1hr radious from our office )
> From what i've heard and seen, there are only 3 of us in CT that offer Preservation work.


That's awesome!! I wish I only had two competitors


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## Guest

That's awesome!! I wish I only had two competitors

Only 2 competitors that are actual Property Preservation companies. I assume everybody else the nationals are using in my state at the very least have a pulse. We've been to quite a few house that "others" have already gone to and I can't believe what passed as acceptable work completed.
Securing, winterize, initial mowing,etc. All looked like it was done by "Hacks". Same old complaint from the REO agent " I had to use Safegaurd and that's the work their guys did "
From where I stand, if the big Nationals had better pay scales, paid me within 30 days, didn't insist on E&O, etc,etc,etc, then I'd work for them and all the property work would be done correctly. 
You know the old saying........." you get what you pay for "


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## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> You know the old saying........." you get what you pay for "






The big boys haven't figured that one out yet. 
Makes you wonder how in the world they had the brain power to grow to the size of company they are.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> The big boys haven't figured that one out yet.
> Makes you wonder how in the world they had the brain power to grow to the size of company they are.



They didn't need brain power......just a few more bucks than we make. Then it all snowballed into what it is today. 

I really wish there was a formula to eliminate the middleman in this business!

Safeguard is getting worse as we speak! I bid to remove 250 (16"x12"x8") cinder blocks from the exterior of a FHA property and they knocked my bid down to an actual C.Y. total. Yes, I bid it high due to multiple trips and weight factor. They continue to say no matter what situation, we can only bid jobs to the actual C.Y. regardless of weight/trips/disposal. 

I'm getting tired....AND BROKE!


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## BPWY

My reply is to call another contractor.

I'm not going broke doing favors for them.


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## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> They didn't need brain power......just a few more bucks than we make. Then it all snowballed into what it is today.
> 
> I really wish there was a formula to eliminate the middleman in this business!
> 
> Safeguard is getting worse as we speak! I bid to remove 250 (16"x12"x8") cinder blocks from the exterior of a FHA property and they knocked my bid down to an actual C.Y. total. Yes, I bid it high due to multiple trips and weight factor. They continue to say no matter what situation, we can only bid jobs to the actual C.Y. regardless of weight/trips/disposal.
> 
> I'm getting tired....AND BROKE!



If they are good i give them away on Craigslist. I gave away 30 pallets this summer to a farmer to put his round bales of hay on........


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> If they are good i give them away on Craigslist. I gave away 30 pallets this summer to a farmer to put his round bales of hay on........


GIVE them away?!?!?! Are you nuts? :laughing: I already posted them for sale. $1/ea. Got to make some money somehow in this scam:clap:


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## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> GIVE them away?!?!?! Are you nuts? :laughing: I already posted them for sale. $1/ea. Got to make some money somehow in this scam:clap:



If they are decent you may get rid of them that way. I had a yard sale in June full of a year of repo chit and cleared over $1200 in 2 days sitting on my arse, drinking beer and smoking a few pork shoulders on my smoker.......


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> If they are decent you may get rid of them that way. I had a yard sale in June full of a year of repo chit and cleared over $1200 in 2 days sitting on my arse, drinking beer and smoking a few pork shoulders on my smoker.......


Nothing beats some good smoked meat! I'm still waiting to come across a "clean" 55 gal. food grade drum at one of these houses.....for my homemade smoker.

And yes, 98% of these blocks are in new condition. If they dont sell, I just may have to build a single stall garage to keep my toys in:thumbup:


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## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Nothing beats some good smoked meat! I'm still waiting to come across a "clean" 55 gal. food grade drum at one of these houses.....for my homemade smoker.
> 
> And yes, 98% of these blocks are in new condition. If they dont sell, I just may have to build a single stall garage to keep my toys in:thumbup:



Your near Rockford. Take em to the West side and you can peddle them!!!


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## mtmtnman

I here they are useful in Kin Tu Key as well!


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## Guest

HA HA HA...thats funny. The funny thing is....I probably could do that!!


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I here they are useful in Kin Tu Key as well!



This must be the outskirts of Machesney Park?!?!?!


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## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> This must be the outskirts of Machesney Park?!?!?!



South Beloit i thing. Or maybe Rockton??


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## ARPPP

mtmtnman said:


> I here they are useful in Kin Tu Key as well!


Hubba hubba, something soft to lay your head on at night. Which of these fine fella's are you? :tt2:

Annette


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## mtmtnman

ARPPP said:


> Hubba hubba, something soft to lay your head on at night. Which of these fine fella's are you? :tt2:
> 
> Annette



We'll, i don't have Dunlop Disorder and i don't smoke..........................


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## mtmtnman

*Welcome to the exciting world of Mortgage Field Services*

You can participate in the exciting industry of Mortgage Field Services without any prior knowledge or experience. As a matter of fact, the industry has become so hot, so newsworthy and so lacking in educated and experienced field inspectors, the industry is throwing the doors open to anyone. The fact that you know nothing of the industry and have absolutely no experience makes your entry into this exciting business opportunity so much easier – all you have to do is believe everything you hear.
*Why would you want to become a field inspector in the mortgage field services industry?*
No other work at home, independent contractor or self employment opportunity offers so much excitement for so little investment. What is your investment? Sorry. That’s the best part. You will have to read further to get to read about that.
*Do you like meeting new people?*
Mortgage Field Services field inspectors meet hundreds of new people every week:


vagrants homesteading vacant properties
irate gun-toting homeowners
drug dealers
prostitutes
clueless tenants
 Although most Mortgage Field Service field inspectors would describe themselves as everyday, common working class people, they do get to meet people at all levels of society, many of which have professional degrees. Mortgage Field Services field inspectors eventually get to meet professionals like:


attorneys and judges
emergency room physicians
process servers
 *Do you like to be the center of attention?*
Mortgage Field Service field inspectors have an almost unlimited number of opportunities to call attention to themselves:


DEA agents are always very interested in your visits to active or retired meth labs
Police officers and Sheriff’s deputies watch you very closely after they have been called by neighbors
Drug dealers eye you with suspicion and curiosity – ready to defend their turf
 *Do you like nature; being outdoors; communing with nature? *
Mortgage Field Services field inspectors experience nature up close and often on a personal level. It is common for Mortgage Field Service inspectors to encounter a variety of God’s creatures:


Vicious and hungry dogs
Dying and dead animals left behind to die in a vacant house
Enormous wasp nest occupied by hundreds of anxious wasps waiting for the storm door to open so they can swoop into action
Snakes in the three foot high lawn weeds
Although tiny in size, mold and mildew wait silently, in anticipation, of your next breath
 *Do you like mysteries?*
If so, then you will love the Mortgage Field Services industry. No more watching whodunit on cable – get involved in your very own mystery. See if you can find answers to:


why haven’t I heard from the company?
who is my company rep this week?
when is my check coming?
is a check coming?
 *What about drama? *Maybe drama is your thing – intense, exciting, striking, vivid. Tension and anticipation can fill your days as a Mortgage Field Services field inspector. Again, you can get deeply involved in your very own drama series. As a Mortgage Field Services field inspector, almost daily you will experience moments of drama such as:


Is he going to shoot me?
Am I going to have to run to the car and lock my doors?
Does she really intend to call the police?
Are they going to take their anger out on me?
 *How important is the field inspector job?*
Nothing is as exciting as the Mortgage Field Services Industry. And nothing about the industry is as important as the field inspector. How important is the field inspector? Important enough that the HUD Guidelines mention the inspection process first, in the General Procedures of the HUD Guidelines.
The inspector is the “eyes and ears” of the industry. The inspector’s report sets off a chain of events involving practically everyone else. No body makes a dime until the inspector performs. Nothing happens until the field inspector completes and submits the field report.
The inspector position is so important that companies require Mortgage Field Services field inspectors to have Professional E&O insurance. If anything goes wrong, the inspector gets to take full responsibility. As a side note; that’s another ideal aspect of being a mortgage field services inspector: being left alone – near total isolation. Let something go wrong and you are completely on your own!
*What will I make as a Mortgage Field Services inspector?*
Recognizing the importance of the inspector, the majority of companies have created a near-perfect system that insures that everyone that wishes, may eventually get the opportunity to become a Mortgage Field Services field inspector. The basics of the system are really pretty simple. Simple – but sheer genius. It goes pretty much like this:


Let’s start with say $20, the amount most commonly recognized as the amount HUD will reimburse the bank for an inspection. The fact that some banks charge the homeowner as much as $50 or more per inspection is totally irrelevant to this discussion.
A bid request is issued and the winner of the bid process takes $5 and puts out their own bid. This is the first sub.
The winner of this bid process takes out $5 and puts out their own bid. This is the second sub.
The winner of the above bid takes out $5 and advertises for inspectors. Depending on how anxious the inspector is to receive work and how many work orders the inspector can handle, and how big an area the inspector can cover, the sub agrees to pay the inspector $3, $4 or as much as $5 per inspection.
 Now here is the genius part. The inspection fees paid to the inspector – $2, $3, $4 or even $5 – is really only a contribution towards the total expense inspectors incur – expenses like car payments, insurance, computers, credit counseling, internet connections, digital cameras, fax machines, business license, medical clinic charges, cell phones, flat tire repairs, gasoline, telephone lines, taxes and such. The inspection fees paid are not intended to help the field inspector create and operate an on-going Mortgage Field Services business; the inspection fees are actually carefully controlled and timed so that everyone has time to groom the next field inspector that will be taking your place. You see, eventually every inspector will run out of money and someone else gets a chance to become a Mortgage Field Services field inspector. Pure genius. Fair as fair can be. Everyone gets to participate in the exciting Mortgage Field Services business opportunity!
So there you have it. Come on – jump right in! Now’s the time. Don’t wait for government regulation or self regulation to ruin everything. Now is the time to act. You don’t even have to start at the bottom! Without any government oversight, no regulations, no training requirements and no entrance requirements you can start hiring your own inspectors. It’s easy – just get a free Craig’s List account and start advertising for inspectors. Be sure to include “no experience necessary” in your ads. That seems to get a terrific number of responses.


----------



## Guest

That's hilarious and pretty much sums it up!


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## BPWY

SWOH REO said:


> That's hilarious and pretty much sums it up!


:laughing::laughing:



Indeed. Not much else for the experienced among us to ad to that. :no:


----------



## BPWY

Another great one!





> April 23rd, 2010 at 12:39 am
> *You’ve Got 30 Days Mister!*
> 
> in: This Business Stinks
> I’m distraught and looking for sympathy so try to muster up some real concern for me. Our resignation prompted a call from the company and I have to admit I had a vision in my head of the caller standing straight and stiff as an ironing board with jaw slightly jutting forward. The caller’s answer was “That’s okay; I have a state-wide rep I can reassign them to.”
> “Well, if you have a state-wide rep why have you been sending us a handful every month? Why isn’t the state-wide rep getting all of them?” ”Hello?” ”You still there?”
> I’m glad she (the caller) could so boldly let me know that our resignation was not going to cause any permanent damage to their business. Even though I have been in this business for a long, long time, I still retain some ethics.
> Of course the visual image of the straight-up stance and the daring chin position was blown to hell when she told me that we had to finish what had already been assigned and give a 30 day notice. ”We will certainly do that. We don’t have a problem with that at all; but tell me – if you have a state-wide rep, couldn’t you go ahead and reassign them to that rep?” ”Hello – you still there?”
> A couple of hours later we got a call and we were told that “Yes, we can reassign them if you let us know what has not been done.” ”Okay, here they are, all five of them that are not already in the field. By the way, your state-wide rep must be really busy; it took you several hours to get back to us.” ”Hello. You still there.”
> There’s a moral in here somewhere. I think it goes something like this:
> 
> 
> Most of the companies in the mortgage field services business (9.9999999 out of 10) will use you and abuse you.
> Most of the companies in the mortgage field services business (9.9999999 out of 10) have you sign a contract that requires you give 30 days notice before you can drop an area without penalty. They have no requirement to tell the field rep they are giving the work to that they are giving all work to another rep as of right now – like maybe a new state-wide rep that will do the inspection for 5 cents less.
> Most of the companies in the mortgage field services business (9.9999999 out of 10) have a “penalty of the day” and the penalty rate is determined by how pissed off they are that you got wise to them. The penalty for unfinished inspections runs from $15 to $5000 (I think).
> When I first started in this business, I didn’t have access to anyone that would talk much about the greedy and corrupt companies we could be dealing with. I learned pretty quick though – I did 500 or so inspections for a company and at the end of the pay period I owed them $800. Seems that the companies have a habit of telling their computers to ignore the fact that the inspection requests were late when they send them to a new rep. Actually it’s a pretty good system. They just transfer all the penalties to the new rep and wallah – they win and you lose!
> Have fun out there and if you’re having any doubts about seven exterior photos (requires a walk-around), I can send you a link to a company that has pretty good prices on bullet proof vests.
> Tomorrow, if I’m not totally wiped out from all the fun I’ll have in the field, I’d like to tell you about a call I had that was just full of complements.


----------



## Guest

I've been reading post for months and I must say, everytime I do, I get an upset stomache. I've been trying to hang in there and hope things will get better but everytime I read, I realize that I'm being naive. I want out but there has been so much time invested and so many debts that's it's difficult to do. We've been doing HUD work for over 9 years. The current M&M (actually the last M&M) was big on bringing in start up companies. They would give them inventories that they weren't competent to service and they would end up back with us to clean up the mess. One of these companies is now the main servicer for the new M&M and we are left with nothing. This just seems crazy to me!
:no:


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## Guest

IndianaHVAC said:


> Hi there guys. I own a small residential HVAC company and am looking to expand into property preservation. I live in the Northwest Indiana\Chicagoland area. I have respomded to two ads on craigslist and did get a response from one. It makes me worry though reading some of the things people have posted here because_ I do not wanna be scammed. The one that did reply sent me a quiz and questionaire but I am not certain how to answer them or find the answers. Is the HUD manual a good place to start. They want to know things like "What are Hazard materials" "What do you do when you show up to an occupied property" "What items are considered personal property?" and " What would you do if a vendor specified a specific key code and you had none?" If anyone can give me some direction I would greatly appreciate it. Also has anyone heard of Midwest REO Maintenance?_


Pretty much all my work comes from Midwest REO Maintenance. If you have any questions I would be happy to answer them as honsetly as I can. You can contact me at pmiservices at ymail dot com - [email protected]m


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## Guest

OK I'm at the point of wanting to ring someone neck

How many of you are getting winterization denies for not cleaning the toilet? Explain: are you suppose to be able to lick the bowl or what to make these people happy?:furious:

This is the last 1 I just had to explain why it appears dirty. 1 of probably 50 in the last week. What say you?


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## brm1109

*Toilets*

About 2 weeks ago I went to a house to do a trash out bid and a janitorial bid. The house was already "winterized" by another company. Just for the heck I opened the toilet and found it full of [email protected] 
I added an extra fee if they wanted the janitorial.
I have seen at least 4 or 5 houses so far that have had the same thing.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> OK I'm at the point of wanting to ring someone neck
> 
> How many of you are getting winterization denies for not cleaning the toilet? Explain: are you suppose to be able to lick the bowl or what to make these people happy?:furious:
> 
> This is the last 1 I just had to explain why it appears dirty. 1 of probably 50 in the last week. What say you?



we have high minerals out here and i get a lot of them with mineral rings. That one looks very clean to me. Might be a curly on the rim though!


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## mtmtnman

By the way, I use a suction gun to pull most of the water out of the tank and bowl before i wint. Saves about 50% on the anti-freeze used. Also use a little battery operated kerosene pump i found in a trashout when i am feeling lazy........


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## Guest

Yeah if they are full of goodies than they shouldn't be paid but come on..if the toilets are already clean? These offshore auditors are not qualified to even figure out what a toilet is.


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> By the way, I use a suction gun to pull most of the water out of the tank and bowl before i wint. Saves about 50% on the anti-freeze used. Also use a little battery operated kerosene pump i found in a trashout when i am feeling lazy........




i find it easy to just use a wet vac....cuts my time at a property in half....and the vac was free...also found it at a trash out...brand new in the box !!!:clap:


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> That's awesome!! I wish I only had two competitors
> 
> Only 2 competitors that are actual Property Preservation companies. I assume everybody else the nationals are using in my state at the very least have a pulse. We've been to quite a few house that "others" have already gone to and I can't believe what passed as acceptable work completed.
> Securing, winterize, initial mowing,etc. All looked like it was done by "Hacks". Same old complaint from the REO agent " I had to use Safegaurd and that's the work their guys did "
> From where I stand, if the big Nationals had better pay scales, paid me within 30 days, didn't insist on E&O, etc,etc,etc, then I'd work for them and all the property work would be done correctly.
> You know the old saying........." you get what you pay for "




THIS IS SOOOO TRUE....i went to a house with my mold guy to take a look at a severe mold problem and saw the "property preservation company" outside trimming a palm tree WITH A RUSTED HAND HELD SAW....it was like out of sanford and son....we were at this property for over an hour and he was still going at the same palm tree while the rest of front side of the property looked like crap and he had no other equipment in his old ass truck so that's probably the only thing that will get done...i wish my battery wasn't going dead or that guy would soooooo be on youtube right now.....it's good to see FAS and safeguard have high vendor standards because it was one of those two companies....he probably made 6.00 ...it's great to see the reason i keep losing work


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Yeah if they are full of goodies than they shouldn't be paid but come on..if the toilets are already clean? These offshore auditors are not qualified to even figure out what a toilet is.







Remember what you told me about "screwing the rich Americans?"


----------



## Guest

THIS IS SOOOO TRUE...

I can't control the others and who they hire, but my clients ( REO Brokers ) know when they send me on on job it's done right. I guess I could lower my standards to match the below par work out there but that's not how I roll. I did an initial mowing today $150......( by myself )not a large yard but really overgrown. I cut it, blew it and raked up the clippings, cut it again, blew it and raked again and then cut it a third time. Took me almost 3 hrs but gosh darn it, it looked like I wanted it to look in the end. I refuse to compromise my standard of work which is why I probably could not do work for the Nationals. I've actually seen agents at properties with their own mower and their mop and vacuum etc, fixing up what the Nationals got paid to do so the property would look good for potential buyers. I just shake my head at the stranglehold the big boys have on this industry. Keep up the good fight folks, know when you lay your head down at night you did right that day.


----------



## Guest

Anyone ever get screwed over having to serve jury duty? The wonderful folks at the courthouse offer $13 a day for me to be there. I tried to explain to them this dont really cover my bills but they didn't seem to care much.


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Anyone ever get screwed over having to serve jury duty? The wonderful folks at the courthouse offer $13 a day for me to be there. I tried to explain to them this dont really cover my bills but they didn't seem to care much.



Your self employed. Tell them it will cause your business undue hardship and you have work orders due daily that CANNOT be changed. Ask them if you can do an Coroners Inquest instead..........


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> THIS IS SOOOO TRUE...
> 
> I can't control the others and who they hire, but my clients ( REO Brokers ) know when they send me on on job it's done right. I guess I could lower my standards to match the below par work out there but that's not how I roll. I did an initial mowing today $150......( by myself )not a large yard but really overgrown. I cut it, blew it and raked up the clippings, cut it again, blew it and raked again and then cut it a third time. Took me almost 3 hrs but gosh darn it, it looked like I wanted it to look in the end. I refuse to compromise my standard of work which is why I probably could not do work for the Nationals. I've actually seen agents at properties with their own mower and their mop and vacuum etc, fixing up what the Nationals got paid to do so the property would look good for potential buyers. I just shake my head at the stranglehold the big boys have on this industry. Keep up the good fight folks, know when you lay your head down at night you did right that day.




Here's a good one i think most of u will find funny....i put in an app to do occupancy inspections...they called today and talked to my brother and laid 936 properties in his lap that needs to be done w/in 7 days....but get this....they are paying 2.00 a property!! I got home today and found out and couldn't believe he took it AND can't believe anyone else would either....just the time and gas it takes to drive there...then take the pictures...then re-size all of them and figure out which picture goes to which property and upload it...i've estimated he spent approx 20 mins per property today....i don't know about a lot of you but i can't pull a profit on that....people really have to stop low bidding and working for scraps or there will be no more industry !!!!! :furious:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

D&R Services said:


> Here's a good one i think most of u will find funny....i put in an app to do occupancy inspections...they called today and talked to my brother and laid 936 properties in his lap that needs to be done w/in 7 days....but get this....they are paying 2.00 a property!! I got home today and found out and couldn't believe he took it AND can't believe anyone else would either....just the time and gas it takes to drive there...then take the pictures...then re-size all of them and figure out which picture goes to which property and upload it...i've estimated he spent approx 20 mins per property today....i don't know about a lot of you but i can't pull a profit on that....people really have to stop low bidding and working for scraps or there will be no more industry !!!!! :furious:


You can still turn them down, Mike. Just send a thank you, but no thank you note when you decline. Keep it nice, though. Who knows but maybe they'll negotiate to $2.50 just for you. :laughing:

I know. I'm bad. Sometimes I just can't help myself. :whistling

Linda


----------



## BPWY

W O W




I was offered $6 regular inspections and $8 for 24 hr RUSH.


I said............ no thank you!!!!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> W O W
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I was offered $6 regular inspections and $8 for 24 hr RUSH.
> 
> 
> I said............ no thank you!!!!


That's crazy. Altisource is offering $15 but there's no access at about 90% of the properties. You end up making more than 1 trip so where's the benefit in doing theirs?

I need to find out where the least expensive electronic locks can be bought.... which supplier? I have a new vendor who needs the info. Any of the suppliers running specials?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> That's crazy. Altisource is offering $15
> 
> Linda






Sure they are.  Not in my area.



Guess who I turned down today. $6 and $8


----------



## ARPPP

I need to find out where the least expensive electronic locks can be bought.... which supplier? I have a new vendor who needs the info. Any of the suppliers running specials?

Linda[/quote]


I just ordered some at BuyLockBox.com. They are $59.99 right now.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> You can still turn them down, Mike. Just send a thank you, but no thank you note when you decline. Keep it nice, though. Who knows but maybe they'll negotiate to $2.50 just for you. :laughing:
> 
> I know. I'm bad. Sometimes I just can't help myself. :whistling
> 
> Linda



i found out when i got home this evening...i stayed away this weekend and played hooky today so i didnt know till this evening and i was a little upset lol....trust me i'll be calling them tomorrow morning and telling them no thank you...nicely of course !!!


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> i found out when i got home this evening...i stayed away this weekend and played hooky today so i didnt know till this evening and i was a little upset lol....trust me i'll be calling them tomorrow morning and telling them no thank you...nicely of course !!!







I'd make bro handle the work..... ALL of it.

He'll learn a very valuable life lesson.


----------



## Guest

Can anyone provide some advice to working as a REO rehab contractor rather than a preservation contractor?


----------



## BPWY

Can I get some camera recommendations including price and model number?


Thanks a ton. 

I've been using the cheap kodak c160 and c180. They've been OK, but longevity is pretty low. 

The best I've done is 10,000 pix from one. 7000 to 8000 is probably "normal".


My newest one died last week and I'm using the semi reliable back up cam.
I took a pic and shut the camera off with the button and put it into my pocket. Seconds later I pull it out to snap another pic......... graveyard dead. Changed batteries at least 3 times.....nada.


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Can I get some camera recommendations including price and model number?


 
I like my NIKON Coolpix L110. Costs a little under $300, has been going strong for the past 8 months for me. You need to use the Advanced Lithium batteries for it though. Otherwise you will be changing everyday. I am using the rechargeable ones now, but I can only get a day out of them vs a week with the lithium. I started out using the Kodaks, like the Nikon 100x better.


----------



## Guest

BPWY

I have tried numerous cameras, and have had the best luck out of the Canon Powershot A490. The thing I like most about this camera is if you bump the lens when it is extended you can simply shut off the camera and it will auto correct itself. I've killed numerous Kodaks just by bumping the lens. This is the camera I carry day in day out. 

For all my bidding, initial secures, P4C's etc. (basically a lot of pictures as quick as possible) I use a Canon Rebel XS DSLR. I can literally shave 15 minutes off my time at a property simply due to the speed of this camera.

Hope this helps.


----------



## BPWY

ARPPP said:


> I like my NIKON Coolpix L110. Costs a little under $300, has been going strong for the past 8 months for me. You need to use the Advanced Lithium batteries for it though. Otherwise you will be changing everyday. I am using the rechargeable ones now, but I can only get a day out of them vs a week with the lithium. I started out using the Kodaks, like the Nikon 100x better.





OUCH, I bet I'm too cheap to pay $300 

Thanks any way.


----------



## BPWY

2Bros said:


> BPWY
> 
> I have tried numerous cameras, and have had the best luck out of the Canon Powershot A490. The thing I like most about this camera is if you bump the lens when it is extended you can simply shut off the camera and it will auto correct itself. I've killed numerous Kodaks just by bumping the lens. This is the camera I carry day in day out.
> 
> For all my bidding, initial secures, P4C's etc. (basically a lot of pictures as quick as possible) I use a Canon Rebel XS DSLR. I can literally shave 15 minutes off my time at a property simply due to the speed of this camera.
> 
> Hope this helps.





WOW, a contractor sure isn't going to be paying for one of them with $30 grass cuts.


Unless I can find an old man to steal one from like another member here does :laughing::laughing::laughing: it'll be a very long time until I buy one of those. Fleabay has em for $400 to over $600.


HOLY COW, at china mart (WM)  they can reach $1000 depending on packaged accessories. 


Looks like I'm going to be sticking with the cheap axx kodaks a while longer.


Thanks for the suggestions.


----------



## BPWY

The Canon Powershot A490 looks affordable. How long between pix when using the flash?

The kodaks have been pretty fast for me. By the time I walk across most rooms its recharged and ready to hit again. 1 or 2 seconds.


----------



## Guest

Capital District home Solutions LLC.

Any one looking for a good Property preservation company to hire or for trash outs in albany NY this is the crew to get they have their own roll off truck and all equip.......
Tim @ [email protected]


----------



## mtmtnman

I have an A480 Canon and it's been solid but the flash recovery is slow. 3-4 seconds between shots. My A1000 was better but after about 15,000 pics i busted the screen. It still takes pics but i cannot see what i am taking till i put the chip in the computer. I REALLY want to get a good SLR for bids and PTC's. One of the appraisers i work with has an SLR with a battery pack flash and can take steady pics one right after another through the whole house. All in all the Canon's are great and they are the only one that take 640x480 so i can drop the chip in my netbook and upload them without resizing them.


----------



## agcreno

Canon Powershot SX120...Wallyworld...Everything we need and not bad on the AA's. Datestamp and all the junk.


----------



## brm1109

I have been using a Kodak C913. It is a pretty good camera but it does eat up batteries.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I have an A480 Canon and it's been solid but the flash recovery is slow. 3-4 seconds between shots. My A1000 was better but after about 15,000 pics i busted the screen. It still takes pics but i cannot see what i am taking till i put the chip in the computer. I REALLY want to get a good SLR for bids and PTC's. One of the appraisers i work with has an SLR with a battery pack flash and can take steady pics one right after another through the whole house. All in all the Canon's are great and they are the only one that take 640x480 so i can drop the chip in my netbook and upload them without resizing them.





The Canon Powershot A490 doesn't get good reviews on CNET for the time between flashes.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I have been using a Kodak C913. It is a pretty good camera but it does eat up batteries.





Pretty much the same price of the C180/C160.


Thanks for the help tonight guys, looks like I'll buy another C180.


----------



## BPWY

C182 specs

Click to capture 


flash off: < 0.4 sec. (wide), < 0.7 sec. (tele)
flash on: < 0.7 sec. (wide), < 0.9 sec. (tele)


----------



## BPWY

The most annoying thing about the "cheap" Kodaks is that this is the smallest they go, 1280 × 960.

So you have to resize EVERY thing.


----------



## Guest

Well for Cameras I always buy the OLD HP Photosmart M437 or M series cameras. Get 'em off ebay for $30-$50 and they last forever and the biggest plus is you don't have to resize the pics. Since they are so cheap you just throw them away after they break but they are hard to destroy. The shutter speed is slower than the new cameras but without resizing you actually save time and less frustration


----------



## Guest

BIG ???: what is everyone using for estimating software for the HUD comparables to the MSB estimator? I am looking for something fast and easy to understand. Yet to find anything that is "easy" and affordable. Help!!!


----------



## BPWY

Just bought a C182 off fleabay for $71 w/free shipping. Pretty much just like the C180.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I am looking for something fast and easy .........





By the time you get home from work and begin uploading your brain power is about done for??????????


:laughing::thumbup::laughing:


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Just bought a C182 off fleabay for $71 w/free shipping. Pretty much just like the C180.



You know i'm a cheap SOB. I pick up cameras at the pawn shops for $40-$50 bucks. Didn't find any today but i have a spare to use. I'm gonna stick with Canon if nothing else for the ease of not having to resize.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> You know i'm a cheap SOB. I pick up cameras at the pawn shops for $40-$50 bucks. Didn't find any today but i have a spare to use. I'm gonna stick with Canon if nothing else for the ease of not having to resize.






And nearly every day I get to hear you beach and moan about how slow it is between taking pix.


Resize is nothing with the right software.


----------



## Guest

One thing I found that helps save camera life is instead of using that shoestring wrist strap, get one of those long key chain straps with the little clip. I wear mine around my neck and it dont get beat up that way. If it gets to swinging around I just throw it down my shirt. I have been using the same Kodak camera for almost 2 years now. It looks like crap but it still gets the job done.


----------



## Guest

We are looking at starting to use a phone to do all the pics to upload for FAS orders while on site and we are hoping to have the same process work for other orders to upload to the office after completion of order, but who knows.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY, Some reviews for you. Mine is the A480

http://www.reviewgist.com/compare-d...-canon-powershot-a490-vs-kodak-easyshare-c182

They say mine is a 4 second recovery. Still pretty slow but not much else that is faster.


----------



## Guest

If I used my Droid (praying it turns into a hockey puck so I can justify throwing it away) for uploading photos I would shoot myself. No comments from the "gallery"


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I've been using my HP Photosmart M44 for about 3 years now and it's still taking great photos, despite being dropped I don't know how many times. I paid $99 for the camera and photo printer at Wal-Mart. 

It's a simple camera but it date stamps and takes clear shots. That's all I need and sometimes I think simpler is better.

My son paid over $300 for a Sony and it doesn't even date stamp. I bought him a bundle just like mine and it lasted almost as long. Unfortunately, his crew is a lot more abusive.:sad:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I can't locate a HP Photosmart M44, even on fleabay.


----------



## BPWY

Speaking of product reviews........ mtmntman highly recommended a Dell laser printer 1125.

I've got one that should arrive via FedEx tomorrow.

The ink savings for this versus my cheap inkjet will pay for the Dell in less than 6 months.
The last printer I bought was based on the price of the ink refills. Even so I go thru 3 or 4 refills for a 250 page pack of paper. I'm spending hundreds of $$$ on ink a yr.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Can I get some camera recommendations including price and model number?
> 
> 
> Thanks a ton.
> 
> I've been using the cheap kodak c160 and c180. They've been OK, but longevity is pretty low.
> 
> The best I've done is 10,000 pix from one. 7000 to 8000 is probably "normal".
> 
> 
> My newest one died last week and I'm using the semi reliable back up cam.
> I took a pic and shut the camera off with the button and put it into my pocket. Seconds later I pull it out to snap another pic......... graveyard dead. Changed batteries at least 3 times.....nada.


 
I like the Fujifilm XP10, you can get them as low as $150 and they are shock proof and water proof!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> BIG ???: what is everyone using for estimating software for the HUD comparables to the MSB estimator? I am looking for something fast and easy to understand. Yet to find anything that is "easy" and affordable. Help!!!


I just started using costestimator.com. It doesn't have everything but was recommended by a national. I tested it to compare with a recent bid and it's along the same lines. They claim that using it should prevent them coming back stating that the bid was too high.


----------



## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> We are looking at starting to use a phone to do all the pics to upload for FAS orders while on site and we are hoping to have the same process work for other orders to upload to the office after completion of order, but who knows.


I've used my iphone, but only when the camera battery has died and I don't have my charger. The problem I have with the iphone is when downloading the pics, they aren't in order causing a big headache.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I can't locate a HP Photosmart M44, even on fleabay.


I searched using the term "HP Photosmart MP" and found a few. This might be a good deal  http://aolsearch.pgpartner.com/user_sales_getprod.php?masterid=7696301&lot_id=10008860

It's not brand new, tho, so it could have problems. 

I think the MP refers to the number of megapixels.

Linda


----------



## Guest

i have my crews using what ever is cheapest at walmart because they haven't learned yet how to take care of things...YET i use my droid htc incredible and it's the best camera i've ever used and the upload is quick....i just get in my truck and plug it into my lap top and its programmed to automatically upload them into my new picture folder and resize them...so while i'm driving to the next place it's doing this all for me....i so love my computer guys !!


----------



## BPWY

So now BAC wants a photo submitted of each and every house prior to giving the authorization number for secures.


First they demand the call in for authorization. This can take up to 30 mins per job ..... uncompensated. 

Now we get to send in free photos using your phones expensive data plan..... yup you guessed it..... also completely uncompensated.


I am seriously considering my working relationship with the nationals that deal with BAC. The nationals won't go to bat for the contractor to get us more money. I don't do a lot of work for BAC nationals... I'm thinking of doing much less.

This is ridiculous, they expect us to do more and more and more....... for free.
Time is money boys and girls. Pay up.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> So now BAC wants a photo submitted of each and every house prior to giving the authorization number for secures.
> 
> 
> First they demand the call in for authorization. This can take up to 30 mins per job ..... uncompensated.
> 
> Now we get to send in free photos using your phones expensive data plan..... yup you guessed it..... also completely uncompensated.
> 
> 
> I am seriously considering my working relationship with the nationals that deal with BAC. The nationals won't go to bat for the contractor to get us more money. I don't do a lot of work for BAC nationals... I'm thinking of doing much less.
> 
> This is ridiculous, they expect us to do more and more and more....... for free.
> Time is money boys and girls. Pay up.



One of the guys i know has spent numerous times of an hour or more on the phone getting Auth. He tends to call in the AM. I usually call in the afternoon and it's 10-15 minutes. Either way i am NOT wasting my time sending photos in for Aut. They can have the inspectors do that.


----------



## BPWY

That guy has FAR more patience than me!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


There is no way I'm waiting that long. I'd call it occupied and trip charge it.


----------



## agcreno

BAC could be such a good deal if they would just pull themselves by the bootstraps into the real world...They have the opportunity right now to be the "client of choice" BUTTTTTTT NOOOOO! Rather just keep taking advantage of the contractors. If this industry could organize a boycott on BAC work maybe they would finally get it! We stopped accepting work from any national that sends BAC work. Kinda shot us in the foot for volume, but the remaining work we do is at close to full price with very few exceptions and all pay within 45 days. No more BAC BS for us... Whew, I feel better... Oh, maybe we should talk about bailouts...No, not right now.

Last job we did for BAC for a simple car removal took almost 6 months to get paid, guess who fronted the tow bill...Not BAC


----------



## BPWY

agcreno said:


> BAC could be such a good deal if they would just pull themselves by the bootstraps into the real world...They have the opportunity right now to be the "client of choice" BUTTTTTTT NOOOOO! Rather just keep taking advantage of the contractors. If this industry could organize a boycott on BAC work maybe they would finally get it! We stopped accepting work from any national that sends BAC work. Kinda shot us in the foot for volume, but the remaining work we do is at close to full price with very few exceptions and all pay within 45 days. No more BAC BS for us... Whew, I feel better... Oh, maybe we should talk about bailouts...No, not right now.
> 
> Last job we did for BAC for a simple car removal took almost 6 months to get paid, guess who fronted the tow bill...Not BAC







Prime example of not giving the slightest bit of a damn about the folks that got you where you are today.


Like I've stated in previous posts.......... your business, the health and profitability of your business doesn't even begin to enter the consciousness or business plan of the nationals, BAC among others for example.


----------



## agcreno

The "we're the biggest bank in america, and you'll do what we say or we'll find someone else" attitude makes me want to barf.

If it weren't for the lowly american taxpayer, they would be sporting america's biggest "out of business sign"


----------



## Guest

*Above all Enterprises &amp; Floridas Finest Industries*

Anyone done work for those 2 companies ? We just started with them these past 2 weeks, did some winterizations. Have'nt heard anything from the Florida company since we did the work and submitted photos 2 weeks ago ( not responding to calls and e mails ). Worried we got duped by them and maybe the same will happen with the other one.


----------



## Guest

*Boat on a trailer*

Have a beat up boat on a trailer at a property we are going to trash out, etc. Maybe it's pure luck but we have never done auto or boat removal yet. What's the procedure in getting that done and what to charge. Anybody know the legal / proper way to do it. Thanks


----------



## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> Anyone done work for those 2 companies ? We just started with them these past 2 weeks, did some winterizations. Have'nt heard anything from the Florida company since we did the work and submitted photos 2 weeks ago ( not responding to calls and e mails ). Worried we got duped by them and maybe the same will happen with the other one.






I'm not saying that these guys are up to no good, but I've learned that often when a company has to put their name out there as being better than every body else that they usually are some of the lowest scum.


----------



## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> Have a beat up boat on a trailer at a property we are going to trash out, etc. Maybe it's pure luck but we have never done auto or boat removal yet. What's the procedure in getting that done and what to charge. Anybody know the legal / proper way to do it. Thanks





Its best to use a tow company. They know the laws.


----------



## mtmtnman

Pressure testing, Most Nationals are saying to test ONLY at 35# of air pressure. If i test at 35# of pressure and it holds but 6 months later the REO agent turns the water on to city pressure of 65-70 PSI and the water leaks who is liable? I am currently testing FNMA properties at 65 psi for this reason. A leak may not present itself at 35PSI but will at 65PSI.


----------



## BPWY

Every day that goes by I get a little sicker of the mistreatment of the contractor's by the nationals. The disrespect, the out right lies that are tolerated and their over all attitude towards the guys that make them who they are.


For example.............



> Please submit a bid sheet: current bid not acceptable, as it does not even state what you are bidding to do


Just because they are unable to read is no reason to hassle me. I've went back into their system and looked. Its plain what I was bidding for. I even told them that in a different email. 
This is part of the response I got this morning.

I'm nearly to my breaking point.


As far as the mention of lies......... thats a topic for a different post when I have more time.
I'm too busy working to cover the expenses generated because the national tolerated the monster lies the other contractor told about me.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Every day that goes by I get a little sicker of the mistreatment of the contractor's by the nationals. The disrespect, the out right lies that are tolerated and their over all attitude towards the guys that make them who they are.
> 
> 
> For example.............
> 
> 
> Just because they are unable to read is no reason to hassle me. I've went back into their system and looked. Its plain what I was bidding for. I even told them that in a different email.
> This is part of the response I got this morning.
> 
> I'm nearly to my breaking point.
> 
> 
> As far as the mention of lies......... thats a topic for a different post when I have more time.
> I'm too busy working to cover the expenses generated because the national tolerated the monster lies the other contractor told about me.




_*Cubicle Minds...............*_


----------



## Guest

Ths latest

HUD has just advised us that they will no longer be approving or allowing for a separate fee to place a property in broom swept condition. From this point forward, broom swept condition must be completed with the debris removal at no additional charge. 

I've heard many times in the past that HUD will no longer pay for this, HUD will no longer pay for that, so I wonder if it's really HUD. Something else I am wonding is will there be compensation if there is no debris or will this service be provided free of charge?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

SWOH REO said:


> Ths latest
> 
> HUD has just advised us that they will no longer be approving or allowing for a separate fee to place a property in broom swept condition. From this point forward, broom swept condition must be completed with the debris removal at no additional charge.
> 
> I've heard many times in the past that HUD will no longer pay for this, HUD will no longer pay for that, so I wonder if it's really HUD. Something else I am wonding is will there be compensation if there is no debris or will this service be provided free of charge?


I doubt very seriously it's HUD. If it were HUD, there would have been another ML letter or addendum issued.

I would lose that client as quickly as possible. Sounds like they're taking advantage of a good situation.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

Got the same e-mail from most likely the same national. Here is my reply.....


So your saying we are now supposed to cart our generators around with us everywhere we go so we can vacuum carpets?? HUD is putting more and more requirements out while paying less and less money and to be honest i am having to do some serious ## crunching to see if this business is even profitable anymore. The only ones that seem to not loose $$$ is you, the middle man. as your expenses are not changing with the new requirements. 1st, tires, paint, chemicals have to be removed per cu/yd, then we have to use estimating software that does not take into account the middle man's discount, now i have to pull a tool trailer with for anything i "could" need at 8MPG??? I don't see many contractors lasting with all these new rules and i am not wasting away my profitability for these banks. Much of the work i have received lately i would be better off sitting home in the lazy boy.

Signed,

DISGUSTED!!


----------



## Guest

Just got off the phone with my contact at Above All Enterprises out of MI. ( just started with them on Tuesday, did 3 winterizes )Been trying to upload pics after re-sizing, but having a problem for 2 days. For 2 days they've been telling me their IT guy will call me and then ask me to send the pics in a zip file in the meantime? ( I'm not sending anything till the IT guy calls me ). That was a rough day, 8 hours with travel time ( camera broke, generator would'nt start, wrong lock box codes, etc ) Could it be they just want the pics so they can get paid and have no intention of having the IT guy call me ? Or them calling me for anymore work ? Hate to sound like I don't trust them, but I've got a bad feeling about it especially after the last national took us for a ride on doing some winterizes, sent the photos, and have'nt heard from them since!


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Got the same e-mail from most likely the same national. Here is my reply.....
> 
> 
> So your saying we are now supposed to cart our generators around with us everywhere we go so we can vacuum carpets?? HUD is putting more and more requirements out while paying less and less money and to be honest i am having to do some serious ## crunching to see if this business is even profitable anymore. The only ones that seem to not loose $$$ is you, the middle man. as your expenses are not changing with the new requirements. 1st, tires, paint, chemicals have to be removed per cu/yd, then we have to use estimating software that does not take into account the middle man's discount, now i have to pull a tool trailer with for anything i "could" need at 8MPG??? I don't see many contractors lasting with all these new rules and i am not wasting away my profitability for these banks. Much of the work i have received lately i would be better off sitting home in the lazy boy.
> 
> Signed,
> 
> DISGUSTED!!


Please update if you get a response.


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> Just got off the phone with my contact at Above All Enterprises out of MI. ( just started with them on Tuesday, did 3 winterizes )Been trying to upload pics after re-sizing, but having a problem for 2 days. For 2 days they've been telling me their IT guy will call me and then ask me to send the pics in a zip file in the meantime? ( I'm not sending anything till the IT guy calls me ). That was a rough day, 8 hours with travel time ( camera broke, generator would'nt start, wrong lock box codes, etc ) Could it be they just want the pics so they can get paid and have no intention of having the IT guy call me ? Or them calling me for anymore work ? Hate to sound like I don't trust them, but I've got a bad feeling about it especially after the last national took us for a ride on doing some winterizes, sent the photos, and have'nt heard from them since!


It's very hard to trust anyone at this point.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I doubt very seriously it's HUD. If it were HUD, there would have been another ML letter or addendum issued.
> 
> I would lose that client as quickly as possible. Sounds like they're taking advantage of a good situation.
> 
> Linda


Unfortunately I have cut out the worst and this company has been the lesser evil! I always miss the good old day!


----------



## Guest

Hey Linda,
Waiting to do some work for ya in CT. 
Tired of throwing darts at the dart board labeled with all the nationals and seeing if "that one" will have work for us, pay enough, pay at all, etc.
I had a dream last night i was standing in the middle of a field buck naked with the song.. "No where to run to baby, no where to hide"....
so sad:sad: 
This business is really getting to me:w00t:


----------



## BPWY

If the news of the day, heck make that the news of the week gets any better I'm going to have to go to the bar and drink my self into oblivion.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> Hey Linda,
> Waiting to do some work for ya in CT.
> Tired of throwing darts at the dart board labeled with all the nationals and seeing if "that one" will have work for us, pay enough, pay at all, etc.
> I had a dream last night i was standing in the middle of a field buck naked with the song.. "No where to run to baby, no where to hide"....
> so sad:sad:
> This business is really getting to me:w00t:


lol. I wanted to come back with, "If you build it, they would come" but that seemed a little inappropriate. Oops! Guess I did say it. lol

I'm doing reviews right now and it's very slow going. I don't have any work in CT right now but am reviewing vendors in your area to be prepared. We are slammed with work right now and it won't be long before we get work in yours, I'm sure.

You'll hear from me very soon. I just have to finish the ones I've got started.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Is anyone else having a problem with Google today? I keep having to sign off of the internet and sign back on in order to access my gmail accounts.

Now I can't even get into my mail. This is irritating, since I have orders to send out. Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh!

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thanks Linda
If nothing else I'm patient....what's that old saying " good things come to those who wait "
Of course in this business it's always " hurry up and wait "


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Is anyone else having a problem with Google today? I keep having to sign off of the internet and sign back on in order to access my gmail accounts.
> 
> Now I can't even get into my mail. This is irritating, since I have orders to send out. Arrrrrrrrrrrrrgh!
> 
> Linda






MTmntman ALWAYS has problems. 


I keep telling him that Gmail doesn't like him.




What i'm having problems with is ocwen's site.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> MTmntman ALWAYS has problems.


I've heard that somewhere before. Oh, wait. You were talking about gmail?:laughing:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing: :clap::clap::clap::clap:




Believe me I give him a merciless ration on a regular basis.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Believe me I give him a merciless ration on a regular basis.


Of that I have no doubts whatsoever, Paul. Matt's got a great sense of humor, though, and I'm sure he gives it right back and maybe even in spades.:thumbup:

Linda

@ Danny............. I sent you an e-mail. Need more pics when you can. Thx!


----------



## BPWY

Hes managed to get one or two jabs in.


----------



## Guest

how did we go from talking about digital cameras to ranting???....see what happens when i'm gone for too long


----------



## BPWY

A good hijack only takes a few seconds.


And the ranting aint done yet.


----------



## BPWY

Ocwen's newest way of cutting out the broker to make more money.
As if the brokers weren't paid enough at .75% of the sale now we have this.





> Dear Vendor,
> 
> Altisource Portfolio Solutions has created a new Order Type called “*Meet and Greet*”. This Order Type will require the Vendor to meet the buyer at the property to allow access to the interior of the home. The Property Preservation & Inspection Team (PPI) will coordinate with Vendors to schedule these meetings. Our vendors will receive a minimum 24 hours advance notification to allow access to the buyer. Vendors will be expected to be available at the property until the buyer inspection is complete. We expect you to contact our toll free number on completion of this activity and register a confirmation. All relevant information pertaining to date and time (schedule) will be mentioned in the order instructions. Vendors will be required to submit date and time stamped pictures of this activity, to fulfill the work order.
> 
> *Price:* $75.00 per visit.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Ocwen's newest way of cutting out the broker to make more money.
> As if the brokers weren't paid enough at .75% of the sale now we have this.


And the problem with this is what? For what you have to do, it's a lot better price than a $15 inspection, which can take the same amount of time. 

$75 is not bad for babysitting for a couple hours.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I didn't say it was a problem for the contractor. And as tight as these guys are it won't take them long to figure out 
how to nail the contractors some more.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I just noticed my comment quoted a different part of your post. It should have quoted the memo from Altisource.

Altisource IS notorious for finding ways to cut back pricing so we'll have to see how it goes with this one.

I remember when FAFS only paid $35 for this service so I'm looking at it from an entirely different perspective.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Hello people my name is Eddy , and i just finished putting all my paper work in order to start workin in the property Preservation industry , to be quite honest i need some input in how to go about getting jobs , or leads. Can anyone out there give me some pointers or advice thank you .


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I doubt very seriously it's HUD. If it were HUD, there would have been another ML letter or addendum issued.
> 
> I would lose that client as quickly as possible. Sounds like they're taking advantage of a good situation.
> 
> Linda


 
Hello Linda , My name is Edgar (eddy) and i recently started my Property Preservation business and as i have kept up reading this forum i have noticed needless to say ara a very experienced in our industry , i wanted to ask you if you have any pointers , or advice for me , i have all my paper work together that the state of florida requires , I live in Miami-dade county and im looking to serve Miami-dade , Broward, or Palm Beach counties, i have been in the construction - preservation industry for more than 15 years , buy now, im going on my own. can you please help me in this matter , my email address is [email protected] if you want to write me direct for all your attention , time and information i thank you very mucy Edgar (eddy)


----------



## Guest

*Hey All*

Hey everyone,

Like most of you I found this thread by accident last night and ended up reading the first 45 pages (when I should have been preparing for my work orders today, lol).

I've been in the industry for a little over a year and still can't stop learning. I went the route of working for brokers rather than nationals so thankfully they've been patient.

BTW, I had a work order today to drain an in ground pool who's pump and filter hadn't even been turned on in 5 years. It looked like a cup of coffee with leaves. By the time I had it drained I was standing in a 15 foot deep end battling 30 trapped frogs yawning because I was reading this post all night...great stuff here! I will be a fequent guest, student, and contributor!:thumbup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

pierri10 said:


> Hello people my name is Eddy , and i just finished putting all my paper work in order to start workin in the property Preservation industry , to be quite honest i need some input in how to go about getting jobs , or leads. Can anyone out there give me some pointers or advice thank you .


To be honest with you, Eddy, everything you could possibly learn about where to start is in the comments at this thread.

Have you gone through the entire post, starting with page one? You'll learn more by reading about vendors' experiences, who to start up with, and who to avoid if you read the whole thing. 

There's no magic and there's no easy way in but if you read everything you can get your hands on about the industry, you'll be in a better position to promote yourself.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Great story, Coastal. I have a feeling you'll have more to share with us. Feel free to participate. We don't bite.......... well, at least MOST of us don't. Watch out for that Paul guy and a few others. :laughing:

Welcome to the forum! 

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> I just noticed my comment quoted a different part of your post. It should have quoted the memo from Altisource.
> 
> Altisource IS notorious for finding ways to cut back pricing so we'll have to see how it goes with this one.
> 
> I remember when FAFS only paid $35 for this service so I'm looking at it from an entirely different perspective.
> 
> Linda



I was blown away when i got a bid approval to paint a 1100 sq ft house for $2600. Found 2 gals in town that "LOVE" to paint and they ended up making over $20 an hour, (painted it in 2 days) i paid for all materials and supplied equipment and still put a VERY hefty sum in my pocket. Best thing is i didn't have to pick up a brush as i HATE painting! Just got the payment Wednesday.......


----------



## Guest

Coastal Breeze said:


> Hey everyone,
> 
> Like most of you I found this thread by accident last night and ended up reading the first 45 pages (when I should have been preparing for my work orders today, lol).
> 
> I've been in the industry for a little over a year and still can't stop learning. I went the route of working for brokers rather than nationals so thankfully they've been patient.
> 
> BTW, I had a work order today to drain an in ground pool who's pump and filter hadn't even been turned on in 5 years. It looked like a cup of coffee with leaves. By the time I had it drained I was standing in a 15 foot deep end battling 30 trapped frogs yawning because I was reading this post all night...great stuff here! I will be a fequent guest, student, and contributor!:thumbup:


Welcome! Ok the ? is::: what did you do with the water?

Here its against the laws to pump out onto a lawn or put it down a drain. Pumper trucks galore
OR like the old days I'm seeing the contractors putting a hole in the side and leaving. NOT ME :no: but I'm seeing it again.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Welcome! Ok the ? is::: what did you do with the water?
> 
> Here its against the laws to pump out onto a lawn or put it down a drain. Pumper trucks galore
> OR like the old days I'm seeing the contractors putting a hole in the side and leaving. NOT ME :no: but I'm seeing it again.


I service the Hampton Roads area of Virginia. Every city in Hampton Roads requires pool water to drain through the sewer system except the city of Virginia Beach which thankfully is where this pool was. 

You think the pool sounded bad, you should have seen the trash out and initial sales clean...ahhhh! Took me a week to complete.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected] gmail.com


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Has anyone ever had their bank shut down? 

Arizona First Savings Bank was shut down yesterday with no warning and it was after 6 pm when I got the e-mail so there was no way to rush over and do anything about my account.

It wasn't taken over by another bank so the FDIC says it's sending checks out Monday to the account holders. The problem with this is that I had just submitted vendor payments and I'm waiting for other credits to hit my account.

If the bank sends checks out Monday, I wonder how accurate their accounting will be and if the vendor payments will go out? Anyone else ever have this happen?

IMO, I think the FDIC should wait a week before they start sending checks out and I think they should have sent an e-mail a week before. But their note says they are not required to give anyone a warning. 

I e-mailed one of the girls that worked there and she said the staff didn't have any warning either. They were told at the end of the day they wouldn't be coming back.

In the meantime, I'm going to have to let my vendors know payments might be late and I don't look forward to that at all. As it is, I moved to Nevada at the beginning of October and my mail just starting catching up with me this week making a few vendor payments already late.

Very interesting times these are, that's for sure. This is one of the things about this industry that really, really sucks.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

WOW, thats going to create a new level of stress that you didn't need or want.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> WOW, thats going to create a new level of stress that you didn't need or want.


You got that right, Paul. I don't need it. Figures, though, doesn't it? Seems to be one thing after the other these days.

Fortunately, a couple of checks arrived yesterday a my new address so they haven't gone to the AZ bank. I don't like Chase but I'll start using my old account again and will still be able to function. Now I have to set up my bill pay system again. I suppose that's the least of my problems at the moment but it can be time-consuming.

I have 2 clients doing direct deposit. One of them, fortunately, mailed a check yesterday instead of submitting it for direct deposit. The other one is Altisource and I'm not sure how long the process will take to switch banks in their system. I sent an e-mail to them last night so we'll see.

It's a mess but I'm on top of it as much as I posssibly can be. I'm not going to stress too bad unless I don't see a check from the FDIC by the end of next week.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I'm looking for vendors in New York. I've got coverage in the southwest portion of the state but am looking for vendors to cover the north and the southeast portions.

I have work right now in Orange, Kings, and Suffolk counties. Anyone interested, write to me at [email protected].

Put New York in the subject line and list the counties you service in the body of the e-mail so I can find you faster. 

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## BPWY

My guess with Altisource is that its best to not rock the boat. LOL


I still have an account open in another city/state from a previous co that I worked with. I set that account up with direct deposit for Altisource and am still using it. With electronic transfer and debit cards its no different than my local account.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> I'm looking for vendors in New York. I've got coverage in the southwest portion of the state but am looking for vendors to cover the north and the southeast portions.
> 
> I have work right now in Orange, Kings, and Suffolk counties. Anyone interested, write to me at [email protected].
> 
> Put New York in the subject line and list the counties you service in the body of the e-mail so I can find you faster.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Linda






Hopefully your prospects can read this time.  :thumbup:


----------



## Guest

Linda,

I'm sorry to hear about the situation your in. It's a stressful line of work as it is, but when factors out of our control add to it it doesn't help.

I'm taking a break from my swamp pool and thought I'd at least send my best condolences.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Unfortunately, I have to rock the boat on this one. Now that the bank is shut down, they have to deposit somewhere. With their payments as slow as they are, though, I will probably have time.

With my luck, though, they'll probably decide to catch us up now that the bank is closed.:w00t:

Problem with Chase, though, is that they screw up all the time and always in their favor. They paid one of our checks twice in the amount of $251.25 back in June of 2009 and the problem is still being investigated. 

I went into another branch last month and talked to a manager about the investigation and they opened a whole new file. I don't trust Chase at all. This isn't the first time they've gotten one over on us and this isn't the first investigation into a problem. We've had a few others, like vendor checks that were deducted from our account and never reached the vendors. 

I may just start cashing all the checks that come in and go get money orders. I think I'd have a lot less of a hassle and, if I carry cash, I won't need the debit card. I trust the underside of my mattress far more than I trust banks these days.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Coastal Breeze said:


> Linda,
> 
> I'm sorry to hear about the situation your in. It's a stressful line of work as it is, but when factors out of our control add to it it doesn't help.
> 
> I'm taking a break from my swamp pool and thought I'd at least send my best condolences.
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> [email protected]


Thanks, Chris. I've gotten through much worse. No doubt I'll get through this. But I certainly appreciate your comment.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Hopefully your prospects can read this time.  :thumbup:


lol. They seem to be getting better and the photos have been coming over much clearer, too. I was able to add another 20 vendors to our network this week, giving us a much broader coverage.

I did have one though that came through with just a name. The state was in the subject line and the name in the body. Nothing else.:thumbup:

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Unfortunately, I have to rock the boat on this one. Now that the bank is shut down, they have to deposit somewhere. With their payments as slow as they are, though, I will probably have time.






I didn't understand that was the branch that was closed.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I didn't understand that was the branch that was closed.


It was my bank that shut down yesterday. All branches of First Arizona Savings Bank are no longer in operation.

Were you thinking one of Altisource's departments was shutting down?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> It was my bank that shut down yesterday. All branches of First Arizona Savings Bank are no longer in operation.
> 
> Were you thinking one of Altisource's departments was shutting down?
> 
> Linda






What I was thinking is that your new bank account that was just opened when you moved was shut down and ASSUMED that since you just moved you hadn't gotten the Altisource direct deposit moved yet.


You know what they say about ASS U ME ing some thing.

And I hadn't had enough coffee, I got cornfuddled. :laughing:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> And I hadn't had enough coffee, I got cornfuddled. :laughing:


I get like that easily. I'm sure everyone knows by now that I am a true blond and it doesn't matter how much coffee I drink, the color doesn't change.:laughing:

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I'm looking for vendors in New York.
> 
> Hey Linda,
> We are about 15 minutes from the NY border ( Westchester County NY ) from our office in CT. We've done some trash outs for REO Brokers over the state line. We don't have a contractors license in NY if that makes a difference, not sure if you really need one.
> LMK
> Dan


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> a1propertyclean said:
> 
> 
> 
> I'm looking for vendors in New York.
> 
> Hey Linda,
> We are about 15 minutes from the NY border ( Westchester County NY ) from our office in CT. We've done some trash outs for REO Brokers over the state line. We don't have a contractors license in NY if that makes a difference, not sure if you really need one.
> LMK
> Dan
> 
> 
> 
> These are preservation orders I have and, as far as I know, they don't require a contractors license.
> 
> Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Linda
Click to expand...


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> These are preservation orders I have and, as far as I know, they don't require a contractors license.
> 
> Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.
> 
> Linda





I've heard of some locals needing a license.


----------



## Guest

If no license required and you have any in Westchester County, NY then send me the work orders and we'll get them done for ya.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> I've heard of some locals needing a license.


For preservation in New York? Just need clarification. I don't want to send someone somewhwere if it's going to cause a problem.

Linda


----------



## brm1109

*New York*

Hi Linda,
I am not sure about all preservation but I know to do trash removal you need a license in NY as well as here in NJ. Also in NJ for most jobs you need a home improvement contractors license.
I always feel it is better to be safe than sorry.
That is why I am also in the process of getting licensed for Pa. just to have it.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

brm1109 said:


> Hi Linda,
> I am not sure about all preservation but I know to do trash removal you need a license in NY as well as here in NJ. Also in NJ for most jobs you need a home improvement contractors license.
> I always feel it is better to be safe than sorry.
> That is why I am also in the process of getting licensed for Pa. just to have it.


That helps considerably. For the most part, everyone should already know what they can and can't do in their states and counties. But it doesn't hurt for me to be informed as well. With vendors in 44 states, it can be hard to remember who is allowed to do what.

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Nationals who represent HUD*

I have a question for all of you.

Since starting my business a year ago I have only worked for brokers. One broker I have owns a real estate group that only deals with Freddie Mac foreclosures and HUDs, however here in the Hampton Roads market all area HUD preservation is contracted by 3 asset groups.

One of the groups asked her to refer a preservation contractor for the area and she wants to refer me. After reading many of the posts throughout this thread I'm now more than apprehensive for her to send my service list and information in.

I was curious as to the thoughts of those of you who are already established. I sub out my sales cleans and have a helper but I am swamped and worry about the "dotting my i's and crossing my t's" issue that I keep hearing about with nationals (I don't have those issues with my brokers).

Is it worth her referring me?

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Coastal Breeze said:


> I have a question for all of you.
> 
> Since starting my business a year ago I have only worked for brokers. One broker I have owns a real estate group that only deals with Freddie Mac foreclosures and HUDs, however here in the Hampton Roads market all area HUD preservation is contracted by 3 asset groups.
> 
> One of the groups asked her to refer a preservation contractor for the area and she wants to refer me. After reading many of the posts throughout this thread I'm now more than apprehensive for her to send my service list and information in.
> 
> I was curious as to the thoughts of those of you who are already established. I sub out my sales cleans and have a helper but I am swamped and worry about the "dotting my i's and crossing my t's" issue that I keep hearing about with nationals (I don't have those issues with my brokers).
> 
> Is it worth her referring me?
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> [email protected]


That's going to be a tough call. If you can get all the work through her instead of the national, it might make a difference. Going direct, depending on who it is, can be a horrible experience. Most nationals will treat their brokers better than a PP vendor.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> That's going to be a tough call. If you can get all the work through her instead of the national, it might make a difference. Going direct, depending on who it is, can be a horrible experience. Most nationals will treat their brokers better than a PP vendor.
> 
> Linda


Linda,

Thank you for your quick response.

One of the nice things about this particular broker is she will give me all my work orders for the week at the same time, as well as any necessary bids. This allows me to plan my week accordingly. My other brokers do something similar so I'm afforded the "luxory" of receiving a lot of work all at once and then working as hard as necessary to complete it all in 7 days. If I finish quicker I get more work orders.

My understanding is that a national will throw a kink into what has turned into a God-sent ruitine...


----------



## BPWY

Nationals will send you a w/o due on their time line. Some times its 24 hr rush, other times you've got 2 to 5 days leeway.

I can promise you won't have the luxury you have now.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Coastal Breeze said:


> Linda,
> 
> Thank you for your quick response.
> 
> One of the nice things about this particular broker is she will give me all my work orders for the week at the same time, as well as any necessary bids. This allows me to plan my week accordingly. My other brokers do something similar so I'm afforded the "luxory" of receiving a lot of work all at once and then working as hard as necessary to complete it all in 7 days. If I finish quicker I get more work orders.
> 
> My understanding is that a national will throw a kink into what has turned into a God-sent ruitine...


You are very fortunate to have that kind of a relationship with your clients.

What typically happens to us is we are bombed with new orders on Friday and most are due on Monday or Tuesday. Once in awhile we have a little more time to complete them but not by much.

I would continue to do what you are doing and, if the need arises, sub some of the work out. If you get work from the nationals they could overwhelm you and the profit margin is far less than what you are probably getting now. It wouldn't be worth subbing most of the nationals' work out.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thank you so much BPWY and Linda, your responses all well as previous posts helped me to think logically and rationally about this and make a decision. 

The number of PP contractors in SE Virginia is relatively small in spite of the large number of foreclosures in the area. Unfortunately there are a lot of "get rich quick" believers that signed up for the nationals and gave PP a bad name in our area due to their lack of professionalism and care. I'm sure they're all around for a summer and then disapear.

On the flip side that has been why my brokers have been so amazing to me. After going through vendor after vendor they work just as hard to keep me as I do them. They are very patient if I fall slightly behind on photo or invoice submission, if my work orders back up slightly, or even if I'm feeling a little under the weather. They all have at least 1 empty desk in their offices that i'm allowed to sit at to type invoices from time to time and if they need to adjust an invoice they let me know and add it onto a different one. It's like I'm an adopted son or something.

If it sound like i'm bragging I'm not, I'm more or less thinking out loud, but it has helped to figure out how i'll explain it to this specific broker. Thank you all of you for being patient while I sorted this out. I wouldn't have been able to make an educated decision without reading 400 million posts and then asking the question.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services


----------



## Guest

Coastal Breeze

Much like you, we've only worked direct with the REO brokers and it's been great as far as pay scale, getting paid and having the relationship we have with our clients. It sounds like you are getting a good amount of work from them. We don't get a full weeks work any given week so we are looking to expand our work load with a national. ( hi Linda ). I agree with your concern about subbing out work ( less pay for you and are they going to get the pics correct and all that ). I'm a hands on guy and am always worried about someone else getting it done right.
Good luck to you in whatever you decide to do.


----------



## Guest

Danny,

We sound like minded regarding being hands on and I didn't know people north of the Mason-Dixon were okay with getting dirty! (I'm kidding, I have family in NJ, VT, NH, and PA...they'd kill me if they heard me cracking jokes on northerners).

I don't know if it's so much "hands on" as it is pridr in work. Something the "get rich quickies" don't understand is that we're building businesses, providing services, and doing what we can to build relationships and help sell houses.

I have a "friend" who believes this is a quick way to get rich and contacted a local real estate company and put a bid in on a trash out. He's in for a rude awakening especially since he hasn't done any research regarding the industry. I've never seen more people jump into any other industry without any research and planning.

I blame it on all those get rich quick e-books tricking people.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Coastal ~

If you become overwhelmed, I have someone in Virginia I'll hook you up with directly. Just shoot me an e-mail if you ever need to.

Linda


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## Guest

OK got a question that has been bugging me lately 

I recently have been advised, since we operate in several States, that we have to be licensed at the Secretary of States Office for each State we do business in. I guess this business is being scrutinized by many many States and I think the final "fallout" will be on the contractors. My question is this: When being filed at the Sec of States Office does that mean we have to be licensed as a contractor for every State?
I am a licensed contractor in several States now but not for every State that we operate in.... Just another thing to scatch my head on....


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## BPWY

I know that for lock changes, trash outs and grass cuts there is no license available in the state of WY.
Most counties and cities the same thing.


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## brm1109

I think that as long as the state requires a license then yes. Your best bet is to check with the division of consumer affairs.
Also don't forget that for every state you operate in you will need to collect sales tax.
A lot of paperwork.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I was blown away when i got a bid approval to paint a 1100 sq ft house for $2600. Found 2 gals in town that "LOVE" to paint and they ended up making over $20 an hour, (painted it in 2 days) i paid for all materials and supplied equipment and still put a VERY hefty sum in my pocket. Best thing is i didn't have to pick up a brush as i HATE painting! Just got the payment Wednesday.......


SHHHHHHHH...too much info... bragging will only produce lower bids and more competition for you.


----------



## Guest

Linda,

I currently working on setting up contracts with 3 more brokers in my area and will definitely hit you up on your offer. I will e-mail you if I have time throughout the day or when I'm uploading photos tonight.

Thank you!

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> I think that as long as the state requires a license then yes. Your best bet is to check with the division of consumer affairs.
> Also don't forget that for every state you operate in you will need to collect sales tax.
> A lot of paperwork.


Yeah the Sales Tax thing is very sticky! What pis**d us off is that you don't have to pay sales tax for a initial cleanout but you do have to pay tax for the maid service portion of a cleanout..go figure! Now that is a pain. 

So it goes back to research.....The nationals are not registered in every State they do business in but they are registered in their domiciled State... Why is this different for them then it would be for the contractors? Our accountant is saying that we would be "doing business without a license". This does not mean a "contractors license" but a "State Business License".... I sure don't want to pay for MORE legal advise :no:

Everytime we sit down with the accountant and complete our Audit paperwork for Work Comp or CGL there is always something new! 

This just does not seem correct but I can't place a finger on the reason:whistling

Maybe Linda can chime in since I'm guessing she is registered in all the States or knows why we don't have to be?


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## APlusPPGroup

No, we are not registered in every state. All of our vendors should be, though. Everyone is required to have all applicable licenses and insurance before they come on board.

I'll do a little checking myself and see what I can find. Interesting question, since we give the work to out of state vendors and THEY are the ones doing the work.

Linda


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## Guest

Linda,
I know there is a lot of "gray" area .. It basically is summed up as this: "if you are doing _business_ as an out-of-State company than you must be registered with that State". Business is the gray area? If I send a job to a sub contractor in XYZ State does that mean "I" am doing business in that State? Accountant say's I am. I guess it means I better get on my "walking" shoes and walk to the attorneys office again 
Now I am licensed and registered in every State that I am actually doing the work in but not every State where we have subs.......


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## APlusPPGroup

Looks like I'll need to do a little homework. We do everything by the book but haven't been asked about this particular chapter.:001_unsure:

I wonder if there isn't a license for interstate that would cover them all? Maybe I'll check federal licensing while I'm researching.

Linda


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## brm1109

Freemont, I am not an expert but I would think that if you send work to a sub in another state, then you are not doing the work they are.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Freemont, I am not an expert but I would think that if you send work to a sub in another state, then you are not doing the work they are.


I've contracted with a couple of national/international companies in the past (totally different field), and in most cases the tax and licensing issues depended on whether they had a physical presence (offices) in a given state.


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## APlusPPGroup

There is no federal license available, which means we'll have to research each state.

The ones that require federal licensing: http://www.business.gov/register/licenses-and-permits/federal-licenses.html

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Tinstaafl said:


> I've contracted with a couple of national/international companies in the past (totally different field), and in most cases the tax and licensing issues depended on whether they had a physical presence (offices) in a given state.


I agree and I've been told this in the past. But now that there are so many new PP companies springing up all over, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to find that the states are now attempting to capitalize by establishing new licensing requirements.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Here's a link to help us locate each state's requirements quickly.

http://www.business.gov/register/licenses-and-permits/index.html

I don't know yet if there's anything at any one of the states that says anything about interstate licensing.

Maybe everyone can check their own state and copy and paste what they find. That will be the quickest way, instead of one or 2 people doing the research.:thumbsup:

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

*Foreign qualifying a company means that you are registering it to transact business in a state other than your state of formation. Corporations and LLCs are considered domestic only in their state of formation. For example, if you formed your LLC in Delaware, it is only domestic in the state of Delaware. If your LLC is transacting business outside the state of Delaware, it would be considered a foreign LLC in those other states.
* 
*What is Considered Transacting Business?* Many factors are used to determine whether a company is transacting business in a state, and therefore needs to foreign qualify. Some of the common criteria evaluated include:

Whether the company has a physical presence in the state
Whether the company has employees in the state
Whether the company accepts orders in the state
Whether the company has a bank account in the state
*Did You Know?*
This is not a complete list, and different states may have different criteria. To determine whether your business needs to foreign qualify in a particular state, it is best to seek the advice of an attorney.


The link to this info: http://www.toolkit.com/small_business_guide/sbg.aspx?nid=P01_4763

Not sure if this helps or not. We send orders out of state but do not do the work ourselves. The vendors themselves accept work in their states.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

*Missouri Foreign Licensing*

*Foreign Entities*

*1. What qualifies as “transacting business” or “doing business”?* Under Missouri law, whether an entity is *transacting or doing business* in the state is determined on a case-by-case basis. There is no statutory standard or bright-line rule to apply to determine if an entity must register. Many entities enlist the assistance of any attorney to make a determination as to the entity’s obligation to register; this analysis is often based upon past court decisions.
*2. Does a single or isolated project or task in Missouri qualify as “doing business”? *Missouri statute specifically provides that an isolated transaction or project that is completed within 30 days, and is not one in the course of repeated transactions of a like nature, does not qualify as “*doing business”*. In this situation, the foreign entity is not under the obligation to register with the Secretary of State.
*3. Does collecting debts qualify as “doing business”? *No. Missouri statute specifically provides that securing and collecting debts, and enforcing mortgages and security interests, do not qualify as doing business.
*4. What if I am obligated to, but do not, register my foreign entity?* An entity that is not registered, but by law is required to be, cannot legally transact business or maintain a lawsuit in Missouri until it secures a certificate of authority. If the failure to properly register is discovered after an action is initiated by an unregistered foreign entity, the action could be suspended until the registration is completed. In addition, foreign entities that do not comply with the registration requirement are subject to a fine of not less than $1,000, which is collected through the institution of a lawsuit.
How would you interpret Item 2? And how would you interpet Item 3 where it says, "enforcing mortgages and security interests"? Seems that one might be construed a couple of different ways.

Anyone here from Missouri who might have a better interpretation? Just curious.

Linda


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## Guest

As far as I know, if your not charging (collecting a tax) for service rendered in any particular state then there's no need to register. The state wants you registered so they can collect their piece of the tax. The licensing requirements of course would depend on what type of work your doing.


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## APlusPPGroup

*Washington Foreign Licensing*

Washington confirms what you just said, Danny. Not sure if it's the same in all other states.

*When to register *

Out-of-state businesses must register with the Washington State Department of Revenue if:


The business conducts activities that establish nexus sufficient for imposing B&O tax or the public utility tax.
The business collects retail sales, use tax, or other taxes administered by the Department.
The business collects Washington's use tax.
A business may not need to register if: 


Their annual gross income from Washington activities is less than $12,000.
The business is not required to collect or pay sales tax or use tax.
The business is not required to obtain a license or registration from another Washington State agency
The easiest way I found to find out about each state was to search "doing business out of state". The search brought up all kinds of stuff and sends me right the page the info is on.

Linda


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## Guest

Yep now I know I'm walking to the attorneys office (gotta save gas money...

Use tax is the bigging as I read it...thats the consumer use tax that applies to the maid services and possibly to the grass cuts and maybe other items in each State. The Dept of Revenue has told me 4 times that it "may" apply 2X yes it does and 2X no it doesn't. 
I guess when the first contractor gets "nailed" then everyone will know eh?
As the accountant (now he is not a lawyer so he's looking at the possible tax implications) we were told that if you are accepting work *FOR or IN* a non-domiciled State than you have to be Registered.


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## Guest

I know this is WAY off topic, but I wanted to share a few thoughts with you.

I'm about to wrap up a 3 day pool clean/secure/skirt clean (those of you who have cleaned and secure pools know if it took 3 days then it was BAD) but as I look at the before pictures I'm realizing how much I've gotteb done, how much better it looks, and how my $X,*** bid (shhhhh) adds at least $20,000 to the value of the house... I feel pretty good right now!

We are in the business to help people and we can't forget that!

Linda,

I'm still on the job but wull e-mail you tonight. I'm on east coast time so my trash outs begin HOURS before yours and I'm home with my 2 little boys HOURS before you (Dont worry, when I get up at 430 am I'm thinking about the west coast people who are still sleeping...and I get jealous!).

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## Guest

Coastal Breeze said:


> I know this is WAY off topic, but I wanted to share a few thoughts with you.
> 
> I'm about to wrap up a 3 day pool clean/secure/skirt clean (those of you who have cleaned and secure pools know if it took 3 days then it was BAD) but as I look at the before pictures I'm realizing how much I've gotteb done, how much better it looks, and how my $X,*** bid (shhhhh) adds at least $20,000 to the value of the house... I feel pretty good right now!
> 
> We are in the business to help people and we can't forget that!
> 
> Linda,
> 
> I'm still on the job but wull e-mail you tonight. I'm on east coast time so my trash outs begin HOURS before yours and I'm home with my 2 little boys HOURS before you (Dont worry, when I get up at 430 am I'm thinking about the west coast people who are still sleeping...and I get jealous!).
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> [email protected]


 
Chris never ever forget those words of helping people...! Unfortunately we are not helping "people" but the thieving bastar*s that take the handout of the taxpayers (ie stimulus) and then will not blink to scr** you also. Now I'm not saying not to do a good job by any means. Take self satisfaction in a job well done. 
After being in this business for over 14 years I would never refer anyone to get into this business anylonger--and I've helped probably a 100 contractors over the years to get into the field. Not anylonger. 
Its a sad state of affairs anylonger.:whistling


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## Guest

Linda,

I will have to send my e-mail tomorrow..im EXHAUSTED.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Chris never ever forget those words of helping people...! Unfortunately we are not helping "people" but the thieving bastar*s that take the handout of the taxpayers (ie stimulus) and then will not blink to scr** you also. Now I'm not saying not to do a good job by any means. Take self satisfaction in a job well done.
> After being in this business for over 14 years I would never refer anyone to get into this business anylonger--and I've helped probably a 100 contractors over the years to get into the field. Not anylonger.
> Its a sad state of affairs anylonger.:whistling


Fremont,

Without getting into politics (though I believe we agree) I will say that yes, Washington created a mess that we are left to clean up, but I am still providing a service to my brokers whom I love like family. 

With that being said I've only been in the business for a year not for 14 so I have not seen it change as you have.

PM me or e-mail me because I would love to talk politics with you.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Coastal ~
> 
> If you become overwhelmed, I have someone in Virginia I'll hook you up with directly. Just shoot me an e-mail if you ever need to.
> 
> Linda


I lied. I'm laying in bed with a hot cup of sleepy time tea STILL working (but on my phone instead of computer, so somehow it's different:whistling).

I did shoot you an e-mail regarding a reliable vendor in SE VA but please take care of work first. I am patient and understand the demands you're under so in Linda time respond. (Unless Linda time is like Coastal Breeze time which believes the government should change the day from 24 hours to 72 and God should add 100 thousand hours of sunlight to each day, lol :laughing

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## mtmtnman

Hammer&Cross said:


> SHHHHHHHH...too much info... bragging will only produce lower bids and more competition for you.



I was luck to have a bunch of pain which saved me a bunch and the rest i got on sale. Just my lucky week. I hate painting and ALWAYS bid high. 1st paint bid i got in a year.............


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## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> I think that as long as the state requires a license then yes. Your best bet is to check with the division of consumer affairs.
> Also don't forget that for every state you operate in you will need to collect sales tax.
> A lot of paperwork.



Sales tax?? Whats that????:whistling:whistling:whistling What i save a year here in Montana in sales tax MORE than covers the measly state income tax i pay.


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Sales tax?? Whats that????:whistling:whistling:whistling What i save a year here in Montana in sales tax MORE than covers the measly state income tax i pay.


I moved to VA from Kalispell, MT...i was really confused at first when my total came to more than what was posted, confused when I tried to buy beer at 1:45 and they told me not after 12, and confused why everyone stared at my Subaru DL hatchback which was covered in salt rust like I was alien...

Where in MT are you?

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## mtmtnman

Coastal Breeze said:


> I moved to VA from Kalispell, MT...i was really confused at first when my total came to more than what was posted, confused when I tried to buy beer at 1:45 and they told me not after 12, and confused why everyone stared at my Subaru DL hatchback which was covered in salt rust like I was alien...
> 
> Where in MT are you?
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> [email protected]



LOL!!! West Valley Kalispell off of Church Drive. Gotta love those blue laws back east to eh?? My SIL lived in Roanoke and stores couldn't open till after noon on Sunday. I buy beer whenever i want here!!


By the way, WHY IN TARNATION WOULD YOU LEAVE THIS BEAUTIFUL VALLEY FOR THE EAST COAST RAT RACE?????? If i never get east of the Mississippi again it will be too soon. Unfortunately i have to go to the midwest around X-Mas...........


Also where did you get the rust from?? I see very little rust around here......


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> LOL!!! West Valley Kalispell off of Church Drive. Gotta love those blue laws back east to eh?? My SIL lived in Roanoke and stores couldn't open till after noon on Sunday. I buy beer whenever i want here!!
> 
> 
> By the way, WHY IN TARNATION WOULD YOU LEAVE THIS BEAUTIFUL VALLEY FOR THE EAST COAST RAT RACE?????? If i never get east of the Mississippi again it will be too soon. Unfortunately i have to go to the midwest around X-Mas...........
> 
> 
> Also where did you get the rust from?? I see very little rust around here......


West Valley?! HaHa..man I miss that place...for a while I lived in Kila, West Glacier, and Evergreen...I moved out her because my parents live out here in the marsh land by I would kill to move back..oh yeah, I lived out in Thompson Falls for a while out near Plains...

and the rust was probly because it was a 1986 Subaru...but it also had a LOT of trips out to Paradise because my my girlfriend at the time was a traveling CNA.

Both of my sisters went to Virginia Tech which is near Roanoke...luckily in SE VA beer is sold again at 7 am not 12


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## mtmtnman

Coastal Breeze said:


> West Valley?! HaHa..man I miss that place...for a while I lived in Kila, West Glacier, and Evergreen...I moved out her because my parents live out here in the marsh land by I would kill to move back..oh yeah, I lived out in Thompson Falls for a while out near Plains...
> 
> and the rust was probly because it was a 1986 Subaru...but it also had a LOT of trips out to Paradise because my my girlfriend at the time was a traveling CNA.
> 
> Both of my sisters went to Virginia Tech which is near Roanoke...luckily in SE VA beer is sold again at 7 am not 12



They are running a new bypass around Kalispell from the South end of town. 1st phase is done from Gardner RV south of tow, west to Hwy 2 just west of Bojangles. The rest will be done next year and tied in by Lowes.


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## Guest

sky is not falling





Winners will be the lawyers


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## Guest

All for a Whopping $15..........We love these jobs, this is why we got in this business, to do these all day, what a money maker!.......:shutup:


1. Inspections must be completed and submitted in the system within three (3) calendar days of assignment.

2. Three (3) high resolution photographs must be provided (i.e. front view, side view and street view).

3. All photographs provided will be used in marketing the asset, therefore, please keep this in mind when capturing the images of the property.

4. Any additional preservation requirement that need to be addressed on the property should be supported with separate pictures.

5. If occupied – Kindly confirm if Tenant or Mortgagor occupied.

6. Kindly confirm the name of the occupants. Complete first and last name.

7. Kindly confirm the contact information of the occupants (i.e. Home phone and Cell Phone).

8. If vacant, we need to know if there are personal belongings in the property. Is the value greater than $300? This should be commented in the additional comments section.

9. If vacant, any and all preservation/maintenance item that needs immediate attention.

10. Kindly confirm the name of Utility service provider. We would like to know the name of the utility service provider for Electricity, Gas and water. For our client this is of critical value, always provide.

11. Homeowner Association (HOA) – Please provide the HOA information in the PIP Form.

NOTE: A delay in the completion of the inspection order affects our productivity and more importantly, it reflects negatively on your score card. Please note that any deviations on not adhering to these timelines will reflect as failure rate on your scorecard and shall be considered for future allocation of new properties.


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## BPWY

Don't be too sure its $15.


The last time they approached me they were offering $6 for regular inspections and $8 for 24 hr rush.


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## mtmtnman

danny1217 said:


> All for a Whopping $15..........We love these jobs, this is why we got in this business, to do these all day, what a money maker!.......:shutup:
> 
> 
> 1. Inspections must be completed and submitted in the system within three (3) calendar days of assignment.
> 
> 2. Three (3) high resolution photographs must be provided (i.e. front view, side view and street view).
> 
> 3. All photographs provided will be used in marketing the asset, therefore, please keep this in mind when capturing the images of the property.
> 
> 4. Any additional preservation requirement that need to be addressed on the property should be supported with separate pictures.
> 
> 5. If occupied – Kindly confirm if Tenant or Mortgagor occupied.
> 
> 6. Kindly confirm the name of the occupants. Complete first and last name.
> 
> 7. Kindly confirm the contact information of the occupants (i.e. Home phone and Cell Phone).
> 
> 8. If vacant, we need to know if there are personal belongings in the property. Is the value greater than $300? This should be commented in the additional comments section.
> 
> 9. If vacant, any and all preservation/maintenance item that needs immediate attention.
> 
> 10. Kindly confirm the name of Utility service provider. We would like to know the name of the utility service provider for Electricity, Gas and water. For our client this is of critical value, always provide.
> 
> 11. Homeowner Association (HOA) – Please provide the HOA information in the PIP Form.
> 
> NOTE: A delay in the completion of the inspection order affects our productivity and more importantly, it reflects negatively on your score card. Please note that any deviations on not adhering to these timelines will reflect as failure rate on your scorecard and shall be considered for future allocation of new properties.




With the word "kindly" throughout the instructions it sounds like the foreign company that starts with an "O"


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## Guest

Right you are.............we decided after signing up a few months ago with them ( over the phone ), not to work with them. ( the vendor pak was alot more truthful than the person on the phone ). We were declining every work order, now i'm just deleting the e mails when they come in ( everyday ). They actually call me about once a week and I nicely decline the work and tell them we aren't interested. Just for fun I checked our performance # a couple of weeks ago and we're still in the high 70's ? I figure we've declined 100+ orders, never accepted one order. You would think by now they would stop sending orders. I've e mailed them asking to opt us out of their system.


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## BPWY

My score comes in showing I've accepted and completed maybe half of the actual work I do.



I only work for them in my county so its not a lot of hassle like it would be if I was driving farther than I am. 
I've got maybe $1000 out of them this summer.


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## BPWY

I can't talk to them on the phone because with my messed up hearing I can't begin to understand what they are wanting done.

Recently they called for a water meter install. Left message on the VM and never sent a w/o. I ignored the VM. I'm not going to allow access for free. Time is money, send over a w/o with a trip charge and I'll get it done.


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## Guest

lol.........and i thought it was just me having a hard time with the "oceanic verbal communication jubilator switch not working properly" he..he...he


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> All for a Whopping $15..........We love these jobs, this is why we got in this business, to do these all day, what a money maker!.......:shutup:
> 
> 
> 1. Inspections must be completed and submitted in the system within three (3) calendar days of assignment.
> 
> 2. Three (3) high resolution photographs must be provided (i.e. front view, side view and street view).
> 
> 3. All photographs provided will be used in marketing the asset, therefore, please keep this in mind when capturing the images of the property.
> 
> 4. Any additional preservation requirement that need to be addressed on the property should be supported with separate pictures.
> 
> 5. If occupied – Kindly confirm if Tenant or Mortgagor occupied.
> 
> 6. Kindly confirm the name of the occupants. Complete first and last name.
> 
> 7. Kindly confirm the contact information of the occupants (i.e. Home phone and Cell Phone).
> 
> 8. If vacant, we need to know if there are personal belongings in the property. Is the value greater than $300? This should be commented in the additional comments section.
> 
> 9. If vacant, any and all preservation/maintenance item that needs immediate attention.
> 
> 10. Kindly confirm the name of Utility service provider. We would like to know the name of the utility service provider for Electricity, Gas and water. For our client this is of critical value, always provide.
> 
> 11. Homeowner Association (HOA) – Please provide the HOA information in the PIP Form.
> 
> NOTE: A delay in the completion of the inspection order affects our productivity and more importantly, it reflects negatively on your score card. Please note that any deviations on not adhering to these timelines will reflect as failure rate on your scorecard and shall be considered for future allocation of new properties.


Let me guess............... Altisource? I suppose you could look at it from the bright side - at least they're paying SOMETHING for them now.:notworthy

Linda


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## Guest

That's true, it was $0 till a couple of months ago
I just don't see how a vendor can justify the time, etc for $0, $6, $8 or even $15 on those work orders. I guess the chance for other work at that job site may be the only reason, or if you must accept those to get the wints, mowing, securing, trash outs, etc. Squeezing a dollar out of some of these jobs is hard enough without the one's that cost you money thrown in the mix.


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## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> you must accept those to get the wints, mowing, securing, trash outs, etc.







You guessed it.


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## BPWY

A national that I was signed up with but never got work from sent out a new price list today.

Among other things $60 dry wints, $20 per cyd for debris, $40 for grass cuts up to 15,000 sq ft.
Boarding is a joke. The prices won't pay for materials, let along labor and travel.

Boarding Small Opening
Ea
$24.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding Medium Opening
Ea
$32.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding Large Opening
Ea
$36.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding sliding door/ double door
Ea
$60.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding single car garage
Ea
$100.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding double car garage
Ea
$140.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Security door w/ hinges & padlock
Ea
$60.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood
Boarding large front door
Ea
$36.00
Bolt board to HUD Spec's using new plywood




I told them nicely thanks for the updates but to immediately remove me from their vendor list.


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## brm1109

I received the same email.
I wrote an email stating that the prices would have to be negotiated.
Not going to hold my breath waiting for a reply.


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## Guest

I know it is frustrating but I have to ask, boarding is more of side work being done on a property normally on the initial secure, how is this not considered cost of doing business on this company if you were willing to do occupancy checks for free from ocwen in order to get the other services they offered ?

the 40 gc are re-cuts on the sizeyou stated


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## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> I know it is frustrating but I have to ask, boarding is more of side work being done on a property normally on the initial secure, how is this not considered cost of doing business on this company if you were willing to do occupancy checks for free from ocwen in order to get the other services they offered ?
> 
> the 40 gc are re-cuts on the sizeyou stated



Boarding is only the half of it but look at it thisway. If the property was right next door to Home Depot it would not be worth boarding a garage for the price they have quoted. You CANNOT buy the materials for the price quoted. Local lawn services get 40-45 A WEEK to do what the bank wants done bi-weekly when the grass is 2x as tall. $20 per Cu-Yd does not even cover dump fees in many areas.

_" Volumes in excess of ten cubic yards are charged at a rate of $15.00/cubic yard. Construction materials, tires, sofas and other furniture, mattresses, and appliances are charged separate fees according to published fee schedules."_

The servicing company makes more in the end than the contractor.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Boarding is only the half of it but look at it thisway. If the property was right next door to Home Depot it would not be worth boarding a garage for the price they have quoted. You CANNOT buy the materials for the price quoted. Local lawn services get 40-45 A WEEK to do what the bank wants done bi-weekly when the grass is 2x as tall. $20 per Cu-Yd does not even cover dump fees in many areas.
> 
> _" Volumes in excess of ten cubic yards are charged at a rate of $15.00/cubic yard. Construction materials, tires, sofas and other furniture, mattresses, and appliances are charged separate fees according to published fee schedules."_
> 
> The servicing company makes more in the end than the contractor.





I don't know where they expect the contractor to buy his material, but you sure can't buy the material for boarding at their rates. Even HUD's united inch rate is pretty low when you consider the cost of material and labor.

The red highlited area is designed for only one thing. To screw the contractor. 
10 yrds takes more work and more costs to dispose of than what 9 does. Why in the world does the rate suddenly go down?

In the area I work the lowest price for a 30 yrd dumpster has been $350. Even at that the guy was really complaining. Usually its between $400 and $500. I've even seen north of $800 for a semi remote area. (I think that co was trying to gouge me).
So lets take the $350 figure which is probably not going to happen.

First 10 yrds is $200, the next 20 pays $300 = $500. Minus the dumpster fees and you are left with $150 to pay yourself and your guys travel time to the job, fuel, maintenance and wear/tear on the pick up. Pay your guys the time on the job and travel time home. The groceries on the supper table is going to be really slim pickings that night for every body involved in that day's work!

Now sure you can haul it yourself. It going to require two trips to the dump, and around here that could be a 2 hr drive one way by it self...... or farther. Depending on where I go it could cost $100 to $200 just for the land fill. No matter how you slice it the contractor is getting screwed!

And for grass cuts...... I don't give a dang if it is a recut. $40 for 15k sq ft is a rip off. Around here that would be $50 weekly to $60/$65 for bi-weekly if I was working for Joe home owner.

There is absolutely no reason to lower my rates for a bank below what I can get on the free market and then they can take up to 60+ days to pay or not pay at all.


Idaho property if you can work for these rates, stay in biz and make a profit then good for you. The rates in question will not even begin to allow me to break even. I don't work for chicken feed or table scraps. And I don't work for free.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I received the same email.
> I wrote an email stating that the prices would have to be negotiated.
> Not going to hold my breath waiting for a reply.






One of the big reasons their rates are that low is the company I had in mind mainly works for ocwen and FAS.


Both of those outfits obviously can't find contractors for their rates before a middle man takes a profit. I wonder how they expect to find contractors now?


----------



## Guest

*Quality Control Plan?*

Hello all,

I have just registered with Cityside as a property preservation vendor, and they want me to briefly describe my QC plan to ensure that my crew is complying with their guidelines. I don't have an "official" QC plan. does anyone have such a plan that relates to PP work and HUD guidelines?

thanks,

John


----------



## Guest

thejohnner:
Good lord man, did you check out their price schedule ?
Did you see their $300 all incompassing preservation job ( hand rails, cement repair, step repair, grass cut, white glove cleaning, trash out, winterizing, etc. etc

Good Luck


----------



## Guest

​Initial Services to Include
Initial Services Flat Fee: $300​•​​​​Removal of up to 5 cubic yards of debris​
•​​​​Installing handrails missing from any walkway or stairwell with more than one step​
•​​​​Replacing any damaged, missing, rotted or otherwise unsecured step​
•​​​​Installing tape over transition areas between carpets and floors​
•​​​​Re-securing with mortar broken, loose, or otherwise un-secured brick or concrete steps​
•​​​​Securing gates surrounding pools​
•​​​​Tacking down loose linoleum​
•​​​​Removing loose tiles and installing black tape between remaining secured tiles and
floors​
•​​​​Removing all falling ceiling tiles​
•​​​​Treating with “Killz” or bleach up to 10 Sq. Ft area of mold​
•​​​​Removing all broken glass from interior and exterior of property​
•​​​​Cap all exposed electrical wires, gas lines, water lines,​
•​​​​Cover all exposed outlets with face plates, cover all exposed electric panels.​
•​​​​Vacuum all interior rooms​
•​​​​Dust windowsills​
•​​​​Remove cobwebs​
•​​​​Sweep and mop floors using bleach, pinesol and/or appropriate cleaning agent​
•​​​​Remove all litter,​
•​​​​Clean all appliances inside and out (unless they are to be removed), counters, back
splashes, cabinets, drawers,​
•​​​​Clean and sanitize and deodorize all bathrooms (including all toilets, showers, sinks,
countertops, cabinets and back splashes).​
•​​​​Appropriate winterization services to be completed as necessary.​
•​​​​Cutting grass to a height not to exceed 2”​
•​​​​Edging all property exterior (front, side and back)​
•​​​​Weed removal from lawns, beds, fence lines, driveways, and curbs​
•​​​​Removal of litter/trash/debris, grass clippings, tree trimmings, leaves, etc., from
the property
Remove all leaves, branches, debris, and refuse from gutters​
•​​​​Disposal of all debris and yard refuse off of property location in accordance with local
standards and regulations​
• Sweeping of all paved areas


----------



## Guest

*Hey John*

Sorry for the knee "jerk" reaction to your Cityside question. Hope it didn't offend
I just happened to be on their site today and thought the pricing was nuts
And then you came on saying you just registered
I don't think I can work for those prices but we all have our own paths to take. 
If you can do it more power to ya
Good luck to you, really


----------



## BPWY

I just got off the phone with what was up until now my best national to work with.

Their brain dead act now has given me a splitting headache.


Because of the steps by HUD and the nationals to cut prices every where or demand more work for the same or less pay I predict that the contractors are going to begin dropping like flies. I cannot work for the no insurance illegal laborer wages that are now being paid.


----------



## Guest

Thanks for the reply. Yeah, these prices are low! I am just starting out (supplementing my home inspection biz). I sent in several apps to different companies (cityside, coopercitiwest, and PEMCO). We'll see how it goes


----------



## BPWY

A few pages back some of you might remember that I posted a comment about how the nationals don't give the slightest bit of a damn about the contractors. And that the health, welfare and the need to turn a profit for your business doesn't even enter into their thought processes or their business model.


Today if you could have heard the other side of the conversation I had with a national company employee would show you that I was 100,000% right in my statement. If I remember right some here even disagreed with me and that I didn't know what I was talking about. Or maybe it was another subject.

This person cannot understand why as an independent contractor that all your time must be accounted for. 
She could not understand why driving time to and from jobs must be paid for, travel expenses, vehicle wear and tear etc.
She cannot comprehend the fact that some of the western states zip codes are well over 1000 sq miles and require expenses that a job must cover.
Because of this she has the mindset that all of your jobs are immediately across the street from your office and that there is no reason under the sun where $4 for installing 2 outlet covers isn't enough.
$20 to spend 4 hrs out of your day on a wint refresh isn't good money and on and on.

In fact her level of being unable to comprehend these things also made her very rude and interrupting when trying to explain why some thing is priced the way it is.


You guys that work for real estate agents that understand you and your business and you've been able to make a good relationship with have no clue how good you have it. I've tried hard to break into the market in my area. With only 1% success. I've been able to do one job for an agent. Far as I know she liked my work and I got paid with in a few days. I just don't get it.


----------



## Guest

quote

You guys that work for real estate agents that understand you and your business and you've been able to make a good relationship with have no clue how good you have it. 

I feel your frustration. Believe me when I say we know how good we have it, ( when we get it ). That's the ever increasing problem for us at least. More and more the big boys are taking over and the agents have no choice in who they use. We've been forced into looking to work for some nationals because the work just isn't there with the agents. I cringe at the thought of doing the same work for 1/3 of the price but we've gotta go where the work is.
I know it's hard to get in with the Realtors. I've been a licensed Realtor for almost 5 years now ( still maintain my license in case the market comes back ), I know hundreds of realtors and still find it hard to get hooked up with work. My business partner and I stood firm on not working for the nationals for as long as we could and guess what.....Hello Nationals


----------



## BPWY

Make every effort to work for the nationals a plan F.

Not B. 
Its only tuesday night and I feel like it should be Friday already with the amount of nonsense I've had to wade thru so far this week.

For example the requirement to completely broom sweep, vacuum and dust to half of white glove service standards, is going to add another probably 3 hrs to most of my debris jobs. 3 hrs completely unpaid for. And these idiots think its just fine for me to work for free.
When you try to reason with them they are rude, they will cut you off, talk over you etc and basically tell you that you are a clueless person and treat you like 2nd or 3rd class citizen. Its the same lack of respect that I got as a truck driver doing a thankless job. 
Its ridiculous.


Good luck. You are going to need it.


----------



## Guest

I'll be honest, I really had no idea how good I had it working for local brokers until I joined this forum. Every thing that I've read in regards to nationals just makes me cringe. I'm also starting to think in the long run the nationals aren't contributing at all to getting the housing market back on track. If a vendor is treated with respect, paid well, and given constructive feedback then they're going to put more into each property because they WANT to which in turn makes the house look nicer which in theory would help it sell quicker.

I imagine that only in a perfect world would this make sense to everyone, nationals and banks included.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## BPWY

Coastal Breeze said:


> I'll be honest, I really had no idea how good I had it working for local brokers until I joined this forum. Every thing that I've read in regards to nationals just makes me cringe. I'm also starting to think in the long run the nationals aren't contributing at all to getting the housing market back on track.
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> [email protected]






For a long time I wanted to believe the best about them too.

But lately its become obvious from all sides that the ONLY thing that drives them is the bottom line. ALL OF THEM, and they don't really care about the contractor as I've laid out more than once on this very thread.


----------



## mtmtnman

FWIW i sent this off to a national tonight.


*Due to the new HUD regs and reduction of rates/bids i am forced to reduce my coverage area to just my general home area. I cannot afford to drive 100+ miles round trip for wint refreshes @ $20 and other crazy pricing. HUD/banks will soon realize they WILL NOT get coverage in the remote areas of Montana, Wyoming, Idaho Ect. at the prices they are forcing on us with the price of everything else including fuel skyrocketing. The towns of Kalispell, Columbia Falls and Whitefish are in my valley and just those three zips encompass 1166 Sq Miles and my county of Flathead is 5,256 square miles. Please see the attached list of zip codes i can cover and still turn a meager profit. Notice i have removed 3/4 of the zips i started with a year ago. I realize the banks and service companies do not really care about the health, welfare and the need to turn a profit for my business nor do they understand the huge expanses of land we have out here but i included this information to show you how i came to my decision.

Signed Disgusted,*


----------



## BPWY

I'll bet you money they won't even pretend to care.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> For a long time I wanted to believe the best about them too.
> 
> But lately its become obvious from all sides that the ONLY thing that drives them is the bottom line. ALL OF THEM, and they don't really care about the contractor as I've laid out more than once on this very thread.


I genuinely do believe the best in my brokers, but I'm staying away from the nationals. I'm very happy with my realtors and encourage you all to keep attempting to make contacts in your area.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services


----------



## BPWY

Thanks bro for the encouragement. 


Right now its tempting to throw in the towel.


----------



## Guest

Don't throw in the towel, you have PP experience so it's a matter of finding a broker. Have you tried e-mail blasts to realtors in your area?


----------



## BPWY

Coastal Breeze said:


> Don't throw in the towel, you have PP experience so it's a matter of finding a broker. Have you tried e-mail blasts to realtors in your area?







Its in the works.  :thumbup: Finalizing the wording to make sure its all perfect.



One thing that is really frustrating is that I've done the meet and greet, handing out hundreds of cards in the process. Almost every one of them to a person was almost orgasmic over hearing the type of services I offer.


And yet................... 0.0 phone calls or emails out of the deal.


----------



## Guest

Have you tried searching for a broker that sells Freddie Mac homes?


----------



## BPWY

Coastal Breeze said:


> Have you tried searching for a broker that sells Freddie Mac homes?






They think that every thing HAS TO go thru the national. Already spoke to them.


----------



## Guest

Are you contacting "big" real estate groups or the "mom and pop" ones too?


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY, Time to go back to school maybe??

http://www.viddler.com/explore/iSheahan/videos/56/


----------



## Guest

Bahhhahahahaha! Das sum funne stuff....mie fren!


----------



## Guest

Now that I think about it, it's probably more profitable working at McDonalds. Or is it Madonna's?


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Now that I think about it, it's probably more profitable working at McDonalds. Or is it Madonna's?



You get a good blow today or did it go south of you?????


----------



## Guest

My wife was out of town...so no! HA HA HA. yes, it was windy as a SOB here today. Still is kinda.


----------



## Guest

OK I'm gooooing out on a limb here but I have been listening and "watching" posts and "making a few of my own" posts 

So here goes:

Instead of complaining and bitc**ng why don't we do something about it? There is a lot of very smart people on this thread and I think if everyone puts their heads together there has to be more than a "coop" that can be formed to protect contractors and give us a voice to the nationals and the Feds.
NAMFS was suppose to be this group for us contractors but they are nothing more than a group that takes the $$ and gives a little advise and newletter things but NO BACKBONE to actually help US the workers. 
Ideas? Lets get something figured out. 
Just a thought?


----------



## BPWY

Coastal Breeze said:


> Are you contacting "big" real estate groups or the "mom and pop" ones too?







Every body.


----------



## Guest

*Freemont*

Funny you should mention joining forces to fight back
I got this e mail the other day
Might be a jump off point but needs more teeth
Then again it could be another collect your dues and not much comes from it. Of course the same old problem will be out there.............
Jose and Manuel with a pick up truck and a hammer



Property Preservation is a growing market in the real estate industry. The men and women who make this industry are the contractors who day in and day out service the properties. I know because I am one of those people. The Realtors and Field Service Companies we service have organizations (National Association of Realtors and National Association of Mortgage Field Services) that help them in their business, but we as contactors do not. So I decided to do something about that. We as contractors are forming a Property Preservation Co Op to assist the hard working members make their business a success. This *not for profit organization* will be able to assist our members at first by providing deep discounts on the following:
*Locks and supplies *
*Insurance: General Liability, E and O, Auto, Equipment and Workman’s Comp*
*Legal Services: ensure that you are paid for the work you have done and provide legal protection*
We will not stop there as we continue of add new benefits for our members which will include:
*News Letters with information and tips to make your business better.*
*Tech Support and Web Design*
*Printing and Business Cards*
*Discounted Rates on Cellular Service, Fuel, Dump Fees, Equipment and much, much more!*
We will also provide training and certifications that will ensure our members are professionals on the leading edge of the industry and establish a network of these professionals who will be sought after by clients across the country to complete their work. 
*This is a ground floor origination that will serve the contractor’s interests and no one else. In time will become a powerful voice of the contractor to the clients and the industry. Together we can make our business work better and become more profitable for us.*
If this is something you would like to become a part of please reply to this email.


----------



## BPWY

It'll be interesting to see where they go with their plans/hopes.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Don't be too sure its $15.
> 
> 
> The last time they approached me they were offering $6 for regular inspections and $8 for 24 hr rush.





I got offered $2.00 for regular and get this,,,,yes $2.00 for 24 hr rush inspections.....and that companies name was sierra field services out of Reno Nv....yikes huh?


----------



## mtmtnman

4 days left THANK GOD!!!!!! Getting sick and damn tired of these nationals nagging about grass cuts! 3/4 of the 150+ i have are dead and dying. We had killing frost the 1st week of September and there isn't even anything to weed wack! Got snow down to 3800' and our valley is at 3000 feet. They still call and nag. Just had one that we weed wacked about 20' behind a garage on the south side of a house where the grass was 3" tall about a foot out and they just called and said we really didn't do anything so it's a trip charge!!!!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> OK I'm gooooing out on a limb here but I have been listening and "watching" posts and "making a few of my own" posts
> 
> So here goes:
> 
> Instead of complaining and bitc**ng why don't we do something about it? There is a lot of very smart people on this thread and I think if everyone puts their heads together there has to be more than a "coop" that can be formed to protect contractors and give us a voice to the nationals and the Feds.
> NAMFS was suppose to be this group for us contractors but they are nothing more than a group that takes the $$ and gives a little advise and newletter things but NO BACKBONE to actually help US the workers.
> Ideas? Lets get something figured out.
> Just a thought?





I'd be really interesting in hearing some ideas regarding this!!! If we are to survive in this industry we have got to stand our ground and unite instead of rushing into the circle like chickens when the banks and nationals throw feed on the ground


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> Property Preservation is a growing market in the real estate industry. The men and women who make this industry are the contractors who day in and day out service the properties. I know because I am one of those people. The Realtors and Field Service Companies we service have organizations (National Association of Realtors and National Association of Mortgage Field Services) that help them in their business, but we as contactors do not. So I decided to do something about that. We as contractors are forming a Property Preservation Co Op to assist the hard working members make their business a success. This *not for profit organization* will be able to assist our members at first by providing deep discounts on the following:
> *Locks and supplies *
> *Insurance: General Liability, E and O, Auto, Equipment and Workman’s Comp*
> *Legal Services: ensure that you are paid for the work you have done and provide legal protection*
> We will not stop there as we continue of add new benefits for our members which will include:
> *News Letters with information and tips to make your business better.*
> *Tech Support and Web Design*
> *Printing and Business Cards*
> *Discounted Rates on Cellular Service, Fuel, Dump Fees, Equipment and much, much more!*
> We will also provide training and certifications that will ensure our members are professionals on the leading edge of the industry and establish a network of these professionals who will be sought after by clients across the country to complete their work.
> *This is a ground floor origination that will serve the contractor’s interests and no one else. In time will become a powerful voice of the contractor to the clients and the industry. Together we can make our business work better and become more profitable for us.*
> If this is something you would like to become a part of please reply to this email.


It's a paid membership. I got the same one and have asked them to remove me from their mass mailing list. I believe the rate is either $199 or $299 per year.

I'm sorry but I smell a rat. It's just another way to line someone's pockets. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

It's a shame because it sounds like a good idea in theory if it worked, but I agree with Linda


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> I got offered $2.00 for regular and get this,,,,yes $2.00 for 24 hr rush inspections.....and that companies name was sierra field services out of Reno Nv....yikes huh?






For $2 I'll look out my office window and tell them that my neighbor's house is still standing. On the phone, I wouldn't take the time to email, take a photo or process photos etc for $2.

Beyond that they are on their own.


What ridiculous pricing.


----------



## Guest

Speaking of Co Ops, 
I may be joining one in January, it's called State Aid ! My health insurance renews 1st of the year and Connecticut recently approved an increase of up to 47%


----------



## mtmtnman

Government bailout hard at work. stopped at a property last night that is a "RUSH" grass cut. I get there and the grass is dead. Maybe 2" tall. Not even a weed to wack anywhere!! I trip charge it and get a nastygram in my inbox this morning.

*"This client requires that we cut the grass at this property regardless of limited growth during grass cut season. Do not report the grass was not cut due to limited growth or grass cut by others. Can not report exterior debris in way of grass cut. Cut around debris as best as possible."*

So y'all can be happy your tax dollar's are going to useful causes when you write your checks out April 15th........:furious::furious::furious:


----------



## brm1109

*Sorry but I have to rant*

I think that I am finally beginning to realize that things may never get better for us that try to do the right thing (pay fair, pay taxes and have insurance).
First you have these companies that expect you to work for next to nothing and be happy to do it. Don't get me wrong, I work for a couple that are actually decent) but some of these new ones with their $6.00 inspections or a complete initial service (including debris and winterization) for $300.00.
Then you have others that are just cut throat. I also perform lawn maintenance and on an average 50 x 100 lot I get $35.00 for the cuts. I just had one customer ask me if I could match the price someone gave them ($20.00) I know "contractor" so I told the customer that when they get insurance and a license I will try to match it. Oh well one less customer.
Then I also have a neighbor that has the guy come and cut the lawn. The guy is actually there almost:furious: 2 hours each time, guess what he charges $25.00. Sorry but I can't compete with people with no insurance or who think $12.50 per hour is good when you have all of your overhead.
Sorry for the rant but I figure you folks know what I am going through.


----------



## Guest

I think we all know its rough out there.

How about this classic Safeguard move......
_
Please remove a 4'x4'x8' and 3'x3'x4' dog houses for $30 Thank You!!

Please deduct your trip charge if you were paid one on your initial visit._


----------



## Guest

*Contractors banding together?*

I think we should use this forum or something to this nature to get our point across. The problem I'm having are clients taking 70% of the money before any work is completed. We all have businesses to run and need to make a profit to stay in business. I like the idea of getting in with a larger Broker but find its impossible to get on with out another contractor screwing up and you happen to be at the right place at the right time. 

What needs to happen is getting to the people that want to here what we have to say. This would not be a National company because they don't care. Banks, Fannie Mae and Insurances companies these are the companies paying National's to service there properties. I find the quality of work is going down due to the amount of work being shelled out. If people on the ground can talk to the people paying the money we can then stop being middle manned out.


----------



## Guest

Much like S&S trashouts said........I don't know if this would work but what if we constructed a letter stating our problems with the national companies and how we are all getting pushed out of business (basically all we are complaining about on this forum) and submitted copies of it to fannie may, freddy mac, FHA, chase, citimortgage, etc. etc. We could all sign this document to let them know exactly how many people are disgusted with the pay and returned bid amounts.

What if we all had our signature attached to it? Would it work? Would they even care? Does anyone have any other bright ideas?


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> I think we all know its rough out there.
> 
> How about this classic Safeguard move......
> _
> Please remove a 4'x4'x8' and 3'x3'x4' dog houses for $30 Thank You!!
> 
> Please deduct your trip charge if you were paid one on your initial visit._







Let me guess your answer..... not only NO, but HELL NO!!!!


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Much like S&S trashouts said........I don't know if this would work but what if we constructed a letter stating our problems with the national companies and how we are all getting pushed out of business (basically all we are complaining about on this forum) and submitted copies of it to fannie may, freddy mac, FHA, chase, citimortgage, etc. etc. We could all sign this document to let them know exactly how many people are disgusted with the pay and returned bid amounts.
> 
> What if we all had our signature attached to it? Would it work? Would they even care? Does anyone have any other bright ideas?







I'm not sure that we can count on the banks to give any more of a damn than what the nationals do.

Most of the bank presidents and the nationals presidents, vice presidents and many of their other upper management are good buddies. In many cases golfing buddies. Many of the national higher ups are former bank higher ups.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I'm not sure that we can count on the banks to give any more of a damn than what the nationals do.
> 
> Most of the bank presidents and the nationals presidents, vice presidents and many of their other upper management are good buddies. In many cases golfing buddies. Many of the national higher ups are former bank higher ups.


O.K., so its kind of like how lawyers and judges are buddy/buddy in the same county??


----------



## BPWY

Some thing like that.


----------



## Guest

OK everyone I've been doing a lot of thinking how to help the contractors in the Property Preservation Field and have talked to many individuals in the business and I have 1 idea....Please don't hold this against me 

For those of you who know me and not being political I am apprehensive to say this but here goes:

Form a union for only Property Preservation Contractors.:shutup: 

Reason: we can all be unified and speak to the banks/service companies for fair pay and "treatment". 

How: as I understand it since we are not "employees" we would need to have a minimum of 30 contractors willing to sign authorization cards and submit them to the National Labor Relations Board for certification of a union. This would not be under any existing union but a new union run by us (the contractors) with our values and knowledge. 

I just don't know what else our field can do that actually have "teeth" that will make the bank/service companies take notice.

Man that was hard and if anyone has other ideas I'd like to hear them:notworthy


----------



## Guest

brm1109
while our west coast brotherin' slumber and we're gearing up for the day....
Similiar situation here, I own a property maint business and lost quite a few accounts do to competition. It's brutal out there, been trying to segway out of it after 10 years in the business so my buddy and I ( he's a painting contractor / handyman ) who's business also decreased, joined forces over a year ago to do PP. We did everything by the book with licensing, insurance, EPA lead cetification, even took the HUD guidelines online certification course to make sure we knew what we were doing. It's been a slow go in building enough contacts to keep us busy but we have managed to steadily increase our PP business. We've focused on working for the REO agents and will continue to do so based on the unfair pricing and business tactics of the nationals.
Actually signed up with 3 nationals over the last few weeks to fill in the gaps from the agents work orders. Not much at all from the nationals so far but hit it big this week from the agents.....some good profitable work lined up through November.


----------



## Guest

*Joning Forces*

While I have not read all 109 pages of this thread...
In the area that we work...Reno/Tahoe/Carson City, NV. I try to communicate with fellow vendors. I have made an attempt to work with them. Some are honest and stand together...some are just as cut-throat as the nationals.
"I have employees to worry about"
To this I say.......CRAP!!!!! 
If everyone from a Local Area stood together then the nationals would have to break. Heres why.
They have contracts with time lines "turn around" Yeah you may not have any work today, but tomorrow...it will be there. They cannot recruit new "vendors" that fast. This industry is not going away. 
All contractors need to work together instead of against each other.
Use some common sense people. Think about what you are doing. Talk to each other...Quit trying to bury your competitor...work with them. That is how WE become a force.


----------



## Guest

Cleanupman said:


> All contractors need to work together instead of against each other.
> Use some common sense people. Think about what you are doing. Talk to each other...Quit trying to bury your competitor...work with them. That is how WE become a force.


This is true, but the economy is so bad you just cant trust the "other" guy. I agree if everyone in the same area worked together WE could force against the nationals. By the nationals dealing with each vendor on a one by one basis, they find it easier to push you into a corner and play their mind tricks on you.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> OK everyone I've been doing a lot of thinking how to help the contractors in the Property Preservation Field and have talked to many individuals in the business and I have 1 idea....Please don't hold this against me
> 
> For those of you who know me and not being political I am apprehensive to say this but here goes:
> 
> Form a union for only Property Preservation Contractors.:shutup:
> 
> Reason: we can all be unified and speak to the banks/service companies for fair pay and "treatment".
> 
> How: as I understand it since we are not "employees" we would need to have a minimum of 30 contractors willing to sign authorization cards and submit them to the National Labor Relations Board for certification of a union. This would not be under any existing union but a new union run by us (the contractors) with our values and knowledge.
> 
> I just don't know what else our field can do that actually have "teeth" that will make the bank/service companies take notice.
> 
> Man that was hard and if anyone has other ideas I'd like to hear them:notworthy


That's a good idea and I am all for it. being a former 20 year Teamster. But, there is a diffference between a union and a non-union collective bargaining agreement. 
The Unions have (had) power because they won that thru intimidation and other things, back in the early 1900's. If they caught you working without a card, you paid for it in physical and financial pain. Many joined because they needed work and it was the safest way to work.

A non-union collective bargaining agreement is the same thing as a union agreement but without any real bite or backing. Basically Employees (contractors) set thier demands for work rules and wages much as the Teamster would do. But, they have no PUNCH to make things happen.

The difference I see here is, we as Contractors are allowing the Asset companies to set our wages and job discription. Compared to the Unions that told the company what they were willing to do for a certain $ amount. There are other boards talking about the same thing, and they have 1 thing in common. - * MONEY*.

Don't get me wrong here...... I like the idea very much of being in control of our destiny and pocketbooks. The problem with all this is they same as we have now. Contractors willing to work for peanuts in order to work, and that includes me too. I think the biggest logistical problem we are goinbg to have is securing an area where we can set rates and be assured no PP work is done without being part of the agreement. *Everyone has to suck it up for atleast 3-6 months and be willing to say.. I'm not going to work for that kinda of money and I will stop anyone in my area from doing the same*. County by county just won't work, because there is too much crossover. If we can get just 1 MEDIUM SIZED STATE to band together, preferably a well populated one, such as IL where I am from, then we have bargianing power!!!!

1 last thing- * How did owners get sucked into working as employees of these asset companies??? - BECAUSE EVERYONE IS WILLING TO CUT EACH OTHER'S THROAT FOR ANOTHER $5*


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## APlusPPGroup

Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't unions for employees? As independent contractors the best we can do is form an alliance, not a union, correct?

Even an alliance would have to pack a pretty hefty punch right out of the gate to get anyone to take notice and make it a requirement that only those in the alliance get work.

If such an alliance can be created, we'd have to have representatives from all the states get together in one place and formulate a plan, I would think. Much of the formation can be done and discussed online but face-to-face meetings are always best so that we know who we're dealing with. I mean, really, how well DO we know each other?

An alliance is going to require creation of an entity, documentation, licensing, maybe even articles, and might even have to go through each state's approval process.

Once the alliance is formed, who would we contact first? It would have to be someone pretty high up in a strong institution that has a lot of pull with other decision makers at other institutions.

If we were to put something together, I'd rather not discuss it in an open forum. 

Just throwing all this out there.............. food for thought, so to speak.

Linda


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## Guest

i'm from chicago and i'm sicilian so you know i'm down to unite!! lol


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## Guest

What's the M&M companies fine or punishment for not having the work done on time or do they have plenty of time and just make us do it in 2 days or less and then "fine us" if not done?
I assume all the professionals in this business across the country are in the same boat as far as wages and unfair practices.
Maybe a nationwide 2wk, 3wk or longer strike by those willing to join in order to force a change might have an affect. ( this time of the year might be affective with all the wints needed ) Rally up the troops across this great land, pick a date and begin a work stoppage until the big boys will negotiate a better work environment for all.
Then again we all might lose what work we currently have when they get others to do the work, and you know they will with these tough times for a lot of people.
I'm willing to go on strike for a month or two and ask my wife to pick up the slack. :whistling


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## BPWY

pmiservices said:


> 1 last thing- * How did owners get sucked into working as employees of these asset companies??? - BECAUSE EVERYONE IS WILLING TO CUT EACH OTHER'S THROAT FOR ANOTHER $5*






Pretty much.


I've done every thing in my power to stand my ground where I work.


Its done as much good as whizzing into a 70 mph wind.


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## BPWY

Like has been mentioned..... how do you get the power to make some thing stick?

And also like has been mentioned...... there are far too many folks without insurance or proper training that are willing to work for $30 dry wints, $15 grass cuts, $2 inspections etc. This fact is obvious other wise the nationals wouldn't be trying to peddle those prices as the going rate. They've gotten the work done for that cheap and think that you should be willing to do so too.

Who in the world thought that $15 per yrd was a good rate for debris removal? To add insult to injury with the likes of some nationals its $15 per yrd less discount of 20 or 25%. 


I'm not sure it would be possible to force all the "contractors" into sticking with a rate sheet that is sufficient to break even, let alone provide for any profit.
Like has been mentioned....... too many folks willing to work for ONLY $5 less just to get the work. Next week they find some one else that is willing to work for ONLY $5 less. And down the drain we all go.


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## APlusPPGroup

Paul ~

You're right about people working with no insurance. If the banks and asset management companies would *ENFORCE THEIR OWN INSURANCE RULES*, a lot of vendors would be out of the mix entirely and only those that put the money out for insurance would be able to work.

Problem is, even insurance docs can be forged. I'm dealing with a few that I've received recently and following up with phone calls to the insurance companies to validate them.

Our rule is very simple............... no insurance, no work. 

We have a lot of expired policies in our system that vendors have not bothered to replace so e-mails will be going out soon to get them to us. BTW.... this is the reason companies are listed as additional insured. The insurance companies notify ALL parties listed on the certs when the insurance expires or premiums aren't paid and policies are cancelled.

Linda


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong but aren't unions for employees? As independent contractors the best we can do is form an alliance, not a union, correct?


True, and then you need to be very careful regarding anti-trust laws. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


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## APlusPPGroup

Tinstaafl said:


> True, and then you need to be very careful regarding anti-trust laws. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.


I agree. And there's a lot more work involved than just forming a group, whether it be a union, alliance, or a coalition.

As independent contractors, if we strike we only hurt ourselves. We can stand outside their doors all day long with protest signs but who's really going to give a crap with all of the bad press other vendors have generated and all the bank and agents that have pinned the fault on vendors, whether they were to blame or not?

Face it. We just need better paying clients, those who can appreciate a job well done and on time. But, with all the money the banks are forking out for CFKs, evictions, cleanup, and commissions [plus other unknown insurances and legal stuff], do you really think they're going to even have it to pay?

AND...... if we give up those clients, the vendors operating under the table will fill the position in a heartbeat. And the nationals have no problem victimizing the next guy anymore than they did the vendor who quit.

And, with all the hype from the media about what *FANTASTIC POTENTIAL TO MAKE TONS OF MONEY* the property preservation industry is, more and more people are starting up businesses. Unfortunately, the key word is potential.............. and most people look right past that and get in over their heads.

It's the law of supply and demand that works for and against us. If we shorten the supply of inexperienced, untrained, unlicensed, uninsured, and fly-by-nights we might have a shot at an effective solution. But I don't see the supply ending anytime soon. Do you?

It's a vicious circle. If anyone has a better idea than what we've come up with so far, I'd certainly like to hear it.

Linda


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## Guest

OK here is what I found out a while back abt the "union" path....
This was information that was given to me from a good friend (socially but not politically  .... that is the HEAD Dog for the State Laborers Union.

1) They are actively pursuing requiring the banks that accepted Stimulus Government $$ then they must use Union Laborers to complete work. 
2) They are more than happy to let the P&P Contractor join the union and sign up for P&P work
3) The Service Employees Union is also actively pursuing having the foreclosed homes be maintained by them.

Here is how I see it: I see a day when you and I will no longer have a job unless we join up with a union since the banks was stupid enough to take Government Bailout $$. 

I only know 1 *fact:* I do not want to be TOLD that I have to join any union....


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## Guest

I remember reading something a few months back about government contracting being phased out altogether and them having government employees perform the work.


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## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> 1) They are actively pursuing requiring the banks that accepted Stimulus Government $$ then they must use Union Laborers to complete work. *Key word laborers ....aka employees.*
> 
> 2) They are more than happy to let the P&P Contractor join the union and sign up for P&P work *....and pay dues.*
> 
> 3) The Service Employees Union is also actively pursuing having the foreclosed homes be maintained by them. *There it is again ....employees.*
> 
> Here is how I see it: I see a day when you and I will no longer have a job unless we join up with a union since the banks was stupid enough to take Government Bailout $$.
> 
> I only know 1 *fact:* I do not want to be TOLD that I have to join any union....


I'm with you. I don't want to join a union either. If I'm forced to do that, I'll close my doors to this particular business permanently.

I've owned my own businesses since 1999, first a thriving bookkeeping business, then preservation. I enjoy being my own boss. Yes, I work my fanny off but it's better than working for someone else. I work longer hours for less pay than I would working for an employer but it still beats dealing with backstabbers and office politics any day of the week.

How many of you want to go back to being an employee?

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

SWOH REO said:


> I remember reading something a few months back about government contracting being phased out altogether and them having government employees perform the work.


I doubt very seriously they'll take the work away from independent contractors since it means providing the wages and health benefits to employees who are state and/or federal tax-exempt. Government loses money big time this way.

Where would their tax money come from to pay wages to those employees if it weren't from us? They can raise taxes again but they will only be able to raise them so much before a revolt happens.

Just my .02.

Linda


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## APlusPPGroup

Just for kicks, why doesn't everyone who owns their home homestead it, those who still have a mortgage stop making payments, and all of us stop paying taxes for 5 years? Bet we'd get some attention then, wouldn't we?:whistling

Sorry, I'm in an ornery mood. Don't even know where that thought came from.:laughing:

Linda


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## Guest

Here is a link. I didn't read it all so I hope it's the right one. 
I definitely don't want to go back to a 9-5 after almost 10 years but unfortunately it's something I'm having to consider at this point in the game :-( 

It won't let me post the link.


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## APlusPPGroup

SWOH REO said:


> Here is a link. I didn't read it all so I hope it's the right one.
> I definitely don't want to go back to a 9-5 after almost 10 years but unfortunately it's something I'm having to consider at this point in the game :-(
> 
> It won't let me post the link.


Post it without the http:/ and we can copy & paste it.

Linda


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## Guest

whitehouse.gov/the_press_office/Memorandum-for-the-Heads-of-Executive-Departments-and-Agencies-Subject-Government/


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## Guest

I think "IF" they ever did do something it wouldn't effect the banks but maybe HUD.


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## Guest

well here's MY .02 

I agree with all your postings regarding uninsured and unlicensed "guy's with trucks" taking our bacon. But striking isn't the way to get things done. Specially because the "guy with a truck" will come in and take all of my clients. BUT what I'm doing is finding out everyone that works in my area. I keep eye out for clean up companies at foreclosures and i stop in, i pretend to be a realtor and get their information and i check up on them to see if they are license and insured and if not then i contact the city enforcement agency and I go on the MLS and find the listing agent and advise them also. Most would call me a narc but these are the people that we are allllll btching about and this is my solution. Weed them out and there will be less people that are out there willing to work for cheap. Is this a easy and fast solution,?? NOOOOOO but it's the only one i've come up with and as of today i've blown the whistle on a total of 10 companies in my city alone, 3 this month AND i got a new client from the listing agent at the property of one i notified them about and they hired me to finish up their job and I got the monthlies.....

like i said this is my small solution to this problem. I'd love to hear others !!!!


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## Guest

How do you find out if they are insured?


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## Guest

D&R we have done the same thing but take it one step farther....if there is any, and I mean any, work that requires a permit and it is not pulled and posted we call the City Building Inspections Office and the wrath of god comes down on them :hammer:

Here we just have to look on the Secretary of States Web Site and pull up the list of licensed contractors. 
Not a "fail safe" approach since not everyone works under the "filed" name at the Sec of State Office. 

D&R also has the MOB in his back pocket there in Vegas so he has all his bases covered? :laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## APlusPPGroup

You're talking about licensed contractorsm though. They are a lot easier to look up than a vendor who's doing work that doesn't require a license.

Hypothetically, would you turn work down from a company who's not licensed as a contractor or, because YOU are licensed, would you take the job? As long as YOU are legal, does it matter where the work comes from.

Think about it. I doubt every national has a contractor's license and, I'm almost positive the realtors don't.

According to California law, the only one who can subcontract work without a contractor's license is the homeowner. I don't know about the other states' laws.

I know my post is a little off track but I'm curious to see everyone's reactions.

Linda


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## Guest

Only a licensed General Contractor can sub work in Iowa and MN. Wisconsin is a gray area. Missouri say's you are supposed to be licensed and then the next paragragh contradicts the first paragraph--go figure. 
Your right its hard to run down the vendors in the field who may or may not be licensed. Licensing in Iowa is no big deal (pay the $$ and get the paper), MN is required schools and testing, MO who cares... That is the reason that when I have to go to a property and someone is doing work that is permit required than the phone will mysteriously make a phone call.


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## Guest

All I can comment on is my brokers here in SE VA...and all of them hold contractors licenses that are higher than mine...I know, go figure!

I don't know that I would work for a realtor who didn't have a contractors license...too many liabilities which are not worth it!


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## Guest

All I can comment on is my brokers here in SE VA...and all of them hold contractors licenses that are higher than mine...I know, go figure!

I don't know that I would work for a realtor who didn't have a contractors license...too many liabilities which are not worth it!


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## BPWY

In my state I can reroof houses without a license or permit as long as nothing structural is modified.



Keep callin the "license" department, around here it won't do ya any good.


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## Guest

Maybe it is more about joining forces with some strong companies in the pp business in your local area and to lobby for certain laws? guidlines or strandards the banks must follow on maintaining forclosed homes?

Boycotts will not work, most work in the pp business is more common sense the skill labor, so anyone can do it, insurance needed is not so much of a cost anyone can get it. I say no on work orders and sure there is 5 people behind me saying yes, im ok with that. But for some reason all from nationals I get bid approvals all the time 10 acres gc, 3k for a tree removal, 150 to 200 local winterization orders(no discount all at full value)... Maybe by not worrying about those doing work for little profit or beer money on the weekend starting to understand it isn't worth it without a big volume. idn

Winter usually gets the weaker out of the way ummmm for awhile but just as in any business in a free world there will always be competition, maybe we can find an ex owner of a hardware store an ask him what he did to gain profits when wal-mart came to town without knowing I would say he whined, talk about how much more knowledge he had in this field and I guess in his mind that should justify why he cost more and has better quality, like he was entitled. Then watch as his customers went elsewhere, From what I am reading some are already going down this path.

I am not saying this to be down on people on this chatroom who post, Some just seem pure negative as if the nationals are the caused of everything that has gone wrong in there life. I am a pretty positive person and I tend to try to distance myself from those that are negative cause it seems those people drag you down to that level.

I know very many PP business owners that are making very good money as they took the time to adapt instead of finger pointing

Maybe next time I can talk about the local pizza palor vs pizza hut, or blockbuster vs netflix or .............................


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> In my state I can reroof houses without a license or permit as long as nothing structural is modified.
> 
> 
> 
> Keep callin the "license" department, around here it won't do ya any good.



Only need Electrical License here and Plumbing in towns but not in the county. No inspections where i am at in the county other than electrical and septic. IMHO, _*License = TAX...............*_ I grew up in Illinois where you practically need a license and a permit to take a dump!!


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## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> But for some reason all from nationals I get bid approvals all the time 10 acres gc, 3k for a tree removal, 150 to 200 local winterization orders(no discount all at full value)...







In the areas I run I see them ignore bids for 1 or 2 yrds of trash, branches on roof already have the shingles torn up, etc etc etc

$3000 tree removals????????????? Whats that?


Around here BAC even ignores winterizes on 6 month or longer houses. I've done BAC winterizes, or should I say "attempt to winterize" houses that have been vacant for 2 yrs. 

With things like this its pretty obvious they don't care.


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## Guest

*Wow, how times have changed!*

Was reading earlier in the post, and things sounded good. You folks will hate me for it, but I've been looking at getting into the business myself.
I have the tools, I have the insurance (already work as contract engineer, work is sparse, looking to supplement income). 
Looking at these later posts, might be a lost cause? 
The company I have been talking with, Homeland field services, seems legit, and pays fair, as far as they say (printed numbers seem fair). They are in great need of contractors in my area.

I'm loaded with tools. Drills, generator, ladders, hand tools, electrical tools/components, and knowledge on how to use them. I've remodeled a few houses completely, so I know what I'm doing.

Should I run from this business, or is there still room for success?


-Chris


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## BPWY

I'd run away, but thats just me.





Homeland insecurity pays fair? :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:




Unless they've adjusted their prices from a yr ago they are some of the most unfair when it comes to pricing.

I worked for them very briefly. I was lied to from the very first recruiter phone call that was made and they didn't pay me what they said they would when I covered another contractor's bid.

From the get go I told them that I would try to work with in their price constraints where I could but that I would be adjusting my bids as needed. 
They said that was OK until I bid a 20 cube trash out higher than their pre-approved $15 per to cover expenses in an area that charges $50 per ton for disposal. They got bid approval and tried to force me to the $15 per price and I told them that was not my bid. I had bid what I did for a reason and I was not doing it for their rip off pricing. They told me they did not care what disposal costs were that $15 is what they pay end of discussion. 

I had the last laugh. I rejected the w/o and that was the end of our business relationship.
They later tried to charge me back for some work that they had already paid me for.



Like myself and others have said I cannot recommend this industry at the current time with a clear conscience. 
At least you know what you are getting yourself into up front.

If you are an experienced remodeler I'd stay with that.


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## ARPPP

Just got off of a 30 minute phone call with Altisource. Received numerous work orders to change the batteries in the digital locks I installed. Fee is $3. So you know where I am going with this.... "Ma'am, kindly install the lock and submit a work order for a trip charge". Me. "Sir why don't you issue a correct work order to me that includes a trip charge". "Ma'am we will pay you for your trip upon completion of the battery change". "I see we paid you a trip charge in *July* for this property" Me, "And you think that covers all trips until the end of time for this property" Phone becomes silent and someone else takes the call. "Ma'am if you create the work order for trip charge we will approve" (I have been down this dark alley with them numerous times before) My response "Sir I will decline these orders as fee unacceptable and you can reissue with the correct fees" Altisource "Fine ma'am we will reassign properties to another vendor" 

Now my fine ladies and gentleman, whose going to take these work orders and further diminish our trade? There is no friggin way in hejj that I would drive all over creation for $3. Are you? It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC
Annette Rogers


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## APlusPPGroup

Don't forget that a 4-pack of Energizer batteries will cost about $4.50 + tax at Home Depot. You can do the $1 store batteries but you'll just keep going back.

I wouldn't do it at $3 either. They will end up paying a trip charge to someone but you'll never hear about it. They don't eat crow any easier than anyone else I know.

Linda


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## Guest

ARPP~~~ you know where that will play out. I was helping a friend that does Altisource and install a lot of those digital lockboxes and the first thing I said was "wait till cold or extreme hot temps and lets see how long those batteries work"...well I've been getting calls from realtors who now cannot gain access since the batteries have died. I doesn't take a rocket scientist :no:

STEAK~~~~ "Is there room to make this business a success?" A.) Yes there is but be prepared to treat this like any other small business..very little or no profit for a few years. You have to start at the bottom of the ladder and work for years through attrition of the competition going out of business (cuz of no profits) till you attain good contracts with better companies. 
Understand this housing slump will not last forever and once housing starts selling again (personally I think 5-7 year slump) than there will be realtors that will again need your services instead of the low paying Homeland Field Service type companies.


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## BPWY

$3 for new bats???????



I can't change my remote bats for that. The cost of the bats for one thing, and then they take a discount for the direct deposit.
I'll bill em $35 including the cost of bats. Suck it up or call some body else that gives a damn.


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## Guest

OK off subject but can happen to any of us:

One of my good friends crews has managed to get bed bugs. This is a 2 man crew so they believe they have picked these up from a foreclosed home--this is what I would suspect also...

Now they have 2 families that may have bedbugs at their homes and the wives are freaking out. We do have equipment that many companies use to kill bedbugs and yes we are loaning out the equipment so they can "cook" the little suckers dead.

They nave no clue what house this came from (not 100% sure anyway) 

This brings up some interesting thoughts:

The media has been reporting this as such a big problem and I have been told by many people that these things can live for up to a year. 
Should we be wearing sometype of "suit" and dispose of after we have been inside some of these homes?
Should we bid to treat these homes for bedbugs? 
Do you think they will approve a bedbug treatment? 

They are advising the bank/service company that they reported this to the Dept of Health whom says they are posting the home as condemned till property is decontaminated... that ought to wake someone up:whistling


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> OK off subject but can happen to any of us:
> 
> One of my good friends crews has managed to get bed bugs. This is a 2 man crew so they believe they have picked these up from a foreclosed home--this is what I would suspect also...
> 
> Now they have 2 families that may have bedbugs at their homes and the wives are freaking out. We do have equipment that many companies use to kill bedbugs and yes we are loaning out the equipment so they can "cook" the little suckers dead.
> 
> They nave no clue what house this came from (not 100% sure anyway)
> 
> This brings up some interesting thoughts:
> 
> The media has been reporting this as such a big problem and I have been told by many people that these things can live for up to a year.
> Should we be wearing sometype of "suit" and dispose of after we have been inside some of these homes?
> Should we bid to treat these homes for bedbugs?
> Do you think they will approve a bedbug treatment?
> 
> They are advising the bank/service company that they reported this to the Dept of Health whom says they are posting the home as condemned till property is decontaminated... that ought to wake someone up:whistling




It would take a freight train to wake some of these banks up.............


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## BPWY

The banks don't care about this. They don't care about the contractors. 
Or at least the service companies don't. 


Getting the bugs would SUCK!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Guest

Hi i have looked on this foroum for a while now and felt the need to finally say something. Its not hard to get work from agents. Just look them up and call them.go on MLS go to bank websites and look for foreclosed homes and find the listing agents.The nationals are a joke and i cant see myself being taken as one. They pay mcdonalds money then have a hard time forking the money over. All I know is things are going to get worse before they get better and we are in an industry where money can be made from the economic mayehm.Agents need good people thats a given.I go to houses where I am being asked to bid where i see Cyprexx Fas Safeguard signs but I am still given the opportunity to bid because the banks need mutiple bids. So even if you dont get the rekey or the trashout wint etc.you still are in the mix to make some money without the middle man making all the money.


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## BPWY

mtk said:


> Its not hard to get work from agents. Just look them up and call them.go on MLS go to bank websites and look for foreclosed homes and find the listing agents.






Its NOT THAT EASY.


The agents in your area have to be needing contractors.

Apparently mine don't. I've knocked on a lot of doors, handed out hundreds of biz cards. In the long run I've gotten ONE lonely job from an agent.
Far as I know she liked my work but there are low ballers in every area and its not possible to compete with those that will do 3' high grass cuts on 5000 sq ft for $45 including bagging all the clippings.

How that person thought he was making money is way beyond me. Even the agent that told me about him said that she didn't think he had a clue what he was doing but as long as he got the job done she would keep using him.


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## Guest

After reading this whole story on the bedbug ordeal. This is just one more negative for those of us that are only getting work from nationals. Think about it....you do a job at a lower rate (because many of us are taking what we can get), you get paid for that job, not what you would normally want but money is money. Then 2 weeks later you find out you have bedbugs. Does the national re-reimburse you for this? I highly doubt it! Now you have something that costs you money for a job you did and the cost you did it at don't even come close to all the problems in the end.


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## oteroproperties

Just something think about. I recently decided to do some sub work for an old school guy in the business. Turns out that even after a 30% discount his prices are still 30% higher then any national I've ever encountered. Apparently there are still nationals out there that pay real money. I asked him where he gets his work and the answer severely pissed me off. Turns out some of these older guys don't have the problems the newer guys have. These guys work for the same companies we do and for whatever reason are getting real money and very low discounts. I am even getting paid for photos on top of the work we are doing. I though that all stopped after the digital camera era. I asked him what he thought about all these companies beating on the contractors and he said that we are all disposable. The nationals and banks already have their favorites and that openings for long term replacements come from the previous contractors solid recommendation. The rest are just fill ins. now this is just the opinion of one old schooler but its something to think about.


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## Guest

Ostero.....SHHHHH. 
You keep at it long enough you will be one of the "old timers" but remember the old timers have other problems than the discounts and the pay rates


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## BPWY

A yr ago I ran across a guy that said he had been working for Cyprex for 15+ yrs.


He *CLAIMED* that his flat rate up to 30 yrds, all locks changed, winterize, 
grass cut, and janitorial was $1100.

I'm still not certain that I believe him.


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## Guest

That is close to the rate we always got for Cyprexx. It just didn't include the winterizing.
Don't worry folks the nationals have plenty of "wiggle room" :whistling
Problem with some companies is that the "old timers" have to have something that the newbies can't provide otherwise the national will always go with the cheaper rate thus more $$ in their pocket.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> A yr ago I ran across a guy that said he had been working for Cyprex for 15+ yrs.
> 
> 
> He *CLAIMED* that his flat rate up to 30 yrds, all locks changed, winterize,
> grass cut, and janitorial was $1100.
> 
> I'm still not certain that I believe him.


That's good money according to my checkbook.

WE get $20 for *each* cy- 1 or 100 still pays the same
Used to be 20 cy flat rate of $400

Secure is $75- max of 6 doors

Janitorial (salesclean) $110

Initial Lawn $50

Winterization-Dry- $60 (done correctly)

If I negotiate and close a CFK, I get $200 plus the secure ,salesclean, winterization, and intial lawn. I would rather do that all day than the trashout with dump fees, labor and everythng else. 
* Less work more profit*.


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## BPWY

WOW their current rates are WAY too cheap.


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## Guest

That's Cyprexx, Ocwen, and Altisource.. Anyone want to tell me what the avg guy is making from them? Maybe I need to re negotiate? No I'm sure I do because I am lucky to make $600 a week on avg.


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## BPWY

Ocwen and Altisource are the same company.


Obviously you are loosing a discount from some one on their prices. 
Their 5000 sq ft recut pays more than $50.


Their direct to the contractor pricing isn't a lot better but it is some.


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## Guest

*Georgia Property Preservation*

Looking for contracts and contacts here in Georgia, primarily the atlanta market. If you know of anyone needing services let me know. Thanks in advance.

I have worked for two regional companies with varying success. The first was a middleman for a national company that paid very low wages and didn't believe in not discounting certain work,trip charges for small work were not even considered. So needless to say that relationship was severed because of the lack of ability to make a decent wage. The company I am with currently pays decent however I am looking to expand and maybe even go direct to bank/ national. Any advice in this area would be greatly appreciated.


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## Guest

Atlanta area is hard......Old Friend of mine that lives out North of Atlanta, but services greater Atlanta area, had 86 employess but due to the undercutting newbies they are selling off equipment and laying people off. Last we talked he was in the 20 +/- employees and more was on the chopping block.
Lots of work just little pay thus no profits thus no business left.


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## mtmtnman

Amazing what people will work for. I bid a 90 yard trash out for $2900 in August and got beat out by a guy who did the job for $1000 all in.............................


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## Guest

That is a small/negative profit margin


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## mtmtnman

"Where do i send my payments????"

http://billingsgazette.com/news/local/article_c5f5a7d6-d74e-11df-869e-001cc4c03286.html


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> "Where do i send my payments????"
> 
> http://billingsgazette.com/news/local/article_c5f5a7d6-d74e-11df-869e-001cc4c03286.html






And the beat goes on and on and on and on.



Ocwen is an evil that must be stopped. 


They've been in deep trouble repeatedly for their bungling of legal proceedings when it comes to foreclosures.
They never learn.


One of my local jobs with them they offered $500 CFK on a house where the H/O had way over $200,000 equity in it. Some how they managed to find the $30,000 still owed and paid it off before Ocwen could get their hands on the house.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> ARPP~~~ you know where that will play out. I was helping a friend that does Altisource and install a lot of those digital lockboxes and the first thing I said was "wait till cold or extreme hot temps and lets see how long those batteries work"...well I've been getting calls from realtors who now cannot gain access since the batteries have died. I doesn't take a rocket scientist :no:
> 
> 
> From the get go i've been saying this electronic door knob thing was a mistake....i've gone to more houses for altisource since this began and couldn't gain access then the past three years with regular locks and lock boxes....plus 70.00 a lock is crazy....who wants to buy in excess to have inventory at that price???? not me


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## Guest

I work for a national company and was winterizing a house that another company screwed up on. I found that there were 3 fixtures that were removed and needed wire caps. I called and got the approval to cap the wires and came back to see that I did the work for $1.35. 9 caps @ .15 each. I will be sure not to spend it in one place lol


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## BPWY

I'm preparing to go repo a lock that hasn't been paid for.


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## APlusPPGroup

Be careful, Paul. If you're serious, they can get you for trespassing. Plus, the time it will take to go get it and replace it with another one isn't worth it.

I really hope you're just joking. I wouldn't put it past you but the usually smiley was missing from your post.:sad:

Linda


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## BPWY

First they have to catch and prove that some one took the lock.

Since they didn't pay for the lock the contractor is only retrieving his equipment that was on loan.


And no i'm not joking. I've had it above my eyeballs with nationals that are taking advantage of their contractors.

Nothing I get is free, same goes for them.


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## APlusPPGroup

I understand your frustration but retrieving the lock doesn't solve the problem because you will have to spend the same amount of time, fuel, wear and tear on your vehicle, and the cost of a new lock as you did the original lock change.

How old is the invoice? Have they declined to pay or is it just late?

Linda


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## BPWY

Very late.



Not a lot of expense when you drive right by the place once some times more a week. ;-)


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## Guest

I realize taking the lock back isn't the answer but what is? It may not be legal to go back and take it but at what point are a lot of us supposed to do something about our situations? I thought about going back to a lot of the properties in the Chicago area to get my locks, sump pumps, etc. etc. when I wasn't paid by Countrywide. But since Chicago isn't really close I refrained from doing so. Maybe if more people went and took their supplies back, someone might catch on and say to themselves "somethings not right in this business".


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## Guest

It is an interesting thought question way to do business, I am guessing the only legal way to do it is to have a national, middleman whatever sign a contract stating that if they do not make payment within certain time frame .... yada yada, can't imagine one signing it

Small claims or lein on the house, 5 dollar out of pocket lock (or whatever it cost) not worth it and once you go that route you will get no work.

Talk to some that cost average the loss or let say dump a tire here or there or make sure they pull an extra cy off when they do a trash out for the company that has screwed them in there eyes. real moral issues with this plus you really only need to be caught once and with the amount of times these little non payment or nickle and dime chargebacks come you will always be on the bottom side. Doing wrong things will create an enviroment of your crew doing wrong things and pushing the evenlope

Would be nice if all banks would have to set up some third party company that can track companies that do not pay there contractors and banks blacklist them from sending them orders, as long as the pics justify payment should be made. Wishful thinking but I cannot see why the banks wouldn't want this program since there paying for the service, we are just lead to believe those that gave us the work order didn't get paid, if more contractors just got paid and less nickled and dime more contractors would have better longjevity in the business which could create quicker turn around time. 

really win win for everyone those that want to make profit on being a national should fund the program


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## APlusPPGroup

A billing service is just one more middleman taking another piece of the pie. The banks won't pay for it, you will. It will become something else that will be deducted from your already small checks.

Once you've decided not to do business with your client, not receiving work from them becomes a moot point. Once you remove locks and equipment, and they find out you did it, they won't send you anything else. But you've already made the decision not to take on anymore non-paying work so it's like the old question, "which came first..... the chicken or the egg?".

Liens are enforceable if you're a general contractor and you've filed all your preliminary paperwork. Small claims threats work much better because the clients know they [or a representative] will have to come to court in the county the work was done and the travel expense is often far more than the value of the work they haven't paid for. They know, too, that if they don't show up in court, you win and they have a judgment against them. 

Give them 10 days, then file your claim if they haven't responded. If they have, work with them. Tell them you're willing to take payments. Should it ever go to court, your willingness to work with them on a payment plan will go in your favor.

Removing locks and equipment, however, will not work in your favor in front of a judge, tho. Keep that in mind.

I've had to do more demand letters in the last 6 months than I ever have in my entire life. It does work. You just have to know how to do it properly. I'm still working on collecting from clients who haven't paid in well over 120 days. 

Linda


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## Guest

I still want to play this out, there is a few nationals i work with that are good and solid. I believe we're in a business with way too many national, middleman so forth that give accessto the problemwe see. National A hasa price sheet they demand for certain service and a pay sheet for what they pay for these services. This is a good partnership I come along with my new boots ready to be a property preservationist I have to go through the pecking order. Barring someone dies, mishandles to many orders, steals whatever My shoes never get dirty and I go away.

Company shady national comes along rolls this without checks and balances moving on to contractor to contractor, little timmy doesn't get bike for xmas.

company c through countless nationals comes along takes wrong from this national give to that contractors takes discount to take that lump of orders to discount to whomever will fullfill...... scary 

I read on the board all the time, can someone tell me about this company they offer me work .... yada, and its a crap shoot...

dont confuse the issue about the lock, that is just smoke and mirrors to me which is cloudy up the real issue of too many people want to live in the ivory tower off others.

consolated the national will consolidate the preservation contractors which will give the banks the some sort of a set of strandards of work being done and work being paid out to contractors, only my opinion


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## APlusPPGroup

Idaho ~

We ARE indeed talking about a lock and the fact that it has not yet been paid for.

You are coming in with an entirely different question / problem. We can address both issues but don't tell Paul that his non-payment issue is all smoke and mirrors. For him, it's a real problem. And it's probably representative of many more.

When you say it's all smoke and mirrors, you diminish the subject we're discussing a resolution to.

Linda


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## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> I still want to play this out, there is a few nationals i work with that are good and solid. I believe we're in a business with way too many national, middleman so forth that give accessto the problemwe see. National A hasa price sheet they demand for certain service and a pay sheet for what they pay for these services. This is a good partnership I come along with my new boots ready to be a property preservationist I have to go through the pecking order. Barring someone dies, mishandles to many orders, steals whatever My shoes never get dirty and I go away.
> 
> Company shady national comes along rolls this without checks and balances moving on to contractor to contractor, little timmy doesn't get bike for xmas.
> 
> company c through countless nationals comes along takes wrong from this national give to that contractors takes discount to take that lump of orders to discount to whomever will fullfill...... scary
> 
> I read on the board all the time, can someone tell me about this company they offer me work .... yada, and its a crap shoot...
> 
> dont confuse the issue about the lock, that is just smoke and mirrors to me which is cloudy up the real issue of too many people want to live in the ivory tower off others.
> 
> consolated the national will consolidate the preservation contractors which will give the banks the some sort of a set of strandards of work being done and work being paid out to contractors, only my opinion


 
Man Idaho, that was painful reading through.....lol


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Idaho ~
> 
> We ARE indeed talking about a lock and the fact that it has not yet been paid for.
> 
> You are coming in with an entirely different question / problem. We can address both issues but don't tell Paul that his non-payment issue is all smoke and mirrors. For him, it's a real problem. And it's probably representative of many more.
> 
> When you say it's all smoke and mirrors, you diminish the subject we're discussing a resolution to.
> 
> Linda


Linda, I received your info. but I've been up to my eyeballs in paperwork and day to day ops.


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## Guest

Lol its easy for me

Paul is a grown man who runs his own business
Paul pays his own bills and answer to pauls family
Paul has probably forgot more methods then I know to legally get the money he is owed

While I may or may not agree with what paul decides, paul is the only one that will answer to his decision

I am sure its not the one door knob that has paul upset, it is probably a history of it happening, but do not know haven't ask paul

for me it isn't about the doorknob


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## APlusPPGroup

IdahoProperty said:


> Lol its easy for me
> 
> Paul is a grown man who runs his own business
> Paul pays his own bills and answer to pauls family
> Paul has probably forgot more methods then I know to legally get the money he is owed
> 
> While I may or may not agree with what paul decides, paul is the only one that will answer to his decision
> 
> I am sure its not the one door knob that has paul upset, it is probably a history of it happening, but do not know haven't ask paul
> 
> for me it isn't about the doorknob


I completely agree. That's why I said you brought up a whole other discussion. Both have their merits.

Linda


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## agcreno

DreamWeaver said:


> Man Idaho, that was painful reading through.....lol


 
No disrespect...........Spelling.......Geez


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## agcreno

On this thread, you could cut the tension with a knife between contractors and whoever they work for...My God people, If you don't enjoy what you do vs. what you get paid for doing it, stop doing it. Do something that you truly enjoy, this industry will dry up just as soon as it was created, as soon as the market recovers; For me, I was a Manufactured home setter, and interior finish contractor prior to the housing meltdown, and I guarantee you as soon as that market comes back...and it will...I'm right back in it. I really enjoy the few complete interior refurbs we get, kinda feels like home. But, they're too far and few between.


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## Guest

agcreno said:


> On this thread, you could cut the tension with a knife between contractors and whoever they work for...My God people, If you don't enjoy what you do vs. what you get paid for doing it, stop doing it.


But what about those of us who enjoy doing it and have to deal with no pay/low pay?

I think thats everyones complaint here. I enjoy working the field....but when prices are slashed it makes it hard to live and continue working.


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## agcreno

I actually like preservation work, It just doesn't pay enough...and there's too much BS. On the positive side, we've weeded out all the companies that want to take advantage of "us" as a contractor, and are focusing on the few companies that will pay a reasonable wage for what we do. At the moment, the market is still too soft to do what we do best, I am hopeful that that will change soon. As to the others thinking this is a long term career...Maybe, but I wouldn't hold my breath, We are doomed before we start because of craigslisters and newbie/wanna be's that will take any job for a dollar, regardless of profit.


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## BPWY

IdahoProperty said:


> I am sure its not the one door knob that has paul upset, it is probably a history of it happening, but do not know haven't ask paul
> 
> for me it isn't about the doorknob







You are absolutely correct.

Its the history and not with just one national.



I never said a word here about my major screwing by what was previously my best national to work for and that gave me the most work. I was hoping that they'd pull their heads out of where the sun doesn't shine and work with me. Since I was obviously with photo and video proof in the right and the other lying sack of animal excrement 1000% wrong in his accusations of me.


Didn't happen. To make a very long story short I have this initial secure with dry wint that was over 2.5 hrs one way away from me. Such is the size of the counties that I operate in. I realize that this is not going to work and reduce coverage immediately upon completion of this w/o. The national sends another contractor to 2nd bid every thing and reports back that I did not winterize the property and they back charge me the winterization. Couple weeks go by and I get another call about how that its my fault that the wint wasn't done right and now its all froze and broke in 5 places. I have a choice of either going to the property and taking care of what I didn't do right the first time and report or they'll let the other contractor go do it and charge me. 

I knew this jerk was lying about the freeze damage as at this time there still hasn't been enough cold weather to freeze inside a house.
I also know that if he found water in the quantities hes was claiming that HE turned the well back on after I had taped the breaker off and the breaker box lid shut.
I've done hundreds of winterizes. I think I might know what I'm doing.

I told them that the jerk was a lying sack of ...... and that to prove him wrong I'd return. I go out and pressure test the property. In 40 mins there isn't even .5 lbs of pressure drop, let alone the 5 froze and broken places that this horses behind is claiming. 

I spend all day on the initial trip to the property and another 7 hrs going back to verify that the jerk was lying about me. All told I didn't get paid enough to cover fuel for both trips, let alone a penny for my time, nothing to cover the cost of locks and lock box for the first trip.

Guess how much the national cared about the fact that the other guy is a worthless SOB.................... NOTHING. Not even a little bit. They didn't even pretend to care.







So yeah I'm fed up past my eyeballs with these nationals that won't dance with the ones that brought them as the old saying goes.


I left out many details for the sake of time.

Mr Nice Guy has gone on vacation.


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## agcreno

So I'll tell you what pisse's me off the most...Nevada leads the nation in home foreclosures...Nevada leads the nation in unemployment...and what....Does that give us an edge on the competition?...We are established, and do a great job...Does anyone care???...NO, We should be the Northern NV Kings in this business, We care about the properties, care about what the realtor can sell as a result of what we do, are we the kings?...NO... WELCOME TO CRAIGS LIST>>>. Thank god for the contacts we have made that know the difference between quality work for a fair price vs. the desperation of a 14% unemployment rate.


----------



## agcreno

BPWY said:


> You are absolutely correct.
> 
> Its the history and not with just one national.
> 
> 
> 
> I never said a word here about my major screwing by what was previously my best national to work for and that gave me the most work. I was hoping that they'd pull their heads out of where the sun doesn't shine and work with me. Since I was obviously with photo and video proof in the right and the other lying sack of animal excrement 1000% wrong in his accusations of me.
> 
> 
> Didn't happen. To make a very long story short I have this initial secure with dry wint that was over 2.5 hrs one way away from me. Such is the size of the counties that I operate in. I realize that this is not going to work and reduce coverage immediately upon completion of this w/o. The national sends another contractor to 2nd bid every thing and reports back that I did not winterize the property and they back charge me the winterization. Couple weeks go by and I get another call about how that its my fault that the wint wasn't done right and now its all froze and broke in 5 places. I have a choice of either going to the property and taking care of what I didn't do right the first time and report or they'll let the other contractor go do it and charge me.
> 
> I knew this jerk was lying about the freeze damage as at this time there still hasn't been enough cold weather to freeze inside a house.
> I also know that if he found water in the quantities hes was claiming that HE turned the well back on after I had taped the breaker off and the breaker box lid shut.
> I've done hundreds of winterizes. I think I might know what I'm doing.
> 
> I told them that the jerk was a lying sack of ...... and that to prove him wrong I'd return. I go out and pressure test the property. In 40 mins there isn't even .5 lbs of pressure drop, let alone the 5 froze and broken places that this horses behind is claiming.
> 
> I spend all day on the initial trip to the property and another 7 hrs going back to verify that the jerk was lying about me. All told I didn't get paid enough to cover fuel for both trips, let alone a penny for my time, nothing to cover the cost of locks and lock box for the first trip.
> 
> Guess how much the national cared about the fact that the other guy is a worthless SOB.................... NOTHING. Not even a little bit. They didn't even pretend to care.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> So yeah I'm fed up past my eyeballs with these nationals that won't dance with the ones that brought them as the old saying goes.
> 
> 
> I left out many details for the sake of time.
> 
> Mr Nice Guy has gone on vacation.


 
I rest my case...


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## Guest

agcreno said:


> So I'll tell you what pisse's me off the most...Nevada leads the nation in home foreclosures...Nevada leads the nation in unemployment...and what....Does that give us an edge on the competition?...We are established, and do a great job...Does anyone care???...NO, We should be the Northern NV Kings in this business, We care about the properties, care about what the realtor can sell as a result of what we do, are we the kings?...NO... WELCOME TO CRAIGS LIST>>>. Thank god for the contacts we have made that know the difference between quality work for a fair price vs. the desperation of a 14% unemployment rate.


"tongue in cheek"   but if its that bad in Nevada than go vote and maybe it will change:w00t: 
OOPS I think the polls have closed and OOPS I see the results....:no:
I guess Nevadans like it the way it is:whistling


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## agcreno

Harry Reid is an embarassment to this state, and the nation...Just my opinion. I'm hoping for a miscount, and last, My dreams of a better housing market have apparently been shattered. FML...................................


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## agcreno

Good Nite all...Got locks to pick tomorrow...GO SHARON ANGLE!!!,,,,Not likely...


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## BPWY

agcreno said:


> I rest my case...







Its a song I've been cranking at top volume for many pages now.


Apparently the nationals have been reading the forum because a lot of my work has dried up.


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## Guest

Linda,
How do you deal with Nationals who short pay, I have had an issue with a company doing this and they recently sent a ck but it was not correct after contacting them regarding this issue, I was essentially told that I would get what I get. I now have the delimia of trying to decide how to handle this without causing issues as this is our companies biggest client, but on the flip side I also can not continue to take short pays. ugh its frustrating can you give me any insight?
Thanks


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## BPWY

Several choices.


Suck it up and keep going.

Cash the check and quit working for them.

Good luck getting them to pay up.


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## APlusPPGroup

Medicme said:


> Linda,
> How do you deal with Nationals who short pay, I have had an issue with a company doing this and they recently sent a ck but it was not correct after contacting them regarding this issue, I was essentially told that I would get what I get. I now have the delimia of trying to decide how to handle this without causing issues as this is our companies biggest client, but on the flip side I also can not continue to take short pays. ugh its frustrating can you give me any insight?
> Thanks


It depends on the type of short pay. Is it the client's typical percentage or did they charge you back for something? Have you been short paid by them before or have all your other checks been 100%?

I won't be able to post much today. I have too many bids to get submitted and work orders to issue.

I need a vendor in the Bristol County area of Massachusetts. The vendor I have is not working out. I have 4 work orders for Bristol County and 2 for Essex County. Anyone?

Linda


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## BPWY

Maybe I won't have to repo a power bolt. 

We'll see in the next few days.


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## Guest

Well this is not do to their percentage they are just paying a portion of what is owed. For instance a winterization that was agreed to be paid at one price was cut in half. then their % removed after that. So it seems to be something they are doing not so much as myself. I contacted and get the run around so just looking for some insight.
BPWY you are correct that I have choices, I have been screwed over by more than $2000.00 on this one check and god knows what the other ck will be short on too. ugh im just trying to figure out a way to deal with this in a good way, my goal is to be paid for work completed , I do not run up my bids etc I work for fair prices and do excellent work its kind of what I said to them, " You work and expect to get paid on friday correct" response yes. Then why do you think we work 7 days but are not to be paid for our work. complete silence at the other end. just frustrated i guess. I pride our company of the work we perform


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## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Maybe I won't have to repo a power bolt.
> 
> We'll see in the next few days.


Does it look like payment is on its way? I'll keep my fingers crossed for you, Paul. :thumbsup:

Linda


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## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> It depends on the type of short pay. Is it the client's typical percentage or did they charge you back for something? Have you been short paid by them before or have all your other checks been 100%?
> 
> I won't be able to post much today. I have too many bids to get submitted and work orders to issue.
> 
> I need a vendor in the Bristol County area of Massachusetts. The vendor I have is not working out. I have 4 work orders for Bristol County and 2 for Essex County. Anyone?
> 
> Linda



What's your bid approval percentage Linda?? I am at 3.75% for the year according to what quickbooks says. All we are doing with the bidding is giving the bank a base to value the property at. It's unreal the houses that have conveyed and then later sold to new owners here with mold, broken plumbing, bad electrical ect............


----------



## Guest

agcreno said:


> So I'll tell you what pisse's me off the most...Nevada leads the nation in home foreclosures...Nevada leads the nation in unemployment...and what....Does that give us an edge on the competition?...We are established, and do a great job...Does anyone care???...NO, We should be the Northern NV Kings in this business, We care about the properties, care about what the realtor can sell as a result of what we do, are we the kings?...NO... WELCOME TO CRAIGS LIST>>>. Thank god for the contacts we have made that know the difference between quality work for a fair price vs. the desperation of a 14% unemployment rate.




same thing in southern Nevada !!! that's why i've dedicated the holiday/slow season to strictly advertising to local realtors and brokers and leaving the national route to as you say" the 14% unemployed"...( i found that funny btw) yes we work a lot less but the difference in pay more then makes up for it. I did a lock change yesterday for a broker that has direct connects with fannie mae. Not bragging but instead pointing out i got paid 120.00 to change one lock! So that's 20 drive time one way, 5 mins to gain access ( and two drill bits lol) and then another 2-3 mins to put on new lock and repin cylinder. Then took interior pics and submitted a bid for trash out, cleaning, and landscaping with out being asked and got all three...in all that job is raking in 850.00 PROFIT for me not including the initial rekey money and the trash out, cleaning, and landscaping took four of my guys 6 hours total......can the nationals touch that?? $&#@ no! 

this is another route I'm using to make sure my company stays afloat, but unfortunately for my employees, most are laid off or had to take on second jobs to keep their families afloat but in this situation the nationals do not run the show and do not run my company !!!! BUT instead of complaining about it I went out and made a change and did something about it, and am continuing to do something about it.....if i get work from nationals, GREAT. it's extra work that keep my employees working, and if not then oh well. 

I'd rather work smart then hard !!! keep that in mind guys !!!


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## APlusPPGroup

Medicme ~ That's a lot of money to be shorted. I would demand an explanation from the client, then let them know if they cannot mail a check for the balance immediately, you will file against them in small claims.

Matt ~ I'm not really sure what the percentage of approved bids has been this year. We've gone up and down in volume so it's hard to keep track. But I do know that we're not going to underbid in order to get work approved. If the vendor doesn't make money for his hard work and effort, we don't want the jobs anyway, regardless of the reasons.

We will negotiate with the client [on request] but we always let the vendor know what the client is asking for in terms of work and dollars before we finalize a negotiated bid.

Mike ~ Good for you! We don't bother with the nationals either and it's for the very reason you've given. When the realtors are in charge of hiring vendors, the find the best available. Since cleaning and maintaining the property is in their best interest, they will [normally] approve more than the nationals do. You are doing it right.:thumbup:

Linda


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## Guest

Linda,
When I told them I would pursue them getting my money, they in turn assumed I was placing a lien on the property. To be honest I have all the bank info on the property and that is an option, but its honestly not the way I work. I would prefer them to pay and to be able to carry on my marry little way, but It appears I will have to go after them in small claims or in some other manner as much as I would like to avoid this, im uncertain how else to handle it.
My Lawyer says file liens on every property which is a blanket lien for all properties they own then the first one that sales they will have to recoup my money before the sale would go forth. but I dont want to, I hate all the legal BS and feel that it could harm me more than just losing the money so I am waiting to see how much my next ck is missing and Im still holding the ck they just sent to try to work it out with them. But this is crazy and its one reason I have seen so many complaints about this company too I guess that should have been my warning. but Nope I was assured it would not occur but here it is occuring. My trust has been broken but my wallet is suffering from it.lol I guess that is business. Perhaps it will be a nice tax break. yeah i doubt that too.


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## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> same thing in southern Nevada !!! that's why i've dedicated the holiday/slow season to strictly advertising to local realtors and brokers and leaving the national route to as you say" the 14% unemployed"...( i found that funny btw) yes we work a lot less but the difference in pay more then makes up for it. I did a lock change yesterday for a broker that has direct connects with fannie mae. Not bragging but instead pointing out i got paid 120.00 to change one lock! So that's 20 drive time one way, 5 mins to gain access ( and two drill bits lol) and then another 2-3 mins to put on new lock and repin cylinder. Then took interior pics and submitted a bid for trash out, cleaning, and landscaping with out being asked and got all three...in all that job is raking in 850.00 PROFIT for me not including the initial rekey money and the trash out, cleaning, and landscaping took four of my guys 6 hours total......can the nationals touch that?? $&#@ no!
> 
> this is another route I'm using to make sure my company stays afloat, but unfortunately for my employees, most are laid off or had to take on second jobs to keep their families afloat but in this situation the nationals do not run the show and do not run my company !!!! BUT instead of complaining about it I went out and made a change and did something about it, and am continuing to do something about it.....if i get work from nationals, GREAT. it's extra work that keep my employees working, and if not then oh well.
> 
> I'd rather work smart then hard !!! keep that in mind guys !!!






The fannie broker in my area doesn't know that she can do this. She says that every thing is done thru the nationals and theres nothing she can do.


Sucks for me.


----------



## Guest

apparently my original message was 3 characters short...weird because I thought it was long...we'll see if this works!



Steak said:


> Was reading earlier in the post, and things sounded good. You folks will hate me for it, but I've been looking at getting into the business myself.
> I have the tools, I have the insurance (already work as contract engineer, work is sparse, looking to supplement income).
> Looking at these later posts, might be a lost cause?
> The company I have been talking with, Homeland field services, seems legit, and pays fair, as far as they say (printed numbers seem fair). They are in great need of contractors in my area.
> 
> I'm loaded with tools. Drills, generator, ladders, hand tools, electrical tools/components, and knowledge on how to use them. I've remodeled a few houses completely, so I know what I'm doing.
> 
> Should I run from this business, or is there still room for success?
> 
> Sorry I've been away for so long. Chris: your post made for the perfect quote as far as why I've been gone and some reminders I had for "beginners" and those of us who may be struggling from time to time.
> 
> I had some checks from brokers that were issued later than expected and as Murphys Law dictates, that means that there were going to be bills that were backing up waiting on those checks.
> 
> I tapped into my business savings to continue operating and then the cable went out, followed by the internet, followed by my cell phone (hence why I disappeared). Thank god I have patient brokers and an even more patient wife.
> 
> Chris (and anyone else thinking about the industry), there IS money to be made in this line of work BUT (and that's a BIG but) it's just like any other business...there are risks and rewards.
> 
> There's this mythological belief online that it's a get rich quick industry but it's not...its like any other industry where it takes hard work, personal sacrifice, and patience.
> 
> I was estatic with my previous line of work if I made a 20% profit...i would say my profit margin now is between 40-50%...but sometimes it drains you while you're waiting.
> 
> For those of you going through hard times, keep your chin up. I've only been in this business for a little over a year but I have very steady work and still found myself broke and on my face this past week. But the foreclosure freeze in VA is over, I've begun receiving my checks, and the work orders are once again pouring in...
> 
> it's not so much that it's a tough industry...its just an industry. If we were all restaurant owners we'd still be talking about bottom lines, making money, and keeping customers.
> 
> Keep on keepin' on guys (and gals!)
> 
> Chris Johnson
> Coastal Breeze Services
> 
> 
> 
> Haven't been on in a while and I apologize...while playing catch up I saw your post Chris and it was the perfect post for me to quote when stating why I've been away and a reminder to those just starting out or currently struggling some (thank you Chris).
> 
> 
> -Chris


----------



## Guest

*Odd...*

so my previous post ended up in the quote of the post I was quoting...i hate technology...

I also wanted to remind everyone to stand firm... I put in a $x,*** bid for a trashout and someone came behind and underbid me by almost $1,000...I just spoke to the broker today and by the time I'm done fixing what this other company didn't do it will cost the broker MORE than my original bid...needless to say she learned a valuable lesson.

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> I realize taking the lock back isn't the answer but what is? It may not be legal to go back and take it but at what point are a lot of us supposed to do something about our situations? I thought about going back to a lot of the properties in the Chicago area to get my locks, sump pumps, etc. etc. when I wasn't paid by Countrywide. But since Chicago isn't really close I refrained from doing so. Maybe if more people went and took their supplies back, someone might catch on and say to themselves "somethings not right in this business".


You can tell I was gone way too long because I'm post-post-posting while I play catch up.

It gets tricky sometimes with invoices. I had an issue today with a $250 invoice that had never been Freddie Mac approved on a bid that was related to another bid/invoice involving the same swimming pool. 

I thought I was going to watch my invoice go through a paper shredder but luckily the broker told me to cut the grass 3 more times and clear the sticks and branches off of a patio overhang and invoice her 4 invoices at $75 each to make up for it...

I was prepared to bite the bullet though because of my own f**k up and if she didn't have a gracious heart then I would have...

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

*I tried...*

I tried so hard to edit my idiotic-looking first post from today but can't...

Any newbees or struggling peeps please read my original post tonight even though it looks like a part of a quote...and I promise, this is my last post tonight...its just good to be back...

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


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## Guest

*sorry...*

I swore up and down that I was done for the night but I guess I lied...which doesn't sit well with me...

Linda,

I know you're bothered left and right because you're a fair, active, and influential leader within our industry (when I say 'leader' I REALLY mean 'authoritative figure'....)...out of curiousity, what are your insurance requirements (and are there excwptions?)

I know, I know...its all within the post...but I'm tired and void of time...

Chris Johnson
Coastal Breeze Services
[email protected]


----------



## Guest

*was 2 weeks enough?*

damn, I'm the only one on?....


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> The fannie broker in my area doesn't know that she can do this. She says that every thing is done thru the nationals and theres nothing she can do.
> 
> 
> Sucks for me.



I get that too....i'm not sure why some realtors can and some can't....if i was able to figure that out i'd be rich !!! any one know why this is???????


----------



## mtmtnman

D&R Services said:


> I get that too....i'm not sure why some realtors can and some can't....if i was able to figure that out i'd be rich !!! any one know why this is???????




Most know they can do a 571 misc. but choose not to as THEY lay the cash online and wait 60-90 days for reimbursement. I made a deal with my brokers that i wouldn't cash there checks till they got paid. I have some invoices from clear back in February we are still trying to get straightened out. Just deposited $1500 last week from a May invoice.......................................


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Most know they can do a 571 misc. but choose not to as THEY lay the cash online and wait 60-90 days for reimbursement. I made a deal with my brokers that i wouldn't cash there checks till they got paid. I have some invoices from clear back in February we are still trying to get straightened out. Just deposited $1500 last week from a May invoice.......................................





571 misc?? is that a tax form?


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## mtmtnman

D&R Services said:


> 571 misc?? is that a tax form?


FNMA Misc. Work Reimbursement form. I think i have the # correct.


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## mtmtnman

Something useful out of a trashout. Walked into the house with this and my daughter gave me the "OH CRAP" look! LMAO!! I remember being on the receiving end of one of these when i was a youngster...........


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## Guest

Isn't that lead filled? It's called a "sap" isn't it?


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Isn't that lead filled? It's called a "sap" isn't it?



Just a piece of leather............................


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## Guest

Yeah used to "sap" me when I was a little younger....


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## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Something useful out of a trashout. Walked into the house with this and my daughter gave me the "OH CRAP" look! LMAO!! I remember being on the receiving end of one of these when i was a youngster...........








Must not have gotten it enough,  look at the way you turned out. 




:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Must not have gotten it enough,  look at the way you turned out.





:innocent::innocent::innocent::innocent:


----------



## Guest

For eveyones information..... The nationals are now canvassing crews off Service Magic. If you want those leads get the wallet out for $13.00 per lead. 
What next?


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## BPWY

Just another sign that the nationals have burned thru the supply of available contractors and are looking for new victims. 
Word will get passed thru the Service Magic circles faster than it did the contractor circles. 
They'll be forced to look for a supply of new victims sooner than they are expecting right now.... I'm betting.


----------



## Guest

Hello everyone.
Interesting read ya'll have here. Took me a few sittings to get to this point (longest thread ever?)

I am wondering if anyone has seen the new FNMA PP Matrix due to go into effect December 15? 
If not here is an interesting clip:

DEBRIS REMOVAL 
Interior and exterior items submitted as debris may be considered personal property by the mortgagor. As a result, Fannie Mae does not typically consider the removal of any items during foreclosure proceedings. 
The following are examples of items typically not removed from the interior: toothpaste, medicine, household cleaning products, and paint thinner, dry or canned goods, paint cans with secured lids, oil in secure containers, alcohol, fire extinguishers, car batteries, broken glass or tires. 
PERSONAL PROPERTY 
Fannie Mae will not usually consider removal or storage of personal property prior to foreclosure with exceptions regarding code violations, liens, fines or discolored debris caused by water damage. Servicers should consult their legal department and provide acknowledgment of approval to remove personal property in the comment section of the bid. 
Items located on the exterior of the home should be moved to the garage or a secured area. *Do not submit *requests to remove personal property. Examples include, but are not limited to, the following: ​
Vehicles (autos, trailers, boats, recreational vehicles, motorcycles, etc.) 
Building materials 
Clothing 
Furniture 
Lawn and Garden equipment 


Anyway, looking forward to joining in on this thread more in the future.

-Chris


----------



## BPWY

PropPresPro said:


> Hello everyone.
> Interesting read ya'll have here. Took me a few sittings to get to this point (longest thread ever?)
> 
> I am wondering if anyone has seen the new FNMA PP Matrix due to go into effect December 15?
> If not here is an interesting clip:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> As a result, Fannie Mae does not typically consider the removal of any items during foreclosure proceedings.
Click to expand...






I know of a thread on another forum thats north of 10,000 pages. 



So why does the gooberment go to the bother of mentioning all those different items if they don't


> As a result, Fannie Mae does not typically consider the removal of any items during foreclosure proceedings.


???



I'm not throwing stones at you for this. I just happened to notice the extreme redundancy of their spelling it out. 


Welcome to the forum.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I'm not throwing stones at you for this. I just happened to notice the extreme redundancy of their spelling it out.


 
I am guessing that FNMA is rewording their regs & specs as a result of the botched foreclosure fiasco by the big national banks.

Common sense for most of us to not remove any personals from a house that does not have the foreclosure papers finalized yet. But then again the last three years has taught me that most the players in our industry don't have any common sense.

On a up note though, the new matrix does include price INCREASES in it.:clap:


----------



## Guest

Welcome Chris,
I've have been told that Fannie is changing as far as removal of debris/personals and that they are going to go *"far out"* on what they are considering personals. This is all because of the lawyers that are gearing up to sue all us contractors for the "illegal foreclosures" that has taken place and the contractors are the "easy prey". What everyone needs to understand from your clip is the "*servicers should consult their legal council and provide acknowledgement in their bid*".....ie every contractor will need to go to their lawyer (obviously on retainer) and have their lawyer review if THEY think its a personal item and then put THEIR lawyers acknowledgement of yes/no that the items are personals or debris and put that in the contractors bid. I can be 99.999% sure the nationals will *not *make that decision but will rest squarely on the contractors shoulders...also known as liability insurance. 

As of right now I have not seen anything in writing that spells out the personals/debris guidelines so can I ask where you got this information? I do a lot of direct work for Fannie and we get these emails all the time but I haven't seen any new guidelines but then again I coulda missed. Also I like the "more pay" but I haven't seen that either....... Sure hope you are right


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Welcome Chris,
> I've have been told that Fannie is changing as far as removal of debris/personals and that they are going to go *"far out"* on what they are considering personals. This is all because of the lawyers that are gearing up to sue all us contractors for the "illegal foreclosures" that has taken place and the contractors are the "easy prey". What everyone needs to understand from your clip is the "*servicers should consult their legal council and provide acknowledgement in their bid*".....ie every contractor will need to go to their lawyer (obviously on retainer) and have their lawyer review if THEY think its a personal item and then put THEIR lawyers acknowledgement of yes/no that the items are personals or debris and put that in the contractors bid. I can be 99.999% sure the nationals will *not *make that decision but will rest squarely on the contractors shoulders...also known as liability insurance.







Sounds like its time to change the wording of the bids. 
Instead of "remove interior debris" change it to "removal of interior items".


----------



## Guest

Sounds like its time to change the wording of the bids. 
Instead of "remove interior debris" change it to "removal of interior items". 

Probably a good idea to change the wording

We just recently put a bid in for an interior / exterior trash out with one of the Brokers we work directly with. 3 floors of stuff....pool table, couches, bedroom set, table saw, carpenter tools, etc ( a lot of hazardous material ) I think the guy ran a furniture refinishing business out of the garage and an out building.
The Broker has contacted the tenant/owner and is posting a 30 day notice before we get the o.k. to clean it out.
BTW...the Hazardous material is $1800 to properly dispose of. the rest of the stuff is $3500.
On another note...........off to do a $875 power wash, ( standard 4 bdrm Colonial w/vinyl siding ) gotta love working with Brokers


----------



## Guest

Just for the record...
That strap that mtmtnman has shared ith us is for sharpening striaght razors...It. at one time was in a barbershop...That is an antique...Wonderful job we have huh???
Willow switches...never a leather strap....not sure if that was a better alternative or not!!!!


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> As of right now I have not seen anything in writing that spells out the personals/debris guidelines so can I ask where you got this information? I do a lot of direct work for Fannie and we get these emails all the time but I haven't seen any new guidelines but then again I coulda missed. Also I like the "more pay" but I haven't seen that either....... Sure hope you are right


Thanks Fremont,

The majority of our work also has been direct for FNMA so they keep us pretty well updated. Here is the link they sent me 

efanniemae.com/sf/guides/ssg/relatedservicinginfo/pdf/ppmatrix.pdf

You'll have to cut & paste and maybe add the w's to the front(You are only allowed to post URLs to other sites after you have made 15 posts or more. ).

Although there is wording in this doc toward defining 'personal property', it is purposely vague. I, too, enjoyed the "servicers should consult their legal department" part. My legal department is just down the hall to the left, decorated with porcelin!

The more pay part comes in the form of higher allowables for boarding. Might not be as broad an increase as we would like, but it is nice to see _any_ numbers go in that direction for a change.


----------



## BPWY

Thanks for the link, thats interesting reading.



How come HUD rates and FNMA rates vary so much? FNMA grass rates are pretty good. So are the wint rates. FNMA boarding is lower than HUD tho.




I like this one. Using the last sentence literally would mean that there is no need to tarp a roof leak or board up a window. 



> EMERGENCY REPAIRS
> The most important element to defining an emergency is that an immediate response is necessary to prevent damage or lessen the loss of property. Gradual and progressive deterioration or lack of property maintenance does not qualify as an emergency


----------



## Guest

Good lookin' out on the link...


----------



## BPWY

Speaking of getting broker work.....



Long time readers have heard my frustrations at getting broker work.


Yesterday I had a pure happen chance meeting with the Fannie broker I've wanted to work with.
We discussed prices and I'm doing a rekey for her tomorrow..... woo hoo

I hope that I'm able to keep her happy with my work and I can tell the nationals to "have a good day". 
Well I'd like to tell them some thing else.... but lets keep it family oriented.  

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:



I don't need to tell ya'll what she thinks of FAS, Screwguard, LPS etc!!!!
Ya'll already know how most folks feel about them.


----------



## Guest

Hey even a shaggy dog sometimes gets a bone


----------



## Guest

I gott'a question.

If you weren't told what you should be charging for your services by FNMA, FHLMC, HUD, etc., what would you charge? Same? More? A lot more?

We do some work for local'ish lenders that wrote non conforming mortgages and are now reaping what they sowed. They've been using our services and (more importantly) paying our invoices for a couple of years now. Obviously, I think that what I've been charging them for "standard" services is a fair market price (and they have never complained), but I also am starting to feel that maybe I should be giving them the same deal FNMA gets. 
Is my thinking being way too influenced by FNMA dictating most of my business? 
What would you do?


----------



## BPWY

I had the same conversation with myself just yesterday.



If our thinking wasn't so heavily influenced by HUD pricing and the nationals discounts etc what would we be charging? On some things more, on some things less I'm sure.

Take grass cuts. HUD's new rate is a lot closer to market rate around here than what the old rate was. 
Joe home owner wouldn't be paying $100 for a simple grass cut 10,000 to 15,000 sq ft.
Not unless he was getting some other services thrown in.
The difference comes from Joe home owner paying either at the point of the work being done or at the minimum the end of the month. I've never had a h/o check bounce. I've had them be late or real late.
There is no wait for up to 60 plus days, the danger of charge backs etc with Joe home owner.
This is why the HUD rate is higher.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Thanks for the link, thats interesting reading.
> 
> 
> 
> How come HUD rates and FNMA rates vary so much? FNMA grass rates are pretty good. So are the wint rates. FNMA boarding is lower than HUD tho.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I like this one. Using the last sentence literally would mean that there is no need to tarp a roof leak or board up a window.


Ha, Ha! I just had to put in a bid a few days ago in this witches house-looking shack because the ceiling in the kitchen and bathroom completely callapsed. The bid was to remove and replace the ceiling but the issue all stemmed from a SSSLLOOWWW leak through the roof.

Freddie Mac has yet to get back to the broker regarding a roof tarping because it took so many years to create the internal damage...but the amount of mold in the ceiling is un godly


----------



## Guest

PropPresPro said:


> I gott'a question.
> 
> If you weren't told what you should be charging for your services by FNMA, FHLMC, HUD, etc., what would you charge? Same? More? A lot more?


I would say keep doing what you're doing. Sometimes I feel like x,y, and z service seems overcharged, sometimes I feel like a, b, and c service is undercharged...but at the end of the day I feel like they balance each other out.

Rarely do I feel like I should raise my prices but it's when I feel like I need to lower my prices because some hot shot cut throat company jumps into the industry out of no where that gets to me.

Raising prices if you justifiably feel you should is an easy decision if your hearts in the right place. Lowering your prices because a "here today, gone tomorrow" company is stealing your business isn't. And sticking to your guns and waiting for brokers to see that your quality of work is higher than joe schmoe is even harder...

It's no different than those 'around for 1 summer' lawn guys that cut $60 lawns for $20 killing the big boys before they drop off the face of the planet come October...


----------



## Guest

Coastal Breeze said:


> Rarely do I feel like I should raise my prices but it's when I feel like I need to lower my prices because some hot shot cut throat company jumps into the industry out of no where that gets to me.
> quote]
> 
> I think this is what has been feuling my thoughts of pricing lately.
> I haven't had any problems in particular with cutthroat pricing/bidding that I know of, nor do I think that most of my clients would abandon me just for a lower price, but just the thought makes me do the "self examination" thing.


----------



## Guest

Pricing? 
It does not matter what industry we work in there is no "clear avenue" to make a decision on what pricing for a job should be. There are estimator programs that "may" help you in your decision but that is not a final arbitrator of pricing since you can change your numbers or your profit percentages.

We rule of thumb it here:
1) What is our profit?

2) What is our profit?

3) How can we overcome all the trip charges that cost us money and time for all the dead bids, no access to properties or completed by others work that is sent out?

4) Do we have enough profit to pay the business bills, the personal bills, put food on the table, put money into savings, put money into retirement, put money into the rainy day fund and pay the health insurance?

and last......

5) What is our profit? :laughing:


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Pricing?
> It does not matter what industry we work in there is no "clear avenue" to make a decision on what pricing for a job should be. There are estimator programs that "may" help you in your decision but that is not a final arbitrator of pricing since you can change your numbers or your profit percentages.
> 
> We rule of thumb it here:
> 1) What is our profit?
> 
> 2) What is our profit?
> 
> 3) How can we overcome all the trip charges that cost us money and time for all the dead bids, no access to properties or completed by others work that is sent out?
> 
> 4) Do we have enough profit to pay the business bills, the personal bills, put food on the table, put money into savings, put money into retirement, put money into the rainy day fund and pay the health insurance?
> 
> and last......
> 
> 5) What is our profit? :laughing:



What's profit??:whistling:whistling:whistling:whistling


----------



## Guest

Profit solves #3 and #4 requirements


----------



## Guest

I don't know about everyone else but we have an epidemic of furnaces that are disappearing from vacant foreclosed homes here... I know of a crew that has sold several on different web sites and now I see another local article about another 1 that developed feet and ran out of the basement....

I can't blame the hvac contractors reclaiming unpaid for property but come-on..how many furnaces can a guy sell without being caught?
Yes these little "for sale ads" have been forwarded to asset managers but without serial numbers and such its just a waste of time.

http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/index.php/2010/11/11/cold-hearted-burglars-steal-furnace/

I wonder how long it will take for these moron nationals to catch on that these low ballers are "making it up" in "other ways".


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> I don't know about everyone else but we have an epidemic of furnaces that are disappearing from vacant foreclosed homes here... I know of a crew that has sold several on different web sites and now I see another local article about another 1 that developed feet and ran out of the basement....
> 
> I can't blame the hvac contractors reclaiming unpaid for property but come-on..how many furnaces can a guy sell without being caught?
> Yes these little "for sale ads" have been forwarded to asset managers but without serial numbers and such its just a waste of time.
> 
> http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/index.php/2010/11/11/cold-hearted-burglars-steal-furnace/
> 
> I wonder how long it will take for these moron nationals to catch on that these low ballers are "making it up" in "other ways".






Sure they "broke" in the front door. They probably used a common key code. lol
The graffiti spraying is probably to throw the cops off the trail.




> Among today’s burglary reports at the Des Moines Police Station is one involving the theft of a furnace.
> Investigators said intruders broke into a vacant house in the 700 block of East 27th Street by forcing open the front door. The furnace, valued at $5,000, was stolen from the basement.
> Words were spray-painted on the walls in black and gold.
> Police have no suspects and no witnesses.




I don't see a lot of missing appliances............ yet.


----------



## Guest

can i get some feedback on Reoresponse inc out of ventura california....anyone work with them before or currently....thoughts???


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Sorry, Mike. Never heard of REO Response. Maybe someone else has.

What about Safe Harbor Field Services? Anyone work with them? They've asked us to come on board and I need some feedback. I thought someone posted something about them but I can't find the post.

Thanks!

Linda


----------



## BPWY

What about M&M mortgage services?


They contacted me today. 
Said they are paying on the old HUD rate less 20%.

I had another company several weeks ago.... 3point lender solutions..... very hot to trot and said they had a lot of work. I paid for the back ground check and got every thing else sent over.
Guess how much work I've gotten..........0.0 work orders. Thats the last time I'm paying for a back ground check prior to getting work.
The next company that wants that can pay for it themselves and take the fee off the first payment.


----------



## Guest

I submitted a bid to replace some shingles that had blown off the roof. Mr National came back and said he needed more information than just "replace 50 sq ft of shingles which have blown off roof". 
So, I resubmitted:
"Replace 50 sq ft of shingles which have blown off roof with 3 tab, fiberglass based, petroleum direvative enhanced, shingles. Shingles will be held on by steel, nickel alloy, cross pollinated, small, sharp metal shingle holding devices. They will be applied with a compressed nitrogen and oxygen utilizing pneumatic sharp metal insertion device" -- Approved without a single question. :thumbup:
Go figure...


----------



## Guest

*The BIG &quot;battle&quot;*



PropPresPro said:


> I think this is what has been feuling my thoughts of pricing lately.I haven't had any problems in particular with cutthroat pricing/bidding that I know of, nor do I think that most of my clients would abandon me just for a lower price, but just the thought makes me do the "self examination" thing.


The trick is figuring out what you're worth and sticking to it. $25/hr? $50/hr? The minute you unjustifyably stray away from that is the exact moment when you begin hating life...On top of performing property preservation for numerous local brokers I also have 15-20 reidential lawn and/or pool contracts (depending on whether or not god wills a disgusting mid-summer drought for coastal Virginia or a freakishly 'wetter than normal fall'...i wish I was in control of nature's sprinkler system!At any rate, I cut my pop's grass for free every week. It's easily a just under 1 acre, $60 lawn but he's my dad. Next door to my parents is an amazing business man who is the epitome of neighborly. His lawn is just over 1 acre and is easily a $70 lawn.

Like an idiot I told him $40/week and now once a week I despise my very exsistance because I'm stuck working FOREVER on a street where I won't make any money...and it was even worse before I closed my pop's pool because he received weekly pool maintenance for free as well.

No, I'll never charge my pops for lawn care, landscaping, pressure washing, pool maintenance, etc; and no, I'll never charge my parents' neighbor what he should really be charged for lawn care, but the bottom line is for 1/2 a day I'm making WAY less than what I feel I'm worth...

In this context I'm talking about family and neighbors, but when we're talking about brokers and complete strangers? Definitely do NOT sell yourself short or you'll have one more excuse piled on top of a million others to get drunk each night, and that's not good for the misses, the kids, yourself, or the business...


----------



## Guest

*Sell out, with me oh yea, sell out, with me tonight...*

So the REAL reason I signed on tonight is because SE Virginia is finally under attack by the nationals. The asset groups have always had a hidden presence her as they do everywhere but it wasn't pronounced.

The Hampton Roads region of Virginia is the 23rd largest metropolitan area in the U.S. but because of how we are shaped geographically we are a very unique place (I live in a city which encompasses 78.4 square miles but only 15.5 square miles of it is land...the rest is marsh land, swamp, and water).

On top of that add in the fact that 43% of our economy is directly tied to the military, federal government, and national defense and you find yourself in a region with millions of people and yet somehow is "other worldly"...

During the Bush years we saw BILLIONS of dollars pour into our region only to watch that money dry up over the past 2 years...and although our unemployment dropped from just over 10% about 9 months ago to around 7.4%, we are just now beginning to see our foreclosure numbers begin to skyrocket...and the nationals are picking up on it...

Joint Forces Command is shutting down, so is Ft. Monroe, NASA is cutting back, government contractor jobs are turning into GS jobs, Jefferson Labs is losing more and more funding, and we just saw yet another round of trrops, sailors, and airmen head off to Afganistan. We're watching locally stationed personal repeatedly get shipped off to a war front 3xs as fast as they're coming back.

(Mike, bite your tongue since we talked about all of this the other day! Lol).

The point is I'm watching unemployment in my area drop, a state government surplus grow, a state wide economy strengthen, and yet somehow NOW the foreclosure rate is increasing...

The nationals picked up on it before I did, and god knows where they're based out of! But I have found my prices dropping and I even sold my soul to the devil tonight by negotiating my company to be the exclusive vendor for 4 counties in NORTHEAST NORTH CAROLINIA for a company contracted by a national who contracted by a bank...

I made a calculated decision that took me from a "no middle man" mentality to a "2 middle men? I'll make it work...NC? I'll sort it out..."

Oh the depths from which we have fallen...


----------



## Guest

danny1217 said:


> On another note...........off to do a $875 power wash, ( standard 4 bdrm Colonial w/vinyl siding ) gotta love working with Brokers


Hey now, no bragging! Lol, that bid reminds me of the good ol' days when I was a vendor for Siebert Realty taking care of beach houses owned by millionares but rented out to yuppies from NY, MA, NJ and the Philly area of PA 51 out of 52 weeks a year for thousands of dollars per week...

These idiots would pour down from north of the Mason-Dixon line, complain that there was too much sand on the side of the beach house, demand that it be pressure washed immediately, Siebert Realty would bow to their very wish, and before you knew it I was pressure washing a 3 million dollar house on the beach, watching dolphins jump in the waves, making an absolute killing because some city slicker found it offensive and grotesque that they're beach house rental was covered with: you guessed it: BEACH.

God I miss those days...people with so much money that they wiped their a**es with it...


----------



## BPWY

Coastal Breeze said:


> The nationals picked up on it before I did, and god knows where they're based out of! But I have found my prices dropping and I even sold my soul to the devil tonight by negotiating my company to be the exclusive vendor for 4 counties in NORTHEAST NORTH CAROLINIA for a company contracted by a national who contracted by a bank...
> 
> I made a calculated decision that took me from a "no middle man" mentality to a "2 middle men? I'll make it work...NC? I'll sort it out..."
> 
> Oh the depths from which we have fallen...






Good luck on that.



I think you'll soon find that "exclusive" doesn't mean squat to a national.

They have to get 2nd bids from some where and these  have 0 loyalty to their "exclusive" vendor. The second that you stand up for yourself and try to prevent them from steam rolling you will be about the time that exclusive provision flies out the window. It won't be long until you start seeing signs in your exclusive area that they are dancing with another girl so to speak.

Another thing don't listen to their claims of "get ready, we have so much work coming down the pike that you'll be so busy, you better buy your equipment and hire your guys because next week or the first of the month the flood gates open".


Don't believe a word of it. 


Been there, done that, paid the money and never got the work.


A day of reconing is coming for the nations for all the lies and mistreatment of the contractors. I think it may happen in select very small pockets of the country. Especially in the remote and small population areas of the west. Eventually word gets out and they are unable to find any one that will do their dirty work.

I firmly believe in Karma, what goes around comes around. Some times Karma comes quickly, other times it takes far too long for justice. The folks that run the nationals and make the decisions to take advantage of hungry contractors are going to have an extremely bad day(s) one day.





Speaking of standing up for yourself. I had a national that I was getting a lot of work from. In fact with out them for the last year I'd have been out of business. They were the back bone of my business. Suddenly they were trying the tricks of every body else and taking advantage of me. I stood up for myself almost immediately. Had a pretty heated conversation with a real B word over pricing. This person was 1000% clueless about the costs of business and very rude to me. I feel that I kept my cool and acted professionally.
What happened to me???????? ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! my work for them has dried up. No work at all since then.

Luckily I have enough work from other sources that I'm not hurting too bad .... *YET*

But I know its coming. 

The nationals will grind you up and spit you out without a second's thought. I trust them about as far as I can throw them.


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## Guest

God I miss those days...people with so much money that they wiped their a**es with it... 

I hear ya. I also own a lawn maint business. Quite a few years back some city folk moved up to "country livin", bought a nice home on 4 acres ( 2.5 lawn and the rest surrounded by woods ). They had me price out removing the woods from the woods. Clean it out they said, fallen trees & leaves & brush, etc. I gave them a price of $15k ( 2 wks of work ) and they did'nt even blink. 2 years later they bought a larger home ( $1.2 mil ) in the same town but couldn't sell the first one. I took care of both properties weekly for about a year until their " Country Club " friends talked them into using another service. It was good while it lasted ! Some of the money in this area is ridiculous. I had another account for a while where the wife had a $10k a month allowance from her snobbish husband to get the house maint done. I met the husband one day, introduced myself and he turned his nose up and proceeded to walk into the house like I wasn't there.
No zingers today on working with Brokers, just finished a $10k (8 day) job. ( interior painting, some vinyl fence, garage door and powerwash ) Don't want to get on the wrong side of Karma


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## Guest

Working for two in the middle and being on the end

All you are doing is helping these companies get settled in your area, I can not say that at some point in the future they won't start to lower your prices, but I would guess.

As far as being exclusive, you really can't believe that can you. I am very sure if this companies has lots of orders in your area there not going to put all of thier eggs in your basket. But hey, good luck to you.


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## APlusPPGroup

*Scam Alert*

I just received this in an e-mail. I don't know for sure if it's true but I thought I'd share it with everyone here.

http://jacksonville.craigslist.org/lab/2056208695.html

Linda


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## Guest

WE ARE ALL A BUNCH OF CHUM!!! FISH FOOD!!!

If you really trully want to know what caused the mortgage meltdown and the out and out fraud of the banking system & Federal Reserve then you need to turn off the computer and watch Conspiracy Theory with Jesse Ventura on Tru TV


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> WE ARE ALL A BUNCH OF CHUM!!! FISH FOOD!!!
> 
> If you really trully want to know what caused the mortgage meltdown and the out and out fraud of the banking system & Federal Reserve then you need to turn off the computer and watch Conspiracy Theory with Jesse Ventura on Tru TV






Son of a gun, its not part of my package.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Son of a gun, its not part of my package.


Yes, it is, Paul. You just have to put on 3x reading glasses and get out the magnifying glass to see the *ultra* Fine Print.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

lol



I've only got the cheap DISH package, and TRU is on an upgraded package.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> lol
> 
> 
> 
> I've only got the cheap DISH package, and TRU is on an upgraded package.


LMAO. I thought you were talking about the package you signed up for when you started working in preservation.:laughing:

Linda


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## Guest

Upgrade your package BPWY.....


----------



## BPWY

PM me your CC number and I'll get right on that. :laughing::laughing::laughing: :clap::clap::clap:


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## Guest

Anyone ever pull up to a property to take photos and notes for a bid at the same time as a competing contactor? Can you say awkward?


----------



## Guest

PS:

Thank you to all of you who care enough about our industry and our roles within it to keep being honest with me and smacking me back into reality during a very depressing, slow week and a half or so.

The work orders and bids are pouring back in from my brokers and I politely retracted my agreement with the national.

I had a pity me, it's slowing down, what am I gonna do moment but y'all stayed honest. Thank you.

Oh yeah, when they released the foreclosure stats this past Friday we learned that foreclosures were up 51% over October of last year in Hampton Roads...those 2 weeks were were really just the calm before the biggest storm since April of this year for us when we saw record numbers of vacant houses for our region...


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## Guest

We see the "competition" all the time. Go have a beer or a soda and compare work orders and notes and figure out how to bid different things so you "both" make good $$.
Nothing pis##s off the banks/servicers more than them knowing you know the competition.


----------



## Guest

I know a lot of the contractors that work for the same brokers as I do and we get along. I consider them fellow contractors...when I said "competing contractor" I should have been more clear...

These guys ended up being the mystery guys running around town underbidding everyone else by a LOT. It at least explained why they looked like bums driving a work van that looked like it rolled down a mountain...its because they're not making any money!


----------



## BPWY

I've rolled up on a yob and the competition was there completing the bid approval items that I was sent out for.

Completely different national too. The guy ended up covering for me last yr when I want to take a week off.


----------



## Guest

Coastal Breeze said:


> It at least explained why they looked like bums driving a work van that looked like it rolled down a mountain...its because they're not making any money!


Hey, when did you see me? :laughing:

I too run into the other guys at houses once in a while. I try to make conversation....and make peace. No need to stab each others back...that can only turn into a nightmare if the other guy don't care for you.


----------



## Guest

There's 6 or 7 of us that have been trying to figure out who these guys were for about a month or so now...i had no idea it was going to be a poor pitiful almost sad to look at set of guys.

Maybe they sleep in the houses they're contracted to since they price everything so low? Lol


----------



## Guest

Well heck offer to buy them a sandwich and they will be your favorite buds  

Have your local P&P Contractors Club meeting at the local favorite watering hole and discuss "how to make $$"...happens all the time here. 
Some of these ideas are shared with others


----------



## Guest

*When you set your standards low...this is what you get.*

Out doing winterizations yesterday and wouldn't you know it, the very last one we walk into had supposedly been winterized by someone else about 2 weeks prior. Now that pissed me off , but when I found out which company it was that supposedly did it, I new that it most likely wasn't done properly as I have seen there work before:whistling. Every job I've seen of theirs I would have failed if I QA'd it. 

Anyhow, what did we discover at this property. Toilets not cleaned and the sound of running water. But where is this running water coming from you ask? The basement, the Hot Water Heater DRAIN VALVE that was left open ......... ALso, they left the Gas Hot Water Heater ON :furious: and it was steaming. There was water all over the place and lots of damage :shutup:. While investigating a bit further we discovered that they also left the basement window open :no:. 

AMAZING..... This is the very reason people shouldn't do drugs then have sex.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> We see the "competition" all the time. Go have a beer or a soda and compare work orders and notes and figure out how to bid different things so you "both" make good $$.
> Nothing pis##s off the banks/servicers more than them knowing you know the competition.


There have been a few instances that I have been my own competition!
I have one broker that has me supply the second bid when required. I seldom get underbid when that happens!:laughing:


----------



## Guest

"There have been a few instances that I have been my own competition!
I have one broker that has me supply the second bid when required. I seldom get underbid when that happens!"

Love it, we have a Broker client that has had us do the same so we get the work. We also ran into some competition at one of the houses, they rolled up in a pick up with 2 push mowers to cut the lawn while we were doing a wint. Couple of nice guys, been in the PP business a few years, we talked for about 45 min. exchanged info so if need be we could cover for each other in an emergency.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> BTW ~ I'm currently looking for a reliable preservation company in Placerville, California. Work will include all areas within a 50 mile radius of Placerville as well.
> 
> Contact me at [email protected] and put "Placerville, CA" in the subject line so I can get back with you quicker.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Linda


I found a posted flyer in a home that I was sent to do a high end refresh. I want to do this type of work. I am starting a company in Arizona and will service Maricopa county. You have yet to answer me back. I have only one sourse of work comming in from a small firm. I can winterize and dewinterize homes,also do lawn service full service trashouts and more.In despert need of more work. Can you help?


----------



## ARPPP

*Deadbeats?*

Anyone familiar with The Promise Land Group out of Georgia. I am not receiving replies to emails, nor return calls regarding past due payments. 

Arrrrgggghhhhh....:furious:

Annette 
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


----------



## Guest

Sorry to hear that Annette. We have all been burned in this business at some point. Lost more $$ with some than others. Lets just hope that this company didn't take so much of everyones earnings and moved to the 

"Promised Land" :furious:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

robertdblr said:


> I found a posted flyer in a home that I was sent to do a high end refresh. I want to do this type of work. I am starting a company in Arizona and will service Maricopa county. You have yet to answer me back. I have only one sourse of work comming in from a small firm. I can winterize and dewinterize homes,also do lawn service full service trashouts and more.In despert need of more work. Can you help?


Robert ~

We had actually approved you back in October but you have not returned any of the forms we sent.

Now that you have posted, I have something of an issue here. You say you're just starting up but in all your correspondence you tell me you have YEARS of experience.

So do you know what you are doing or not? Your job photos were not the best but I see potential in you. I have several other vendors who service Maricopa County for me. What can you bring to the table that will encourage me to give you the work I give to others?

Also, you have to be patient. When you say, _"you have yet to answer me back"_, it tells me that I can probably expect weekly e-mails asking for work. We can only send work when the clients send it to us. With the vendors I already rely on, you may be waiting awhile for a good work flow. Are you willing to wait for it or are you going to be pushy?

I have a multi-function position being the owner of a company that provides preservation in 45 states. I don't have a lot of time to spend answering the same e-mails over and over.

And another thing you have to understand is that *I DON'T HAVE TO* respond to anybody. There are several good vendors also waiting for me to finish their reviews and reviews are something I've had to squeeze because I have had very little time lately, but your post made it feel as if I was being called on the carpet for not doing my job. Never, ever put me in that position again.

I'm not here to be popular so if people don't like this response to Robert's post, I'm sorry. I come here to join in and contribute to the conversations. A *PUBLIC FORUM IS NOT* where I conduct my business with potential vendors.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Coastal Breeze said:


> Anyone ever pull up to a property to take photos and notes for a bid at the same time as a competing contactor? Can you say awkward?



it happens to me all the time too....but i like to find out who my competition is so i can A.- find out if they are a legit company, and B.- turn my competitor into a working acquaintance. If you bid a property and it's over a certain $$ NTE amount then they need additional bids....so you can have either a 50% or 33.3% chance of getting the work depending how many vendors are needed to bid.....BUT if you are in cahoots with your competitor and you negotiate who gets what services on each work order (eg i get all landscaping and trash outs, you get all repairs)...and if a job comes in that's just landscaping then your competitor wins the bid and subs it to you BUT he tacks on a small fee and visa versa to him on repairs so both contractors get paid on every job even if you don't do any work....so you take your 50% or 33.3% chance of getting work to a 100% chance and sometimes you don't even have to do any work.....work smart not hard fellas !!


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Robert ~
> 
> We had actually approved you back in October but you have not returned any of the forms we sent.
> 
> Now that you have posted, I have something of an issue here. You say you're just starting up but in all your correspondence you tell me you have YEARS of experience.
> 
> So do you know what you are doing or not? Your job photos were not the best but I see potential in you. I have several other vendors who service Maricopa County for me. What can you bring to the table that will encourage me to give you the work I give to others?
> 
> Also, you have to be patient. When you say, _"you have yet to answer me back"_, it tells me that I can probably expect weekly e-mails asking for work. We can only send work when the clients send it to us. With the vendors I already rely on, you may be waiting awhile for a good work flow. Are you willing to wait for it or are you going to be pushy?
> 
> I have a multi-function position being the owner of a company that provides preservation in 45 states. I don't have a lot of time to spend answering the same e-mails over and over.
> 
> And another thing you have to understand is that *I DON'T HAVE TO* respond to anybody. There are several good vendors also waiting for me to finish their reviews and reviews are something I've had to squeeze because I have had very little time lately, but your post made it feel as if I was being called on the carpet for not doing my job. Never, ever put me in that position again.
> 
> I'm not here to be popular so if people don't like this response to Robert's post, I'm sorry. I come here to join in and contribute to the conversations. A *PUBLIC FORUM IS NOT* where I conduct my business with potential vendors.
> 
> Linda




lol Definitely knew this one was coming after i read his.....keep it social guys....business meetings should be done more personally (eg phone or in person) ...just my opinion.

BUT since your being called out miss Linda in public, what happened to tropical smoothie time????


----------



## APlusPPGroup

D&R Services said:


> lol Definitely knew this one was coming after i read his.....keep it social guys....business meetings should be done more personally (eg phone or in person) ...just my opinion.


I think most everyone here knows me pretty well. I think a few people expected a response such as the one I posted this morning.

I was online when the post came through and it upset me. I waited a few days before responding to give me time to cool down. It was the "you have yet to answer me back" part that got to me the most, which I'm sure you already know.

I may generalize an issue but I never discuss business directly between clients or vendors in ANY forum, public or private.

I don't mind people asking where they are in the review process but there will be vendors who I've rejected and I really don't want to post that here. I'm not the type of person who likes to make people feel bad. 

I don't sugar coat anything, and I'm very blunt, but I'm also very cautious about what I say to them, especially in public.

Linda


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## BPWY

So Linda, what about............................ :laughing: :laughing:


----------



## Guest

UUMMMM....Linda...You nev.... ah never mind


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## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Sorry, Mike. Never heard of REO Response. Maybe someone else has.
> 
> What about Safe Harbor Field Services? Anyone work with them? They've asked us to come on board and I need some feedback. I thought someone posted something about them but I can't find the post.
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Linda



how's their price sheet?


----------



## Guest

HEY I'm in the MIDWEST I have haven't heard a dang ............
Crud!


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> What about M&M mortgage services?
> 
> 
> They contacted me today.
> Said they are paying on the old HUD rate less 20%.
> 
> I had another company several weeks ago.... 3point lender solutions..... very hot to trot and said they had a lot of work. I paid for the back ground check and got every thing else sent over.
> Guess how much work I've gotten..........0.0 work orders. Thats the last time I'm paying for a back ground check prior to getting work.
> The next company that wants that can pay for it themselves and take the fee off the first payment.



How did m & m mortgage services prices look? Did they require e/o insurance?


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## BPWY

Their prices are about what I'd expect with a 25% discount.

I didn't see the E&O requirement, but have not looked closely.
So far all the companies I work for don't require it, I've got some thing
called "Products completed aggregate" or some thing like that along 
with my GL. Even Five Brothers was OK with that coverage.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Robert ~
> 
> We had actually approved you back in October but you have not returned any of the forms we sent.
> 
> Now that you have posted, I have something of an issue here. You say you're just starting up but in all your correspondence you tell me you have YEARS of experience.
> 
> So do you know what you are doing or not? Your job photos were not the best but I see potential in you. I have several other vendors who service Maricopa County for me. What can you bring to the table that will encourage me to give you the work I give to others?
> 
> Also, you have to be patient. When you say, _"you have yet to answer me back"_, it tells me that I can probably expect weekly e-mails asking for work. We can only send work when the clients send it to us. With the vendors I already rely on, you may be waiting awhile for a good work flow. Are you willing to wait for it or are you going to be pushy?
> 
> I have a multi-function position being the owner of a company that provides preservation in 45 states. I don't have a lot of time to spend answering the same e-mails over and over.
> 
> And another thing you have to understand is that *I DON'T HAVE TO* respond to anybody. There are several good vendors also waiting for me to finish their reviews and reviews are something I've had to squeeze because I have had very little time lately, but your post made it feel as if I was being called on the carpet for not doing my job. Never, ever put me in that position again.
> 
> I'm not here to be popular so if people don't like this response to Robert's post, I'm sorry. I come here to join in and contribute to the conversations. A *PUBLIC FORUM IS NOT* where I conduct my business with potential vendors.
> 
> Linda


I'd rather not work for someone who feels the need to come on to a public forum and treat me like a child either. Look up professionalism.


----------



## Guest

wncbuilder said:


> I'd rather not work for someone who feels the need to come on to a public forum and treat me like a child either. Look up professionalism.




Not worth your time, Linda. Just take a deep breath & move on to the next post. We all understand.


----------



## mtmtnman

wncbuilder said:


> I'd rather not work for someone who feels the need to come on to a public forum and treat me like a child either. Look up professionalism.


Professionalism goes both ways. Linda was called out for something that was no fault of her own. If someone cannot follow directions and lies about experience i think they deserve to be called out in public. I have had NOTHING but great interactions with Linda's company but i follow instructions.............


----------



## APlusPPGroup

PropPresPro said:


> Not worth your time, Linda. Just take a deep breath & move on to the next post. We all understand.


I'm already over it. After posting my response, I forwarded Robert the e-mail I'd already sent to him [back in October] with the forms again. I'm not an unreasonable person and I really DO see potential in him. His photos are not good but I can still see enough to know that, with a little guidance, he would become an integral part of our network.

I also told him that I'd responded to his post here at CT. If he has any further issues, no doubt he'll bring them up, either here or to me personally in an e-mail. He still hasn't gotten back with me so I'm not going to worry about it.

Thank you, though. I appreciate the kind words.


Linda


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## BPWY

Those of us doing BAC work are going to start getting a lot more initial secure denials.
They now


> ALSO PERSONAL PROPERTY IS CONSIDERED ALL FURNITURE, CLOTHES, TOYS, DISHES, ANYTHING LEFT BEHIND.


Along with denying the secure they will begin paying for a LOT of busted plumbing and flooded houses since the winterizing won't be getting done.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Those of us doing BAC work are going to start getting a lot more initial secure denials.
> They now
> Along with denying the secure they will begin paying for a LOT of busted plumbing and flooded houses since the winterizing won't be getting done.




1/3 of the houses i maintain for BAC have busted plumbing because they are such blithering idiots...........................


----------



## Guest

I think you have to pass an incompentency check in order to work in their securing center. Sending in a photo of the house and then verbally describing it to them twice is such a pain. Called them yesterday for a house that had 2 door knobs broken off, the doors were swinging freely in the breeze, and they wouldn't give authorization to install new knobs. This was a 5000 sq ft custom home and they just wanted to leave the doors open. We pushed the issue and after going 3 levels up someone got approval for us to put a couple knobs on to hold the doors shut.


----------



## BPWY

I don't have a camera phone that works for FREE. :no: :no:


----------



## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> I think you have to pass an incompentency check in order to work in their securing center. .





Similar to working for the gubbmint on most levels. 

99.9% incompetency is a job skill requirement.




As for the doors I'm so fed up with them I'd have probably said OK, thanks and hung up. Send in a trip charge and rolled on to the next one.
I'm sorry that I can't produce any more level of give a dang than what they are. My give a dang is busted until further notice.


----------



## brm1109

I went to do an initial and they wanted a photo of the street sign. The city I was in is missing about 30-40% of the street signs because the gangs take them down. 
I explained that I drove for 4 blocks and there were no signs. The operator couldn't understand how there was no sign and told me "well the last inspection 2 months ago had a street sign".
My response, "well that was 2 months ago now it is gone".


----------



## Guest

BRM1109, thats when your ride-a-long jumps out and writes the street sign on a sheet of paper and holds it up on the street corner. I know its only 1 sign but we have literally had to do this to quit getting denies for our uploads. Stupidity at its best.


----------



## Guest

Just wanted to check in and say a few things found out this week in school. Myself and 4 of our crews have been in a school all week to meet our continuing education requirments for licensing and have learned a ton. 

Unfortunately the school has turned into a big "recruiting center" for doing Property Preservation work.:no:

Here is the 2 big things that have "stuck out" :

according to instructor and I did see some paperwork to validate

1) 2 of the largest banks have signed contracts for all repair work with HOME DEPOT. Yes you heard right. They have signed up with Home Depots Contractor Registry list and are going to be sending work to this network for all the repair work. Instructor told everyone in class this is BIG $$$ and you had better run to Home Depot and get on the bandwagon!

2) All remediation work (water, mold, lead, etc etc) will be sent to an environmental licensing/certification group that will dispurse the work to qualified contractors. That is good in my opinion since this work is currently not being done right!

These were to 2 biggest issues that jumped out at us but the course isn't over yet.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> That is good in my opinion since this work is currently not being done right!





Damn right.


When I've protested about the improper way of doing it I was told "the bank don't care".

I don't believe it.


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## Guest

*New with Questions*

Hi I'm new to this site , but I have been doing some reading , in turn I think I have more questions than I did before I started. anyway" can any one tell me anything about a company called Asset Management Specialist ?
Are they on the level ???
Thanks,


----------



## Guest

AMS is like roadkill. They stink. 
I have to say I know of 1 (yes only 1) contractor who likes them. Possibly there could be more


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> AMS is like roadkill. They stink.
> I have to say I know of 1 (yes only 1) contractor who likes them. Possibly there could be more






Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while. 

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> BRM1109, thats when your ride-a-long jumps out and writes the street sign on a sheet of paper and holds it up on the street corner. I know its only 1 sign but we have literally had to do this to quit getting denies for our uploads. Stupidity at its best.


 
That is great. I have painted house numbers on a few houses but making a street sign is genius.


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## Guest

wow 72hours and not 1 post...has to be a record! Must mean everyones working and thats a good thing


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## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> wow 72hours and not 1 post...has to be a record! Must mean everyones working and thats a good thing


Getting ready for this........


5-Day Forecast 
Monday 
11° F | -10° F 








Tuesday 
-4° F | -19° F 








Wednesday
-4° F | -17° F 








Thursday
4° F | -4° F 








Friday
9° F | 9° F


----------



## Guest

*Get Started NOW!*

For the past two years my work has been mainly dealing with REO properties. The thing you should really be looking into is companies known as "asset managment companies". Property Preservation companies rarely have the inside track on things and rarely give you work. They are contractors just like you that specialize in clean outs, board ups, and winterizations. While I have done several of these jobs that prop. preservation companies do I find it to be more profitable by offering simple services like painting, flooring, and pool repair. 

The way it works is like this. A bank or other lending firm receives the defaulted properties. They then pass it on to a broker to manage and sell the property. Prior to doing so it needs to be taken care of. So the broker assigns an "asset Managment" company to the account. The broker then gives them a report on the condition of the home and what he would like to see done with it. The asset company then coordinates other contractors to bid on the work and they then choose those who fit their needs. 

First they will send in a poperty preservation company to clean out the house, blow the lines, and board up any broken or unsecure windows/doors. They also install a lockbox and put dummy knobs on the doors. Then they call in me. I bid the job, get the job, and get in and paint the entire place from footing to peak. Replace the carpet. Do a little finish carpentry and get the crew out.

Some Advice:
Don't try to underbid anyone. The number one thing these people look for is "when will it be done"
I have a strict mission to respond to a work order same day, get the bid out (same day) and get the job done as soon as it is approved!
Usually the comanies I work for give me a call and tell me that it is approved and that they are just waiting for the contract to be developed. Take the liberty to write up a letter of intent and send it out to them and tell them that you are going to start the work and that you will sign the contract when it is received.


Many people think that the housing crisis is passing and will be recovering soon. They are wrong though. If you do some research you will find that there is another type of loan program that will be causing thousands of other people to lose there homes within the next two too three years. Even without that, there are thousand of home yet to be touched in my county alone and we weren't that hard hit as many areas of the country. Don't hesitate. If you make any mistakes you will learn quick. get started NOW!!! 

Good Luck and be sure to stock up on the coffee!


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## Guest

DC3 said:


> Hi I'm new to this site , but I have been doing some reading , in turn I think I have more questions than I did before I started. anyway" can any one tell me anything about a company called Asset Management Specialist ?
> Are they on the level ???
> Thanks,


 
They are a great company! I have done I beleive three jobs for them. They have good communications and pay quicker than they say they will. Talk to the project coordinator that contacted you and tell them that you would like to become their exclusive contractor for your area. Good Luck!


----------



## Guest

mc handyman said:


> They are a great company! I have done I beleive three jobs for them. They have good communications and pay quicker than they say they will. Talk to the project coordinator that contacted you and tell them that you would like to become their exclusive contractor for your area. Good Luck!


I'm not sure about this one. It would take me more than three jobs to determine if a company was great or not. To me, you are in that "let's get inside his head so we can see how to shaft him" stage. But that's just my $0.02


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## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> I'm not sure about this one. It would take me more than three jobs to determine if a company was great or not. To me, you are in that "let's get inside his head so we can see how to shaft him" stage. But that's just my $0.02


 
Haha I understand your view. However, I am not a fan of mind games or setting others up for dissapointment. Yes, maybe I only did three jobs for this firm and maybe that is not enough experiance with the firm to trust them as a legit business. But here is the thing; I have worked with 27 different asset managment companies. I have seen the good, the bad, and allot of the ugly when it comes to how they run their business. As many have stated, the majority of these companies are somewhat "durr-da-Durr" when it comes to getting the right work orderedin the right ttime frame and following through with the process. The company we are referring to have been one of my favorite companies to contract with. Their communication, there fast pay, and their speed in every area is top notch. 

Now, what was your complaint? :no:


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## Guest

I can't speak for others but I can say after doing a lot more than 3 w.o.'s that my main complaint with ams is slow or no pay and the inept help that they call employees. Also understand that ams has their own employees that take the good profitable work and leave the marginal at the best work to the independent contractors. Extreme rural areas are not as effected as the metro areas....huh I wonder why....


----------



## Guest

DC3 said:


> Hi I'm new to this site , but I have been doing some reading , in turn I think I have more questions than I did before I started. anyway" can any one tell me anything about a company called Asset Management Specialist ?
> Are they on the level ???
> Thanks,


 
They are good for awhile but then they start making changes in prices and start including things that you would normally be paid for in with other services. The bad part is, they don't tell you they are doing this. You get a check 2 months later for less than half what you billed and then when you ask they tell you and I agree with the "get it in writting" because they say so many things verbally then act like you're crazy! They do provide steady work but the profit is very low. I would recommend them is you are hard up for work, but if you're doing good, it's probably not worth it.


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## Guest

For all you that are backfeeding power PLEASE keep it up! We sincerely ask that you please stick around for a few hours to see if anything is smoldering so you can call the fire dept before the house is to expensive to fix. Personally we really like the smoke damage claims but light rebuilds are not to bad either. This pic is of a backfed power on a foreclosed home this last Saturday. Apparently the crew left and the fire broke out in earnest approx an hour after they left...bummer since now we gotta fix the attic and the 2nd floor and if the crew had stuck around they could have used their fire extenguishers to help control it till the Fire Dept arrived. 
Its gonna be a good Christmas! arty:


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## brm1109

*BAC secures*

Well I went on 5 initial secures and winterizations for BAC. 2 denied and 2 approved. Each call took about 10 mins to get through. The fifth one, between getting busy signals and being on hold it actually took 35 minutes. I finally just gave up and left.
So much for that..lol As they say time is money and I don't have that much of either to waste.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Its gonna be a good Christmas! arty:


Looks like a great job!
I've bid restorations on *alot* more house than that, and still haven't seen one get done yet.
I need some of your luck.


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## Guest

Thanks everyone, I just want to make sure I'm not stepping in it ( if you know what I mean ) !!!


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## Guest

PropPresPro said:


> Looks like a great job!
> I've bid restorations on *alot* more house than that, and still haven't seen one get done yet.
> I need some of your luck.


 
We have done a lot of restores but this house....? I think it will be a total and should be demolished but....And heres the bad part......the adjuster will be subrogating back to the contractor so they said they want it fixed...Personally I will believe it when I see it. :whistling I guess the house is worth more fixed with someone elses money than an empty lot. 
Either way it looks like some decent dollars coming our way but 99.99% chance it won't happen till Feb/March till all the dust settles.


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## Guest

FremontREO said:


> ...Personally I will believe it when I see it. :whistling


 I hear ya. It feels good to at least have the opportunity to get the "bigger" projects these days. Still, good luck!


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## Guest

I've seen negative stuff about Safeguard but I'm thinking about giving them a try (trying to not have all my eggs in one basket). Can anyone give me a heads up on what to look out for?


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## BPWY

Go to ripoff report and search Safeguard. Count the ways.


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## brm1109

*Happy Thanksgiving*

I would like to wish everybody a Happy Thanksgiving.
Rich Bozzone
Bozzone Property Maintenance, LLC


----------



## Guest

*America's Infomart*

Wondering if anyone has experience with them? Received a couple of work orders, pricing seems good. Just wondering how they are on paying?


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## BPWY

Their checks are always good. They pay once a month so depending on when the work was done you can get 45 days out.
When you talk to them on the phone you get the impression that they are friendly happy folks and they want to help you. Unlike many/most other places where you are just a number and the quicker they can get rid of you the quicker they are able to go home.


----------



## Guest

Thanks BPWY...not a huge fan of working for nationals...but no choice right now. Just didn't want to end up with another non-payer. Actually trying to get enough business with local realtors so that I can drop the other companies. Any advice on that? I have collected email addy's of local realty companies listing foreclosure homes and sent out a few email flyers. Managed to get in with one real estate group so far. Much prefer working for them...less headaches and quicker payments.


----------



## mtmtnman

barefootlc said:


> Wondering if anyone has experience with them? Received a couple of work orders, pricing seems good. Just wondering how they are on paying?




I concur with BPWY. Been with them a year and they are one of the only ones i have no complaints with.............


----------



## Guest

Which company is this?


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## BPWY

The answer lies with in your grasp. 

Its even on this very page.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> The answer lies with in your grasp.
> 
> Its even on this very page.


 
:laughing: LOL, it slipped right by me. Must have been all that turkey!


----------



## Guest

*Ok...how about LEC (leadingedgecompanies)?*

Received work order from them last week...property was occupied, new order today. History of order shows occupied on last 3 visits, the latest being 3 weeks ago. Pretty sure it will still be occupied. 

Anyone have exp with this company? Ever get a property that isn't occupied? How are they on payment? Pricing seems fair...typically 240 to do one rekey, lockbox, winterize and initial cut (if less than 15,000 sqft).


----------



## Guest

Anyone from the Detroit area on here? Wanna know if anyone is familiar with the "Foreclosure Resale Store" for personal belongings.....
Very interesting concept to me and trying to find out more


----------



## Guest

I HAVE AN E/O INSURANCE QUESTION..

i'm having trouble finding brokers/firms able to write e/o insurance for our type of work....was wondering who had it and how much it's costing them monthly.....also any referrals would be helpful !! Thx guys


----------



## oteroproperties

I have York-jersey underwriters and the monthly would be about $200


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## Guest

*Andersen PPS, Richmond VA*

First, I would like to say hello to everyone on the forum here. My name is Rob Andersen, with Andersen Property Preservation Services, located in Richmond, VA. For almost a year I have watched this forum and I believe I have read every post..I finally decided I would go for the gold (or go broke, TBD) and I have assembled a great group of ex-home builders ready and eager to work.

We have decided to stick with local brokers and intend to tap into the rental property maintenance realm as well.

@Coastal_Breeze - If you come across this post, I don't think our service areas will overlap unless you're doing work in Richmond, or north of Richmond. However, if we should meet, I am all about the greater good and I am sure we can find mutually beneficial ways to work together, we're not low-ballers either, unlike some "companies" out there, we have insurance and equipment to maintain. 

@a1propertyclean and everyone else - You guys are truly amazing. Although this may be a place to share anecdotes and rants.. whether intentionally or not, the wealth of knowledge that you all have displayed on these pages is simply phenomenal. Nowhere else was I able to find unbiased, first hand information. It's here for the taking, and truly free. 

So thank you all. I look forward to future conversations.

Cheers


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## APlusPPGroup

Happy to help, AndersenPPS. Welcome to Contractor Talk.

Linda


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## Guest

*Forms and such*



a1propertyclean said:


> Happy to help, AndersenPPS. Welcome to Contractor Talk.
> 
> Linda



A previous post by mtmtnman mentioned a specific form that agents use for reimbursement - 571 misc....this is a FNMA form.

I was wondering what form names and numbers other services use for reimbursement purposes.

I am meeting with a broker from the area Wednesday and would like to be fully prepaired to overcome any reasons she may give for not working with us.

I intend to follow mtmmtnman's lead by holding checks untill the broker gets reimbursed. This seems like a great deal for both sides. I'd rather hold a guaranteed check then waiting for something that may never show.

Also, what other common obstacles would I be likely to encounter when persuading an agent to handle repairs and reimbursement rather than letting a national do it?


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## oteroproperties

It's been my experience with brokers that its better to not deal with the ones you have to persuade to use you.


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## Guest

AndersenPPS said:


> A previous post by mtmtnman mentioned a specific form that agents use for reimbursement - 571 misc....this is a FNMA form.
> 
> I was wondering what form names and numbers other services use for reimbursement purposes.
> 
> I am meeting with a broker from the area Wednesday and would like to be fully prepaired to overcome any reasons she may give for not working with us.
> 
> I intend to follow mtmmtnman's lead by holding checks untill the broker gets reimbursed. This seems like a great deal for both sides. I'd rather hold a guaranteed check then waiting for something that may never show.
> 
> Also, what other common obstacles would I be likely to encounter when persuading an agent to handle repairs and reimbursement rather than letting a national do it?





unfortunately, a lot of the time the realtor/broker doesn't have a choice when it come to vendors. It all depends who their client is. IF it's a bank that already has their own vendors then the realtor doesn't have a choice, and then again some banks allow their realtors to take charge of vendors. I wish i know why some do and some don't, i'd be rich ! but unfortunately i advertise to everyone as though they need the service and hopefully if they don't, then they might know someone who does. Referrals are golden


----------



## Guest

does anyone have any suggestions/referrals of national companies that have *good* pay sheet and DON'T require e/o insurance ????? :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

D&R you are asking a lot when you say "good pay and no e&o insurance requirements" :whistling E&O isn't bad till you go over the $250k a year than the rates soar. MTMTNMN found a carrier that rates didn't look to bad. We have York Jersey since I am confident that the policy is designed specifically for the Property Preservation Business but the rates stink.

AndersonPPS, Welcome:thumbsup:
Working with Realtors is a "tough nut to crack" but persistance can pay off. Osteroproperties is correct--the ones you have to persuade very rarely turn out favorable but your bio appears that repairs would not be difficult to complete for your group. The best selling point to present to the realtor is "We can handle all types of repairs in-house" which takes a ton of time off the realtors shoulders. Basically I have never found a realtor that wants to fool around with repairs unless you can "do it all" then they will consider doing the fixups themselves instead of wanting a national to perform the services. You will understand after you start seeing the "quality" of work most of the contractors are performing....that is not a "jab" at contractors till you realize what a difficult corner the contractor is in when the pay for correct/good work is to low to do "good work". That is the main reason we don't do much repair work for nationals. :no:
Realize that according to most sources the repairs for the Federal backed loans will not be done by realtors nor the nationals OR I should say bids through nationals will be non-competitive due to the discount structure that has to be passed on in the bidding process. As you continue and get comfortable in the Repair network you will qualify for signing up direct. 
Its a fun ride!
Good luck!


----------



## Guest

AndersonPP, 
I forgot to add: due your due deligence for property management repair work. Most States that we deal with require contractors to license and be bonded as a Property Management Company even if you only do contracting and this can be very expensive for both the license/bond and the extra insurance requirements. We do a lot of water remediation work in townhouses/condos every winter from broken water lines (freezing--Love the cold and we have to purchase the Property Management Insurance/bonds/licenses... Cuss all the time over this requirement but better than the fines---I guess


----------



## Guest

Hello,
I have thoroughly enjoyed reading and gleaning from this thread. I have been monitoring it for a few months and yes, I too have read every last post. I echo AndersonPP by saying "THANKS" for all the insight and tips. I look to forums like this to get the "pulse" of whats going on out there.:thumbsup: I have worked for mostly nationals, but have started working direct for some local banks and am delving into the realtor market.

I decided to jump on when I saw Fremont asking about the Detroit area. I have lived 30-80 miles from there most of my life and work in the area all the time. I'm not familiar with the Foreclosure resale store, but will look into it.

A1Property, you mentioned your son having issues with NOW Property Preservation in the Detroit area. If you want to touch base with me some time about how my lawyers are doing collecting the thousands they owe me and if I can be of assistance, let me know.

A lot more could be said, but don't want to take up too much space on the first post! Thanks again.

Ethan


----------



## BPWY

So Ethan does NOW still REQUIRE you pay $5000 up front to go thru their "training" program in order to get work?

They couldn't figure out why I wasn't falling all over myself in order to sign up for that.


----------



## Guest

That is what they wanted us to do at first, but after explaining that we were an experienced company they backed off. That probably should have been my first clue that they would even ask!! After conversations with several other contractors in the same boat it is apparant that these guys are professionals......just not at property preservation.


----------



## BPWY

According to the conversation I had with them I was the first contractor they offered the program to.
There would be other calls made that day but I was the first one.
At that time there was no option if you wanted to get in on some of their great paying work. According to them they had a lot of it too. lol

I told them at $500 I might consider it, above that........... forget about it!


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## Guest

It was a "new" program when they were telling me about it. Glad to hear you didn't get involved in their scheme.


----------



## BPWY

Just further proof that all keeps adding up to the nationals are INTENTIONALLY TRYING to screw over the contractor.
Common sense would tell you to keep the guys happy that are making money for you.
But it doesn't seem that common sense has infiltrated the halls of the national company's management offices.


----------



## Guest

There are still some decent ones out there. Unfortunately it seems that they have very little work for us and the so-so to poor companies have lots of work. I'm just trying to focus my efforts on the ones that seem like they can be trusted. Yes, that can be difficult.


----------



## Guest

RFS said:


> There are still some decent ones out there. Unfortunately it seems that they have very little work for us and the so-so to poor companies have lots of work. I'm just trying to focus my efforts on the ones that seem like they can be trusted. Yes, that can be difficult.




that's all we can do!!

I think it would be beneficial for all vendors/contractors on this site to put a top 10 list together of best AND worst national/preservation companies to work for and WHY.....it would take the guessing out of the game and most likely we all might get one or two new contacts from it..... Give me some feed back guys and tell me what you think?? I'd even be willing to quarter back it if enough of you are interested :thumbsup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Mike ~

Putting a list together of the Top 10 probably won't happen. PP vendors rarely share their best clients because it means less work available for them if others sign up with them.

The Worst 10 can be found within the 100 or so pages here at this thread.

We all share what we can without giving up all our secrets, including our client lists. There are far more people reading these posts than actually posting and who knows how much work people have lost already?

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

RFS said:


> A1Property, you mentioned your son having issues with NOW Property Preservation in the Detroit area. If you want to touch base with me some time about how my lawyers are doing collecting the thousands they owe me and if I can be of assistance, let me know.


Thanks, Ethan. Go ahead and shoot me an e-mail to [email protected] so we can discuss it. I think he received some money on some jobs but I don't have all the details. I don't know if he's working directly for NOW or through a vendor who does but I can put you in touch with him directly. No doubt he'd appreciate the info.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Mike ~
> 
> Putting a list together of the Top 10 probably won't happen. PP vendors rarely share their best clients because it means less work available for them if others sign up with them.
> 
> The Worst 10 can be found within the 100 or so pages here at this thread.
> 
> We all share what we can without giving up all our secrets, including our client lists. There are far more people reading these posts than actually posting and who knows how much work people have lost already?
> 
> Linda




I never said anything about posting....I don't know about other but i strongly feel sometimes you gotta give to receive....I communicate with a ton of my competitors in my own area and we share info on customer and other propitiatory information all the time....sometimes you gotta work together to stay in competition with big corps....it was just a suggestion


----------



## oteroproperties

I hear ya but Linda is right. I will talk all day about the majors, but there are still some companies out there that still even pay for photos. Those are the ones I do not tell people about. You might be right on giving to receive but most people in this business live by the "bird in the hand" theory.


----------



## mtmtnman

Anyone getting any snowplowing?????:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

hello fellow contractors I just joined about a week ago


----------



## Guest

platnumplus1 said:


> hello fellow contractors I just joined about a week ago


 
I have been doing property preservation for AMS. asset property mngt

for the past 4 months. anyone ever heard of them.


----------



## mtmtnman

platnumplus1 said:


> I have been doing property preservation for AMS. asset property mngt
> 
> for the past 4 months. anyone ever heard of them.


Yup. Many mixed feelings. So far so good for me but i am in a remote area of the country............


----------



## Guest

platnumplus1 said:


> I have been doing property preservation for AMS. asset property mngt
> 
> for the past 4 months. anyone ever heard of them.


WHO? Never heard of 'em:shutup:


----------



## BPWY

:laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> WHO? Never heard of 'em:shutup:


 
I was approached by someone from there co. But I have not made a decision yet . How are they to work for ?


----------



## mtmtnman

DC3 said:


> I was approached by someone from there co. But I have not made a decision yet . How are they to work for ?



Being your in Pittsburg i would say no way as they have company employees there. Where i am at there are no company employees................


----------



## Guest

I'm not actually in the city , I'm about an hour north. do you think the same would apply?


----------



## BPWY

Depends on how far the company employees travel.


If the company employees are working the same area as a contractor you can bet that the contractor will get all of the unpleasant and difficult work. While the company employee crews get all the easy ones so as to maximize company profits.


----------



## Guest

Ever heard of a company called Contractor Management Support out of Hollywood Ca. they claim to be a nationwide co, and also claim they have a lot of work in my area, mostly bank owned foreclosures . However I am very sceptical because there isn't much going on around my area. I checked out the BBB and I didn't,t find many good things said.
Does anyone know of them?


----------



## Guest

That is an awesome setup!!!!!


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> That is an awesome setup!!!!!



You getting any snow out by you???


----------



## Guest

This year yes, but really dont get a lot of snow that sticks in boise last few years none, I have some guys I network with in twin falls and CDA, Mccall that get a lot of snow. But I am not sure what they use, I think both have craftman riders with plow attachment and one uses a tractor.

I got caught off gaurd and walked into the office with 13 snow shovels and some hot chocolate this morning, Today was the first day we did them, I kind of got stuck on some bid work and missed all the fun.


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> This year yes, but really dont get a lot of snow that sticks in boise last few years none, I have some guys I network with in twin falls and CDA, Mccall that get a lot of snow. But I am not sure what they use, I think both have craftman riders with plow attachment and one uses a tractor.
> 
> I got caught off gaurd and walked into the office with 13 snow shovels and some hot chocolate this morning, Today was the first day we did them, I kind of got stuck on some bid work and missed all the fun.



Lawn tractor & blade won't cut most of my properties. I have 38 FNMA's and 12 HUD's currently to plow out, many of them rural......


----------



## Guest

we got standard sub homes, i get 99 percent of mine through FAS and reo a. ( i know, but I like them ) reminds me that my rig has been stuck in my driveway for last 2 days in snow and I paid someone off craigslist to plow my driveway today, i live kinda rural, and we are only talking maybe 13 to 16 inches of snow.

We had to bid a snow removal on a roof my first one ever, I think I might of bid to little because before I could finish saying 200 the lady from reo said approved. Oh well you got a nice setup, I am jealous.


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> we got standard sub homes, i get 99 percent of mine through FAS and reo a. ( i know, but I like them ) reminds me that my rig has been stuck in my driveway for last 2 days in snow and I paid someone off craigslist to plow my driveway today, i live kinda rural, and we are only talking maybe 13 to 16 inches of snow.
> 
> We had to bid a snow removal on a roof my first one ever, I think I might of bid to little because before I could finish saying 200 the lady from reo said approved. Oh well you got a nice setup, I am jealous.



Bought the plow this summer for 3K. 2 years old and hardly used. They run 5600 new PLUS install. Took me about 6 hours total to install. I also have a sportsman 500 with a plow for sidewalks and small driveways...........


----------



## Guest

I'm working out of philadelphia in a 15 to 20 mile radius The company (AMS.) is itself is pretty sound how ever they do have so people working for them that are pretty nasty people. So that may have a bearing on how well you do as far as revnue wize with them. I have a A-1 rating with the fannie mae brokers but attend to bump heads with some of the employees from ams so lately I haven't got any work from them for the past month actually. and when I call and ask about work they say things are very slow thats why I was wondering if any one else was geting work orders from them in my area.


----------



## mtmtnman

platnumplus1 said:


> I'm working out of philadelphia in a 15 to 20 mile radius The company (AMS.) is itself is pretty sound how ever they do have so people working for them that are pretty nasty people. So that may have a bearing on how well you do as far as revnue wize with them. I have a A-1 rating with the fannie mae brokers but attend to bump heads with some of the employees from ams so lately I haven't got any work from them for the past month actually. and when I call and ask about work they say things are very slow thats why I was wondering if any one else was geting work orders from them in my area.




Been slow here too and i know every FNMA property that goes through the auction in my area. There was 3 for me last month......


----------



## brm1109

*WHen they don't understand*

I recently bid and did a trashout and janitorial of a house where vandals ripped out most of the walls to steal the piping and broke the windows (client didn't approve boarding). And we also had to remove all of the appliances.
Well, after doing the work and showing photos of mopping and vaccuming I get a call that the carpets are still dirty.
We went back out and vacummed them again and explained that the drywall was imbedded into the carpet (this doesn't come out). Plus we had to vacumm most of the house since debris came in from the open windows.
Next get a call questioning why the appliances were not pictured on the truck and that they will not approve it. I asked them "did I sent pics. of the rooms with the appliances and then the same rooms without? They say yes but there not pictured on the truck. I explained that this is because they were loaded first onto the truck. The photos I sent show my truck (20 yds) completely full.
It must just be me.


----------



## BPWY

Every day that goes by I look for an exit from the P&P biz.


Is it any wonder why?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Every day that goes by I look for an exit from the P&P biz.
> 
> 
> Is it any wonder why?




You and me both my friend. By trade I'm a firefighter / medic but Vegas has been almost a billion dollars over budget for the past 4 years straight. I got laid off 4 years ago when i started this up and I'm sure i could move somewhere and get into a house but I've lived in Vegas for almost ten years now and I can't take the cold no more. Well can't and don't want to lol.....I used to also Personal train so I've been back in school Part time now for strength and conditioning, nutrition, bio mechanics/energetics so hopefully there will be some growth for me in the fitness industry until CCFD lifts the hiring freeze.....One thing I do know is this industry will still pay my bill for the next couple years but i no longer want all my eggs in one basket


----------



## mtmtnman

D&R Services said:


> You and me both my friend. By trade I'm a firefighter / medic but Vegas has been almost a billion dollars over budget for the past 4 years straight. I got laid off 4 years ago when i started this up and I'm sure i could move somewhere and get into a house but I've lived in Vegas for almost ten years now and I can't take the cold no more. Well can't and don't want to lol.....I used to also Personal train so I've been back in school Part time now for strength and conditioning, nutrition, bio mechanics/energetics so hopefully there will be some growth for me in the fitness industry until CCFD lifts the hiring freeze.....One thing I do know is this industry will still pay my bill for the next couple years but i no longer want all my eggs in one basket



I'll take cold over that blast furnace y'all got there. I cannot imaging what it's like wearing turnouts in the middle of summer down there!!!!!


----------



## Guest

Kind of sound like an @#@ here, but I hate to say part of the job we have is to show we removed and how we removed it, I always have my guys take a few extra pics it can't hurt. Any items big I get the pics in whatever is taking it away. I would have to say I understand it was there but not know but you cover your butt and prove you remove it by taking the pics. I don't blame the bank if they don't pay but would be frustrated if it was me.


Even on flat fee's I have my guys take the pics, really no excuses if they don't get the pics I can find someone who can.


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> Kind of sound like an @#@ here, but I hate to say part of the job we have is to show we removed and how we removed it, I always have my guys take a few extra pics it can't hurt. Any items big I get the pics in whatever is taking it away. I would have to say I understand it was there but not know but you cover your butt and prove you remove it by taking the pics. I don't blame the bank if they don't pay but would be frustrated if it was me.
> 
> 
> Even on flat fee's I have my guys take the pics, really no excuses if they don't get the pics I can find someone who can.



I see both sides buty the load pics are ridiculous. Some banks require them, some don't. Show the property completely trash free is all that should be required. Who's to say someone could show a load pic and then go unload the stuff and stash it on the property???


----------



## Guest

LOOKEN FOR SOME ROOF WORK IN TAMPA FLORIDA REPAIRS REROOFS WE ARE STATE LICENSE CONTRACTORS. THAT WILL WORK WITH YOU GOT AROOF JOB WILL PAY YOU OR YOU COULD HELP 
[email protected]


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## Guest

Just wondering...
Has anyone done work for Richard Rodriguez? His company is Integrirty (HA!) Custom Contracting and they are out of Pheonix AZ. He is a vendor for Cyprexx. He owes us $4500 and of course won't return our emails or phone calls. Would like to find out how to get a hold of him. And whats the best way to get your money from these cheats?


----------



## Guest

I was doing lawn cuts for a PP Company for the past 2 years. I gave a bid to haul off stove, ref, lawn chairs, toys, gas cans etc that had about 3 ft of weeds grown around them. Get the picture? Well the guy calls me and ask if I would come down on my price if I just throw all the junk back into the house then do the cutting.* This stuff really happens and the banks know it.* Anyway I said no way and the job was done the next day. I had all my eggs in one basket with this guy and he did keep me busy. Now I'm out of work. Just needed to share that.(not whinning)


----------



## Guest

thats what i'm talkin about looks great


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## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> I was doing lawn cuts for a PP Company for the past 2 years. I gave a bid to haul off stove, ref, lawn chairs, toys, gas cans etc that had about 3 ft of weeds grown around them. Get the picture? Well the guy calls me and ask if I would come down on my price if I just throw all the junk back into the house then do the cutting.* This stuff really happens and the banks know it.* Anyway I said no way and the job was done the next day. I had all my eggs in one basket with this guy and he did keep me busy. Now I'm out of work. Just needed to share that.(not whinning)


If its a pre -sale property than we get 25/cud to place all debris inside home or garage
Only if it is in the way of grass cut. The banks want it this way and its for your protection.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I'll take cold over that blast furnace y'all got there. I cannot imaging what it's like wearing turnouts in the middle of summer down there!!!!!





eh sometimes it's bad...mainly just the month of July is the scorcher...but wearing turnouts aren't bad. Your gotta remember we go into burning buildings that's a little bit hotter then July's in Las Vegas lol ....i grew up in chicago and cold was never a problem for me....I've been here for almost ten years and i'm just starting to have to wear a coat and the worst it gets here is maybe into the low 40's at night....but during the day in winters when the sun is out it's usually high 50's low 60's during the day in the winter....this is for me!!! palm trees, almost all year round swim weather or atleast hot tub weather !! if the economy, and school systems were better i would say it's perfect....well as long as you stay off the strip!! we leave that for the tourists


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> If its a pre -sale property than we get 25/cud to place all debris inside home or garage
> Only if it is in the way of grass cut. The banks want it this way and its for your protection.


 This house was already trashed out and the sales cleaning was complete..Obviously the junk was left outside from the trash out crew. I'm not a perfectionist but the appliances and other debris was to nasty and should of been dumped..It's not just this situation that concerns me it's the whole PP industry that is going down the tubes. Yes, There's ton's of work here in So Fla, if you're willing to mow lawns for 15-20 bucks a cut, trash outs 250- & acid wash 300- All those prices are 1/2 of what we got in 2007


----------



## Guest

*Roof patching/repairs*

I'm finding lately that even the (good) companies aren't wanting to pay anything to patch roofs. I replaced shingles on a 2 story, billed $300 (before discount) and they came back saying NO, $50 (before discount). Another company same thing, only paying $75 (before discount) to drive an our to patch a roof. It's getting pretty frustrating!:furious:


----------



## Guest

SWOH REO said:


> I'm finding lately that even the (good) companies aren't wanting to pay anything to patch roofs. I replaced shingles on a 2 story, billed $300 (before discount) and they came back saying NO, $50 (before discount). Another company same thing, only paying $75 (before discount) to drive an our to patch a roof. It's getting pretty frustrating!:furious:


That sucks! I did alot of roofing in the 70's & 80's and it was no problem getting $150+ for repair work.. What state do you work in? Did you have a cost plus agreement with them? My deal with GC'S was anything under $300 was a go and over 300 went to bid. I hope things turn around for ya soon. I don't know your situation but a friend of mine up in Mass still knocks on doors after 40 yrs in biz and makes a killing on just repair work.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Mike Hammer said:


> I don't know your situation but a friend of mine up in Mass still knocks on doors after 40 yrs in biz and makes a killing on just repair work.


Mike.......... I'd be interested in talking to your friend. I need good preservation vendors in Massachusetts.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Guys and gals listen....

Like the many used saying:

"Its not the game your in its how you play the game!"

There is 5 words the Service Companies and the banks hate to hear-all legitimate:

1) NO
2) EPA
3) OSHA
4) DNR
5) DOT

For a roofing bid (repairs or replacement): 

Due to OSHA guidelines installation of fall arrest harness system is needed for $***
Due to EPA requirement on disposal of petroleum based shingles we require $*** to pick up and dispose of these shingles.
Due to DOT requirements for carrying debris for disposal we need $*** to complete the job
Due to the DNR (dept of natural resourses who oversee the landfills here) we are surcharged for disposal of materials and we charge $*** to dispose of the petroleum based shingles.

And if they still try to chew you down then: NO


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> Guys and gals listen....
> 
> Like the many used saying:
> 
> "Its not the game your in its how you play the game!"
> 
> There is 5 words the Service Companies and the banks hate to hear-all legitimate:
> 
> 1) NO
> 2) EPA
> 3) OSHA
> 4) DNR
> 5) DOT
> 
> For a roofing bid (repairs or replacement):
> 
> Due to OSHA guidelines installation of fall arrest harness system is needed for $***
> Due to EPA requirement on disposal of petroleum based shingles we require $*** to pick up and dispose of these shingles.
> Due to DOT requirements for carrying debris for disposal we need $*** to complete the job
> Due to the DNR (dept of natural resourses who oversee the landfills here) we are surcharged for disposal of materials and we charge $*** to dispose of the petroleum based shingles.
> 
> And if they still try to chew you down then: NO


You missed a couple, Fremont. Code violation and health hazard.

They are attention-getters, just like yours.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

I suppose it depends on who the client is and maybe the part of the country you work in.


Health hazards and code violations don't even faze the players that I deal with in my area.


You would think that if a house is already posted as in violation and the grass is 4' tall that you'd see 24 to 48 hr bid approvals for grass cuts before the violation date...........

HELL NO, try 6 weeks or so.......... of course by now the city has already cut it and levied violation fines. Some of the towns that I've had the misfortune of working in assess code violations for a simple grass cut in the thousands of bux. 
And all I got was a trip charge to go take pics that the grass is now 2''.

Doesn't faze the banks at all. I'm not referring to isolated incidents. More like a habit.


----------



## Guest

*pinelands preservation monthly maintance*

hey guys i found this company on craigslst. has any one worked for these guys? there out of sacramento ca and say they contract to 13 states. 

*pinelandspreservation*.com/


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> You missed a couple, Fremont. Code violation and health hazard.
> 
> They are attention-getters, just like yours.
> 
> Linda


Good points Fremont and Linda.

Also helpful are biological hazard, explosive hazard, fall or trip hazard, shock hazard, and lest we forget EPA RRP requirements when appropriate.....


----------



## mtmtnman

*The 25-Year 'Foreclosure From Hell' *





http://finance.yahoo.com/loans/article/111500/the-25-year-foreclosure-from-hell


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Mike.......... I'd be interested in talking to your friend. I need good preservation vendors in Massachusetts.
> 
> Linda


Hi Linda,
He only does roof repairs and won't do any sub jobs. I checked out your web site. Lots of good info. If you need someone in the Palaka/Jacksonville/Gainsville Florida area for trash outs or sales cleaning my sister would be interested. She has truck and is a very good worker. 

Thanks,
Mike


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Mike Hammer said:


> Hi Linda,
> He only does roof repairs and won't do any sub jobs. I checked out your web site. Lots of good info. If you need someone in the Palaka/Jacksonville/Gainsville Florida area for trash outs or sales cleaning my sister would be interested. She has truck and is a very good worker.
> 
> Thanks,
> Mike


That's a shame but thank you very much for letting me know. 

In Florida, I have an overload of vendors in all areas and we have not really been able to use everyone this year. It was busier last year than this one has been. You can have your sister contact me, though. 

We never know where we're going to get hit with a high volume next. For awhile it was Kentucky, Arizona, and a few other Southern states. Right now California and Massachusetts are our super busy areas and we're bringing vendors onboard like crazy to make sure we have adequate coverage.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Need help pleaseeeeeeeee*



sandblandscape said:


> hey guys i found this company on craigslst. has any one worked for these guys? there out of sacramento ca and say they contract to 13 states.
> 
> *pinelandspreservation*.com/


i found this company on craigslist and they just sent me my first work order for tommorow. which is 10 grass cuts in my area. i checked 2 of the propertys and they are reo's. but i cant find any information on these people besides there website. i dont want to do all this work and turn out to be a scam. please help with any comments u guys may have


----------



## Guest

ok I will take a stab at this cause I do not know,

it loo orks to me there a sub contracting from a bigger middle man, I would say maybe I am guessing, I will just guess US Best.

What I would do, 
1. I need someone from that company I can be in contact with - liasion (SP?) or atleast one point of contact this is a deal breaker and I go no futher if it can't be provided. AND Yes I did this with FAS and have the same contact person


2. which I hope you did before getting the orders, understand the pay you recieve and when it is getting paid.

3. Do the work at a limited pace - at this time you only want 10 orders a week until a pay cycle comes through or whatever. I know what there website says what you must be prepared for, but that would only mean something if they paid your bill since your self employeed you get to make your own rules.

Thats it, I may or may not take a chance based on the above three. I don't know this company but if I did and told you they were bad, it should have some merit but hopfully wouldn't make the judgement you make working with this company, I mean you should know me less then them at this point. 

ok, Im off to kick the dog


----------



## Guest

Okay I have been and am still reading the 100+ pages pf post on PP. I have thought aobut getting in to some with two companys that have contacted me. I have a question I keep reading about "discounts" what is this all about, are these companys wanting a discount from us to do the work that already does not pay enough?


----------



## Guest

Roberts Ren said:


> Okay I have been and am still reading the 100+ pages pf post on PP. I have thought aobut getting in to some with two companys that have contacted me. I have a question I keep reading about "discounts" what is this all about, are these companys wanting a discount from us to do the work that already does not pay enough?


Well I will step up to answer that question :clap:

Yes they want to take a chunk of your money for them to provide you the work. 
The upfront amount is called a "discount" normally 20-35%.
The rearend discount is called a "chargeback" normally 100%. Yes that is when you take it in the rearend. 

Hope all is well in Gods Country! Love K-ville.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Well I will step up to answer that question :clap:
> 
> Yes they want to take a chunk of your money for them to provide you the work.
> The upfront amount is called a "discount" normally 20-35%.
> The rearend discount is called a "chargeback" normally 100%. Yes that is when you take it in the rearend.
> 
> Hope all is well in Gods Country! Love K-ville.








This is pretty much the post of the week.

I'd thank that post 100 times if I could.


----------



## Guest

Has anyone worked with "Make Ready LLC" I have a few work orders they want to send BUT have read some stuff on Rip Off Report. I sent the link to the "rep" and she assures me all was handled and that the "vender" was not proforming to standards,,,,blah, blah blah. You know the it is not us it is them speech, BUT wanted to throw it out here and see ;-) thanks


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> That's a shame but thank you very much for letting me know.
> 
> In Florida, I have an overload of vendors in all areas and we have not really been able to use everyone this year. It was busier last year than this one has been. You can have your sister contact me, though.
> 
> We never know where we're going to get hit with a high volume next. For awhile it was Kentucky, Arizona, and a few other Southern states. Right now California and Massachusetts are our super busy areas and we're bringing vendors onboard like crazy to make sure we have adequate coverage.
> 
> Linda


Thanks Linda, I sent her your web link. If you end up needing Kathy you won't be sorry. I told my wife that I could get work in Mass and she said "lets go" (home) lol....too cold!

Mike


----------



## Guest

Linda, are you looking for anyone in Northern Ca? We cover Shasta and Tehama counties. we are located in Red Bluff, 2 hours north of Sacramento


----------



## mtmtnman

So anyone ever deal with the Habeebs in India with Quickbooks Tech Support? My wife finally got pizzed last night and asked for someone who spoke decent English and they hung up on her. Just switched from Simple Start to 2010 and CANNOT get an accountants copy to work!!! My accountant was over here the day before and cannot get it to work either. Last time the wife used QB was 2006 and it was a 2005 Copy. She was basically an expert then but is totally lost now. As far as i'm concerned a paper ledger would be simpler. What a pain in the azz..............................................


----------



## Guest

*Safeguard*

Well after just a few weeks working with Safeguard P&P, we have asked them to remove us as their vendor. It was worse than I even imaged. So many jobs to be done for free in hope of getting bid approvals. We lost alot of money, especially in the locks, over a grand but it's best to quit now before we lose more. :no: I should have listened LOL


----------



## APlusPPGroup

joshuajames99 said:


> Linda, are you looking for anyone in Northern Ca? We cover Shasta and Tehama counties. we are located in Red Bluff, 2 hours north of Sacramento


Hi, Joshua. We are ALWAYS looking for good vendors in California. Shoot me an e-mail first chance you get. We've been pretty busy in Central and Northern California and can use several more reliable vendors.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Mike.......... I'd be interested in talking to your friend. I need good preservation vendors in Massachusetts.
> 
> Linda


Hi Linda,

I have full state coverage in MA and would be interested in speaking with you about the opportunity. 3+ years experience in all areas working with several different nationals.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Gryphon said:


> Hi Linda,
> 
> I have full state coverage in MA and would be interested in speaking with you about the opportunity. 3+ years experience in all areas working with several different nationals.


I can use a few more vendors in Massachusetts right now. About every other week is busy and we always need things done right away. Just shoot me an e-mail, Gryphon. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> I can use a few more vendors in Massachusetts right now. About every other week is busy and we always need things done right away. Just shoot me an e-mail, Gryphon.
> 
> Linda


I just sent to [email protected]

Thank You and hope to speak soon!


----------



## Guest

SWOH REO said:


> Well after just a few weeks working with Safeguard P&P, we have asked them to remove us as their vendor. It was worse than I even imaged. So many jobs to be done for free in hope of getting bid approvals. We lost alot of money, especially in the locks, over a grand but it's best to quit now before we lose more. :no: I should have listened LOL



well you need to voice that opinion on the safeguard website so their clients and CEO's can see ....posting on forums are good advice for newcomer (if they listen lol) but the outside world needs to know A: how these companies are treat vendors and B: so do the realtors who's commission checks depend on properties showing well. I know all my clients are enraged by these companies and are looking for a solution. 

My longest standing local broker and i talked last night, and he said he got two calls regarding the P&P vendor that cyprexx and FAS sent to his properties. The first one was that the neighbor saw the vendor get a vacuum out of his truck, go inside and plug it in, had someone take a picture of his holding it and put the vacuum back on the truck, and did the same things with the landscaping equipment and then left....

the second call was stating that some scuzzy person was breaking into the property. The agent called me to go check it out, YUP you guessed it, it was an FAS vendor......WOW he was scuzzy, all his equipment was litterally in a wooden oldschool tool box. His lawn mower was a manual nonenergized push one that spins around. His bush pruning sheers were a pair of scissors andddd his vehicle was a bike that he hooked a makeshift trailer up to.....OMGGGG !! i wish i brought a camera with me, he would so be on youtube or tosh.o right now :w00t:


----------



## brm1109

Sure and he probably charges 10.00 for a lawn cut. That is what we are up against.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> Sure and he probably charges 10.00 for a lawn cut. That is what we are up against.








Exactly right. Probably carries no insurance too.



I love it that FAS jerks are reduced to having to hire this level of person to get their work done. I'm not even going to call him a contractor. 
I'm sure he has a family to feed and bills to pay like every one else.



But back to FAS I'm glad they have this "professional" carrying their banner. If they weren't so damn greedy and such huge jerks to their FORMER professional contractors they wouldn't have to be so desperate.


----------



## BPWY

Word of advice concerning some thing that happened to me.



I knew better but work was a little slow and these guys claimed they had a lot of it.

Turns out they got NOTHING what so ever.


3point lender solutions contacted me saying that I came highly recommended and that they desperately needed my services. They refused to tell me who had recommended my company. I only wanted to know so that I could thank that person.

I'm betting that there was no recommendation but that they had just found my company name thru an internet search and were blowing sunshine to knock me off guard.

I ignored the red flags and got stung. 

They wouldn't discuss pricing at any level except to say once ALL the paper work was done, all the back ground info was in etc etc etc then I'd get a price sheet.
I paid $35 for a wasted back ground check and when the price list came its plenty cheaper than I want to work for, but about in line with BAC pricing.


What gets under my skin is that I had to pay for a back ground check that came back 100% clean BTW, and this company gives me NO work at all. N O T H I N G.

Next time a company tries that I'll tell to pay for it themselves and when I get work out of them I will reimburse them.


----------



## Guest

*General Liability Insurance question*

My policy is up for renewal, my previous agent dropped the ball and now I find myself with only about two days for my policy to expire. My insurer was Scottsdale and I might be renewing with them today, but I have a better offer for insurance from Lloyd's of London...anyone familiar with them? I know the best insurer for foreclosure clean up is Scottsdale, but Lloyd's of London has a better rate and they can write me a policy today as am having problems renewing with Scottsdale due to my agent dropping the ball and not communicating the renewal offer to me on time. Any advice will be greatly appreciated!


----------



## BPWY

Far as I know Lloyds is reputable.


----------



## Guest

Floridian said:


> My policy is up for renewal, my previous agent dropped the ball and now I find myself with only about two days for my policy to expire. My insurer was Scottsdale and I might be renewing with them today, but I have a better offer for insurance from Lloyd's of London...anyone familiar with them? I know the best insurer for foreclosure clean up is Scottsdale, but Lloyd's of London has a better rate and they can write me a policy today as am having problems renewing with Scottsdale due to my agent dropping the ball and not communicating the renewal offer to me on time. Any advice will be greatly appreciated!



what's your premium with scottsdale??? I'm with farmers who i'm sure broker it out but i'm only paying 708 annually for mine which breaks down to only 59.00 a month.....


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Sure and he probably charges 10.00 for a lawn cut. That is what we are up against.



oh i'm sure that all any of them get and are happy to get it....I won't go lower then 45.00 a visit for re-accruing...but that also include bushes, trees, blowing, trimming, mowing and so on after the initial......i miss the days when we had 60-70 a month to do...now we only have 6 ....times have a changed


----------



## Guest

There is no "real" insurance company in the states that offers property preservation general liability. I know everyone will disagree but there is no ISO classification for this business so everyone has commercial general liability policies that cover contracting orjanitorial or whatnot

Lloyd's of London does offer a property preservation policy only for this business
Its written for all the inherent risks for only this business
Understand though..
Lloyd's is NOT an insurance company but a syndicate
Thus you have surplus lines tax and you have to use a surplus lines broker
No big deal in Florida I wouldn't think
27 years on the insurance business and I carry Lloyd's for the p&p work


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> what's your premium with scottsdale??? I'm with farmers who i'm sure broker it out but i'm only paying 708 annually for mine which breaks down to only 59.00 a month.....






Mine is a Farmer's agent with Scottsdale underwriting.

$78something. Same price for 2010 as it was for 2009.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> There is no "real" insurance company in the states that offers property preservation general liability. I know everyone will disagree but there is no ISO classification for this business so everyone has commercial general liability policies that cover contracting orjanitorial or whatnot
> 
> Lloyd's of London does offer a property preservation policy only for this business
> Its written for all the inherent risks for only this business
> Understand though..
> Lloyd's is NOT an insurance company but a syndicate
> Thus you have surplus lines tax and you have to use a surplus lines broker
> No big deal in Florida I wouldn't think
> 27 years on the insurance business and I carry Lloyd's for the p&p work




what is ur annual premium for lloyds?


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> There is no "real" insurance company in the states that offers property preservation general liability. I know everyone will disagree but there is no ISO classification for this business so everyone has commercial general liability policies that cover contracting orjanitorial or whatnot
> 
> Lloyd's of London does offer a property preservation policy only for this business
> Its written for all the inherent risks for only this business
> Understand though..
> Lloyd's is NOT an insurance company but a syndicate
> Thus you have surplus lines tax and you have to use a surplus lines broker
> No big deal in Florida I wouldn't think
> 27 years on the insurance business and I carry Lloyd's for the p&p work



also i heard that some GL policies have e/o written in them somewhere someway....I haven't been able to clairify this with any agent or broker but like you said it's not a true preservation type of GL....does lloyds do that???


----------



## Guest

yes Lloyds policy is a General liability expressely written and the policy is clearly stated for Property Preservation General Liability. Premiums for the GL portion is approx $100 per month...they also write the E&O Policy and well that figure is a ton more....Depends on the amount of gross revenue. Ours is 5 figures per year. Terrible to me but good to others


----------



## Guest

Its that time of the year again:

BE Careful when thawing or working on homes. Another house *exploded* this weekend from propane tank heaters. If you are going to thaw with temporary heaters (propane or kereosene) do not leave the house thinking all will be ok. Nobody was hurt fortunately since nobody was there. Maybe this could have been prevented.

Personally we do not leave ANY heater inside the home due to the liability risk unless we hire it out to a professional Temporary Heating Company. 

Good luck and be safe!!!


----------



## BPWY

There are certain things your insurance isn't going to cover.

One is burning a house down, another one is back feeding electrical to the wiring via a gen set.


----------



## Guest

*Florida/ property preservation*

*new to this do you just cut grass and clean up.*
*is the jockey that sends you work call themselves a contractor?*
*Have you been asked to work on a roof or ac work any kind of plumbing? Are you a state certifed contractor? Most likey not. Have you been asked " can you sub out?" Thats acting as a contractor. Well that a felony in Florida.*
*The "management firms" cannot "sub" work to anyone because they are not "contractors". If they ask for money to be kicked back to them, then they are attempting to "contract" without a license. Florida has strict licensing requirements, as well as permitting requirements. :furious::jester:*


----------



## Guest

proline said:


> *new to this do you just cut grass and clean up.*
> *is the jockey that sends you work call themselves a contractor?*
> *Have you been asked to work on a roof or ac work any kind of plumbing? Are you a state certifed contractor? Most likey not. Have you been asked " can you sub out?" Thats acting as a contractor. Well that a felony in Florida.*
> *The "management firms" cannot "sub" work to anyone because they are not "contractors". If they ask for money to be kicked back to them, then they are attempting to "contract" without a license. Florida has strict licensing requirements, as well as permitting requirements. :furious::jester:*


You are so right! Most States (not all States have licensing) require the person "sending out" the work to the Subs to have to be licensed in that State. I know we are in each State we have crews in. 

Trouble is brewing in several States right now over this verbage and we know (insider information the Atty Generals Office and Dept of Labor is investigating this problem with Contractors and Service Companies that are not "themselves" licensed in that particular State.

If the Company sending out the work receives compensation/overrides than they supposedly fall under the Contracting Laws for that State. We will see how the dust settles on this next "chicken little" dilemma. :whistling

Example: I was in another State working this week and my very first home I went to had a main water line spraying water all over the basement, I called the City Water Dept for emergency water shutoff at the curb...Question#2 was my contractor number..... Crap I'm running all over pushing water to the drain and they want my "contractor #?????". come on.... But I do understand the situation and why


----------



## APlusPPGroup

proline said:


> *new to this do you just cut grass and clean up.*
> *is the jockey that sends you work call themselves a contractor?*
> *Have you been asked to work on a roof or ac work any kind of plumbing? Are you a state certifed contractor? Most likey not. Have you been asked " can you sub out?" Thats acting as a contractor. Well that a felony in Florida.*
> *The "management firms" cannot "sub" work to anyone because they are not "contractors". If they ask for money to be kicked back to them, then they are attempting to "contract" without a license. Florida has strict licensing requirements, as well as permitting requirements. :furious::jester:*


Out of curiosity, what do you do if you get a request to bid roof work from a national and they're not licensed? Do you fulfill the request, then do the work if it's approved without questioning the legality of the transaction?

Or do you report them for not being a licensed contractor?

Many, many contractors have gotten into preservation because of the slow down in building projects. They have "expanded" their services and can now do it all. They have become [for the most part] invaluable entities to banks, lenders, realtors, etc., and an integral part of preservation. I highly doubt that every national is licensed to be a general contractor in every state. But they are providing work.

So, if you are aware they are not licensed, then are you going to bite the hand that feeds you if you accept the work and something goes wrong to the point where they have a legitimate chargeback? Or will you stick with them through good and bad times if the volume is there and they've always paid you?

I'm just really curious about how contractors make the distinction with regards to who they accept work from and where the line is drawn. Your rant got me thinking and wondering so I hope you don't take my questions wrong. I really am just curious.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> You are so right! Most States (not all States have licensing) require the person "sending out" the work to the Subs to have to be licensed in that State. I know we are in each State we have crews in.
> 
> Trouble is brewing in several States right now over this verbage and we know (insider information the Atty Generals Office and Dept of Labor is investigating this problem with Contractors and Service Companies that are not "themselves" licensed in that particular State.
> 
> If the Company sending out the work receives compensation/overrides than they supposedly fall under the Contracting Laws for that State. We will see how the dust settles on this next "chicken little" dilemma. :whistling
> 
> Example: I was in another State working this week and my very first home I went to had a main water line spraying water all over the basement, I called the City Water Dept for emergency water shutoff at the curb...Question#2 was my contractor number..... Crap I'm running all over pushing water to the drain and they want my "contractor #?????". come on.... But I do understand the situation and why



Let me get this straight, You have water shooting all over, you inform them of this and they want your contractor number????? Most here would be extremely concerned about wasted water and send a guy right out. I had a 1st last week. A town i was doing a wint in actually had me come to city hall and sign to shut the water off. 1st time anything like that has ever came up and this town has 3500 residents. Most when i call show right up and cut it off on the spot. Had one a few weeks ago that they couldn't send anyone out as everyone went home already (2PM) because they all came in at 4am to plow snow................



On Edit: Fremont, i have no desire to deal with the big city chit you deal with! I'll stay out here and be a hermit im my little towns LOL! I am going to have to deal with y'alls traffic soon though as i leave Friday driving to Illinois, then to Florida and back home through Texas by the 3rd of Jan......


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## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Sure and he probably charges 10.00 for a lawn cut. That is what we are up against.


 If you said that a year ago I'd say No way! You're crazy!..Down here in So Fla the gypsies are cutting for $10-$20 a cut. No trim, No edge, No blow-off, Just cut and run!..The National Companys get the work and bring in the sub-subs. The local guys get nothing!..I paid my dues in this biz and it really errks the sh!t out of me to see this.


----------



## Guest

Not fun finding #'s when your wallet is 1/2 block down the street and your doing your best to keep the water going down the drain..
Nonetheless the water dept was there in 10 minutes and I was very impressed they got there that fast:thumbup:

Linda,
I don't think ProLine was ranting but stating a fact as he see's it. IMO

The days of the "middleman" service company sending work out to subs for the Nationals are quickly coming to an end in most States. I believe the reason is that there has been 1000's of complaints to the Respective Atty Generals Offices about these "middlemen" not paying the subs and all the other problems associated with the business. The old saying "a few bad apples" applies.

These laws have been on the books for a long time but has not been enforced. 

You stated "are you going to bite the hand that feeds you?"...I don't think most contractors are turning in these "middlemen" companies nor the Nationals for any violations but I do believe that realtors and the unions ARE....I know that as a fact in 1 of the States that we service that the XX Board of Realtors has asked for official review/investigation into the practice and are petitioning to have it stopped. Without adding even more regulation the States are looking at enforcing the existing law on the books. 

I can also state that we have withdrawn from doing business in every State that requires a license OR we have went and took all the testing and got licensed in each State the requires it. We figure that this year alone with schooling, testing, travel and motels that we have spent nearly $10,000 in the licensing process. 

1 of our Service Companies ( a large national) has required a copy of each State License that we do business in otherwise they will stop sending work in that State. We do not have a problem with that at all since if you are suppose to be licensed then we follow the rules.

This business has very very large $$ in it (not for us peons) but for the larger interests and where there is big bucks everyone is trying to get their piece of the pie. 

These rules will filter down to all branches of the P&P field...Now I just wish that ALL the rules were the same (ie insurance/e&o etc) from 1 company to the next so the playing field is more equal


----------



## BPWY

Mike Hammer said:


> If you said that a year ago I'd say No way! You're crazy!..Down here in So Fla the gypsies are cutting for $10-$20 a cut. No trim, No edge, No blow-off, Just cut and run!..The National Companys get the work and bring in the sub-subs. The local guys get nothing!..I paid my dues in this biz and it really errks the sh!t out of me to see this.







Even the HUD REO grass mowers do this. I saw one this past summer that was driving a rusted out Chevette or similar POS with a 3hp push mower, no weed eater and no blower or broom do a mow and go on a HUD REO.

This guy was probably a former bicycle driving FAS vendor.


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## mtmtnman

Mike Hammer said:


> If you said that a year ago I'd say No way! You're crazy!..Down here in So Fla the gypsies are cutting for $10-$20 a cut. No trim, No edge, No blow-off, Just cut and run!..The National Companys get the work and bring in the sub-subs. The local guys get nothing!..I paid my dues in this biz and it really errks the sh!t out of me to see this.




In the densely populated areas i can see this happening. My lawn route last summer usually took me between 100-150 miles a day to do 6-10 lawns. I would like to see them try that for $10 a lawn!


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## Guest

*contractor or not*



a1propertyclean said:


> out of curiosity, what do you do if you get a request to bid roof work from a national and they're not licensed? Do you fulfill the request, then do the work if it's approved without questioning the legality of the transaction?
> 
> Or do you report them for not being a licensed contractor?
> 
> Many, many contractors have gotten into preservation because of the slow down in building projects. They have "expanded" their services and can now do it all. They have become [for the most part] invaluable entities to banks, lenders, realtors, etc., and an integral part of preservation. I highly doubt that every national is licensed to be a general contractor in every state. But they are providing work.
> 
> So, if you are aware they are not licensed, then are you going to bite the hand that feeds you if you accept the work and something goes wrong to the point where they have a legitimate chargeback? Or will you stick with them through good and bad times if the volume is there and they've always paid you?
> 
> I'm just really curious about how contractors make the distinction with regards to who they accept work from and where the line is drawn. Your rant got me thinking and wondering so i hope you don't take my questions wrong. I really am just curious.
> 
> Linda


*well first i think none of them are contractors.at least not florida contractors. If they were they could not hire an unlicensed contractor or they would lose there license. Also taking about insurance/ i;ll bet your not insured to work on the roof gl for a roofer is hard to get and cost 10,000. A year to start a policy unless you realy low ball i've tried that one myself. And yes we want to take all the work we can get, all of us in this p.p. Biz . But the fact is if you are not a licensed contractor you cannot by law contract. They can hire you to clean cut grass but thats all you can not replace a window, or toilet, ac. Eletric switch- ceiling fan, siding, and roof repair. And they cant either. *


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## oteroproperties

All the things you've just mentioned can be done legally here in Florida under a handy man license with the exception of electric. You can even patch roofs up to 500 sqft. Floridas laws are based on amounts per job more then the scope of work. Through a partnership with a building contractor I am qualified to do these things anyway, but I know of very few gc's here in fl that are desperate enough to do P&P work through a national, and even fewer are willing to qualify a p&p company.


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## BPWY

I just heard that the FAS "contractor" on his bicycle finally got paid from them and was able to upgrade....................... a little bit. :clap::clap: :laughing: :laughing:
:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:



Now hes in the big leagues and is expanding into snow plowing too.



http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:KpWoyudmytCu6M:http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr162/sexymonkeygod20/*******-snowplow.jpg&t=1


----------



## Guest

Where did you get my picture from?:laughing:


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I just heard that the FAS "contractor" on his bicycle finally got paid from them and was able to upgrade....................... a little bit. :clap::clap: :laughing: :laughing:
> :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
> 
> 
> 
> Now hes in the big leagues and is expanding into snow plowing too.


:laughing:That's Funny!!!

The Cops in Florida made 3 different arrest for "DUI on a lawn tractor!" Bet they were $10 bucks a cut FAS / Safeguard guys too!...................:thumbsup:


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## Guest

*wrong*



oteroproperties said:


> all the things you've just mentioned can be done legally here in florida under a handy man license with the exception of electric. You can even patch roofs up to 500 sqft. Floridas laws are based on amounts per job more then the scope of work. Through a partnership with a building contractor i am qualified to do these things anyway, but i know of very few gc's here in fl that are desperate enough to do p&p work through a national, and even fewer are willing to qualify a p&p company.


 
under a hanyman license you can not 100%
your not license to do anything but clean cut grass tree work. You are not aloud to even cover a in ground pool with a structer with out pool license and you are not insured for this type of work show your license number. Or go look at myflorida.com
and thing are so bad, we would be the qualifield agent for someone we can not sub out any work that we are not license to do.or the state will pull are license for contracting with out a gc lic. Or i spend the ten bucks and get the hanyman lic


----------



## Guest

i have to totally agree and disagree with proline. Each state is different but most national's are holding us to strict guidelines and using us as scape goats but breaking many state and federal guidelines in the process. I'm just speaking for Nevada but to sub out work you have to be a contractor and in order to do that you have to be licensed in our state. So if a bank hires a company in Nevada to do work that's a company hire. But if the bank hires a company like safeguard or FAS and they sub out to middle man who subs out to a vendor in Nevada or safeguard/FAS directly subs out to a vendor in Nevada then they have to be licensed in Nevada and be a contractor. I've never worked for either and i'm sure you all know why, BUT my question is are either for those companies contractors and licensed in Nevada??? 

I know i've said this before but i'm going to say this again. Every realtor I work with are in the works of putting something together to get rid of national companies and put the option for hire back in the listing agents hands. They are sick of blow average work that in the long run hampers the efforts of them getting top dollar for their sale. I know GLVAR and alot of las vegas realtors are in the works of going to congress in cahoots with a few other western states including AZ and CA. The quicker we get this back in the hands of the agents, the quicker we can start making a living again. I don't know about any of you but I made a great living my first 2-3 years in this industry when I got 80-100% of the take.....rattle the cages in your neck of the woods, with your agents, b/c i know my agents are sick and tired of this


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I just heard that the FAS "contractor" on his bicycle finally got paid from them and was able to upgrade....................... a little bit. :clap::clap: :laughing: :laughing:
> :thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:
> 
> 
> 
> Now hes in the big leagues and is expanding into snow plowing too.
> 
> 
> 
> http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:KpWoyudmytCu6M:http://i480.photobucket.com/albums/rr162/sexymonkeygod20/*******-snowplow.jpg&t=1



nope cuz i saw him again on saturday and he's still peddling away...

OOOOH and i got a new funny story from saturday at the dump....i was unloading one of my trailers and the guy next to me had an old beated up astro van type of truck and an old trailer.....so i got to talking with him and he's got 4 employees plus himself that only do cleanings, trash, and lawns....8 hrs a day, 7 days a week...he's gets a flat rate of 300.00 a day....well basic math if he's paying 10.00 an hr and say a normal work day is 8 hrs that only leaves 30-40 profit before gas, insurance, licensing, so on and so on....BUT they are busy 7 days a week and haven't had a day off in over a year....


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> In the densely populated areas i can see this happening. My lawn route last summer usually took me between 100-150 miles a day to do 6-10 lawns. I would like to see them try that for $10 a lawn!


I did the same type of route but got $40-50 a cut..I started PP in 2007 doing work for a Home Inspector & RE agent..I never heard the term "property preservation"???... I Looked it up online and see that it's only cleaning houses, lawn cuts & board ups & whatever? it's basically Handyman work....:shifty:


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## Guest

D&R Services said:


> nope cuz i saw him again on saturday and he's still peddling away...
> 
> OOOOH and i got a new funny story from saturday at the dump....i was unloading one of my trailers and the guy next to me had an old beated up astro van type of truck and an old trailer.....so i got to talking with him and he's got 4 employees plus himself that only do cleanings, trash, and lawns....8 hrs a day, 7 days a week...he's gets a flat rate of 300.00 a day....well basic math if he's paying 10.00 an hr and say a normal work day is 8 hrs that only leaves 30-40 profit before gas, insurance, licensing, so on and so on....BUT they are busy 7 days a week and haven't had a day off in over a year....


Might wanna check that basic math again! Is this $300 for the whole crew?


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## Guest

Warren said:


> Might wanna check that basic math again! Is this $300 for the whole crew?



oops...typo...four members total...three crew members so he pays out 240 a day and makes 300.00 so profit before expeses is 60 a day or 420 a week....yikes !


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## Guest

D&R Services said:


> oops...typo...four members total...three crew members so he pays out 240 a day and makes 300.00 so profit before expeses is 60 a day or 420 a week....yikes !


 
sorry to say we have skilled trades ,call that are willing to work for 50.00 a day
thats very sad , people around here are in this kind of shape
150,000.00 dollar home for sale for 45,000.00

i all so spoke with a lady who's in the inspection bizz 6.00 per house 
whats that

i think the big ones loke safeguard need to be boycot . make them pay more at the very least:gun_bandana:


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## Guest

proline said:


> sorry to say we have skilled trades ,call that are willing to work for 50.00 a day
> thats very sad , people around here are in this kind of shape
> 150,000.00 dollar home for sale for 45,000.00
> 
> i all so spoke with a lady who's in the inspection bizz 6.00 per house
> whats that
> 
> i think the big ones loke safeguard need to be boycot . make them pay more at the very least:gun_bandana:


I cannot believe Safeguard pays only $10.00 for a grass cut, this is the first I hear of such thing. They did reduce their pricing this year, but $10.00 for a recut, I guess I should wait for them to try to pull that on me?


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## Guest

proline said:


> i think the big ones loke safeguard need to be boycot . make them pay more at the very least:gun_bandana:


The bad thing about it is that no matter how many people boycott these scamming nationals.....there will be 10 more guys with a truck, trailer, and drill ready to work for pennies.


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## Guest

Floridian said:


> I cannot believe Safeguard pays only $10.00 for a grass cut, this is the first I hear of such thing. They did reduce their pricing this year, but $10.00 for a recut, I guess I should wait for them to try to pull that on me?


Safeguard pays a PP guy $30-? and he then subs it out for 10 bucks. Of course the sub has no lic/ins and his goal is to cut 10 yards a day=$100-"not bad" eh! :w00t:


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## oteroproperties

I am not saying you can complete construction projects under a handyman license, for one FL doesn't issue Handyman licenses. They issue occ lic that say something like "non-structural under $1000 and no electrical" or something to that nature. As for insurance, I have a true genuine P&P policy (even covers legal fees) that is tailored to our specific type of work. The license I obtained (legally) to complete preservation work including, cleaning (which we do almost none of), cutting grass, trimming trees, reglazing (not replacing) windows, changing locks, and the occasional pool cover was issued by the florida tax collector. Now, as I stated earlier I have a partnership with a Florida building contractor, but have yet to need that backing. It was more a previous partnership that has not dissolved (from my days of real estate investment and rehabbing) My company is operating on the up and up. We exceeded 300k in revenues (from some of the mosted hated companies) in 09 and will do just under that by this years end. In any event the GC license is very simple to obtain. Try getting an EC license in FL!!

I'm not dumb enough to make this my only source of revenue. I have another venture (albiet started just recently) that I will be pushing very hard in 2011 to ensure that when the **** hits the fan I got an umbrella. I love this industry and always have so I will do this as long as its profitable, but i'm a business man first and foremost, feelings are a distant second to that. Things are changing as everyone knows. I don't think its as radical as the "all nationals are gonna die" view that seems so popular, but change is happening. Compaines like Safeguard alone generated over $500,000,000 in revenues this year, MCS? more then that, These companies run this industry and there is no coup that can be staged to change that. Maybe some change will come in favor of the contractors if enough people yell, but they have and always will run this industry as it sits. 

I also have something to say about the "bike contractor" your looking at it all wrong. If a guy is willing to get on a bike and go out and cut grass and change locks to make money then chances are he is a very motivated person and it won't be long before he makes something more of himself. Sure it could go the other way, but believing in the good rather then the bad in people has served me well so I won't stop now. This industry is full of people that were out of work and down on their luck. I'll go one better and say that 99% of the people that got into this business in the last 5 yrs were out of work before starting.


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## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> I also have something to say about the "bike contractor" your looking at it all wrong. If a guy is willing to get on a bike and go out and cut grass and change locks to make money then chances are he is a very motivated person and it won't be long before he makes something more of himself. Sure it could go the other way, but believing in the good rather then the bad in people has served me well so I won't stop now. This industry is full of people that were out of work and down on their luck. I'll go one better and say that 99% of the people that got into this business in the last 5 yrs were out of work before starting.










My only point of contention is that he is unprofessional in the extreme. Probably has no insurance of any kind and is a sad testament to how FAS treats their contractors and is a GREAT point of advertising for their company of how far you can go when you work for FAS.



If I was still working for free for them I'm sure that is about how my business would look.


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## oteroproperties

Bpwy, I'm with ya. And your probably right in those points.


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## Guest

The reason why we are in trouble in this nation:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/40342863#40342863

I don't normally watch this station but there is a bunch of truth here.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> My only point of contention is that he is unprofessional in the extreme. Probably has no insurance of any kind and is a sad testament to how FAS treats their contractors and is a GREAT point of advertising for their company of how far you can go when you work for FAS.
> 
> 
> 
> If I was still working for free for them I'm sure that is about how my business would look.



I have to agree with bpwy....the "bike contractor" most likely doesn't have insurance and a license, I'm working on finding out as we speak. And I'm sure he is motivated and possibly down on his luck and out of work. BUT to all the companies in this business doing it the right way, paying out the necessary expenses just to put food on OUR tables, and the big business who have a strangle hold on this industry will hire companies that hire "vendors" like that just to add a few more $$ to their profit margin is a slap in the face to the real companies out here....I don't know about all of you but a lot of us, me included, have been around from the beginning and have worked hard to get where we are only to loose most to all of it because we aren't' willing to work 7 days a week just to break even.

and companies like safeguard is only making 500mil revenues because of vendors like us.


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## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> The reason why we are in trouble in this nation:
> 
> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/21134540/vp/40342863#40342863
> 
> I don't normally watch this station but there is a bunch of truth here.






There is some heavy thoughts brought out in that clip.


This woman does not speak as most dems do. She is bucking some powerful folks in her own party to be trying to get this scheme investigated.


----------



## Guest

*New to REO Preservation*

Hello to everyone, I am trying to get some info. on a company called Mcaffrey Properties, I am a licensed Mass. Contractor thinking about doing some REO preservation work, has anyone dealt with them? This end of the business is new to me, can anyone recommend an outfit to start out with? I never knew there were so many until I started my research about two weeks ago.


----------



## BPWY

joseph Amato said:


> Hello to everyone, I am trying to get some info. on a company called Mcaffrey Properties, I am a licensed Mass. Contractor thinking about doing some REO preservation work, has anyone dealt with them? This end of the business is new to me, can anyone recommend an outfit to start out with? I never knew there were so many until I started my research about two weeks ago.








With increasingly rare exception they are all worthless, just some are worse than others.


I've worked for a whole handful of them because of my rural location no one national has a lock on the work thats here and get a few work orders from them. 
The excuses will BLOW YOUR MIND that they will come up with to deny payment or just out right screw the contractor.


If there is any way you can find enough work/income to survive without getting into the P&P biz the better off you'll be.


----------



## oteroproperties

Just out of curiosity how many of you guys only offer one type of service? Meaning REO services as opposed to P&P? If you do both what does the split look like? I.e. 20% P&P 80% REO or vise versa?


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## Guest

70% P&P 30% REO here.

More risk but better rewards (that means dimes instead of nickels)


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## Guest

You can register with the master contractors to do only some jobs. There are folks who only do grass cuts, Lock-changes, and so on. Just because you sign up to get work-orders dosent mean you have to be familiar with all aspects of the buisness. You can also do work for other preservation companies and learn from them once you have your equiptment. There is plenty of work out there for driven people. The hardest part of this buisness is getting paid in a timely manner. You would be surprised at how much work you can get with limited knowledge. Be honest dont pretend to know more than you do. If you can mow grass you can make $1000.00 a week then learn the rest. I would not try to get started until spring. If I can be of any help feel free to contact me at [email protected] I have a company Abshear & Assoc. Property Preservation LLC. It is by trial that you learn this buisness but never by error, mistakes can be very costly so do what you know and take time to learn the rest.


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## Guest

I did some work for macaffrey back in Sept. Fortunatly I didnt do too much as I never got paid. There were a total pain to deal with.


----------



## Guest

I probably have about 60 - 40 REO/PP by the time I count the work I get directly from Real Estate Agents. The direct work from the agents is SOOOO good. 

We had a sales clean last Thursday from a national that was killing me. Brand new, huge custom home in the Rizty-est town in Utah. We thought we were done but on Friday but the agent involved came up with more stuff to do. Then again on Saturday then again on Monday. The final items were that we hadn't wiped out the inside and cleaned the rack of a brand new dishwasher and oven, the top of the water heater in the mechanical room and if you got at just the right angle you could see spots on toilet lid. She was also worried about the little black bugs we hadn't vacuumed up on the carpet. I knew we had vacuumed really well already so I checked it out and took great delight in telling her they weren't bugs but that she had mice in the house. It took all my self control to not tell her it doesn't matter how clean the inside of the dishwasher is if there are mouse dropping around the house. And with that WHITE carpet they stand out pretty bad.


----------



## Guest

i have another fun fact of the industry to share.....i too got a sales clean for a big rittzie house in southern highlands las vegas today...BUT i got two work orders for the same house....one from the national company and one from the listing agent which is a long time client of mine.....the house is 3800 sqft with a HUGE master bed/bath....the standing shower alone is 10x10ish with 12 water sources. Well i got the work order from the listing agent first for 350.00 to clean it....then got the work order from the national later in the day for 75.00.....hmmmmmm which to choose which to choose


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## Guest

Now that's funny there...lol

It's amazing what these nationals want to pay for sales cleans.

You took the 75 and ran with it right:no:


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## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> Now that's funny there...lol
> 
> It's amazing what these nationals want to pay for sales cleans.
> 
> You took the 75 and ran with it right:no:




I was actually thinking about taking both


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## oteroproperties

Take both


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## Guest

anyone have BAC price sheet???? if so could you please email it to me ???  ty


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## BPWY

They some times use HUD rate, other jobs not so much. I have no idea why.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> They some times use HUD rate, other jobs not so much. I have no idea why.





hmmm hud rates ain't too shabby...i'll take that lol


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## BPWY

Except the trip charge is like $17. Are you going to work for them directly or for another contractor that works for them?


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## Guest

*New Jersey*



a1propertyclean said:


> And the problem with this is what? For what you have to do, it's a lot better price than a $15 inspection, which can take the same amount of time.
> 
> $75 is not bad for babysitting for a couple hours.
> 
> Linda


Linda, Please allow me to introduce myself, I am Claude Mitchell owner of Environmental Resources Property Preservation, we are a husband and wife team in Northern New Jersey. The counties we service are Bergen, Essex, Hudson, Hunterdon, Morris, Passaic, Sussex, and Warren. Dawn and I have been in business over a year and are fully insured. I have been subbing work from Safeguard and Altisource steady since we have incorporated, we would like to offer our professional services to you and your establishment. Please let us know the registration procedures to come aboard. I would like to thank you in advance for your anticipated cooperation. Sincerely Claude Mitchell ERPP (973)620-0476 [email protected].


----------



## Guest

We need to start the "Lindas new hiring Forum Thread"  

Gotta keep you busy Linda!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

lol, Fremont. I know. It's becoming embarassing, actually.

Claude [and anyone else interested], just send an e-mail to me. I'd rather not have this thread become all about me.

Linda


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Except the trip charge is like $17. Are you going to work for them directly or for another contractor that works for them?



directly for BAC


----------



## Guest

quick question....to become a fannie mae sam vendor for trash outs, cleanings, and lawn do you have to have a contractors license or will a preservation & landscaping business license do?


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> quick question....to become a fannie mae sam vendor for trash outs, cleanings, and lawn do you have to have a contractors license or will a preservation & landscaping business license do?


Contractors license. There is a 100 different items that you will need to fill out. Takes nearly 2 years to start but the earlier you get the paperwork in the sooner the wait begins.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> lol, Fremont. I know. It's becoming embarassing, actually.
> 
> Claude [and anyone else interested], just send an e-mail to me. I'd rather not have this thread become all about me.
> 
> Linda


Nah just ribbing ya:thumbsup:
You really should put a thread on though. Get some good guys and gals.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

lol. I knew you were poking fun, Fremont.:jester:

I just received an e-mail regarding a company who sells the electronic locks. The link is pretty lengthy so I hope it works for everyone. 

http://campaign.r20.constantcontact...UN36hECboz1-jxUqRHFWIWn3aBB1dJCRHcCcEAkV4VA==

The cost is the lowest I've seen in awhile so it might be a good time to stock up.

Linda


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## Guest

BOA admits not paying vendors, we need more media attention like this...it might be a few months old but still.....
http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/investigates-96773444.html


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## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> directly for BAC






I've heard they are nearly impossible for the "small time" operators to get on with.


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> BOA admits not paying vendors, we need more media attention like this...it might be a few months old but still.....
> http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/investigates-96773444.html







I've never believed it either.



> Teideman said he doesn't believe the bank's "computer glitch" explanation.






This is why I still have every photo I've taken in this industry.
Going back to Feb of 09 when I started back in.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I've never believed it either.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This is why I still have every photo I've taken in this industry.
> Going back to Feb of 09 when I started back in.




me too! I have everything saved and archived off site.....ever job big and small i still have.....but from what i'm reading that doesn't matter either....there's one company that's out 2 mil and he's been tied up in court with BACFS for three years now....the big companies have the lawyers and money to stretch things out....if you're out 20-50k, do you have the money to go to war with a company worth 500mil? they have more lawyers and money then us regular small businesses


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> me too! I have everything saved and archived off site.....ever job big and small i still have.....but from what i'm reading that doesn't matter either....there's one company that's out 2 mil and he's been tied up in court with BACFS for three years now....the big companies have the lawyers and money to stretch things out....if you're out 20-50k, do you have the money to go to war with a company worth 500mil? they have more lawyers and money then us regular small businesses






You make a good point. 
AND if nothing else it makes BACFS look guilty as hell. 
If they weren't TRYING to bang the contractors on purpose they'd pay up.


----------



## Guest

These is the one I like!
Not that this is good for them.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/NO-CHECKS-NO-BALANCES-92363609.html


----------



## BPWY

> *Two states sue Bank of America on mortgage servicing*


http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6BG5FA20101217





> Arizona’s attorney general is taking Bank of America Corp. to court, alleging that the company committed fraud


http://financial.washingtonpost.com/custom/wpost/html-story.asp?dispnav=business&mwpage=story&symb=BAC&sid=147233&guid={E3EEDC48-0A0D-11E0-B8A9-00212804637C}


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> These is the one I like!
> Not that this is good for them.
> 
> http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigates/NO-CHECKS-NO-BALANCES-92363609.html









> With thousands of these empty, foreclosed homes across the country, the "property preservation" business is booming.




Suuuuuure it is.




I haven't had an initial secure in over a week. Before that it was probably 2 weeks. If it wasn't for the handicap ramps I'm doing I'd be just like last winter. Little to no work.


I haven't seen a craigslist spam ad in months.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Suuuuuure it is.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I haven't had an initial secure in over a week. Before that it was probably 2 weeks. If it wasn't for the handicap ramps I'm doing I'd be just like last winter. Little to no work.
> 
> 
> I haven't seen a craigslist spam ad in months.



you and me both....This time last year i was flourishing..This year I'm on the verge of BK....I have one client that owes me 20k that's almost 90 days and he just contacted me on friday stating "we need to talk"....can't wait for that conversation......well I don't know about any of you but I am done sitting back being nice, "hoping" things will get better. I'm not the type to sit back and do nothing. I have a meeting with two big time labor unions heads this week and next week, one actually from teamsters. I feel we need a voice in this industry for fair wages, and a control on contracts. Because right now all we have is "take what we give you or we'll find someone who will". Big bank and corporations got us into this crisis and now since the mortgage fraud business is dried up they took hold of the clean up efforts and make billions while we break even (if we're lucky)......If you feel the same way and want to do the same in your neck of the woods please email me at [email protected] .....we desperately need to take control back before things get worse. FAIR WAGES FOR A FAIR DAYS WORK! ..... regular companies can't get away with not paying their employees or changing their paychecks to what ever they want....why is it ok for us?????


----------



## oteroproperties

I'm with ya but we are not employees. What can the unions do for contractors? I don't know enough about them to know.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Otero....... you took the words right out of my mouth. We are NOT employees and we've had this discussion before many pages back. 

I would LOVE to see what kind of constructive ideas we can come up with to put some sort of an alliance together that would affect change in the industry but I would rather discuss it at a private forum, not a public one where there are too many opportunists reading and not contributing.

Mike, you have my number. Call me after your meeting, especially if it's bad news. I might be able to help since I'm right down the street from you now.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

What ever became of that super hot to trot CO-OP a couple of months back?


It seems as if they've dropped off the map.


----------



## oteroproperties

I would like to be apart of any REAL talks and would even help finance some type of meeting or organization.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Otero....... you took the words right out of my mouth. We are NOT employees and we've had this discussion before many pages back.
> 
> I would LOVE to see what kind of constructive ideas we can come up with to put some sort of an alliance together that would affect change in the industry but I would rather discuss it at a private forum, not a public one where there are too many opportunists reading and not contributing.
> 
> Mike, you have my number. Call me after your meeting, especially if it's bad news. I might be able to help since I'm right down the street from you now.
> 
> Linda




I was a union delegate for the teamsters about ten years ago and i know with the teamsters you don't have to be employees of a company to band together....as long as you can start a brother hood to mainstream an industry they will back you.....back in the 70's the vendors for the major car manufacturers got together and formed a union....not saying this is the same way now a days with the teamsters lack of muscle in the industry but anything has got to be better than nothing.... we need to get as many vendors on board as possible and get something started and stop talking about it.....not only have i lost a lot, i used to employee lots of employees that have all fallen into sh*t because of this. They all have families like i have a family that is on the brink of losing our own home......I'll definitely post my findings on here as well as other foreclosure networks i post on...

and Linda no I don't have your number...PM me with it or email me with it..... and for anyone else feel to show me your support because this will benefit all of us !!!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Paul, I haven't seen hide nor hair of the co-op. Maybe they went underground or took the members money and ran, which would not surprise me at all. Anyone belong to the co-op and is it a viable operation?

Mike, I'll shoot you an e-mail. I'd like to talk to you about non-employee unions to see what the rules and regs are.

Otero, I'd be happy to be part of any talks, too, but same as everyone else, money's tight here as well. If I could get the clients to catch up the past dues, I might be able to arrange travel myself but also have a lot of other stuff going on that will require my attention [and money] for the next couple of months.

We might all want to hash a few things out [via e-mails] before we set up any type of meeting, so that we can keep it relatively short and on topic. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

The co-op didn't get any dues from me.


----------



## oteroproperties

Linda, let me know what I can do, for me money is there for the right purpose. I love This business and I will do anything necessary to revive it.

I suppose we will wait and see if there is any word on the union info. After that we will know our next step. It will take some organizing in any event and the talks for said organization should be private until it needs to go public. We might need to look into a yahoo or Google talk group that is only accessible by the organizers. We will have to play ball with the big boys for a while ie attending conferences and opening mouths.


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> Linda, let me know what I can do, for me money is there for the right purpose. I love This business and I will do anything necessary to revive it.
> 
> I suppose we will wait and see if there is any word on the union info. After that we will know our next step. It will take some organizing in any event and the talks for said organization should be private until it needs to go public. We might need to look into a yahoo or Google talk group that is only accessible by the organizers. We will have to play ball with the big boys for a while ie attending conferences and opening mouths.






You can be certain that the big kids will play serious hard ball.


The idea of them loosing out and getting the short end of the stick like they've been doing to the contractors for years is not going to sit well with the cushy big wheels that run all the nationals.


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> you and me both....This time last year i was flourishing..This year I'm on the verge of BK....I have one client that owes me 20k that's almost 90 days and he just contacted me on friday stating "we need to talk"....can't wait for that conversation......well I don't know about any of you but I am done sitting back being nice, "hoping" things will get better. I'm not the type to sit back and do nothing. I have a meeting with two big time labor unions heads this week and next week, one actually from teamsters. I feel we need a voice in this industry for fair wages, and a control on contracts. Because right now all we have is "take what we give you or we'll find someone who will". Big bank and corporations got us into this crisis and now since the mortgage fraud business is dried up they took hold of the clean up efforts and make billions while we break even (if we're lucky)......If you feel the same way and want to do the same in your neck of the woods please email me at [email protected] .....we desperately need to take control back before things get worse. FAIR WAGES FOR A FAIR DAYS WORK! ..... regular companies can't get away with not paying their employees or changing their paychecks to what ever they want....why is it ok for us?????


 


Mike,
I spent 12 years as a union member here in NJ until this mess, I remain in contact with alot of delegates and presidents ETC... lets chat and get the ball rolling!:thumbsup:


Claude


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> Linda, let me know what I can do, for me money is there for the right purpose. I love This business and I will do anything necessary to revive it.
> 
> I suppose we will wait and see if there is any word on the union info. After that we will know our next step. It will take some organizing in any event and the talks for said organization should be private until it needs to go public. We might need to look into a yahoo or Google talk group that is only accessible by the organizers. We will have to play ball with the big boys for a while ie attending conferences and opening mouths.




i agree with that.....why not set something like that up and keep it invite only....


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> You can be certain that the big kids will play serious hard ball.
> 
> 
> The idea of them loosing out and getting the short end of the stick like they've been doing to the contractors for years is not going to sit well with the cushy big wheels that run all the nationals.




do big corps ever give in easy?? that's why a REAL union or brotherhood is needed.


----------



## Guest

ERPP said:


> Mike,
> I spent 12 years as a union member here in NJ until this mess, I remain in contact with alot of delegates and presidents ETC... lets chat and get the ball rolling!:thumbsup:
> 
> 
> Claude



pm me contact infor and i'll touch base with you this week before the holiday.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

D&R Services said:


> i agree with that.....why not set something like that up and keep it invite only....


I have something set up already that I don't use anymore. Give me a day or 2 to reformat it and I'll send messages to a few of you to get your opinions.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

OK so I do a few QC inspections on other folks REO work.


Its a sad testament to the nationals that have driven the REO flat rates down to $400 or $500. I see some of the most pitiful jobs being done the maid service and initial trash outs. 
2 of today's properties are getting completely failing grades.

Both places barely looked broom swept in some places, dusting wasn't done, cobwebs were not vacuumed up. One place the yard wasn't completely mowed, there was still exterior debris and one of the two exterior sheds was still full of junk.

What makes no sense is that on the sign in sheet I can see who is doing the work. One property by the company can be almost OK, the next a complete failure.
I firmly believe it has to do with the way too low flat rates and the company doing the work realizing they are getting screwed in a big way.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> OK so I do a few QC inspections on other folks REO work.
> 
> 
> Its a sad testament to the nationals that have driven the REO flat rates down to $400 or $500. I see some of the most pitiful jobs being done the maid service and initial trash outs.
> 2 of today's properties are getting completely failing grades.
> 
> Both places barely looked broom swept in some places, dusting wasn't done, cobwebs were not vacuumed up. One place the yard wasn't completely mowed, there was still exterior debris and one of the two exterior sheds was still full of junk.
> 
> What makes no sense is that on the sign in sheet I can see who is doing the work. One property by the company can be almost OK, the next a complete failure.
> I firmly believe it has to do with the way too low flat rates and the company doing the work realizing they are getting screwed in a big way.


Unfortunately I would have to agree with you. Compensation is directly related to their performance. Fortunately we've had success in forming direct relationships with credit unions and small banks in our footprint so we've been able to survive during these hard times.


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> i agree with that.....why not set something like that up and keep it invite only....


I belong to a couple of groups on linkedin and yahoo! It takes a lot of time to keep up with them. It's a good way to get contacts in your area. I like what I'm reading here and agree something has to be done before we lose it. I've lost a lot of work to the 10 dollar a cut guys.


----------



## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> I belong to a couple of groups on linkedin and yahoo! It takes a lot of time to keep up with them. It's a good way to get contacts in your area. I like what I'm reading here and agree something has to be done before we lose it. I've lost a lot of work to the 10 dollar a cut guys.





any suggestions????


----------



## Guest

thoughts on sentinel field services out of Utah ???


----------



## Guest

is mfs still the best prices on lock boxes???? anyone know of anyone cheaper??? how about locks and deadbolts??


----------



## APlusPPGroup

http://bargainlocks.com has a special. I just got an e-mail today giving me a code to use to get $25 off my order. Have no idea how much the boxes are, tho. You'd have to check and see.

The code is 25off.

Linda


----------



## oteroproperties

Mfs still has the cheapest lockboxes but their knobs, deadbolts and padlock are more expensive. Also their flexible hasps do not come with hole blanks and they are more expensive then at bargin. However, it you call them and ask them and make a big enough order MFS will match bargins prices.


----------



## Guest

I'm looking for experienced help in CA - I think I have came to the right place! I need people with a lock supply for BAC and Others -- ready to work. I don't babysit, so please do not contact me unless you are ready to work.


----------



## Guest

*Pool security cover?*

Haven't had to do this yet, got a client wanting 18x36 pool covered with bolts into concrete/springs/safety cover. Any tips on best place to order one? Pricing suggestions? I know in the landscape industry, we usually double cost. (ie we pay 700 for plants, we charge 700 to install).


----------



## Guest

*Could you do this trashout for $1200?*

Allowable is only 600! Wanting me to do for 1200.


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> Mfs still has the cheapest lockboxes






:no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no:




Not really.




It goes against my religion to help the competition this much.  But http://www.buylockbox.com/ is much cheaper.
Their knoblocks are not rekeyable.


----------



## BPWY

From only those pics its hard to tell how much is there.


From what I think is there $1200 doesn't seem so bad.

How ever I'm sure that these aren't the only pics of the house. I'd tell your client that $1200 is good for 25 to 30 yrds. If there is more than that they need to pony up more.


----------



## Guest

thanks for the input...didn't post all the pics.

2 more bedrooms that look the same.
Outside has prob 10-12 cyd. Includes lots of cement blocks, maybe 80 of them.
Anyway to word additional charge for animal poo all throughout house? Will easily fill 2 lawn bags. ugh....


----------



## BPWY

See if they'll approve hazardous material pay.


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> :no: :no: :no: :no: :no: :no:
> 
> Not really.
> 
> It goes against my religion to help the competition this much.  But http://www.buylockbox.com/ is much cheaper.
> Their knoblocks are not rekeyable.


I buy enough material at a time that my cost is less with Mfs and I don't buy locks you can't rekey due to the ever chaging key code crap. Thanks for another supplier name though.


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> I buy enough material at a time that my cost is less with Mfs and I don't buy locks you can't rekey due to the ever chaging key code crap. Thanks for another supplier name though.







I buy a few of their knoblocks in 35241. Its a code that I use enough of all the time that its OK to have a couple that I can't rekey.


Their lockboxes are way cheaper than MFS.



Have you been doing much work?


Myself and every one else I know is way slow. I did an initial secure today.
First one in a couple weeks.


----------



## Guest

anywhere besides mfs supply to get the pool security cover?

Our work seems to come in spurts...$2500+ one week, $400 the next...


----------



## agcreno

D&R Services said:


> thoughts on sentinel field services out of Utah ???


 
Check Ripoff Report before you go there...............................Trust me, did that for a while...Bad JuJu.


----------



## BPWY

agcreno said:


> Check Ripoff Report before you go there...............................Trust me, did that for a while...Bad JuJu.






Whats this make?? some thing like 4 companies out of UT that are ...... well.... not real reputable?

What the heck is in the water out there?


----------



## Guest

Has anyone had any issue's with National Field Representatives good or bad?


----------



## agcreno

Katrinski said:


> I'm looking for experienced help in CA - I think I have came to the right place! I need people with a lock supply for BAC and Others -- ready to work. I don't babysit, so please do not contact me unless you are ready to work.


 
So tell us how you really feel...Were you looking for Craigslist?


----------



## thanohano44

I do work for Sentinel and have for close to 2 years. I have had no problems with them. they're honest people. they just don't cut you much slack. I even met the people at their office location. good people.


----------



## BPWY

Lets discuss 5 Brothers.



Any body having problems with them?


I started working with them last fall/early winter. Every thing was good up until Sept of this yr and things really started going down hill. I had very few complaints with them and got a fair amount of work from them. For a big company they seemed like one of the better ones out there.


Then in Sept they allowed another contractor to lie thru his teeth about my work. I stood up for myself and eventually at a cost of several hundred to me went back to the property and proved him full of **it and asked them why they took his word over mine. Of course they had no explanation. This was also about the same time that I was forced to cut my coverage area way back because of the expense of traveling. 

Of course just like that they cut 99.9% of my work with no explanation. In early Oct there was a property that I initial secured and winterized for them. 2 days later the water department told me that the property had been dewinterized by a squatter. I immediately let vendor management know and requested a w/o to redo the wint. 
Nope, not needed. 
Oh really??????????

Recently they came back to try and get me to re-wint for free because another contractor reported that there is water in the toilets and no RV anti freeze. I have to assume its the same lying sack that I've gotten screwed by a couple months ago.

Its impossible to discuss it like adults with them. The ignorance game is sickening, as it is with other large nationals that I've dealt with. They profess ignorance at an extreme level. Its an insult to me, and they are insulting themselves at the same time.
Just one small example of the ignorance routine is their claim that contractors DO NOT need to be bidding travel expenses on their bids. There is absolutely no need to worry about travel expenses in your biz plan/model. "My boss does not pay me to travel from my house to my job here at 5 Brothers. There is absolutely no reason why you should be either"
My comment was "you don't understand how business works do you?"
The reply was "no I don't, but that doesn't make any difference to this discussion! YOU DO NOT NEED TO BE PAID FOR TRAVEL EXPENSES! I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHY WE ARE DISCUSSING THIS".


I just think its a crying shame that a once great company has chosen to take the route of the other nationals and try to hose over the contractors that make their cushy life style possible for them.

At this point the only national that seems to be worth much that I work for is AIM. And I don't get nearly enough work from them.





Now I realize that greed and the desire for the almighty dollar is pretty powerful but it seems to me that if you take good care of the guys you've already got doing good work for you instead of running them off, that your advertising budget for hiring new subs would be enough lower to more than make up the difference in what you think you are making by banging your contractors. 
That seems like common sense to me, but what do I know?
I'm just a field contractor. Not an office worker.


----------



## thanohano44

barefootlc said:


> anywhere besides mfs supply to get the pool security cover?
> 
> Our work seems to come in spurts...$2500+ one week, $400 the next...


 
ushardwaresupply.com


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Lets discuss 5 Brothers.
> 
> 
> 
> Any body having problems with them?
> 
> 
> I started working with them last fall/early winter. Every thing was good up until Sept of this yr and things really started going down hill. I had very few complaints with them and got a fair amount of work from them. For a big company they seemed like one of the better ones out there.
> 
> 
> Then in Sept they allowed another contractor to lie thru his teeth about my work. I stood up for myself and eventually at a cost of several hundred to me went back to the property and proved him full of **it and asked them why they took his word over mine. Of course they had no explanation. This was also about the same time that I was forced to cut my coverage area way back because of the expense of traveling.
> 
> Of course just like that they cut 99.9% of my work with no explanation. In early Oct there was a property that I initial secured and winterized for them. 2 days later the water department told me that the property had been dewinterized by a squatter. I immediately let vendor management know and requested a w/o to redo the wint.
> Nope, not needed.
> Oh really??????????
> 
> Recently they came back to try and get me to re-wint for free because another contractor reported that there is water in the toilets and no RV anti freeze. I have to assume its the same lying sack that I've gotten screwed by a couple months ago.
> 
> Its impossible to discuss it like adults with them. The ignorance game is sickening, as it is with other large nationals that I've dealt with. They profess ignorance at an extreme level. Its an insult to me, and they are insulting themselves at the same time.
> Just one small example of the ignorance routine is their claim that contractors DO NOT need to be bidding travel expenses on their bids. There is absolutely no need to worry about travel expenses in your biz plan/model. "My boss does not pay me to travel from my house to my job here at 5 Brothers. There is absolutely no reason why you should be either"
> My comment was "you don't understand how business works do you?"
> The reply was "no I don't, but that doesn't make any difference to this discussion! YOU DO NOT NEED TO BE PAID FOR TRAVEL EXPENSES! I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHY WE ARE DISCUSSING THIS".
> 
> 
> I just think its a crying shame that a once great company has chosen to take the route of the other nationals and try to hose over the contractors that make their cushy life style possible for them.
> 
> At this point the only national that seems to be worth much that I work for is AIM. And I don't get nearly enough work from them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Now I realize that greed and the desire for the almighty dollar is pretty powerful but it seems to me that if you take good care of the guys you've already got doing good work for you instead of running them off, that your advertising budget for hiring new subs would be enough lower to more than make up the difference in what you think you are making by banging your contractors.
> That seems like common sense to me, but what do I know?
> I'm just a field contractor. Not an office worker.


 

wow, this is news to me. I havent had any problems working for these guys. where in WY do you service? I do some work in UT and was thinking of expanding into WY and CO. I have had a contractor sabotage my work in Eastern Utah...take out my dead bolts and locks. installed plate covers in their place...take my padlocks etc. have you experienced this in your area's?


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> wow, this is news to me. I havent had any problems working for these guys. where in WY do you service? I do some work in UT and was thinking of expanding into WY and CO. I have had a contractor sabotage my work in Eastern Utah...take out my dead bolts and locks. installed plate covers in their place...take my padlocks etc. have you experienced this in your area's?






Eastern WY.


Far as I know they have VERY little work in WY. I've never gotten any work in my home county from them. No body there knows why. I don't buy it. They just don't want to tell.



I don't feel that I'm being sour grapes against them. I'm genuinely hurt that they are treating me like this after I did the best I could for them.


There are a lot more things that I could say about the jerk that lied about me but I'm not gonna say much. I am highly suspicious that he kicked a sliding door in to make work. And I'm also highly suspicious that he stole all the minor personal prop that was left at that house when the H/O moved out. Dirt bike that looked like it didn't run, antique wagon wheels, couple of small gas cans, 6' fiberglass ladder, made in china guitar, nice boom box. Items like that. Using 5 Bros logic it had to be him, according to the sign in sheet nobody else was there.
That was the logic they used to justify his lies about my wint job. His was the first name on the sign in sheet after mine so that means that it was impossible for some one to enter the house and dewint. (two different properties they are claiming I didn't properly wint)



As for missing locks, deadbolts and lock boxes............ with guys like this...... ANY thing is possible.
I had some one steal a lockbox off of one of my properties. I found it and reported it. Luckily they paid me for installing a new one.


I don't work that way, never have.




I hope you don't have to experience the treatment that I have. 
Up until Sept of this yr I never had issues either. This is why I don't understand whats happened to them.




I also know of a couple other contractors that got their debris removal bid approvals chopped way back from them after the guys paid their help and the dump.


----------



## agcreno

thanohano44 said:


> I do work for Sentinel and have for close to 2 years. I have had no problems with them. they're honest people. they just don't cut you much slack. I even met the people at their office location. good people.


 
Good luck my friend...


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Anyway to word additional charge for animal poo all throughout house? Will easily fill 2 lawn bags. ugh....


Health hazard: dog feces throughout interior.

Don't forget, if the carpets are soiled by the animal that were living there, you may have to remove the carpet and pad and haul it off to the dump. That will need to be bid, too.

Good luck with that one. We've had many that were actually worse than that. That's no easy job.

Linda


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> thanks for the input...didn't post all the pics.
> 
> 2 more bedrooms that look the same.
> Outside has prob 10-12 cyd. Includes lots of cement blocks, maybe 80 of them.
> Anyway to word additional charge for animal poo all throughout house? Will easily fill 2 lawn bags. ugh....


Removal of biohazard materials that appear to be canine feces. Usage of PPE required. Also, as seen in the pics the property is filled with raw garbage that may have rat or mouse infestation that will also require PPE during the hazardous material removal. Price is quoted at $75/cyd for removal, bagging, signage attached to bags for hazardous and proper disposal. Dept of Health "MAY" be contacted if we fill it is required 

There ya go. Make some money. But be wearing your PPE. Look up PPE if you don't know or look at pic


----------



## mtmtnman

Golden Gate said:


> Has anyone had any issue's with National Field Representatives good or bad?



So far so good. Honest and upfront. Full HUD rates and about 40 days to my 1st check with them......


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Eastern WY.
> 
> 
> Far as I know they have VERY little work in WY. I've never gotten any work in my home county from them. No body there knows why. I don't buy it. They just don't want to tell.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't feel that I'm being sour grapes against them. I'm genuinely hurt that they are treating me like this after I did the best I could for them.
> 
> 
> There are a lot more things that I could say about the jerk that lied about me but I'm not gonna say much. I am highly suspicious that he kicked a sliding door in to make work. And I'm also highly suspicious that he stole all the minor personal prop that was left at that house when the H/O moved out. Dirt bike that looked like it didn't run, antique wagon wheels, couple of small gas cans, 6' fiberglass ladder, made in china guitar, nice boom box. Items like that. Using 5 Bros logic it had to be him, according to the sign in sheet nobody else was there.
> That was the logic they used to justify his lies about my wint job. His was the first name on the sign in sheet after mine so that means that it was impossible for some one to enter the house and dewint. (two different properties they are claiming I didn't properly wint)
> 
> 
> 
> As for missing locks, deadbolts and lock boxes............ with guys like this...... ANY thing is possible.
> I had some one steal a lockbox off of one of my properties. I found it and reported it. Luckily they paid me for installing a new one.
> 
> 
> I don't work that way, never have.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I hope you don't have to experience the treatment that I have.
> Up until Sept of this yr I never had issues either. This is why I don't understand whats happened to them.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I also know of a couple other contractors that got their debris removal bid approvals chopped way back from them after the guys paid their help and the dump.


 
oh I know all about other contractors doing this. I send my QC reps out to check out our properties anywhere from 24-72 hrs after the job has been completed to only find other contractors that works for the same client removing items. I have my team take pictures and then ask for id's and work orders....8 out of 10 times these people dont have it.

whats worse, is that I see these people even after I report what they have been doing.


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> whats worse, is that I see these people even after I report what they have been doing.










Thats unforgivable on the part of the national.


If the banks had any clue how badly the nationals are banging them 10 ways from sunday they'd be in an uproar. 

But its all kept hush hush and as long as the kickback checks don't bounce they'll keep ignoring whats going on.

Like I've said before the nationals and the banks both are in bed with each other.
Go look at the nationals that post their upper echelon officer's positions. 
This guy worked for 10 yrs at this bank before coming to be president of _____________ national mortgage co.
That gal used to work at so and so bank for 20 yrs before coming to work for _______________ field service co as the CFFO. etc etc etc etc etc



I don't know what the answer is. Some thing has to give and soon.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> So far so good. Honest and upfront. Full HUD rates and about 40 days to my 1st check with them......






10 months from now let us know again.



5 Bros was good for about that long too.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> But be wearing your PPE. Look up PPE if you don't know or look at pic


PPE= Poopy Protective Equipment?:thumbup:


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> PPE= Poopy Protective Equipment?:thumbup:



Hey 815, WTF is with people in your area??? They can't drive for chit! Came out of Rockford last night heading for Byron and the idjits where going 10-15 mph!!!! No reason to go this slow. It's just friggen snow!!! I hammered on the brakes in my expedition and never even got the anti-lock brakes to kick in. I am slowly remembering why i moved away from this hole 12 years ago. BTW, The Stone Eagle has great food! It's in the old Cheddars building off of State Street............


----------



## Guest

Welcome to Crackford! Though I work in the general area....i'm sure glad I don't live in it! Have not made it to The Stone Eagle yet but I heard its good. If you are going to be around for a while check out Backyard Bar & Grill in either Cherry Valley or Loves Park. That's some good food @ good prices. 

So, you havin' fun in our snow? Take some back with you.....matter of fact take it all so I can hop on 2 wheels again!


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> I buy a few of their knoblocks in 35241. Its a code that I use enough of all the time that its OK to have a couple that I can't rekey.
> 
> Their lockboxes are way cheaper than MFS.
> 
> Have you been doing much work?
> 
> Myself and every one else I know is way slow. I did an initial secure today.
> First one in a couple weeks.


My work comes in spurts also. Just picked up a little. Got about 5 securings in the last day or so. Doing a lot of code violation work for brokers right now and we have about 250 grass cuts (still cutting here in Fla) which helps keep us busy. I've also been doing some evictions for brokers that all seem to be vacant and already initially secured by either safeguard or BOA. Seems like we are pretty well diversified right now. It was a way different story for us this time last year!! We almost went under.


----------



## Guest

_Health hazard: dog feces throughout interior.

Don't forget, if the carpets are soiled by the animal that were living there, you may have to remove the carpet and pad and haul it off to the dump. That will need to be bid, too.

Good luck with that one. We've had many that were actually worse than that. That's no easy job._

This is actually for a realtor, she said she doubts the bank will put much money in this one...they never want to replace anything. They aren't even planning on having it cleaned 

That does bring me to another question...

I know the nationals are all about not removing personal property...but my realtors don't seem a bit concerned about it. I try to make sure I am covered by getting them to state specifically in our email correspondence that they do want these items disposed of. Should I be doing something else to protect myself in that regard?

PPE :laughing:


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> ushardwaresupply.com


thanks! Cheaper than mfs too.


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> My work comes in spurts also. Just picked up a little. Got about 5 securings in the last day or so. Doing a lot of code violation work for brokers right now and we have about 250 grass cuts (still cutting here in Fla) which helps keep us busy. I've also been doing some evictions for brokers that all seem to be vacant and already initially secured by either safeguard or BOA. Seems like we are pretty well diversified right now. It was a way different story for us this time last year!! We almost went under.


09' was quite the year wasn't it? In my 15 years of kickin a$$, I've never seen things so slow across the boards!


----------



## Guest

_Quote:
Originally Posted by oteroproperties 
My work comes in spurts also. Just picked up a little. Got about 5 securings in the last day or so. Doing a lot of code violation work for brokers right now and we have about 250 grass cuts (still cutting here in Fla) which helps keep us busy. I've also been doing some evictions for brokers that all seem to be vacant and already initially secured by either safeguard or BOA. Seems like we are pretty well diversified right now. It was a way different story for us this time last year!! We almost went under._

Miss the grass cuts here in South Carolina...did a couple of hundred per week over the summer. Now just doing winterizations, initial secures, and the occasional trashout with national companies. Most of our work the past few months has been with local realtors. Do like not having to wait 30 days to get paid, though. Most of the realtors pay within the week, and require very little in the way of pics.


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> _Quote:_
> _Originally Posted by oteroproperties _
> _My work comes in spurts also. Just picked up a little. Got about 5 securings in the last day or so. Doing a lot of code violation work for brokers right now and we have about 250 grass cuts (still cutting here in Fla) which helps keep us busy. I've also been doing some evictions for brokers that all seem to be vacant and already initially secured by either safeguard or BOA. Seems like we are pretty well diversified right now. It was a way different story for us this time last year!! We almost went under._
> 
> Miss the grass cuts here in South Carolina...did a couple of hundred per week over the summer. Now just doing winterizations, initial secures, and the occasional trashout with national companies. Most of our work the past few months has been with local realtors. Do like not having to wait 30 days to get paid, though. Most of the realtors pay within the week, and require very little in the way of pics.


 
grasscutting? how is that business going? Is there money in that still, even with all the migrants?


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> I know the nationals are all about not removing personal property...but my realtors don't seem a bit concerned about it. I try to make sure I am covered by getting them to state specifically in our email correspondence that they do want these items disposed of. Should I be doing something else to protect myself in that regard?






It has to do with the legal status of the loan.

Usually by the time the realtor gets it the property is out of redemption and has probably been posted the required number of days for personal property to be removed by the previous occupant. 

After that its fair game.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Removal of biohazard materials that appear to be canine feces. Usage of PPE required. Also, as seen in the pics the property is filled with raw garbage that may have rat or mouse infestation that will also require PPE during the hazardous material removal. Price is quoted at $75/cyd for removal, bagging, signage attached to bags for hazardous and proper disposal. Dept of Health "MAY" be contacted if we fill it is required
> 
> There ya go. Make some money. But be wearing your PPE. Look up PPE if you don't know or look at pic


Fremont is spot on.

No point in working for nothing or pennies. You can stay home and in bed to make the same with less grief.....lol

I will say this, I constantly try to educate my employees in the matter of painting the picture for the desk jockey on the other side. All they have to go by is your pictures and bid provided. Although it is a PIA, there are times when you need to articulate your bid in a manner that "Paints the Picture" for the person on the other side that is ordering or approving the work. 

I'm not saying it will always get you an approval or that there aren't unreasonble companies with dilusional expectations out there that prey on contractors. Even funnier is when the person ordering the work or approving it has NFI (No __cking Idea) what they are talking about and they are going to tell you your bid is to high. lol..........

Always remember also, diversification is the key to survival in this business.


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> any suggestions????


Trust No One


----------



## Guest

agcreno said:


> So tell us how you really feel...Were you looking for Craigslist?


good reply.........................:laughing:


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> Welcome to Crackford! Though I work in the general area....i'm sure glad I don't live in it! Have not made it to The Stone Eagle yet but I heard its good. If you are going to be around for a while check out Backyard Bar & Grill in either Cherry Valley or Loves Park. That's some good food @ good prices.
> 
> So, you havin' fun in our snow? Take some back with you.....matter of fact take it all so I can hop on 2 wheels again!




Yeah, It's unreal how far this place has been flushed down the chitter since i left. I used to like it around here and camped almost every weekend at Lowden state park on the rock river. I will say i did enjoy our drive through the Galena area Sunday night. Can't believe they got a W/M Stupid Center!!! Still a beautiful town with a lot of history...........


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Yeah, It's unreal how far this place has been flushed down the chitter since i left. ...........






You just have short wick memory syndrome :clap::clap::clap::clap:
:laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Eastern WY.
> As for missing locks, deadbolts and lock boxes............ with guys like this...... ANY thing is possible.
> I had some one steal a lockbox off of one of my properties. I found it and reported it. Luckily they paid me for installing a new one.
> 
> 
> Well if these national companies would pay better no one would steal anything....if i'm only making a profit of 2.00 to put on a lockbox or for a new deadbolt and knoblock and travel expenses "arien't part of a business model" for a contractor that travels all day, then i'd rather steal the item and use it on my next property to save the expense and increase our bottom line....why should the corporations be the only ones that only care about their bottom line??????


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> So far so good. Honest and upfront. Full HUD rates and about 40 days to my 1st check with them......



i just signed up with them...i'll keep you all posted if i get on with them in my state.


----------



## BPWY

Like I've stated a hundred times.


The health, profit and welfare of your business doesn't even enter the conscientiousness of the nationals.
Its not part of their business model. All we are is a number to them. When the value of that number is used up they spit us out and take the next guy waiting in the wings to be screwed over and used up.
When he gets wise to their ways and won't accept the bent over a barrel position any longer they move right on to the next one without a moment's hesitation.


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> My work comes in spurts also. Just picked up a little. Got about 5 securings in the last day or so. Doing a lot of code violation work for brokers right now and we have about 250 grass cuts (still cutting here in Fla) which helps keep us busy. I've also been doing some evictions for brokers that all seem to be vacant and already initially secured by either safeguard or BOA. Seems like we are pretty well diversified right now. It was a way different story for us this time last year!! We almost went under.




wow congrats!!!! 250 monthly grass cuts?? that's good money!!

I'm the complete opposite, last year we were really busy and i was sitting high , this year i'm on the verge of pulling my hair out ( even though i've shaved my head since i joined the marines in 94) and on the verge of bk


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> Well if these national companies would pay better no one would steal anything....if i'm only making a profit of 2.00 to put on a lockbox or for a new deadbolt and knoblock and travel expenses "arien't part of a business model" for a contractor that travels all day, then i'd rather steal the item and use it on my next property to save the expense and increase our bottom line....why should the corporations be the only ones that only care about their bottom line??????






I pick up all the rekeyable locks I can during trashouts etc. I realize its only a couple bux but eventually it'll add up... right?
If I can find an easily accessible and open window or door on initial secure I'll rekey those locks. After all most of the W/Os we get say "rekey" one door, or all doors.


But I don't go around stealing other folks installed products. 


I have already "borrowed" a lock box when I was out and had an order not yet delivered. I called the agent and she was cool about it. Soon as my order came in I replaced it. Thats only happened once on a weekend.


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> wow congrats!!!! 250 monthly grass cuts?? that's good money!!
> 
> I'm the complete opposite, last year we were really busy and i was sitting high , this year i'm on the verge of pulling my hair out ( even though i've shaved my head since i joined the marines in 94) and on the verge of bk






Did you get the email I sent you sunday?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Did you get the email I sent you sunday?



I don't think so...was it in a PM or to my personal email?? either way resend it, i'll be online for another hour or so...it's pouring rain here today, and the last three days.....the midwest and east coast are in for some snow big time this week !!!


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> I don't think so...was it in a PM or to my personal email?? either way resend it, i'll be online for another hour or so...it's pouring rain here today, and the last three days.....the midwest and east coast are in for some snow big time this week !!!





It was the address you had posted a page or two back.



So far nothing more than just a small skiff of snow here.

I need daily snow of 2 or 3 inches. I'd be able to survive on the 5 smallish plowing jobs I have if we were getting 2+ every day.


If we were getting that much snow I'd be able to pick up a couple more pretty easily.

This winter reminds me of the late 90s when we wouldn't get enough snow to even mention it. And then the summers would be extremely dry.


----------



## BPWY

Resent it to your _live_ address.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> It was the address you had posted a page or two back.
> 
> 
> 
> So far nothing more than just a small skiff of snow here.
> 
> I need daily snow of 2 or 3 inches. I'd be able to survive on the 5 smallish plowing jobs I have if we were getting 2+ every day.
> 
> 
> If we were getting that much snow I'd be able to pick up a couple more pretty easily.
> 
> This winter reminds me of the late 90s when we wouldn't get enough snow to even mention it. And then the summers would be extremely dry.



well usually when it rains here , you guys get hammered with snow...and it's been raining none stop here for the past three days...


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Yeah, It's unreal how far this place has been flushed down the chitter since i left. I used to like it around here and camped almost every weekend at Lowden state park on the rock river. I will say i did enjoy our drive through the Galena area Sunday night. Can't believe they got a W/M Stupid Center!!! Still a beautiful town with a lot of history...........


Yes, Galena is a neat town. You should have seen the riff raff around the area when Wallyworld was being built. I think every Galena resident had a sign that said "Wal-Mart sucks....the life out of your town"!

Hey if you went to Galena, you probably passed right by my place. I'm just North of the ISP station on 20. If I see some weird guy in a Ford Pinto with a push mower on the roof and a plow on the front and plates that read "MTMTNMAN 1"....I'll know its you! I'll wave for sure!

:w00t:


----------



## BPWY

I'd hate to be the contractor that did this job and get this lawsuit.




> TRUCKEE, Calif. — When Mimi Ash arrived at her mountain chalet here for a weekend ski trip, she discovered that someone had broken into the home and changed the locks.
> When she finally got into the house, it was empty. All of her possessions were gone: furniture, her son’s ski medals, winter clothes and family photos.
> Also missing was a wooden box, its top inscribed with the words “Together Forever,” that contained the ashes of her late husband, Robert.
> The culprit, Ms. Ash soon learned, was not a burglar but her bank. According to a federal lawsuit filed in October by Ms. Ash, Bank of America had wrongfully foreclosed on her house and thrown out her belongings, without alerting Ms. Ash beforehand.


http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40777392/ns/business-the_new_york_times


----------



## Guest

The sad part (besides the Mr Ashes Ashes) is the contractor will be paying for this. 

Oh yeah BOA will also pay but the majority will be the contractor. 

Reasons:

1) Mrs Ash will need to prove what was said on the phone with BOA ie...he said she said thing in order for BOA to assume ALL the liability for the mess.

2) The contractor did not due his/her due diligence to determine if the property was eligible for the lockchange to commence. 

3) Contractor did not determine if the property was abandoned. BIG BIG difference between unoccupied and abandoned. 

4) Contractor disposed of personals that obviously had a lot of value..financially and emotionally...thus they are screwed. 

5) Best case scenario for contractor is that they will pay all the defense costs and BOA pays the settlement awards. It will never go to trial. 

Just my Opinion. 

Abandonement is the biggest risk there is for anyone in this business...Good luck determining this since as our lawyer has stated there really is no way a contractor can determine this by knocking on a door and looking through the windows. The house can 100% empty of all items but if the mortgagee *states they are checking* on the house once a month then the property is not abandoned and technically we (us) cannot change the locks.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I'd hate to be the contractor that did this job and get this lawsuit.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40777392/ns/business-the_new_york_times




well looting houses will continue to increase because no one can turn a profit so they have to steal and sell to keep the food on the table.....not everyone is excited to make 60.00 a day profit like my trash dump friend....:laughing:


----------



## BPWY

This is a copy/paste from a posting at another forum.


In my opinion this is where this biz has gone wrong and will continue to the point that the guy providing the insurance one day will have a big claim and get the royal screwing he has coming to him.
I'll just bet that he lied on his insurance ap about having subs or not.




> Problem is I work directly for a "vendor" who works for Safeguard, so I don't ever speak directly to Safeguard, just the vendor. It looks like the vendor may be irresponsible. It's all so confusing. A reason I work for the vendor is I don't carry insurance, well, none of us working for him carry insurance, that's why many of us work for vendors who don't require insurance. We just do as we are told and we get paid.


----------



## Guest

BPWY, 
You are right. I know we require all our guys to carry their own matching limits as our policies...even work comp. 
Problem is the sub has no protection at all unless they carry their own insurance policy. You might work for another vendor that don't require insurance but unless they are an employee then they are called "barebones" (no coverage). 
Not smart.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> This is a copy/paste from a posting at another forum.
> 
> 
> In my opinion this is where this biz has gone wrong and will continue to the point that the guy providing the insurance one day will have a big claim and get the royal screwing he has coming to him.
> I'll just bet that he lied on his insurance ap about having subs or not.


I posted responses in this thread at the other forum. Scandalous, isn't it?

Linda


----------



## brm1109

*No Insurance*

I don't understand how anyone could do any work in a vendor relationship and not have insurance.


----------



## brm1109

*Merry Christmas*

I want to wish everyone a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year. May 2011 be a profitable year for all.


----------



## JenkinsHB

is anyone having a really hard time getting through to the BAC authorization center today? One of my guys called 54 times, alway getting a busy signal, before he could get through.


----------



## Guest

JenkinsHB said:


> is anyone having a really hard time getting through to the BAC authorization center today? One of my guys called 54 times, alway getting a busy signal, before he could get through.


My memo stated that:

"During the holiday season be patient since we are allowing our staff to spend time with their family members. Don't leave the site before making contact. We fully expect all work to be completed on the required due dates, that means to staff your office accordingly to be open and available 24 hours a day including Christmas and New Years. " 

I think their staff had better spend quality time with their families now cause when the State Atty Generals are preaching that jail time is coming for the staff that robosigned applications and wrongfully foreclosed on homeowners than they may be "adopting" new families for next Christmas


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> My memo stated that:
> 
> "During the holiday season be patient since we are allowing our staff to spend time with their family members. Don't leave the site before making contact. We fully expect all work to be completed on the required due dates, that means to staff your office accordingly to be open and available 24 hours a day including Christmas and New Years. "
> 
> I think their staff had better spend quality time with their families now cause when the State Atty Generals are preaching that jail time is coming for the staff that robosigned applications and wrongfully foreclosed on homeowners than they may be "adopting" new families for next Christmas




Pleaseeeeeee jail time?????!?!??!?!??? I can't say I'll hold my breath, they'll find some way to hush this up or putting out a statement condemning this and promising it's a "random act" bla bla bla and that will be it.....But if Joe smith who lives on main street even jaywalks they get a ticket and are held accountable.....hmmmmmmmm


----------



## Guest

Hey not my words but I tend to believe you on the excuse and the blah blah blah.....sorry my pen worked overtime and I was tired and I was mentally incompetent cause of lack of sleep syndrom and its just not my fault crap 

But here is another story from today:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/12/14/tom-miller-foreclosure-fraud-jail_n_796647.html

Now from all the screaming this guy (I have absolutely no respect for this guy) is doing he will have to do something or HE will be losing his job and he knows it since the Iowa People kinda got fed up with the Supreme Court Judges and voted everyone of them off the bench.. First time in National History as I understand it. 
We are pis**d and something will be done.


----------



## thanohano44

D&R Services said:


> BPWY said:
> 
> 
> 
> Eastern WY.
> As for missing locks, deadbolts and lock boxes............ with guys like this...... ANY thing is possible.
> I had some one steal a lockbox off of one of my properties. I found it and reported it. Luckily they paid me for installing a new one.
> 
> 
> Well if these national companies would pay better no one would steal anything....if i'm only making a profit of 2.00 to put on a lockbox or for a new deadbolt and knoblock and travel expenses "arien't part of a business model" for a contractor that travels all day, then i'd rather steal the item and use it on my next property to save the expense and increase our bottom line....why should the corporations be the only ones that only care about their bottom line??????
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I disagree, people with no integrity are the same...no matter how much money they have or don't have. the more money you throw at a problem, the worse it gets...look at the state of welfare services in this country.
> 
> We need to hold ourselves accountable for our actions as well as others who we see ruining it for everyone else. especially these hack contractors...believe me, AZ has A LOT of them.
Click to expand...


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> My memo stated that:
> 
> "During the holiday season be patient since we are allowing our staff to spend time with their family members. Don't leave the site before making contact. We fully expect all work to be completed on the required due dates, that means to staff your office accordingly to be open and available 24 hours a day including Christmas and New Years. "
> 
> I think their staff had better spend quality time with their families now cause when the State Atty Generals are preaching that jail time is coming for the staff that robosigned applications and wrongfully foreclosed on homeowners than they may be "adopting" new families for next Christmas








I've calmed down since I first read that post, several hrs ago my comments would have been much more :furious::furious::furious: :w00t:



I'd simply them that since they weren't paying the bill for 24 hr service they weren't getting 24 hr service.
The nationals have sure gotten awful needy without giving additional compensation.


BAC is an example. First all the time wasted with getting the authorization.
And now the pic requirement prior to giving authorization. All this extra work for no extra pay.


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> We need to hold ourselves accountable for our actions as well as others who we see ruining it for everyone else. especially these hack contractors...believe me, AZ has A LOT of them.







There is little that can be done to hold other contractors responsible.

Like was previously posted the national didn't even care when informed that some of their contractors were stealing stuff with photo proof.


----------



## Guest

putting the " I HATE NATIONALS" stuff to the side for a few days.....HAPPY HOLIDAYS EVERYONE!!! BE SAFE !!! see you all on monday...long weekend for me!!!


----------



## Guest

*Wisdom*

_ Merry Christmas, Good Health & A Prosperous New Year!_
_ Cheers! 

_
_If you can make one heap of all your winnings 
_
_And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,_
_And lose, and start again at your beginnings,_
_And never breathe a word about your loss: _
_Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,_
_And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!_

_- Rudyard Kipling _


----------



## Guest

Can somebody here give me a good reason why you are all working for these companies you complain about?

Come on!


----------



## BPWY

Michigan11 said:


> Can somebody here give me a good reason why you are all working for these companies you complain about?
> 
> Come on!








I'm kinda partial to feedin the pie hole. How about you?



And my rant on 5 brothers comes after it seems they've severed ties with me.

I didn't say any thing until its become obvious that they quit giving me paying work.


----------



## BPWY

BPWY said:


> Lets discuss 5 Brothers.
> 
> 
> 
> Any body having problems with them?
> 
> 
> I started working with them last fall/early winter. Every thing was good up until Sept of this yr and things really started going down hill. I had very few complaints with them and got a fair amount of work from them. For a big company they seemed like one of the better ones out there.
> 
> 
> Then in Sept they allowed another contractor to lie thru his teeth about my work. I stood up for myself and eventually at a cost of several hundred to me went back to the property and proved him full of **it and asked them why they took his word over mine. Of course they had no explanation. This was also about the same time that I was forced to cut my coverage area way back because of the expense of traveling.
> 
> Of course just like that they cut 99.9% of my work with no explanation. In early Oct there was a property that I initial secured and winterized for them. 2 days later the water department told me that the property had been dewinterized by a squatter. I immediately let vendor management know and requested a w/o to redo the wint.
> Nope, not needed.
> Oh really??????????
> 
> Recently they came back to try and get me to re-wint for free because another contractor reported that there is water in the toilets and no RV anti freeze. I have to assume its the same lying sack that I've gotten screwed by a couple months ago.
> 
> Its impossible to discuss it like adults with them. The ignorance game is sickening,











And lets just say that I might have discovered they are lying like a rug ............ again.
About the 2nd incident mentioned above. 
Hell I knew they were all along, just didn't have any proof.

Just wait until they try to claim that the fixtures froze n broke. That wont go so well if/when they try that.


I don't play stupid children's games. I quit that sort of thing many many yrs ago. 
By the time I turned 12 or so.


----------



## BPWY

D&R Services said:


> putting the " I HATE NATIONALS" stuff to the side for a few days.....HAPPY HOLIDAYS EVERYONE!!! BE SAFE !!! see you all on monday...long weekend for me!!!







I love the nationals so much that I'd like Santa to help them with their heating bills this winter............... a lump of black and very sulfurous coal in each stocking! :thumbup:





Every body else...... MERRY CHRISTMAS.


----------



## thanohano44

Merry Christmas everyone!!


----------



## oteroproperties

Yeah the grass cuts are what keep us up. We could stay up and profitable with only grass cuts so any work above and beyond that is a blessing.


----------



## oteroproperties

Michigan11 said:


> grasscutting? how is that business going? Is there money in that still, even with all the migrants?


We do well with the cuts but we cut directly for the nationals so we are getting hud less discount.


----------



## Guest

Dont do it. Little money, typically dangerous neighborhoods, and no promise of future work. Large companie already have the largest accounts and do the work for almost no profit. Want to make money, and have to experience, sell cars.


----------



## BPWY

ohiohomedoctor said:


> Dont do it. Little money, typically dangerous neighborhoods, and no promise of future work. Large companie already have the largest accounts and do the work for almost no profit. Want to make money, and have to experience, sell cars.







What kind of spam post is this?

What is it that we are not supposed to do?


----------



## Guest

I think he is saying to sell cars with lawnmowers attached to them for big nationals with no profit?????????:thumbup:


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> And lets just say that I might have discovered they are lying like a rug ............ again.
> About the 2nd incident mentioned above.
> Hell I knew they were all along, just didn't have any proof.
> 
> Just wait until they try to claim that the fixtures froze n broke. That wont go so well if/when they try that.
> 
> 
> I don't play stupid children's games. I quit that sort of thing many many yrs ago.
> By the time I turned 12 or so.


5 Brothers are a joke


----------



## BPWY

wmhammons said:


> 5 Brothers are a joke







I had 10 or so good months with them before they became a real headache.
I've done about $22,000 with them this yr.


I don't know what happened to them, but some thing certainly did.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I had 10 or so good months with them before they became a real headache.
> I've done about $22,000 with them this yr.
> 
> 
> I don't know what happened to them, but some thing certainly did.



I did work for them, they are hiring new people at a lower fee and hardly any experience. This economy has brought the worst in the nationals, and the low fee new folks


----------



## BPWY

wmhammons said:


> I did work for them, they are hiring new people at a lower fee and hardly any experience. This economy has brought the worst in the nationals, and the low fee new folks







I knew that when HUD cut some of the rates and forced the use of 3rd party software this was going to happen.

I predicted it several months ago already.

With the use of 3rd party software for bids this was going to cut way back on the % that the nationals made. Turns out I was right.


----------



## BPWY

Speaking of changes at HUD and their new requirement to trash out up to 12 yrds on the initial secure I expected to start seeing a lot more debris removal orders with the initial secure.
But that has not happened. 


What about the rest of ya?


----------



## Guest

The ones I get from scamguard are only 12c.y. of debris ONLY if there is a real infestation risk. 

another thing they are picking at now are when we bid interior debris. they have been trying to knock them down dramatically by photo views. if i have photos of something like unattached shelving units, i always write the rough dimensions with the pics. but they still claim "it only looks like 3c.y. to me".:wallbash:


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> The ones I get from scamguard are only 12c.y. of debris ONLY if there is a real infestation risk.
> odf
> another thing they are picking at now are when we bid interior debris. they have been trying to knock them down dramatically by photo views. if i have photos of something like unattached shelving units, i always write the rough dimensions with the pics. but they still claim "it only looks like 3c.y. to me".:wallbash:


scamguard (Safeguard) Is the bottom of the cesspool. Real cut throat and crappy company


----------



## BPWY

wmhammons said:


> scamguard (Safeguard) Is the bottom of the cesspool. Real cut throat and crappy company








My experience has been that FAS was worse than Safeguard.

But Safeguard sure has a lot of negative hits on ripoff report.


----------



## Guest

Hope you all had a Safe and Merry Christmas and here's to us ALL having a Safe, Happy and Prosperous New Year.....:clap:


----------



## mtmtnman

New way to get rid of debris. I got a kickback form a National because they didn't have a "BEFORE" pic of a set of tires removed from a property. Never mind there is 4' of snow. They had the pics from 3 weeks ago showing where they where. My guys dug them out of 4' of snow last week and took a pic of them lying in a clearing and then another loaded in the truck. This national says they don't accept load photos so i asked if it was ok to take a before and take an after with the tires missing from that spot and move them 30' away to the fenceline and leave them. Hey if they don't want load photos there is no reason to load debris up right????:clap::clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

Michigan11 said:


> Can somebody here give me a good reason why you are all working for these companies you complain about?
> 
> Come on!




I think i can answer this the best out of everyone here...I don't...and because of it I'm about bankrupt. I don't work for them because my brokers and realtors don't do chargebacks, or don't pay, or tell me that because of pictures it's not worth what I bid ( i mean come on, based on a picture they feel they can estimate better than the people on site).....they don't do any of that AND they pay well, I work only 2 days a week and make more then my local competitors that work 7 days a week...BUT because of this I have lost a lot of my clients because the banks tell the realtors who they can and can't use now....so to answer your questions, it's either work for them or go out of business, and good luck collecting unemployment.....so no real need to "come on"


----------



## Guest

I have a question regarding insurance.

We carry gen liability and Errors & Omissions.

Most companies request to be added as certificate holder, I assume this is to keep them in the know if the insurance is cancelled, etc.

What I don't clearly understand is adding companies as "additional Insured". I was under the impression that being insured covers damage we may do to properties. Am I not correct? Someone clue me in please.


----------



## Guest

*Nationals*

Hi there everyone. Im new to the site but have been in the preservations biz full time for 6yrs. We are quite slow and looking to pic up another client or two. We are currently working for a national and back in the day did alot of realtor direct for fannie and freddie and have excellent references. Im in a really rural area of MI and have been searching out the nationals. Already familiar with FAS and Safe. Ive heard of a few others that have good reviews...NFR and 1st. Have an app in with NFR, but cannot figure out where to find First Americans?? Ive scrubbed the net for hours and keep getting redirected to corelogic and cant find vendor area. 

Up for suggestions. Just got my 1st new initial work order in a month:sad:
Thanks a bunch!
Audrey


----------



## oteroproperties

Ive learned that even though everyone hates the nationals and their turn over rate is so high its still hard to get in the game with them due to oversaturation of vendors. Though I have a feeling that after the first of the year they will once again be in the market for some new guys. Ive been with them long enough to know that when they hire during the slow season as they always do, they get people that cant handle real volume when it comes.


----------



## Guest

ARpreservation said:


> Hi there everyone. Im new to the site but have been in the preservations biz full time for 6yrs. We are quite slow and looking to pic up another client or two. We are currently working for a national and back in the day did alot of realtor direct for fannie and freddie and have excellent references. Im in a really rural area of MI and have been searching out the nationals. Already familiar with FAS and Safe. Ive heard of a few others that have good reviews...NFR and 1st. Have an app in with NFR, but cannot figure out where to find First Americans?? Ive scrubbed the net for hours and keep getting redirected to corelogic and cant find vendor area.
> 
> Up for suggestions. Just got my 1st new initial work order in a month:sad:
> Thanks a bunch!
> Audrey


We’ve always found it effective to do a simple Google search online for terms such as
“Asset Management Companies”, “REO Management Companies”, “Property
Management Companies”, “Preservation Companies”, “REO Departments”, “Property
Disposition Companies”, etc. You’ll have to sort through some irrelevant results but you
may end up with some good leads. For a more targeted list, add your city/county/state
to the search (I.e. “California Asset Management Companies”) From ForeclosureCleanup


----------



## BPWY

Congrats Grandpa Fremont.  :thumbup:


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Congrats Grandpa Fremont.  :thumbup:


Well Thank you...man I'm feeling old now :shutup:


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> I have a question regarding insurance.
> 
> We carry gen liability and Errors & Omissions.
> 
> Most companies request to be added as certificate holder, I assume this is to keep them in the know if the insurance is cancelled, etc.
> 
> What I don't clearly understand is adding companies as "additional Insured". I was under the impression that being insured covers damage we may do to properties. Am I not correct? Someone clue me in please.


Barefoot, Its really easy for the reason for this:

1) So the service company can claim to "their clients" that they have $Billions of dollars of insurance in force to protect their assets. Which in truth your policy NOW became THEIR policy too....

2) So the Service company can turn claims in on YOUR/THEIR policy without having to ask YOU for permission since they are NOW in control of YOUR policy without having to PAY any PREMIUMS... slick huh?


----------



## Guest

So do y'all add companies as additional insured? 

This company is actually on my list of companies to get rid of. Screwed us on one job already... Cancelled a trashout as we were almost finished, had to put items back in house and didn't get paid for all the man hrs we had in the job. But, times are rough and need the work, you know?


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> So do y'all add companies as additional insured?
> 
> This company is actually on my list of companies to get rid of. Screwed us on one job already... Cancelled a trashout as we were almost finished, had to put items back in house and didn't get paid for all the man hrs we had in the job. But, times are rough and need the work, you know?


 

We do for only 1 company and we placed restrictions on our policy that "now" prevents them from turning claims in on MY policy. Don't know if it will work but worth a shot......:whistling

Had a trashout cancelled on us a few times and we basically told them we were already done--now what? We Literally had to show pics of us "reloading" the goodies at the landfill and we got paid double for the trashout and the reloading and cleaning of the stuff.... Guess they shouldn't have ordered the trashout "to early" huh.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> We do for only 1 company and we placed restrictions on our policy that "now" prevents them from turning claims in on MY policy. Don't know if it will work but worth a shot......:whistling
> 
> Had a trashout cancelled on us a few times and we basically told them we were already done--now what? We Literally had to show pics of us "reloading" the goodies at the landfill and we got paid double for the trashout and the reloading and cleaning of the stuff.... Guess they shouldn't have ordered the trashout "to early" huh.


I will look into putting restrictions...

Our trashout was basic...less than 300 in personals, job order said to proceed if less than 300. Spoke with coordinator later, she was wanting update. I mentioned a few items, she said we had to stop and put all back because there were personals present. I said fine, how do I bill for that. She said it wouldn't be paid because personals were present and we should have let them know. Told her that job order specifically stated to notify if more than 300 in personals. She said that is usually the case, but this client would not allow $5 in personals to be removed. Told her that should be in the job order. We argued back and forth for weeks. They ended up paying 100.00 for a job that we had 10 man hrs in trashing out, and 8 more in unloading and putting back. :furious:


----------



## mtmtnman

barefootlc said:


> I will look into putting restrictions...
> 
> Our trashout was basic...less than 300 in personals, job order said to proceed if less than 300. Spoke with coordinator later, she was wanting update. I mentioned a few items, she said we had to stop and put all back because there were personals present. I said fine, how do I bill for that. She said it wouldn't be paid because personals were present and we should have let them know. Told her that job order specifically stated to notify if more than 300 in personals. She said that is usually the case, but this client would not allow $5 in personals to be removed. Told her that should be in the job order. We argued back and forth for weeks. They ended up paying 100.00 for a job that we had 10 man hrs in trashing out, and 8 more in unloading and putting back. :furious:



Sounds like BOA......................


----------



## BPWY

Any body here heard of or worked for http://www.impastoservices.com/index.html ??



thanks!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Any body here heard of or worked for http://www.impastoservices.com/index.html ??
> 
> 
> 
> thanks!


I don't know how they treat [or pay] their vendors but we had to terminate our relationship with them towards the end of 2009.

Fairly nice people in the office but a couple of the vendors they put on our jobs faked before and after photos, thinking we wouldn't notice they hadn't actually done the work. For that reason [and a couple others], I don't think very highly of their QC department.

Hopefully, they were simply inexperienced and others will have had a more positive experience than I did.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

Let me see if I understand this right.


They had some vendors that were QCing your work??

Or some how doing other work behind you and by their half axx contractor's work or shall we say non work your company was getting into trouble?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Their QC person was pushing pics through accounting [that had been faked by their vendors/independent contractors in the field] when it was very obvious the work had not been done. 

I'm not going to say how their photos were faked 'cause we don't need to give anyone any ideas.

I'm also not saying they're not a good company. They just weren't a good fit for us.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

"Faking" a pic of the air compressor on a wint when you forgot to take one specifically for that property is one thing. 
I've had occasion where I forgot to take one at the property and reused a former one. I've always done the wint tho. 
Inspite of what 5 Bros says about me. 



Faking work supposedly done but not done is fraud and HUD could prosecute or so I've heard.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

As far as I can tell, it was their vendors that were faking the photos. But they passed them through accounting to be invoiced as completed jobs.

The faked pics were only on a couple of jobs but they had a lot of other issues producing good photos from the field and it was time-consuming for me to keep going back and forth with them.

As I said, it was over a year ago so perhaps they have better vendors now. Hopefully they'll have a better QC person by now, too.

But I can only tell you my experience from a client's point of view. I have no clue how they are to work for or how they pay.

I looked at the link you posted. It appears they've grown so, hopefully, they have better controls in place and run more efficiently.

Linda


----------



## thanohano44

speaking of recuts, has anyone here been paid a "limited growth fee" when you did an actual recut? what is up with that? We have been getting that from LPS. a few years ago, we were pumping out 4800 recuts a month at $55 a cut. now it seems like nationals are wanting to pay what regionals pay ($20-$25 a cut up to 15sf). LPS is also starting to not pay trip charges? has anyone else experienced this?


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> speaking of recuts, has anyone here been paid a "limited growth fee" when you did an actual recut? what is up with that? We have been getting that from LPS. a few years ago, we were pumping out 4800 recuts a month at $55 a cut. now it seems like nationals are wanting to pay what regionals pay ($20-$25 a cut up to 15sf). LPS is also starting to not pay trip charges? has anyone else experienced this?




ummm ya!! it's better to pay 20-25 and not pay trip charges because the CEO of the nationals have found it's better to have yachts on every continent instead of having to rent one...plus gas prices have gone up and private jets use a lot of gas!! any questions ???


----------



## BPWY

No trip charge????



My reply is YOU don't work for free. Neither do I.

Last time I went to Mini Mart and fueled and told them that I wanted it for free because I was working for __________ and they don't pay me for what I'm doing, that didn't go over real well. They threatened to call the cops.


You have got to stand up for yourself with these companies. Because if you don't no one will.
And its because the contractors have just rolled over and said hit me again big daddy I like it is why we have these guys going with $20 cuts and $0 trip charges.
Back when that nonsense started if they'd have told the bank or national no way we wouldn't be as bad off as things are today.


----------



## thanohano44

oh I do...I was doing work for them through a regional. he said they wouldnt pay any of my trip charges. I let him know that I will stop the work I was doing until I got paid. I did 85% of his work in AZ. I got paid. he claims it was out of his own pocket. I have heard from other LPS vendors the same, they wont pay trip charges. 

I have a contract on file with LPS since MARCH. they had just contacted me today to check on my coverage area's. This would be my 4th job directly for them. any advice on working with them?


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> oh I do...I was doing work for them through a regional. he said they wouldnt pay any of my trip charges. I let him know that I will stop the work I was doing until I got paid. I did 85% of his work in AZ. I got paid. he claims it was out of his own pocket. I have heard from other LPS vendors the same, they wont pay trip charges.
> 
> I have a contract on file with LPS since MARCH. they had just contacted me today to check on my coverage area's. This would be my 4th job directly for them. any advice on working with them?


Fill up the checkbook and hire a lawyer on retainer to pay for all the LPS screwups (thay you won't know a thing about till the lawsuit). 
Otherwise they are ok. NOT


----------



## Guest

One of our best subs today was walking around the side of the house to check the gas meter where a snow drift had "slided over" a window well cover and he fell in hitting chest on the window well breaking 3 ribs.... 
We never go into a snow covered yard/lot without a snow removal if there is 12" of snow or more and this was a perfect example of why. CRAP!


----------



## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> Fill up the checkbook and hire a lawyer on retainer to pay for all the LPS screwups (thay you won't know a thing about till the lawsuit).
> Otherwise they are ok. NOT


 
can you give me some examples? I've worked for the AZ and UT rfp winners. It's been rare I had a go back or made a mistake. I have found mistakes of their other contractors and reported them and got the job back.

the weird thing is, I did 4 jobs for them when all they did was send work to their RFP winners, which I was not one of them. would it be because what I asked for in pricing was too high?


----------



## thanohano44

what does everyone here do an initial lawn for? a cyd of debris?

I got an email from a client stating the national average for a cyd of debris is $16 per cyd and that I need to lower my price of $35 per cyd. and average price for a initial lawn is $55?

$50 a dry wint w/ 1 unit? I havent done these for less than $90(which is damn low)


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> what does everyone here do an initial lawn for? a cyd of debris?
> 
> I got an email from a client stating the national average for a cyd of debris is $16 per cyd and that I need to lower my price of $35 per cyd. and average price for a initial lawn is $55?
> 
> $50 a dry wint w/ 1 unit? I havent done these for less than $90(which is damn low)


 
$16 a yard is a good way to go broke. If there isn't much driving involved getting to the property, $50 a wint will at least break you even. Not that breaking even is something to shoot for.:blink:


----------



## BPWY

The nationals are not above lying to us either.


Average is $16 per cube????? What a crock.


I did a trash out yesterday with 43 cubes. I got paid much closer to HUD rate than $16.
Depending on the weight of the junk you are getting rid of you wouldn't be able to pay the dump fees on $16 let alone pay for help and yourself.

Initial lawn for $55 is low.
And $80/$90 for a dry wint.


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> what does everyone here do an initial lawn for? a cyd of debris?
> 
> I got an email from a client stating the national average for a cyd of debris is $16 per cyd and that I need to lower my price of $35 per cyd. and average price for a initial lawn is $55?
> 
> $50 a dry wint w/ 1 unit? I havent done these for less than $90(which is damn low)



ya 16.00/cyd won't get me out of bed in the morning....i try to go around 20-25 because out here it's around 13.00/cyd just to dump....i don't know about you but out here day labors don't even work for 3.00 lol.....as for winterizations i usually go around 90-125.00 to winterize and 90-100 to dewinterize.....as for initial lawns, that i don't do...we don't have alot of lawns out here so we do initial yard care which include front and back yard or just front yards and we do the whole yard for around 150.00-200.00...that's just for landscaping type services, not debris...


----------



## Guest

We average 20-25 cyd for debris removal, 65.00 for initial cut up to 1/4 acre and 70-100 for winterization.

Of course, with our realtor customers, we have more leeway as far as adding extra charge for filth, etc.


----------



## Guest

Hello all, I am a long time reader but first time poster. 
Any one here done work for GTK Contracting. Says they have been in bus. for 10 years but I did not find anything on the negative about them. That's a bit hard to believe for 10 years in the business. I mean I know first hand you just can't make everyone happy. I am considering becoming a vendor for them and since I could not find any discussion about them out there, I thought I would post here. Their prices are low and its all hud props. I was reading here a few days ago and saw a hud pricing matrix but now I can not seem to find it. I shot an email off to them and let them know what I thought and asked for a few present or past references, we will see how that goes. 
I have a full time job but I also run a few things on the side. (jack of all trades), In the area where I live it does not seem like many prop pres services are around. I tried contacting banks direct but got pretty much nowhere. Margin for error is zero and profit is minimum but it could fill in the gaps as long as we can get paid .

TY all


----------



## Guest

Highballit said:


> Hello all, I am a long time reader but first time poster.
> Any one here done work for GTK Contracting. Says they have been in bus. for 10 years but I did not find anything on the negative about them. That's a bit hard to believe for 10 years in the business. I mean I know first hand you just can't make everyone happy. I am considering becoming a vendor for them and since I could not find any discussion about them out there, I thought I would post here. Their prices are low and its all hud props. I was reading here a few days ago and saw a hud pricing matrix but now I can not seem to find it. I shot an email off to them and let them know what I thought and asked for a few present or past references, we will see how that goes.
> I have a full time job but I also run a few things on the side. (jack of all trades), In the area where I live it does not seem like many prop pres services are around. I tried contacting banks direct but got pretty much nowhere. Margin for error is zero and profit is minimum but it could fill in the gaps as long as we can get paid .
> 
> TY all


Do your homework. There are a lot of companies hiring for P&P that aren't worth a piece of toilet paper if you know what I mean. If you decide to move forward with a particular company request a variety of different work with them if possible but limit how much. Don't let them get to deep into you pocket until you see how they operate, pay, and treat their contractors. There is a lot of scum out there. That goes from the Nationals on down. 

You kind of need to look at it as if you are "Mining for Gold". Everyone will tell you that their claim is loaded, but very few actually produce, often a lot of time and money gets spent to find that out and at the end of the day you usually have a big A$$ pile of dirt and rocks with very little to show for it. 

Having said that, when you do find it, the rewards can be very great.

Also, NEVER put all your eggs in one basket if at all possible. 

Just my 2 cents:blink:


----------



## Guest

Has anyone ever used or heard of Pinelands Preservations in the Sacarmento,CA area? They have some work orders for me on Monday, but am a little nervous since I found them on craigslist. There website is pinelandspreservationcom


----------



## Guest

TY DW I am trying to do ma homework that's why I decided to post here. Seems like some wisdom floating around here and there. They want E&O and add. ins. I am not crazy about that, but that is the cost of doing business and getting my feet wet. I came across them by way of a local newspaper ad, I have only had email contact up to this point, but I feel like I will get someone on the phone before I commit time and material. The contract is a pretty easy read and not to much lawyer speak.


----------



## Guest

Happy New year folks! Let's hope 2011 brings more joy than 2010. IMO 2010 was one of the worse in my life!


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## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> Happy New year folks! Let's hope 2011 brings more joy than 2010. IMO 2010 was one of the worse in my life!









08 was the worst ever yr for me..... House fire.




2010 wasn't so hot for me the first 9 months of the yr. 



The key to survival is diversify!!!!!!!!!!!!!


If I was counting on P&P only to keep me going I'd be 1000% screwed right now.

But I've branched out into other areas of property services and I get a little here and a little there. In the end I'm making it.... barely.


There are things like carpet and tile cleaning, snow plowing, lawn care (in season) I'm also a handicap ramp installer for a company with a VA contract. This by no means is an inclusive list of services available.

None of it keeps me busy full time. But I make a few $$ from all of it.

50 degree temp drop from the day of the ramp install to the day of the snow removal. 
The ramp on wed, the snow plowing on friday.


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## Guest

Happy New Year y'all! arty:


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## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Happy New Year y'all! arty:


Sad day for SC football..... everyone went down in flames.


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## thanohano44

times are tough....but we can't let it stop us! I pray that you all have a year full of love, learning, work and it be prosperous as well!! thank you everyone for your input/comments. let's work together to weed out the scum.


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## Guest

Anyone know when the Fannie Mae contract is up for bid renewal?


----------



## Guest

*Help with carpet removal bid?*

Not sure what ballpark I should be in?

Average size double wide, needs carpet removed from living/dining combination area, hall way and 3 bedrooms. Carpet is caked with feces and stinks to high heaven. Told realtor it would never come clean, and I wouldn't try. She wants price to pull it out.

I know what I can get it done for :shifty:, but I know that isn't what I will bid.
Need to make some money, but want to be fair in my pricing....any ideas?


----------



## Guest

"Fair" in your pricing is all relative. You have to be fair to yourself - you are not running a non profit. There are a hundred items you have to include in your cost: buying a truck to get to the job, insuring it, insuring the company, insuring the workers who do it, paying for a trailer to haul the carpet off, Uncle Sam's piece of the pie, etc...

I had an employee complain I was charging too much to a client today, until I went through a few of my costs with him. 2 minutes of Biz Owner 101 was really an eye opener for him.

If the price is too high the agent will let you know. Talk it over with the him/her and go from there.


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Not sure what ballpark I should be in?
> 
> Average size double wide, needs carpet removed from living/dining combination area, hall way and 3 bedrooms. Carpet is caked with feces and stinks to high heaven. Told realtor it would never come clean, and I wouldn't try. She wants price to pull it out.
> 
> I know what I can get it done for :shifty:, but I know that isn't what I will bid.
> Need to make some money, but want to be fair in my pricing....any ideas?


I'd clean it....:whistling
$.62 sf for hot water extraction on feces stained (caked) carpets.
$.32 sf for odor control
$165.00 for equipment sanitization. 
$22 per stain
No guarantees. Hazmat work but then again its more dangerous on removal which I charge a premium for. 

But then again if the realtor calls a carpet remover they will charge her approx $.50 /sf so you won't make a ton unless you get to replace it. 
JMO


----------



## Guest

Thanks for the input, y'all. 



FremontREO said:


> I'd clean it....:whistling
> $.62 sf for hot water extraction on feces stained (caked) carpets.
> $.32 sf for odor control
> $165.00 for equipment sanitization.
> $22 per stain
> No guarantees. Hazmat work but then again its more dangerous on removal which I charge a premium for.
> 
> But then again if the realtor calls a carpet remover they will charge her approx $.50 /sf so you won't make a ton unless you get to replace it.
> JMO



22 per stain...ha, the entire carpet is one big stain! It has to come out.

I can live with .50 a sqft. I can get it removed for 250.00, so anything else is profit with no time/labor from me. 

Home is less than desirable...in less than desirable area, so no way bank is putting much into it. I can get carpet taken out and house cleaned for 350.00, charge her 800-900 for carpet removal and home clean. I make a little, she gets a deal and maybe remembers it. :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

few pics of the carpet...


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## Guest

uintahiker said:


> "Fair" in your pricing is all relative. You have to be fair to yourself - you are not running a non profit. There are a hundred items you have to include in your cost: buying a truck to get to the job, insuring it, insuring the company, insuring the workers who do it, paying for a trailer to haul the carpet off, Uncle Sam's piece of the pie, etc...
> 
> I had an employee complain I was charging too much to a client today, until I went through a few of my costs with him. 2 minutes of Biz Owner 101 was really an eye opener for him.
> 
> If the price is too high the agent will let you know. Talk it over with the him/her and go from there.


Had the same talk yesterday, lol. Guy didn't understand why he only got half of the job pay. Told him he could have it all if he bought his own trailer and truck, took out insurance, advertised, and did all the pics/docs/and uploading....Hell, I even bought the trash bags for him.


----------



## Guest

*Cyprexx?*

Any of y'all work with Cyprexx? Have a voicemail from one of their coordinators. Just wondering if anyone had any experience with them.


----------



## brm1109

*Tired of lowballers*

Put in a bid for a 100 yd trashout 100 x $35.00 = $3500.00 pus an additional $80 for 8 cans of paint. I find out that someone actually underbid me and did it for around $2k.
How can anybody compete with that?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Any of y'all work with Cyprexx? Have a voicemail from one of their coordinators. Just wondering if anyone had any experience with them.


I wouldn't do it. I'm going back and forth with them on a whopping $128.22 they've owed me for almost a year.

They deducted 9% from our invoices, even though we had workers comp insurance. They sent a check for the difference that they didn't pay on the first check........... but deducted 9% from THAT, too.

What a mess they are and the coordinator I worked with was a total **witch**. 

It's ultimately your decision, though, since there will be other vendors who have had nothing but good experiences......... or at least not had enough experiences to make them quit.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thanks Linda...things aren't bad enough yet for me to take the chance. :no:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Thanks Linda...things aren't bad enough yet for me to take the chance. :no:


It's hard to find the good ones anymore. Everyone's gotten so greedy and I've only got one client who's paying on time now.

I'm at my most disgusted with this industry. I've had 2 vendors in a row who thought that the photos they took 2 months ago were the only "before" photos they needed when they did the work. For that reason, I doubt very seriously anyone will get paid at all. 

Clients love it when vendors do the work and can't support what they did with good photos. Now they have a reason not to pay. One of those jobs was almost $3,000!

If we don't get paid, neither will the vendors. I'll lose out on my fee but they'll lose out on all the labor, roll-offs, dump fees, etc. None of us likes to work for free, however small the amount, including me!:furious:

Linda


----------



## Guest

Sucks, huh?

We are lucky in that most of our work is for area realtors, who require very little in the way of photos. I do almost all the photo taking. Before pics for bidding, and after pics for billing. Most of them do not even want me to send pics, just keep them on file for 90 days in case they need them. Our subs just do the labor. I am a control freak, lol. If you want something done right......


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Yes, it does suck. I spend a lot of time cultivating clients so that we can get the good jobs, then stuff like this happens.

Our work orders are very clear regarding the photos required to close the job and be paid successfully. Both vendors totally ignored the guidelines.

If the bid photos were taken within a week of the work being approved, it wouldn't be such a big deal. But BOTH jobs were approved 2 months after the initial bid photos were taken. Now neither of these vendors have provided proof that someone else didn't come in and do the work. All I have are after photos.

This industry is just turning to crap. I spend an inordinate amount of time trying to get vendors to perform on time and conform to clients' guidelines so that everything goes smoothly for all of us, then end up spending even more time on collections, partially due to the vendors' poor documentation of the work done and partially due to the client simply being slow to pay. The rewards are just not there anymore.

I'm ready to walk away from all of it and I'm tempted to re-open my bookkeeping business. I had way fewer headaches when I was the only one doing the work. I hear ya on the control thing and, if I could get out there and do the work in other states myself, I definitely would.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Yes, it does suck. I spend a lot of time cultivating clients so that we can get the good jobs, then stuff like this happens.
> 
> Our work orders are very clear regarding the photos required to close the job and be paid successfully. Both vendors totally ignored the guidelines.
> 
> If the bid photos were taken within a week of the work being approved, it wouldn't be such a big deal. But BOTH jobs were approved 2 months after the initial bid photos were taken. Now neither of these vendors have provided proof that someone else didn't come in and do the work. All I have are after photos.
> 
> This industry is just turning to crap. I spend an inordinate amount of time trying to get vendors to perform on time and conform to clients' guidelines so that everything goes smoothly for all of us, then end up spending even more time on collections, partially due to the vendors' poor documentation of the work done and partially due to the client simply being slow to pay. The rewards are just not there anymore.
> 
> I'm ready to walk away from all of it and I'm tempted to re-open my bookkeeping business. I had way fewer headaches when I was the only one doing the work. I hear ya on the control thing and, if I could get out there and do the work in other states myself, I definitely would.
> 
> Linda


 
I can only imagine the headaches...

Think that is the downside of growth...loss of control.
Pics are a big issue with me. Even for the realtors who don't require them, I still take them as if it is a job for one of the nationals. Keeps me in the habit, and always nice to have some proof in the way of photos if issues ever arise. 

Hey bookkeeper....wanna come set up Quickbooks for me?? What a misnomer....:shutup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Hey bookkeeper....wanna come set up Quickbooks for me?? What a misnomer....:shutup:


Too bad you're not right down the road from me or I would love to. Quickbooks is the best and it's really simple once you learn a few of the tricks that make it work YOUR way.

I had my bookkeeping business for 9 years before I shut it down. I got too busy with the preservation business and didn't have time for it. I still have my website up, though, so it will be easy to start back up. The general public doesn't even know I shut down in the first place.

Come on out and bring your laptop with you.:thumbup:

Linda


----------



## Guest

Linda,
I'm 100% sure you will agree that the business has spiralled out of control...DOWNWARDS.
That the reason we pulled out of South Carolina, Georgia and most the Midwest. Just can't *control* anything with the Service Companies that are *"out of control". *
Down to just a few States and only the GOOD Guys/Gals are left with us. Kinda like a warparty every morning trying to stay ahead of the Service Companies trying to find ways to screw us....just shouldn't never be this way.


----------



## Guest

Wow, Linda...wish I could take you up on that. Just so much set up with us getting diff pay from diff companies for same services...

Get this,
My husband goes to Rutherfordton Nc (about an hr drive) to perform a work order. Spends 4 hrs onsite, heads home. Halfway home, gets email from same company for another job order....right next door to the house he just left.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Linda,
> I'm 100% sure you will agree that the business has spiralled out of control...DOWNWARDS.
> That the reason we pulled out of South Carolina, Georgia and most the Midwest. Just can't *control* anything with the Service Companies that are *"out of control". *
> Down to just a few States and only the GOOD Guys/Gals are left with us. Kinda like a warparty every morning trying to stay ahead of the Service Companies trying to find ways to screw us....just shouldn't never be this way.


 
Hey...lay off SC. :sad:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> Linda,
> I'm 100% sure you will agree that the business has spiralled out of control...DOWNWARDS.


Yup. You betcha. It's been going downhill for a long time and I've had a tough time keeping my mouth shut when I read all the "rosie" posts from new vendors who are going to change the world.

I'm not a negative person by nature and I can find the good side in any bad situation. But the 2 vendors who just screwed up big time are not newbies and have always followed our photo guidelines in the past. 

One of them recently told me........... well, our OTHER clients don't have the same expectations. Huh????????? What makes this vendor think I have to lower my expectations and run my company like their other client? WE get the good clients because OUR guidelines give them everything they need and then some. It's what keeps them coming back, darn it!

I've just finally had it and, like I said before, I'm at my most disgusted point in this industry.

So I'm going to re-open the bookkeeping business and run both part-time until one or the other gets busy. Then I'll get some help in the office. Within the next month, though, I'm cutting a LOT of vendors and ALL OF THE SLOW PAYING CLIENTS. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

Here's a bright vendor for you.

I receive work order for 340 Thompson Rd, go into site to see previous info. Another vendor has done occupancy checks for last 3 months, always occupied. I pull up his pics...he has been going to the wrong house.:laughing: His pics clearly show 342 as the house number.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Here's a bright vendor for you.
> 
> I receive work order for 340 Thompson Rd, go into site to see previous info. Another vendor has done occupancy checks for last 3 months, always occupied. I pull up his pics...he has been going to the wrong house.:laughing: His pics clearly show 342 as the house number.


Do your best to hang onto this client. Sounds like they don't mind paying for misinformation. lol

Linda


----------



## Guest

They obviously aren't checking the photos at all...crazy.

Work order:

*Order Number: 8175*


*Address: 340 Thompson Road*

*His photo uploaded to the job order:*


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> They obviously aren't checking the photos at all...crazy.
> 
> Work order:
> 
> *Order Number: 8175
> *
> 
> *Address: 340 Thompson Road*
> 
> *His photo uploaded to the job order:*


So is 340 Thompson occupied or is it ready for securing and cleanup? :laughing:

No one ever said QC departments hired the best and brightest.

Linda


----------



## Guest

In all the States I have worked in I gotta admit SC has some of the weirdest ways of putting an address to a property. 

I had 1 in Aiken, SC that the inspector put all the signage on the doors and I just knew this could not be the right house....kept calling the Service Company and saying this cannot be right (they wanted us to trash out). The locks had been changed by the inspector so I go inside and the house is full of personals but you could tell nobody had been there for a long long time....

There was a house right behind the home that was secured that had the same address number that was newer but occupied....I gotta admit that it was confusing at best but I was taking no chances...

When the Service Company wouldn't listen I told them to reassign. 

Last I hear till I got subpeoned from the inspector who got sued as part of a lawsuit that the contractor trashed the wrong house....Apparently the inspector ALSO told the service company that this was the wrong house or wrong address BUT the picture the service company sent was the house he secured....
Lady who owned the house was in the nursing home for over 2 years....house full of antiques and family heirlooms...:no:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> In all the States I have worked in I gotta admit SC has some of the weirdest ways of putting an address to a property.
> 
> I had 1 in Aiken, SC that the inspector put all the signage on the doors and I just knew this could not be the right house....kept calling the Service Company and saying this cannot be right (they wanted us to trash out). The locks had been changed by the inspector so I go inside and the house is full of personals but you could tell nobody had been there for a long long time....
> 
> There was a house right behind the home that was secured that had the same address number that was newer but occupied....I gotta admit that it was confusing at best but I was taking no chances...
> 
> When the Service Company wouldn't listen I told them to reassign.
> 
> Last I hear till I got subpeoned from the inspector who got sued as part of a lawsuit that the contractor trashed the wrong house....Apparently the inspector ALSO told the service company that this was the wrong house or wrong address BUT the picture the service company sent was the house he secured....
> Lady who owned the house was in the nursing home for over 2 years....house full of antiques and family heirlooms...:no:


No doubt someone made a good chunk of change off the sale of the antiques. Sheesh!

If something doesn't feel right, we won't do it either. That particular intuition has kept us out of trouble over the years. I'd rather give up a major trashout with a ton of profit in it than be sued ANY day of the week.

Linda


----------



## oteroproperties

barefootlc said:


> Any of y'all work with Cyprexx? Have a voicemail from one of their coordinators. Just wondering if anyone had any experience with them.


One of my employees when I got slow left me and went to work their as a coordinator. He has some stories to tell about some of the contractors excuses for sub par work. I did some work for them in early 2006 but dropped them due to lack of work flow. This was well before they became big enough to take Fannie Mae from Safeguard. That 9% that Linda was talking about was for them running your invoices through a sister company called infinicorp. That was only a requirement if you did not carry wc. You were not allowed to be exempt regardless of the laws. When I worked with them the pay was good and usually within 2 weeks I got a check. Of course their office was 2 miles from mine. Anyway take what I say with a grain of salt because to say the least a lot has changed since 06


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> Put in a bid for a 100 yd trashout 100 x $35.00 = $3500.00 pus an additional $80 for 8 cans of paint. I find out that someone actually underbid me and did it for around $2k.
> How can anybody compete with that?






I wonder if this "new and improved" pricing plan provided disposal receipts when the job was complete.


----------



## BPWY

BPWY said:


> Like I've stated a hundred times.
> 
> 
> The health, profit and welfare of your business doesn't even enter the conscientiousness of the nationals.
> Its not part of their business model. All we are is a number to them. When the value of that number is used up they spit us out and take the next guy waiting in the wings to be screwed over and used up.
> When he gets wise to their ways and won't accept the bent over a barrel position any longer they move right on to the next one without a moment's hesitation.






It makes me feel better that the big companies are finally realizing some thing that I've been saying over and over. For a long time.   
My brother says that I'm able to see the bad in a good situation. And that might be a little bit true. But I've certainly seen it and been preaching it to any one that will listen.
I'm not really sour grapes. Its the truth. 


More posts where I've said the same thing. 
http://www.contractortalk.com/search.php?searchid=3312387




I believe that the time will come when the banks can't find some one to do the work. Or they won't be able to find enough folks to do the work. The word is getting out about how the banks and nationals treat folks.

I'll say it again. The banks don't care how the nationals treat folks. They are all in cahoots with each other. 

I wish I had a solution..... for me and all of ya'll. I'm just trying to feed the family and pay the bills as are you. Too much of the industry has gotten cut throat and a me only attitude.


----------



## thanohano44

a1propertyclean said:


> Yes, it does suck. I spend a lot of time cultivating clients so that we can get the good jobs, then stuff like this happens.
> 
> Our work orders are very clear regarding the photos required to close the job and be paid successfully. Both vendors totally ignored the guidelines.
> 
> If the bid photos were taken within a week of the work being approved, it wouldn't be such a big deal. But BOTH jobs were approved 2 months after the initial bid photos were taken. Now neither of these vendors have provided proof that someone else didn't come in and do the work. All I have are after photos.
> 
> This industry is just turning to crap. I spend an inordinate amount of time trying to get vendors to perform on time and conform to clients' guidelines so that everything goes smoothly for all of us, then end up spending even more time on collections, partially due to the vendors' poor documentation of the work done and partially due to the client simply being slow to pay. The rewards are just not there anymore.
> 
> I'm ready to walk away from all of it and I'm tempted to re-open my bookkeeping business. I had way fewer headaches when I was the only one doing the work. I hear ya on the control thing and, if I could get out there and do the work in other states myself, I definitely would.
> 
> Linda


I feel your pain. I had to drop a sub who could handle the volume of work I sent him, but couldnt get the right photos, follow directions, get results in on time...after me training him and his office staff...TWICE!!


----------



## Guest

Has anyone worked with US Best? Any issues? I got a call tonight looking for me to secure a property. Any feedback would be great.
Thanks


----------



## Guest

mpmaint said:


> Has anyone worked with US Best? Any issues? I got a call tonight looking for me to secure a property. Any feedback would be great.
> Thanks


Great company if you don't mind sending in 10 invoices for each piece of work and then wait 10 months Otherwise I dropped them like a hotpotato


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## Guest

We also declined to do any work with them.


----------



## Guest

We have been doing work for US Best since Aug. So far they have been great to work with! They pay super fast and have not stiffed us on anything yet. I know things can change, but so far so good with them in Cali. However we did some work for a Company called Integrity, who got all their work from Cyprexx. The guy we dealt with was Richard Rodriguez and he stiffed us for $4500. Cant find him, he wont answer emails blah blah blah. Pretty shady people out there! Beware and always go with your gut!


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## Guest

US Best seemed low on their pricing...maybe it varies by state or vendor...but they were lower on everything and the only jobs they wanted to send us were an hr away.


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## Guest

Yes, they are low, but unfortunatly, sometimes you take what you can get! And all we have done for them are BAC Initial Services, that have been pretty simple, done in a few hours. And they pay in less then two weeks.


----------



## Guest

mpmaint said:


> Has anyone worked with US Best? Any issues? I got a call tonight looking for me to secure a property. Any feedback would be great.
> Thanks


 We did some work for them in TX. They were easy to work with and paid within 2 weeks of comletion of trashout and secure.


----------



## Guest

sacoop said:


> We did some work for them in TX. They were easy to work with and paid within 2 weeks of comletion of trashout and secure.




thanks for the feedback, I think i'll check them out


----------



## Guest

isn't it funny how some contractors get along supposedly great with a certain company and others have had nothing but bad experiences? USB suc*s in our book. After the legal dept had to contact them did they pay us. No fault of ours was this late but the excuses were: our homeoffice staff has experienced significant turnover and your invoices were lost----sure-- we sent them up to 9 times. Turnover is the only thing we believed


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Out of 100 complaints against a national, there might be 5 or 6 glowing testimonials.

There are 2 things that amaze me. One, even though I always like to think positive, I am inclined to believe the majority is correct. Two, out of the few good testimonials, there will be at least 1 or 2 from folks that are disguised as vendors.

I'm not just talking about US Best. I've seen others posting rave reviews about companies, then there are no further posts from those "vendors".

I'm inclined to dismiss the onesies and twosies altogether.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Out of 100 complaints against a national, there might be 5 or 6 glowing testimonials.
> 
> There are 2 things that amaze me. One, even though I always like to think positive, I am inclined to believe the majority is correct. Two, out of the few good testimonials, there will be at least 1 or 2 from folks that are disguised as vendors.
> 
> I'm not just talking about US Best. I've seen others posting rave reviews about companies, then there are no further posts from those "vendors".
> 
> I'm inclined to dismiss the onesies and twosies altogether.
> 
> Linda







I'm a moderator an another forum and we have company insiders sign up and give the most glowing testimonies about this or that company.


They are pretty easy to spot. 

Its sickening.


----------



## Guest

Has anyone done any work for Lamco (Lenders Asset Management) and does anyone have information on their Lamco Network? We have been invited to join. Looking for info Good or Bad.

Thanks

Rich
Grangeville Environmental


----------



## BPWY

Rich51 said:


> Has anyone done any work for Lamco (Lenders Asset Management) and does anyone have information on their Lamco Network? We have been invited to join. Looking for info Good or Bad.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Rich
> Grangeville Environmental





They are a hot dang company.

Pay $225 to register with our company and we'll provide you with absolutely no guarantee of work.

I got in such a frenzy to sign up with them that I had a stroke from the high blood pressure.


















not!




Let me know if they give you work.


----------



## Guest

I don't think LAMCO sends orders but is more of a network ??? WellIknow they are always sending emails about megiving them money for something.


----------



## Guest

AS far as US Best goes, I too have seen lots of negative things about them. Fingers crossed that the people we are dealing with stay honest. After being burned big, we are cautious and dont let our invoices get too big without pay. On another note, tell me what you all think of this...
We work for a Field service company out of California. They give us a lot of LPS work. Since about October, about 90% of their LPS secures, the houses have been occupied. Some still months away from being forclosed on. Its gotten to the point where I do all the secures myself. Today we went to do one and after we gain access, we saw that the whole house was full of personals. Antique dishes, family photos, clothes etc... We completed our lock change,(on the back door only), took pics and high tailed it out of there. We reported it as occupied and submitted pictures. The jerk that we have to deal with emailed us that we had to go back and winterize and do the initial grass cut. If we didnt, he was going to do charge backs for all work done to the house, including out of area charges. He said just because there are personals dosen't mean its occupied, and we had an order that we are to follow. We told him that we didnt feel comfortable working on a house that we felt was occupied. I realize that personals dont equal occupancy, but we worry only because so many of the LPS orders have been occupied, and there were A LOT of personal belongings. What do you al think? What would you have done?
I wish we didnt have to work for these dipsh***!


----------



## Guest

joshuajames99 said:


> AS far as US Best goes, I too have seen lots of negative things about them. Fingers crossed that the people we are dealing with stay honest. After being burned big, we are cautious and dont let our invoices get too big without pay. On another note, tell me what you all think of this...
> We work for a Field service company out of California. They give us a lot of LPS work. Since about October, about 90% of their LPS secures, the houses have been occupied. Some still months away from being forclosed on. Its gotten to the point where I do all the secures myself. Today we went to do one and after we gain access, we saw that the whole house was full of personals. Antique dishes, family photos, clothes etc... We completed our lock change,(on the back door only), took pics and high tailed it out of there. We reported it as occupied and submitted pictures. The jerk that we have to deal with emailed us that we had to go back and winterize and do the initial grass cut. If we didnt, he was going to do charge backs for all work done to the house, including out of area charges. He said just because there are personals dosen't mean its occupied, and we had an order that we are to follow. We told him that we didnt feel comfortable working on a house that we felt was occupied. I realize that personals dont equal occupancy, but we worry only because so many of the LPS orders have been occupied, and there were A LOT of personal belongings. What do you al think? What would you have done?
> I wish we didnt have to work for these dipsh***!


Well thats a dilemma. I had something similar from LPS a year +/- ago..it cost us $21,000 in atty fee's. 

My advise would be: 
1) Tell the fella that is giving you orders to send a "Liability Release Form" that releases you of all liability from claims/lawsuits (won't help but might make them think)

2) Tell them all signage is going to have THEIR name and phone numbers on it--nothing with your contact info.

3) Take a pic of you talking to someone inside a doorway and say "made direct contact with occupant"

4) Tell the fella that is giving the orders to have the Police/Sheriffs Officers meet you at the property so that THEY will know that you are not the instigator of the breaking/entering.

5) Advise the fella that an eviction needs to be done.

6) RUN RUN RUN


----------



## APlusPPGroup

joshuajames99 said:


> AS far as US Best goes, I too have seen lots of negative things about them. Fingers crossed that the people we are dealing with stay honest. After being burned big, we are cautious and dont let our invoices get too big without pay. On another note, tell me what you all think of this...
> We work for a Field service company out of California. They give us a lot of LPS work. Since about October, about 90% of their LPS secures, the houses have been occupied. Some still months away from being forclosed on. Its gotten to the point where I do all the secures myself. Today we went to do one and after we gain access, we saw that the whole house was full of personals. Antique dishes, family photos, clothes etc... We completed our lock change,(on the back door only), took pics and high tailed it out of there. We reported it as occupied and submitted pictures. The jerk that we have to deal with emailed us that we had to go back and winterize and do the initial grass cut. If we didnt, he was going to do charge backs for all work done to the house, including out of area charges. He said just because there are personals dosen't mean its occupied, and we had an order that we are to follow. We told him that we didnt feel comfortable working on a house that we felt was occupied. I realize that personals dont equal occupancy, but we worry only because so many of the LPS orders have been occupied, and there were A LOT of personal belongings. What do you al think? What would you have done?
> I wish we didnt have to work for these dipsh***!


All kinds of alarms go off here for me. I don't think a waiver of liability will work but, as FremontREO says, it doesn't hurt to try and get one.

Under no circumstances, would I set another foot in the house until you know what's up. Are there any default notices posted on the front door or window?

Have you thought about looking up the listing agent and talking to him/her about the property's occupancy status or if the foreclosure / eviction process has even been started?

Not knowing the whole situation, it's difficult for me to give you any concrete advice. But be very careful about exposing yourself to unnecessary risk by going forward on the say so of the people you get the work from.

Let us know if you come up with a solution.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Is there such a thing as general liability with E&O for "Property Preservation"?.. I've been using my GL policy for my lawn service since 2007. About 80 % of assignments are for lawn cuts. I'm talking with a new asset management co that wants a policy that's for PP and my ins agent never heard of it. 

Mike (florida)


----------



## Guest

*Preservation*

I have been a contractor more than 20 years and have conducted work for HUD, and others during.
If you wish to cover yourself , be sure to have the extra insurance.
My BL covers all the required by including the double claim limits .
The advantage to working directly with the bigger parties is you do not have the Cheats like Colonial that will claim they were not paid so you are not getting paid.
BAC has thousands of properties they cannot keep up with and the afore mentioned has attempted to corner the market with them.
Helix is slow to respond to contractors requesting work as is Cyprex.
The better is to market and build with the realtors and Commercial companies individually.
Stronger bonds and closer working..


----------



## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> Is there such a thing as general liability with E&O for "Property Preservation"?.. I've been using my GL policy for my lawn service since 2007. About 80 % of assignments are for lawn cuts. I'm talking with a new asset management co that wants a policy that's for PP and my ins agent never heard of it.
> 
> Mike (florida)


No such thing as General Liability "with" E&O insurance (not for Property Preservation).
General Liability (standard form insurance policy) is required to be carried with the E&O Insurance (surplus form insurance) as underlying limits so some people think that it is 1 policy but its not--its only packaged to appear so.

This requirement is not fair to us contractors who actually do "real" work other than P&P since we now have to carry multiple General Liability Policies since 1 is for the E&O Carrier and the 2nd is for the company that writes the Work Comp or Business Policy for the trailers/trucks/equipment.

There are 2 companies that I know of that carry the surplus lines E&O that explicitely is for Property Preservation. You can go to NAMFS.org (.com maybe) and they are listed.


----------



## Guest

*Find New Insurer*

Not sure who you deal with but what a mess..
Look into a different company or become more than a Sub.


FremontREO said:


> No such thing as General Liability "with" E&O insurance (not for Property Preservation).
> General Liability (standard form insurance policy) is required to be carried with the E&O Insurance (surplus form insurance) as underlying limits so some people think that it is 1 policy but its not--its only packaged to appear so.
> 
> This requirement is not fair to us contractors who actually do "real" work other than P&P since we now have to carry multiple General Liability Policies since 1 is for the E&O Carrier and the 2nd is for the company that writes the Work Comp or Business Policy for the trailers/trucks/equipment.
> 
> There are 2 companies that I know of that carry the surplus lines E&O that explicitely is for Property Preservation. You can go to NAMFS.org (.com maybe) and they are listed.


----------



## Guest

joshuajames99 said:


> AS far as US Best goes, I too have seen lots of negative things about them. Fingers crossed that the people we are dealing with stay honest. After being burned big, we are cautious and dont let our invoices get too big without pay. On another note, tell me what you all think of this...
> We work for a Field service company out of California. They give us a lot of LPS work. Since about October, about 90% of their LPS secures, the houses have been occupied. Some still months away from being forclosed on. Its gotten to the point where I do all the secures myself. Today we went to do one and after we gain access, we saw that the whole house was full of personals. Antique dishes, family photos, clothes etc... We completed our lock change,(on the back door only), took pics and high tailed it out of there. We reported it as occupied and submitted pictures. The jerk that we have to deal with emailed us that we had to go back and winterize and do the initial grass cut. If we didnt, he was going to do charge backs for all work done to the house, including out of area charges. He said just because there are personals dosen't mean its occupied, and we had an order that we are to follow. We told him that we didnt feel comfortable working on a house that we felt was occupied. I realize that personals dont equal occupancy, but we worry only because so many of the LPS orders have been occupied, and there were A LOT of personal belongings. What do you al think? What would you have done?
> I wish we didnt have to work for these dipsh***!



In Las Vegas we have a property taxs assessors website you can go to see if the property has any leins or if the house's title has been transfered to the banks names....ANYTIME i get a rekey or secure order or request to bid i always check that site to see if the title has changed hands...It's a good tool we have here...hopefully your town/city has something similar.

and if it still shows the tenants name then i turn it down....losing out on 20-100.00 is better then 21k in attorney fees any day!


----------



## Guest

since you are on the topic of e/o insurance i got a quote for e/o insurance but it states the carrier is "mount vernon fire insurance company"...it has an a++ rating.....but since its a fire insurance company it concerns me....any comments or does it not matter?????? great rates if it will work for our industry


----------



## Guest

i got contacted today by sentinal field services.......thoughts on the company???


----------



## Guest

Thank you to all who replied to my post about US Best. There seems to be a ton of negative comments not only here but on the net as well. There are many positives as well. They offered to pay up front but I learned to go on my gut and it just didnt feel right. 
Again, We thank all of you for your input.


----------



## Guest

BetterBollards said:


> Not sure who you deal with but what a mess..
> Look into a different company or become more than a Sub.


 
HaHa...thats funny. :clap:

It is how the insurance is for this business.. IF YOU HAVE PROPER COVERAGE. Thats what is important. 

Unfortunately 99.9% of contractors and 95% of insurance agents have NO CLUE what this business is comprised of and out of ignorance, since they "don't know better", that they are fully covered properly and they have "this and that" but its to late when you find out otherwise.

After writing insurance for 27 years and dealing with surplus line companies I truly believe that 99.9% of contractors "think" they are covered when in truth they are not. 

"look into a different company or become more than a sub" ? What a joke!:shutup:


----------



## Guest

Guess I was correct..LOL


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> HaHa...thats funny. :clap:
> 
> 
> After writing insurance for 27 years and dealing with surplus line companies I truly believe that 99.9% of contractors "think" they are covered when in truth they are not.
> 
> 
> Hey buddy, go to the page before this and read what i put about an E/O quote i got yesterday and tell me what you please.
> 
> since you were in the industry of insurance i think your feedback would be good to have. Thanks bro


----------



## APlusPPGroup

C'mon, guys. Play nice.

I've noticed sooooooooooo much negativity lately toward new members and it's so counter-productive. We all come here to learn and, who knows, maybe they can teach a few of us "oldies" a thing or two. 

If we shoot 'em down as soon as they post, we'll never find out what they have to contribute.

Linda


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> since you are on the topic of e/o insurance i got a quote for e/o insurance but it states the carrier is "mount vernon fire insurance company"...it has an a++ rating.....but since its a fire insurance company it concerns me....any comments or does it not matter?????? great rates if it will work for our industry


 
They better not since that is the company I have our E&O Policy with for our Insurance Agency and losses means higher premiums for all us policyholders

But here is who they write and I didn't see anything for Property Preservations Contractors :thumbup: I left the description (for space reasons) for anything that someone may misinterpret for insurance for P&P E&O.

*Errors & Omissions*


*Allied Healthcare Professional and General Liability:*

*Personal Lines Insurance Agents Errors & Omissions:*

*Property Managers Errors & Omissions:*
Our unique form is tailored to meet the professional liability needs of both commercial and residential property managers. We offer three distinct coverages, each with a separate limit of liability: errors and omissions, tenant discrimination and employment practices liability. Our product offers coverage for up to 100% ownership interest in personally owned property. Premises Preferred Package is also available.


*Real Estate Errors & Omissions:*
Designed for real estate firms which derive at least 65% of their commission from residential real estate transactions. Discrimination and lock box coverages are automatically provided in the form. This competitively priced product provides coverage which competes with association-endorsed programs. Business Owners Package is also available.


*Specified Professions Errors & Omissions:*
Our product targets over 80 classes including advertising agencies, claims adjusters, collection agencies, landscape architects, employment agencies, event/meeting planners, human resource consultants, management/marketing consultants, tax preparers/ bookkeepers and tutors. 

*SuperTek Pak Technology Professional Liability:*

*MicroTek Pak Small Business Technology Professional Liability:*


----------



## Guest

HA! Did a I.S. today and the PO winterized it himself....with auto antifreeze even! I give him some credit, the well & water heater were empty upon arrival:thumbup:


----------



## Guest

*All of a sudden it got real quiet*

Don't know about the rest of ya'll but here in Connecticut it's like someone shut the faucet off about 4 weeks ago. Still getting $15 work orders from Alti but just ignoring them. The Realtors we work with have nothing going on. Was tempted to accept an order today from Alti for sign installs, about 100 of them at $30 each. Great $3000 worth of work! oh wait "vendor supplies the materials" Lets see.....$25per sign post, fuel, labor with the frozen ground. I declined


----------



## APlusPPGroup

somewherein815 said:


> HA! Did a I.S. today and the PO winterized it himself....with auto antifreeze even! I give him some credit, the well & water heater were empty upon arrival:thumbup:


No doubt he did it with the best of intentions but I hope you re-winterized with marine antifreeze.:thumbsup:

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> Don't know about the rest of ya'll but here in Connecticut it's like someone shut the faucet off about 4 weeks ago. Still getting $15 work orders from Alti but just ignoring them. The Realtors we work with have nothing going on. Was tempted to accept an order today from Alti for sign installs, about 100 of them at $30 each. Great $3000 worth of work! oh wait "vendor supplies the materials" Lets see.....$25per sign post, fuel, labor with the frozen ground. I declined


You have to buy your own signs? That's crazy. I don't know of any vendor who has to buy their own. They usually get shipped to our door within a day or so of the order placement. Haven't done any for Altisource yet, tho.

BTW. It's been quiet since Christmas for us, too. I'm loving it right now but have a feeling it's just the calm before the storm.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Linda
They supply the 18"x24" sign, we supply the proper sign post. Cheapest i could find was about $25 w/tax and hardware. About $2500 up front for materials, hundreds of dollars for fuel, and time to get the posts in the frozen ground. No room for profit, and I would have to try to sell or storage all the posts as they come back. Can't bring myself to do work at that price just for the sake of having some work.
At this rate, looks like I'll be expanding my Lawn Maint business in 2011


----------



## BPWY

I was in what could have easily been the absolute worst nastiest house I've been in to date.


I've been in some baaaaad ones but this one...............


The smell of feces of all kinds is so overwhelming that it was nearly impossible to change one door knob. I believe the house should be condemned!!!!!!


The pics don't even begin to do it justice.
Because of all the junk thrown down the stairs and resting at the bottom I wouldn't even be able to do a wint on it without first doing debris removal.


----------



## Guest

We've done sewage clean ups a foot deep, but its those kind of house jobs that send that chill up your back. I'm thinking that is definitely an AS IS


----------



## BPWY

Rich51 said:


> We've done sewage clean ups a foot deep, but its those kind of house jobs that send that chill up your back. I'm thinking that is definitely an AS IS










As is???



I'd recommend full demo.... immediately.


----------



## Guest

eww...looks like the one we had the other week. Thank god for subs. 

I had an insurance guy today tell me the same thing about there being a policy that combines Gen Liab and E&O spec for reo industry. He said he wasn't familiar with it, but thought it was a company out of New Jersey that offered it.

I am looking to change my insurance...wondering if anyone had company they recommended? My insurance guy is a flake and getting me all messed up.

We have actually been quite busy since Christmas. Hope it lasts. 

Having to bid a job for AIM --has inground pool, they want bid to drain and secure per HUD specs. I assume that is the wood/grated box built over the pool rather than a security cover that is anchored into the concrete? Any tips on pricing for draining and covering? I know Safeguard pays vendors 2.05/sq ft to cover. The only covers we have ever done are the vinyl security ones.

Ha...working on bid now for "dismantle and removal of 47 chicken coops" lol


----------



## Guest

Linda....I am learning to love Quickbooks! But, only thing I really dislike are the templates. Really wish there was an option to design one in word and inport. I looked at the ones on the Intuit site and they were ugly too. And thinking maybe I should have sprung for Premier rather than Pro, apparently it has more options to set price levels for each company..which would be helpful.

Another question...anyone know what Nationals have a real presence in South Carolina? We are signed with lots of them, but most of them tell me they don't do much in SC. Get a good bit from LEC, a little from AIM...
If it weren't for the local realtors, I would be in trouble. Honestly, I wish I could get a few more realtors and dump the nationals. Much less paperwork and pic requirements and they leave lights/water on for me.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

You can change the look and feel of the templates by removing lines and borders and adding logos, images, text, shading, and font styles & colors wherever you like.

I wouldn't pay the money for Premier. You can set up items to reflect different level pricing. I wouldn't do the items all at once either. Just set them up as you go along. 

You can even create just one level with no pricing and enter the pricing in as needed for each client. Sounds like you've got your work cut out for you if you break it down too much. You honestly don't need to.

Quickbooks is EASY. I love it and I just have the Pro series.

Linda


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> eww...looks like the one we had the other week. Thank god for subs.
> 
> I had an insurance guy today tell me the same thing about there being a policy that combines Gen Liab and E&O spec for reo industry. He said he wasn't familiar with it, but thought it was a company out of New Jersey that offered it.
> 
> I am looking to change my insurance...wondering if anyone had company they recommended? My insurance guy is a flake and getting me all messed up.
> 
> We have actually been quite busy since Christmas. Hope it lasts.
> 
> Having to bid a job for AIM --has inground pool, they want bid to drain and secure per HUD specs. I assume that is the wood/grated box built over the pool rather than a security cover that is anchored into the concrete? Any tips on pricing for draining and covering? I know Safeguard pays vendors 2.05/sq ft to cover. The only covers we have ever done are the vinyl security ones.
> 
> Ha...working on bid now for "dismantle and removal of 47 chicken coops" lol


 
Actually your insurance guy is "right on the mark"...They package a GL and an E&O policy together to make them look as "1" policy. They are out of Trenton, NJ. 
Its actually where I have our policy from. There is another company that I know of also out of Oregon/Wash/Ca area... Don't remember the name.
namfs.org (.com) has them listed.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> Actually your insurance guy is "right on the mark"...They package a GL and an E&O policy together to make them look as "1" policy. They are out of Trenton, NJ.
> Its actually where I have our policy from. There is another company that I know of also out of Oregon/Wash/Ca area... Don't remember the name.
> namfs.org (.com) has them listed.




York Jersey and Insurance Tek


----------



## Guest

_Real Estate Appraisers E&O Insurance_
I'm going to call this Company today. Anyone heard of them?
OREP
*$850 Minimum Premium for Mortgage Field/Property Preservation Errors & Omissions/General Liability: $2 Million Aggregate Limit -  * 
_Inspectors Liability E&O Insurance_
_Real Estate Agents & Brokers E&O Insurance_
_Mortgage Field/Property Preservation E&O Insurance_
_Energy Raters/Auditors E&O Insurance_


----------



## Guest

Now I can read it better...
OREP

*$850 Minimum Premium for Mortgage Field/Property Preservation Errors & Omissions/General Liability: $2 Million Aggregate Limit *​


----------



## Guest

*Fremont REO read alll....*

Fremont claims,27 YEARS INSURANCE WRITER AND KNOWS IT ALL..
wALMART iNSURANCE cOMPANY, lol


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Actually your insurance guy is "right on the mark"...They package a GL and an E&O policy together to make them look as "1" policy. They are out of Trenton, NJ.
> Its actually where I have our policy from. There is another company that I know of also out of Oregon/Wash/Ca area... Don't remember the name.
> namfs.org (.com) has them listed.


Wouldn't the sub have to carry their own insurance policy?

"Thank God for subs" 
_Priceless!...:w00t:_


----------



## Guest

BetterBollards said:


> Fremont claims,27 YEARS INSURANCE WRITER AND KNOWS IT ALL..
> wALMART iNSURANCE cOMPANY, lol


be nice now


----------



## BPWY

BetterBollards said:


> Fremont claims,27 YEARS INSURANCE WRITER AND KNOWS IT ALL..
> wALMART iNSURANCE cOMPANY, lol






To what great occasion do we owe your troll behavior?

Your mommy didn't hug you enough?


----------



## Guest

*Age limit*

Are the Kids allowed to post here?
first errant statements about insurance and now someone needs a hug
Cmon


----------



## Guest

Mmm...wow.

How much to haul off and dispose?


----------



## Guest

Safeguard price = $400

You can only bid it by the c.y.! :thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

OR....just a little gas and a match and finish it off.


----------



## Guest

Safeguard price = $400

You can only bid it by the c.y.! :thumbsup: 

I hope that's a joke...


----------



## Guest

BetterBollards said:


> Fremont claims,27 YEARS INSURANCE WRITER AND KNOWS IT ALL..
> wALMART iNSURANCE cOMPANY, lol


 
Bud you should read posts a little better and perhaps grow up:whistling
Nobody, including myself says we know it all. :no:


----------



## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> Wouldn't the sub have to carry their own insurance policy?
> 
> "Thank God for subs"
> _Priceless!...:w00t:_


 
Mike that is normally true unless you add the subs on as additional insureds. We pay $200 per sub to add on our policy so that they don't have to carry their own e&o policy BUT they still have to carry their own General Liability that matches our coverage limits. 

I was looking at the OREP policy and that don't look bad. I'm going to call them and "price shop" myself. What I like is that at least they offer Automatic Tail Insurance Option. Better than a claims made policy.

Just so BetterBoop knows: Even being in the insurance business we don't have a surplus lines contract with any companies that will write P&P E&O. Wish I did since I think being in the business I would know what the risk associated with this business better than an underwriter sitting at a desk in a highrise building:whistling

There is only 1 certainty in this business: *uncertainty:thumbsup:*


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Mike that is normally true unless you add the subs on as additional insureds. We pay $200 per sub to add on our policy so that they don't have to carry their own e&o policy BUT they still have to carry their own General Liability that matches our coverage limits.
> 
> I was looking at the OREP policy and that don't look bad. I'm going to call them and "price shop" myself. What I like is that at least they offer Automatic Tail Insurance Option. Better than a claims made policy.
> 
> Just so BetterBoop knows: Even being in the insurance business we don't have a surplus lines contract with any companies that will write P&P E&O. Wish I did since I think being in the business I would know what the risk associated with this business better than an underwriter sitting at a desk in a highrise building:whistling
> 
> There is only 1 certainty in this business: *uncertainty:thumbsup:*


Fremont, I just called and the lady said to fill out app & fax it to them and they can write it same or next day..:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Mmm...wow.
> 
> How much to haul off and dispose?


$4500, we just bid a similar one, there was actually a company that does this. That included capping plumbing, electrical, water and permits.


----------



## Guest

monumentinc said:


> $4500, we just bid a similar one, there was actually a company that does this. That included capping plumbing, electrical, water and permits.


Actually sent the bid about 5 mins before you posted. I bid at 5000, includes grading the plot afterward. Nice to see I was in the ballpark.


----------



## Guest

monumentinc said:


> $4500, we just bid a similar one, there was actually a company that does this. That included capping plumbing, electrical, water and permits.


Exactly what permits am I looking at?

They won't give me permit to move it, the condition makes it too unsafe to be mobile. So we are actually demo-ing on site and then hauling off.


----------



## Guest

We are in California so it may be different for you, I was referring to a building type permit to remove it and the capping of utilities also is supposed to be permitted. The mobile home mover included all of this in his bid. This was definitely a new type of service for me. We haven't had it approved yet so I'm sure I will learn more if we actually do this job. The one we bid on was actually behind a house which made it more difficult to remove too.


----------



## Guest

Hmmm...y'all get the Altisource memo for bundled services?


----------



## Guest

A2Z Field Services??


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Is there anyone in or close enough to Rohnert Park, California, who can go to a property and take 2 photos for me?

I just need one shot of the whole front of the property, including house, garage, and both sides [all in one shot] and a photo of the front door showing the type of lock that's been installed.

PM me here for details. It's a rush job so I need it done right away.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Another reason why business is slow with some banks:

https://sites.google.com/site/sueyourlendernow/ 

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, cpa, cowboy or a goatroper. Form you own decisions at your own risk


----------



## mtmtnman

BetterBollards said:


> Are the Kids allowed to post here?
> first errant statements about insurance and now someone needs a hug
> Cmon


You started it and think you know it all. How long you been doing this?? Not to long from the lack of knowledge you have is my bet...........................


----------



## mtmtnman

barefootlc said:


> Hmmm...y'all get the Altisource memo for bundled services?



Yes and i am really intrigued but will withhold judgment until i find out if there is a Cu. Yd. cap on debris..............


----------



## BPWY

BetterBollards said:


> Are the Kids allowed to post here?
> first errant statements about insurance and now someone needs a hug
> Cmon








Its pretty obvious who the kids are.




I don't know where you've learned internet forum etiquette but you've got a long way to go.
Forum rambos never make any friends. From nearly the first post you've been rude and confrontational. Knock the chip off your shoulder and get along with the other posters. "You'll be able to attract many more flies with honey than you can vinegar."


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Yes and i am really intrigued but will withhold judgment until i find out if there is a Cu. Yd. cap on debris..............







Exactly!


I got the email too.


----------



## oteroproperties

FremontREO said:


> Another reason why business is slow with some banks:
> 
> https://sites.google.com/site/sueyourlendernow/
> 
> Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer, cpa, cowboy or a goatroper. Form you own decisions at your own risk


I dont doubt that some people will get a favorable outcome, but there wont be a blanket verdict. The bottom line is you signed papers for a loan and used the property as collateral. Thats it.


----------



## Guest

Some pages back someone ask about sentinel field service, I do work for them. Price wise they arent my best vendor but the pay comes in very consistant. They are on the ball and the photo requiements are pretty detailed. But all and all a good company to work with I have had good expience with them been working with them close to 2 years.


----------



## thanohano44

somewherein815 said:


> Safeguard price = $400
> 
> You can only bid it by the c.y.! :thumbsup:


What? Safeguard would only pay $400? Are you serious? My how time has changed. I did a removal of 4 from a property in rural Arizona. I did it for $7000 each. Dumping that can't be easy. There was so much prep work to do to move them legally. I thought $7k each was low.


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> What? Safeguard would only pay $400? Are you serious?


Yes and no. They try that tactic a lot with us. Claiming things can only be bid by the C.Y. There is no way in hell I would bid a mobile home by only the c.y.

Oh, and Fremont made me spit soda out of my nose with the "goatroper" line!:laughing:


----------



## Guest

*wayyyyyy off topic....*

but too funny, this is what I see when I sit down at my laptop.


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> Yes and no. They try that tactic a lot with us. Claiming things can only be bid by the C.Y. There is no way in hell I would bid a mobile home by only the c.y.
> 
> Oh, and Fremont made me spit soda out of my nose with the "goatroper" line!:laughing:


 
Maybe not a goatroper, maybe a gelding


----------



## Guest

It was all in good fun 

Hey anyone heard the news with the Fannie Servicers today? Was it just a few or all of them?

The layoffs......that is.....


----------



## Guest

i hadn't heard... of course, my tv stays tuned to nick jr all day and my xm to kids place live.


----------



## Guest

From page 97 of this thread......










HA HA HA, just bustin' your chops a bit. Only reason I noticed it is because I have page 97 saved on my favorites and thats the first thing I see every time I open this forum. 


Disclaimer: I like grilled cheese sandwiches with Jesus images burned into them. 


Please carry on.........


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> From page 97 of this thread......
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> HA HA HA, just bustin' your chops a bit. Only reason I noticed it is because I have page 97 saved on my favorites and thats the first thing I see every time I open this forum.
> 
> 
> Disclaimer: I like grilled cheese sandwiches with Jesus images burned into them.
> 
> 
> Please carry on.........


Alright women no smart comments but I guess we "missed the bowl" :clap:


----------



## thanohano44

IdahoProperty said:


> Some pages back someone ask about sentinel field service, I do work for them. Price wise they arent my best vendor but the pay comes in very consistant. They are on the ball and the photo requiements are pretty detailed. But all and all a good company to work with I have had good expience with them been working with them close to 2 years.


 
I have also worked for them for 2 years. they are great to work with.


----------



## thanohano44

joshuajames99 said:


> We have been doing work for US Best since Aug. So far they have been great to work with! They pay super fast and have not stiffed us on anything yet. I know things can change, but so far so good with them in Cali. However we did some work for a Company called Integrity, who got all their work from Cyprexx. The guy we dealt with was Richard Rodriguez and he stiffed us for $4500. Cant find him, he wont answer emails blah blah blah. Pretty shady people out there! Beware and always go with your gut!


 i know Richard...I really doubt what you just said.


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> What? Safeguard would only pay $400? Are you serious? My how time has changed. I did a removal of 4 from a property in rural Arizona. I did it for $7000 each. Dumping that can't be easy. There was so much prep work to do to move them legally. I thought $7k each was low.





I know $7000 would be on the low side around these parts for an onsite demo and haul off.


In 08 we had a lighting strike right on the roof of our single wide. The FD got the fire out but the ins company decided to total it out. If I remember right the charge was some thing like $3200 to put wheels and axles on it, unblock it and tow it the 15 miles to the landfill. Took the crew most of the day.


I'd expect onsite demo to be much higher because of more equipment needed.


----------



## Guest

*New Member In Search of Property Preservation/REO Intel*

Greetings and Happy New Year,

As a new member to CT, I enjoy reading the various comms regarding property preservation and bid projects relating to foreclosed and reo properties. ‘Thanks be to you’ for your insight and tips.

After my third assignment to Iraq as an U.S. Army contractor, I returned home to northern Michigan in August 2010. Finding a job in this part of Michigan was like trying to find a Home Depot in Baghdad – it just wasn’t there! Long story short, during the last quarter of 2010, I took my many years of project management experience, people skills and a ‘can-do’ attitude and launched my own reo property services company.

While I’ve gotten a few jobs under my belt, I’m finding out that by the time I add all my variable costs such as dumpster rental, fuel, extra supplies and labor costs into my proposals, some of the decision-makers find my bid to be higher. I try to keep within HUD and Fannie Mae guidelines – but it’s difficult to break even, let alone make anything that resembles a profit. Insurance premiums and vehicle expenses aren’t helping either!

I don’t expect to become a millionaire – but I would at least like to make enough to provide for my family. I would love nothing more than to get off unemployment and once again have gainful employment (and) pride of owning my own successful business.

To that end, does anyone have any tips or ‘Best practice’ guidelines that I can learn from (that) will help me put together better proposals? While I’m used to dealing with gov contracts and working in hostile environments, perhaps I’m making my bid process too complicated! Thank you; stay safe and best of luck in the New Year!


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Hmmm...y'all get the Altisource memo for bundled services?




i did....it actually doesn't look half bad....


----------



## Guest

Get a trailer and stop using dumpsters. They are way too expensive relative to hauling and dumping debris with a dump trailer. Examine all of your costs and see what you can do more efficiently.


----------



## BPWY

tango51 said:


> Greetings and Happy New Year,
> 
> As a new member to CT, I enjoy reading the various comms regarding property preservation and bid projects relating to foreclosed and reo properties. ‘Thanks be to you’ for your insight and tips.
> 
> After my third assignment to Iraq as an U.S. Army contractor, I returned home to northern Michigan in August 2010. Finding a job in this part of Michigan was like trying to find a Home Depot in Baghdad – it just wasn’t there! Long story short, during the last quarter of 2010, I took my many years of project management experience, people skills and a ‘can-do’ attitude and launched my own reo property services company.
> 
> While I’ve gotten a few jobs under my belt, I’m finding out that by the time I add all my variable costs such as dumpster rental, fuel, extra supplies and labor costs into my proposals, some of the decision-makers find my bid to be higher. I try to keep within HUD and Fannie Mae guidelines – but it’s difficult to break even, let alone make anything that resembles a profit. Insurance premiums and vehicle expenses aren’t helping either!
> 
> I don’t expect to become a millionaire – but I would at least like to make enough to provide for my family. I would love nothing more than to get off unemployment and once again have gainful employment (and) pride of owning my own successful business.
> 
> To that end, does anyone have any tips or ‘Best practice’ guidelines that I can learn from (that) will help me put together better proposals? While I’m used to dealing with gov contracts and working in hostile environments, perhaps I’m making my bid process too complicated! Thank you; stay safe and best of luck in the New Year!







If you are already broke going into the P&P business will only make you broker.



I don't mean to sound harsh but its the cold harsh reality of truth. Read the last 10 or so pages. Even those that have been in the biz for some time are hurting. 

The banks have choked up on the amount of work they are releasing and the nationals have choked up on the purse strings. There is super heavy downward pressure on the amount of payment for different items and the nationals spend their days trying to figure out new and mo better ways at changing their already assinine job requirements to give them a reason to reduce or outright deny payment all together.

I'd love to paint a rosey pic of $$$$$$$ for all but it aint the case.
Not in this industry.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Welcome to CT, Tango51. 

Sometimes it takes reading some of the pages here more than once to really understand what everyone's trying to say.

Filter through all the info and dismiss all the petty squabbles and I think you'll find what you're looking for.

Linda


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> i did....it actually doesn't look half bad....


 
True...as long as you don't have to secure an inground pool...or like my present project, demo and remove approx 30 chicken coops. I assume it's a "call from site if it can't be done for allowable"...


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> If you are already broke going into the P&P business will only make you broker.
> 
> 
> 
> I don't mean to sound harsh but its the cold harsh reality of truth. Read the last 10 or so pages. Even those that have been in the biz for some time are hurting.
> 
> The banks have choked up on the amount of work they are releasing and the nationals have choked up on the purse strings. There is super heavy downward pressure on the amount of payment for different items and the nationals spend their days trying to figure out new and mo better ways at changing their already assinine job requirements to give them a reason to reduce or outright deny payment all together.
> 
> I'd love to paint a rosey pic of $$$$$$$ for all but it aint the case.
> Not in this industry.


Totally agree...we went into this with enough savings to keep us afloat for about 4 months, but still things got really tight before we actually started making some money. Waiting 30 days for payments is rough, esp when you consider the money you have to put into the jobs upfront (pool covers, locks, lockboxes, etc).


----------



## Guest

RE US Best....they sent us a price sheet. I truly thought it was a joke. 
15 cyd debris removal?
50 winterizations?
0 for lock boxes?

obviously they had us on the bottom price matrix, lol.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I know $7000 would be on the low side around these parts for an onsite demo and haul off.
> 
> 
> In 08 we had a lighting strike right on the roof of our single wide. The FD got the fire out but the ins company decided to total it out. If I remember right the charge was some thing like $3200 to put wheels and axles on it, unblock it and tow it the 15 miles to the landfill. Took the crew most of the day.
> 
> 
> I'd expect onsite demo to be much higher because of more equipment needed.


I am realistic enough to admit this is beyond our scope...we are subbing it out and they assure me they can do it for 5000 and give me 15% for setting up the job. My only concern is limiting their interaction with the customer. Do not trust this guy not to try to squeeze us out of future work.


----------



## oteroproperties

tango51,

if you read any of the previous posts you would know that usually im the optimistic one, but........... 

I would try and find something a little more profitable if i were you. The problem with this business even more then the battle with the nationals is with the competition. It's all over the place and they are willing to do crazy things like work for free to cut you out. 

I didnt read anywhere in your post that you were broke, and i know a few govt contractors that are buying houses by the 10s right so dont take this the wrong way, but you will need money, patience, and a side gig to make it in this business right now.

I also have a PSA for all new comers. Think about the indusrty your trying to gain access to before you start. This is not the kind of business you get into as a last resort. The glitz and glamour of this will be all over in a few years (seems like its happening now) and you will be left trying to find a regular job when the work goes back to the few that were carrying all this before the boom.

If you are looking for something to put food on the table then try to get in with a good regional and remove your self from as much liability as you can. Operate it as a flexible job not a business. it will be much more bearable that way. but if you are a glutten for punishment (as i am) then do every single thing you can to be as efficient as possible. I custom build my trucks, trailers and even some equipment to ensure that a job can be completed as fast as possible with minimal wear on me, my crew, and our equipment. I learned to pick locks very well and can rekey almost any of them. I buy gold and silver metallic paint to recondition knobs and locks. i buy material from craigslist i.e plywood and 2x4's from completed construction projects, and sometimes even inventory from an out of work REO PP contractor. You have to do what ever it take, morally acceptable of course........


----------



## oteroproperties

Just got done building this mini trailer for the new grass season. It will be equip that 36 toro that i bought for 100 and wil be putting a new motor on (a motor i had from a trashout i did) now thats a whole mini grass rig for $500.00


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> Just got done building this mini trailer for the new grass season. It will be equip that 36 toro that i bought for 100 and wil be putting a new motor on (a motor i had from a trashout i did) now thats a whole mini grass rig for $500.00


Nice score on the TORO! Them things come in handy!:clap:


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> tango51,
> 
> 
> 
> I didnt read anywhere in your post that you were broke,






> Originally Posted by *tango51*
> I would love nothing more than to get off unemployment and once again have gainful employment








I'm the one that made the assumption of broke.


Believe me I'd love to paint a rosey pic but simply can't.


I know that Central Valley has a lot of work in MI but when you consider that you'll be waiting a min of 60 days for payment and by the time that the check is cut and mail delivery it approaches 75 or more ........... its tough to work for them.


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> RE US Best....they sent us a price sheet. I truly thought it was a joke.
> 15 cyd debris removal?
> 50 winterizations?
> 0 for lock boxes?
> 
> obviously they had us on the bottom price matrix, lol.






When you take BAC's already low prices and discount them I'm sure the price is low.


$0 for a lock box?????????????????????? they really have lost their minds. 
Last I checked those things cost close to $15 each when you figure in shipping.


----------



## Guest

Tango, where are you from ? I do not see the property preservation side as being a loosing business, but you never know me and my partner have been improving month after month and we aren't new to this but just like with any business it can all fall out from underneath us at anytime. But till that time I just try to make the most money I can.


----------



## Guest

tango51 said:


> Greetings and Happy New Year,
> 
> As a new member to CT, I enjoy reading the various comms regarding property preservation and bid projects relating to foreclosed and reo properties. ‘Thanks be to you’ for your insight and tips.
> 
> After my third assignment to Iraq as an U.S. Army contractor, I returned home to northern Michigan in August 2010. Finding a job in this part of Michigan was like trying to find a Home Depot in Baghdad – it just wasn’t there! Long story short, during the last quarter of 2010, I took my many years of project management experience, people skills and a ‘can-do’ attitude and launched my own reo property services company.
> 
> While I’ve gotten a few jobs under my belt, I’m finding out that by the time I add all my variable costs such as dumpster rental, fuel, extra supplies and labor costs into my proposals, some of the decision-makers find my bid to be higher. I try to keep within HUD and Fannie Mae guidelines – but it’s difficult to break even, let alone make anything that resembles a profit. Insurance premiums and vehicle expenses aren’t helping either!
> 
> I don’t expect to become a millionaire – but I would at least like to make enough to provide for my family. I would love nothing more than to get off unemployment and once again have gainful employment (and) pride of owning my own successful business.
> 
> To that end, does anyone have any tips or ‘Best practice’ guidelines that I can learn from (that) will help me put together better proposals? While I’m used to dealing with gov contracts and working in hostile environments, perhaps I’m making my bid process too complicated! Thank you; stay safe and best of luck in the New Year!


I want to Thank You for your service and hope all is well:notworthy

Yes you can make a living in this industry but just don't expect to "get rich". Unfortunately if you are to be a successful businessman/woman your goal should be to get rich and not to buy yourself a job. 

Its hard for us that have been in the business for several years since we "know what it used to be". 3 years ago you could be blind and have a kindergarten education and you would make money---NOT today. 
A good business plan and a good platoon sarge leading the crew and you would be watching the savings acct go UP and not DOWN. 

I will share an example that a few on this forum and I have spoke about:

2009 Invoices X111
2010 Invoices X129 (18 additional invoices for the year--a wash)

2010 vs 2009 Gross Income=== DOWN 37.9% in 2010. 

The Banks and service companies are requiring more work for less pay. At this pace there won't be any "knowledgable and dedicated" contractors left. They (banks/service companies) are removing items that we used to able to bid and have established a "set amount" that is being paid. This takes away a profit potential. As these profit potentials evaporate the contractors are evaporating. 

I'm sure your bidding is mark on BUT till you learn how to "word your bid" the approval process will be limited. Its assinine but that is the people you/we work with.

I can provide 100's of "imaginative bid wordings" and everyone here can too....maybe some will share a few. I don't remember who posted about a roof repair bid that was denied and then he reworded the bid (same work) and it was approved. Go back 20 pages and look forward. 

Good luck and THANK YOU!


----------



## mtmtnman

One particular bank has head firmly inserted in back door. Got an initial secure Thursday and will have to call the "HOTLINE" for an auth. #. Here is the history of this property. Not the dates AND years........

W/O # ****** _*Oct. 15th 2009*_ Initial secure and noted Black Mold.

W/O ******x Obtain bid for mold. ($42,000)

W/O # ******x Feb. 15th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
unsecure and noted black mold.

W/O # ******x March 18th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
unsecure and noted black mold.

W/O# ******x April 6th 2010 Bid Grass.

W/O# ******x June 22 2010 Bid Grass.

W/O# ******x June 22 2010 Bid Grass.

W/O# ******x July 14th 2010 Bid Grass.

W/O# ******x August 5th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
unsecure and noted black mold and water in basement.

W/O ******x Aug. 26th 2010 CK for conveyance. Noted mold and water.

W/O# ******x Aug. 29th 2010 Bid approval cut lawn.

W/O# ******x Sept. 21 2010 Restore Utilities.

W/O# ******x Oct. 19 2010 Re-secure W/O. Noted mold and water.

And i get this one Thursday (#******x) for initial secure after i have
been in and around the property 13 + times in the last 15 months and
reported mold and water over and over and over and over again. Is
nobody reading my reports??


----------



## Guest

Can you say "inspector"?:thumbsup:


----------



## thanohano44

tango51 said:


> Greetings and Happy New Year,
> 
> As a new member to CT, I enjoy reading the various comms regarding property preservation and bid projects relating to foreclosed and reo properties. ‘Thanks be to you’ for your insight and tips.
> 
> After my third assignment to Iraq as an U.S. Army contractor, I returned home to northern Michigan in August 2010. Finding a job in this part of Michigan was like trying to find a Home Depot in Baghdad – it just wasn’t there! Long story short, during the last quarter of 2010, I took my many years of project management experience, people skills and a ‘can-do’ attitude and launched my own reo property services company.
> 
> While I’ve gotten a few jobs under my belt, I’m finding out that by the time I add all my variable costs such as dumpster rental, fuel, extra supplies and labor costs into my proposals, some of the decision-makers find my bid to be higher. I try to keep within HUD and Fannie Mae guidelines – but it’s difficult to break even, let alone make anything that resembles a profit. Insurance premiums and vehicle expenses aren’t helping either!
> 
> I don’t expect to become a millionaire – but I would at least like to make enough to provide for my family. I would love nothing more than to get off unemployment and once again have gainful employment (and) pride of owning my own successful business.
> 
> To that end, does anyone have any tips or ‘Best practice’ guidelines that I can learn from (that) will help me put together better proposals? While I’m used to dealing with gov contracts and working in hostile environments, perhaps I’m making my bid process too complicated! Thank you; stay safe and best of luck in the New Year!


 
be very descriptive in your bids and why you are bidding the prices that you are. break it down for them in man hours if you have to. just don't include travel fee's. explain to them why the set prices are not acceptable for the work you are bidding on.


----------



## thanohano44

mtmtnman said:


> One particular bank has head firmly inserted in back door. Got an initial secure Thursday and will have to call the "HOTLINE" for an auth. #. Here is the history of this property. Not the dates AND years........
> 
> W/O # ****** _*Oct. 15th 2009*_ Initial secure and noted Black Mold.
> 
> W/O ******x Obtain bid for mold. ($42,000)
> 
> W/O # ******x Feb. 15th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
> unsecure and noted black mold.
> 
> W/O # ******x March 18th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
> unsecure and noted black mold.
> 
> W/O# ******x April 6th 2010 Bid Grass.
> 
> W/O# ******x June 22 2010 Bid Grass.
> 
> W/O# ******x June 22 2010 Bid Grass.
> 
> W/O# ******x July 14th 2010 Bid Grass.
> 
> W/O# ******x August 5th 2010 Inspection as property was reported
> unsecure and noted black mold and water in basement.
> 
> W/O ******x Aug. 26th 2010 CK for conveyance. Noted mold and water.
> 
> W/O# ******x Aug. 29th 2010 Bid approval cut lawn.
> 
> W/O# ******x Sept. 21 2010 Restore Utilities.
> 
> W/O# ******x Oct. 19 2010 Re-secure W/O. Noted mold and water.
> 
> And i get this one Thursday (#******x) for initial secure after i have
> been in and around the property 13 + times in the last 15 months and
> reported mold and water over and over and over and over again. Is
> nobody reading my reports??


is the property conveying into another loan...for example, FHA to CONV or VA? just wondering. that could be why you're getting another initial secure.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> When you take BAC's already low prices and discount them I'm sure the price is low.
> 
> 
> $0 for a lock box?????????????????????? they really have lost their minds.
> Last I checked those things cost close to $15 each when you figure in shipping.


 
are they providing the lock boxes like FAS does?


----------



## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> In all the States I have worked in I gotta admit SC has some of the weirdest ways of putting an address to a property.
> 
> I had 1 in Aiken, SC that the inspector put all the signage on the doors and I just knew this could not be the right house....kept calling the Service Company and saying this cannot be right (they wanted us to trash out). The locks had been changed by the inspector so I go inside and the house is full of personals but you could tell nobody had been there for a long long time....
> 
> There was a house right behind the home that was secured that had the same address number that was newer but occupied....I gotta admit that it was confusing at best but I was taking no chances...
> 
> When the Service Company wouldn't listen I told them to reassign.
> 
> Last I hear till I got subpeoned from the inspector who got sued as part of a lawsuit that the contractor trashed the wrong house....Apparently the inspector ALSO told the service company that this was the wrong house or wrong address BUT the picture the service company sent was the house he secured....
> Lady who owned the house was in the nursing home for over 2 years....house full of antiques and family heirlooms...:no:


 
i ran into a situation like this for the LPS RFP winner for AZ back in March. I advised them that the house had more than $500 in personal property (cadillac escalade in garage, an 2003 model) many booksm clothes etc. the demanded I trash it out. and wanted me to take a 50% discount due to the size of the job, over 300 yds. I advised them I cannot do it based off of their guidelines and that they need to reassign it.

the owner was in a nursing home, he children came down from Boston to pack up and handle her affairs. the home hadnt foreclosed yet, it was just considered vacant/abandoned. how do you like them apples?


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> i ran into a situation like this for the LPS RFP winner for AZ back in March. I advised them that the house had more than $500 in personal property (cadillac escalade in garage, an 2003 model) many booksm clothes etc. the demanded I trash it out. and wanted me to take a 50% discount due to the size of the job, over 300 yds. I advised them I cannot do it based off of their guidelines and that they need to reassign it.
> 
> the owner was in a nursing home, he children came down from Boston to pack up and handle her affairs. the home hadnt foreclosed yet, it was just considered vacant/abandoned. how do you like them apples?


 
Exactly the problem...the Service Companies don't care if "you" do something wrong since by contract you are "suppose to follow local/state/federal/city" laws and codes. Unfortunately its like taking a knife to a gun fight. The poor guy/gal in the field does not have all the "information" to make informed decisions. The abandoned term is what is starting to get the contractors. According to our lawyer the person going through foreclosure only has to "state" they are going by 1x every 30days to check on the property and the house is not abandoned thus you/I can't complete most services. We just learned last week that in 1 of the States we service that if the homeowner is going through foreclosure all they have to do is call a realtor and list it for sale and the redemption starts over, as explained by the Service Company to us. We had to remove locks/lockboxes/window signs/wz signs from 20+ houses last week.


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> i know Richard...I really doubt what you just said.


If you know Richard, could you PLEASE tell me how to contact him. I spoke the honest truth. We did work for him fro Sep-Nov, then he dropped off the planet. His phones are all disconnected and his emails don't work. He owes us $4500 and never paid a dime. We have been trying to locate him but don't have much to go on. I posted a comment on another site about him and in 2 days had 3 contractors from CA write me and say the same thing happened to them. Honestly, if you have a way for me to get a hold of him please let me know. Cyprexx wrote us and said he was paid for the work that we did. However, we were not, and that is stealing.


----------



## Guest

Thanks for your insight. As I take a forward leaning posture regarding this endeavor, your thoughts parallel with my own. At some point in the near future, I will decide to either push forward or cut my losses and move on. One can lose a battle but still win the war!
 
I’ve been contacted by a larger company (AMS) to become a sub for them. In terms of more exposure and perhaps more jobs, I might go through the paperwork process and see what develops.
Thanks again and stay safe!


----------



## mtmtnman

tango51 said:


> Thanks for your insight. As I take a forward leaning posture regarding this endeavor, your thoughts parallel with my own. At some point in the near future, I will decide to either push forward or cut my losses and move on. One can lose a battle but still win the war!
> 
> I’ve been contacted by a larger company (AMS) to become a sub for them. In terms of more exposure and perhaps more jobs, I might go through the paperwork process and see what develops.
> Thanks again and stay safe!




I have been working for them for over a year and things had been pretty good but the new pricing structure came out today and i don't know that i can stay profitable with them anymore....................................


----------



## JenkinsHB

tango51 said:


> Thanks for your insight. As I take a forward leaning posture regarding this endeavor, your thoughts parallel with my own. At some point in the near future, I will decide to either push forward or cut my losses and move on. One can lose a battle but still win the war!
> 
> I’ve been contacted by a larger company (AMS) to become a sub for them. In terms of more exposure and perhaps more jobs, I might go through the paperwork process and see what develops.
> Thanks again and stay safe!


I've worked for AMS for a couple of months. I've received 2 bid approvals from them. One for $5 and another for $11. I've had people there promise me 40+ properties, but they are all full of it.


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> I am realistic enough to admit this is beyond our scope...we are subbing it out and they assure me they can do it for 5000 and give me 15% for setting up the job. My only concern is limiting their interaction with the customer. Do not trust this guy not to try to squeeze us out of future work.




that will happen....it's happened to me once....they would rather make the extra 15% and take the other work you do in house from you as well...be very careful


----------



## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> i ran into a situation like this for the LPS RFP winner for AZ back in March. I advised them that the house had more than $500 in personal property (cadillac escalade in garage, an 2003 model) many booksm clothes etc. the demanded I trash it out. and wanted me to take a 50% discount due to the size of the job, over 300 yds. I advised them I cannot do it based off of their guidelines and that they need to reassign it.
> 
> the owner was in a nursing home, he children came down from Boston to pack up and handle her affairs. the home hadnt foreclosed yet, it was just considered vacant/abandoned. how do you like them apples?




A 50% DISCOUNT????!??!?!?! ARE THEY F&%K#$G CRAZY???? they want 50% of the pay to "assign" a job???? see this is the problem right there.....50% of the take is way more then a referral fee!!


----------



## mtmtnman

D&R Services said:


> A 50% DISCOUNT????!??!?!?! ARE THEY F&%K#$G CRAZY???? they want 50% of the pay to "assign" a job???? see this is the problem right there.....50% of the take is way more then a referral fee!!



Yup. Sounds like truck driving where it is not uncommon for the freight broker to take 50-75% of the load.............


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> that will happen....it's happened to me once....they would rather make the extra 15% and take the other work you do in house from you as well...be very careful


If they are a subcontractor they work for you and are paid by you. We never connect our subcontractors with our clients, neither would need us anymore....


----------



## mtmtnman

monumentinc said:


> If they are a subcontractor they work for you and are paid by you. We never connect our subcontractors with our clients, neither would need us anymore....



The problem is they see the postings on the property and end up hooking themselves up...........


----------



## brm1109

*Time stamping photos on Kodak C183*

Hello all,
I just got a Kodak C183 camera and for some reason in order to get the date stamp on the photo, I need to go to each photo and edit it with the stamp. Can somebody tell me how to get the camera to automatically date stamp the pic? Thanks


----------



## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> Hello all,
> I just got a Kodak C183 camera and for some reason in order to get the date stamp on the photo, I need to go to each photo and edit it with the stamp. Can somebody tell me how to get the camera to automatically date stamp the pic? Thanks




I don't datestamp ANY photos as many of the companies i do business with don't want them and some want date AND time. Use a photo editing program to pull the EXIF data from the photo file and add a datestamp if needed. I can date 200 photos in about 45 seconds.................


----------



## thanohano44

joshuajames99 said:


> If you know Richard, could you PLEASE tell me how to contact him. I spoke the honest truth. We did work for him fro Sep-Nov, then he dropped off the planet. His phones are all disconnected and his emails don't work. He owes us $4500 and never paid a dime. We have been trying to locate him but don't have much to go on. I posted a comment on another site about him and in 2 days had 3 contractors from CA write me and say the same thing happened to them. Honestly, if you have a way for me to get a hold of him please let me know. Cyprexx wrote us and said he was paid for the work that we did. However, we were not, and that is stealing.


 
have you been to their office off of Bell Rd in Phoenix?


----------



## thanohano44

D&R Services said:


> A 50% DISCOUNT????!??!?!?! ARE THEY F&%K#$G CRAZY???? they want 50% of the pay to "assign" a job???? see this is the problem right there.....50% of the take is way more then a referral fee!!


yes...thats because they have set pricing for each job(a flat fee)....LPS is not the only one who does this...so does FAS.


----------



## Guest

No, I live in CA. I have 2 different numbers for him but they are both disconnected. And We sent him numerous emails to the only email address we had for his "Integrity" company and we never got a response, and finally we started getting those emails back as invalid address. Any info you have for finding him would be very much appriciated. We are in the process of placing liens on the properties and will be pursuing any legal actions we can.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Hello all,
> I just got a Kodak C183 camera and for some reason in order to get the date stamp on the photo, I need to go to each photo and edit it with the stamp. Can somebody tell me how to get the camera to automatically date stamp the pic? Thanks


 I have C142 and have the same problem, I don't think it will do it automaticly. I just ordered 2 C183's hoping to not have the same problem. I have had tons of Kodak easy share cameras and never had the date not be automatic. These must have been just a little too cheap...


----------



## mtmtnman

monumentinc said:


> I have C142 and have the same problem, I don't think it will do it automaticly. I just ordered 2 C183's hoping to not have the same problem. I have had tons of Kodak easy share cameras and never had the date not be automatic. These must have been just a little too cheap...



I use Cannon's as they are one of the few that take in 640x480. No re size necessary. Here are a few pics. 16 seconds to datestamp 100 photos. Nothing illegal or immoral about this as it's pulling date and time from the SD card and adding it.


----------



## BPWY

For the extra initial up front cost of your cannon I'll deal with the few seconds longer that it takes to resize and date stamp at the same time.

If I was resizing those it would have been about 45 seconds to resize and date stamp. 
Negligible time saved compared to cost.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> For the extra initial up front cost of your cannon I'll deal with the few seconds longer that it takes to resize and date stamp at the same time.
> 
> If I was resizing those it would have been about 45 seconds to resize and date stamp.
> Negligible time saved compared to cost.



Hell i'm still picking them up at pawn shops for for a Grant. Kodaks seem to bring around a Franklin but always come with that docking station.


----------



## BPWY

lol


Different model numbers come without the printer.


----------



## BPWY

I seem to remember how pissed you were the last time you TRIED to find one at the pawn shop.
Lol, my last kodak from the pawn shop was $65 NEW.
From china mart they are $100 plus.


----------



## Guest

joshuajames99 said:


> No, I live in CA. I have 2 different numbers for him but they are both disconnected. And We sent him numerous emails to the only email address we had for his "Integrity" company and we never got a response, and finally we started getting those emails back as invalid address. Any info you have for finding him would be very much appriciated. We are in the process of placing liens on the properties and will be pursuing any legal actions we can.


 
He contacted me about working for him in Utah last spring. Said he had tons of work and then quit answering his phone and responding to email before I actually did any work. I am glad now he did that before he owed me any money.

Sorry to hear about the headache.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> He contacted me about working for him in Utah last spring. Said he had tons of work and then quit answering his phone and responding to email before I actually did any work. I am glad now he did that before he owed me any money.
> 
> Sorry to hear about the headache.


Yes, be thankful! It is very unfortunate that this happens. Hopefully we will be able to find him. At the very least put a stop to him doing this to others.


----------



## Guest

Well, this is a first for me. Submitted a bid on a property last week....company just emailed me and actually ADDED to my bid, to the tune of another 800 bucks. Basically same cyd but they are breaking it down into lots of categories. Also added additional cost for cleaning appliances, we always bid that to be included in sales clean. Just seems odd to have them basically offering more for same amount of work.


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Well, this is a first for me. Submitted a bid on a property last week....company just emailed me and actually ADDED to my bid, to the tune of another 800 bucks. Basically same cyd but they are breaking it down into lots of categories. Also added additional cost for cleaning appliances, we always bid that to be included in sales clean. Just seems odd to have them basically offering more for same amount of work.


That is great. It only happened to me once when I was doing a job for The REO Contractor. They were really good to work with. But because of the changes in this industry, they moved on to other things.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

thanohano44 said:


> yes...thats because they have set pricing for each job....LPS is not the only one who does this...so does FAS.


 
And Cyprexx!

Linda


----------



## thanohano44

anyone here use the iphone for taking pix? We do for recurring work. we use an app called PHOTOZIPSEND.

you need the iphone 4 since the camera is better and there is a flash. anyone know of any droid apps that can do the same. AT&T's service is awful. I wish we never left Verizon. we use the digitial camera's for big jobs, bids and trash outs.


----------



## thanohano44

a1propertyclean said:


> And Cyprexx!
> 
> Linda


 cyprexx contacted us a few times to do work for them in some rural area's in which they had no coverage. They had agreed to not take a discount if I would help them out on a few jobs. they kept their word. I did about 18 Trash outs for them in rural Utah and Arizona and it was nice. they told me if I came on full time with them, they would have to discount my work. I'm mulling that offer.

any advice?


----------



## Guest

Cyprexx has never taken any discounts when we worked with them unless your company doesn't have work comp. They are a good "short term" company to work with since they take YOUR bid and then mark it up substancially and keep the difference. This was acceptable till the realtors started showing just HOW MUCH they were marking up and that kinda soured the stomach... $1200 bid job and they got $2700 approval? Many jobs around $800 to us and they got $2000 approval. 
For 2 years we did OK with them and got up to approx $500k volume then along comes someone else that would do the $800 job for $700 and vamoose...gone....adios to them. Got bad work from the $700 contractors and they came back asking us to help and by then we had went on down the road and replaced them with more volume...NOW IF THAT was today, with the markets we are in, I couldn't blame anyone for wanting to just earn a dime..... That was then when most companies were good.....or better than now


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> anyone here use the iphone for taking pix? We do for recurring work. we use an app called PHOTOZIPSEND.
> 
> you need the iphone 4 since the camera is better and there is a flash. anyone know of any droid apps that can do the same. AT&T's service is awful. I wish we never left Verizon. we use the digitial camera's for big jobs, bids and trash outs.






Yesterday I heard on the radio some thing along the lines of 2/10 you can go back to VZ and still have your iphone.


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> Well, this is a first for me. Submitted a bid on a property last week....company just emailed me and actually ADDED to my bid, to the tune of another 800 bucks. Basically same cyd but they are breaking it down into lots of categories. Also added additional cost for cleaning appliances, we always bid that to be included in sales clean. Just seems odd to have them basically offering more for same amount of work.







Sounds like America's Infomart.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> ..... That was then when most companies were good.....or better than now






Better than now....... doesn't take a whole lot. :no:


----------



## Guest

For those of us in the snowy areas......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPg1ZMiC9pA


----------



## Guest

*Serious Advise Needed*

Hello to all,
I'm new to this site, but I have been reading comments for the past few months. I find this site to be very helpful and informative. Having said that, I have a question. Well first let me provide some back ground information. My husband and I started our own property preservation company about 2 yrs ago. We both lost our jobs. His line of work was in the PP business so he had years of experience. I had the administrative experience so we make a great team. Since starting we have been sub-contracting. My husband is a very hard worker, he works 7 days a wk most of the time. He strongly believes in quality and it shows in his work. The man that we are sub-contracting with praises him all the time, especially since my husband saved him from losing his contract with FAS. The only problem is the praise is verbal and financial. We are ready to start to contract with nation PP companies. So my question is...where do we start? What companies would you suggest. We've actually tried FAS, but there currently looking for new vendors at this time. Please help!!!

Ruth


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> For those of us in the snowy areas......
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tPg1ZMiC9pA






I love that clip, I've seen it several times and it never gets old.


----------



## BPWY

OK, so I get an initial secure w/o. I go to the property and as soon as I get out of the truck what do I see?? ice flowing out of the foundation.

I'm thinking this can't be good.


Upon further checking I find that the basement has at least 18'' in it and rising quickly because the line is broke and actively flowing.


But because of the over $1000 in personals specified in the w/o I cannot enter the property. I take photos and leave.
I just don't have it in me to give much of a dang.... the banks and nationals don't. Why should I?


----------



## Guest

Ah yes. I had one of them just North of Chicago my second year. Mine was a bit higher up though...ice waterfall out of the kitchen window. Though I was able to perform the I.S. since it was just the water line for the sink broken and pointing directly at the base of the window. The basement had minimal flooding. The ice sculpture was quite nice though! I think it was art?


----------



## Guest

Seems this year we are running into these all the time..maybe the contractors (newbies) don't know what they are doing? Banks are loving this since they are getting them fixed up for free off the contractors insurance policies so they are hoping they go to mold FAST....No drying or water removal approvals so the house will go to mold. To bad since those contractors that actually did the "mistake" should not be responsible for the extensive damages that will happen over the next few months when the banks KNOW that there is damage and it can be fixed NOW for minimal amounts. They just want the contractors insurance monies


----------



## Guest

wrong pic


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY, You think the finance co. is looking for those 2 ATV's???:whistling:whistling:whistling:whistling


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> BPWY, You think the finance co. is looking for those 2 ATV's???:whistling:whistling:whistling:whistling






Would be an easy repo. Garage isn't exactly secure. 
And its got windows in it. If so they aren't very well hidden.

It does seem kinda funny that those two items are the only two things of personal property at the property.
Looking thru the house windows its obvious nobody is living there.


----------



## BPWY

The bleakest year in foreclosure crisis has only just begun. Lenders are poised to take back more homes this year than any other since the U.S. housing meltdown began in 2006.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/13/banks-repossess-million-homes/#ixzz1AuYzUWd6


----------



## Guest

*Frannie Mae Vendor*

I just sent in our application to become a Fannie Mae Vendor, How long does it usually take before I hear something?


----------



## Guest

*Newb*

Hello everyone, I stmbled on this site yesterday, looks like you guys have a good thing going here. We are curently servising HUD properties for a number of companies accross Oklahoma but were always looking for more. Has anyone worked for AMSREO? We have been contacted about becoming a vendor an dwould like to know all we can before taking the leap. Thanks in advance an look forward to contributing to the group.


----------



## REO2Rentals

Cheap RATES:thumbup:

REO Diva!
Michigan


----------



## Guest

Yes, but all these properties are post-conveyance and should be a simple once over at least thats what they are leading me to believe.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Are we missing posts here? Have a few been removed?

I'm not understanding where the posts from Timpane, Michigan REO, and The Junkcleaner are coming from or which posts they're referring to.

The bottom of this page reminds me of a jigsaw puzzle. Did I miss something? Can someone fill in the blanks?

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

bayouhomes said:


> Hello to all,
> I'm new to this site, but I have been reading comments for the past few months. I find this site to be very helpful and informative. Having said that, I have a question. Well first let me provide some back ground information. My husband and I started our own property preservation company about 2 yrs ago. We both lost our jobs. His line of work was in the PP business so he had years of experience. I had the administrative experience so we make a great team. Since starting we have been sub-contracting. My husband is a very hard worker, he works 7 days a wk most of the time. He strongly believes in quality and it shows in his work. The man that we are sub-contracting with praises him all the time, especially since my husband saved him from losing his contract with FAS. The only problem is the praise is verbal and financial. We are ready to start to contract with nation PP companies. So my question is...where do we start? What companies would you suggest. We've actually tried FAS, but there currently looking for new vendors at this time. Please help!!!
> 
> Ruth


Starting up, even though you have the experience, is a long, slow process that requires a lot of fortitude and determination.

My only recommendation is to re-read all the posts here and take whatever information people have generously given and do with it whatever you feel compelled to do.

If you are experienced in this industry, you'll automatically know which info is good and which is useless.

Linda


----------



## Guest

I was looking for info on the company AMSREO, I guess I kind of hijacked the thread and got off topic. Is there a property preservation heading our is every just posting here?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Re: Cyprexx........... we also had workers comp in place. They took the 9% anyway.

Then, when I called them on it, they paid the balances of the invoices.......... minus 9%. <<<------ This is what they still owe me, plus an invoice for $100 that should have been paid a year ago!

Sorry but they are idiots in my book with a few am's who have major personality disorders and really lag in their accounts payable department.

I've worked with them twice and they have us in their system twice. What does that tell you? 

You'll have to make up your own minds whether to work with them or not. Looks like a couple vendors have had very good experiences with them. That just hasn't been the case for us....... either time.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

The JunkCleaner said:


> Yes, but all these properties are post-conveyance and should be a simple once over at least thats what they are leading me to believe.


Here is the post I was referring to, JunkCleaner. I can't tell who you're responding to but you appear to be answering a question.

There are 3 of you posting all in a row and I can't figure out who's responding to what.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thank you Linda! I really have found a lot of great information from this site. Wish I would've join earlier.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

bayouhomes said:


> Thank you Linda! I really have found a lot of great information from this site. Wish I would've join earlier.


Glad we can help. Welcome aboard!

Linda


----------



## Guest

grrr...

$35 is too much for an emergency occupancy inspection? 
They called at 12, by 2 I had emailed them photos, report and invoice.
I was being too kind with the $35.

She called and said that there was no way she could get 35 approved.
Told her there was no way we would be doing any future occupancy checks for them. :no:

But, on a happier note...pretty sure I have picked up two more realty companies today. 
Counting down to being able to ditch the nationals. :thumbsup:


----------



## BPWY

The JunkCleaner said:


> Yes, but all these properties are post-conveyance *and should be a simple once over at least thats what they are leading me to believe*.






:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :no: :no: :no: :no:



Ask mtmntman how many 100 yarders hes done for AMS.


----------



## Guest

100 yarders? I'm looking for answers like do they pay on time, easy to work with or a pain in the a$$. I have not worked for allot of the nationals but I have seen the good and bad comments allot of you like to post about.


----------



## BPWY

All of my answers on them would be second hand.


Based on the advice I've gotten from some folks that have worked for them, I do not work for them. 
They've certainly tried to sign me up.... repeatedly


----------



## Guest

*Electrical testing*

Has anyone been asked along the way by one of there customers to provide appliance and HVAC testing? If so what kind of extension cord did you find most useful for back-feeding the electrical system for testing?


----------



## BPWY

The JunkCleaner said:


> Has anyone been asked along the way by one of there customers to provide appliance and HVAC testing? If so what kind of extension cord did you find most useful for back-feeding the electrical system for testing?







I don't mean to be a spoil sport here but its illegal to back feed the system like they want unless you are licensed electrician. Remember all the contracts read that you must follow all pertinent laws and regs.
Use the contract in your favor.
And have a proper service disconnect going to the main lines.

Also your insurance does not cover that unless you are an electrician.

Ask Fremont. He can tell you about some guys that burnt a house down near him..... back feeding the system.


----------



## Guest

JunkCleaner...
AMS pays when they feel like it....I've still got invoices from April/May Grass cuts that were approved (in writing) that they just skipped and can't seem to find after sending in multiple times. Others I know love them and others I know hate them :shutup:

Backfeeding power: Not on you life unless you are licensed electrician. Yep a crew burned down a house (they said that they were testing appliances and had left. Musta been some bad wiring or something) just a couple months ago 30 miles from our office...I watched it burning as we drove by to a job site. Made the nightly news. BUT there is good news that came from this: My work load increased

Barefoot there is a story on this forum somewhere that I used just this week that made the service company stutter and approved an emergency after hours call for $250 and it goes like this: "if you drive yourself to the emergency room is cheaper than if you call and have an ambulance drive you to the emergency room AND YOU CALLED 911. I'm your ambulance since you called 911" 
It worked is all I know. They may not like it but they declared the emergency (911) and they must pay the rate. 

How many of you contractors have signed up for the Lease Maintenance Program for the Fannie/Freddie Homes? They are starting to try to lease out approx 80% (target amount they want) of homes to the mortgagors that are in default....The emergency call fee for that is $500 but its 24/7 and could be a minor thing since you are basically the "maintenance man/woman" for the worlds largest slum lord :laughing:


----------



## Guest

tompat said:


> I just sent in our application to become a Fannie Mae Vendor, How long does it usually take before I hear something?


 
Direct Fannie takes up to 2-3 years before they "may" start sending work. Took us 2 years to get our sams contract.


----------



## Guest

BAC Auth Center....




AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We got an initial REO job yesterday, met the agent there, and that pack of goobers denied us access because the photos didn't match. After keeping us on the line for over an hour. That place will be the death of me.


----------



## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> BAC Auth Center....
> 
> 
> That place will be the death of me.








I'm about done working for them. I have so very little work from them that it 
won't make much difference.

Previously I have been able to get approval without having a camera phone.
Earlier this week they said there were no exceptions.
Send in a pic. If no pic automatic denial.

My stance is pay up for the extras you want or find some one else that will work for free.


----------



## Guest

BAC....so over them.
still trying to collect from a job, only 365, but still. We actually waited on WRITTEN authorization in addition to the job order and still can't get them to pay. Going on 4 months now. No way I would do anything else for them. 

I am working hard on direct realtors, looking forward to the day when that is all we do.


----------



## Guest

Looking for someone in the spokane washington area, going to need the basement pump out and also a bid to fix the issue causing the water damaged.


----------



## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> Looking for someone in the spokane washington area, going to need the basement pump out and also a bid to fix the issue causing the water damaged.


 
I suppose you mean to pump basement and to dry it correct? Otherwise the liability issues for the coming mold tends to trickle down to the pumper....:whistling
If you aren't doing it yourself look on www.iicrc.com and punch in the zip code under certified contractors, that way you are sure they are insured. Theres 8 in the 1 zip code that I looked at.


----------



## Guest

nope just to pump it and see if we can find the reason it got flooded, we do not use pp to "Have a mold specialist visit the property in order to test a sample and accurately write a report on the extent of the damage and provide a appropriate cure per bid." we have better methods for that, I am posting this part of the job here cause we are also looking for someone to help out with more work orders that we currently have in the area.


----------



## Guest

Gotchya...and smart reasoning. Gonna say if its a dryout and pumping that hell I'd hop on a plane and rent the equipment and take my monitoring equipment with me.....ready for a break! LOL. Bout time to go snowmobiling the first week of Feb and it can't come soon enough. Maybe I'll have to go to Cheyenne and talk someone in going with....eh BPWY?


----------



## BPWY

That sounds cold. :laughing:


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Gotchya...and smart reasoning. Gonna say if its a dryout and pumping that hell I'd hop on a plane and rent the equipment and take my monitoring equipment with me.....ready for a break! LOL. Bout time to go snowmobiling the first week of Feb and it can't come soon enough. Maybe I'll have to go to Cheyenne and talk someone in going with....eh BPWY?



Snowmobiling and skiing is sucking here right now. 9:30 at night and 40 degrees out!!!!!


----------



## thanohano44

uintahiker said:


> BAC Auth Center....
> 
> 
> 
> 
> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> 
> We got an initial REO job yesterday, met the agent there, and that pack of goobers denied us access because the photos didn't match. After keeping us on the line for over an hour. That place will be the death of me.


 same here, had to to a PTC today....drives me nuts. all this does is tell me that they dont trust the work of their contractors who do occupancy checks...or we are cheap ones with just a trip charge. the mortgagors just mad ea payment, so now they have to start the process up all over again they told me. I had advised them Safeguard had also secured this property, 4 months after I did it. they left their POST SALE sign in sheet there. along with the eviction papers from the sheriff. this seems fishy to me.

I understand all of the issues w/the countrywide merger and their loans, bad docs etc...but come on, this is just way over kill. I worked for 10 years for CITImortgage in Loss Mitigation, the last 5 in management. This


----------



## BPWY

30 here right now, 40s during the day


----------



## thanohano44

barefootlc said:


> BAC....so over them.
> still trying to collect from a job, only 365, but still. We actually waited on WRITTEN authorization in addition to the job order and still can't get them to pay. Going on 4 months now. No way I would do anything else for them.
> 
> I am working hard on direct realtors, looking forward to the day when that is all we do.


 I did it for direct realtors for awhile. a lot of my old customers are forced to use the Nationals. ugh


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> I did it for direct realtors for awhile. a lot of my old customers are forced to use the Nationals. ugh






I do some work for an agent. 


She has NO love for the nationals and their contractors.
None what so ever.


----------



## Guest

I feel so much more appreciated:thumbup:

This thread got moved to "specialty trades" so NOW I FEEL SPECIAL:clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I feel so much more appreciated:thumbup:
> 
> This thread got moved to "specialty trades" so NOW I FEEL SPECIAL:clap::clap:


Congrads!!..........:thumbup:
Oh! It was cold here this week! Down in the 70's yesterday....


----------



## Guest

TeamOnePS said:


> Hello All: I have followed this forum for some time now but never registered to make a post. I own a property preservation company in the "Scenic City" of Chattanooga, Tennessee and we cover the Chattanooga Metro Area. Although I have not been an active poster in the past, I would like to become an active poster here. I think this is a great area for us to share best practices and industry information.
> 
> 1) Does anyone have any feedback on Asset Management Specialist Inc (AMS)? [good or bad]
> 2) What vehicle set up do you find works best for you and do you have pictures to share? (truck, van, box truck, trailer)
> 
> We are a small business with about 10 staff members and growing. As of now, we use F-150's and GMC box trucks for our business, but I wanted to know what others think is the best set-up. We have been communicating with AMS about contracting with them so that is the reason for the question about them.
> 
> Thanks,
> Victor
> TeamOne Property Solutions



I have been working for this company for 45 days, I thought I was going to get payed today (1/15/11), (I still have not received an audit, I have kept calling them and they would say that I would receive an audit any minute...I called them back on friday and said that I would get paid on february 15, that is 90 days, and I have accumulated all my accounts payables to 1/15/11). Does anyone have any advice or any info or know how does the payment process work?


----------



## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> Congrads!!..........:thumbup:
> Oh! It was cold here this week! Down in the 70's yesterday....


Mike, that just ain't right:no:

Been in the 20's and 30's here for about 2 weeks.


----------



## mtmtnman

Multi-Services said:


> I have been working for this company for 45 days, I thought I was going to get payed today (1/15/11), (I still have not received an audit, I have kept calling them and they would say that I would receive an audit any minute...I called them back on friday and said that I would get paid on february 15, that is 90 days, and I have accumulated all my accounts payables to 1/15/11). Does anyone have any advice or any info or know how does the payment process work?



Read the contract. 45 days from the END of the month work was completed in. All December work is paid by Feb 15th, January work April 15th Ect. You can hustle and qualify for early pay. I have reached that goal for the last 8 months as well as preferred vendor which gives you a 5% bonus. You have to be early or on time with ALL work and have a stellar broker score. This is paid 15 days after the work is complete but i find it is usually 20-25 days. You have to keep on them but i have always been paid.....................


----------



## mtmtnman

DreamWeaver said:


> Mike, that just ain't right:no:
> 
> Been in the 20's and 30's here for about 2 weeks.


Been in the 40's in the northern Rockies here for the last 4 days..............


----------



## Guest

*pinelandpreservation*



sandblandscape said:


> hey guys i found this company on craigslst. has any one worked for these guys? there out of sacramento ca and say they contract to 13 states.
> 
> *pinelandspreservation*.com/


becareful about this company. pay period ends on the 1 and 15th day. takes about 10 days to get a check. and you pay for your own gas. cutting grass and cleaning up all debris.sometimes 60 miles a day one way.and the pay is not all that great:sad:


----------



## Guest

TeamONe Property,
I personally do not like AMS but that does not imply they are a bad company everywhere. Some do really good with them. 1 thing you need to consider is AMS ,in the metro areas, hires their own territory manager who goes out and hires a bunch of daylabor types (all employees with AMS supplied trucks/rolloff containers/vans) and they will take the "better" property preservation jobs and leave you the ones that they don't want....ie the large sucky ones  Chattanogga is probably close in size to the Central Iowa area and thats large enough for them to use Company Employees. I personally know of NO contractors that work for them anylonger due to the pis* poor way that treated the contractors in relation to the field employees. 
Good luck...nothing to lose but $$ and you can't take it with ya


----------



## BPWY

jimmy c said:


> becareful about this company. pay period ends on the 1 and 15th day. takes about 10 days to get a check. and *you pay for your own gas. cutting grass and cleaning up all debris.sometimes 60 miles a day one way*.and the pay is not all that great:sad:






I'm kinda curious what you thought independent contractors do.


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> TeamONe Property,
> I personally do not like AMS but that does not imply they are a bad company everywhere. Some do really good with them. 1 thing you need to consider is AMS ,in the metro areas, hires their own territory manager who goes out and hires a bunch of daylabor types (all employees with AMS supplied trucks/rolloff containers/vans) and they will take the "better" property preservation jobs and leave you the ones that they don't want....ie the large sucky ones  Chattanogga is probably close in size to the Central Iowa area and thats large enough for them to use Company Employees. I personally know of NO contractors that work for them anylonger due to the pis* poor way that treated the contractors in relation to the field employees.
> Good luck...nothing to lose but $$ and you can't take it with ya





$1 less 20% discount on replacing outlet covers regardless of size.



Oh yeah baby, we are gonna be eating T Bone steaks tonight. 






Now I know that no one is going to get rich on replacing outlet covers. But come on........ $0.80 each???????????????????????
Yeah I don't work for them either.


----------



## Guest

lowballers!

Husband was doing a winterization for one of our realtors. 
Coupla guys show up, say they are bidding for trashout. 
Husband pumps them for info...playing off like we only do wints.
They state they just do this for extra money on the side. 
Husband asks if it pays well.
Them: "Pretty good....we will get about $300 for this one.
....it was every bit of 30 cyd.

I'm gonna lose my realtors to 2 dudes and a trailer


----------



## APlusPPGroup

But are they operating above-board, Barefoot? Sorry to hear this is happening. But it does and will continue to happen until we find a way to stop it.

How is your relationship with the agent? Maybe you can have a talk with him/her about the pitfalls of hiring just anyone and everyone? There is a lot of liability in this business. If these guys screw up, it's on the agent to either be insured or pay for damages.

Linda


----------



## Guest

They are well below board, lol.
They mentioned to my husband that they would like to learn how to do winterizations. My husband replied that the costs of insurance can kill ya. They said yeah, that's why we dont have it. They also forgot to look under house and behind the outbuilding...husband said there is over 2 trailer loads of "vote for" signs piled up back there. :no:

I actually did talk to the agent just a bit ago. She said it was a Freddie Mac property and they question if she uses one vendor for all the work, so she is forced to spread it around a bit. She did state that she would prefer to use us exclusively, she was more than pleased with our work, and more importantly our customer service.


----------



## Guest

Speaking of Insurance does anyone have a workers comp policy of 1,000,000? Were in Pa. We pay big bucks for our 100,000 policy I can't imagine what 1 million would cost and we have never had a claim. Received an app packet that requires the 1 million policy amount.


----------



## Guest

jimmy c said:


> becareful about this company. pay period ends on the 1 and 15th day. takes about 10 days to get a check. and you pay for your own gas. cutting grass and cleaning up all debris.sometimes 60 miles a day one way.and the pay is not all that great:sad:


Don't let them try and tell you that you have to use your own equipment either....


but on a serious note it sounds like they pay faster then I pay my contractors


----------



## Guest

Hey everyone, Its great to see like minded professionals in our industry sharing ideas. I can't help but notice some of the frustration felt by some. 

I've been in the business for nearly 12 yrs. I've seen it ALL, the good, bad and the ugly. but of course in recent years its been a little more challenging but none the less we survive once we adjust and adopt. 

I recently received an email from a credit union and realtors we've been worked with in the pass that if i was looking for more work in my area i should consider using some site called *quickgigs.net* its suppose to be a site they used to find reps in my area to provide fixed pricing on certain remodeling and preservation jobs. 

I thought that was interesting. Have any of you heard or used it in your business. I hope to learn more from you all and continue reading each of your post.

David Dickson


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> lowballers!
> 
> Husband was doing a winterization for one of our realtors.
> Coupla guys show up, say they are bidding for trashout.
> Husband pumps them for info...playing off like we only do wints.
> They state they just do this for extra money on the side.
> Husband asks if it pays well.
> Them: "Pretty good....we will get about $300 for this one.
> ....it was every bit of 30 cyd.
> 
> I'm gonna lose my realtors to 2 dudes and a trailer







Follow them after they do the trash out. Document their illegal dumping and turn them in.


Most parts of the country $300 is only going to pay for the landfill. In many other parts of the country $300 is not going to pay for all of the landfill bill.
There is no way they are disposing legally for a mere $300.


Unbelievable. 
I'll just bet they have no GL insurance, no vehicle insurance and/or registration.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Follow them after they do the trash out. Document their illegal dumping and turn them in.
> 
> 
> Most parts of the country $300 is only going to pay for the landfill. In many other parts of the country $300 is not going to pay for all of the landfill bill.
> There is no way they are disposing legally for a mere $300.
> 
> 
> Unbelievable.
> I'll just bet they have no GL insurance, no vehicle insurance and/or registration.


They actually admitted to not having GL...husband said it was a rough looking outfit...
And I didn't even mention the 16 gallons of paint in the outbuilding. We couldn't touch the job for less than 900.


----------



## Guest

R they starting to charge at the south Carolina landfills?


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Read the contract. 45 days from the END of the month work was completed in. All December work is paid by Feb 15th, January work April 15th Ect. You can hustle and qualify for early pay. I have reached that goal for the last 8 months as well as preferred vendor which gives you a 5% bonus. You have to be early or on time with ALL work and have a stellar broker score. This is paid 15 days after the work is complete but i find it is usually 20-25 days. You have to keep on them but i have always been paid.....................


If december goes into february, shouldn't january go into march? and not april? therefore since I am newbie, at first it takes me 2 months to get paid, after that monthly? I am kind of confused, sorry.


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> They actually admitted to not having GL...husband said it was a rough looking outfit...
> And I didn't even mention the 16 gallons of paint in the outbuilding. We couldn't touch the job for less than 900.






They were workin for beer money sounds to me like.


----------



## thanohano44

Rich51 said:


> Speaking of Insurance does anyone have a workers comp policy of 1,000,000? Were in Pa. We pay big bucks for our 100,000 policy I can't imagine what 1 million would cost and we have never had a claim. Received an app packet that requires the 1 million policy amount.


I have it for $1,000,000.


----------



## thanohano44

a1propertyclean said:


> But are they operating above-board, Barefoot? Sorry to hear this is happening. But it does and will continue to happen until we find a way to stop it.
> 
> How is your relationship with the agent? Maybe you can have a talk with him/her about the pitfalls of hiring just anyone and everyone? There is a lot of liability in this business. If these guys screw up, it's on the agent to either be insured or pay for damages.
> 
> Linda


 I know of an agent who would have illegal aliens move in to his REO listings rent free, as long as they did the repairs and paint work. I reported him. this was 3 years ago. He is still a realtor today. I havent seen anyone living in his homes for about a year now.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> I do some work for an agent.
> 
> 
> She has NO love for the nationals and their contractors.
> None what so ever.


 I don't know of one agent that has love for the nationals. sad isnt it?


----------



## mtmtnman

Rich51 said:


> Speaking of Insurance does anyone have a workers comp policy of 1,000,000? Were in Pa. We pay big bucks for our 100,000 policy I can't imagine what 1 million would cost and we have never had a claim. Received an app packet that requires the 1 million policy amount.



$10,000 would cost me $2200 a year through the state fund which is the cheapest. I don't carry it as i am exempt as a sole proprietor LLC and have no employees......


----------



## mtmtnman

Multi-Services said:


> If december goes into february, shouldn't january go into march? and not april? therefore since I am newbie, at first it takes me 2 months to get paid, after that monthly? I am kind of confused, sorry.



Yup, I was thinking too far ahead..............


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> I'm about done working for them. I have so very little work from them that it
> won't make much difference.
> 
> Previously I have been able to get approval without having a camera phone.
> Earlier this week they said there were no exceptions.
> Send in a pic. If no pic automatic denial.
> 
> My stance is pay up for the extras you want or find some one else that will work for free.


 
hows this one...today I spent 78 minutes waiting for them. on hold several times and their line hangs up on me. I had to keep trying because I wasnt about to drive back out into that area again. rural desert in AZ where the tweakers and pot heads dwell. property just conveyed to HUD but I still have to get the authorization or denial info to submit with my work order and photos.

I know that it has conveyed to HUD because Safeguard has secured it and the locks have been changed to another keycode. I smell either marijuana or a skunk in the house and can't enter it.

I got fed up and drove 9 miles north, hoping it was due to my bad cell reception(AT&T). with 5 bars, same thing. I was hung up on. I can't stand their process, although thankful for the work that I receive.


----------



## Guest

Some landfills charge here...some don't. Basically depends on who is running it.

Was a nice suprise to have my husband drive up to one the other week and the manager is my uncle, lol. We use that one a lot now. :shifty:


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> hows this one...today I spent 78 minutes waiting for them. on hold several times and their line hangs up on me. I had to keep trying because I wasnt about to drive back out into that area again. rural desert in AZ where the tweakers and pot heads dwell. property just conveyed to HUD but I still have to get the authorization or denial info to submit with my work order and photos.
> 
> I know that it has conveyed to HUD because Safeguard has secured it and the locks have been changed to another keycode. I smell either marijuana or a skunk in the house and can't enter it.
> 
> I got fed up and drove 9 miles north, hoping it was due to my bad cell reception(AT&T). with 5 bars, same thing. I was hung up on. I can't stand their process, although thankful for the work that I receive.






This has been my point all along. They demand some thing from us that takes up a lot of time and yet we get compensated nothing. 

I'm afraid a job like this one would have been the end of my relationship with any thing related to them. I simply do not have the patience for 30 to 45 mins on hold, let alone over an hr.


----------



## Guest

I have a sister who is a journalism major. I have asked her to write a story about how these nationals and banks are screwing over the contractors. If you have a story that you would like to be heard, please send me a PM with your story, or email me at [email protected]. The only way we can stop them is to call them out for the world to see.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Follow them after they do the trash out. Document their illegal dumping and turn them in.
> 
> 
> Most parts of the country $300 is only going to pay for the landfill. In many other parts of the country $300 is not going to pay for all of the landfill bill.
> There is no way they are disposing legally for a mere $300.
> 
> 
> Unbelievable.
> I'll just bet they have no GL insurance, no vehicle insurance and/or registration.


Maybe they put everything in the back yard? It happens..


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> This has been my point all along. They demand some thing from us that takes up a lot of time and yet we get compensated nothing.
> 
> I'm afraid a job like this one would have been the end of my relationship with any thing related to them. I simply do not have the patience for 30 to 45 mins on hold, let alone over an hr.


I have a Real estate Agent friend that has a saying that he uses often. He says " We teach people how to treat us." This is one of the best sayings for the PP industry.

If you took your vehicle to an auto mechanic for a tune up and told him that you do not pay for spark plugs his reply would be one of three things.

1.) Just laugh you out of his shop.
2.) Say ok, and jack the hourly rate to cover it.

OR

3.) Up th prices of other parts used to cover the cost.

But somehow you're paying, or it AIN'T happening.

Only exception, would be if its a large job and he could absorb the cost.

Point being, if all the BAC contractors said sure I can do this circus act for you, but I bill at a $100 per hour and the clock starts the minute I get on site and stops the minute I leave site. Now this would take some collective fortitude, but eventually they will capitulate on this ridiculous requirement.

As far as losing the business. The way I look at it, I can go broke staying home. It's a lot less bull ***** and quite frankly would take longer before I need a cardboard box with a "Home Sweet Home" sign on it because I wouldn't be wasting money on fuel, insurance, cell phones, computers, etc.etc.etc.:w00t: 

Trust me, I feel everyones pain and understand the current economic contraints and requirements to take on jobs one wouldn't normally accept and to put up with more than one normally would. 

But somewhere the line has to be drawn. 

Just say'n.


----------



## BPWY

You are absolutely right DreamWeaver.


I've fought BAC as long as I can. But its a loosing battle because almost every one bent over and said have another round big daddy, I like it. 
Because I'm the lonely voice in the wilderness the time for me is to either accept their asinine requirements or quit.

The memo I got said specifically that their new photo requirement "was very well received with in the supplier community."
Now I want to know who they asked or if they just pulled that out of their butts. 
Because they sure didn't ask me.


I'm going to be protesting sending in a pic. One time the photo may come in upside down, or side ways etc.


----------



## Guest

The biggest problem I see with this industry is fear and lack of business sense.

I truely mean that.

I don't wish to be disrepectful to anyone. 

I support anyone whole heartedly that wishes to be their own boss and to try and live out the American Dream with hard work and the rewards that go with such. BBBBBBUUUUUUUUUTTTTTTTTTTTTT, if you want to be a business owner, then dam it..... Act like one. Everyone takes jobs that aren't necessarily what they wish to make on that particular type job, but you should always have a realistic walk away number..... You can bet your A-$-$ the Nationals do. 

The only business that can operate at a constant loss, it the Gooberment.

This is where the lack of knowledge comes in.

You see, there's an old saying in sales that goes something like this, " If they (the client) accepts your first offer, it was to low." What happens ever so often in this business is the contractors / wannabe contractors that really don't have a firm grasp (knowledge) on what it will take to keep them operational and profitable will bid or accept very low prices for services rendered. Figuring, something is better than nothing. As a result, they cannot do the job properly for the agreed upon price and because insufficient revenue they are unable to sustain their business. 

When in reality, as I said earlier in another post, it may be more prudent to go broke setting on your arse at home.

I would even venture to say that most don't even know what they need to make per hour to keep their doors open. It's not that complicated to figure out, but I seriously doubt most have ever even thought about it. Why because although many want to be in business for themselves, many don't do the necessary research to educate themselves on the manners in which BUSINESS operates. 

What's the old saying " If you don't know, you don't know."

The fear side is human nature. Can be a great motivator, but can also destroy you from within. Every business man and woman experiences it, the question is if you know how to temper it. 

God Bless and Best wishes to all.


----------



## BPWY

I'd thank that post 100 times if I could.


For me the "walk away price" is Ocwen's. ANY THING lower than what they pay direct to the contractor is unacceptable. Even their prices are too low and I try to keep every one over that but I do have to have work.

Recently I got a pricing structure that was obvious the company is working for ocwen and then taking a discount. NO WAY I'm signing up with them. Absolute property out of MI.
PacPres is another one whose major client is Ocwen and takes a discount off of their rates.
I don't work for them either.


----------



## Guest

Great message Dreamweaver...:thumbup:

Ya know the o'll saying..."You've got to pay you're dues" I use to be the first one to try and help out the new guy coming into this business but it's a waste of time if they don't have the common sense and 30k to start with.. I'd say 80% of PP work where I live in So Fla is cutting grass year round.. If a crew is going to cut 75-100 houses a week and not get paid for the first 2-3 months they'll need to put up a lot of bread to pay the bills..I've been in biz my whole life so in 2007 it wasn't that difficult taking on PP work..I had other work to pay the help witch comes FIRST..Now you take these low balling dopes that go to Home Depot and buy cheap equipment and steel work from us!..They don't last..That's where I have a problem lately..Two brokers that I was with for 2 yrs + pulled that on me. Telling me they had no choice and had to try and save on lawn cuts.. But they are sorry and would I come back..What do I do? Swallow my pride and start cutting their lawns again? You bet-cha! It's work. I could go on & on but you REAL guys & gals know the rest of the story.

Mike


----------



## Guest

DreamWeaver said:


> The biggest problem I see with this industry is fear and lack of business sense.
> 
> I truely mean that.
> 
> I don't wish to be disrepectful to anyone.
> 
> I support anyone whole heartedly that wishes to be their own boss and to try and live out the American Dream with hard work and the rewards that go with such. BBBBBBUUUUUUUUUTTTTTTTTTTTTT, if you want to be a business owner, then dam it..... Act like one. Everyone takes jobs that aren't necessarily what they wish to make on that particular type job, but you should always have a realistic walk away number..... You can bet your A-$-$ the Nationals do.
> 
> The only business that can operate at a constant loss, it the Gooberment.
> 
> This is where the lack of knowledge comes in.
> 
> You see, there's an old saying in sales that goes something like this, " If they (the client) accepts your first offer, it was to low." What happens ever so often in this business is the contractors / wannabe contractors that really don't have a firm grasp (knowledge) on what it will take to keep them operational and profitable will bid or accept very low prices for services rendered. Figuring, something is better than nothing. As a result, they cannot do the job properly for the agreed upon price and because insufficient revenue they are unable to sustain their business.
> 
> When in reality, as I said earlier in another post, it may be more prudent to go broke setting on your arse at home.
> 
> I would even venture to say that most don't even know what they need to make per hour to keep their doors open. It's not that complicated to figure out, but I seriously doubt most have ever even thought about it. Why because although many want to be in business for themselves, many don't do the necessary research to educate themselves on the manners in which BUSINESS operates.
> 
> What's the old saying " If you don't know, you don't know."
> 
> The fear side is human nature. Can be a great motivator, but can also destroy you from within. Every business man and woman experiences it, the question is if you know how to temper it.
> 
> God Bless and Best wishes to all.


Have to agree. I know what my time is worth. When bidding jobs, I estimate man hours and make sure the bid allows for me to make what I have decided I must have per hr.


----------



## BPWY

*Craigslist ad*

Is this some one working for cheap from their bicycle with out the proper equipment for the job at hand????





> I need someone with a larger truck to haul a dump trailer to the dump and possibly help clean up some jobsites. i need this done on a regular basis. 970 373 ***x


----------



## Guest

Re: Pinelands Preservations
I worked for these people last week. What a joke there price list is. They will nickel and dime you. When it is time to collect there phone will ring and ring. It's funny how they will call you over and over about the work..but when the work is complete and the photos are uploaded they are no where to be found.


----------



## BPWY

[email protected]#$%^&*()(*&^%$#@#$%^&*()_



I've been on hold with the auth center for 14 mins and still haven't spoke to any one yet.


This very well maybe my last job for them. I am fed up with this.


----------



## BPWY

BPWY said:


> [email protected]#$%^&*()(*&^%$#@#$%^&*()_
> 
> 
> 
> I've been on hold with the auth center for 14 mins and still haven't spoke to any one yet.
> 
> 
> This very well maybe my last job for them. I am fed up with this.





27 mins to get authorization...........100% uncompensated.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> 27 mins to get authorization...........100% uncompensated.


 just left one right now. I knew I wouldnt get an authorization, since Safeguard took it over...but I had to go. after being on hold for 37 minutes, I was denied. just as I thought. perhaps they need to find a better way of updating their systems, as well as vendors of when Safeguard takes over. after all, wouldnt they have the HUD conveyance date? gonna put on some of my favorite music and put my shoulder to the wheel and head on to the next one and the next...LOL!!

Enjoy the rest of this beautiful day gang.

and while I'm at it, I WILL stop back at a Verizon store and transfer back to them.


----------



## Guest

Ugh on the authorizations...US best did that too...we never accepted any jobs from them.

Anyone familiar with or work for MSI? Got an email from them this morning. Inspection prices are too low to fool with. She stated all property preservation work is by bid. Wanted me to complete a ppr quiz. Don't want to waste my time to complete if they aren't worth messing with.

WWYD?...we are contracted with a national. I have a great relationship with our coordinator. Got a call from another company this morning wanting us to do eviction/lockout/winterization. Looking at paperwork, it is originating from national we are signed with. Would u mention it to coordinator? Basically I am being asked to compete against myself, lol.


----------



## thanohano44

I do work for MSI. Hit and miss with them. Some pm's are better to work with than others.


----------



## Guest

I love bidding against myself. The real estate agents on some bank jobs are great for having us do work on the house directly through them. We did some stuff on the house about 3 weeks ago. Over the weekend I got the bid request from national to bid the items we repaired last month. 

I told them I had called the agent and he stated the work had already been completed. Didn't tell them who had completed it. I am pretty sure they would get their knickers in a bunch if they found out who it was.

The Auth # center was kind enough to inform me today their service was so bad because they are under-staffed due to the holiday. I asked the rep what the problem was the rest of the time cuz I couldn't tell any difference from any other day.


----------



## mtmtnman

I've been told over 15 min on hold, take a pic of the phone with # called and time elapsed and BAC will pay A trip charge..................


----------



## Guest

I was told 30 min, but 15 sounds even better. I think I will be changing company policy.

I just don't understand why it is so hard to hire people to answer the phone and ask half a dozen questions. I wish I could get the contract to set up their call center. Any idiot "should" be able to set up a call center with the technology available.

I understand their reason but their method is so beyond my scope of understanding. It doesn't seem to be working either. I was on a conference call the other day discussing a contractor who secured the wrong property, it was a condo, right unit # wrong building. And this after they gave him Authorization. Doesn't seem like they are helping anything. But alas...


----------



## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> I was told 30 min, but 15 sounds even better. I think I will be changing company policy.
> 
> I just don't understand why it is so hard to hire people to answer the phone and ask half a dozen questions. I wish I could get the contract to set up their call center. Any idiot "should" be able to set up a call center with the technology available.
> 
> I understand their reason but their method is so beyond my scope of understanding. It doesn't seem to be working either. I was on a conference call the other day discussing a contractor who secured the wrong property, it was a condo, right unit # wrong building. And this after they gave him Authorization. Doesn't seem like they are helping anything. But alas...




Here's a good one and one i DEFINITELY want an answer too. I had one denied last week as they did not have a photo in their system to compare my photo too. Who takes the original photo they have and why are they trusted more than i am? ( i heard MCS does there inspections here) I have other BAC properties i have been maintaining for over a year and still have to get Auth. on them. This is BS as well.................


----------



## Guest

Hey All
Would like to know if anyone had any suggestions as to how I may go about becoming a vendor for HUD.
Thanks


----------



## Guest

Carlton said:


> Hey All
> Would like to know if anyone had any suggestions as to how I may go about becoming a vendor for HUD.
> Thanks


 
The more important question would be: WHY would anyone want to work for HUD? The M&M Company keeps all the profits and leaves chickenfeed left over for the contractors to fight over.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> I have other BAC properties i have been maintaining for over a year and still have to get Auth. on them. This is BS as well.................








Aren't they the kings of frozen and busted pipes?


----------



## JenkinsHB

BPWY said:


> [email protected]#$%^&*()(*&^%$#@#$%^&*()_
> 
> 
> 
> I've been on hold with the auth center for 14 mins and still haven't spoke to any one yet.
> 
> 
> This very well maybe my last job for them. I am fed up with this.


14 mins? I wish all of my calls to the authorization center only took that long. I was on the phone for an hour at a property only to be denied because I couldn't see in the windows of the house. You know why I couldn't see into them? Because they were covered with 2" of ice on the INSIDE!!! I'm pretty sure that's a vacant property.


----------



## Guest

After a reading a few posts I have to ask, why do any of you guys do this kind of work? Everyone complains, rarely anything positive.

Why not become a carpenter, a plumber, hvac guy or heck, even a roofer.


----------



## JenkinsHB

BamBamm5144 said:


> After a reading a few posts I have to ask, why do any of you guys do this kind of work? Everyone complains, rarely anything positive.
> 
> Why not become a carpenter, a plumber, hvac guy or heck, even a roofer.


ok. With property preservation I've been able to expand my business from 3 employees to 26 employees. Revenue for 2010 was 3x the revenue for 2009. It's a lot more fun to bitch and complain.


----------



## BPWY

JenkinsHB said:


> 14 mins? I wish all of my calls to the authorization center only took that long. I was on the phone for an hour at a property only to be denied because I couldn't see in the windows of the house. You know why I couldn't see into them? Because they were covered with 2" of ice on the INSIDE!!! I'm pretty sure that's a vacant property.






Read what I posted. *14 mins and still hadn't talked to any body.*
I was posting while I was on hold.


I really dislike dealing with these low IQ folks that have less than no clue what they are doing and no idea how to do it.

What I don't get is that BAC mysteriously finds all these funds for payroll to staff a call center..... and yet can't find a few measly bucks to throw the way of the contractor to put up with their asinine requirements.


----------



## Guest

Got a Statement to make at the end of a true story:

A non-named contractor dewinterized a property and through, I'm sure not intentional but ignorance nonetheless, not knowing about the heating system the furnace quit working. $573,000 property flooded 2of 3 stories. 

While at property to do other work we found the "rainforest" in full force and got the water off and called the Service Company and was told to get an emergency bid in NOW. 

Due to the size of the home it was going to require X #of dehumidifiers, X #of airmovers, X #of floor drying systems, X #of wall injection drying systems and Heating systems to dryout this home to normal drying standards. Was this cheap? NO but the alternative was worse.

Today we went to the property and the basement and the main floor is in the middle of being gutted (6800sf) and the crew is drying with 1 1970's model home dehumidifier and 4 home box fans. :no:

NOW the bank has a house that is next to WORTHLESS and could have been saved if they would have acted when the flooding first happened. 
I don't like to throw numbers but our bid was in the $10k range (on the low side if anyone out there knows structural drying costs) and now the "KNOWN" damages from gutting home we are estimating at $100,000 in gutting and replacement/rebuild damage.....:no: Not including are the future mold, kitchen cabinets and subflooring costs from improper drying.

If any bank reps are monitoring this site please respond to someone that must be ignorant of the reason YOU let this crap happen! WHY? 
Does anyone care anymore? Are YOU wasting OUR stimulus monies or are you wasting your Shareholders/Investors monies?

This blows me away.
Sorry for the vent but I feel better:furious: kinda:shutup:


----------



## BPWY

They do not care, not even a teeny tiny shred.


Like the one last week I posted. So far NOTHING from the bank to pump or dry that one.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> They do not care, not even a teeny tiny shred.
> 
> 
> Like the one last week I posted. So far NOTHING from the bank to pump or dry that one.




Was the water still running when you left???


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Was the water still running when you left???





Yup, I did not enter the house because of the amount of personals.
Told em I couldn't find the curb stop. It was covered in snow.

I think your fav buddies in eastern NE called the utility company.


----------



## Guest

I had a situation where upon arrival at a property we found water to be flowing into the basement from the hot water heater. The property was improperly winterized. To make a long story short, there was mold growing in full force and everything in the basement needed to be removed and disposed of. It was so humid in the basement that water was actually beaded up on the door knobs. I contact the company that dispatched me and informed them of the situation. They needed me to provided an emergency repair bid. I have yet to hear anything about that property or bid and its been nearly 2 months.

So my question is, What the PHOOCK was the EMERGENCY bid required for?


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Here's a good one and one i DEFINITELY want an answer too. I had one denied last week as they did not have a photo in their system to compare my photo too. Who takes the original photo they have and why are they trusted more than i am? ( i heard MCS does there inspections here) I have other BAC properties i have been maintaining for over a year and still have to get Auth. on them. This is BS as well.................


 
I have had them tell me google earth is where they are looking to see if the photos match


----------



## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> I have had them tell me google earth is where they are looking to see if the photos match








Thats precious. If that is any thing like google street view they'll be looking at the wrong house every time.


----------



## brm1109

_ had a situation where upon arrival at a property we found water to be flowing into the basement from the hot water heater. The property was improperly winterized. To make a long story short, there was mold growing in full force and everything in the basement needed to be removed and disposed of. It was so humid in the basement that water was actually beaded up on the door knobs. I contact the company that dispatched me and informed them of the situation. They needed me to provided an emergency repair bid. I have yet to hear anything about that property or bid and its been nearly 2 months.

So my question is, What the PHOOCK was the EMERGENCY bid required for?
_
Whenever I give bids for work, I put in it that the quote is good for 30 days. Once I gave a bid to a company and they called me almost 5 months later to do the work. I explained I would have to rebid it and they said no. Oh well good luck getting it done for the old price.


----------



## Guest

*Unspsc*

Does anyone know what the UNSPSC code is for property preservation or inspections. Or what is the closet commodity code to use to get notice in the BAC supplier's database.


----------



## Guest

happyinspector said:


> Does anyone know what the UNSPSC code is for property preservation or inspections. Or what is the closet commodity code to use to get notice in the BAC supplier's database.


 
HUH thats in interesting idea....I wonder who the providers are that service properties in other countries...BAC and all the Banks would have foreclosures in other countries besides just the US of A.....

I would sign up for Costa Rica for the months of Nov till April. Anyone want April till Nov?:clap:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

lol. Couldn't help myself.... I had to post this. Anyone in Cincinnati want this wint?:no:

http://cincinnati.ohjobz.com/winterization-property-preservation-cincinnati.htm

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

Make sure y'all follow "SUGGESTED"traffic signs. Went to look at a plowing job for a National today after the bank came unglued at the broker for the $350 bid he submitted from his plow guy. The bank is going to get about double the bid from me + discount! Drive is up this mountain "road" (more like trail) 1/2 mile and then the drive is 18" deep, 400 feet long and almost solid after a warm spell earlier in the week thawed and refroze it. Bout had to change my skivies when i got to the bottom!!!


----------



## BPWY

You'll be chaining up............ again. 




lol


----------



## Guest

You need a set of these bad boys http://insta-chain.com/


----------



## BPWY

The mountain man is way too dang tight for that. 
He squeaks when he walks.


----------



## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> You need a set of these bad boys http://insta-chain.com/




The school buses and Waaahmbulances run them here. There spendy enough the post office don't put them o ntheir mail vans. I see the mailman chain up in town quite often........


----------



## Guest

lol


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> The mountain man is way too dang tight for that.
> He squeaks when he walks.




Blah Blah Blah!!! Gotta save to buy more equipment!!!!!


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> lol. Couldn't help myself.... I had to post this. Anyone in Cincinnati want this wint?:no:
> 
> http://cincinnati.ohjobz.com/winterization-property-preservation-cincinnati.htm
> 
> Linda


That's funny there, I don't care who you are, that's funny.....lol As Larry the Cable Guy would say:w00t:


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Make sure y'all follow "SUGGESTED"traffic signs. Went to look at a plowing job for a National today after the bank came unglued at the broker for the $350 bid he submitted from his plow guy. The bank is going to get about double the bid from me + discount! Drive is up this mountain "road" (more like trail) 1/2 mile and then the drive is 18" deep, 400 feet long and almost solid after a warm spell earlier in the week thawed and refroze it. Bout had to change my skivies when i got to the bottom!!!


At least they don't suggest Whips and Chains...lol. Although if they did MTMTNMAN may never be heard from again:laughing:


----------



## Guest

I guess I'm the lucky one here. I plowed snow for many years but this week I'm draining a pool in Florida...


----------



## mtmtnman

Mike Hammer said:


> I guess I'm the lucky one here. I plowed snow for many years but this week I'm draining a pool in Florida...



Your lucky till April. I spent 5 years in Florida near Gainesville and had heat exhaustion twice. I'll take the cold.................


----------



## Guest

Those helpful folks at the BAC auth center just told one of my guys he is only approved to change a secondary door knob on an REO job. 

I would take the heat over the cold anytime. I have yet to slide off the road because it was too hot.


----------



## Guest

uintahiker said:


> I would take the heat over the cold anytime. I have yet to slide off the road because it was too hot.


You need to take the twisty curves a little faster!:thumbup:


----------



## oteroproperties

Sometimes the rain can be just as dangerous as the snow. I was born and raised in jersey so im with you on the slidding thing but the rain is what caused the ultimate demise of my favorite truck!! Not that its as slippery as snow, but people under estimate how wet the roads get sometimes. Plus april my ass i was using th ac on my truck yesterday!!


----------



## Guest

Florida is great in the Winter. But the hot humid summers start to really stink about half way through the summer. The "Florida Ice" on the slick roads can be a killer if your tires aren't great. Among the hurricanes we are also the lighting capital of the world. Kind of make me wonder what the hell I'm doing here?


----------



## mtmtnman

DylanKallday said:


> Florida is great in the Winter. But the hot humid summers start to really stink about half way through the summer. The "Florida Ice" on the slick roads can be a killer if your tires aren't great. Among the hurricanes we are also the lighting capital of the world. Kind of make me wonder what the hell I'm doing here?



You forgot Fireants, snakes, Africanized bees and spiders. I used to just LOVE crawling around under houses down there knowing one of the 4 where just waiting to bite me!!! I'll put up with the cold.................................


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> You'll be chaining up............ again.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> lol




ya we have that problem here too, oh wait no we don't, it's high 60's low 70's :thumbup::thumbsup:


----------



## mtmtnman

D&R Services said:


> ya we have that problem here too, oh wait no we don't, it's high 60's low 70's :thumbup::thumbsup:


Hmmmmmmmmm, in the 5 years i lived in Flardy i chained up all the time. Chained the bikes to the porch post, chained the generator ect. to the trailer, chained the trailer to the telephone pole in the yard................


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> You forgot Fireants, snakes, Africanized bees and spiders. I used to just LOVE crawling around under houses down there knowing one of the 4 where just waiting to bite me!!! I'll put up with the cold.................................


That's Funny!
When I do an initial cut that's over 2 ft high I run through it with the deck up to scare of any snakes or rats!.. We have to watch out for beehives too..:w00t:


----------



## Guest

I just got A GL policy with E&O added to it. Is this something new with all nationals? I only needed 1 million general liabilty with the Agents and they never asked for proof.


----------



## Guest

D&R Services said:


> ya we have that problem here too, oh wait no we don't, it's high 60's low 70's :thumbup::thumbsup:


Hey Mike,
I love Las Vegas! I use to go out there alot when I was in a different type of business....


----------



## Guest

DylanKallday said:


> Florida is great in the Winter. But the hot humid summers start to really stink about half way through the summer. The "Florida Ice" on the slick roads can be a killer if your tires aren't great. Among the hurricanes we are also the lighting capital of the world. Kind of make me wonder what the hell I'm doing here?


They don't board up many houses down here so what's going to happen when we get a hurricane warning. I stocked up on plywood 3 yrs ago and no warnings yet. It's a potential crises the banks don't want to think about.:shutup::shutup:


----------



## mtmtnman

Mike Hammer said:


> They don't board up many houses down here so what's going to happen when we get a hurricane warning. I stocked up on plywood 3 yrs ago and no warnings yet. It's a potential crises the banks don't want to think about.:shutup::shutup:



I see hurricane boarding being ripe for chargebacks. Some idiot in a cubical 1000 miles away will say you didn't HUD board it LOL!!! Just sayin..................:jester::jester::jester::jester:


----------



## Guest

Talk about a long thread.. just trying to read through the good and the bad. Been trying to pic up a few other companies to do prop preservation to keep my guys busy and boy, I am glad I have been slow and jumping with some companies.. sounds like a lot of issues out there period. 
I did read one bad comment on US Best, the only complaint I have on them, is we got work coming but I dont see it unless I want to drive 150 miles away from home. Good thing is they do pay like clock work.. 
Any body have any leads on companies that have work for the Texas area. Namely San Antonio, or the Hill country.


----------



## Guest

Ok, I have been working for a company here in Oklahoma for a couple of years doing property preservations. I have recently became disgusted at the fact that the company I am working for is taking 50% of the payout and keeping it for there selves. If a job bid was for $100, I put in, they would put the bid in for $200 to the agency, no wonder I never got the bid to do anything. If payout on a house trash out was $600 they would pay me $300… wtf they keep the same amount I make for there selves. All they had to do is email me and pass out the work… no wonder they all had new $40k cars in the driveway of the business. I was waiting to see my portion of that money… 
Well I have quit and am wanting to pick up the houses I have been doing in my area since I am the only one within a 200 mile radius that dose any of this work… I know that they use Safeguard, and not sure about how they do but they also use FAS. What I am asking is what other companies I should look into to get started with; I want to keep away from 3rd party companies to keep my money in my hands.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

kev19stokes said:


> Ok, I have been working for a company here in Oklahoma for a couple of years doing property preservations. I have recently became disgusted at the fact that the company I am working for is taking 50% of the payout and keeping it for there selves. If a job bid was for $100, I put in, they would put the bid in for $200 to the agency, no wonder I never got the bid to do anything. If payout on a house trash out was $600 they would pay me $300… wtf they keep the same amount I make for there selves. All they had to do is email me and pass out the work… no wonder they all had new $40k cars in the driveway of the business. I was waiting to see my portion of that money…
> Well I have quit and am wanting to pick up the houses I have been doing in my area since I am the only one within a 200 mile radius that dose any of this work… I know that they use Safeguard, and not sure about how they do but they also use FAS. What I am asking is what other companies I should look into to get started with; I want to keep away from 3rd party companies to keep my money in my hands.


No doubt the reason you only see 1/2 is because Safeguard takes a hefty percentage off the top, then the company YOU are working for takes a percentage off of that, resulting in only 50% to you. That 50% doesn't ALL go to the person you're getting the work from. 

Go to Safeguard direct, or FAS. But be sure to read all of the pros and cons of working for both before you get too involved with either one.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Where the wind comes sweeping down the plains....*



a1propertyclean said:


> No doubt the reason you only see 1/2 is because Safeguard takes a hefty percentage off the top, then the company YOU are working for takes a percentage off of that, resulting in only 50% to you. That 50% doesn't ALL go to the person you're getting the work from.
> 
> Go to Safeguard direct, or FAS. But be sure to read all of the pros and cons of working for both before you get too involved with either one.
> 
> Linda


With all due respect Linda, unfortunately he is right on one of his statements. The company is well known, and yes they take 50% of what they are getting paid. He is not getting paid 50% of the HUD allowable. It's more like $12 cyd, $35 wints, etc. You get the picture. They are upfront and let you know that they are taking 50% of what they are getting paid. I can't live on that, but to each their own.

To Kev19Stokes-- Do a little research and you will find there are a ton of us doing preservation work in Oklahoma. I know of at least 3 other companies working for your aforementioned companies. I won't work for either of them directly, or indirectly, but again to each their own. Yes it has been extremely slow in Oklahoma the last few months, but there are numerous companies handing out work.


----------



## mtmtnman

2Bros said:


> With all due respect Linda, unfortunately he is right on one of his statements. The company is well known, and yes they take 50% of what they are getting paid. He is not getting paid 50% of the HUD allowable. It's more like $12 cyd, $35 wints, etc. You get the picture.



Sounds like Helix out of Denver area...............


----------



## Guest

Sounds like GREED to me.


----------



## Guest

kev19stokes said:


> Ok, I have been working for a company here in Oklahoma for a couple of years doing property preservations. I have recently became disgusted at the fact that the company I am working for is taking 50% of the payout and keeping it for there selves. If a job bid was for $100, I put in, they would put the bid in for $200 to the agency, no wonder I never got the bid to do anything. If payout on a house trash out was $600 they would pay me $300… wtf they keep the same amount I make for there selves. All they had to do is email me and pass out the work… no wonder they all had new $40k cars in the driveway of the business. I was waiting to see my portion of that money…
> Well I have quit and am wanting to pick up the houses I have been doing in my area since I am the only one within a 200 mile radius that dose any of this work… I know that they use Safeguard, and not sure about how they do but they also use FAS. What I am asking is what other companies I should look into to get started with; I want to keep away from 3rd party companies to keep my money in my hands.





a1propertyclean said:


> No doubt the reason you only see 1/2 is because Safeguard takes a hefty percentage off the top, then the company YOU are working for takes a percentage off of that, resulting in only 50% to you. That 50% doesn't ALL go to the person you're getting the work from.
> 
> Go to Safeguard direct, or FAS. But be sure to read all of the pros and cons of working for both before you get too involved with either one.
> 
> Linda


Linda, is this really the answer?

I have been following this thread on and off for a few months... at least since last March, and I've learned a lot. From what I gather from reading everyone's posts is that even the nationals like Safeguard & FAS are hard to deal with. 
I have personal experience dealing with Safeguard doing grass cuts for $30, them not wanting to give me more for initials, saying that the only way I'll get more per cut is if the property is over an acre... then I send a link to the county tax assessor's website showing the information that says the property is 1.66 acres and the 'regional' says, "I'll forward the information" with no authorization to go ahead and cut it while I'm on site . But I digress.

What I'm basically trying to ask is how can one win at this? Just put up with the nationals as long as I can? Only deal with them as long as I'm making a profit and stand on my price like rock or walk away if they buck on me?

I hear you all talking of brokers... I had a bad experience with a broker lady. She had me do an initial service that included lock change, trash out, clean out, and initial grass cut for a property that had 2 houses on it(both were 2 bd/1 ba). I didn't get paid until months later, and even then it was in partial payments ($400 here..$900 there).

How are you guys marketing yourselves to brokers? 
What brokers are the ones to look for?

Something's gotta shake, man.

I am registered with Cityside management, CooperCiti-West, FAS, AMS, MCB, Safeguard, Snow enterprises, and MCS.... and I'm wondering if it'll even be worth it if and when any of these companies send work my way.

Please give me some direction.


----------



## Guest

Oh yeah... Hey everybody! My name's Ethan! I'm new here.

I started as a lawn company, then a grass cut contractor for Safeguard for a brief stint.... now I'm really wanting to push it to the limit doing property preservation work for more than one company at a time during the grass cut season. I'm hoping 2 or 3 nationals and doing a volume of about 40-60 a week for each.


----------



## Guest

FreshCut said:


> Oh yeah... Hey everybody! My name's Ethan! I'm new here.
> 
> I started as a lawn company, then a grass cut contractor for Safeguard for a brief stint.... now I'm really wanting to push it to the limit doing property preservation work for more than one company at a time during the grass cut season. I'm hoping 2 or 3 nationals and doing a volume of about 40-60 a week for each.


 
Ethan, 

Welcome to the forum. Lot of good information can be gleamed here...both good and bad....lotta love and a lotta frustration with Nationals....OK NO LOVE but a lotta frustrastion

1 thing you might state is where you live. I find most of us won't give a lot of information if you are our competitor since business is really slow and profits are marginal for the last year. 

If you are looking for grass cuts with big volume you would need to be with a HUD M&M (service company) and Safegourd. 

We made no profit in 2010 cutting grass so we are not accepting recurring cuts in 2011. Just don't know how you all do it and turn profits. We cut 200+/- grass bi-weekly and barely covered costs. We run a really "tight" ship and watch costs daily/weekly/monthly and the numbers do not jive and I don't dance that dance:surrender:


----------



## mtmtnman

So pics for those southerners afraid of snow...........:whistling:thumbsup:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Ethan,
> 
> Welcome to the forum. Lot of good information can be gleamed here...both good and bad....lotta love and a lotta frustration with Nationals....OK NO LOVE but a lotta frustrastion
> 
> 1 thing you might state is where you live. I find most of us won't give a lot of information if you are our competitor since business is really slow and profits are marginal for the last year.
> 
> If you are looking for grass cuts with big volume you would need to be with *a HUD M&M (service company)* and Safegourd.
> 
> We made no profit in 2010 cutting grass so we are not accepting recurring cuts in 2011. Just don't know how you all do it and turn profits. We cut 200+/- grass bi-weekly and barely covered costs. We run a really "tight" ship and watch costs daily/weekly/monthly and the numbers do not jive and I don't dance that dance:surrender:


I'm in Atlanta, GA.

What is/are a HUD M&M? (I know what it is, I'm asking for names)


----------



## mtmtnman

FreshCut said:


> I'm in Atlanta, GA.
> 
> What is/are a HUD M&M? (I know what it is, I'm asking for names)



Honestly good luck in Hotlanta. To many broke people willing to cut grass for 15-20 bucks and the nationals love it.....................


----------



## Guest

This site really says it all quickgigs.net I think were in a losing game. 
Sorry could not put the www in front


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Honestly good luck in Hotlanta. To many broke people willing to cut grass for 15-20 bucks and the nationals love it.....................


Where are you ?

How you know?

I think you're right, I talked to a regional coordinator with a national today and he said that there is a saturation of vendors in metro Atlanta that he's never seen in any of the other 30 states that he covers.


----------



## Guest

Rich51 said:


> This site really says it all quickgigs.net I think were in a losing game.
> Sorry could not put the www in front


Losing game?

So what's the answer?


----------



## mtmtnman

Rich51 said:


> This site really says it all quickgigs.net I think were in a losing game.
> Sorry could not put the www in front




Holy crap!!! Wints for $50?? Drive bys for $5???????? $400 trash outs no matter what size and $50 initial cuts???? 1/2 off your 5th order?? Where do i sign up!!!!!


----------



## mtmtnman

FreshCut said:


> Where are you ?
> 
> How you know?
> 
> I think you're right, I talked to a regional coordinator with a national today and he said that there is a saturation of vendors in metro Atlanta that he's never seen in any of the other 30 states that he covers.



Been in this for a while now. I have connections across the country and have seen the downhill spiral of the industry.............


----------



## Guest

FreshCut said:


> Where are you ?
> 
> How you know?
> 
> I think you're right, I talked to a regional coordinator with a national today and he said that there is a saturation of vendors in metro Atlanta that he's never seen in any of the other 30 states that he covers.


5-6 years ago we had a contract direct for a large national and we covered the entire State of GA. Included Atlanta...sorry for the traffic...hated the City. Couldn't believe the Mountain that was the landfill:clap: 

Good buddy of mine had a huge P&P company that served Northern Atlanta-he was from Dehlonaga sp?- that had 60 employees and he just shut the door in 2010. Gave up losing money to the craigslist freeworkers. 

Atlanta is a tough market the last couple of years but I have old co-workers that are still doing good East of the City by Augusta and still making $$ in Savannah. So if you are willing to drive those areas seem to be still profitable. 

hang in there the market will come back in about another 5 years


----------



## Guest

Hey guys, it's been a LONG time since I was on this site. I've had some amazing opportunities and company growth come my way the past few months. Hopefully I can get caught up on the thread from while I've been gone and begin contributing again.

I hope all has been well for everyone, it's nice to get back on.


----------



## thanohano44

FreshCut said:


> Linda, is this really the answer?
> 
> I have been following this thread on and off for a few months... at least since last March, and I've learned a lot. From what I gather from reading everyone's posts is that even the nationals like Safeguard & FAS are hard to deal with.
> I have personal experience dealing with Safeguard doing grass cuts for $30, them not wanting to give me more for initials, saying that the only way I'll get more per cut is if the property is over an acre... then I send a link to the county tax assessor's website showing the information that says the property is 1.66 acres and the 'regional' says, "I'll forward the information" with no authorization to go ahead and cut it while I'm on site . But I digress.
> 
> What I'm basically trying to ask is how can one win at this? Just put up with the nationals as long as I can? Only deal with them as long as I'm making a profit and stand on my price like rock or walk away if they buck on me?
> 
> I hear you all talking of brokers... I had a bad experience with a broker lady. She had me do an initial service that included lock change, trash out, clean out, and initial grass cut for a property that had 2 houses on it(both were 2 bd/1 ba). I didn't get paid until months later, and even then it was in partial payments ($400 here..$900 there).
> 
> How are you guys marketing yourselves to brokers?
> What brokers are the ones to look for?
> 
> Something's gotta shake, man.
> 
> I am registered with Cityside management, CooperCiti-West, FAS, AMS, MCB, Safeguard, Snow enterprises, and MCS.... and I'm wondering if it'll even be worth it if and when any of these companies send work my way.
> 
> Please give me some direction.


as long as you can follow directions, remain thorough and TACTFUL it will be profitable in the long run. there will be times where you might have to eat it on a few jobs and some other times you can really make some hefty profits. it will get better with experience.

things to watch out for are the tweakers who like to low ball you and take your work. I know of a few large companies in AZ who are doing recuts for $15 a cut just so they can get all the rehab and trash outs. not to mention a lot of them pay off the nationals.


----------



## thanohano44

kev19stokes said:


> Ok, I have been working for a company here in Oklahoma for a couple of years doing property preservations. I have recently became disgusted at the fact that the company I am working for is taking 50% of the payout and keeping it for there selves. If a job bid was for $100, I put in, they would put the bid in for $200 to the agency, no wonder I never got the bid to do anything. If payout on a house trash out was $600 they would pay me $300… wtf they keep the same amount I make for there selves. All they had to do is email me and pass out the work… no wonder they all had new $40k cars in the driveway of the business. I was waiting to see my portion of that money…
> Well I have quit and am wanting to pick up the houses I have been doing in my area since I am the only one within a 200 mile radius that dose any of this work… I know that they use Safeguard, and not sure about how they do but they also use FAS. What I am asking is what other companies I should look into to get started with; I want to keep away from 3rd party companies to keep my money in my hands.


 
i do work for a few regionals, but only in a small condensed area so that I can stay profitable. for the nationals, I do bigger area's. you gotta figure out this one for you.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> So pics for those southerners afraid of snow...........:whistling:thumbsup:










Per recent phone conversations you must still be a southern boy scared of the snow.


:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> i do work for a few regionals, but only in a small condensed area so that I can stay profitable. for the nationals, I do bigger area's. you gotta figure out this one for you.






Exactly.


Less pay.... means smaller work area.


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> things to watch out for are the tweakers who like to low ball you and take your work. I know of a few large companies in AZ who are doing recuts for $15 a cut just so they can get all the rehab and trash outs. not to mention a lot of them pay off the nationals.









At $15 per cut where is the coin to pay any body off??????? let alone yourself for the work you're doing.





On a slightly different note I can't buy a craigslist ad for P&P work in this area. I've check the 2 neighboring states............... NADA.
Been like that since fall of 2010.


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## BPWY

Any body know what Safeguard's 2011 grass cut price structure is?


Thank you


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Per recent phone conversations you must still be a southern boy scared of the snow.
> 
> 
> :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:




I just avoid wind and road closures for lack of hotels in certain areas. Snow don't bother me but the damn wind along I-25 sucks as bad as a hurricane does in Flardy.

*http://kisscasper.com/casper-one-of-the-worst-winter-weather-cities/*


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## BPWY

You just gotta be a big boy and deal with it. :thumbup: :laughing:


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## Guest

2Bros said:


> To Kev19Stokes-- Do a little research and you will find there are a ton of us doing preservation work in Oklahoma. I know of at least 3 other companies working for your aforementioned companies. I won't work for either of them directly, or indirectly, but again to each their own. Yes it has been extremely slow in Oklahoma the last few months, but there are numerous companies handing out work.


 
OK, you all will like this one... look at the conversation I had with my company on a property I did last week…

Amber 1/11/2011 > Payout $614

Kevin 1/11/2011 > That will work for me.

Amber 1/21/2011 > We are going to be cutting the price on this payout due to the fact that our client had not yet taken their discount at the time your original payout was sent. With that said your new payout amount will be $480.00, please respond back with your agreement / disagreement. Our clients’ original statement was for $1,228 they took a 21.8% discount making our total invoice $960 and your total statement will be $484

Kevin 1/21/2011 > This is how I figure the payout should break down, Based on what I’ve been told. 

2, 18 foot stock trailers full of debris shown in the photos= 48CY

48 CY X $12 = $576


Clean a 1800 sq Ft house $100

Winterize Property $75

Install 48 light Bulbs throughout the house $48

Mow 1 Acre of grass in the Freezing ass cold in snow (At-least $50) 

Getting Raped by ******* Contractors again....... PRICELESS

TOTAL - $850

When I put a pencil to it, it appears that the original payout wasn't enough, therefore I don't authorize a "Discount" for your client. I did the work, I believe I should be paid for it.

Amber 1/21/2011 > You do not have to authorize a discount for our company...we don't either...they just take it. Please see details below on what we pay (every time) for trashouts on FHA.

Debris - 45cy - 10 per cy - $450.00
Janitorial - (up to 2000sq ft) - $75.00
Lightbulbs - .25each - 38 - $9.50
Hazards - $25.00 

anything over 20cy has a discount 
Your total is $484.00
</SPAN>We are very grateful for having a crew in this area and you are greatly needed. However, if you cannot work for our prices, we totally understand and will look for someone to replace you. Let me know what you decide.



I quit...
</SPAN></SPAN></SPAN>


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## BPWY

I quit........ yup.

$10 per yrd???????????????????????????????

I'd have never signed with them in the first place.






AT THE LEAST you got some one responding to you about the subject and on topic.
My last dispute with 5 brothers was a major exercise in futility and ignorant life on the other end.
They'd send me a dispute email. I'd address the dispute email's topic.

The reply I'd get was not on topic, heck it wasn't even in the same slightly general subject.
They aren't the only national with this major malfunction. It sure seems like there is no intelligent life on the other end of the computer.


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## APlusPPGroup

Kev19stokes, the math doesn't add up on your client's end. 

$614 is already half of the job's original value of $1,228. $484 is what they want to pay after taking that 50%?:no:

Why did they even bother asking you to agree or disagree? Sheesh!

I'd definitely be firing that company.

Linda


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## thanohano44

At $15 a cut, they're paying their a fixed rate of $5 per cut with a minimum of 35 lawns per day. They pay $10 a cube on a debris removal. $8 a maid refresh. The trashout guys are doing trashout for $225 a trash out regardless on size. They apparently get full pricing on rehabs and such. To that fellow who is making $10 a cyd. Sounds like his client does work for FAS. At $40-$50 cyd for the nationals, this regional I assume takes $20 a cyd, or more and no work is done yet. Unreal. 

What you do is talking to the listing agents and see if they will pay you direct. You said you're the only
One within 200 miles? You'll get your money faster. Be happier and do a better job.


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> I quit........ yup.
> 
> $10 per yrd???????????????????????????????
> 
> I'd have never signed with them in the first place.
> 
> AT THE LEAST you got some one responding to you about the subject and on topic.
> My last dispute with 5 brothers was a major exercise in futility and ignorant life on the other end.
> They'd send me a dispute email. I'd address the dispute email's topic.
> 
> The reply I'd get was not on topic, heck it wasn't even in the same slightly general subject.
> They aren't the only national with this major malfunction. It sure seems like there is no intelligent life on the other end of the computer.


Well, this was the first big job since the new year I have turned in, the payout sheet I had and have been paid off of in the past was $12 a cyd. Now it is $10 and if you do a complete on a house they don’t pay for lawn or wint on a complete:furious:


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## APlusPPGroup

2Bros said:


> With all due respect Linda, unfortunately he is right on one of his statements. The company is well known, and yes they take 50% of what they are getting paid. He is not getting paid 50% of the HUD allowable. It's more like $12 cyd, $35 wints, etc. You get the picture. They are upfront and let you know that they are taking 50% of what they are getting paid. I can't live on that, but to each their own.


Unfortunately, the poster didn't mention that part, nor did he mention the name of the company he was doing the work for. Obviously, if they told him up front they take 50% of the invoiced amounts, that changes all the rules.

So my question now is............. why did he ever sign up with them in the first place, knowing they were going to take 50% off the top? 

Don't mean to sound harsh but, if he agreed to the terms when he signed up then it seems he doesn't have any room to complain about the conditions.

Linda


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## mtmtnman

thanohano44 said:


> At $15 a cut, they're paying their a fixed rate of $5 per cut with a minimum of 35 lawns per day. They pay $10 a cube on a debris removal. $8 a maid refresh. The trashout guys are doing trashout for $225 a trash out regardless on size. They apparently get full pricing on rehabs and such. To that fellow who is making $10 a cyd. Sounds like his client does work for FAS. At $40-$50 cyd for the nationals, this regional I assume takes $20 a cyd, or more and no work is done yet. Unreal.
> 
> What you do is talking to the listing agents and see if they will pay you direct. You said you're the only
> One within 200 miles? You'll get your money faster. Be happier and do a better job.




A guy cannot afford to work for FAS directly much less through someone else. Most transfer stations are $15-$20 a cu yd here. I am lucky enough to live 4 miles form the county landfill so my expenses are lower but i would barely break even at $10 a cu-yd............


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## APlusPPGroup

FreshCut said:


> Linda, is this really the answer?


I never said it was the answer. That was a recommendation. If he doesn't like working for 50%, he should go direct. 

But I also recommend he check the companies out before he does and weigh the pros and cons.

Linda


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## Guest

I never care what others make. I've worked for many guys that drive around in BIG cars and it looks like that's all they do..But I don't know that..As long as I get what I think is fair I don't whine about it..I just hate to see these guys towing a 3hp lawnmower with a little motorbike for $10- a cut..lol

70s in So Fla today..:shutup:


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## mtmtnman

Mike Hammer said:


> 70s in So Fla today..:shutup:


And it won't be long till it's 95* with 100% humidity! :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Guest

How do y'all market to brokers and listing agents?


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## Guest

I know it sounds like I am whining but all I am saying is I didn’t even get paid to cut the grass or do a wint on a house I had to drive 80 miles 3 times to complete the job. 
Look at in these eyes at $1 a mile that is $240 off profit in ware, tare and gas on a vehicle. Then look at the 2 days of work with 2 people… dump fee receipts with a total $198 
Ok, $484 - $240=$244 
$244 - $198=$46
$46/2=$23
$23/2 days= 11.5 a day to work my a:shutup: off for nothing….


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## Guest

kev19stokes said:


> I know it sounds like I am whining but all I am saying is I didn’t even get paid to cut the grass or do a wint on a house I had to drive 80 miles 3 times to complete the job.
> Look at in these eyes at $1 a mile that is $240 off profit in ware, tare and gas on a vehicle. Then look at the 2 days of work with 2 people… dump fee receipts with a total $198
> Ok, $484 - $240=$244
> $244 - $198=$46
> $46/2=$23
> $23/2 days= 11.5 a day to work my a:shutup: off for nothing….


You gotta crunch them numbers before you put your (han)cock on the line and accept the work. 
We all must know what our "walk away" price is.


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## Guest

FreshCut said:


> We all must know what our "walk away" price is.


Yep, that's a hard thing to learn but a valuable thing to know. Walk away and don't grieve over the lost job. Cheerfully and confidently tell your client that if he has another vendor that is willing to do the job for less, then that's who he needs to hire. Then comfort yourself in the knowledge that some fool is working himself to death for peanuts and he'll soon wear himself out and quit when he realizes he's not making any money, thus removing more competition from you. :thumbup:


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Per recent phone conversations you must still be a southern boy scared of the snow.


 

What's "snow?"


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## Guest

kev19stokes said:


> OK, you all will like this one... look at the conversation I had with my company on a property I did last week…
> 
> Amber 1/11/2011 > Payout $614
> 
> Kevin 1/11/2011 > That will work for me.
> 
> Amber 1/21/2011 > We are going to be cutting the price on this payout due to the fact that our client had not yet taken their discount at the time your original payout was sent. With that said your new payout amount will be $480.00, please respond back with your agreement / disagreement. Our clients’ original statement was for $1,228 they took a 21.8% discount making our total invoice $960 and your total statement will be $484
> 
> Kevin 1/21/2011 > This is how I figure the payout should break down, Based on what I’ve been told.
> 
> 2, 18 foot stock trailers full of debris shown in the photos= 48CY
> 
> 48 CY X $12 = $576
> 
> 
> Clean a 1800 sq Ft house $100
> 
> Winterize Property $75
> 
> Install 48 light Bulbs throughout the house $48
> 
> Mow 1 Acre of grass in the Freezing ass cold in snow (At-least $50)
> 
> Getting Raped by ******* Contractors again....... PRICELESS
> 
> TOTAL - $850
> 
> When I put a pencil to it, it appears that the original payout wasn't enough, therefore I don't authorize a "Discount" for your client. I did the work, I believe I should be paid for it.
> 
> Amber 1/21/2011 > You do not have to authorize a discount for our company...we don't either...they just take it. Please see details below on what we pay (every time) for trashouts on FHA.
> 
> Debris - 45cy - 10 per cy - $450.00
> Janitorial - (up to 2000sq ft) - $75.00
> Lightbulbs - .25each - 38 - $9.50
> Hazards - $25.00
> 
> anything over 20cy has a discount
> Your total is $484.00
> </SPAN>We are very grateful for having a crew in this area and you are greatly needed. However, if you cannot work for our prices, we totally understand and will look for someone to replace you. Let me know what you decide.
> 
> 
> 
> I quit...
> </SPAN></SPAN></SPAN>


 
Um......based on the above, you wuzzint robbed, you wuzz raped! :shutup:


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## Guest

$614 - $240=$374 
$374 - $198=$176
$176/2=$88
$88/2 days= $44 a day not to bad... 
Acceptable but not happy; but no! lets take a DISCOUNT AND PAY $484 

normal pay at to do this property 

$850 - $240=$610
$610 - $198=$412
$412/2=$206
$206/2 days= $103 I wold take that any day and that is what i should have been paied!

Although if I get started independently I could have made $206 a day on that job…


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> Any body know what Safeguard's 2011 grass cut price structure is?
> 
> 
> Thank you



I'd like to know this as well


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## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> And it won't be long till it's 95* with 100% humidity! :laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


I love it! I'll take year round working in the sunshine than the gloomy New England weather I grew up in..Trust me. I took many a diet pill to stay awake plowing snow at night and shoveling off roofs to start re-roof..:cool2:

no mas


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## Guest

FreshCut said:


> How do y'all market to brokers and listing agents?


knock on doors. go to their office. The most $$$ I made was with a REO Agent.
Good Luck!

btw, where you from/working?


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## mtmtnman

Mike Hammer said:


> I love it! I'll take year round working in the sunshine than the gloomy New England weather I grew up in..Trust me. I took many a diet pill to stay awake plowing snow at night and shoveling off roofs to start re-roof..:cool2:
> 
> no mas



Thats why its great to live in the USA with lots of different climates. Personally i couldn't stand the heat, the bugs, the snakes, the spiders, traffic, Wife in bed for days on end due to mold and pollen in the air and severe allergies Ect. while we lived in Florida, but the final straw was the lousy education system. My daughters where almost 2 years behind in school when we got to Montana and took them almost a year to catch up. Florida dumbs down the schools by bending over to the No Child Left Behind act. and dumbing down the curriculum so more kids can pass the FCAT. Out here we take the ones that are having trouble and give them extra help so they pass. My girls are my world and if it is good for them i would live at the north pole.........


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## BPWY

kev19stokes said:


> $614 - $240=$374
> $374 - $198=$176
> $176/2=$88
> $88/2 days= $44 a day not to bad...
> Acceptable but not happy; but no! lets take a DISCOUNT AND PAY $484
> 
> normal pay at to do this property
> 
> $850 - $240=$610
> $610 - $198=$412
> $412/2=$206
> $206/2 days= $103 I wold take that any day and that is what i should have been paied!
> 
> Although if I get started independently I could have made $206 a day on that job…






I'm not entirely sure what your numbers represent. BUT if that $206 per day is your income to the business owner and you pay for equipment over head, truck, fuel, insurances, taxes etc etc...................

You are already behind the 8 ball in a big way. You are going broke. Its just a matter of when.


IF that $206 is profit at the end of the day then you've done pretty good.

At the posted numbers of $12 for debris, $35 or $50 wints, $75 full janitorial etc etc................. I won't even go out to the garage and start my pickup.

It takes $100 just to fill my pickup. If I'm real busy I need to fill every other day or 2.5 to 3 times per week. 
That is JUST for fuel.


I suggest that you make a business plan, get your accountant to help you figure up the real cost of doing business and revise your needed income numbers way up. Other wise you won't be in business for much longer.

Not trying to be harsh here but telling you the facts. 

And the fact that you are willing to sell yourself so short makes life exponentially more difficult for those out here that are trying to run and grow a real business.
This isn't a weekend hobby money for most of us. 

This is how we make a living, and you are not making a living and running successful business at $12 per yrd debris, $50 winterizes etc.


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## Guest

Ok recent conversation on a different property closer to home but I got raped once again… in the new year.
_Amber 1/24/2011 > Payout $875_

_Kevin 1/24/2011 > _How did we come up with this number?
_Amber 1/24/2011 > __IT IS WHAT IT IS KEVIN_
We have bid to remove the debri over the 70 cubic yard cap as well as all of your hazards, and we were unable to get paid for relocating the excess debri to the garage. So this payout only consists of 70 cubic yards of debri and your janitorial, with more than a 50% cut due to our consideration of the heavy debri. As soon as the bid is approved, we will update a new work order allowing you to remove the excess debri and hazards and receive a seperate payout. If you have any questions concerning this matter please feel free to contact me to discuss.
_Kevin 1/24/2011 > _Amber- don’t get me wrong, I want to finish the job. I have done all of the hard work, why would I want you to pay some one else to do something as easy as loading the rest of the trash and hauling it off. All of the hard work ”bagging and hauling to the garage” is done; that you stated I was not getting paid for. 
All I am saying is that it is CRAP that you pay everyone else $12 a cubic yard to haul off trash, before I took the job I informed you that there was 85-90 cubic yards at this property and told her that the house was a mess. I understand you only got paid X, BUT HOW IS IT FAIR I CLEANED A 5000 SQ FT HOUSE, MOW 5 ACRES OF GRASS 3 FEET TALL AND RAKE IT, WEED FRONT GARDEN, TRIM HEDGES AROUND HOUSE, CHANGE LOCKS, WINTERIZE 9 BATHROOMS AND RELOCATE 20 CYD OF TRASH. FOR $35. Do you realize how many hours it took Kori and I to do this house. We worked around the clock to complete this job IN 48 HRS. 
I just do not think it is fair. If you can shed some light on the matter and explain “it is what it is” and why it is, when I told you guys it was a mess and 90 cubes WE HAD TO RAKE THE CARPET BEFORE WE COULD SWEEP THEN PUT A VACUME ON IT PER PICTURES!
COME ON AMBER!!! WAKE UP!
_Amber 1/24/2011 >_We will not be debating this issue with you anymore. If you no longer want us to send you work orders just let me know. The payout stands. We have placed a bid for the items in the garage and will sending you the work order as soon as it gets approved, unless you do not want it...you will have the chance to decline it when we call you. 

just looked up the house on the market $985,500

I am done with this contracting agency. Make sure you check your numbers and ask questions. I realize they have to pay for the people and the overhead but I could live with the old rules and the old payouts but this new system is not working for me… guys don’t get me wrong I have made good money with them in the past but this $10 a cyd and not paying for lawn and wint on a complete has killed me. Read the fine print… the contract I signed says that I can not go independent for 1 year after quitting with them… ***** I am F’ed. 
One option I have is my brother start an agency then pays me under it in his name and his business…. Hmmm that’s a thought


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## mtmtnman

It costs around 48 cents a mile with truck value (new at 50K/200,000 miles), tires, oil changes, insurance Ect. all figured in to operate a truck dragging a trailer around. Run JUST your miles for a week and see where you stand. The truck won't last forever and will need to be replaced! I have been very fortunate and gotten GREAT deals on low miles pickups but still manage to wear them out in 2 years.


----------



## mtmtnman

kev19stokes said:


> Ok recent conversation on a different property closer to home but I got raped once again… in the new year.
> _Amber 1/24/2011 > Payout $875_
> 
> _Kevin 1/11/2011 > _How did we come up with this number?
> _Amber 1/24/2011 > __IT IS WHAT IT IS KEVIN_
> We have bid to remove the debri over the 70 cubic yard cap as well as all of your hazards, and we were unable to get paid for relocating the excess debri to the garage. So this payout only consists of 70 cubic yards of debri and your janitorial, with more than a 50% cut due to our consideration of the heavy debri. As soon as the bid is approved, we will update a new work order allowing you to remove the excess debri and hazards and receive a seperate payout. If you have any questions concerning this matter please feel free to contact me to discuss.
> _Kevin 1/11/2011 > _Amber- don’t get me wrong, I want to finish the job. I have done all of the hard work, why would I want you to pay some one else to do something as easy as loading the rest of the trash and hauling it off. All of the hard work ”bagging and hauling to the garage” is done; that you stated I was not getting paid for.
> All I am saying is that it is CRAP that you pay everyone else $12 a cubic yard to haul off trash, before I took the job I informed you that there was 85-90 cubic yards at this property and told her that the house was a mess. I understand you only got paid X, BUT HOW IS IT FAIR I CLEANED A 5000 SQ FT HOUSE, MOW 5 ACRES OF GRASS 3 FEET TALL AND RAKE IT, WEED FRONT GARDEN, TRIM HEDGES AROUND HOUSE, CHANGE LOCKS, WINTERIZE 9 BATHROOMS AND RELOCATE 20 CYD OF TRASH. FOR $35. Do you realize how many hours it took Kori and I to do this house. We worked around the clock to complete this job IN 48 HRS.
> I just do not think it is fair. If you can shed some light on the matter and explain “it is what it is” and why it is, when I told you guys it was a mess and 90 cubes WE HAD TO RAKE THE CARPET BEFORE WE COULD SWEEP THEN PUT A VACUME ON IT PER PICTURES!
> COME ON AMBER!!! WAKE UP!
> _Amber 1/24/2011 >_We will not be debating this issue with you anymore. If you no longer want us to send you work orders just let me know. The payout stands. We have placed a bid for the items in the garage and will sending you the work order as soon as it gets approved, unless you do not want it...you will have the chance to decline it when we call you.



Once again it sounds like FAS. When you get payment Rat them out to us so word gets out but don't say a word till you get payment. Those SOBS owe me at least a couple grand from 2 years ago. The problem is there will always be someone willing to work for nothing. Quality suffers but the banks and servicing companies could really care less as long as it LOOKS good in the photos which is very easy to do........


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## Guest

kev19stokes said:


> Ok recent conversation on a different property closer to home but I got raped once again… in the new year.
> _Amber 1/24/2011 > Payout $875_
> 
> _Kevin 1/11/2011 > _How did we come up with this number?
> _Amber 1/24/2011 > __IT IS WHAT IT IS KEVIN_
> We have bid to remove the debri over the 70 cubic yard cap as well as all of your hazards, and we were unable to get paid for relocating the excess debri to the garage. So this payout only consists of 70 cubic yards of debri and your janitorial, with more than a 50% cut due to our consideration of the heavy debri. As soon as the bid is approved, we will update a new work order allowing you to remove the excess debri and hazards and receive a seperate payout. If you have any questions concerning this matter please feel free to contact me to discuss.
> _Kevin 1/11/2011 > _Amber- don’t get me wrong, I want to finish the job. I have done all of the hard work, why would I want you to pay some one else to do something as easy as loading the rest of the trash and hauling it off. All of the hard work ”bagging and hauling to the garage” is done; that you stated I was not getting paid for.
> All I am saying is that it is CRAP that you pay everyone else $12 a cubic yard to haul off trash, before I took the job I informed you that there was 85-90 cubic yards at this property and told her that the house was a mess. I understand you only got paid X, BUT HOW IS IT FAIR I CLEANED A 5000 SQ FT HOUSE, MOW 5 ACRES OF GRASS 3 FEET TALL AND RAKE IT, WEED FRONT GARDEN, TRIM HEDGES AROUND HOUSE, CHANGE LOCKS, WINTERIZE 9 BATHROOMS AND RELOCATE 20 CYD OF TRASH. FOR $35. Do you realize how many hours it took Kori and I to do this house. We worked around the clock to complete this job IN 48 HRS.
> I just do not think it is fair. If you can shed some light on the matter and explain “it is what it is” and why it is, when I told you guys it was a mess and 90 cubes WE HAD TO RAKE THE CARPET BEFORE WE COULD SWEEP THEN PUT A VACUME ON IT PER PICTURES!
> COME ON AMBER!!! WAKE UP!
> _Amber 1/24/2011 >_We will not be debating this issue with you anymore. If you no longer want us to send you work orders just let me know. The payout stands. We have placed a bid for the items in the garage and will sending you the work order as soon as it gets approved, unless you do not want it...you will have the chance to decline it when we call you.
> 
> I am done with this contracting agency. Make sure you check your numbers and ask questions. I realize they have to pay for the people and the overhead but I could live with the old rules and the old payouts but this new system is not working for me… guys don’t get me wrong I have made good money with them in the past but this $10 a cyd and not paying for lawn and wint on a complete has killed me. Read the fine print… the contract I signed says that I can not go independent for 1 year after quitting with them… ***** I am F’ed.
> One option I have is my brother start an agency then pays me under it in his name and his business…. Hmmm that’s a thought


You gotta publicize this "client's" name. First of all, she's a total a$$. Secondly, she's ripping you off by a factor of at least 4. What you've described is easily a $3,000 to $4,000 job if not much more. Watch "Hoarders" sometime or research companies that do that kind of clean-out --- $10,000 is not unheard of. 

BTW, is there no such thing as establishing an agreed-upon, not-to-be-violated price prior to doing the work???


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Kev19stokes, it sounds like you don't have a very good rapport with your coordinator. She's inflexible and you are NOT going to win an argument with her. Period.

My advice to you is to stop the arguing before she makes matters worse for you and either accept or decline the work, based on what you think is fair.

Downsides:

If you decline, you will put them in a bind. But it will only be temporary until they find a replacement.

If you decline, they may pay you more slowly than they are and discount the heck out of what's left.

Upside:

If you decline, you obviously won't get the work but at least you won't be losing money. You ARE operating at a loss, whether you realize it or not and, if you want to stay in business, you need to make some major adjustments.

The numbers you're posting are showing gross income, not a net profit. Besides the obvious such as fuel, labor, dump fees, you also need to calculate your overhead such as insurances, taxes, office space, utilities, and depreciation on your equipment, not to mention vehicle maintenance.

What you have at the end of the day is NOT your profit. Find other clients quickly and cut them loose asap. But try your best not to make it hard on yourself by pissing this client off any further. They are not reasonable, rational people and it won't matter what you say. It will not go in your favor.

Linda


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## Guest

You are wondering about AMS's pay schedule?


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## Guest

only one problem.... you do not know how much the pay is for untell you turn in pictures


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## APlusPPGroup

kev19stokes said:


> only one problem.... you do not know how much the pay is for untell you turn in pictures


How can you possibly work for a company like that? I'd have turned them down in a heartbeat.

When you go to a restaurant, you don't tell the manager how much you'll pay after you've eaten, do you? Same principle.

Linda


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## thanohano44

kev19stokes said:


> only one problem.... you do not know how much the pay is for untell you turn in pictures


Bro, sounds like a scam by your client and poor negotiations on your part. No wonder they're stringing you along. 

The good thing out of all of this is, you're learning an invaluable lesson. How not to do business and your searching on a way to do it better and be more profitable. Hang in there! You will make it as long as you keep pushing forward and learn from these experiences. I wish you the best!!


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> How can you possibly work for a company like that? I'd have turned them down in a heartbeat.
> 
> When you go to a restaurant, you don't tell the manager how much you'll pay after you've eaten, do you? Same principle.
> 
> Linda


I dont anymore


----------



## Guest

Ok, on my quest to starting my own business I am looking to find the cheapest and best contractors general liability insurance. I have been working under the companies plan. They took $300 a month for my g.l. insurance and my w.c. insurance. Where is the best place to buy the nue-sest locks and stickers/toilet covers?


----------



## Guest

Mike Hammer said:


> knock on doors. go to their office. The most $$$ I made was with a REO Agent.
> Good Luck!
> 
> btw, where you from/working?


In Atlanta

How am I to know which brokers or listing agents are dealing with REO's?

Just knocking on doors seems a bit aimless to me and I've done the door to door marketing in another field and it doesn't yield good results.


----------



## Guest

Wow....I may never complain again 

Now I see why that lady from Spectrum thought I was such a bitch this morning. I wouldn't budge $5 on an inspection. She said 15...I said 25...she said 20...I said 25. She said she would call me back...she didn't. :no:

I know what I want to make, and if I can't make it...there's no point in wasting my time. 

I love my realtors, I love my realtors, I love my realtors. :notworthy


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Wow....I may never complain again
> 
> Now I see why that lady from Spectrum thought I was such a bitch this morning. I wouldn't budge $5 on an inspection. She said 15...I said 25...she said 20...I said 25. She said she would call me back...she didn't. :no:
> 
> I know what I want to make, and if I can't make it...there's no point in wasting my time.
> 
> *I love my realtors, I love my realtors, I love my realtors.* :notworthy


How do you get them?! How do you find them?

Are all realtors dealing with REO?


----------



## Guest

Fresh cut...no easy way to do it. 
Hit the phone book and the pavement. You may spend months getting realtors, but they are so much easier to work for. I have never had an agent question an invoice or complain about a job. Most of them pay within a week or so, as well. Have a few we do net 30 or end of month.

Being in SC, we are lucky in that many realtors do not use nationals. I've had nationals tell me they don't go after the work here because the laws are tough on them. May not be the same where you are.

Takes time, but worth the effort.


----------



## Racerx

Anybody do any work for Altisource?..I did all the neccessary paperwork and training for their program and the only thing that's happend so far is ,I got a order to repair some broken windows ,and I go to the property the next day and there's already someone there doing the job!,the only other request I got was a clean out and yard maintenence back in October that we're still dancing around on!! ,numerous bid re-works, trips back and forth taking pics etc.

At this point I don't know if I want to do any work for them,if it takes this long to get a go ahead for a job I can just imagine how long it would take to get paid!!!.:whistling:whistling


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> Wow....I may never complain again
> 
> Now I see why that lady from Spectrum thought I was such a bitch this morning. I wouldn't budge $5 on an inspection. She said 15...I said 25...she said 20...I said 25. She said she would call me back...she didn't. :no:
> 
> I know what I want to make, and if I can't make it...there's no point in wasting my time.
> 
> I love my realtors, I love my realtors, I love my realtors. :notworthy


lmao! You negotiate like I do. Are you sure we're not related?:laughing:

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> lmao! You negotiate like I do. Are you sure we're not related?:laughing:
> 
> Linda


 
You go, sistas! 

Remember boys, this is easier for you. If we hold the line, we're bitches. If you do it, you're shrewd negotiators. Use the advantage you have! :notworthy


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Curb Appeal REO said:


> You go, sistas!
> 
> Remember boys, this is easier for you. If we hold the line, we're bitches. If you do it, you're shrewd negotiators. Use the advantage you have! :notworthy


Awwwwww. You're too kind.:laughing: 

I've been called much worse, inside and outside the industry but smiling and walking away makes me feel good. No point in arguing what they think, right?

Seriously, though, if YOU don't hold the line, who will? In the end, MOST clients will respect you for it because they will also come away with the understanding that you won't budge with the vendors and turn in less than acceptable work, too.

I don't nickel and dime my vendors and I won't allow the clients to do that to me. We might negotiate on large orders but NEVER for $5.

Barefoot gets a big :thumbsup: from me!

Linda
Linda


----------



## Guest

Not to change the subject but might anybody know of an easier image editor to label photos. We are using paint.net, I can grab a picture without having to go through opening and closing programs but can't pull multiple photos up and do several at a time without closing the one I just completed. Was kinda hoping I could find one that is computer guy proof and easy.


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> How can you possibly work for a company like that? I'd have turned them down in a heartbeat.
> 
> When you go to a restaurant, you don't tell the manager how much you'll pay after you've eaten, do you? Same principle.
> 
> Linda


BPWY and myself had a co. out of Nebraska that USED to try and pull that game. We put a stop to it right quick............


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Rich51 said:


> Not to change the subject but might anybody know of an easier image editor to label photos. We are using paint.net, I can grab a picture without having to go through opening and closing programs but can't pull multiple photos up and do several at a time without closing the one I just completed. Was kinda hoping I could find one that is computer guy proof and easy.


All your photos are in the same file, right? Click on the first one, hold down the shift key, then click the last one in the group so that the group you are labeling is highlighted. Take your finger off the shift key and hit F2. One of the photos will come up waiting for you to name it. Once you do, it will label all the ones you highlighted.

If you are labeling select photos, not a group, click the first one, hold down the control key, then click each of the ones you want to label. Once done, take your finger off the control key and do what you did to label the group above.

Doing it this way eliminates a lot of time going in and out of programs. Hope that helps.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> BPWY and myself had a co. out of Nebraska that USED to try and pull that game. We put a stop to it right quick............


Nobody in their right mind should even consider doing business that way. 

Name your price and stick to it....... or agree on set pricing if you think it's fair. If you don't think it's fair, walk away.

The main thing is to not be desperate enough to take what you can get. It will ruin you very quickly.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

kev19stokes said:


> Ok, on my quest to starting my own business I am looking to find the cheapest and best contractors general liability insurance. I have been working under the companies plan. They took $300 a month for my g.l. insurance and my w.c. insurance. Where is the best place to buy the nue-sest locks and stickers/toilet covers?





Damn they where ripping you off there!!! $3600 a year???? If you work ALONE you can get a work comp. exemption from compsourceok.com. Just get an AFLAC plan as it is cheaper than work comp. on yourself. 

General Liability: A 1,000,000-2,000,000 will satisfy MOST nationals and should cost under $800 a yr. Mine is $650. As far as locks, MFS stuff is spendy and crappy. Bargainlocks is marginally better. Nu-Set stuff is decent but damn expensive.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Damn they where ripping you off there!!! $3600 a year???? * If you work ALONE you can get a work comp. exemption from compsourceok.com. Just get an AFLAC plan as it is cheaper than work comp. on yourself. *
> 
> General Liability: A 1,000,000-2,000,000 will satisfy MOST nationals and should cost under $800 a yr. Mine is $650. As far as locks, MFS stuff is spendy and crappy. Bargainlocks is marginally better. Nu-Set stuff is decent but damn expensive.


Can you tell me more about this worker's comp. exemption?

What do you mean an AFLAC plan is cheaper than worker's comp. on myself?
If I have health insurance then I don't need worker's comp. on myself?


----------



## Guest

First of all I would like to say thanks to everyone who posts on this site, it makes me feel better when I see other people going through the same stuff that we go through on a weekly basis. Linda..thanks for all the info. We have been doing property preservation for about three years and even I can say that we have seen the industry begin to run itself into the ground. We try very hard to do things correctly and for reasonable price. Key word being reasonable, some of the numbers I see on this post downright scare me. Have a business plan, know what goes out before you decide to accept work orders. You may find that staying home and doing marketing instead is a better option. Hold your ground and watch the crappy work get done. Don't worry, you will get called back to"fix" the problems and imagine that, the price just went up.


----------



## mtmtnman

FreshCut said:


> Can you tell me more about this worker's comp. exemption?
> 
> What do you mean an AFLAC plan is cheaper than worker's comp. on myself?
> If I have health insurance then I don't need worker's comp. on myself?


work comp is a requirement if you have employees but you don't have to get it on yourself if you have a state work comp. exemption certificate. All the companies i work with accept the work comp exempt form. I have an AFLAC plan in case i get injured plus a High Deductible Insurance Plan & Health Savings account. This will pay if i get injured on any of my jobs. The health ins. i pay no matter what and the AFLAC makes up my deductibles at a cheaper rate than work comp would cost me.........


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Once again it sounds like FAS. When you get payment Rat them out to us so word gets out but don't say a word till you get payment. Those SOBS owe me at least a couple grand from 2 years ago. The problem is there will always be someone willing to work for nothing. Quality suffers but the banks and servicing companies could really care less as long as it LOOKS good in the photos which is very easy to do........










At this point I'm not so sure that FAS is completely to blame.

I am absolutely certain that some of the blame resides with the guy that is about to get his own house returned to bank control after he banged you, your guys, me and who knows who all.

Karma is a witch and it couldn't be happening to a nicer B hole.


----------



## BPWY

FreshCut said:


> In Atlanta
> 
> How am I to know which brokers or listing agents are dealing with REO's?
> 
> Just knocking on doors seems a bit aimless to me and I've done the door to door marketing in another field and it doesn't yield good results.






Same here, cold calling hasn't produced profitable results for me either.


I've passed out hundreds of biz cards to nearly orgasmic agents when they find out the kind of work I do.
And yet...................0.0 phone calls.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> At this point I'm not so sure that FAS is completely to blame.
> 
> I am absolutely certain that some of the blame resides with the guy that is about to get his own house returned to bank control after he banged you, your guys, me and who knows who all.
> 
> Karma is a witch and it couldn't be happening to a nicer B hole.


What did I miss here?

"the guy that is about to get his own house returned to bank control"? "...after he banged you,.."?

You talking about the guy that bought the house from the bank after they, the bank, had sub-standard work done on it?


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> The main thing is to not be desperate enough to take what you can get. It will ruin you very quickly.
> 
> Linda







The main reason I have few nationals I'm working for right now is because of this.
After a while you develop a spine and don't allow them to bully and push you around. They will drop you like a hot potato.


On the same subject........ diversify diversify diversify!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Don't put all your eggs in one basket, don't work solely for just one national/regional. 
Don't work solely in P&P. Market your biz to other folks too. I get a little work from many different sources.


----------



## BPWY

FreshCut said:


> What did I miss here?
> 
> "the guy that is about to get his own house returned to bank control"? "...after he banged you,.."?
> 
> You talking about the guy that bought the house from the bank after they, the bank, had sub-standard work done on it?






Talking about the owner of a wanna be national company that banged myself and some other guys I know when we were getting work from his company.

Karma is a witch and while he was banging us and trying to bring us and our companies down in the end we are still successful and hes the one going down.

He was nearly successful at getting my house returned to bank control. 
I managed to pull thru and am in a position to where I could pay my pickup off tonight if I choose to. 
Its a good place to be compared to a mere 12 months ago.
Does this mean I'm floating in cash? Hell no, just that I'm not starving.
The upcoming lawn care season looks to be a good one. I'm bidding a lot of stuff out already in Jan and have high hopes.



If any of you guys struggling in the P&P biz are thinking of getting into lawn care by all means research your local scene, get your equipment and insurances in line and go for it. BUT for the love of God make sure that you are market pricing. Don't set out with the business model of beating any and all prices like has become the standard of P&P.
I just saw an ad on Craigslist by some guys promising to do just that. Beat any and all prices regardless.

A lot of folks are in business to make a living for themselves and their families and cut throat operators are not doing themselves or any body else a favor. 
There is nothing immoral about a fair price for a quality job.


----------



## BPWY

Any body wanna repo a church?????


http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/25/churches-end-nigh/?test=latestnews


I'd be scared of a stray lightning bolt hitting me while I was trying to break in the front door to change locks. 
lol


----------



## Guest

FreshCut said:


> Can you tell me more about this worker's comp. exemption?
> 
> What do you mean an AFLAC plan is cheaper than worker's comp. on myself?
> If I have health insurance then I don't need worker's comp. on myself?


Health Insurance won't cover "on the job injuries" unless you have a work comp rider or some States call them a 24 hour rider. Ask your insurance agent if you have coverage (in writing preferably) if injured on the job. 

Now sometimes you "might" get by if you don't tell your insurance company that you got "hurt" while working but if there is an emergency and you are transported by ambulance (ie falling off ladder or roof or shooting a nail through your hand) than its going to be pretty darn hard explaining why you were at *** address and not your home. 

AFLAC is a little injury policy that does pay well but does not take place of work comp.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Health Insurance won't cover "on the job injuries" unless you have a work comp rider or some States call them a 24 hour rider. Ask your insurance agent if you have coverage (in writing preferably) if injured on the job.
> 
> Now sometimes you "might" get by if you don't tell your insurance company that you got "hurt" while working but if there is an emergency and you are transported by ambulance (ie falling off ladder or roof or shooting a nail through your hand) than its going to be pretty darn hard explaining why you were at *** address and not your home.
> 
> AFLAC is a little injury policy that does pay well but does not take place of work comp.



My group health will and has picked up my medical bills less deductibles but i do not have any wage loss benefits cept for AFLAC. When i got my health current policy i informed the underwriter i was a Sole Proprietor LLC. There are states that a sole proprietor CANNOT buy work comp. Wyoming being one of them. Work comp. here is over 4K a year for a 10K max payout. Not worth it as in 2 1/2 years i can put that 10K in the bank and pay my own medical eh?.


----------



## Guest

Work Comp is offered in all 50 States for Self Employed persons. There is a big difference between "exempt" and "elect" . 

1) a self employed person can be exempt which means that he or she is not required to purchase w.c. 

2) a self employed person in any of the 50 States can elect to purchase work comp. 

You might want to ask that underwriter the "what if" and get it in writing that if you get seriously hurt are they going to cover the "on the job injury" when you elected to exempt yourself from coverage for accidents on the job......

Just saying:whistling

you can purchase in MT here: 

*Some individuals and groups of workers are exempted by law from workers’ comp insurance.* To elect coverage for exempted employments (subject to Montana State Fund approval), please call us at 1-800-332-6102.


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Work Comp is offered in all 50 States for Self Employed persons. There is a big difference between "exempt" and "elect" .
> 
> 1) a self employed person can be exempt which means that he or she is not required to purchase w.c.
> 
> 2) a self employed person in any of the 50 States can elect to purchase work comp.
> 
> You might want to ask that underwriter the "what if" and get it in writing that if you get seriously hurt are they going to cover the "on the job injury" when you elected to exempt yourself from coverage for accidents on the job......
> 
> Just saying:whistling
> 
> you can purchase in MT here:
> 
> *Some individuals and groups of workers are exempted by law from workers’ comp insurance.* To elect coverage for exempted employments (subject to Montana State Fund approval), please call us at 1-800-332-6102.


As i said, Over $4,000 for 10K minimum coverage. We have the highest work comp rates in country. (logging, mining and ranching state, go figure)

*Sole Proprietor:* Excluded from coverage/may elect to be included 

*Partners:* Excluded from coverage/may elect to be included 

*Corporate Officers:* Included in coverage/may elect to be exempt 

*LLC Members:* Excluded from coverage/may elect to be included
As far as Wyoming, BPWY would have to form an LLC to get coverage.

*Sole Proprietor:* Excluded from coverage 

*Partners:* Excluded from coverage 

*Corporate Officers:* Excluded from coverage/may elect to be included 

*LLC Members:* Excluded from coverage/may elect to be included

_*
Just dug out my notes. $3149 per yr was the quote from State Fund last summer....................................................*_


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> My group health will and has picked up my medical bills less deductibles but i do not have any wage loss benefits cept for AFLAC. When i got my health current policy i informed the underwriter i was a Sole Proprietor LLC. There are states that a sole proprietor CANNOT buy work comp. Wyoming being one of them. Work comp. here is over 4K a year for a 10K max payout. Not worth it as in 2 1/2 years i can put that 10K in the bank and pay my own medical eh?.


Your group health??? What's this?

AFLAC offers a wage loss benefit policy? What kind of policy is this? What's it called?


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Work Comp is offered in all 50 States for Self Employed persons. There is a big difference between "exempt" and "elect" .
> 
> 1) a self employed person can be exempt which means that he or she is not required to purchase w.c.
> 
> 2) a self employed person in any of the 50 States can elect to purchase work comp.
> 
> You might want to ask that underwriter the "what if" and get it in writing that if you get seriously hurt are they going to cover the "on the job injury" when you elected to exempt yourself from coverage for accidents on the job......
> 
> Just saying:whistling
> 
> you can purchase in MT here:
> 
> *Some individuals and groups of workers are exempted by law from workers’ comp insurance.* To elect coverage for exempted employments (subject to Montana State Fund approval), please call us at 1-800-332-6102.


So you're saying it isn't wise to exempt yourself from worker's comp insurance if you're working alone?

$3149 _*is*_ a lot for one year and I can't afford that to be honest. What's the alternative?

I have GL ins and everything else for the record (I've read how bad y'all talk about those that don't)


----------



## JenkinsHB

BPWY said:


> Any body wanna repo a church?????
> 
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/25/churches-end-nigh/?test=latestnews
> 
> 
> I'd be scared of a stray lightning bolt hitting me while I was trying to break in the front door to change locks.
> lol


I've been sent to do a secure on a church. We walked away.


----------



## mtmtnman

FreshCut said:


> So you're saying it isn't wise to exempt yourself from worker's comp insurance if you're working alone?
> 
> $3149 _*is*_ a lot for one year and I can't afford that to be honest. What's the alternative?
> 
> I have GL ins and everything else for the record (I've read how bad y'all talk about those that don't)




It's probably better to have it in general. Work Comp depends on where you live. Some states are "reasonable" My state is not. Look here for approximate pricing. http://www.scribd.com/full/40093573?access_key=key-2116xg1u4j9irn9lcu7h 

All in all Insurance is a racket. I am married with 2 healthy kids and my health ins. premiums are over 10K a year with nothing more than minor claims of less than 2K a year for the past 10 years. This means i paid in an average of 100K in this time period while receiving under 10K in benefits. I should be able to claim any self employed injury or weekend accident for what i pay. I am going to do a little more digging on my policy today..........


----------



## mtmtnman

FreshCut said:


> Your group health??? What's this?
> 
> AFLAC offers a wage loss benefit policy? What kind of policy is this? What's it called?



I pay 75% of a group health plan through my wife's employer.

AFLAC accident insurance. 3 to four hundred bucks a year.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> The main reason I have few nationals I'm working for right now is because of this.
> After a while you develop a spine and don't allow them to bully and push you around. They will drop you like a hot potato.
> 
> 
> On the same subject........ diversify diversify diversify!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> Don't put all your eggs in one basket, don't work solely for just one national/regional.
> Don't work solely in P&P. Market your biz to other folks too. I get a little work from many different sources.





Curb Appeal REO said:


> You gotta publicize this "client's" name. First of all, she's a total a$$. Secondly, she's ripping you off by a factor of at least 4. What you've described is easily a $3,000 to $4,000 job if not much more. Watch "Hoarders" sometime or research companies that do that kind of clean-out --- $10,000 is not unheard of.
> 
> BTW, is there no such thing as establishing an agreed-upon, not-to-be-violated price prior to doing the work???


I do NOTHING without an agreed upon base price. The beauty of being in business for yourself is that you can easily tell them " We decline this work order for insufficient compensation." NEXT!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

JenkinsHB said:


> I've been sent to do a secure on a church. We walked away.


No churches yet but we've secured banks taken over by the FDIC and taken photos of the interiors, including the vaults. 

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> No churches yet but we've secured banks taken over by the FDIC and taken photos of the interiors, including the vaults.
> 
> Linda







Nice.

Back in my construction days I put a foundation in for a bank, including the basement vault. Pretty intense stuff that goes on behind the concrete.

It'd be interesting to see the completed product.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> Nice.
> 
> Back in my construction days I put a foundation in for a bank, including the basement vault. Pretty intense stuff that goes on behind the concrete.
> 
> It'd be interesting to see the completed product.


It's a little strange to see a fully set up bank with no people in it. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

Hello all... I just found the site and joined. You guy's are very knowledgeable, funny, friendly, direct, honest, and informative. Thanks!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

CleanoutMasters said:


> Hello all... I just found the site and joined. You guy's are very knowledgeable, funny, friendly, direct, honest, and informative. Thanks!


You forgot the 7th dwarf......... crazy!:laughing:

In any case, welcome to the forum!

Linda


----------



## Guest

*preservations*

Hello,

Im a an owner of a company who does work for these people. If you have any questions please feel free toask away.


----------



## BPWY

Who is "these people"????????????????????????????


----------



## mtmtnman

My condolences to the FAS contractor who's house i rekeyed for Fannie Mae today. Found a bunch of work orders all over the floor dating back to the time last year when i quit for them. Looks like you where my replacement and also looks like there cheap azz pay didn't save your house. Sure wish you would have made a few more trips to the dump instead of your home with trash though. Good luck in your endeavors....................


----------



## BPWY

Yesterday I get a bid to secure for BAC............ for the 4th time.

The price to do the work isn't changing, the door is still kicked in and allowing animals, snow, birds, and rain to enter the house.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Yesterday I get a bid to secure for BAC............ for the 4th time.
> 
> The price to do the work isn't changing, the door is still kicked in and allowing animals, snow, birds, and rain to enter the house.




Let me guess. No authorization #..............................


----------



## BPWY

Original secure on the house was long before they dreamed that disaster up.

Some one vandalized the door and removed the easy to take copper. 

They are completely incapable of approving HUD rates for boarding a door.


----------



## Guest

They have been approving all kinds of stuff for me lately. I have been very surprised at things I have bid and got approved. Funny how it changes from area to area. I wonder if they have some formula for doing it. 

It really pays to get creative with your wording when submitting bids. Using big technical sounding words has paid off: shingles vs petroleum based fiberglass reinforced roofing sheets. 

I had an employee get a denial from the auth center today because they "couldn't verify the photo on google street view or zillow" My guy called me and told me, I pulled it up on google and called the auth center back, told them how find the property and we got the authorization. 

We got a denial today because the property had only been reported vacant 30 days ago and it had to be over 30 days before they would issue authorization. I don't know who dreamed up that a house won't freeze in less than 30 days.

Seeing insurance rates has been enlightening. On workers comp I pay about $8000 annual but that is with half a dozen guys. I am really glad I'm not in MT. That looks pretty steep up there.


----------



## Guest

I been seeing a lot of hits on FAS lately I am not feeling the pain, after the learning curve 4 to 5k a week coming in on average, they pay very well for services done and if you miss a pic you can let there qa figure out what you need to get then email it in within 24 hours.

average initial lawn care with the abilty to trim or rake up leaves to 5 cy that could be a 227 dollars lawn cut on a simple home, if more needs to be done approval comes fast .

debris is a min 1 cy, not breakdown to half a cy, sure it gets harder when debris reaches over 20 cy due to discounts, but there is oppurtinities even then

wints - pay per water heater, not units or anything else. run into a lot of homes with more then one. lot of others I work with say I can bid it out but I am there lets get er done and move on.

these are some of the advantages with fas, but the biggest one if i just dont want to do it I hit the deny button and no phones calls trying to leverage me to do it they just reassign.

of course I do feel a hate hate love relationship with them but honestly they have been the least of my problems and good communication with them there more then willing to work with you.

at first it was a nightmare, but our growth since we stuck with them and figure it out not only in our bank account and pay with the ability to upgrade equipment has been tremendous.

I look at a lot of things in a different way, I heard someone comment about spectrum. Spectrum sent me a rush inspection order got it done same day I know the order paid 5 or 8 dollars whatever wasnt concern cause spectrum sent me tons of wints a few month ago and I know there in line to get a big volume in the near future.

I am just not seeing what a lot of people seem to be complaining about, I am starting to wonder if I just keep reading these negative post from the same people to help stop the growth of newcomers.

I understand those that work in rural area's have different challenges and yes you can be very succesful with a small crew or grow yourself right into bankruptcy because sometimes being very busy with 20 crew aint going to make the same amount of money either.

and no I do not work 7 days a week I take vacation and spend time with my family and I have done this for awhile.


----------



## BPWY

Idaho you have a rare FAS relationship from every thing I've ever heard, and experienced myself.
Maybe you happen to have a great asset manager you work with.

My experience with them in NE, CO, and WY was nothing like you mentioned.

I don't bag on them because I'm trying to keep FNGs out of the biz. I hate them because they were the most idiotic company I had ever worked with to date. They were unable to grasp the concept of paying for work completed and even when they did they expected me to work for far too cheap to cover expenses, let alone make a profit.
Some of the fault was the huge amount of miles I had to drive.... some of it. 
Most of it was the gross incompetence of the folks I had the misfortune to work with. Count yourself lucky.


----------



## BPWY

I see that 5 Brothers is looking hard and heavy for contractors in many states across the US.
Maybe if you hadn't changed your policies to one of screwing the contractors at every turn you'd still have some of your valuable experienced contractors. 
They used to be a good company to work for. Then they got greedy. Right about the time that HUD chopped the rates and the bid approvals.


Coincidence??????????????


----------



## Guest

Idaho,

I congratulate you with the success with FAS. Personally a few years back we dropped a 6 figure contract with them due to the incompetence. 

I hear both bad and good on every company out there. Depends on who you deal with. 

Just don't go overboard on equipment and hired help since the business is so volitale right now that all the work with a "certain" company can vaporize overnight. 

For now make the most of it that you can and build the bank account:thumbsup:

ATTN: we heard this "rumor" today from a very good solid source.....NO P&P contractors will be doing any repair work on Fannie Properties effective 2-1-11. We have a $10k repair job approved today and was told that this should be the last one we receive from Fannie since they are now starting their program that is through a big "box store"......


----------



## Guest

On this hud thing, we had a realtor come to us stated that due to the new hud changes the realtor is responsible to getting the de-wint done before an inspection and home winterized after job is done. we were more then happy to get the house she wanted done and she has advertise like crazy for us to other realtors cause she said there is a lot of realtors in a bind because of this, best thing is no pics are required. But was this realtor confused or is there some truth to it


----------



## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> On this hud thing, we had a realtor come to us stated that due to the new hud changes the realtor is responsible to getting the de-wint done before an inspection and home winterized after job is done. we were more then happy to get the house she wanted done and she has advertise like crazy for us to other realtors cause she said there is a lot of realtors in a bind because of this, best thing is no pics are required. But was this realtor confused or is there some truth to it


For Fannie that is correct but I have not heard of this for HUD homes since they order the M&M Service Company contractors to handle this.....
She might want to check to see if she will be reimbursed from HUD since I don't think there is a direct reimbursment vehicle for submission of invoices for a realtor....? 
If this is so then I will have to contact all the HUD realtors who I work with but I woulda thought that they would have said something before now. :blink:


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> On this hud thing, we had a realtor come to us stated that due to the new hud changes the realtor is responsible to getting the de-wint done before an inspection and home winterized after job is done. we were more then happy to get the house she wanted done and she has advertise like crazy for us to other realtors cause she said there is a lot of realtors in a bind because of this, best thing is no pics are required. But was this realtor confused or is there some truth to it



Dunno but i have gotten a few of those lately myself..............


----------



## Guest

OH one other thing you will need to ask the realtor if she/he needs to have the Plumbing Form signed and if so then you have to be a licensed plumber to complete the dewinterize. Not the winterize but the dewz...go figure?


----------



## mtmtnman

IdahoProperty said:


> I been seeing a lot of hits on FAS lately I am not feeling the pain, after the learning curve 4 to 5k a week coming in on average, they pay very well for services done and if you miss a pic you can let there qa figure out what you need to get then email it in within 24 hours.
> 
> average initial lawn care with the abilty to trim or rake up leaves to 5 cy that could be a 227 dollars lawn cut on a simple home, if more needs to be done approval comes fast .
> 
> debris is a min 1 cy, not breakdown to half a cy, sure it gets harder when debris reaches over 20 cy due to discounts, but there is oppurtinities even then
> 
> wints - pay per water heater, not units or anything else. run into a lot of homes with more then one. lot of others I work with say I can bid it out but I am there lets get er done and move on.
> 
> these are some of the advantages with fas, but the biggest one if i just dont want to do it I hit the deny button and no phones calls trying to leverage me to do it they just reassign.
> 
> of course I do feel a hate hate love relationship with them but honestly they have been the least of my problems and good communication with them there more then willing to work with you.
> 
> at first it was a nightmare, but our growth since we stuck with them and figure it out not only in our bank account and pay with the ability to upgrade equipment has been tremendous.
> 
> I look at a lot of things in a different way, I heard someone comment about spectrum. Spectrum sent me a rush inspection order got it done same day I know the order paid 5 or 8 dollars whatever wasnt concern cause spectrum sent me tons of wints a few month ago and I know there in line to get a big volume in the near future.
> 
> I am just not seeing what a lot of people seem to be complaining about, I am starting to wonder if I just keep reading these negative post from the same people to help stop the growth of newcomers.
> 
> I understand those that work in rural area's have different challenges and yes you can be very succesful with a small crew or grow yourself right into bankruptcy because sometimes being very busy with 20 crew aint going to make the same amount of money either.
> 
> and no I do not work 7 days a week I take vacation and spend time with my family and I have done this for awhile.



They still owe me $2K that i'll never see. $35 lawn cuts didn't even pay for fuel to the job but they just didn't get it. The brokers here HATE FAS. Their photo policy is unreal. I had to take 4-500 pics on an reo clean lawn lock and wint and sometimes that wasn't enough for them. Funny how i get work form brokers on REO properties and never have to submit a photo but get a check from the bank in a week or 2. (i usually take a few dozen just for my records) The brokers tell me they take 12-15 for their BPO and they are done.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Dunno but i have gotten a few of those lately myself..............


 
I get a ton for the REO and the Fannies but are you doing the HUD ones for the realtors and not for the Service Company?

Could be a great opportunity:thumbsup:


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> OH one other thing you will need to ask the realtor if she/he needs to have the Plumbing Form signed and if so then you have to be a licensed plumber to complete the dewinterize. Not the winterize but the dewz...go figure?




Nothing here on that. In fact i meet with the local cities and ask them to check the Water Meters for me before they turn the curb box on. They have actually changed a few due to age.......


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I see that 5 Brothers is looking hard and heavy for contractors in many states across the US.
> Maybe if you hadn't changed your policies to one of screwing the contractors at every turn you'd still have some of your valuable experienced contractors.
> They used to be a good company to work for. Then they got greedy. Right about the time that *HUD chopped the rates and the bid approvals*.
> 
> 
> Coincidence??????????????


What do you mean by this? When and what exactly happened?


----------



## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> On this hud thing, we had a realtor come to us stated that due to the new hud changes the realtor is responsible to getting the de-wint done before an inspection and home winterized after job is done. we were more then happy to get the house she wanted done and she has advertise like crazy for us to other realtors cause she said there is a lot of realtors in a bind because of this, best thing is no pics are required. But was this realtor confused or is there some truth to it





FremontREO said:


> For Fannie that is correct but I have not heard of this for HUD homes since they order the M&M Service Company contractors to handle this.....
> She might want to check to see if she will be reimbursed from HUD since I don't think there is a direct reimbursment vehicle for submission of invoices for a realtor....?
> If this is so then I will have to contact all the HUD realtors who I work with but I woulda thought that they would have said something before now. :blink:





mtmtnman said:


> Dunno but i have gotten a few of those lately myself..............





FremontREO said:


> I get a ton for the REO and the Fannies but are you doing the HUD ones for the realtors and not for the Service Company?
> 
> Could be a great opportunity:thumbsup:


Uhm.... I'm confused and in need of some clarification.

OK, so these gov't agencies (fannie mae, freddie mac, HUD) award contracts to Field Service Managers(formerly called P&P) nationals (Safeguard, FAS, Cityside), right? And Brokers & listing agents work as the Asset Managers (formerly called M&M) to get REO listings sold.

Then we (us here, depending on the size of our company) register with these FSM's & AM's as vendors, right?

Working for the FSM's as independent contractors and brokers (AM's) as contractors to get help them get stuff done that they are responsible for... like the de-winterizations talked about above?

Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'm here to learn.

Also, if we as contractors have complaints, can't we just go here..http://www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/hoc/hsghocs.cfm Contact 
your Homeownership Centers and tell 'em what's going on with the FSM not doing right?

Another thing, as contractors shouldn't there only be work given out from the listed FSM's & AM's on this map http://www.hud.gov/offices/hsg/sfh/reo/mm/mm3map.pdf
I'm hearing about way more FSM's than are listed at the bottom of that map.
Lastly, how would I get a list of brokers & listing agents that are AM's for HUD or any other gov't agency? Shouldn't they be published or listed somewhere?


----------



## Guest

M&M and real estate agents/brokers are not the same as asset managers, they are 3 seperate entities.

The asset manager is the person at the bank who is responsible to get the REO house sold. They work with the real estate agent on deciding the price of the asset (house) and other items about the asset to get it sold. They can then send orders to either the feild services (Nationals- BAC, FAS, Safeguard etc) or they can ask the real estate agent to get the job done. Sometimes they are required by some rule in their system to use one way or the other, sometimes they will use both avenues.

Some of the banks think they are getting a better deal using the nationals. They are afraid the real estate agents are taking a cut on the work they are in charge of. I don't know of any of the agents I work with who take anything. I have heard of agents who do. I do know even if they did, it would be a whole lot less than what the national's are taking.

General agreement among real estate agents and contractors is that better, faster, less expensive work gets done when the real estate agent is in charge of getting the work done. I met an agent at a house to get him a bid to clean it. An FAS contractor had cut a whole in the middle of a very nice front door to install a deadbolt back and cover, no guts in the lock. Just for the contactor to be able to send in a photo of a new lock on the door and ruin a solid wood door in the process. 

That is an example of the asset manager sending the national out to the house to do the lock work and asking the real estate agent to take care of cleaning the house. The agent was upset because had he been in charge of all of it, I would have been doing all the work. The front door would not have been ruined making it that much harder to sell the house, so he would get his commission sooner.


----------



## BPWY

Most likely FAS demanded a deadbolt be put on thanks to HUD's new regs.


I got a nice check this week from some work I was REQUIRED to do by a national.
The property was old with no deadbolts as OEM equipment on the doors.... YOU MUST 
install deadbolts on ALL doors ... and knoblocks, padlocking is not acceptable on a "regular" door.


----------



## Guest

50$ to install handrails on steps that by code do not even require handrails. 40$ in material alone to secure said rails into concrete. What a joke. We are laborers,carpenters,electricians,plumbers,landscapers,janitors and garbage men or women all rolled into one. Since when does an individual who posseses these multiple skillsets work for minimum wage? These national and regional companies are nothing more than brokers who take a large portion of money from those of us who actually do the work. As an owner operator of a trucking business I have had years of dealings with these snakes who feel entitled to rake you over the coals again and again. The beauty of being self employed is that the words NO THANK YOU flow freely and often from your mouth with such ease that a person stands proud at the end of the day.
UNITED WE STAND, DEVIDED WE BEG!!!!


----------



## BPWY

craneop said:


> 50$ to install handrails on steps that by code do not even require handrails. 40$ in material alone to secure said rails into concrete. What a joke. We are laborers,carpenters,electricians,plumbers,landscapers,janitors and garbage men or women all rolled into one. Since when does an individual who posseses these multiple skillsets work for minimum wage? These national and regional companies are nothing more than brokers who take a large portion of money from those of us who actually do the work. As an owner operator of a trucking business I have had years of dealings with these snakes who feel entitled to rake you over the coals again and again. The beauty of being self employed is that the words NO THANK YOU flow freely and often from your mouth with such ease that a person stands proud at the end of the day.
> UNITED WE STAND, DEVIDED WE BEG!!!!






As a former O/O in trucking I've stated from the time I re-entered this industry 2 yrs ago that P&P feels A LOT like working for brokers etc.

I like your last statement.




Yesterday I was thinking......... WHY are we asking what so and so's grass cut price list is for 2011?

We should be the ones telling them what our rate is. After all this is free market and if we are working for their rate that basically makes us employees.

The entire industry sure has fallen a long way.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> As a former O/O in trucking I've stated from the time I re-entered this industry 2 yrs ago that P&P feels A LOT like working for brokers etc.
> 
> I like your last statement.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yesterday I was thinking......... WHY are we asking what so and so's grass cut price list is for 2011?
> 
> We should be the ones telling them what our rate is. After all this is free market and if we are working for their rate that basically makes us employees.
> 
> The entire industry sure has fallen a long way.



You bring up a good point that a shark lawyer should be able to run with. If they tell us what they are paying we are in effect employees and THEY should pay work comp. Ect. If we tell them what we will work for on a job, effectively bidding each one we are then private contractors. Problem with that is there will always be some broke guy cutting lawn for $15.............


----------



## Guest

No problem for me, I say let the fool cut it. And when he runs out of gas at 3$ a gallon, he will fall away like so many before him. And when there is a code violation posted on the front door for unkept lawn my phone will ring and the price will be what I say it will be. I am not expecting to get rich but I sure as hell understand operating cost,overhead and P&L. The dude that is cutting @ 15$ does not!!! All of these companies that divy out this work have a cutoff price, and I can garantee if there P&L sheet dont jive they will not accept the work either. Stand tall for yourself, I would rather be broke and proud than broke and ashamed of the scraps these ppl through to me. 

That is exactly what I told them mtmn. They didnt even allow me the chance to bid, they told me how much it would pay, NO THANK YOU the last time I checked, the name on my GL cert was GriffinCo P&P, have a nice day  ( dial tone )


----------



## Guest

I have always thought that if a company dictates the price and specifies the timelines work needs to be done by then in effect we are employees of that company. Maybe they can pay the insurance too??? I like to think that we are more than capable of setting a price for service that we as a company provide. 15 dollar grass cuts don't even come close.


----------



## oteroproperties

Im with you all on setting price but we do have the ability to turn down the work if the pay is not enough. Business has been operating like this since the begining of time. A customer needs a product or service. They also have a price they are willing to pay for that product or service end of story.

When i was building homes for Le__ar Homes we laid out the price per sheet for the drywall, price per square foot for flooring, price per lf for trim and so on. The guy who could hit the number got the work. Simple as that. 

The way you all talk its like you wanna be employees. . .


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> The way you all talk its like you wanna be employees. . .






Hardly!!




But at $15 per grass cut some body else had better be picking up the tab for taxes, insurance, worker's comp and health insurance.


----------



## Guest

We were invited by a company to send in a vendor application, we printed it out, this is what they are offering. My partner and I looked at each other laughed and threw it away.


Initial Services to include:
Initial Services Flat Fee: $300

Removal of up to 5 cubic yards of debris
Installing handrails missing from any walkway or stairwell with more than one step
Replacing any damaged, missing, rotted or otherwise unsecured step
Installing tape over transition areas between carpets and floors
Re-securing with mortar broken, loose, or otherwise un-secured brick or concrete steps
Securing gates surrounding pools
Tacking down loose linoleum
Removing loose tiles and installing black tape between remaining secured tiles and floors
Removing all falling ceiling tiles
Treating with “Killz” or bleach up to 10 Sq. Ft area of mold
Removing all broken glass from interior and exterior of property
Cap all exposed electrical wires, gas lines, water lines,
Cover all exposed outlets with face plates, cover all exposed electric panels.
Broom clean and/or vacuum all interior rooms
Dust windowsills
Remove cobwebs
Sweep and mop floors
Remove all litter,
Clean all appliances inside and out (unless they are to be removed), counters, back splashes, cabinets, drawers,
Clean and sanitize and deodorize all bathrooms (including all toilets, showers, sinks, countertops, cabinets and back splashes).
Appropriate winterization services to be completed as necessary.
Cutting grass to a height not to exceed 2”
Edging all property exterior (front, side and back)
Weed removal from lawns, beds, fence lines, driveways, and curbs
Removal of litter/trash/debris, grass clippings, tree trimmings, leaves, etc., from
the property
Disposal of all debris and yard refuse off of property location in accordance with local standards and regulations
Sweeping of all paved areas


----------



## BPWY

Sounds like HUD work.


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> Hardly!!
> 
> But at $15 per grass cut some body else had better be picking up the tab for taxes, insurance, worker's comp and health insurance.


Seems simple to me. Dont do it.


----------



## oteroproperties

Rich51 said:


> We were invited by a company to send in a vendor application, we printed it out, this is what they are offering. My partner and I looked at each other laughed and threw it away.
> 
> Initial Services to include:
> Initial Services Flat Fee: $300
> 
> Removal of up to 5 cubic yards of debris
> Installing handrails missing from any walkway or stairwell with more than one step
> Replacing any damaged, missing, rotted or otherwise unsecured step
> Installing tape over transition areas between carpets and floors
> Re-securing with mortar broken, loose, or otherwise un-secured brick or concrete steps
> Securing gates surrounding pools
> Tacking down loose linoleum
> Removing loose tiles and installing black tape between remaining secured tiles and floors
> Removing all falling ceiling tiles
> Treating with “Killz” or bleach up to 10 Sq. Ft area of mold
> Removing all broken glass from interior and exterior of property
> Cap all exposed electrical wires, gas lines, water lines,
> Cover all exposed outlets with face plates, cover all exposed electric panels.
> Broom clean and/or vacuum all interior rooms
> Dust windowsills
> Remove cobwebs
> Sweep and mop floors
> Remove all litter,
> Clean all appliances inside and out (unless they are to be removed), counters, back splashes, cabinets, drawers,
> Clean and sanitize and deodorize all bathrooms (including all toilets, showers, sinks, countertops, cabinets and back splashes).
> Appropriate winterization services to be completed as necessary.
> Cutting grass to a height not to exceed 2”
> Edging all property exterior (front, side and back)
> Weed removal from lawns, beds, fence lines, driveways, and curbs
> Removal of litter/trash/debris, grass clippings, tree trimmings, leaves, etc., from
> the property
> Disposal of all debris and yard refuse off of property location in accordance with local standards and regulations
> Sweeping of all paved areas


This is the very reason why if your not one of what i call the big 3 i just wont entertain your work offer.


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> Seems simple to me. Dont do it.









Believe me I don't. 


The gist of the conversation was for those rates that is closer to an employee pay scale than independent contractor.


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> When i was building homes for Le__ar Homes we laid out the price per sheet for the drywall, price per square foot for flooring, price per lf for trim and so on. The guy who could hit the number got the work. Simple as that.
> 
> The way you all talk its like you wanna be employees. . .


What's with y'all???? Nobody wants to type names of companies??? Is there a rule against just stating the name? What gives? What am I missing?

What is accomplished by only typing a partial name? Or by only describing the business or its location???


----------



## Guest

Rich51 said:


> We were invited by a company to send in a vendor application, we printed it out, this is what they are offering. My partner and I looked at each other laughed and threw it away.
> 
> 
> Initial Services to include:
> Initial Services Flat Fee: $300
> 
> Removal of up to 5 cubic yards of debris
> Installing handrails missing from any walkway or stairwell with more than one step
> Replacing any damaged, missing, rotted or otherwise unsecured step
> Installing tape over transition areas between carpets and floors
> Re-securing with mortar broken, loose, or otherwise un-secured brick or concrete steps
> Securing gates surrounding pools
> Tacking down loose linoleum
> Removing loose tiles and installing black tape between remaining secured tiles and floors
> Removing all falling ceiling tiles
> Treating with “Killz” or bleach up to 10 Sq. Ft area of mold
> Removing all broken glass from interior and exterior of property
> Cap all exposed electrical wires, gas lines, water lines,
> Cover all exposed outlets with face plates, cover all exposed electric panels.
> Broom clean and/or vacuum all interior rooms
> Dust windowsills
> Remove cobwebs
> Sweep and mop floors
> Remove all litter,
> Clean all appliances inside and out (unless they are to be removed), counters, back splashes, cabinets, drawers,
> Clean and sanitize and deodorize all bathrooms (including all toilets, showers, sinks, countertops, cabinets and back splashes).
> Appropriate winterization services to be completed as necessary.
> Cutting grass to a height not to exceed 2”
> Edging all property exterior (front, side and back)
> Weed removal from lawns, beds, fence lines, driveways, and curbs
> Removal of litter/trash/debris, grass clippings, tree trimmings, leaves, etc., from
> the property
> Disposal of all debris and yard refuse off of property location in accordance with local standards and regulations
> Sweeping of all paved areas



Cityside?


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> This is the very reason why if your not one of what i call the big 3 i just wont entertain your work offer.


Who are the "big 3"?


----------



## oteroproperties

FreshCut said:


> Who are the "big 3"?


For me its Safeguard, MCS, and First American. Theres one more but that one i keep close to my chest.


----------



## oteroproperties

FreshCut said:


> What's with y'all???? Nobody wants to type names of companies??? Is there a rule against just stating the name? What gives? What am I missing?
> 
> What is accomplished by only typing a partial name? Or by only describing the business or its location???


There is a liability involved in disclosing information about a company that might portray them in a negative light.


----------



## Guest

oteroproperties said:


> There is a liability involved in disclosing information about a company that might portray them in a negative light.


A liability? One that is negated by the first amendment? :sad:


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> Im with you all on setting price but we do have the ability to turn down the work if the pay is not enough. Business has been operating like this since the begining of time. A customer needs a product or service. They also have a price they are willing to pay for that product or service end of story.
> 
> When i was building homes for Le__ar Homes we laid out the price per sheet for the drywall, price per square foot for flooring, price per lf for trim and so on. The guy who could hit the number got the work. Simple as that.
> 
> The way you all talk its like you wanna be employees. . .




It's a very fine line these Nationals are walking. Look to work comp laws specifically and you will find that in many cases you have an Employer/Employee relationship, not an Employer/subcontractor relationship. Google Florida case _Debell v. Piermatteo._

_"An independent contractor is a person engaged by another to perform specific work according to his own methods and whose method of performing of work are not controlled by the person engaging him and are not subject to that person’s right of control.”

*The nationals are telling us how we have to do it and when it has to be done. Are we a contractor or an employee??

Do you have Employees Otero?? *__Employees of a subcontractor in Florida are recognized as the employees of the general contractor. And the general contractor is responsible for providing workers compensation insurance anytime there is a contractor /subcontractor relationship. Even if any employees of the subcontractors are independent contractors.

C_ourts also use the "right to control" test. When the hiring party controls the way work is carried out and a product is delivered, the relationship between the parties is employer/employee. If an employer does not have authority over how a party accomplishes his or her work but simply give requests an outline, the relationship between the parties is that of hiring party/independent contractor.


----------



## BPWY

The line between a true independent contractor or not is very blurry in the P&P biz.


Even HUD setting the rate violates a true independent set up.

If they were taking bids annually for the common work and going with the cheapest price that would be a true independent relationship.

I've done gooberment work that was competitively bid. 
They did not tell me the price and if I liked it I was allowed to do the work.
So I know the gooberment knows how to do it right.


----------



## oteroproperties

FreshCut said:


> A liability? One that is negated by the first amendment? :sad:


Well you know the funny thing about amendments. . . .

I HAD a website dedicated to a specific vehicle that i and a few friends own. The site was up and running for 3 years with no troubles. After the 3rd year it blew up, and the manufacturer sewed us to shut it down or change the name. We went damn near broke before we gave up.

2nd amendment says we have the right to bare arms, doesnt mean you can shoot whoever you want.


----------



## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> It's a very fine line these Nationals are walking. Look to work comp laws specifically and you will find that in many cases you have an Employer/Employee relationship, not an Employer/subcontractor relationship. Google Florida case Debell v. Piermatteo.
> 
> "An independent contractor is a person engaged by another to perform specific work according to his own methods and whose method of performing of work are not controlled by the person engaging him and are not subject to that person&#146;s right of control.&#148;
> 
> The nationals are telling us how we have to do it and when it has to be done. Are we a contractor or an employee??
> 
> Do you have Employees Otero?? Employees of a subcontractor in Florida are recognized as the employees of the general contractor. And the general contractor is responsible for providing workers compensation insurance anytime there is a contractor /subcontractor relationship. Even if any employees of the subcontractors are independent contractors.
> 
> Courts also use the "right to control" test. When the hiring party controls the way work is carried out and a product is delivered, the relationship between the parties is employer/employee. If an employer does not have authority over how a party accomplishes his or her work but simply give requests an outline, the relationship between the parties is that of hiring party/independent contractor.




This only matters if one of the 2 parties has a problem and decides to push the issue. I no longer have employees. I decided last year that it wasnt worth the hassle. We are in line with florida law on both businesses i personally operate and the partnership i am also involved in. 

As a side note when you sign with a national the only document they really care about is your agreement for being an independent contractor and your signed W9. You will more then likely loose a case in court if you decided to push it. Albiet you might win if its reported to the irs. . . . .


----------



## Guest

is it me or does it seem like these nationals are promising these banks more and more to beat the competiton and for less money so we end up doing more and more work for the same fees when is it going to end the industry is on an uprise and we as venders are on a down fall. seem a little odd or is it just me


----------



## Guest

Rich51 said:


> We were invited by a company to send in a vendor application, we printed it out, this is what they are offering. My partner and I looked at each other laughed and threw it away.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Initial Services to include:
> Initial Services Flat Fee: $300
> 
> Removal of up to 5 cubic yards of debris
> Installing handrails missing from any walkway or stairwell with more than one step
> Replacing any damaged, missing, rotted or otherwise unsecured step
> Installing tape over transition areas between carpets and floors
> Re-securing with mortar broken, loose, or otherwise un-secured brick or concrete steps
> Securing gates surrounding pools
> Tacking down loose linoleum
> Removing loose tiles and installing black tape between remaining secured tiles and floors
> Removing all falling ceiling tiles
> Treating with “Killz” or bleach up to 10 Sq. Ft area of mold
> Removing all broken glass from interior and exterior of property
> Cap all exposed electrical wires, gas lines, water lines,
> Cover all exposed outlets with face plates, cover all exposed electric panels.
> Broom clean and/or vacuum all interior rooms
> Dust windowsills
> Remove cobwebs
> Sweep and mop floors
> Remove all litter,
> Clean all appliances inside and out (unless they are to be removed), counters, back splashes, cabinets, drawers,
> Clean and sanitize and deodorize all bathrooms (including all toilets, showers, sinks, countertops, cabinets and back splashes).
> Appropriate winterization services to be completed as necessary.
> Cutting grass to a height not to exceed 2”
> Edging all property exterior (front, side and back)
> Weed removal from lawns, beds, fence lines, driveways, and curbs
> Removal of litter/trash/debris, grass clippings, tree trimmings, leaves, etc., from
> the property
> Disposal of all debris and yard refuse off of property location in accordance with local standards and regulations
> Sweeping of all paved areas


I have the exact same list, only the price is 150$ from the jokers I talked to. Dont forget they want HPIR lll insp and testing and about 175 pics

I call BS they had the balls to tell me there was no more money in it. 
Thats 300$ to you and 600$ to their client. What a bunch of arrogant aholes.


----------



## Guest

I don't know that I have posted since I introduced myself a few weeks back. I have been reading and getting some chuckles out of the playful banter......

Off topic I know, but has anyone heard of FEI out of Washington? They contacted me today.

Thanks


----------



## BPWY

RFS said:


> I don't know that I have posted since I introduced myself a few weeks back. I have been reading and getting some chuckles out of the playful banter......
> 
> Off topic I know, but has anyone heard of FEI out of Washington? They contacted me today.
> 
> Thanks






They won't give you a price list until you sign all the paper work etc?????????


Thats almost always a sign of way too cheap. They are ashamed of their prices and don't want to let it be known what they are until they have you on the hook. In the hopes that because you've gone this far in the process that you'll just go along with their cheap pricing.

I don't know what their pricing is because I didn't fall for the trap.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> They won't give you a price list until you sign all the paper work etc?????????
> 
> 
> Thats almost always a sign of way too cheap. They are ashamed of their prices and don't want to let it be known what they are until they have you on the hook. In the hopes that because you've gone this far in the process that you'll just go along with their cheap pricing.
> 
> I don't know what their pricing is because I didn't fall for the trap.


Not necessarily, Paul. We don't have a set price list either. We use our clients' price lists or we use HUD rates for pricing everything except yard work. We bid on lawns, shrubs, recuts, etc. because HUD rates are way too low.

When we take on a new client, however, we don't accept just anyone. We take a discount so their pricing has to be at a level to where the vendor makes money and so do we. [You have no clue how many potential clients we turn down every week.]

But I think RFS just wanted to know if anyone had heard of them so they can get a recommendation. I've never heard of FEI myself.

Linda


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## Guest

FEI who? Tried looking them up got nothing on search.


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## APlusPPGroup

Is anyone going to be ordering 10-digit electronic locks for Altisource securing orders?

I received a memo last night that, as of February 1st, they will no longer be using 4-digit locks and that all vendors have to buy them through Anaconda. 

No more Home Depot locks, even though they have them, and we don't do enough lock changes to warrant stocking up. 

Anaconda's rate per lock is okay for now but I wonder how much the price will go up after the deadline, now that they are exclusive? 

Any thoughts on this?

Linda


----------



## Guest

I have no problem using a certain lock...I have a real problem being told where I have to purchase them.

Last I looked, I was self-employed.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> I have no problem using a certain lock...I have a real problem being told where I have to purchase them.
> 
> Last I looked, I was self-employed.


Exactly my point. I am definitely not going to be told where to purchase ANY materials so I will decline lock changes. Period. End of story.

Altisource says that, if you have any 4-digit locks, let them know so they can send orders to you and you can use them up. Well, hell. What if you have more inventory than they have properties available? 

They should leave the conversion date open until vendors use their last 4-digit lock. Then they can use the 10-digit. What a bunch of boneheads.

They also do not mention a rate increase for the 10-digit locks. This is where the "exclusive" wholesaler can stick it to the vendors and that's why I asked what everyone's going to do when they are locked in to Anaconda and they raise their per lock price.

Sorry for the rant but Altisource leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth.

Linda


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## Racerx

"Sorry for the rant but Altisource leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth"

Exactly...This is the reason behind my previous post questioning if there were any 'Altisource Vendors' here? ..As I stated previously I've been dancining around with them for months now on a property trashout and I'm wondering if it's even worth pursuing work from them anymore?...by the way I got the same e-mail last night, I just laughed:thumbup:.. I get all the updates and no work request!!!..any info about this outfit would be greatly appreciated....


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## APlusPPGroup

There are several Altisource vendors here at CT. Sometimes it's worth it for us but typically it's not and we decline a lot of orders. 

Accepting work from Altisource, as with any other potential client, is a decision we each have to make for ourselves. Some vendors do well by them but many other vendors do not.

Linda


----------



## Racerx

Thanks,Linda

You've reinforced what I've been thinking, which is ..I've been going round and round with them since Oct. on this project and even finally broke down and sent a revised bid back to them for exactly half of my initial bid (they asked me to remove some items from the original bid and lo and behold it came out to be exactly half the amount of my inital bid!!)and still no reply.

I've noticed that the only time I get any activity from them is after three phone calls and four emails!!..I think it's time for me to move on.:furious:

Thanks again Rick.


----------



## BPWY

I think I'm going to start declining more and more orders.


I've installed exactly two electric slide bolts for them......... I've been paid for exactly 0.0 of them.

I've sent emails, I've threatened to go pull MY locks off in the emails. They ignore me.


----------



## BPWY

barefootlc said:


> I have no problem using a certain lock...I have a real problem being told where I have to purchase them.
> 
> Last I looked, I was self-employed.





Exactly my thinking on the matter.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> I think I'm going to start declining more and more orders.
> 
> 
> I've installed exactly two electric slide bolts for them......... I've been paid for exactly 0.0 of them.
> 
> I've sent emails, I've threatened to go pull MY locks off in the emails. They ignore me.



Find out who the broker is and get them to help you. The broker for this area is at her wits end with them but has pretty good contacts. She got a mold approval on a bid put in 7/3/10 last week. Guesss what? It's double the damage now as water has sat in the basement all this time........


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> It's double the damage now as water has sat in the basement all this time........







Theres a shock.
I am so sick of these low IQ bankers not giving a damn about their assets.



Next time put that bid is only good for 30 days or in the case of mold 15 days.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Theres a shock.
> I am so sick of these low IQ bankers not giving a damn about their assets.
> 
> 
> 
> Next time put that bid is only good for 30 days or in the case of mold 15 days.



Oh heck thats nothing. October 09 i had a company bid mold on a home. He gave me a 48 page IN DEPTH bid for almost $50,000 Guess what? Home is still sitting and is now a total loss...........


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## Guest

Dear Asset Managers,

Ask me why we should care? Ask me why do you and the service companies impose regulations and time frames on when and how we are to do our work? Mr/Ms Asset Manager why don't you look in the mirror and ask yourself "how are we screwing up?"

1) House that we had bid 6 times over 2 years for a fallen tree into the 2nd story roof. Totally ignored. A decent home 2 years ago till YOU Asset Manager got your hands on it. Here is what the City did to YOUR home since YOU ignored:


----------



## Guest

PAGE 2:

Dear Asset Manager,

All of us contractors try to do our best to maintain these homes and some of us STILL take this personal and try to maintain high integrity and while you ASSET MANAGER are still looking in that mirror ask yourself this:::

"Why do you have emergency contact tele numbers when nobody will answer the phone?" 

We try Mr/Ms Asset Manager. Why don't you cut us contractors a break and put yourself in our shoes? 

See we could save YOU Mr/Ms Asset Manager a lot of money if you would only listen or at the very least answer the phone on a Saturday Afternoon! We just had a simple question on an emergency but since YOU did not have anyone answering the phones or returning the messages we will let you figure out how to stop the flooding in the basement. 

Thank YOU MR/MS Asset Manager for allowing me to vent and not feel bad not turning off your water. Next time hire a contractor to dewinterize a home instead of letting your realtor complete....you might save your AS* next time...

Well I just think I will go back to listening to some old bluegrass music---GO Loud OZZY


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## Guest

A company reqested that I do a bid on a house that when fixed up would probably be worth between $1.25 and $1.5 million. It had suffered an enormous amount of water damage due to burst pipes. This was a large bid that had to be done immediately. Nearly 500 pictures taken to substantiate repairs needed and several days to prepare the bid. 

We submitted the bid 7 months ago.

Didn't hear a thing about it again until just recently. They really needed me to go check to see if the mold issue was any worse.

I thought that If ignorance is bliss, these idiots must be on cloud nine.....


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## Guest

Hi guys, is Cityside a decent company to work for?


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## mtmtnman

DreamWeaver said:


> A company reqested that I do a bid on a house that when fixed up would probably be worth between $1.25 and $1.5 million. It had suffered an enormous amount of water damage due to burst pipes. This was a large bid that had to be done immediately. Nearly 500 pictures taken to substantiate repairs needed and several days to prepare the bid.
> 
> We submitted the bid 7 months ago.
> 
> Didn't hear a thing about it again until just recently. They really needed me to go check to see if the mold issue was any worse.
> 
> I thought that If ignorance is bliss, these idiots must be on cloud nine.....




My thoughts on this is the Nationals do not transfer all of our notes to the bank HOPING things get worse so they can line their pockets even more. My local bank with 104 branches between this valley in Western Montana and other banks they have purchased over the years in Wyoming, Idaho, Colorado, Utah and Washington ABSOLUTELY REFUSES to use a national due to issues in the past. They use local contractors and real estate brokers to take care of their properties. I have noticed over the last 6 months my volume with local brokers working direct with the banks has increased. I believe this trend will continue and eventually the nationals will be out of the picture save for the biggest banks IE: BOA, WELLS, CHASE ect. who will still use them.........................


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Dear Asset Managers,
> 
> Ask me why we should care? Ask me why do you and the service companies impose regulations and time frames on when and how we are to do our work? Mr/Ms Asset Manager why don't you look in the mirror and ask yourself "how are we screwing up?"
> 
> 1) House that we had bid 6 times over 2 years for a fallen tree into the 2nd story roof. Totally ignored. A decent home 2 years ago till YOU Asset Manager got your hands on it. Here is what the City did to YOUR home since YOU ignored:



I take it the city condemned it and used it for fire dept. drills???


----------



## brm1109

*time limit on bids*

I have started putting on all my bids that they are good for 30 days. If there is mold damage I lower it to 20 days. After that I just start adding 5% every 30 days to the bid. It has gotten to the point where I have been asked 3 months later to do the work. If they do not accept the new price I just decline the order. I hate to do, business is business but you also have to stand up for yourself.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> I have started putting on all my bids that they are good for 30 days. If there is mold damage I lower it to 20 days. After that I just start adding 5% every 30 days to the bid. It has gotten to the point where I have been asked 3 months later to do the work. If they do not accept the new price I just decline the order. I hate to do, business is business but you also have to stand up for yourself.


 
BRM I understand the frustration but lately the Nationals have been addressing this issue concerning bids approvals taking to long.:no:

Lately what I have been told through memos and company directives is this:

Bids are now valid for 90 days minimum. Now what the problem is: If we don't accept the approval they reserve the right to reassign the bid and WE are responsible for paying to have the work completed since WE (Contractor) could not accept the approved bid. 

HOW they get by with this crap is beyond me Again it goes back to the prior discussion of "what is an independent contractor?". I think I can dictate the terms of MY bids and I can dictate the terms after MY bid has expired then I can say NO with no retributions:furious:


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I take it the city condemned it and used it for fire dept. drills???


 
Yep a controlled burn. Just a month ago I had to bid this thing all over again...what a waste of my time


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Yep a controlled burn. Just a month ago I had to bid this thing all over again...what a waste of my time



95% of the bids for these nationals are a waste of time. On the other hand i get around 75% approval on my bids with realtors and small town banks. Go figure. The national is tacking on so much extra the bank says no..............


----------



## BPWY

FremontREO said:


> HOW they get by with this crap is beyond me Again it goes back to the prior discussion of "what is an independent contractor?". I think I can dictate the terms of MY bids and I can dictate the terms after MY bid has expired then I can say NO with no retributions:furious:






Put that wording into your bid notes.


"As an independent contractor I am able to set bid specifications and requirements the same as the property owner. Demanding this or that from an independent contractor begins to blur and negate the independent relationship into one of employer/employee. Along with that comes responsibility to with hold taxes, pay worker's comp and health insurance."

Or some thing similar.


Like I've always said..... they are quick to throw the wording of the contract into your face. Return the favor! They are quick to point out that you are an independent..... remind them of it.

Summer of '10 I put on a bid that was over $1000 that 50% of the bid amount was due immediately upon approval of the bid and to be mailed immediately so that the sub could be paid per his bid/contract. They responded with "you can't put that into your bid requirements." I told them "oh yes I can, as an independent contractor I can put any thing I want in there". They said they would not accept it. I told them to reassign because that was the deal. Not specified by me but by the licensed trade contractor. 
Yup, I don't work with them any more.


Unless you need the work so bad that you must roll over and take their abuse to keep the house payments made, the lights on and groceries on the table I'd fight with em. Sooner or later they'll dump you for either a very very hungry contractor or one that is ignorant of how things should be.



A mold bid should only be good for 5 to 10 days in the middle of summer when temps are high and the mold growth is exploding.
This time of yr when the temp inside the house doesn't exceed freezing in many of the northern states you might be able to accept a 30 day window.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> 95% of the bids for these nationals are a waste of time. On the other hand i get around 75% approval on my bids with realtors and small town banks. Go figure. The national is tacking on so much extra the bank says no..............






Its up around 98% or 99% for me.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> 95% of the bids for these nationals are a waste of time. ..............







I know that we've touched on this before, but we've got a lot of new guys in the last few weeks and I'd like to see what their experiences are in other parts of the country.



Because of very rarely getting a bid approval for work many of the licensed trades are refusing to give FREE bids for work on a bank owned house.
Are you guys seeing this in other states/cities and what can we do about it. The nationals come down on us like its our fault and expect us to come up with a bid amount and if they ever approve any thing they expect us to be the banker, paying the plumber, HVAC guy or who ever and then be fine with us waiting for 60 plus days in many cases.

On things like mold damage or freeze damage etc when they want an eye ball estimate of damages I put in "call a licensed contractor" in an effort to CYA.


----------



## brm1109

*Free bids*

I m having the same problem. As soon as my contractors hear foreclosed or bank owned they don't even want to come out since they know it is a waste of their time. I recently had an order for a bid and I told the company it would be $50.00 to pay the contractor, never heard back from them.


----------



## mtmtnman

brm1109 said:


> I m having the same problem. As soon as my contractors hear foreclosed or bank owned they don't even want to come out since they know it is a waste of their time. I recently had an order for a bid and I told the company it would be $50.00 to pay the contractor, never heard back from them.




I get between $50 & $100 bid fees refundable on bid approval. Ocwen is one of the few who will pay this......


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I m having the same problem. As soon as my contractors hear foreclosed or bank owned they don't even want to come out since they know it is a waste of their time. I recently had an order for a bid and I told the company it would be $50.00 to pay the contractor, never heard back from them.



I tell em $300 refundable upon bid approval..... I never hear from them.
After discounts thats $100 to $150 to the sub and a few $$$ for my trip charge.




mtmtnman said:


> I get between $50 & $100 bid fees refundable on bid approval. Ocwen is one of the few who will pay this......






Not my experience. They demanded a termite inspection on a house here. 
I finally tracked down a guy that would do it. $150 payable on the spot before he'd do the inspection. They said hell no.


----------



## Guest

I would say out of 100 bids about .5 get approved. I mean that they will approve the really stupid stuff replace doors but don't worry about the 6 windows still broken out etc. It has gotten so bad that most of the specialty contractors (mold, etc) don't even return our phone calls. I don't blame them. Who wants to go out and spend 2 hours in the field, a couple in the office to provide us with numbers for the bank to write down and stick in some file somewhere. I like the idea of charging for a bid, I may start to do that. It's almost embarassing to call people anymore.:no:


----------



## Guest

Hello All!!!

I have to say this has been the most helpful thing I have read in weeks and thank you to everyone who has put time and energy into spreading the knowledge. 

I am very new to this industry and from what I've read it seems like a crazy game. I'd like a recap to see if what I've learned is correct. 
So far, this is it. Please help where I’m missing and correct anything that is outta place or wrong.

Ok the following are the “National's” from which we can get work from but at very low rates (from what I have seen I do not understand how this can be profitable, if someone could please answer that question, is it all just volume?). 

These nationals give prices they are willing to pay for services no negations. They do have some bid work but the bulk is set prices. They get paid about double what they are willing to pay out and expect top quality work for low wage. 

American Property Management, Inc.
Bank of America/BAC Field Services
Corporate Asset Management LL
Cyprexx Service
Default Services, Inc.
Field Asset Service
First American Field Services (Corelogic)
First American REO Servicing
FirstService Corporatio
Five Brothers Mortgage Services
Fontaine Inspections Inc.
Lender Processing Service
LPS Field Services
M&M Mortgage
Maxim Enterprises
Mortgage Contracting Services (MCS)
National Field Reps
North American Property Preservation
Now Property Preservation
REO Allegiance
Safeguard Properties Inc
Sierra Field Services
SingleSource Property Solution
Southeastern Asset Services
Spectrum Field Services Inc
Trinity Field Services
Wolverine Real Estate Service

~As someone put it the Big 3 Safeguard, MCS, and First American~

There are other companies I have found like US Best Repair, Ason’s Property Preservation, AMSREO and a bunch others that get work from the “nationals” and pass it along (for a fee/cut). This is the part I’m confused on, why would I sign onto any of these when I could sign onto the National’s and get the work directly from the nationals? 

There is also work through real estate firms/agents. This pays much better, most if not all can be bid based and if can be found is the best way to go. 

There is also work from local banks and mortgage companies which is also better paying and can be bid based. 

HUB, FHA, Fannie and Freddie hand out the work to these Nationals and set prices they are willing to pay. 

Some of the nationals require you to take tests before you can be approved as a vendor. 

The nationals hardly ever answer their phones. 

As expected every company has Insurance requirement that must be met. 

Costs for E&O with general liability is state dependant but can be found from $600 & up per year, $850 seems to ring a bell for some reason. 

So far I am trying to figure out if I should just apply to all the nationals and see what happens. I assume that everyone has different ways to invoice and different pay schedules. Are there any I should avoid completely? Are these contracts binding for a specific duration (1 or more years)? If they ask me to do an assignment I am assuming I can decline if I feel it is not in my best interest. Is this something I can grow and eventually have a few crews out doing the work or is this something that I would have to be an owner operator from day one on. 

I have a ton of questions about this as I think I would really enjoy it. I currently work in Afghanistan as a ‘contractor’ and would love it if I could get this to the point where I was making enough money to not have to go back. As well if anyone would be willing to mentor me and assist me in my learning curve it would be much appreciated. This seems like there is a lot of room for error. If the right offer was made I would be willing to relocate for a period and work for knowledge for a bit. 

Again thank you so much for all the info, I have sat here for hours reading all the posts since this started. I wish I would have found it weeks ago. 

Please feel free to email me [email protected]


----------



## Guest

Just to be sure, I looked at our contracts (Agreements) and not one of them indicates how long a bid has to be good for, so unless it is clearly stated on the bid order and it is something you are completely clear about before you accept and do the bid, what you put on the bid when it is returned is how long it is good for. That is why we use our own estimate form with our terms and conditions. Fortunately for us PA has very strict guidelines on contractor estimates and requires this under our contractor license. 

We charge for some estimates these are usually involving real estate. We were getting hit all the time buy buyers that wanted an estimate for a repair and had no intention of having us do the work, they just wanted something to go back to the seller with and ask for a price drop.


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## BPWY

Test you state you've read for hours and yet ask if this is some thing that we think you should get into.


I'm thinking that you haven't read the whole thread yet.
I don't mean to sound mean. Its just that I don't think you've read and comprehended whats trying to be conveyed across the posts.
Myself and others I know cannot recommend this biz to any one with a clear conscience. If you were able to get in tight with a couple of agents then maybe.

I'm branching out my biz to get as much non bank owned property work as possible.
I'd have to recommend that you spend your investing dollars and time into a different line of work.

Some here might claim that I'm sour grapes. I don't look at it that way. I'd way rather be posting about the type of work I'm doing or the amount of vacation time I'm taking and the things I did on that vacation than talking about the newest way that a national dreamed up to screw over the contractors.

I think your return on investment would be much better spent in another direction than trying to go with P&P. Many folks in this line of work have lost their own house. 
Roughly a yr ago for 4 to 6 months I was threatened with it. Why? Because the work dried up so much over the winter. Too many times even when the work is there its too cheap.


----------



## Guest

Test.1.2 Welcome to the forum. Yep you pretty much hit it square on the head. Of everything I have read the only thing that always seems odd is how much people say they pay for insurance. We have good coverage and do commercial and residential work, so our limits are equal to or higher then what most companies want. Our insurance is well over $15,000 a year if you include workers comp, which by the way we have never had a claim and its still high. 

I guess if you are a sole proprietor it might be that low, but once you start adding vehicles and employees it can't stay that low for long

Good Luck


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Any body wanna repo a church?????
> 
> 
> http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/01/25/churches-end-nigh/?test=latestnews
> 
> 
> I'd be scared of a stray lightning bolt hitting me while I was trying to break in the front door to change locks.
> lol


I have done a couple. no lightning hit me. lol. I would secure Barack Obama's house and not think twice. not because I dont think much of him, it's because I have a work order.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Test you state you've read for hours and yet ask if this is some thing that we think you should get into.
> 
> 
> I'm thinking that you haven't read the whole thread yet.
> I don't mean to sound mean. Its just that I don't think you've read and comprehended whats trying to be conveyed across the posts.
> Myself and others I know cannot recommend this biz to any one with a clear conscience. If you were able to get in tight with a couple of agents then maybe.
> 
> I'm branching out my biz to get as much non bank owned property work as possible.
> I'd have to recommend that you spend your investing dollars and time into a different line of work.
> 
> Some here might claim that I'm sour grapes. I don't look at it that way. I'd way rather be posting about the type of work I'm doing or the amount of vacation time I'm taking and the things I did on that vacation than talking about the newest way that a national dreamed up to screw over the contractors.
> 
> I think your return on investment would be much better spent in another direction than trying to go with P&P. Many folks in this line of work have lost their own house.
> Roughly a yr ago for 4 to 6 months I was threatened with it. Why? Because the work dried up so much over the winter. Too many times even when the work is there its too cheap.


 
you're not sour grapes sir. you have the ability to see things as they are. cut and dry. the ability to see bad in a good is what has saved you from breaking down and losing your house. We are all the captains of our own ship. We need to do what we think is best for our business'. As tough as this business gets sometimes, I always ask myself what can I do better? where can I improve? how can I stay profitable, meet these guidelines and continue to grow? I enjoy your posts and insights.


----------



## thanohano44

a1propertyclean said:


> There are several Altisource vendors here at CT. Sometimes it's worth it for us but typically it's not and we decline a lot of orders.
> 
> Accepting work from Altisource, as with any other potential client, is a decision we each have to make for ourselves. Some vendors do well by them but many other vendors do not.
> 
> Linda


 
i've done well with them this past summer. I do not like to use the electric locks they ask us to use.


----------



## Guest

So, how do I find out what brokers/agents a certain bank uses and if these brokers/agents are responsible for the work done on their listings?

I've called around and searched online, but, for instance, I searched a particular bank and found their REO listings which had the listing agents info. I called the agent in an attempt to solicit my services as a REO vendor/contractor and was told that in most cases the bank uses companies such as "FAS, AMS, and Safeguard" (that's what she said), and that in the few other cases that the bank does not use national companies it uses it's own list of vendors/contractors. 
She still let me email my information to her, but I really want to ask you guys how I can get in touch with the REO asset manager for the bank(s)?


----------



## thanohano44

FreshCut said:


> So, how do I find out what brokers/agents a certain bank uses and if these brokers/agents are responsible for the work done on their listings?
> 
> I've called around and searched online, but, for instance, I searched a particular bank and found their REO listings which had the listing agents info. I called the agent in an attempt to solicit my services as a REO vendor/contractor and was told that in most cases the bank uses companies such as "FAS, AMS, and Safeguard" (that's what she said), and that in the few other cases that the bank does not use national companies it uses it's own list of vendors/contractors.
> She still let me email my information to her, but I really want to ask you guys how I can get in touch with the REO asset manager for the bank(s)?


It's something that can't be done online. Any work that I have
Receives from a realtor or broker came from me marketing myself to them in person. I find emailing and cold calling pointless. 


Do a great job and they will pass you along to their friends and others in the business.


----------



## Guest

I haven't heard much about Cityside on this thread. Has anyone worked for them in the past or work for them currently? Also, how many work orders are you guys doing a week? After becoming a vendor for a national, how soon did you get your first work order? :shifty:


----------



## Guest

DEE JAY DEE said:


> I haven't heard much about Cityside on this thread. Has anyone worked for them in the past or work for them currently? Also, how many work orders are you guys doing a week? After becoming a vendor for a national, how soon did you get your first work order? :shifty:


I'd like to know the answer to these questions as well.


----------



## Guest

It took us about 7 months. They kept us really busy for about 7 months. However, for the past 2 monrhs, it has been really slow.


----------



## Guest

How do y'all feel about AMSREO?
They have the hud work for my region.
Had signed up with HMBI, and the work is coming from AMSREO...
sent a few orders today, but no pricing info? Do they have preapproved pricing, hud allowables with discount, or am I gonna have to negotiate?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Test you state you've read for hours and yet ask if this is some thing that we think you should get into.
> 
> 
> I'm thinking that you haven't read the whole thread yet.
> I don't mean to sound mean. Its just that I don't think you've read and comprehended whats trying to be conveyed across the posts.
> Myself and others I know cannot recommend this biz to any one with a clear conscience. If you were able to get in tight with a couple of agents then maybe.
> 
> I'm branching out my biz to get as much non bank owned property work as possible.
> I'd have to recommend that you spend your investing dollars and time into a different line of work.
> 
> Some here might claim that I'm sour grapes. I don't look at it that way. I'd way rather be posting about the type of work I'm doing or the amount of vacation time I'm taking and the things I did on that vacation than talking about the newest way that a national dreamed up to screw over the contractors.
> 
> I think your return on investment would be much better spent in another direction than trying to go with P&P. Many folks in this line of work have lost their own house.
> Roughly a yr ago for 4 to 6 months I was threatened with it. Why? Because the work dried up so much over the winter. Too many times even when the work is there its too cheap.


Could your problems in this industry have anything to do with you living in the middle of nowhere?


----------



## BPWY

DEE JAY DEE said:


> Could your problems in this industry have anything to do with you living in the middle of nowhere?





With the amount of work.... yes.



All the other problems...... no way. 
The nationals are idjits in the middle of no where the same as they are in the big city.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Test you state you've read for hours and yet ask if this is some thing that we think you should get into.
> 
> 
> I'm thinking that you haven't read the whole thread yet.
> I don't mean to sound mean. Its just that I don't think you've read and comprehended whats trying to be conveyed across the posts.
> Myself and others I know cannot recommend this biz to any one with a clear conscience. If you were able to get in tight with a couple of agents then maybe.
> 
> I'm branching out my biz to get as much non bank owned property work as possible.
> I'd have to recommend that you spend your investing dollars and time into a different line of work.
> 
> Some here might claim that I'm sour grapes. I don't look at it that way. I'd way rather be posting about the type of work I'm doing or the amount of vacation time I'm taking and the things I did on that vacation than talking about the newest way that a national dreamed up to screw over the contractors.
> 
> I think your return on investment would be much better spent in another direction than trying to go with P&P. Many folks in this line of work have lost their own house.
> Roughly a yr ago for 4 to 6 months I was threatened with it. Why? Because the work dried up so much over the winter. Too many times even when the work is there its too cheap.


Well, I could not take offense to your opinion. It just seems that you have not read this forum. The use of this forum seems to be a place to discus experiences, situations, and dislikes about the industry, oh yeah and talk about the weather. Everyone especially people in similar situations enjoy a venue to release, wine, mope in company of their peers. I see that there is a fair number of people contributing to this and that being the case must be making profit. If they are not pulling a profit they would all be working at KFC or wal-mart ( I think they would chose a steady $8 an hr vs paying a bank to clean up its mess). I'm looking to reach the people on here who are being profitable to see if the low dollar amount and average amount of work provides a positive cash flow to support a crew and add to an already established entity. I know the cash cow that was once property preservation has gone dry but in a downed economic situation having another means to keep a crew or two busy even to just cover costs could be promising. 

Again, Thanks to all the contributors :notworthy, this has been a learning experience. :clap::clap::thumbup:


----------



## Guest

*field service international*

just got a call from a lady at field service international for a bid request. have any of you worked with them before? please help thank you


----------



## Guest

Been lurking here for awhile and figured I'd jump in and share my thoughts and PP experience(s). I've been doing this work for a little over 5 years. Gotta say I actually like it. Every day is a little different than the day before...of course sometimes in a good way and sometimes in a bad way. I, like many of the regular posters on this thread, have had my ups and downs in this biz but I feel that I am making a pretty decent living doing PP. 

I work for some REO brokers here and there but I have been a Safeguard vendor for the entire time I've been in this business. I have read, and in some cases experienced 1st hand, some of the Safeguard horror stories that have been shared here and in other forums. As someone said in a previous post, at times it is a love/hate relationship, but over the course of time, and make no mistake....it has taken me 5 years of time *and patience*, I've learned to work within their system. I average about $4500 a week with them (I've made as little as $500 a week and as much as $9000 a week) Those numbers are after Safeguard takes their discount so that ain't too bad all things considered. 

I do not run multiple crews. I think trying to get too big and operating under the impression that more crews will make you more money is the quickest way to fail in this business. The margins are too tight and the liability for substandard work and the *CHARGE-BACKS* that follow are too great so most days, I work alone. I hire people occasionally when I need a 2nd set of hands. 

Anyway, don't want this to be a 4 page introductory dissertation so I'll end it here. I plan on participating somewhat regularly so till then....


----------



## BPWY

Test.1.2 said:


> Well, I could not take offense to your opinion. It just seems that you have not read this forum. .........







:laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:





Hey man, its your story. You tell it how ever it makes you feel good.


----------



## Guest

I really don't find a lot of post to really deserve a thanks, but I even logged in to give yours a thumbs up ttalons


----------



## Guest

Ttalon,

Welcome and enjoy. 
You hit on a very good point---longevity! For us who have been in the business for a over a decade we have seen the good come and the good go.... Its like everything else-goes in cycles. 

The problem I have is these cycles are going round and round faster and faster and why?

Personally if hate Safeguard due to many many bad experiences and then I have friends who just love them and been with them many years. That Company name can be interchanged with any number of service companies since in reality they are all the same. 

Got another buddy that does great with AMS while many others have had nothing but bad exeriences.

When you hear the bad remember there is always some good. Just post your good and your bad and we all learn.

Again welcome!


----------



## mtmtnman

ttalon said:


> Been lurking here for awhile and figured I'd jump in and share my thoughts and PP experience(s). I've been doing this work for a little over 5 years. Gotta say I actually like it. Every day is a little different than the day before...of course sometimes in a good way and sometimes in a bad way. I, like many of the regular posters on this thread, have had my ups and downs in this biz but I feel that I am making a pretty decent living doing PP.
> 
> I work for some REO brokers here and there but I have been a Safeguard vendor for the entire time I've been in this business. I have read, and in some cases experienced 1st hand, some of the Safeguard horror stories that have been shared here and in other forums. As someone said in a previous post, at times it is a love/hate relationship, but over the course of time, and make no mistake....it has taken me 5 years of time *and patience*, I've learned to work within their system. I average about $4500 a week with them (I've made as little as $500 a week and as much as $9000 a week) Those numbers are after Safeguard takes their discount so that ain't too bad all things considered.
> 
> I do not run multiple crews. I think trying to get too big and operating under the impression that more crews will make you more money is the quickest way to fail in this business. The margins are too tight and the liability for substandard work and the *CHARGE-BACKS* that follow are too great so most days, I work alone. I hire people occasionally when I need a 2nd set of hands.
> 
> Anyway, don't want this to be a 4 page introductory dissertation so I'll end it here. I plan on participating somewhat regularly so till then....



I find Safeguards site one of the most difficult to navigate. Takes way more time than the money paid to upload an initial Ect. I have made a bit of coin with them but wonder if they are worth the hassle sometimes when there are other companies that are a breeze to work with. There "zones" also screw me badly. I have had to drive 140 miles round trip for "1" initial secure that ended up just being a lock change due to a frozen property 3 times in the last month. (no thaw bid approvals either)Average trip for them is 50 miles. My zone gets between 15 & 20 work orders a month. There is only one other contractor i nthe area an i know him. He he gets between 5 &10 w/o's a month.


----------



## Guest

*anyone worked for them before? or is this just another scam?*



sandblandscape said:


> just got a call from a lady at field service international for a bid request. have any of you worked with them before? please help thank you


 please help


----------



## BPWY

sandblandscape said:


> please help





I looked at their website and saw a couple of things that concern me.

First of all its only been copyrighted since 2010. 
Second its hosted by yahoo. 


I doubt that a serious international company would host via yahoo. But maybe I'm wrong. And they claim 13 yrs experience with a site thats only up for a yr.


Not saying they are a bad company. Just that I see some warning signs.


----------



## Guest

I'm new on the forum also. I have been reading the posts for quite some time and have learned a LOT from all of you seasoned professionals. I appreciate all of you sharing. Makes me feel that I am not alone in this crazy business!
We've been in business going on 4 years now. Started out as a vendor for Pyramid when they were the M&M Contractor (didn't know any better; but we sure learned the ropes). If I remember correctly, our first initial services: yard, cleaning, trashout, wint and secure paid $90.00 and we had to pay for our own debris disposal! Wrote them off after about 6 weeks and basically used it as a training and proving ground.:thumbsup:
Our next clients were 4 national companies. Still with them and like the rest of you, have had bittersweet relationships with all of them. But because of working with them, we have come in contact with brokers and agents that are now using us direct. We now work directly for brokers and that is definitely the way to go. Better pay, hardly any homework, and payment within 2-3 weeks and lots of respect and appreciation!
We are making a good living. We do a lot of the work ourselves - we have a retired pipefitter/plumber on staff - so we are able to get work done immediately. Agents love that especially during wint season.
Gonna close now just saying that this is the hardest thing I have ever done in my life but also the most rewarding. Turning the worst house on the street into the best is instant gratification like no other. If anyone else is planning on getting into this biz, be prepared for: No Attaboy! No Thank-You! No You did a great job! and No Loyalty (I'm speaking about the nationals only - not brokers and agents) and the hardest work you have ever done in your life! 
Just do the best job that you can do and I believe you will be rewarded for it. Hard work always pays off in the end! Good luck to old and new and I hope that everyone has a very profitable year!
And I more thing.... I have been mistaken for Pollyanna more than once and yes, I did just take my antidepressant! lol


----------



## brm1109

*Paint disposal*

I was wondering how people are handling disposal of paints. We currently have a 55 gallon drum that we use to dispose of it. The cost is $225.00. I recently did a bid for a national for paints and was told that it can now only be bid by the yard. There were 10 gallons of paint and I was told that it takes a 55 gallon drum to make a yard. So at that rate I would be behind by about $175.00.
No other trashout just the paint. How are others handling the fees.
Thanks


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> I was wondering how people are handling disposal of paints. We currently have a 55 gallon drum that we use to dispose of it. The cost is $225.00. I recently did a bid for a national for paints and was told that it can now only be bid by the yard. There were 10 gallons of paint and I was told that it takes a 55 gallon drum to make a yard. So at that rate I would be behind by about $175.00.
> No other trashout just the paint. How are others handling the fees.
> Thanks






Use the contract in your favor. It states "all local laws and regs must be followed" or similar.

I tell em that 5 gallons is a yrd equivalent. 
Tell them that HUD can wish in one hand and ..... in the other, see which one fills up first. Local laws and regs must be followed or I'll just leave the paint in the house.

55 gal at $225 $4.09 just for disposal. Plus labor for the removal.
Tell em that you are not paying for the disposal and unless they reimburse expenses you are just leaving it in the house.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:



> I was wondering how people are handling disposal of paints. We currently have a 55 gallon drum that we use to dispose of it. The cost is $225.00. I recently did a bid for a national for paints and was told that it can now only be bid by the yard. There were 10 gallons of paint and I was told that it takes a 55 gallon drum to make a yard. So at that rate I would be behind by about $175.00.
> No other trashout just the paint. How are others handling the fees.
> Thanks


 
How we do the 55ga drums or per the ga for latex paints is this:

1) provide a copy of the landfill rules (pic or scanned rate sheet) that shows that paints are not acceptable as debris

2) We get $8.00 per ga (net) for Latex paints. This covers the cost of the sawdust/kittly litter to dry it out for disposal and the labor cost of doing the mixing and cleanup afterwards:laughing:

3) 55 ga drum we get $352.00 NET for 55 ga drum of "paints". I don't see many drums of paints though...normally ours is used oils and those we get $12.00 per ga (net). 

4) You can use national companies such as SafetyKleen for the drum removals for oils but they require an affadivit stating you "know" that the drum is only oils and not contaminated. We will Never ever sign that-so then we have to pay to have the drums tested. 

We also will NEVER remove paints per cyd except as BPWY stated "5ga of paints is cost equavelent to 1cyd of debris". ie..... 10 ga x $8.00 net = $80.00 / $50cyd payable=== 1.6cyd of debris.


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> I find Safeguards site one of the most difficult to navigate. Takes way more time than the money paid to upload an initial Ect. I have made a bit of coin with them but wonder if they are worth the hassle sometimes when there are other companies that are a breeze to work with. There "zones" also screw me badly. I have had to drive 140 miles round trip for "1" initial secure that ended up just being a lock change due to a frozen property 3 times in the last month. (no thaw bid approvals either)Average trip for them is 50 miles. My zone gets between 15 & 20 work orders a month. There is only one other contractor i nthe area an i know him. He he gets between 5 &10 w/o's a month.


I thought an initial secure *was* a lock change? If not, what all does an initial secure entail?


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## Guest

I don't know about Safeguard but to us an initial secure is much much more than a lockchange. 

report all damages, report all icc items, winterize, grass cut if in season, bid all damages and icc items. I know I'm missing some:whistling

HOW is everyone handling units with the gas/electric both on and the furnace is off? Are you lighting them off? Or bidding an hvac contractor to inspect and restore heat?

We have all our guys not turning the heat on anylonger because of any liability risks. Is this reasonable? Kinda paranoid after hearing about all these fires


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I don't know about Safeguard but to us an initial secure is much much more than a lockchange.


It is. Don't you know you have to knock out windows, throw ice cubes in the toilet, bring dog doodoo in from the yard and put it in the livingroom, bring your trash from YOUR house........all to do as allowables to make a buck or two on your IS? :w00t:


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I don't know about Safeguard but to us an initial secure is much much more than a lockchange.
> 
> report all damages, report all icc items, winterize, grass cut if in season, bid all damages and icc items. I know I'm missing some:whistling
> 
> HOW is everyone handling units with the gas/electric both on and the furnace is off? Are you lighting them off? Or bidding an hvac contractor to inspect and restore heat?
> 
> We have all our guys not turning the heat on anylonger because of any liability risks. Is this reasonable? Kinda paranoid after hearing about all these fires





somewherein815 said:


> It is. Don't you know you have to knock out windows, throw ice cubes in the toilet, bring dog doodoo in from the yard and put it in the livingroom, bring your trash from YOUR house........all to do as allowables to make a buck or two on your IS? :w00t:


Thanks for your responses. Please forgive my ignorance, I am still learning.

I was going off of the name being "initial secure", what you described as an "initial secure" I've always known and thought was "initial services" for which we don't always change locks, rarely do. The "secure" threw me off.


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## Guest

I don't have my guys light furnaces either. I bid it everytime. UT has a code that you have to be a certified gas tech to do it. I whip out the code number and say "to comply blah blah local laws blah blah per UT code blah blah certified tech blah blah" 

In Utah, the gas company won't even turn the gas on at the meter after they have unlocked it. They will leave a note on the meter and the door telling you to get a certified tech to come turn the gas on and check all appliances. You have to be certified to even buy supplies to work on gas lines around a house. 

A over the years there have been a few houses blow up. Big, big, booms, not just fires. The last one killed a few people, one being a gas company man, and damaged houses for a block in every direction from it. There wasn't anything left but the hole in the ground for the basement. Sad situation, a mom and kid died too.

Funny thing about the bids though, none of our bids have ever been approved to turn on the gas and light the furnace, but when we get sent back to the property for another order the furnace is running. I am sure they have other contractors who they are sending to light furnaces since our bids to light the furnace are more than double HUD allowable for a UT dry winterization. I sure don't want that liability of blowing up a house and/or causing a death.


----------



## mtmtnman

uintahiker said:


> I don't have my guys light furnaces either. I bid it everytime. UT has a code that you have to be a certified gas tech to do it. I whip out the code number and say "to comply blah blah local laws blah blah per UT code blah blah certified tech blah blah"
> 
> In Utah, the gas company won't even turn the gas on at the meter after they have unlocked it. They will leave a note on the meter and the door telling you to get a certified tech to come turn the gas on and check all appliances. You have to be certified to even buy supplies to work on gas lines around a house.
> 
> A over the years there have been a few houses blow up. Big, big, booms, not just fires. The last one killed a few people, one being a gas company man, and damaged houses for a block in every direction from it. There wasn't anything left but the hole in the ground for the basement. Sad situation, a mom and kid died too.
> 
> Funny thing about the bids though, none of our bids have ever been approved to turn on the gas and light the furnace, but when we get sent back to the property for another order the furnace is running. I am sure they have other contractors who they are sending to light furnaces since our bids to light the furnace are more than double HUD allowable for a UT dry winterization. I sure don't want that liability of blowing up a house and/or causing a death.



When the gas co. turns on gas here THEY light the furnace, water heater, ect..................


----------



## thanohano44

mtmtnman said:


> When the gas co. turns on gas here THEY light the furnace, water heater, ect..................


 
I also never light a furnace. sorry to hear of the sad news! where in Utah did that happen?


----------



## thanohano44

......


----------



## Guest

We would like you to refresh winterization, clean the god awful gunk out of the toilets, and trim 4 enormous shrubs.
We will not be available to answer the phone if you have any questions.
We will pay you a whopping 65 dollars.
Invoice will be processed 72 days from now.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> We would like you to refresh winterization, clean the god awful gunk out of the toilets, and trim 4 enormous shrubs.
> We will not be available to answer the phone if you have any questions.
> We will pay you a whopping 65 dollars.
> Invoice will be processed 72 days from now.


OMG. Can you post the company name or is it one you get good orders from, too?

On the bright side, however, at least they're up front.:laughing:

Linda


----------



## Guest

I don't know about you all but I am starting to get sick and tired of walking into homes that have winterization stickers all over everything only to find that:
A. The main water valve to the house is still in the open position
B. Toilets, sinks etc are not even close to clean
C. Water still in the hot water heater
Etc, Etc, Etc......
Is it just me or does anybody else clean all of this stuff before pouring in antifreeze (pink of course)
I can't believe how many people are getting away with such crappy work.
The worst part is that we get paid to "refresh winterization" when we find this. We still have to do the entire job cleaning up someone else's mess but only get paid to "refresh"......


----------



## Guest

ODIE said:


> Our next clients were 4 national companies. Still with them and like the rest of you, have had bittersweet relationships with all of them. But because of working with them, we have come in contact with brokers and agents that are now using us direct.


Some have asked how to get work directley from brokers, this is also how I got hooked up with my REO brokers. With the over saturation of contractors in this business and so many getting into this business daily, I don't think calling or emailing brokers is going to be very productive in this day and age. 

I meet my REO brokers doing evictions for Safeguard. Many times, the broker that was going to be listing the property for the bank would show up at the eviction. At 1st, they'd hang around asking all kinds of questions and I was like get lost clown, I'm busy here. At one eviciton, the realtor there was an old guy and he reminded me of my grandfather. I humored him and we exchanged phone numbers. He called me 2 days later with 6 winterizations. Here's the best part....at the time, Safeguard was paying $75.00 (less discount) for a winterization and requiring all the photos and what not. I ask this broker what his allowable is....get this, he says $150.00...no photo's...he wasn't looking for a kick back and he'd pay me as soon as I sent him an invoice because he didn't want me to have to wait for my money so he'd front it and get reimbursed from the bank. 

True story....still working for him today. He doesn't have the volume though, maybe 5-10 orders a month.


----------



## Guest

Oh, just a by the way...I lost money everytime I did an eviction. Evictions suk. I won't do them anymore. But it was a good way to meet REO brokers while losing money :laughing:


----------



## Guest

Exactly! Hate evictions but love meeting those brokers and agents!:clap:


----------



## Guest

I wouldn't answer the phone either! I would be too embarrassed after offering $65.


----------



## Guest

We as well meet many new clients on site and we have developed a very good relation with many of them. For those that are just getting started or signing up with new nationals that are still poping up, please read over any agreements or contracts very carefully. The below was in a contract for a vendor that we declined to complete. The reason was for this specific reason only. We do other work outside of PP work we deal with and solicit work from realtors all the time. This would have caused problems. There have been a few others with no compete clauses. Just be careful. 

*8.3 Covenant not to Compete*. Subcontractor and its principals signatory below, individually or as a
partner, shareholder, joint venture, or as an employee, agent, or officer, or through agents, servants or
employees, shall each refrain from engaging in any other similar business with clients of *** during the
effective period of the agreement. Furthermore, neither Subcontractor not its principal(s) shall contact
or otherwise do business with any client or potential client of *** where leads were generated prior to
termination of this agreement, whose identity becomes known to Subcontractor or its principal(s) during
the term of this agreement, for a period of three (3) years following the termination of this agreement,
except with specific written consent of ***. This provision shall survive the termination of this agreement.

*8.4 Non-Solicitation*. For a period of two (2) years following the effective date of termination of this
agreement, Subcontractor, nor its principals signatory below, or their respective agents, employees,
officers, heirs, successors or assignees will not, directly or indirectly, (a) solicit or accept any business or
orders as described in section 1.1 from any active customers and/or suppliers of *** (or its affiliates) or
customers and/or suppliers who have dealt with *** (or its affiliates) during the two (2) years preceding
the termination of this agreement, solicit for employment or otherwise attempt to engage (as an
employee, consultant or otherwise) the services of any employee then employed by the Company (or
its affiliates) or any former employee employed by *** (or its affiliates) within one (1) year after
termination of agreement, or become a shareholder, member, manager, employee, officer, director,
partner, lender, investor, advisor, agent or consultant (whether or not compensated in any way in any
such capacity) for or in, as the case may be, any individual, organization, entity, company or business
that engages in work as described in section 1.1.


----------



## Guest

Rich51,

Most all of the Nationals have now incorporated this into their agreements. If they don't have this now they will on the next renewal. This was a top subject that was discussed at the NAMFS conference and when the top dogs start then everyone follows suit.

Our Atty told us the only way to get out of this clause is to domicile your business in a State the does not allow "non compete" clauses that hinders a person from making a living. There is supposedly 11 States that negates non competes. I know where our business license is domiciled they do not recognize these non-competes. :thumbup:


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> Rich51,
> 
> Most all of the Nationals have now incorporated this into their agreements. If they don't have this now they will on the next renewal. This was a top subject that was discussed at the NAMFS conference and when the top dogs start then everyone follows suit.
> 
> Our Atty told us the only way to get out of this clause is to domicile your business in a State the does not allow "non compete" clauses that hinders a person from making a living. There is supposedly 11 States that negates non competes. I know where our business license is domiciled they do not recognize these non-competes. :thumbup:


Same here.................


----------



## BPWY

Rich51 said:


> We as well meet many new clients on site and we have developed a very good relation with many of them. For those that are just getting started or signing up with new nationals that are still poping up, please read over any agreements or contracts very carefully. The below was in a contract for a vendor that we declined to complete. The reason was for this specific reason only. We do other work outside of PP work we deal with and solicit work from realtors all the time. This would have caused problems. There have been a few others with no compete clauses. Just be careful.
> 
> *8.3 Covenant not to Compete*. Subcontractor and its principals signatory below, individually or as a
> partner, shareholder, joint venture, or as an employee, agent, or officer, or through agents, servants or
> employees, shall each refrain from engaging in any other similar business with clients of *** during the
> effective period of the agreement. Furthermore, neither Subcontractor not its principal(s) shall contact
> or otherwise do business with any client or potential client of *** where leads were generated prior to
> termination of this agreement, whose identity becomes known to Subcontractor or its principal(s) during
> the term of this agreement, for a period of three (3) years following the termination of this agreement,
> except with specific written consent of ***. This provision shall survive the termination of this agreement.
> 
> *8.4 Non-Solicitation*. For a period of two (2) years following the effective date of termination of this
> agreement, Subcontractor, nor its principals signatory below, or their respective agents, employees,
> officers, heirs, successors or assignees will not, directly or indirectly, (a) solicit or accept any business or
> orders as described in section 1.1 from any active customers and/or suppliers of *** (or its affiliates) or
> customers and/or suppliers who have dealt with *** (or its affiliates) during the two (2) years preceding
> the termination of this agreement, solicit for employment or otherwise attempt to engage (as an
> employee, consultant or otherwise) the services of any employee then employed by the Company (or
> its affiliates) or any former employee employed by *** (or its affiliates) within one (1) year after
> termination of agreement, or become a shareholder, member, manager, employee, officer, director,
> partner, lender, investor, advisor, agent or consultant (whether or not compensated in any way in any
> such capacity) for or in, as the case may be, any individual, organization, entity, company or business
> that engages in work as described in section 1.1.





First they have to catch you. :thumbup:



I wouldn't sign it either. Just X thru it and see what they do when you send it in. lol


----------



## JenkinsHB

FremontREO said:


> Rich51,
> 
> Most all of the Nationals have now incorporated this into their agreements. If they don't have this now they will on the next renewal. This was a top subject that was discussed at the NAMFS conference and when the top dogs start then everyone follows suit.
> 
> Our Atty told us the only way to get out of this clause is to domicile your business in a State the does not allow "non compete" clauses that hinders a person from making a living. There is supposedly 11 States that negates non competes. I know where our business license is domiciled they do not recognize these non-competes. :thumbup:


There was an attorney that spoke at my continuing ed class on Tuesday. He says they can overturn about 99% of all the non-compete clauses that you run into. The main reason for being non-payment. If they don't pay you on a job, they broke your contract first, so the non-compete doesn't even apply.


----------



## brm1109

*Additional insured*

Just received a call from a "national" that I signed up with 2 years ago and they told me they needed my updated policy with them listed as additional insured. I told them that I would send a certificate with them listed but that since in 2 years I have not received 1 job I could not justify the added expense.
Their response was "well if we are not listed as additional we can't send work" I told them, send me work and you will be listed the same day with a copy. "Well we can't do that".
Fine take me out of your system. I am tired of wasting time and money on these folks.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Catch-22. Same thing happened with us, too. Never received work and, after numerous e-mails, we declined to add the company to our insurance policy when we renewed.

On the flip side, we have several vendors in our system who we haven't put to work yet so, if their insurance has expired, we have to ask for their updated certificate again when we do. But at least, when we ask for it, it's because we finally have work for them.

Linda


----------



## brm1109

*Snow*

Ok so we have had 7 snow storms so far this winter and the other day we got hit with 1/4" of ice. I went today for a winterization and there is 3 feet of snow in the driveway. Called the company and am submitting a bid for the snow in order to do the work. I don't have a problem bidding but,
a) our business also does snow removal, the customer calls and we look at the property and give a bid. They either say yes or no. I refuse to give a bid to a bank where I have to justify the equipment being used and manhours.
b) I know certain companies have a pre approval limit up to $75.00 for snow, that is fine for most properties I can deal with it. If there is no pre approval I am not even going to the properties just for the trip charge.
Am I wrong and bull headed?


----------



## Racerx

Okay, I don't know if the Nationals lurk in these forums but since my post about not getting any work a few day's ago I've suddenly got a few things developing!!..

I got sent on my first occupancy inspection today and before I left this morning i got an e-mail telling me I could go ahead and do the property secure, problem is it appears that the occupants have not vacated the property yet,according to the neighbor he saw the occupants there yesterday (you gotta love old timers!!, they see and know everything) and since we had a blizzard the other day and the walks and driveway were cleared I believe him.

Since I was'nt getting any work from the national I did'nt have any digital locks on hand so I ordered one today and I fiqure that the lag time between recieving the lock and me returning to the property will give the occupant time to vacate..so any advice as to how to proceed from some of you more experinced contractors would be greatly appreciated.


----------



## BPWY

You have to look out for your company's best interests.

If the bank don't want to play ball.............. NEXT.


----------



## Racerx

BPWY said:


> You have to look out for your company's best interests.
> 
> If the bank don't want to play ball.............. NEXT.


Luckily being a General Contractor I don't have to rely on a banks or nationals in my daily operations , I just figured branching out into property preservation would be another avenue of revenue for my business, I do have to admit though that since I originally stumbled upon this Forum searching for info about property preservation that I have learned so much from not just this disscussion but the Forum in general that I've changed a lot of my business practices after 20yrs in the business!!!, I guess it's true you never can know enough!! you guy's & gals ROCK!!!!:notworthy:notworthy


----------



## Guest

All-Craft I am sure they do, as they post on here when work or vendors are needed. This should not stop anyone from posting as long as the post are true. Non of us are in the business of losing money, if anothers post can help us in our business thats what its all about.


----------



## Guest

IT seems that about 75% of the country has been getting pounded by snow lately and that is good and bad.....

To that I stress do be careful:

After a while the work comp will kill me

Worker twisted back on lifting a small snowblower and couldn't move so off he went on a backboard in his new pimped out ride


----------



## Guest

OK on a lighter note:

We had a property that had $1000's of personal property and listed it all out for the service company. They kept coming back for the last 2 weeks saying they don't see that much "garage sale" valued personals....

There was 2 flat screen tv's, 1 big screen, 1 pool table just to name a few BUT in the FRIDGE was a 6 pack of Bud Lite!

Finally I said "you cannot expect us to throw away the BUD LITE...be serious man" :whistling
That generated a guy calling and laughing his butt off!!! AND said that just makes sense.
Next call from a lady she said I was being sarcastic?:no:
Was I?:blink:


----------



## Racerx

FremontREO said:


> IT seems that about 75% of the country has been getting pounded by snow lately and that is good and bad.....
> 
> To that I stress do be careful:
> 
> After a while the work comp will kill me
> 
> Worker twisted back on lifting a small snowblower and couldn't move so off he went on a backboard in his new pimped out ride


True. I watched my 80yr old neighbor get blown out of his boots by a snow plow yesterday..he stood there and watched it coming like a deer caught in headlights:whistling:whistling


----------



## Guest

All-Craft said:


> True. I watched my 80yr old neighbor get blown out of his boots by a snow plow yesterday..he stood there and watched it coming like a deer caught in headlights:whistling:whistling


Ah crap...was he ok?

I think with "packer nation" that your in Wisconsin? We do a lot of work on the Western 3rd and they keep getting hammered too. They do a lot of private plowing and WAS loving it--now they are dragging


----------



## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> IT seems that about 75% of the country has been getting pounded by snow lately and that is good and bad.....
> 
> To that I stress do be careful:
> 
> After a while the work comp will kill me
> 
> Worker twisted back on lifting a small snowblower and couldn't move so off he went on a backboard in his new pimped out ride


 get well soon.


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> Ok so we have had 7 snow storms so far this winter and the other day we got hit with 1/4" of ice. I went today for a winterization and there is 3 feet of snow in the driveway.
> 
> Looked at a couple of jobs recently through Brokers. Went to bid on removal of a collapsed garage behind a house. They have a 10+ foot high mountain of snow and ice in front of the property and driveway from all these storms. Obviously nobodys been there to plow or shovel, gonna need some big equipment to remove, problem is it's a very busy and not very wide street, no room for big equipment. $10k with snow/ice removal or $7k in late spring. Did a de-wint / wint for a buyers inspection a couple of weeks ago at a house with 3+ feet of snow in driveway and walkways. FAS is supposed to be handling this property, went back yesterday to do some furnace repair and still all the snow + more, the Broker has called several times but nothing gets done. Doing a trash out this Saturday, same thing, the national has not had the driveway plowed plus theres 3-4" of water in the basement.
> Numerous other properties with the nationals sign on the front door but the their work is a joke.
> Boy, those nationals are running a tight ship:thumbup:


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> We would like you to refresh winterization, clean the god awful gunk out of the toilets, and trim 4 enormous shrubs.
> We will not be available to answer the phone if you have any questions.
> We will pay you a whopping 65 dollars.
> Invoice will be processed 72 days from now.


Priceless!...:thumbup:


----------



## Racerx

FremontREO said:


> Ah crap...was he ok?
> 
> I think with "packer nation" that your in Wisconsin? We do a lot of work on the Western 3rd and they keep getting hammered too. They do a lot of private plowing and WAS loving it--now they are dragging


Yep I'm in Southeastern Wi. and yeah the neighbors O.K and still stubborn as ever, he's alway's outside over execerting himself ( shoveling, chopping wood, etc.) I alway's offer to help him but he refuses to just sit down...


----------



## brm1109

My bid is my bid. If it is too much then someone else can do it.


----------



## Guest

Buddy of mine turned this eviction down twice and no wonder 

http://www.kcci.com/news/26750463/detail.html

look at the slideshow of pics
Someone did get the coffin!


----------



## Racerx

FremontREO said:


> Buddy of mine turned this eviction down twice and no wonder
> 
> 
> look at the slideshow of pics
> Someone did get the coffin!


I was originally gonna make a joke about needing a garbage can full of wrapping paper but after seeing it on the slideshow it was not like the mental picture I had.. and did you notice the engine hoist ? it actually looked to be in good shape!.


----------



## BPWY

That makes today's 50 cubes look like a couple of bags in the back of the pickup.


----------



## Guest

Funny thing is that according to the buddy they are not done...that was only the basement and the main level and half the garage. Upper floor and attic to go:no:

Did you see the U-haul truck in the pics? Just as soon as the Sheriff leaves it become community property and the vultures will be digging through all the stuff and the papers will be flying. The neighbors are really going to be bitc**g tomorrow as the winds blows it all over. 

I wouldn't have done it either for a measly $20/hr GROSS and that includes the disposal the next day AND picking up all the crap thrown all over the neighbors yards. 

Guarantee that the City will be fining the house Saturday for debris in the exterior since that is how they make $$.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Apparently, *NOW PP*, is still alive and kicking. In case anyone they owe money to is still trying to figure out where they went, looks like they're still in biz, just not responding.

Press release from yesterday

http://www.prlog.org/11274087-now-property-preservation-tackles-the-blizzards-and-wins.html

Has anyone been paid yet? Any updates to share with anyone else who's owed money or have you written them off?

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Apparently, *NOW PP*, is still alive and kicking. In case anyone they owe money to is still trying to figure out where they went, looks like they're still in biz, just not responding.
> 
> Press release from yesterday
> 
> http://www.prlog.org/11274087-now-property-preservation-tackles-the-blizzards-and-wins.html
> 
> Has anyone been paid yet? Any updates to share with anyone else who's owed money or have you written them off?
> 
> Linda


 
WOW from reading that you would thank Sam Sushi is a modern day hero!!!
:w00t:


----------



## JenkinsHB

a1propertyclean said:


> Apparently, *NOW PP*, is still alive and kicking. In case anyone they owe money to is still trying to figure out where they went, looks like they're still in biz, just not responding.
> 
> Press release from yesterday
> 
> http://www.prlog.org/11274087-now-property-preservation-tackles-the-blizzards-and-wins.html
> 
> Has anyone been paid yet? Any updates to share with anyone else who's owed money or have you written them off?
> 
> Linda


They owe me about $4000. They did pick up the phone the other day when I called ... after I called them 12 times in a row. They said they were forwarding my information to the accounting department.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

FremontREO said:


> WOW from reading that you would thank Sam Sushi is a modern day hero!!!
> :w00t:


Did you read the other press releases below this one? Sam pulled a family from a burning building, received a lifetime award, etc.

Sam makes a statement in the lifetime award press release about working with large clients who are behind and that NOW's current financial condition is out of his control.

I feel for you guys who are owed money. Jenkins, I hope you are eventually able to collect. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

funny...company I posted about sending us crap order the other day for 65.00 (refresh wint, sanitize toilets, shrub pruning)...now they send an order for sales clean, 1200 sq ft condo and offer 350.00?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

barefootlc said:


> funny...company I posted about sending us crap order the other day for 65.00 (refresh wint, sanitize toilets, shrub pruning)...now they send an order for sales clean, 1200 sq ft condo and offer 350.00?


Maybe they're making up for the $65 order.

Linda


----------



## Guest

*Newbie Question*

I'm new to the forum, but I've been reading through this thread for a while, and I've gotten a lot of good information. I started my own business of land clearing/improvement/construction site clean up, etc., about 2-1/2 years ago after working in the corporate world for 15+ years. I do have all the necessary insurance etc, and I have quite a large investment in equipment, truck, trailer, etc. I don't consider myself a fly by night company, but I am rather new in some areas. In an effort to get more revenue, I started advertising through a national lead service for junk/debris hauling. One of my first customers was a mortagage company who wanted a bid on hauling some debris from a home. It was the outside debris only. I looked at it, bid it, and I got the job. I made a few hundred bucks for about an hour of work. And I took the before and after pictures, etc. I had no idea that is was a foreclosure. Well, long story short- I did a nice chunk of business with them last year and I've gotten every job I've bid, and I've gotten every job I've bid this year. I guess my niche is heavy duty mowing/lot clearing on more rural acreage. I never looked at the HUD cost schedule till my contact (with whom I have built a solid working relationship) suggested I look at it. I bid the jobs at what I can make a good profit margin on.....depending on the amount of labor and time, dump fees etc. I've since, been doing the interior debris, reglazing of windows, grass cuts; everything but Winterizations, Lock Changes, and the initial inspections. I've even built travel and per diem rates for hotels and meals into the work. I started thinking this is some pretty good work, but then I ran into a company who wanted me to be on their contractor list and hold to a cost schedule to do a grass cut for $35, or a trashout for any house (up to 2500 sq ft) and in any condition for $200.00 up and lock changes for $5.00 per lock (though they would provide the locks). And, like I recently saw on a previous post, they wanted me to enter into this crazy non-compete clause, and sign their contract etc. I'm not about to do that. So, I told them I would work for them on an as needed basis for larger lot mowing, tree removal etc. I've done another large haul off job for a realtor (about 150 tons of concrete and dirt), but I really would like to do more work, but I can do a large trashout for what some of these companies want to pay. 


I hope I'm not beating a dead horse here, but is there any magical potion for getting more work with the mortgage companies directly? I haven't had any problems with getting paid, and I'm enjoying the work, and it's been very profitable for me..... I wouldn't have to much of an issue working for a national company as a sub, but only if I can get a decent price for the quality of work I feel I will do for them. 

I'm sorry for the long, drawn out post, but I wanted the veterans on this board to hopefully realize, that I'm not a craiglister guy with a beat up truck looking to haul off some trash and willing to do it for beer money.

Thanks for your input.


----------



## Guest

I have a question. Why is it that the newer contractors do not put in their location? If we have a request and need to get someone to fill it for us quickly, we will know who is in that particular location. Are you here to share or just get information?

I hope this is taken in the spirit it is given and not as a slam.


----------



## Guest

sacoop said:


> I have a question. Why is it that the newer contractors do not put in their location? If we have a request and need to get someone to fill it for us quickly, we will know who is in that particular location. Are you here to share or just get information?
> 
> I hope this is taken in the spirit it is given and not as a slam.


 I'll be happy to share... Austin, Texas. I'll go anywhere....I've built fences and cleared property as far east as Giddings/Lexington, south of Pleasanton, West to Uvalde, and north near Ft. Worth. 

I wasn't trying to not put my location. Just an oversite.


----------



## Guest

Agree...I feel funny about those that don't post there location. Nice to see I am not the only one.


----------



## Guest

I haven't seen anyone from my area here yet.


----------



## Guest

EZ Land said:


> I'll be happy to share... Austin, Texas. I'll go anywhere....I've built fences and cleared property as far east as Giddings/Lexington, south of Pleasanton, West to Uvalde, and north near Ft. Worth.
> 
> I wasn't trying to not put my location. Just an oversite.


Have a friend that has a fairly large P&P company in Austin and he may be looking for help. I know they asked us if any of our crews would be happy to coming to Warm and Friendly Texas for the winter.....just hasn't been that warm there lately though huh:whistling

Get a couple more posts and private message me and I'll give you his numbers unless you want to post your tele number for everyone to see?


----------



## thanohano44

a1propertyclean said:


> Maybe they're making up for the $65 order.
> 
> Linda


Either that or they submitted a bad bid and the contractor who did it doesn't work for them and they need it done.


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Have a friend that has a fairly large P&P company in Austin and he may be looking for help. I know they asked us if any of our crews would be happy to coming to Warm and Friendly Texas for the winter.....just hasn't been that warm there lately though huh:whistling
> 
> Get a couple more posts and private message me and I'll give you his numbers unless you want to post your tele number for everyone to see?


 I'll PM you... Thanks!!


----------



## Guest

*Floridas Finest Industries*

Hi Dan, We have done several jobs for Floridas Finest Industries and have a great working relationship with them



danny1217 said:


> Thanks Linda
> 
> Will look forward to the opportunity to work with you. We just did 3 winterizations for Florida's Finest Industries on Wednesday, first time doing work for them. Ever hear of them ? As with most vendors ( i assume ) we're a little concerned about working for someone we've never met in person, and is a thousand miles away and then hope to get paid. I'm a face to face kinda guy, have met all the REO agents we do work for and most of the time they meet us at the property to go over everything that needs to be done so we're all on the same page. Obviously we have to take our chances if we are going to work with out of state companies. BTW, I neglected to add 2 counties in NY ( Putnam, Westchester ) when I submitted my info. We are on the CT / NY border so we cover those Counties in NY
> 
> Thanks again, hope to hear from you soon
> 
> Dan
> S&S property Preservation


----------



## Guest

^ Uh Oh, another Illinois guy!


----------



## mtmtnman

somewherein815 said:


> ^ Uh Oh, another Illinois guy!



Yeah From Harvard to boot! We stole their cow mascot in Highscool and they sprayed Roundup on our football field! Gardner, I grew up in Marengo but i left in 99 never to go back.........................


----------



## BPWY

Its sickening the things that NOW blows their own horn about trying to blow smoke to the uninformed.


----------



## ARPPP

*Altisource*

Wondering if any of you that works with Altisource has heard anything from them regarding the initial bundle packages. This was to have started on January 17th. I accepted a couple of orders for the occupancy inspection which was supposed to generate an initial bundle inspection if you accepted it. I have not received this order, nor am I able to get a repsonse to my questions regarding how they work. My questions to start are:
1. How are you paying for multi-unit properties?
2. Are we only supposed to occupancy on initial trip?
3. How much debris is included in initial bundle
4. If debris is more than allowable how is this handled. 

So little information has gone out, how do you know if you want to be bothered or not.

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC

I have done decently with them despite all I have been hearing.


----------



## ARPPP

somewherein815 said:


> ^ Uh Oh, another Illinois guy!


 
I am at the south end of Cook and Will county. Any others on this side of town?


----------



## Racerx

ARPPP said:


> Wondering if any of you that works with Altisource has heard anything from them regarding the initial bundle packages. This was to have started on January 17th. I accepted a couple of orders for the occupancy inspection which was supposed to generate an initial bundle inspection if you accepted it. I have not received this order, nor am I able to get a repsonse to my questions regarding how they work. My questions to start are:
> 1. How are you paying for multi-unit properties?
> 2. Are we only supposed to occupancy on initial trip?
> 3. How much debris is included in initial bundle
> 4. If debris is more than allowable how is this handled.
> 
> So little information has gone out, how do you know if you want to be bothered or not.
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC
> 
> I have done decently with them despite all I have been hearing.


I just did my first occupancy inspection for them on Thursday and spoke with a rep that afternoon and was left with the impression that completing the inspection generated the bundle process..I'll go check research some of my paperwork and see if I can come of with a better answer for you but it appears that is the way it works though..on a related note though I'll be going to do a securing Monday and was wondering what method is commonly used to gain entry to change the locks ? since I obviously won't have keys..I've got a pretty good idea as to how to do it, but since it'll be my first one I want to tap into the knowledge of the more experienced contractors on the forum. Thanks in advance.


----------



## Guest

Our realtor was asked to start hiring all the lockchange/wz/cleanout crews to complete for Altisource/Ocwen. They said that they are not going to use the P&P crews here anylonger. Doing my first one Monday. 
Realtor is doing the Initial Occupancy then invoices for all the P&P work. Another thing weird.....no 10digit digital lockbox. 
Ocwen/Altisource signage though. 

Does anyone anywhere knows what is going on anymore:no:

All-Craft we use a variety of methods to gain entry including: realtors key, channel locks and drill with a good bit......


----------



## Guest

oh yeah we use the battery powered pick too.....just know your county ordinances since we find it illegal in a lot of communities and the Sheriff/Police Dept will confiscate. We used it in front of a deputy at an eviction and he about crapped how fast we went through the locks (so was I...everything fell together on those locks):clap:


----------



## thanohano44

FremontREO said:


> Our realtor was asked to start hiring all the lockchange/wz/cleanout crews to complete for Altisource/Ocwen. They said that they are not going to use the P&P crews here anylonger. Doing my first one Monday.
> Realtor is doing the Initial Occupancy then invoices for all the P&P work. Another thing weird.....no 10digit digital lockbox.
> Ocwen/Altisource signage though.
> 
> Does anyone anywhere knows what is going on anymore:no:
> 
> All-Craft we use a variety of methods to gain entry including: realtors key, channel locks and drill with a good bit......


That's good news!!


----------



## Racerx

FremontREO said:


> Our realtor was asked to start hiring all the lockchange/wz/cleanout crews to complete for Altisource/Ocwen. They said that they are not going to use the P&P crews here anylonger. Doing my first one Monday.
> Realtor is doing the Initial Occupancy then invoices for all the P&P work. Another thing weird.....no 10digit digital lockbox.
> Ocwen/Altisource signage though.
> 
> Does anyone anywhere knows what is going on anymore:no:
> 
> All-Craft we use a variety of methods to gain entry including: realtors key, channel locks and drill with a good bit......


Excatly what I was thinking:thumbsup:..I appreciate the advice,since it's my first time out I want to be as efficent as possible, Thanks


----------



## mtmtnman

FremontREO said:


> oh yeah we use the battery powered pick too.....just know your county ordinances since we find it illegal in a lot of communities and the Sheriff/Police Dept will confiscate. We used it in front of a deputy at an eviction and he about crapped how fast we went through the locks (so was I...everything fell together on those locks):clap:



You forgot VISA and MASTERCARD. I get into most of my knoblocks with one or the other............................


----------



## Guest

Face it the Realtors key is the easiest  LOL!!!

If you don't know what that is just ask


----------



## ARPPP

FremontREO said:


> Face it the Realtors key is the easiest  LOL!!!
> 
> If you don't know what that is just ask


Agreed, I keep a set of most codes handy. It is great when you can use them.


----------



## Racerx

I gotta ask...What is a realtors key?:jester:


----------



## Guest

round ones or the square ones? Seems I see the realtors using the rectangle ones the most..... easiest


----------



## Guest

This is the "realtors key"....
Used very often. Cost is right:whistling 
I don't use them but the realtors seem to use quite a LOT...


----------



## ARPPP

All-Craft said:


> I just did my first occupancy inspection for them on Thursday and spoke with a rep that afternoon and was left with the impression that completing the inspection generated the bundle process..I'll go check research some of my paperwork and see if I can come of with a better answer for you but it appears that is the way it works though..on a related note though I'll be going to do a securing Monday and was wondering what method is commonly used to gain entry to change the locks ? since I obviously won't have keys..I've got a pretty good idea as to how to do it, but since it'll be my first one I want to tap into the knowledge of the more experienced contractors on the forum. Thanks in advance.


 
Thanks for the response All Craft. I don't think the answer to my question is in your paperwork. I have been asking them these questions for past week and a half and the repsonse I get is that they are still trying to work it out. It would be nice if they sent a blast communication to this effect. The answer seems simple to me on multi-units. Pay full price for 1st unit and a portion of that for the others. 1st unit $1110, additional units $900 or something like this. Duuuuuhhhh :wacko:


----------



## Racerx

ARPPP said:


> Thanks for the response All Craft. I don't think the answer to my question is in your paperwork. I have been asking them these questions for past week and a half and the repsonse I get is that they are still trying to work it out. It would be nice if they sent a blast communication to this effect. The answer seems simple to me on multi-units. Pay full price for 1st unit and a portion of that for the others. 1st unit $1110, additional units $900 or something like this. Duuuuuhhhh :wacko:


PM sent before I read this.


----------



## Racerx

FremontREO said:


> This is the "realtors key"....
> Used very often. Cost is right:whistling
> I don't use them but the realtors seem to use quite a LOT...


Cherry 7up all over my laptop...NICE..lol:clap::clap::clap:


----------



## ARPPP

FremontREO said:


> This is the "realtors key"....
> Used very often. Cost is right:whistling
> I don't use them but the realtors seem to use quite a LOT...


 
Ooooo shame shame. I've got a 300 pound fella working for me. I call him my mack truck. Most doors do not stand a chance if he runs into them :boxing:


----------



## mtmtnman

ARPPP said:


> Ooooo shame shame. I've got a 300 pound fella working for me. I call him my mack truck. Most doors do not stand a chance if he runs into them :boxing:




If he ever finds out your tripping him when he's walking up to a door he will pound you to a pulp!!!!:laughing:


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> You forgot VISA and MASTERCARD. I get into most of my knoblocks with one or the other............................


I use that trick often but it chews the hell out of your cards! But that dont matter really....since they are all maxed out.


----------



## BPWY

Over 50% of the locks I run into are quickset types.
30 seconds to go thru one of them, or less.

Schlages can take longer. Drilling a deadbolt out always takes the longest.

One of the VERY RARE evictions I've done the deadbolt was being stubborn.
In front of the cop. It seemed to take forever. 

What do you use and where are you guys getting your drill bits?
The standard issue Lowes or Home Cheapo don't last very long.


----------



## BPWY

Another tip for gaining access for the newbs since I'm in such a generous mood.

Check ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the doors for unlocked.
Look for unlocked windows.



A property I worked over a yr ago had some thing like 4 or 5 doors on it. I checked all but one basement door. Finding all of them locked I chose what looked to be the easiest lock to dismantle and set to work on it. Between dull and broken drill bits it took a while to drill out the deadbolt.

Once inside and making sure every thing was secured .............. I find that the one door I didn't check was wide open to God and the world. And I had just wasted 30 minutes trying to dismantle a deadbolt.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Another tip for gaining access for the newbs since I'm in such a generous mood.
> 
> Check ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! the doors for unlocked.
> Look for unlocked windows.
> 
> 
> 
> A property I worked over a yr ago had some thing like 4 or 5 doors on it. I checked all but one basement door. Finding all of them locked I chose what looked to be the easiest lock to dismantle and set to work on it. Between dull and broken drill bits it took a while to drill out the deadbolt.
> 
> Once inside and making sure every thing was secured .............. I find that the one door I didn't check was wide open to God and the world. And I had just wasted 30 minutes trying to dismantle a deadbolt.


BPWY posted exactly what I was going to say. I can't tell you how many times I've found a property in an un-secure state.

For you newbies, make sure you photo and document this in your records and report it to whomever dispatched you. This is a CYA measure, because you have no idea what or who was in the dwelling before you got there. You don't want to be held liable for anything. Even when I have to gain entry I still check all places someone could have entered the dwelling and document it, you can't be to careful in this biz. I'm not paying for damages someone else caused or items someone else took.

This also applies every time I go to a property. Other workers, realtors etc.etc.etc. are famous for leaving things un-secure. Once again, you don't want to get blamed for anything. CYA,CYA,CYA,CYA......


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Over 50% of the locks I run into are quickset types.
> 30 seconds to go thru one of them, or less.
> 
> Schlages can take longer. Drilling a deadbolt out always takes the longest.
> 
> One of the VERY RARE evictions I've done the deadbolt was being stubborn.
> In front of the cop. It seemed to take forever.
> 
> What do you use and where are you guys getting your drill bits?
> The standard issue Lowes or Home Cheapo don't last very long.


There is a brand of drill bits from an industrial supply distributer called partsmaster. They are in their "Cryotool" line of products. They are very good. I've drilled through oil field pipe with one and it was almost like drilling into a soft 2x4. They are more expensive, but may be worth the extra cost. (Although, I've never drilled a lock with one.)

You could also try a TiN Coated bit that you can find at Grainger or other local industrial supply companies. In my opinion, the big box stores don't have the truly industrial cutting tools for metal. Just my $0.02.


----------



## BPWY

Does this washing machine look winterized to ya'll???
See the orange sticker on it?




I didn't think so. The plumbing has stickers all over it stating it was winterized.
I was asked to do a pressure test. Before starting I found 4 busted pipes.
Yup, holds 0.0 lbs of pressure and I didn't have to hook up the compressor.



The water valve was still zip tied shut so unless some one dewinterized it and then zip tied the valve again one would have to assume a very careless wint job by the previous contractor.


----------



## mtmtnman

2nd story windows are also a good place to enter. I carry a small pair of binoculars and if i see a window latch undone i get the folding ladder out and climb right in. As far as credit cards go all mine are chewed to chit but they are all paid off and canceled. Using credit to float this business is a good way to loose your own home. I find plenty of gift cards and satellite dish cards in trashouts and keep a collection of them around.


----------



## Guest

I don't know how many of you deal with condominiums that have the electronic card type lock systems on them. I got a tip one time from the maintinence man, use the "do not disturb" signs given out at hotels and condos. These plastic signs are the perfect length and flexibility to open these types of locks. Also work really well for typical latch locks AND you don't tear up your credit cards.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Does this washing machine look winterized to ya'll???
> See the orange sticker on it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think so. The plumbing has stickers all over it stating it was winterized.
> I was asked to do a pressure test. Before starting I found 4 busted pipes.
> Yup, holds 0.0 lbs of pressure and I didn't have to hook up the compressor.
> 
> 
> 
> The water valve was still zip tied shut so unless some one dewinterized it and then zip tied the valve again one would have to assume a very careless wint job by the previous contractor.


 
Hey, I'm looking for a new washer. Can you drain it, cleanit, deliver it for $50. { OH and I'll be taking a 50% discount}


----------



## BPWY

Yer too late. 
Loader at the landfill already crushed it.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Does this washing machine look winterized to ya'll???
> See the orange sticker on it?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I didn't think so. The plumbing has stickers all over it stating it was winterized.
> I was asked to do a pressure test. Before starting I found 4 busted pipes.
> Yup, holds 0.0 lbs of pressure and I didn't have to hook up the compressor.
> 
> 
> 
> The water valve was still zip tied shut so unless some one dewinterized it and then zip tied the valve again one would have to assume a very careless wint job by the previous contractor.


 safeguards finest. Lol


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> safeguards finest. Lol




:thumbup: :thumbup: :laughing:




Once in a while I work for them. When they can't get it done any other way. They call in the fixer. lol


And I am their finest :clap:..... with out the sarcasm. lol 

I have yet to find one of my wints freeze later.... as long as nobody de-wints them.


----------



## Guest

Talking winterizes....Just a heads up for the ones that aren't real familiar with wints:

When you are at a property with no electric ALWAYS put disclaimers on winterizing the wash machines or the diswashers. You can pour down into but without starting a cycle on the machine you can't wz the pump. Don't want them to come back to haunt ya when someone turns the water on and walla a mini-niagara.....


----------



## Guest

Also, shut the #%(#$*%^&#%$^^#)(*$&$ Hot Water Heater drain valve and boiler drain valve (if a wet system) after draining them. I've seen property ruined by a contractor not doing so and the main water isolation valve to the dwelling was leaking by. The water was running directly into top of the HWH and out the bottom into the dwelling. Oh, and in one situation they drained the gas fired HWH but NEVER shut it off:no:. Oh yeah, that was interesting


----------



## BPWY

DreamWeaver said:


> Also, shut the #%(#$*%^&#%$^^#)(*$&$ Hot Water Heater drain valve and boiler drain valve (if a wet system) after draining them. I've seen property ruined by a contractor not doing so and the main water isolation valve to the dwelling was leaking by. The water was running directly into top of the HWH and out the bottom into the dwelling. Oh, and in one situation they drained the gas fired HWH but NEVER shut it off:no:. Oh yeah, that was interesting











These are the reasons that the nationals are wanting meters pulled.
Or the incoming supply lines cut and capped.
I can't say that I blame them. Cutting and capping and then repairing them if the house sells is far cheaper than fixing water damage.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> These are the reasons that the nationals are wanting meters pulled.
> Or the incoming supply lines cut and capped.
> I can't say that I blame them. Cutting and capping and then repairing them if the house sells is far cheaper than fixing water damage.


 
You got that right.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> These are the reasons that the nationals are wanting meters pulled.
> Or the incoming supply lines cut and capped.
> I can't say that I blame them. Cutting and capping and then repairing them if the house sells is far cheaper than fixing water damage.


 
You're spot on.... 

We aren't allowed to touch the meters here. Only the municipality can.

But the real answer to their problem is to have competent people doing the work. Not the lowest bidder that was the ticket boy at the drive in movies last week. Oh, and a scooter with a Red Rider wagon tied to the back of it should be a warning signarty:


----------



## Guest

GardnerHandyman said:


> Hi Dan, We have done several jobs for Floridas Finest Industries and have a great working relationship with them


 Good luck getting your money. I couldn't do some work for them so I passed it on to someone else. That was in October, they did alot of work for them and was promised fast payment. Guess what they haven't been paid and now get hung up on when they call about payment.


----------



## BPWY

DreamWeaver said:


> You're spot on....
> 
> We aren't allowed to touch the meters here. Only the municipality can.
> 
> But the real answer to their problem is to have competent people doing the work. Not the lowest bidder that was the ticket boy at the drive in movies last week. Oh, and a scooter with a Red Rider wagon tied to the back of it should be a warning signarty:






In just a couple of short sentences you've summed up pretty much the majority discussion of this particular thread.

The old adage "you get what you pay for" applies even in 2010/2011.
It was true when our grannies were young, and its true in the modern age.

I wonder if the banks and nationals have put pen to paper and discovered yet that their "saving money" on the front end by hiring the cheapest schlub they can find off craigslist hasn't paid off in terms of real money saved when the substandard work ends up costing them TONS more money on the back end to get things corrected.


----------



## Guest

willabshear6974 said:


> Good luck getting your money. I couldn't do some work for them so I passed it on to someone else. That was in October, they did alot of work for them and was promised fast payment. Guess what they haven't been paid and now get hung up on when they call about payment.


We did 3 wints for them about 4 months ago, got paid when they said they would pay but have'nt heard from them since


----------



## trashman

*question*



FremontREO said:


> Our realtor was asked to start hiring all the lockchange/wz/cleanout crews to complete for Altisource/Ocwen. They said that they are not going to use the P&P crews here anylonger. Doing my first one Monday.
> Realtor is doing the Initial Occupancy then invoices for all the P&P work. Another thing weird.....no 10digit digital lockbox.
> Ocwen/Altisource signage though.
> 
> Does anyone anywhere knows what is going on anymore:no:
> 
> All-Craft we use a variety of methods to gain entry including: realtors key, channel locks and drill with a good bit......


 in what state do you work from? realtors are not contractors and in california as well as many other states, they cannot sub out the p&p work! that would be illegal as they would be working as a unlicensed contractor, just the yard cares in a year would put them over the handyman limit! they cannot do any of the repairs or the lock changes or sub the work out! unless they are licensed contractors! realtors should stick to selling homes and let the experianced ,licensed contractors do the preservation and repair work! as a handyman, they can only due up to 500.00 work per property per year!, if they are subbing out the initial services bundle, they are over there limit, and acting as a illegal contractor! i wonder how upset the realtors would get if i started selling homes? i cannot sell homes as a general contractor, they should not be allowed to act as illegal contractors by doing or subbing out contractor work!


----------



## mtmtnman

trashman said:


> in what state do you work from? realtors are not contractors and in california as well as many other states, they cannot sub out the p&p work! that would be illegal as they would be working as a unlicensed contractor, just the yard cares in a year would put them over the handyman limit! they cannot do any of the repairs or the lock changes or sub the work out! unless they are licensed contractors! realtors should stick to selling homes and let the experianced ,licensed contractors do the preservation and repair work! as a handyman, they can only due up to 500.00 work per property per year!, if they are subbing out the initial services bundle, they are over there limit, and acting as a illegal contractor! i wonder how upset the realtors would get if i started selling homes? i cannot sell homes as a general contractor, they should not be allowed to act as illegal contractors by doing or subbing out contractor work!



They are hiring for the bank. The Realtor is responsible for all aspects of the property once listed. If the property is not winterized and it freezes because the heat was not activated guess who foots the bill?? Not the bank! I for one am VERY glad that the Realtors are taking back control as they are the "boots on the ground" compared to some national 1000 miles away and they are able to use common sense on a property. No offence but Cali has way to many laws and 730+ more new ones went into effect at the 1st of the year. I'm betting somewhere this will not past muster in that state but oh well..................


----------



## APlusPPGroup

trashman said:


> .......realtors should stick to selling homes and let the experianced ,licensed contractors do the preservation and repair work!


I'll bet they'd love to have you go directly to the bank and not have the added responsibility of having to handle cleanup and repairs. That way, instead of making sure contractors are doing their job, they can concentrate on selling houses.

When you get the bank's attention and start working directly with them, be sure to let us know how it goes.

Linda


----------



## Guest

HOT off the Scamguard press.......
_CY adjustments

Please try the following:

1. When a crew arrives at a property, once it is determined there are no
personals present, before any work is done, go room to room and move ALL
debris in each room to the center of the room, in one pile.
2. Once all rooms are done in the above fashion, take a photo of the
pile from the front, left and right. Place a person in the photo so our
Client can have a gauge, and in fact, if that person is holding out a
yard stick it will help even more. Now you will have 3D photos which
will clearly show exactly the debris in each room.
3. This above process (minus photos) will typically take a crew of 3-4
approx 20-30 minutes.
4. NOW when the crew begins to bag the debris, they will be working in
one location, picking up momentum, and not walking from debris to
debris, therefore reducing the hours in which the trash out is
completed. Most Vendors state that this process will reduce their hours
by a minimum of 1/3rd. I am sure this is once the process is followed a
couple times though to become routine.
5. This process will typically result in finding the Safety Hazards and
other conditions better by the crew too, as the property will be a bit
easier to assess.
Any Vendor who uses the above process has virtually eliminated their
adjustments as well as cut their trash out man hours by 1/3rd._


----------



## APlusPPGroup

somewherein815 said:


> HOT off the Scamguard press.......
> _CY adjustments_
> 
> _Please try the following:_
> 
> _1. When a crew arrives at a property, once it is determined there are no_
> _personals present, before any work is done, go room to room and move ALL_
> _debris in each room to the center of the room, in one pile._
> _2. Once all rooms are done in the above fashion, take a photo of the_
> _pile from the front, left and right. Place a person in the photo so our_
> _Client can have a gauge, and in fact, if that person is holding out a_
> _yard stick it will help even more. Now you will have 3D photos which_
> _will clearly show exactly the debris in each room._
> _3. This above process (minus photos) will typically take a crew of 3-4_
> _approx 20-30 minutes._
> _4. NOW when the crew begins to bag the debris, they will be working in_
> _one location, picking up momentum, and not walking from debris to_
> _debris, therefore reducing the hours in which the trash out is_
> _completed. Most Vendors state that this process will reduce their hours_
> _by a minimum of 1/3rd. I am sure this is once the process is followed a_
> _couple times though to become routine._
> _5. This process will typically result in finding the Safety Hazards and_
> _other conditions better by the crew too, as the property will be a bit_
> _easier to assess._
> _Any Vendor who uses the above process has virtually eliminated their_
> _adjustments as well as cut their trash out man hours by 1/3rd._


LMAO. Gee, now they can handle the debris twice. Makes perfect sense to me...... how totally efficient! Wish I'd thought of that.:laughing:

The nationals have run out of ideas to overwork the vendors, I think. But *THIS* is the best they can do?

Linda


----------



## Guest

Hey there, I know its been discussed in short. I have a fujifilm waterproof, freeze proof camera I use (z33wp) I have date and time set up but it doesnt stamp it on my photos for my client. I need to have this in my photos also resizing them to the typical 600x480. Is there a free download you guys use for this? If so can you please tell me the name or direct me to their site. Thank you


----------



## APlusPPGroup

ARpreservation said:


> Hey there, I know its been discussed in short. I have a fujifilm waterproof, freeze proof camera I use (z33wp) I have date and time set up but it doesnt stamp it on my photos for my client. I need to have this in my photos also resizing them to the typical 600x480. Is there a free download you guys use for this? If so can you please tell me the name or direct me to their site. Thank you


http://download.cnet.com/Photo-Dater/3000-2192_4-10303277.html

This is the fastest and easiest to use. 

Some of the guys will recommend Fastone but you'll have to get the link from them. I don't have it anymore.

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> LMAO. Gee, now they can handle the debris twice. Makes perfect sense to me...... how totally efficient! Wish I'd thought of that.:laughing:
> 
> The nationals have run out of ideas to overwork the vendors, I think. But *THIS* is the best they can do?
> 
> Linda


Look at it this way.....you can gather up all the debris on a I.S. and some other schmuck gets your bid approval! Who loves to work for free? I DO I DO ! !


----------



## APlusPPGroup

somewherein815 said:


> Look at it this way.....you can gather up all the debris on a I.S. and some other schmuck gets your bid approval! Who loves to work for free? I DO I DO ! !


LOL. Document, document, document!!!! JUSTIFY your numbers so the guy who gets the work doesn't have to.

Linda


----------



## Guest

trashman said:


> in what state do you work from? realtors are not contractors and in california as well as many other states, they cannot sub out the p&p work! that would be illegal as they would be working as a unlicensed contractor, just the yard cares in a year would put them over the handyman limit! they cannot do any of the repairs or the lock changes or sub the work out! unless they are licensed contractors! realtors should stick to selling homes and let the experianced ,licensed contractors do the preservation and repair work! as a handyman, they can only due up to 500.00 work per property per year!, if they are subbing out the initial services bundle, they are over there limit, and acting as a illegal contractor! i wonder how upset the realtors would get if i started selling homes? i cannot sell homes as a general contractor, they should not be allowed to act as illegal contractors by doing or subbing out contractor work!


 
I hear your frustration but the realtor is being only an extension of the bank. We are not working as a sub for the realtor. The realtor makes no profit off of our work but does get paid additional funds to manage the home. 
Kinda like the service companies relationship except the realtor actually is looking at the home and is local. 
I love working with the realtors (most of the time) ONLY if they have some common sense.


----------



## thanohano44

somewherein815 said:


> Look at it this way.....you can gather up all the debris on a I.S. and some other schmuck gets your bid approval! Who loves to work for free? I DO I DO ! !


This is just ridiculous!! Altisource telling us where to buy our locks, Safeguard trying to tell us how to handle debris (again!!). What's next?


----------



## Guest

somewherein815 said:


> HOT off the Scamguard press.......
> _CY adjustments_
> 
> _Please try the following:_
> 
> _1. When a crew arrives at a property, once it is determined there are no_
> _personals present, before any work is done, go room to room and move ALL_
> _debris in each room to the center of the room, in one pile._
> _2. Once all rooms are done in the above fashion, take a photo of the_
> _pile from the front, left and right. Place a person in the photo so our_
> _Client can have a gauge, and in fact, if that person is holding out a_
> _yard stick it will help even more. Now you will have 3D photos which_
> _will clearly show exactly the debris in each room._
> _3. This above process (minus photos) will typically take a crew of 3-4_
> _approx 20-30 minutes._
> _4. NOW when the crew begins to bag the debris, they will be working in_
> _one location, picking up momentum, and not walking from debris to_
> _debris, therefore reducing the hours in which the trash out is_
> _completed. Most Vendors state that this process will reduce their hours_
> _by a minimum of 1/3rd. I am sure this is once the process is followed a_
> _couple times though to become routine._
> _5. This process will typically result in finding the Safety Hazards and_
> _other conditions better by the crew too, as the property will be a bit_
> _easier to assess._
> _Any Vendor who uses the above process has virtually eliminated their_
> _adjustments as well as cut their trash out man hours by 1/3rd._


 
I don't work with this company anylonger for their stupidity but *Please tell my you are kidding?*


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> LOL. Document, document, document!!!! JUSTIFY your numbers so the guy who gets the work doesn't have to.
> 
> Linda


Meaning what, exactly?

Take *more* pictures? Explain how we keep our books? Detail why our bottom line is what it is? 

Or do you mean that we should itemize everything so that Safeguard sees what we are charging, why we are charging it, and how we came up with the figures?

I acknowledge that there is a difference between transparency and micromanaging, but exactly where is the line drawn?


----------



## BPWY

somewherein815 said:


> HOT off the Scamguard press.......
> _CY adjustments.........................
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Any Vendor who uses the above process has virtually eliminated their
> adjustments as well as cut their trash out man hours by 1/3rd._







The nationals are very adept at blowing smoke.

I for one don't believe em.


----------



## mtmtnman

ARpreservation said:


> Hey there, I know its been discussed in short. I have a fujifilm waterproof, freeze proof camera I use (z33wp) I have date and time set up but it doesnt stamp it on my photos for my client. I need to have this in my photos also resizing them to the typical 600x480. Is there a free download you guys use for this? If so can you please tell me the name or direct me to their site. Thank you



http://www.faststone.org/FSResizerDownload.htm


Linda's link works fine too but Fastone resizes and datestamps in one click. Usually about 30 seconds for 100 pics................


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> I don't work with this company anylonger for their stupidity but *Please tell my you are kidding?*


No sir. I may joke around on here a little bit but this is 100% true.


----------



## Guest

I Did presevation work for 3 months. I'm done with it. What a bunch of BS. I don't need it!

www.thesidingguy.com


----------



## Guest

Do they honestly believe it is even possible to purchase and install a sump pump for 130.00??


----------



## mtmtnman

barefootlc said:


> Do they honestly believe it is even possible to purchase and install a sump pump for 130.00??



$29 bucks at Harbor Freight. Still doesn't cut it after driving to property, installing pump misc. fittings Ect. and driving home.


----------



## Guest

*Rhode Island*

Anyone working in Rhode Island doing P/P ? If so are you working for a national such Cyprexx/ocwen Altisource,Asons,etc...any problems? Thanks


----------



## Guest

barefootlc said:


> Do they honestly believe it is even possible to purchase and install a sump pump for 130.00??


if you dont do it sombady else will

www.thesidingguy.com


----------



## Guest

Your licensed plumber? $130? The permit will be half that amount at least. If you want to do the work unlicensed then there can be no complaints.


----------



## Guest

Depends on the situation. 

I have installed a few sump pumps where the city didn't require a permit or a plumber to install. First one I called the city to get the permit and they told me they didn't need to issue a permit. The others I had a plumber come check out and he told me the same thing. 

They have all been in window wells with the discharge just running to a section of the lawn away from the house. Pumps on the inside of the house are whole different ball of wax.

Mountain Man is right, you can get a pump for $30 but I don't want the liability of a flood resting on Harbor Freight quality. $130 will just buy a decent pump and $200ish to get a good one. 

$130 to buy the pump and install is a losing job... So surprising since everything else is so profitable.:whistling


----------



## Guest

Mountain Man is right, you can get a pump for $30 but I don't want the liability of a flood resting on Harbor Freight quality. $130 will just buy a decent pump and $200ish to get a good one. 

$130 to buy the pump and install is a losing job... So surprising since everything else is so profitable.:whistling[/quote]
Will you be held responsible if the pump you install fails at a later date?

I've come to realize the companies that are paying most of us don't really care if the work is done right or not just as long as you send the right photos to get the mortgage companies to pay them their happy.
Was contacted by a company today that wanted grass cut and maid service for $40.00 per property. When I declined was asked if I thought I was too good to work for $15.00 and hour. I said I couldn't find $15.00 an hour in those numbers anywhere. I was told $10.00 for expences and 1 hour to clean walls ceilings and floors, counter tops, ceiling fans, mop all rooms that were not carpet and wipe out the windows. And 1 hour to mow the grass, do the weed whacking, clean the clippings off the walks and drive, pick up all debris in the yard. It was also mandatory that you upload at least 150 photos per property documenting your work. Just how many people have their forks in these work orders before the man that buys the materials, pays the insurance, and does all the work gets his piece of the pie? How many of them are making much more than he is for just pushing the button on their computer?


----------



## Guest

I was told 10.00 for expences and That left $15.00 for an hour on the house cleaning and $15.00 for and hour mowing the grass. and it was manditory you send 150 photos showing before during and after work done. sounds like taking pictures is all the time you had.


----------



## mtmtnman

rafterrat said:


> Was contacted by a company today that wanted grass cut and maid service for $40.00 per property. When I declined was asked if I thought I was too good to work for $15.00 and hour.




"AND THAT'S WHEN THE FIGHT STARTED!!" I would have come unglued at that point. They are collecting AT LEAST 5 times that if they are working directly for the bank and even if they are working 1 step down they are collecting 3X what they offered you! PLEASE post this companies name so we know who they are!!


----------



## Guest

No company name was given just Paul Marsala. A real &ic& head.


----------



## Guest

He said if I wasn't serious about working to not reply to adds for work. I told him if he wasn't going to be serious about the pay don't post the adds.


----------



## mtmtnman

rafterrat said:


> No company name was given just Paul Marsala. A real &ic& head.




You got the phone # he called you from? Was it 827 - 6644(left out area code)


----------



## Guest

Anyone heard of National Field Services Out of Florida?
I received a contractors packet from them today but when I email and ask what their % was they said they would have to find out and get back with me later.
Shouldn't everyboby that works there know that?


----------



## Guest

No but that doesn't mean anything these days


----------



## BPWY

rafterrat said:


> Anyone heard of National Field Services Out of Florida?
> I received a contractors packet from them today but when I email and ask what their % was they said they would have to find out and get back with me later.
> Shouldn't everyboby that works there know that?






I wouldn't even think about working for a company like that.
There are too many red flags!


----------



## mtmtnman

Anyone ever heard of these guys out of Phoenix?? A friend of mine sent me the info asking about them.

http://www.freemanbuiltreo.com/

Bank Management has changed the way they will pay. We are pleased to announce the launch of an Exciting New Program designed to Eliminates individual bidding and approval process. These services below are approved at the following pricing to be done immediately without submitting a bid to Freeman Built.
SECURING/ LOCK INSTALLATION $100.00
TRASH OUT $250.00 (trying to find out the Cu-Yd cap)
JANITORIAL $85.00
WEED AND TRIM/LAWN MAINTENANCE $50.00
INITIAL INSPECTION $15.00
Benefits to the vendors include:
– Increases the opportunity for vendor profitability.
– Eliminates individual bidding and approval process.
– Places more control of scheduling activities with the vendor.
– Reduces the overall number of trips to a property and reduces fuel consumption.
– Consolidates vendor activities.
– Enables the vendor to identify additional Work Items necessary for preservation activities.
– Encourages greater vendor ownership in property’s overall management.
– Improves vendor ratings with Freeman Built, Bank and shortens completion times.


----------



## Guest

rafterrat said:


> I was told 10.00 for expences and That left $15.00 for an hour on the house cleaning and $15.00 for and hour mowing the grass. and it was manditory you send 150 photos showing before during and after work done. sounds like taking pictures is all the time you had.


Wow! Don't know about anyone else, but I don't think you could barely drive to a property and back home/office for $40.00. Diesel fuel is $3.29 (the cheapest I found yesterday), and I spent $90.00 alone yesterday and $50.00 the day before on fuel. Not to mention, insurance, dump fees, wages, and certainly don't forget Uncles Sam's slice of the pie.:furious: Now granted, I was pulling about 10,000 lbs and driving quite a distance, but fuel, insurance, vehicles and equipment are real expenses.


----------



## mtmtnman

EZ Land said:


> Wow! Don't know about anyone else, but I don't think you could barely drive to a property and back home/office for $40.00. Diesel fuel is $3.29 (the cheapest I found yesterday), and I spent $90.00 alone yesterday and $50.00 the day before on fuel. Not to mention, insurance, dump fees, wages, and certainly don't forget Uncles Sam's slice of the pie.:furious: Now granted, I was pulling about 10,000 lbs and driving quite a distance, but fuel, insurance, vehicles and equipment are real expenses.



There looking for that bicycle contractor mentioned a few pages back!!!:clap::clap:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> Anyone ever heard of these guys out of Phoenix?? A friend of mine sent me the info asking about them.
> 
> http://www.freemanbuiltreo.com/
> 
> Bank Management has changed the way they will pay. We are pleased to announce the launch of an Exciting New Program designed to Eliminates individual bidding and approval process. These services below are approved at the following pricing to be done immediately without submitting a bid to Freeman Built.
> SECURING/ LOCK INSTALLATION $100.00
> TRASH OUT $250.00 (trying to find out the Cu-Yd cap)
> JANITORIAL $85.00
> WEED AND TRIM/LAWN MAINTENANCE $50.00
> INITIAL INSPECTION $15.00
> Benefits to the vendors include:
> – Increases the opportunity for vendor profitability.
> – Eliminates individual bidding and approval process.
> – Places more control of scheduling activities with the vendor.
> – Reduces the overall number of trips to a property and reduces fuel consumption.
> – Consolidates vendor activities.
> – Enables the vendor to identify additional Work Items necessary for preservation activities.
> – Encourages greater vendor ownership in property’s overall management.
> – Improves vendor ratings with Freeman Built, Bank and shortens completion times.


They are outsourcing Altisource jobs. The verbiage was taken from Altisource's recent e-mail to its vendors.

The cap on the debris is 60 cy. After 60 cy, you can bid it. Otherwise, 60 cy is included in the low payout.

IMO - it's not worth it. Altisource's bundled package is okay if there's very little debris to remove but Freeman's rates are way lower than the package price. Freeman is keeping over 50%.

Linda


----------



## mtmtnman

a1propertyclean said:


> They are outsourcing Altisource jobs. The verbiage was taken from Altisource's recent e-mail to its vendors.
> 
> The cap on the debris, so I've heard, is 60 cy. After 60 cy, you can bid it. Otherwise, 60 cy is included in the low payout.
> 
> Linda


60 CY for $250?????????


----------



## APlusPPGroup

mtmtnman said:


> 60 CY for $250?????????


Exactly! I just added to my post above.

Linda


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> Anyone ever heard of these guys out of Phoenix?? A friend of mine sent me the info asking about them.
> 
> 
> 
> Bank Management has changed the way they will pay. We are pleased to announce the launch of an Exciting New Program designed to Eliminates individual bidding and approval process. These services below are approved at the following pricing to be done immediately without submitting a bid to Freeman Built.
> SECURING/ LOCK INSTALLATION $100.00
> TRASH OUT $250.00 (trying to find out the Cu-Yd cap)
> JANITORIAL $85.00
> WEED AND TRIM/LAWN MAINTENANCE $50.00
> INITIAL INSPECTION $15.00
> Benefits to the vendors include:
> – Increases the opportunity for vendor profitability.
> – Eliminates individual bidding and approval process.
> – Places more control of scheduling activities with the vendor.
> – Reduces the overall number of trips to a property and reduces fuel consumption.
> – Consolidates vendor activities.
> – Enables the vendor to identify additional Work Items necessary for preservation activities.
> – Encourages greater vendor ownership in property’s overall management.
> – Improves vendor ratings with Freeman Built, Bank and shortens completion times.


First, I haven't heard of them. But, I have some questions. It appears that they want to pay $500.00 for all the work listed, correct? 

Sounds somewhat fair, but what scares me (and I'm sorta new at this), is that not every house is the same, some are easier/cleaner, yards are smaller and easier to cut.... (I mean, how much do lawn companies charge to do a cut and trim on a regular basis? Around here, they charge about an avg of $40 per lawn, but they swoop in with about 3 guys and do everything in about 20-30 minutes, and are then on they're way. They probably cut about 15-20 yards a day in the peak season. But, these are lawns that are regularly maintained every 1-2 weeks... not some lawn with 4ft high weeds and grass, with crap strewn everywhere.)

If there were some provisions to protect the vendor in extenuating circumstances, and If I was guaranteed 8-10 properties per week, I'd consider it... maybe. Am I way off, here? Is that even possible with these companies? Seems that they are wanting all the "take" and none of the "give". But, they sure dress up their little proposal, with "exciting new program" and "more ownership," "more opportuinties".... Sounds almost like they are trying to sell a t*rd.... They can paint it, pour some perfume on it....but in the end, it's still a t*urd.

My niche, so far in this business has been rural large properties that are really bad... Maybe I'm the sucker that'll drive 150 miles to a property out in the sticks to do a disgusting property. I don't know...so far I've made out pretty good. I don't mind getting dirty if the pay is decent, and I don't mind some heavy lifting. I'm happy to have left the corporate world and get my hands dirty again.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

EZ Land said:


> First, I haven't heard of them. But, I have some questions. It appears that they want to pay $500.00 for all the work listed, correct?
> 
> Sounds somewhat fair...................


It's not even somewhat fair. 

The bundle they're selling you is paying over $1,000 to them. You are getting less than 50% of the job's value to do an initial grass cut, sales clean janitorial, and remove up to 60 cubic yards of debris and hazards.

The initial inspection itself pays $15. They're not making any money on that but it's over and above the job itself so you're only getting $485 for the work.

:thumbdown

Linda


----------



## Guest

mtmtnman said:


> 60 CY for $250?????????


One of our local landfills charges per cubic yard- which is $8.00 per yard.

60 x $8 = $480...

Or, they'll also charge by the ton- $35/ton with a 2 ton minimum. 

60 yards of household debris could weigh easily 4-5 tons ($140-$175)...before fuel and labor to load. I'd say no profit in that.... 

I'm sure they say, "you make it up though, on the jobs that just have a 4-5 cu yards...." Yeah, you allllwayyys make it up.... not!

I need to go, It's raining and icing here, so I'm kinda stuck in the office today, but I should go before I go "office space" on my computer. :hammer:


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> It's not even somewhat fair.
> 
> The bundle they're selling you is paying over $1,000 to them. You are getting less than 50% of the job's value to do an initial grass cut, sales clean janitorial, and remove up to 60 cubic yards of debris and hazards.
> 
> The initial inspection itself pays $15. They're not making any money on that but it's over and above the job itself so you're only getting $485 for the work.
> 
> :thumbdown
> 
> Linda


Thank you for noting that... that's the info I was looking for... the more i looked at it, that's what i thought....


----------



## APlusPPGroup

You're welcome, EZ Land. I just hate it when I see vendors being taken advantage of so, if I know what the situation is, I'll post it.

Linda


----------



## Guest

That company FSI ( field services international ) someone asked about a few threads back is also subbing out Altisource ( Ocwen ) work. The e mail I got sounded pretty good till I called and got the all to familiar accent. When probed they said the work was through Altisource at their rates less FSI's cut. WOW, I did'nt even bother to ask what would be left for the vendor. Sounds like too many "legit contractors" are turning Altisource down because of the pricing and business practices so they may be trying to get some vendors to do the work through a different company name.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Altisource's rates are low to reasonable. We decline orders that are low and accept the ones that are reasonable.

The problem with other Altisource vendors is that they cut everything to a fixed rate [far lower than the original rate from the client], then take a discount off of that. 

That's where we are different. We take a percentage off the top but we take it off the full rate. We don't sub from the sub of a sub..... too many fingers in the pie and no one makes any money.

I've got a client right now trying to get us to take care of Altisource orders at a package rate of $600. It just isn't going to happen and our client will ultimately have to decline the order, which Altisource may [or may not] reassign to us and, if they do, we can offer it at full rate to our vendor.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thanks Linda
It's refreshing to know there are reputable people doing the right thing.
I definetly got the impression from my conversation with them that Altisource is the puppet master behind this FSI company. I could be wrong but......my trust in someone's word has greatly diminished since dealing with theses nationals.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

As far as I know, FSI is only a vendor for Altisource, not another branch of the company itself. 

Linda


----------



## Racerx

Here's a question that my wife posed to me the other day that left me stumped "so what happens to the digital lock you install after the property is sold?,does the buyer just keep it?" , too which my reply was :blink: .
I understand that when a property is sold anything on the property at the time of closing is part of the deal, but she did have a point what's the new homeowner going to do with a 70.00 digital lock?.


----------



## brm1109

*Is it just me?*

So I received an order for a winterization. Too much snow on the ground to get my equipment in and out so I put a bid for snow removal.
So now the bid was denied and no winterization wasn't done.
How much you want to bet that the property will freeze and cause more damage then the price of the snow removal.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

All-Craft said:


> .... what's the new homeowner going to do with a 70.00 digital lock?.


Mechanical locks are usually re-keyed or changed and electronic locks can be re-programmed. Lockboxes are typically removed by the realtors and agents, then recoded and reused on other properties.

Linda


----------



## ARPPP

mtmtnman said:


> Anyone ever heard of these guys out of Phoenix?? A friend of mine sent me the info asking about them.
> 
> http://www.freemanbuiltreo.com/
> 
> Bank Management has changed the way they will pay. We are pleased to announce the launch of an Exciting New Program designed to Eliminates individual bidding and approval process. These services below are approved at the following pricing to be done immediately without submitting a bid to Freeman Built.
> SECURING/ LOCK INSTALLATION $100.00
> TRASH OUT $250.00 (trying to find out the Cu-Yd cap)
> JANITORIAL $85.00
> WEED AND TRIM/LAWN MAINTENANCE $50.00
> INITIAL INSPECTION $15.00
> Benefits to the vendors include:
> – Increases the opportunity for vendor profitability.
> – Eliminates individual bidding and approval process.
> – Places more control of scheduling activities with the vendor.
> – Reduces the overall number of trips to a property and reduces fuel consumption.
> – Consolidates vendor activities.
> – Enables the vendor to identify additional Work Items necessary for preservation activities.
> – Encourages greater vendor ownership in property’s overall management.
> – Improves vendor ratings with Freeman Built, Bank and shortens completion times.


They must be an Altisource vendor. The verbage is the exact same from Altisource for there initial bundle package of $1110 for the same work. Which, by the way I am wondering if anyone has ever received one. I have done several inspections and received no bundle packages yet. 

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


----------



## Guest

Hi I worked for them from June til Dec. when they lost the Houston area contract,was a good working relationship as I was paid for the jobs and reimbursed for fuel costs;but I don't know what's going on I've been trying to contact the old Houston, TX region coordinator Tori just to get my 1099 info but no answer so I would be cautious. I've been looking up information to try to find the company's EIN and any contact other info but no such luck.


----------



## ARPPP

*Companies that have stiffed you*

Hey,

I have a thought 
Would some of you regulars, those who have been on the forum and doing property preservation for awhile, care to share with other regulars the companies that have stiffed you over the past year. I am thinking this could help a lot of us out so that the companies don't continue to use us anymore. I am sure they will find someone else, but perhaps not one of us that are sharing information on this forum. We could do it by posting directly to this site or sending messages to all that are willing to participate. I hate to see another one of us get shafted because we didn't know. I would only want to see legitimate, followed work order, sent in correct photos and now no one returns calls or emails regarding pay. Let's say at least 90 days late.

Thoughts please :detective:


----------



## ARPPP

tntxfromnc said:


> Hi I worked for them from June til Dec. when they lost the Houston area contract,was a good working relationship as I was paid for the jobs and reimbursed for fuel costs;but I don't know what's going on I've been trying to contact the old Houston, TX region coordinator Tori just to get my 1099 info but no answer so I would be cautious. I've been looking up information to try to find the company's EIN and any contact other info but no such luck.


Who is the "them" you are referencing in this post?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

ARPPP said:


> Would some of you regulars, those who have been on the forum and doing property preservation for awhile, care to share with other regulars the companies that have stiffed you over the past year.


You won't find too many who are willing to post who they've been stiffed by. Some of them are probably still attempting to collect and negative feedback has the potential to hurt their case, not to mention there could be backlash and counterclaims from libelous or slanderous comments.

I don't see any such lists on the horizon here at CT. Most members will simply post links to rip-off reports or headlines/articles to make others aware of what's going on.

Linda


----------



## Guest

brm1109 said:


> So I received an order for a winterization. Too much snow on the ground to get my equipment in and out so I put a bid for snow removal.
> So now the bid was denied and no winterization wasn't done.
> How much you want to bet that the property will freeze and cause more damage then the price of the snow removal.


 
BRM1109, 
This is the classic dilemma and you gotta "know" your companies practices toward the contractor. I KNOW its hard to ever know any company:whistling

Here is what has been happening to several guys we know:

1) No access to complete the winterize due to the snow and you can't get the equipment to the house and there is no off street parking.

Risk: if the property freezes after YOU had a work order to winterize and you did not do it, even though you had no access, then you risk paying for any damages. 

Your outs: Go into the home without any equipment and at a minimum turn the water off at the meter so it won't flood, The property may already be froze or go ahead and complete a winterize and don't date your pics. This way YOU know there won't/isn't any damages THEN bid the snow removal. YOU may or YOU may not get the approval but its worth it compared to paying for the damages. 

This winter is killing all of us. No parking in the alleys, streets are not wide enough to park on the street, without your mirrors getting hit AND the desk jockeys don't care.


----------



## Guest

We received a "rush" order to go do a snow removal at a property. It was a 100 mile drive out to the hole (literaly, it was a nasty mining town in the middle of the Utah desert, about any other time I love heading out there) just to discover that there was no snow. 

Got to a house we had winterized once but someone had decided it would be a decent place to set up camp for a while and had turned the water back on while they were using the house. It had burst pipes all over, plumber came and checked it out to give me a bid of $800 for all repairs. Our bid to national read "repair 7 breaks in various pipes throughout plumbing system". The house had 2 bathrooms, kitchen and laundry. There was a break leading to each bathroom, the kitchen and the water heater. 

The approval we received back read "bid to cut and cap 7 pipes for $150 approved", complete pressure test and winterization. HUH??? 

I responded that I would not complete since it wasn't my bid they approved and doing it their way would make it unable to be winterized.

I have been loving the "thaw frozen house" bid approvals lately. We have been getting a couple a week. 

I have had 5 different REO agents I work with tell me I better have a dozen extra guys hired by April cuz things are going to get uber busy. I hope they are right.


----------



## Guest

That bites when that happens. I hope your Reo agents are right but I've heard that a hundred times this year thaws stink for us. Low low approvals and we are having to decline 90%. All with the excuse "Hud cut the bid ". I'm not doing any work that is a break even at best. Past years avg was $840/floor and this year is half that at best and we have to pull temporary heating permits. Stinks!


----------



## Guest

Heres one for ya...
A few weeks ago we were sent to a multi unit property to secure 2 out of 4 units. Got sent back out last week to secure the 3rd unit. Theses are REO so agent was present. The third unit had old mattresses and couches in it and other house hold crap that they are deeming personal property, and they put an 18 day hold on everything inside. We were back out there today to secure the 4th unit. The company we work with was "sharing the love" and had given quite a few of our monthly janitorials to another contractor including the units we had just done initial services on. They happened to be at the property same time we were and we saw them hauling out all the mattresses. The ones that were placed on an 18 day hold. That we have bids in to remove. Went over and asked the newbie, you guys getting paid to remove those? She said, "I sure hope so!"
All her work order was for was a monthly janitorial. And she was packing her truck full of all this crap. Thats what they get for taking away our work!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

She's obviously very new and it sounds like she might become real experienced real fast about breaking a redemption order.

Sounds like your client isn't very loyal to you so, no doubt, the newbie is not the one at fault. I think, in this case, I might have pointed out the redemption order and explained personal property to her.

Then I would talk to the client about their assignment of work orders. 

But that's just me.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Pinelands Preservation out of Sacramento, CA.


----------



## BPWY

CHI-CAW-GO

First you must learn to pronounce the city name. It is Chi-caw-go, assuming you live north of Roosevelt Rd. , otherwise it's Chi-ca-ga.

Next, if your road map is more than a few weeks old, throw it out and buy a new one. If in Naperville , and your map is one day old, then it is already obsolete.

Forget the traffic rules you learned elsewhere. Chicago has its own version of traffic rules: "Hold on and pray." 

There is no such thing as a dangerous high-speed chase in Chicago . We all drive like that.

All directions start with, "I-94." I-94 has no beginning and no end. It just IS.

The morning rush hour is from 5 to 11. The evening rush hour is from 2 to 8. 

Friday's rush hour starts Thursday morning.

If you actually stop at a yellow light, you will be rear ended, cussed out and possibly shot. 

When you are the first one on the starting line, count to five when the light turns green before going to avoid crashing with all the drivers running the red light in cross-traffic.

Construction on Northwest Tollway is a way of life and a permanent form of entertainment. 

We had so much fun with that we have added the Elgin-O'Hare and the I-355 to the mix. (Incidentally the 'Elgin-O'Hare' does NOT go to either Elgin or O'Hare.)

All unexplainable sights are explained by the phrase, "Oh, we're in Cicero !"

If someone actually has their turn signal on, it is probably a factory defect. 

Car horns are actually "Road Rage" indicators. 

All old ladies with blue hair in Buicks, Caddys, or Lincolns have the right of way. Period.

First Ave, LaGrange Rd, NW Highway - and more, all mysteriously change names as you cross intersections 

If you stop to ask directions on the West side you'd better be armed.

A trip across town (from The Lake to the West Side ) will take a minimum of two hours. 

Although many expressways (they are not freeways), have posted speed limits of 55, the minimum acceptable speed on expressways is 85. Anything less... get the hell out of the left lane. 

The wrought iron on windows in Englewood , Lawndale and Austin are not ornamental.

The Eisenhower (Ike) (formerly Congress expressway) is our daily version of NASCAR. 

If it's 100+ degrees, it's "Taste of Chicago."

If it's 10 degrees and sleeting/snowing, it's opening day at Wrigley

IF IT'S 60 DEGREES IN APRIL IT'S OPENING DAY AT SOX PARK


If it's rained 6 inches in the last hour, the Western Open is in the second round.

If you go to Wrigley Field pay the $50.00 to park in "Cubs Lot."

Parking elsewhere could cost up to $2500 for damages, towing fees, parking tickets, etc.

If some guy with a flag tries to get you to park in his yard, run......

Chicago , there's no place like it!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You might be from Chicago if....

* You don't pronounce the "s" at the end of Illinois .

* You are annoyed by people who do

* You measure distance in minutes. 

* You have no problem spelling or pronouncing " Des Plaines ."

* Your school classes were canceled because of the cold.

* Your school classes were canceled because of the heat.

* Stores don't have sacks, they have BAGS. 

* You end your sentences with an unnecessary preposition. (Example: "Where's my coat at?" or "If you go to the Jewel I wanna go with.") 

* You can locate Illinois on the United States map.

* You carry jumper cables in your car - and you know how to use them.

* "You drink "pop." 

* You realize that I-290, I-90, I-94, and I-294 are all different roads.

* You refer to any interstate highway as "the Tollway."

* You know the names of the interstates: Stevenson, Kennedy, Eisenhower, Dan Ryan, Reagan, Bishop Ford. (Numbers? They have Numbers?)

* You refer to anything South of I-80 as " Southern Illinois " and anything west of Rt. 47 Iowa.

* You refer to Lake Michigan as "The Lake."

* You refer to Chicago as "The City."

* No matter where you are, when you hear the term "Downtown" you immediately assume they're talking about Downtown Chicago.

* You buy "The Trib." 

* You know what goes on a " Chicago " Hot Dog, and you're permitted to berate anyone who puts ketchup on a hot dog. 

* You know what Chicago Style Pizza REALLY is.

* You know why they call Chicago "The Windy City." 

* You understand what "lake-effect" means.

* You know the difference between Amtrak and Metra, and know which station they end up at (oops ...ending preposition again).

* You have ridden the "L."

* You can distinguish between the following area codes: 847, 630, 773, 708, 312, & 815.

* You know the phone number for Empire Carpets.-


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> They are outsourcing Altisource jobs. *The verbiage was taken from Altisource's recent e-mail to its vendors.*
> 
> The cap on the debris is 60 cy. After 60 cy, you can bid it. Otherwise, 60 cy is included in the low payout.
> 
> IMO - it's not worth it. Altisource's bundled package is okay if there's very little debris to remove but Freeman's rates are way lower than the package price. Freeman is keeping over 50%.
> 
> Linda







I had wondered about that.





So the cap is 60 yrds? Nobody else I know has been able to get the info out of them.


I've got one right now thats at 60 yrds............ I'm not touching it for the cap. The bid on it was 5 times the cap.......... and Some might say that was too low. Its BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Huh?????:blink:

What was all that stuff about Chicago, Paul?

Linda


----------



## BPWY

EZ Land said:


> One of our local landfills charges per cubic yard- which is $8.00 per yard.
> 
> 60 x $8 = $480...
> 
> Or, they'll also charge by the ton- $35/ton with a 2 ton minimum.
> 
> 60 yards of household debris could weigh easily 4-5 tons ($140-$175)...before fuel and labor to load. I'd say no profit in that....
> 
> I'm sure they say, "you make it up though, on the jobs that just have a 4-5 cu yards...." Yeah, you allllwayyys make it up.... not!
> 
> I need to go, It's raining and icing here, so I'm kinda stuck in the office today, but I should go before I go "office space" on my computer. :hammer:










I might suggest that your estimated weight is far too low.


Recently on two jobs of around 35 yrds of what I consider "normal" house hold debris I was north of 5000 lbs.
This is your typical wood, trash, boxes, bagged trash, mattresses, ordinary press board furniture, sectional couch, bedding/clothing etc.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Huh?????:blink:
> 
> What was all that stuff about Chicago, Paul?
> 
> Linda










A joke for our northern IL friends enjoyment. :laughing:


----------



## BPWY

Don't mind me, I'm strung out on head cold meds.


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Altisource's rates are low to reasonable. We decline orders that are low and accept the ones that are reasonable.
> 
> The problem with other Altisource vendors is that they cut everything to a fixed rate [far lower than the original rate from the client], then take a discount off of that.
> 
> That's where we are different. We take a percentage off the top but we take it off the full rate. We don't sub from the sub of a sub..... too many fingers in the pie and no one makes any money.
> 
> I've got a client right now trying to get us to take care of Altisource orders at a package rate of $600. It just isn't going to happen and our client will ultimately have to decline the order, which Altisource may [or may not] reassign to us and, if they do, we can offer it at full rate to our vendor.
> 
> Linda








For me their rates offered direct to the contractor are as low as I'll accept.
I believe US Best is offering $55 dry wints. :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing: :laughing:
That must be why I'm not contracting with them.


----------



## BPWY

brm1109 said:


> So I received an order for a winterization. Too much snow on the ground to get my equipment in and out so I put a bid for snow removal.
> So now the bid was denied and no winterization wasn't done.
> How much you want to bet that the property will freeze and cause more damage then the price of the snow removal.






I'll take that bet and raise it...................... that the client doesn't care in the least little bit about continued damage.


Or that seems to be my experience. So often the banks just ignore small problems that might cost them $5000 to $15,000 to preserve the value of their property. Turning the situation into one that destroys 50% and in some cases 100% of the property's value.


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> She's obviously very new and it sounds like she might become real experienced real fast about breaking a redemption order.
> 
> Sounds like your client isn't very loyal to you so, no doubt, the newbie is not the one at fault. I think, in this case, I might have pointed out the redemption order and explained personal property to her.
> 
> Then I would talk to the client about their assignment of work orders.
> 
> But that's just me.
> 
> Linda


Linda, I agree with you. It's not her fault. She is like the rest of us trying to get some work. It is ok to share information to keep someone from getting into trouble. I know I would like for someone to let me know if I am going down the wrong street.


----------



## BPWY

I just got an email from MFS on their lockbox sale. $9.99 if buying 12 or more.


----------



## BPWY

I was told yesterday by one of the very large nationals that HUD has dropped their "must change" deadbolts (or rekey). 

The new directive is to disable and reinstall. No deadbolt covers allowed.
If you drill out a deadbolt for access you better have a spare in the truck to reinstall.



Any of ya'll hear about this?


----------



## APlusPPGroup

sacoop said:


> Linda, I agree with you. It's not her fault. She is like the rest of us trying to get some work. It is ok to share information to keep someone from getting into trouble. I know I would like for someone to let me know if I am going down the wrong street.


Thank you. That was exactly my thought. We have a tendency to complain about other vendors who we have to clean up after but no one is willing to take the time to work with them because of the fear of competition.

I have no fear of the competition and other vendors have been a great resource for me. They provide leads and they also do work for us.

Bottom line is, as long as they're "papered", I'd rather work with them than against them. You never know when something good might come out of a relationship with them.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

BPWY said:


> The new directive is to disable and reinstall.


Am I missing something here? What does "disable and reinstall" mean?

Linda


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Am I missing something here? What does "disable and reinstall" mean?
> 
> Linda


Remove the actual "bolt" inside. Re-install the inner and outer plates. Leaving an empty deadbolt inside the door.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

somewherein815 said:


> Remove the actual "bolt" inside. Re-install the inner and outer plates. Leaving an empty deadbolt inside the door.


This is for secondary locks, right? Probably sounds like a dumb question but you never know how someone might interpret the instruction.

Linda


----------



## BPWY

a1propertyclean said:


> Am I missing something here? What does "disable and reinstall" mean?
> 
> Linda



Disable internally from working and reinstall so that theres no empty hole in the door.






a1propertyclean said:


> This is for secondary locks, right? Probably sounds like a dumb question but you never know how someone might interpret the instruction.
> 
> Linda








The way they talked it was any deadbolt.

Now days who the hell knows????????????
The regs change so fast.


----------



## Guest

sacoop said:


> Linda, I agree with you. It's not her fault. She is like the rest of us trying to get some work. It is ok to share information to keep someone from getting into trouble. I know I would like for someone to let me know if I am going down the wrong street.


WE did advise her that the stuff had a personal property hold on it, and that you dont remove stuff out of a property unless you had bid approval. She said she called and talked to someone about it and they told her to remove the mattresses if she wants to. We told her she should check again because that is not required for a janitorial. We also called the vendor management leader and let her know what was going on. She said she would take care of it. We know its not her fault. We just had to chuckle to ourselves the way she was chucking stuff out of the house with the hopes of bidding after the fact I guess. The company is at fault for just hiring any joe shmoe, but she must be held a little accountable for not reading all her paperwork they give you when you sign up, to understand the services that she is doing.


----------



## Guest

JoshuaJames99

Where in Northern CA are you located? I am in the San Jose area at least every other month.


----------



## Guest

I got coolest work order ever today "provide bid for damage and theft of appliances" 

How much would you charge to go damage then steal some appliances?


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> I might suggest that your estimated weight is far too low.
> 
> 
> Recently on two jobs of around 35 yrds of what I consider "normal" house hold debris I was north of 5000 lbs.
> This is your typical wood, trash, boxes, bagged trash, mattresses, ordinary press board furniture, sectional couch, bedding/clothing etc.


I have no doubt you're correct...I was trying to be a little conservative with my rant.... That particle wood, pressed board crap gets heavy...I hate that stuff...


----------



## BPWY

uintahiker said:


> I got coolest work order ever today "provide bid for damage and theft of appliances"
> 
> How much would you charge to go damage then steal some appliances?










:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


----------



## Guest

rafterrat said:


> was asked if I thought I was too good to work for $15.00 and hour?




*Yes, I am! 

I, Fresh Cut, am a company. A company that is larger than one individual, and Fresh Cut has a standard of service that demands the same standard of compensation.

If and when you can meet the standard of compensation that Fresh Cut requires, then please feel free to reach out for Fresh Cut's standard of service.
:thumbsup:
*


----------



## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hey,
> 
> I have a thought
> Would some of you regulars, those who have been on the forum and doing property preservation for awhile, care to share with other regulars the companies that have stiffed you over the past year. I am thinking this could help a lot of us out so that the companies don't continue to use us anymore. I am sure they will find someone else, but perhaps not one of us that are sharing information on this forum. We could do it by posting directly to this site or sending messages to all that are willing to participate. I hate to see another one of us get shafted because we didn't know. I would only want to see legitimate, followed work order, sent in correct photos and now no one returns calls or emails regarding pay. Let's say at least 90 days late.
> 
> Thoughts please :detective:





a1propertyclean said:


> You won't find too many who are willing to post who they've been stiffed by. Some of them are probably still attempting to collect and negative feedback has the potential to hurt their case, not to mention there could be backlash and counterclaims from libelous or slanderous comments.
> 
> I don't see any such lists on the horizon here at CT. Most members will simply post links to rip-off reports or headlines/articles to make others aware of what's going on.
> 
> Linda


Linda, 

It doesn't have to be anything slanderous or libelous. Just a simple list of company names in a quoted window like such...



> Field Blah Blah Inc
> Service Such and Such
> Management so & so LLc
> America's first whoopty whoop


And we can all just quote the same post and add to it, without any identifying remarks about specific dealings or personnel names.


----------



## ARPPP

FreshCut said:


> Linda,
> 
> It doesn't have to be anything slanderous or libelous. Just a simple list of company names in a quoted window like such...
> 
> 
> 
> And we can all just quote the same post and add to it, without any identifying remarks about specific dealings or personnel names.


Thanks for weighing in. We have Linda's point of view and now yours. Anyone else have an opinion on this? In my opinion this forum should be used as an avenue to help each other. In keeping with that spirit I think this information would be good. It may even make the stated companies pause a moment and make some changes. I say put the %[email protected]#$ on blast!


----------



## Guest

There is an avenue that newbies can go and get more ahhh ummmm "information on companies" and thats at cubicyard.com. Its been a long time since I've been on Terrys site but it was real "informative" till they started charging. Linda I used to see you "over there" and perhaps you "joined" and could give more insight on the information that is on the forum?

I think what everyone has to know is "what are u willing to risk" when posting information on the forums. The Service Companies (nationals) have employees that sit there 8 hours a day monitoring these webs... HI JOHN! Yes we know they snoop and try to get the general attitudes that are out there on the web. To this day I don't understand why since I have never seen any changes except to PI*S us off more...YES JOHN. You already know how I feel....right JOHN? LOL


----------



## Guest

I hope this works check out what I got in my email today. Wana sign up?


----------



## BPWY

rafterrat said:


> I hope this works check out what I got in my email today. Wana sign up?







Hey I wanna get all over that................. NOT



$200 for initial services including 5 cubes????????????????

You gotta be freaking kidding me! Some of these bad properties the janitorial alone could exceed $200. Grass heights of 4' to 5' is not unheard of.... the grass cut will be over $200!


----------



## Guest

rafterrat said:


> I hope this works check out what I got in my email today. Wana sign up?


ECO's Pricing Sheet is beyond ridiculously low. It's insulting to any legitimate business.

But there will be people / companies that say "Hey, I gotta put food on the table for my family. What they don't understand is that they are actually starving them to death slowly. Which is much more cruel and tortuous.


----------



## thanohano44

rafterrat said:


> I hope this works check out what I got in my email today. Wana sign up?


Wow, they're wanting to pay employee's but not pay workmans comp and weekly or biweekly payroll.


----------



## Guest

Did you see page 2? replace a 12 x 12 tile $2.00. doesn't matter the color as long as it fills the space. does that make it cheaper when buying a piece of tile if you don't care what color it is?


----------



## Guest

sacoop said:


> JoshuaJames99
> 
> Where in Northern CA are you located? I am in the San Jose area at least every other month.


We are about 3.5 hours north near Redding.


----------



## thanohano44

rafterrat said:


> Did you see page 2? replace a 12 x 12 tile $2.00. doesn't matter the color as long as it fills the space. does that make it cheaper when buying a piece of tile if you don't care what color it is?


These guys have never done the work themselves it seems.


----------



## Guest

Anyone have any experiences with this company out of Cali. They e mailed looking for a vendor in my state of CT. They have a wint/lock change job they need done through BOA and said they are willing to pay "my" pricing on this one till they set up a matrix for my state. They also said they would pay out of pocket in a matter of days and wait to be reimbursed from their client


Central Valley Mortgage Services, Inc.
(559)782-8011- EXT. 1016


----------



## thanohano44

danny1217 said:


> Anyone have any experiences with this company out of Cali. They e mailed looking for a vendor in my state of CT. They have a wint/lock change job they need done through BOA and said they are willing to pay "my" pricing on this one till they set up a matrix for my state. They also said they would pay out of pocket in a matter of days and wait to be reimbursed from their client
> 
> 
> Central Valley Mortgage Services, Inc.
> (559)782-8011- EXT. 1016


I've done work for them. Great experience.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

danny1217 said:


> Anyone have any experiences with this company out of Cali. They e mailed looking for a vendor in my state of CT. They have a wint/lock change job they need done through BOA and said they are willing to pay "my" pricing on this one till they set up a matrix for my state. They also said they would pay out of pocket in a matter of days and wait to be reimbursed from their client
> 
> 
> Central Valley Mortgage Services, Inc.
> (559)782-8011- EXT. 1016


They are extremely nasty if you decline to work for them. I still have the e-mails somewhere.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Thanks
I think they are in a jam to get this done for their client, BOA. I see they work with safeguard, LPS, 5 bros. They said their usual pay on a knoblock/deadbolt combo is $22.50 and $75 for a dry wint. I told them $60 on the lockchange and $150 on the wint. he o.k.'d it over the phone, waiting for something in writing.


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Let us know if they pay you, Danny. Another vendor used to work for them and he subbed us a job installing 7 locks. We never got paid and I don't know if it was CVMS or the other vendor, who was a good friend at the time.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Fremont ~

I wasn't very active at Cubic Yard. All I did was post an ad and wrote an article for them regarding plagiarism.

I went ahead and signed up with them a couple days ago but haven't had the chance to get in and look around yet.

I'll let you know what I think after I've had the chance to check it out. The owners are super nice and they're well-informed so it should be a good site.

Linda


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Joshua ~

I'm glad you did the right thing by the new vendor. It's on them if they choose to ignore the info you've given them.

Linda


----------



## Guest

can anyone offer suggestions on how I can track down the lock-change/thief/left a huge pile of human waste in my house P.P. contractor who rifled through all my stuff, stole wedding gift Mikasa China, Car Audio equipment, camera & equipment, wife's jewelry, opened mail, and likely works for "Premiere Asset Services" or "Spectrum Home Services" ? ? ? Thanks for any help


----------



## APlusPPGroup

PAS should have a record of the vendors they've sent to the property, even if it was a vendor who declined the order.

They should also have a record of all the people who have the lockbox code.

Did you file a police report? Did they take fingerprints?

Linda


----------



## Guest

police report was filed, we (wife & I) owned this house, were not living it, was on the market with a realtor, still had personal property there, finger prints were taken, I've check pawn shops, Craig's List & Ebay for my stolen items, have not had any luck with anything,,,I am going to see if I can still file an insurance claim for my personal property as I am sure the Insurance Co. will gladly subrogate the loss to the guilty party


----------



## Guest

Hopefully this is not a repeat as I just tried to post a second ago. We are still owed thousands by NOW. Those press releases were a joke. I especially enjoyed the one about the pizza party in Sam's honour. Where are all these happy contractors? All the ones I run into are owed tons of money like me!


----------



## Guest

Sorry, still getting used to the site. I wanted to "insert" that last post a few pages back when NOW was being discussed. Is that possible?


----------



## Guest

I did work for CVMS they always payed but you had to wait 60 days to get it.
They were not very nice and always wanted bids on things that I could not have fronted the money for the materials for 60 days.
Like a tare off roof that would take 35 sq of shingles. They were real strict on the photos. If they were not just right they would refuse to pay.
Also I almost never got bids back and didn't know why till one of the girls that worked there told me they changed all my bids to a higher price in order for them to make more. After I added to my bids for them to get their 35% they added more and I'm sure I would have never seen the extra on the bids if they were approved.


----------



## Guest

Sweebs said:


> can anyone offer suggestions on how I can track down the lock-change/thief/left a huge pile of human waste in my house P.P. contractor who rifled through all my stuff, stole wedding gift Mikasa China, Car Audio equipment, camera & equipment, wife's jewelry, opened mail, and likely works for "Premiere Asset Services" or "Spectrum Home Services" ? ? ? Thanks for any help


You should be able to get in touch with company with your loan # and find out who was sent to your home for the lock change. Or better yet have the law do it.


----------



## BPWY

danny1217 said:


> Anyone have any experiences with this company out of Cali. They e mailed looking for a vendor in my state of CT. They have a wint/lock change job they need done through BOA and said they are willing to pay "my" pricing on this one till they set up a matrix for my state. They also said they would pay out of pocket in a matter of days and wait to be reimbursed from their client
> 
> 
> Central Valley Mortgage Services, Inc.
> (559)782-8011- EXT. 1016









I hope you have deep pockets.


They pay once a month, 60 days out. A job thats done after the payment cut off date will be 75 plus days out until paid. 
Not so big of a deal when working with small fry items, but try a large bid approval that requires buying a lot of material...... and then you get to be the bank for nearly 3 months, and finance the cost of the products.


Oh and their 35% discount.


----------



## BPWY

rafterrat said:


> I did work for CVMS they always payed but you had to wait 60 days to get it.
> They were not very nice and always wanted bids on things that I could not have fronted the money for the materials for 60 days.
> Like a tare off roof that would take 35 sq of shingles. They were real strict on the photos. If they were not just right they would refuse to pay.
> Also I almost never got bids back and didn't know why till one of the girls that worked there told me they changed all my bids to a higher price in order for them to make more. After I added to my bids for them to get their 35% they added more and I'm sure I would have never seen the extra on the bids if they were approved.









This would explain virtually NO bid approvals.


----------



## BPWY

Nothing like more gooberment interference to create far more real estate market instability.




*Obama moves to abolish Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae*


----------



## APlusPPGroup

RFS said:


> Sorry, still getting used to the site. I wanted to "insert" that last post a few pages back when NOW was being discussed. Is that possible?


No way to insert but, if you click "quote", you can respond to the person who posted what you want to answer, just like I "quoted" your question above.

Linda


----------



## Guest

Sweebs said:


> can anyone offer suggestions on how I can track down the lock-change/thief/left a huge pile of human waste in my house P.P. contractor who rifled through all my stuff, stole wedding gift Mikasa China, Car Audio equipment, camera & equipment, wife's jewelry, opened mail, and likely works for "Premiere Asset Services" or "Spectrum Home Services" ? ? ? Thanks for any help


 
Sweebs, 

How do you know it was a P&P contractor?

It sounds like a normal realtor thing. Taking a poo* on the floor to devalue the house for easier sell. 

Realtors steal more stuff than any contractor...yep hard to believe but they line their pockets in and out of these homes since they supposedly are "immune" from anyone "looking" at them...Case in point---you. 

Realtors know when the occupants are home or away. They rent out overnight to vagrants or rent on monthly short term leases--yep seen that to the tune of 150 houses by 1 realtor doing this at $500 per month and it went on for nearly a year while we kept reporting the home as occupied and the banks just didn't want to listen to what we kept telling them. 

Yep sounds like your favorite realtor was getting their bucket of gold. 

Hope/Wish you the best of luck on getting your stuff back but *remember* that when you start making accusations to the bank that it was the P&P contractor be certain it was:whistling


----------



## Guest

a1propertyclean said:


> Joshua ~
> 
> I'm glad you did the right thing by the new vendor. It's on them if they choose to ignore the info you've given them.
> 
> Linda


Had to go back to this particular property today to a diiferent unit. Stuck my head in the door just to check on things. All the mattresses were in a pile by the front door, as well as all the other stuff she hauled out! Will make my job much easier when we get bid approval!


----------



## Guest

I hope you have deep pockets.

They pay once a month, 60 days out. A job thats done after the payment cut off date will be 75 plus days out until paid. 
Not so big of a deal when working with small fry items, but try a large bid approval that requires buying a lot of material...... and then you get to be the bank for nearly 3 months, and finance the cost of the products.

Oh and their 35% discount. 

Thanks BPWY and others
Decided not to work with them. After a long conversation with their " special projects coordinator " and his endless blah,blah,blah what we can do for you speech that he ended with.......so that's my pitch


----------



## Guest

Hey I'm getting started working on foreclosures and can't get into the house. Does the national company usually send you keys, if not, where do you have them made? Also, I need to get this house done by tomorrow and it has a 3 letter combination lock on the back door. Can anyone direct me where to find this information because its the weekend and my national company isnt in the office and I think they forgot to give me the code or could you pm me the information.


----------



## Guest

DEE JAY DEE said:


> Hey I'm getting started working on foreclosures and can't get into the house. Does the national company usually send you keys, if not, where do you have them made? Also, I need to get this house done by tomorrow and it has a 3 letter combination lock on the back door. Can anyone direct me where to find this information because its the weekend and my national company isnt in the office and I think they forgot to give me the code or could you pm me the information.


You are joking right?


----------



## Guest

DEE JAY DEE said:


> Hey I'm getting started working on foreclosures and can't get into the house. Does the national company usually send you keys, if not, where do you have them made? Also, I need to get this house done by tomorrow and it has a 3 letter combination lock on the back door. Can anyone direct me where to find this information because its the weekend and my national company isnt in the office and I think they forgot to give me the code or could you pm me the information.


Bust the dang door down and you have access. Then take many pics of the damaged door and bid to fix :clap:

Seriously its your job to bust into the home and gain access. 

1) How do you have keys made when you don't know the keycode of the lock? Don't know about everyone else but I've tried cutting keys for these P&P Homes and they don't work worth a darn if at all. 

2) There are 1000's of lockbox codes

3) Order $600 worth of locks of different codes and then you will have a lot of the "possible" keycodes from a P&P Lock provider...BargainLocks, Nuset, MFS or whoever.

4) The National Company will have an emergency phone number and most of us on here can tell you the contact # if you provide the name of the National Company. You have to call over and over and leave messages but someone will call you back eventually (Probably Monday)

5) Who's lockbox is it? It may be a realtor maintained home that you are not suppose to enter.

Good luck


----------



## Racerx

Freemont you forgot to tell him about the "Realtors Key":clap::clap::clap:


----------



## Guest

All-Craft said:


> Freemont you forgot to tell him about the "Realtors Key":clap::clap::clap:


I was going to but there is already a realtors lockbox on the door so that may look wierd


----------



## Guest

FremontREO said:


> Sweebs,
> 
> How do you know it was a P&P contractor?
> 
> It sounds like a normal realtor thing. Taking a poo* on the floor to devalue the house for easier sell.
> 
> Realtors steal more stuff than any contractor...yep hard to believe but they line their pockets in and out of these homes since they supposedly are "immune" from anyone "looking" at them...Case in point---you.
> 
> Realtors know when the occupants are home or away. They rent out overnight to vagrants or rent on monthly short term leases--yep seen that to the tune of 150 houses by 1 realtor doing this at $500 per month and it went on for nearly a year while we kept reporting the home as occupied and the banks just didn't want to listen to what we kept telling them.
> 
> Yep sounds like your favorite realtor was getting their bucket of gold.
> 
> Hope/Wish you the best of luck on getting your stuff back but *remember* that when you start making accusations to the bank that it was the P&P contractor be certain it was:whistling


So let me get this straight,,even though I have documentation that a contractor from Premiere Asset Service has been at the house, and a neighbor who saw his car in the drive (assuming someone was there for a showing), it was actually my realtor damaging all the doors, finally breaking through the back door by destroying the jam (rather than use her key from her Century 21 lock box which was hanging on the doorknob), and who subsequently rifled through everything, stealing stuff, taking mail from the mailbox & taking a dump in the toilet/not the floor, but whatever, no water/no flushie. Oh and changed a lock too, even though my REALTOR already had a key to the existing lock.

Pretty sure realtors (at least for 99.9% of them) usually make their money when they sell a house, not by breaking in like a common thief to loot their client's belongings. Sell a house/pocket big commission, or break-in, steal some stuff/try to fence it somewhere? 

I dunno, your hypothesis sounds like it needs some work to be believable.

So I don't need to accuse anyone of anything, the facts tell the story.


----------



## Guest

dna test the stool sample


----------



## Guest

IdahoProperty said:


> dna test the stool sample


ha ha ha, was actually (briefly, very briefly) thinking the same thing when the cop was dusting for prints, I was like, dang I JUST had of a huge pile of DNA, oh well, I don't think the officer would have Ttoo highly of THAT idea,,,


----------



## Guest

Sweebs said:


> So let me get this straight,,even though I have documentation that a contractor from Premiere Asset Service has been at the house, and a neighbor who saw his car in the drive (assuming someone was there for a showing), it was actually my realtor damaging all the doors, finally breaking through the back door by destroying the jam (rather than use her key from her Century 21 lock box which was hanging on the doorknob), and who subsequently rifled through everything, stealing stuff, taking mail from the mailbox & taking a dump in the toilet/not the floor, but whatever, no water/no flushie. Oh and changed a lock too, even though my REALTOR already had a key to the existing lock.
> 
> Pretty sure realtors (at least for 99.9% of them) usually make their money when they sell a house, not by breaking in like a common thief to loot their client's belongings. Sell a house/pocket big commission, or break-in, steal some stuff/try to fence it somewhere?
> 
> I dunno, your hypothesis sounds like it needs some work to be believable.
> 
> So I don't need to accuse anyone of anything, the facts tell the story.


Sweeb sorry you are going through the foreclosure process. It is not an easy process. 
You just supplied a ton more "facts" than you did the first 2 posts and it appears the "case is solved then". So, why did you even ask in the first place since you seem to have all the facts already?

" 99.9% of realtors make their money selling the home". Yep that is correct BUT when a house goes into foreclosure the selling realtor does not make the "big bucks" selling the home but average, after deductions from their service companies/brokers/selling fee/bpo fees/misc fees, approx 1.5-2% of the sale price so no that is not much money for the amount of money they put out of pocket. Add that the realtors USED to sell "several" private homes and make lots of money and due to the credit crisis their sales have dried up. I have changed locks on as many realtors fancy 6-10 bedroom mini-mansions that are in foreclosure as I have $30,000 1 bedrooms. 

Do realtors steal? Sure do. Been caught many times.

Do realtors break doors? Sure do. Windows too;;;;;Where do you think the term "realtors key" came from?

Do realtors use the toilet and not flush? Hell yes all the time. Tick us contractors off since WE are the ones that have to clean up after them. 

But this is not the case in your situation since you already got your girl/guy bagged and the police ought to have it solved. 

Unfortunately the contractor gets blamed for everything in this business and it rubs wrong. Put blame where blame is deserved. 

I hope the facts you got will hold up. :whistling

Sorry man. Good luck. Been 1 of those weeks. Just call Premeir and ask them who the contractor was and ask him/her to bring it back.


----------



## Guest

Oh yeah forgot to add: if this happened to me I would go after the responsible party with everything I got (legally of course)

To help you might try to find out if it was a/the realtor that hired the contractor? At least 75% of my Premier work we are hired by the realtor and not the Service Company for Premier. 

Luck.


----------



## thanohano44

I've caught realtors stealing many times. Caught them on camera too. 
We had a realtor who was renting out his REO properties out to illegals and having them do the repairs and painting. How this realtor is still in business I do not know.


----------



## Racerx

Sweebs ,without divulging (sp) to much of your personal business here, you were vague in a couple of areas are you a homeowner/remodeler or homeowner just looking for help?, and was your property up for sale or forclosed on?.

It just seems kinda weird that you would leave such valuable items in a home you were not living in:blink:and if if was'nt for the lock change part it does'nt seem like taking a dump in a winterized property you were assigned is the type of thing a pp person would do...

Now don't get me wrong I'm not doubting your story it just appears to be the circumstances are really weird ,and to be quite honest with you it should be pretty easy to track down who was sent to your property to change the locks, as I'm sure this deginerate has the gall to actually want to be paid for their time and has billed the respective company that sent them there. with that being said it's time to go all CSI on this and get to the bottom of it.

Best of luck:thumbsup:


----------



## APlusPPGroup

DEE JAY DEE said:


> Hey I'm getting started working on foreclosures and can't get into the house. Does the national company usually send you keys, if not, where do you have them made? Also, I need to get this house done by tomorrow and it has a 3 letter combination lock on the back door. Can anyone direct me where to find this information because its the weekend and my national company isnt in the office and I think they forgot to give me the code or could you pm me the information.


Something doesn't smell quite right here. Are you sure you're not Joe Schmoe trying to find a way to walk in the front door instead of breaking a window to get in?

That might sound a little sarcastic but you'd be surprised at the kind of stuff people send me e-mails about and, to me, it looks like you're fishing for info you might not have the right to have.

Whoever sent you the work order will TELL you which key code to change the lock to AND they will also give you the lockbox combo OR tell you to contact the realtor for access.

NOBODY [that I know of] just sends a newbie a work order with no information on it. Most likely, you also received an emergency or after hours contact phone number or signage to post on the property with the number on it.

If you ARE legit and you really don't have the contact numbers or info, wait until Monday morning and contact your client first thing. This is not the kind of stuff you should be asking at this forum. And you shouldn't be asking anyone to PM you with info until we get to know who you are. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

All-Craft said:


> Sweebs ,without divulging (sp) to much of your personal business here, you were vague in a couple of areas are you a homeowner/remodeler or homeowner just looking for help?, and was your property up for sale or forclosed on?.
> 
> It just seems kinda weird that you would leave such valuable items in a home you were not living in:blink:and if if was'nt for the lock change part it does'nt seem like taking a dump in a winterized property you were assigned is the type of thing a pp person would do...
> 
> Now don't get me wrong I'm not doubting your story it just appears to be the circumstances are really weird ,and to be quite honest with you it should be pretty easy to track down who was sent to your property to change the locks, as I'm sure this deginerate has the gall to actually want to be paid for their time and has billed the respective company that sent them there. with that being said it's time to go all CSI on this and get to the bottom of it.
> 
> Best of luck:thumbsup:


1. Remodeler (looking for help).
2. For Sale (thus the Century 21 lock box on the door). 
3. We had moved to nearby home & had removed 99% personal property & had no reason to believe that anyone would break in to steal the 1% of our stuff we had yet to move; property was not winterized (why would it when it had not foreclosed?) we simply had the water turned off.
4. yes, circumstances weird since property had NOT foreclosed, but while trying to sell home, and due to dwindling market values, we were trying to work out a short-sale with the lender (yeah, sure) so we could lower the asking price and get a buyer, & in the endless 'we lost your paperwork' & run-arounds, & 'we can only correspond via fax' BS, foreclosure was becoming more & more "likely" but likely doesn't mean anyone has the right to break in and change a lock.

Point is there was no conclusion to anything, we still 'owned' the house, still had the for sale sign in the yard, still maintained the property, still had personal belongings inside, and still were in and out of there 3 to 4 times per week (which is why I discovered the break-in less than 24 hrs afterwards).

If it should be easy to track down who did this,,,please advise how. This is the entire reason for my initial post - to ask those of you with the know-how if you can advise me on exactly what I need to do to find out who did this.

Getting my stuff back really isn't that much of a concern - finding the person responsible though most definitely is.

BTW, he drove a grey or silver Camaro & had a blond female with him playing lookout.

Thanks for the help.


----------



## thanohano44

Sweebs, 

If your home was indeed secured by the lender, you were behind on your loan and it was vacant....the bank has every right to change a lock and secure the property. It's written in your contract. at anytime that your loan goes past due, the lenders can send inspectors out to check on the condition and occupancy status of the property. Once it is reported vacant once or twice, they send someone to change a lock or all of the locks. This is done to prevent vandalism, theft and squatting. This is al done in the best interest of you and the lien holder. 

I personally don't know how someone in a camaro can take all that you say he did. I don't even know of a contractor who does securing who can use a car and get the job done right.


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Nothing like more gooberment interference to create far more real estate market instability.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Obama moves to abolish Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae*


Another lie by the left. He's a democrat, the last people to want less involvement in the lives and pocket books of it's citizens. The white house "moves to" blah blah blah....moves to take more money out of everyones pocket as underwhelm citizens is more like it.


----------



## mtmtnman

Sweebs said:


> 1. Remodeler (looking for help).
> 2. For Sale (thus the Century 21 lock box on the door).
> 3. We had moved to nearby home & had removed 99% personal property & had no reason to believe that anyone would break in to steal the 1% of our stuff we had yet to move; property was not winterized (why would it when it had not foreclosed?) we simply had the water turned off.
> 4. yes, circumstances weird since property had NOT foreclosed, but while trying to sell home, and due to dwindling market values, we were trying to work out a short-sale with the lender (yeah, sure) so we could lower the asking price and get a buyer, & in the endless 'we lost your paperwork' & run-arounds, & 'we can only correspond via fax' BS, foreclosure was becoming more & more "likely" but likely doesn't mean anyone has the right to break in and change a lock.
> 
> Point is there was no conclusion to anything, we still 'owned' the house, still had the for sale sign in the yard, still maintained the property, still had personal belongings inside, and still were in and out of there 3 to 4 times per week (which is why I discovered the break-in less than 24 hrs afterwards).
> 
> If it should be easy to track down who did this,,,please advise how. This is the entire reason for my initial post - to ask those of you with the know-how if you can advise me on exactly what I need to do to find out who did this.
> 
> Getting my stuff back really isn't that much of a concern - finding the person responsible though most definitely is.
> 
> BTW, he drove a grey or silver Camaro & had a blond female with him playing lookout.
> 
> Thanks for the help.




In my experience as soon as you start talking short sale with the mortgage holder and they find out the property is vacant they send out a work order whether your behind or not. I make it a point to ALWAYS contact the realtor whether the bank says so or not. (_the nationals hate this and have chewed me out more than once but OH WELL! I have to live in this valley they don't!_) I live in a huge valley with a very small population and if i did not do this i would be a hated P&P contractor like many are around here. In turn being i am upfront with the realtors i get a lot of work direct from them. Being up front and honest i have become the highest volume company in my area. 
Had a dewint direct from a realtor for a home inspection on a full price sale Friday on a home where the bank had sent a P&P contractor in on Wednesday to do a wint and lock change. If he would have called the realtor he would have found out there was a home inspection in 2 days but he didn't and now he is on this realtors chit list. What i loose in the difference between a trip charge and a wint and lock change i more than make up in direct realtor work..................


----------



## ARPPP

Winterizations should be done on any property that is unoccupied in the winter. Most realtors, including myself, do winterizations on unoccupied properties regardless of ownership to avoid damage to the property during the harsh Illinois winter months. Winterization is not a signal that the property is foreclosed it is more so a signal that someone is trying to prevent damage to the property. 

Being on both sides of this business I have seen the good, bad and ugly from my colleagues. Taking keys, stealing personal property, lying about property conditions and the list goes on. This is from both sides. Neither group is more saintly then the other.


----------



## ARPPP

*Help for the Newbie*



DEE JAY DEE said:


> Hey I'm getting started working on foreclosures and can't get into the house. Does the national company usually send you keys, if not, where do you have them made? Also, I need to get this house done by tomorrow and it has a 3 letter combination lock on the back door. Can anyone direct me where to find this information because its the weekend and my national company isnt in the office and I think they forgot to give me the code or could you pm me the information.


 
Hi Dee Jay Dee,

If you have not gathered from the posts yet. This was not the forum for this type of question. The majority of the participants here are well experienced and use this forum for more advanced questions. If you are serious about this business read the pages and pages of information here for some good information. Skip through the racist and offensive remarks and accept my apology for them. I will PM you with the names of some websites and groups that are good for beginners and you can get your information there. As I have stated in my previous posts we should be helping each other. Help does not take food away from your table.

This is a hard, labor intensive field. 

I wish you all the best.

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


----------



## Guest

This is my first post after reading just about every page on this thread. I have been trying and pushing to get into this business since November. 
Assured I would be given direction to paperwork, company templates, a "webinar" training video to get started as to what THIS company is expecting of me. Assurance to "call if you have any problems" Had to search the web to find their tutorials. Requested several times for the templates needed to get going. Never did get the key code from them.
A very good soul of a man stepped up to the plate and said don't worry I'll help ya through the process. Just give me a call. He graciously has been answering my questions and can't thank you enough!!! I felt I could do this.

I have 13 1/2 yrs of heavy highway construction as an operating engineer for the union back east. 11 yrs of flipping houses. (not on a big scale, personal) NO BRAINER RIGHT?

After 2 1/2 month ridiculous long wait, back and forth negotiating price...(took them 4 days to add the numbers correctly for me to agree)...finally got my first house...
Friday around 2pm their time opened e-mail 4pm my time. winterization due in 24hrs.
* Been laid up with fever and you know what for three days and can't move, not today.
* woke up 5am Saturday, feeling like s%#t, but packed up my truck to head to the house. Will meet this man to go over pressurizing the lines. COOL!
* Have a friend come to remove the 3' high ice build up from the plows and snow/ice fall from the metal roof on the drive. He can budge it with the bobcat. 
* Taking pictures in the house, and well the bug hits me and I have to fly home to take care of some business.
* HAVE to go back...hook up trailer and the GD thing is frozen to the ground can't budge it!! spinning tires...chipping ice...

Called company 4 times. 2 e-mails. no response. requested they re-assign the job. I screwed this one up for sure, and am rethinking ...do I really want this??? 
Got an e-mail this morning that I missed the first deadline...No crap...I've been trying to get a hold of them to tell them just that! This job was an easy one for sure. I couldn't get there. 

I wanted to write this because I owe a HUGE thanks to mtmtnman who offered me a great opportunity and stepped in to give me help when the company itself couldn't seem to get me the right information or direction. He did!! Didn't have to. There are great people out there in this business, and proud to have met one of them. Thank you Sir!


----------



## Guest

ARPPP said:


> Hi Dee Jay Dee,
> 
> If you have not gathered from the posts yet. This was not the forum for this type of question. The majority of the participants here are well experienced and use this forum for more advanced questions. If you are serious about this business read the pages and pages of information here for some good information. *Skip through the racist and offensive remarks* *and accept my apology for them*. I will PM you with the names of some websites and groups that are good for beginners and you can get your information there. As I have stated in my previous posts we should be helping each other. Help does not take food away from your table.
> 
> This is a hard, labor intensive field.
> 
> I wish you all the best.
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


Annette,

I sure hope to Gosh you are not throwing out a "racist" blah blah blah and this is just a misprint. Seems to come from some "parts" of the country more than others though:whistling

p.s. I don't think YOU need to apologize to anyone.


----------



## Guest

UGH. I know all of the HUD key codes. I received them through a link from my National Company. But on that link there was no information about the 3 letter alpha code for the lock box. I'm not doing a lock change or of course I would have that information. I am doing "Initial Service".


----------



## thanohano44

DEE JAY DEE said:


> UGH. I know all of the HUD key codes. I received them through a link from my National Company. But on that link there was no information about the 3 letter alpha code for the lock box. I'm not doing a lock change or of course I would have that information. I am doing "Initial Service".


Rekeying is part of the initial services 75% of the time. Sounds like an REO work order. Try the realtor.


----------



## ARPPP

FremontREO said:


> Annette,
> 
> I sure hope to Gosh you are not throwing out a "racist" blah blah blah and this is just a misprint. Seems to come from some "parts" of the country more than others though:whistling
> 
> p.s. I don't think YOU need to apologize to anyone.


Thanks for the clarification Fremont! I cringe when I read these comments. I have thought a few times about responding to them. Instead I just let them roll of my back and keep moving. God help them...


----------



## mtmtnman

thanohano44 said:


> Rekeying is part of the initial services 75% of the time. Sounds like an REO work order. Try the realtor.



Not around here it isn't. I get the re-keys direct from a realtor and the initial services through a national......


----------



## mtmtnman

sgspanky said:


> This is my first post after reading just about every page on this thread. I have been trying and pushing to get into this business since November.
> Assured I would be given direction to paperwork, company templates, a "webinar" training video to get started as to what THIS company is expecting of me. Assurance to "call if you have any problems" Had to search the web to find their tutorials. Requested several times for the templates needed to get going. Never did get the key code from them.
> A very good soul of a man stepped up to the plate and said don't worry I'll help ya through the process. Just give me a call. He graciously has been answering my questions and can't thank you enough!!! I felt I could do this.
> 
> I have 13 1/2 yrs of heavy highway construction as an operating engineer for the union back east. 11 yrs of flipping houses. (not on a big scale, personal) NO BRAINER RIGHT?
> 
> After 2 1/2 month ridiculous long wait, back and forth negotiating price...(took them 4 days to add the numbers correctly for me to agree)...finally got my first house...
> Friday around 2pm their time opened e-mail 4pm my time. winterization due in 24hrs.
> * Been laid up with fever and you know what for three days and can't move, not today.
> * woke up 5am Saturday, feeling like s%#t, but packed up my truck to head to the house. Will meet this man to go over pressurizing the lines. COOL!
> * Have a friend come to remove the 3' high ice build up from the plows and snow/ice fall from the metal roof on the drive. He can budge it with the bobcat.
> * Taking pictures in the house, and well the bug hits me and I have to fly home to take care of some business.
> * HAVE to go back...hook up trailer and the GD thing is frozen to the ground can't budge it!! spinning tires...chipping ice...
> 
> Called company 4 times. 2 e-mails. no response. requested they re-assign the job. I screwed this one up for sure, and am rethinking ...do I really want this???
> Got an e-mail this morning that I missed the first deadline...No crap...I've been trying to get a hold of them to tell them just that! This job was an easy one for sure. I couldn't get there.
> 
> I wanted to write this because I owe a HUGE thanks to mtmtnman who offered me a great opportunity and stepped in to give me help when the company itself couldn't seem to get me the right information or direction. He did!! Didn't have to. There are great people out there in this business, and proud to have met one of them. Thank you Sir!



Anytime. Now you know why i have told you i am working on an exit strategy for this business eh??


----------



## mtmtnman

Friday morning I went to sign my Dogs up for welfare. At first the lady said, "Dogs are not eligible to draw welfare." So I explained to her that my Dogs are mixed in color, unemployed, lazy, can't speak English and have no frigging clue who their Daddys are. They expect me to feed them, provide them with housing and medical care, and feel guilty because they are dogs. ​ 

So she looked in her policy book to see what it takes to qualify. My Dogs get their first checks Friday. 

Damn this is a great country! ​


----------



## ARPPP

Need I say anymore.....


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Had a dewint direct from a realtor for a home inspection on a full price sale Friday on a home where the bank had sent a P&P contractor in on Wednesday to do a wint and lock change. If he would have called the realtor he would have found out there was a home inspection in 2 days but he didn't and now he is on this realtors chit list. What i loose in the difference between a trip charge and a wint and lock change i more than make up in direct realtor work..................








So you call the realtor and get the info and then call the national to tell them.
For the most part their reply is "we don't care, do the work on your work order."

I've had the conversation more than once.

Some of them will allow you to disregard the w/o if the realtor is maintaining the property. But a lot of them are hesitant to make that claim......... for liability reasons.


----------



## BPWY

mtmtnman said:


> Friday morning I went to sign my Dogs up for welfare. At first the lady said, "Dogs are not eligible to draw welfare." So I explained to her that my Dogs are mixed in color, unemployed, lazy, can't speak English and have no frigging clue who their Daddys are. They expect me to feed them, provide them with housing and medical care, and feel guilty because they are dogs. ​
> 
> So she looked in her policy book to see what it takes to qualify. My Dogs get their first checks Friday.
> 
> Damn this is a great country! ​





ARPPP said:


> Need I say anymore.....









Can't take a very simple joke?


----------



## ARPPP

BPWY said:


> Can't take a very simple joke?


 
No. By this statement I would not expect you to understand.

Be blessed.
Annette


----------



## thanohano44

BPWY said:


> Can't take a very simple joke?


People are so damn sensitive these days. Nobody would laugh if some of these things weren't true.


----------



## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> So you call the realtor and get the info and then call the national to tell them.
> For the most part their reply is "we don't care, do the work on your work order."
> 
> I've had the conversation more than once.
> 
> Some of them will allow you to disregard the w/o if the realtor is maintaining the property. But a lot of them are hesitant to make that claim......... for liability reasons.



Depending on who the National is i usually tell them the realtor was at the property when i arrived. Calling the realtor also saves me from "BREAKING" in. I have had dozens meet me with keys or have me stop at the office.........


----------



## ARPPP

What does this have to do with Property Preservation? Did I strike a nerve?

You are speaking with many people from all races, financial standings and household structures. The comments in the name of a joke are not necessary or appreciated. There are plenty of sites for that kind of thinking and this one should not be it.

But as someone mentioned earlier, this seems to be coming from a certain part of the country. I think those of us who are tolerant and acclimated to differences understand where I am coming from.

This is my last post on this subject. If you don't get it then I feel sorry for you.

Annette Rogers


----------



## mtmtnman

ARPPP said:


> What does this have to do with Property Preservation? Did I strike a nerve?
> 
> You are speaking with many people from all races, financial standings and household structures. The comments in the name of a joke are not necessary or appreciated. There are plenty of sites for that kind of thinking and this one should not be it.
> 
> But as someone mentioned earlier, this seems to be coming from a certain part of the country. I think those of us who are tolerant and acclimated to differences understand where I am coming from.
> 
> This is my last post on this subject. If you don't get it then I feel sorry for you.
> 
> Annette Rogers


Annette, Fyi i grew up 70 miles west of you. (HWY 20 and I90) Drove into the windy EVERY DAY for almost 15 years. Cabrini Green, Humboldt park, Wentworth, Hyde Park, Englewood, Calumet Heights Ect. 3 and 4 generations on the dole while i am busting my azz and paying taxes. I got sick and damn tired of my tax dollars supporting this insanity so i left! Sorry if your offended but there was a lot of truth in that "JOKE" and is both sad AND funny in it's own way. A joke once in a while in a forum thread CAN lighten the mood a bid. Just don't be so easily offended....................

*
By the way, My wife who is a HARD WORKING half Mexican even laughed. (Her Grandpa swam the Rio Grand in 1947)*


----------



## oteroproperties

ARPPP said:


> What does this have to do with Property Preservation? Did I strike a nerve?
> 
> You are speaking with many people from all races, financial standings and household structures. The comments in the name of a joke are not necessary or appreciated. There are plenty of sites for that kind of thinking and this one should not be it.
> 
> But as someone mentioned earlier, this seems to be coming from a certain part of the country. I think those of us who are tolerant and acclimated to differences understand where I am coming from.
> 
> This is my last post on this subject. If you don't get it then I feel sorry for you.
> 
> Annette Rogers


I get it and its Appreciated. . . . . . .


----------



## oteroproperties

There was a time when i posted and read posts here because i thought myself to be in the same boat as some of you. It has clearly become apparent that i am not in the same mind set or position as most any of you. I am far more successful in this business. Some of you people are so jaded that i actually feel sorry for you. If i was having as hard a time as some of you i believe i would be done with this business.........now if i know theses people at all i will here things like "well when you get screwed as much as i have......" did you ever stop to think that these things happen to you because you are an easy target? 

As far as the inappropriate comments towards race and class of people, I've always chalked that up to them not knowing any better. I'm mixed race (moms white dads pr and italian) i do not know my father nor do i ever care to meet him. I fear i would be dissapointed anyway because i have a low tolerance for weak minded people. We were on welfare when i was a kid but have never taken a hand out as an adult. (not because i'm better then anyone but because I've never needed it) wait there's more....I forgot to round off this self loathing with the fact that I never made it to 10th grade!! But there's a good ending, I will not bragg about my income because I am a very humble person but I typically pay more in taxes then any 10 people collect in welfare and guess what? I dont care. My mom needed it when we were kids, maybe due to bad descisions on her part maybe because of the times, but she has never needed anything since i've been able to work. If that program helps 1/4 of the people like it has helped my family then i will pay twice that yearly and i'm able.....

and in the words of my boy Forrest......"thats all i got say bout that"


----------



## oteroproperties

Apparently my device thought i was done writting. Ill finish that on up on the computer


----------



## ARPPP

oteroproperties said:


> There was a time when i posted and read posts here because i thought my s


 
Click edit and finish your thought please. I am interested in reading it.

Annette


----------



## BPWY

thanohano44 said:


> People are so damn sensitive these days. Nobody would laugh if some of these things weren't true.






The world is trying to be PC.



I am not PC, and I don't care. 
So much of what is considered PC is insanity. 

ARPPP is entitled to her opinions. Doesn't mean she is right and the others are wrong. Doesn't mean that the rest of us are right and she is wrong.


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> The world is trying to be PC.
> 
> I am not PC, and I don't care.
> So much of what is considered PC is insanity.
> 
> ARPPP is entitled to her opinions. Doesn't mean she is right and the others are wrong. Doesn't mean that the rest of us are right and she is wrong.


Its not about pc. Its about negativity and positivity. If your father in law gets on your nerves all the time do you really think your wife wants to hear it every 20 seconds? It amazes me how much you all think you know about the system and politics. Do you really think you are educated enough in the inner working of government that you can make a wise assesment of any situation? Or are you just repeating what you heard from someone else?


----------



## BPWY

oteroproperties said:


> It amazes me how much you all think you know about the system and politics. Do you really think you are educated enough in the inner working of government that you can make a wise assesment of any situation? Or are you just repeating what you heard from someone else?







Just as qualified as you.







Its interesting how the loudest voices for tolerance are at times the most intolerant of others views when others views don't agree with theirs.


----------



## oteroproperties

BPWY said:


> Just as qualified as you.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Its interesting how the loudest voices for tolerance are at times the most intolerant of others views when others views don't agree with theirs.


I assure you i am not quailfied at all to speak on governmental policy, and you've never heard me say anything about politics or the system. In fact the only time I reply on here is if I had direct experience with it. That's why when you guys talk about the beatings you take all the time im silent. Actually that's not true, I usually try to explain my experiences but I get the "you just havent gotten your lumps yet blah blah blah cry cry cry....."


----------



## BPWY

So with no opinion on politics you don't vote????


----------



## BPWY

When you think you've seen it all you find a new one.

Today at an initial secure we found a large catfish and 2 large perch in the fish tank and they walked out. 
Months later when we showed up............. the smell was just beyond more than the senses could tolerate.


----------



## oteroproperties

-000-


----------



## mtmtnman

oteroproperties said:


> Its not about pc. Its about negativity and positivity. If your father in law gets on your nerves all the time do you really think your wife wants to hear it every 20 seconds? It amazes me how much you all think you know about the system and politics. Do you really think you are educated enough in the inner working of government that you can make a wise assesment of any situation? Or are you just repeating what you heard from someone else?



All my political knowledge comes from the Constitution. How many current politicians do really think have ever read it or understand it? I know enough about the Constitution to know that entitlements are not in it. It wasn't till FDR and the New Deal era that people started getting something for nothing and that started the downhill spiral in this country. You ever tried to hire any of these people getting a monthly check? Near impossible! The joke posted has many truths relating to entitlements. Sorry if i hit a nerve but i call a spade a spade.........................


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> Can't take a very simple joke?


Joke, yes. But not at anyones expense.


----------



## Guest

BPWY said:


> When you think you've seen it all you find a new one.
> 
> Today at an initial secure we found a large catfish and 2 large perch in the fish tank and they walked out.
> Months later when we showed up............. the smell was just beyond more than the senses could tolerate.


Same thing happened to me, kindof. I walked into a house that had been empty according to the neighbors for 6-8 months. On the kitchen table was a bowl containing 3 fish that had about 2 " water in it and the fish were still alive. Needless to say, it was before everything was called personals and I being way too nice took the fish and now they live in a nice new fish tank that I never wanted.......what a sucker I am.


----------



## mtmtnman

Working2hard said:


> Needless to say, it was before everything was called personals...................



Which brings up another issue as of late. BOA has stated ANYTHING left will now be considered personals. Even an old pair of nasty sneakers! I asked that one! Basically working for BOA is one trip charge after another. Over 2/3's of my initial secures have been denied due to personals over $500 and i believe the other 1/3 will be denied due to the new rules now.......


----------



## APlusPPGroup

I have openings for vendors throughout Montana, Utah, and Idaho. Unfortunately, one of my vendors passed away in January and I just found out from his mom this morning.

I have 2 orders right now in Roosevelt and Richland Counties in Montana that need to be covered, nothing in the other states.

If anyone can take these, please let me know. One is an initial secure and the other is one that I expect we will probably decline since the authorized amount was another vendor's and it's way too low for the job. The client has already told me the bank won't allow a re-bid.

BTW. I hope everyone is finished fighting. If you only knew how it reads in a public forum........:sad:

Linda


----------



## Guest

agreed, I wish the last three pages can just be removed and lets play start over


----------



## ARPPP

a1propertyclean said:


> BTW. I hope everyone is finished fighting. If you only knew how it reads in a public forum........:sad:
> 
> Linda


A public forum is to discuss issues. Why are you starting this back up again? Wait.... don't reply. I really don't care at this point. You speak as if the REAL issue that I brought up is ok. If no one says anything then you are complacent with the status quo. When one does not agree with others it is not necessarily a fight. I only now that this is supposed to be property preservation related topics. My only request is that we keep it that way.

Annette Rogers


----------



## APlusPPGroup

Annette ~

I couldn't agree more that this forum is for preservation-related topics.

There was no fight going on, however, until you posted what you did. It provoked some people into responding and a fight started. The rest of your post was perfect.

I'm sure we can call agree that, when it comes to race, religion, or politics that we can all agree to disagree.

I wasn't saying anything against you or anyone else. I was just hoping it was over and trying to make everyone aware of how it looked from someone "looking in". I didn't post things I wanted to post during the fight because I was horrified that it was even happening. 

Linda


----------



## Guest

BIG group hug everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## ARPPP

somewherein815 said:


> BIG group hug everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!


 
Muuuuuaaaaahhhhhhh :tt2: 

Happy Valentines Day to all of my colleagues on Contractor Talk

Annette


----------



## APlusPPGroup

somewherein815 said:


> BIG group hug everyone!!!!!!!!!!!!!


In the words of Smokey Robinson, "I'll second that emotion".:thumbup:

Linda


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## thanohano44

Lol! Today while I was working some realtor asked for my card and told me I spoke really good English for a horse eating coconut! I asked him how did he know I ate horse? He said he lived in Tonga for 2 years and over heard me speaking to my crew in Tongan. I laughed and told him sorry bro, I'm not Tongan. My wife is. I'm Samoan, Hawaiian and portugese. He then tells me you looked a little Hispanic to me but I saw your calves and heard you speak. You have the face of a spaniard and the legs of a Rhino. Lol.


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## APlusPPGroup

LMAO. Thanks for the laugh. I needed that, after a long day!:laughing:

Linda


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## Guest

BPWY said:


> When you think you've seen it all you find a new one.
> 
> *Today at an initial secure we found a large catfish and 2 large perch in the fish tank and they walked out. *
> Months later when we showed up............. the smell was just beyond more than the senses could tolerate.



If you had filmed that, you could take a nice vacation, maybe retired! :jester:

Sorry, attempt at brevity, since it seemed for a little while things were going downhill. :laughing:


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## Guest

thanohano44 said:


> Lol! Today while I was working some realtor asked for my card and told me I spoke really good English for a horse eating coconut! I asked him how did he know I ate horse? He said he lived in Tonga for 2 years and over heard me speaking to my crew in Tongan. I laughed and told him sorry bro, I'm not Tongan. My wife is. I'm Samoan, Hawaiian and portugese. He then tells me you looked a little Hispanic to me but I saw your calves and heard you speak. You have the face of a spaniard and the legs of a Rhino. Lol.


 
I have a Tongan who works for me. Dude is hilarious. He kills me with the comments, old boy is missing his 2 front teeth. I asked him one time what happened. He just smiles nods and says "rugby man, I play lots rugby." I asked him if he was going to false teeth or something and he looked at me like I was nuts, shook his head and said "nobody know I play rugby." I never thought of a Rhino when I looked at his legs but I can see the similiarities now you mention it.

Glad you brought that up. Just thinking about my poly buddies makes me laugh.


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## mtmtnman

BPWY said:


> Nothing like more gooberment interference to create far more real estate market instability.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Obama moves to abolish Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae*




Had to dig a bit for this post but as much as it pains me to say, i think Obama has it right on this one. Way too many people in the last 8-10 years where in no shape to buy a home. All these programs do is help broke people buy homes. I guess i am to old school but i really believe it should be a requirement that anyone buying a home brings 10-20% CASH to the table on closing. If they have the wherewithal to SAVE money than they are a good risk. If the spend every last dollar and get a mortgage for 0-3% down, what happens when they loose a job? Nothing to fall back on! I will GUARANTEE YOU the ones that come to the table with 10-20% down continue saving after they buy. The ones that don't have $$ down keep spending. Most of the time, when someone takes out a loan like this, it’s because they were advised poorly or they don’t have any money, which means they shouldn’t be buying a house. Me you ask? I am leasing an EXTREMELY nice custom home in the country on 5 acres for less than i could buy it for per month and saving every penny i can. I like the 100% down plan but will probably do the 20% plan to avoid mortgage insurance by the end of this year.

If all of this foreclosure mess was over with we could ALL go back to making real money doing repairs and maintenance for homeowners instead of arguing with banks.............


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## oteroproperties

mtmtnman said:


> Had to dig a bit for this post but as much as it pains me to say, i think Obama has it right on this one. Way too many people in the last 8-10 years where in no shape to buy a home. All these programs do is help broke people buy homes. I guess i am to old school but i really believe it should be a requirement that anyone buying a home brings 10-20% CASH to the table on closing. If they have the wherewithal to SAVE money than they are a good risk. If the spend every last dollar and get a mortgage for 0-3% down, what happens when they loose a job? Nothing to fall back on! I will GUARANTEE YOU the ones that come to the table with 10-20% down continue saving after they buy. The ones that don't have $$ down keep spending. Most of the time, when someone takes out a loan like this, it’s because they were advised poorly or they don’t have any money, which means they shouldn’t be buying a house. Me you ask? I am leasing an EXTREMELY nice custom home in the country on 5 acres for less than i could buy it for per month and saving every penny i can. I like the 100% down plan but will probably do the 20% plan to avoid mortgage insurance by the end of this year.
> 
> If all of this foreclosure mess was over with we could ALL go back to making real money doing repairs and maintenance for homeowners instead of arguing with banks.............


I agree. Requiring a substantial down payment will force people buying to look at the amount they are borrowing and settle for what they can afford. As far as getting rid of fannie and freddie, well as longs as its not replaced with another establishment fine. Theoretically it would put smaller regional banks back where they belong loaning money to people in the communities they operate in and possibly loosen the grip nationals have on this industry. Of course my previous statement relies on the assumption that the regional banks would hire regional contractors to perform the needed preservation and maintenance on the properties they do have to take back.


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## ARPPP

Update: Never received the bundled package order as stated. Received individual work orders without an initial. This means I cannot create work orders for the other pre-approved items that need to be done.... :-(

Annette
AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC


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## REO2Rentals

ARPPP said:


> Update: Never received the bundled package order as stated. Received individual work orders without an initial. This means I cannot create work orders for the other pre-approved items that need to be done.... :-(
> 
> Annette
> AR Professional Property Preservation, LLC



Yes.....they will email you *Property Inspection and Preservation *
fill that out and the create work orders will open up.:thumbsup:


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