# Interesting article on Employee vs IC



## BamaPPC (May 7, 2012)

Among the blogs and forums I frequent is one called the Society of Field Inspectors. 

Here's an interesting article from over there

http://sofi.typepad.com/sofi-inspec...-independent-contractor-or-employee.html#more


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## BamaPPC (May 7, 2012)

Take the IRS test. The way I am treated, some of these are gray areas, some come down on the side of independent contractor, others are decidedly employee.

​*IRS 20-Factor Test: Independent Contractor or Employee 
Basic Question: Who Has Control Over the Work Being Done? *​*
*1. ​​*Instructions*. Workers who are required to comply with others’ instructions about when, where, and how they are to work are ordinarily employees. 
2. *Training*. Training workers indicates that employers exercise control over the means by which results are accomplished. 
3. *Integration. *When the success or continuation of a business depends on the performance of certain services, the workers performing those services are subject to a certain amount of control by the owners of the businesses. 
4. *Services rendered personally*. If services must be rendered personally, employers control both the means and the results of the work. 
5. *Hiring, supervising, and paying assistants. *Control is exercised if employers hire, supervise, and pay assistants. 
6. *Continuing relationships*. Continuing relationships between workers and employers indicate that employer-employee relationships exist. 
7. *Set hours of work. *The establishment of set hours of work by employers indicates control. 
8. *Full-time required. *If workers must devote full time to employers’ businesses, employers have control over workers’ time. Independent contractors are free to work when and for whom they choose. 
9. *Doing work on employers’ premises*. Control is indicated if the work is performed on employers’ premises. 
10. *Order or sequences set*. Control is indicated if workers are not free to choose their own patterns of work but must perform services in the sequences set by the employers. 
11. *Oral or written reports*. Control is indicated if workers must submit regular oral or written reports to employers. 
12. *Payment by hour, week, or month*. This points to employer-employee relationships, provided that this method of payment is not just a convenient way of paying a lump sum agreed on as the cost of a job. Independent contractors are usually paid by the job or on straight commission. 
13. *Payment of business and/or traveling expense. *Employers paying workers’ expenses of this nature shows that employer-employee relationships usually exist. 
14. *Furnishing tools and materials. *If employers furnish significant tools, materials, and other equipment, employer-employee relationships usually exist. 
15. *Significant investments. *Workers are independent contractors if they invest in facilities that are not typically maintained by employees (such as an office rented at fair market value from an unrelated party). Employees depend on employers for such facilities. 
16. *Realization of profits or losses. *Workers who can realize profits or losses (in addition to profits or losses ordinarily realized by employees) they are independent contractors. Workers who cannot are generally employees. 
17. *Working for more than one firm at a time. *If workers perform services for a number of unrelated persons at the same time, they are usually independent contractors. 
18. *Making services available to the general public. *Workers are usually independent contractors if they make their services available to the general public on a regular and consistent basis. 
19. *Right to discharge*. The right of employers to discharge workers indicates that the workers are employees. 
20. *Right to terminate. *Workers are employees if they have the right to end their relationships with their principals at any time without incurring liability.​


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Every time I try to explain this to people they want to argue about the contracts they signed under the auspices...I willingly signed the contract...No made you agree...What everyone forgets...just because you have signed a contract does not make it valid...that is why there are severability clauses written onto all contracts....
I'll let you post this to the FB page.....:whistling2::whistling2::whistling2::whistling2:


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## tak (Dec 28, 2012)

Speaking of an employee or IC. Just recently got forced to attend a TRAINING session on how to cut grass from a safeguard rep. I would assume I should be classified as an employee due to the training and WHAT photos I am to take. One day these nattys like sg WILL pay bc a contractor or the irs will nail thier a $$.


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## GTX63 (Apr 12, 2012)

Want to know the level of contractor you are competing against with Safeguard? When you leave those training sessions, look at the vehicles they are driving...


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## Gypsos (Apr 30, 2012)

GTX63 said:


> Want to know the level of contractor you are competing against with Safeguard? When you leave those training sessions, look at the vehicles they are driving...


or pushing?


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## tak (Dec 28, 2012)

I am actually really wanting to see these other clowns. I have 3 trucks I use. 07 tundra, 04 F150, 09 RAM. My F150 doesn't look the best (accident on front end) but its a beast with 200k on it. I have 4 different trailers, no falling apart junkers here and good equipment (no Ryobi's or craftmans, or tractor mowers here all scags and 1 yazoo/kees ztr 's and echo commercial handhelds)


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## wmhlc (Oct 8, 2012)

whats the number you have to answer yes to make you an employee?

When I was college many years ago I think the law was you had to answers yes to 15 out of the 20 questions. So if you ask me you would have to have all your eggs in one basket.


I would call us subcontractors unless you only work for one national, and if you do only have one client then you are stupid:thumbsup:


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## Cleanupman (Nov 23, 2012)

Perhaps a grass cutter for one of these companies needs to file for unemployment after the grass cutting season???? as a seasonal employee of course...be interesting to see what happens....


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## BamaPPC (May 7, 2012)

wow, can you imagine. I've been party to a call from the unemployment office. had to defend myself after denying unemployment benefits to a guy that walked off the job. That would be a really good phone call to record and play back on youtube. LOL


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